Spittin’ Chiclets Episode 651: Featuring Liam Blutman & Michael Landsberg

Summary

Spittin’ Chiclets Episode 651: Featuring Liam Blutman & Michael Landsberg

Date: June 1, 2026
Main Theme:
This episode of Spittin’ Chiclets is anchored by a deep dive into the upcoming 2026 Stanley Cup Final between the Carolina Hurricanes and the Vegas Golden Knights, with a substantial, heartfelt segment reflecting on the tragic passing of Claude Lemieux—one of hockey’s fiercest competitors and beloved teammates. The boys also welcome Liam Blutman for Vegas insights and a moving, no-BS conversation on mental health with broadcast legend Michael Landsberg.

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1. Claude Lemieux’s Passing: Hockey Community in Mourning

Segment Timestamps: 04:00–15:00

• The hosts open the show on a somber note, mourning the sudden and tragic loss of Claude Lemieux.
• Personal stories are shared from sandbagger golf tapings and time spent with Lemieux off the ice.
• Whit, Biz, Keith, and RA underline how Lemieux, despite being one of the NHL’s most hated rivals on the ice, was “an incredible, incredible gamer. One of the best playoff performers hockey’s ever seen…” (Whit, 06:25) and was beloved by teammates for his loyalty and mentorship.
• “If you wanted to win… that’s the guy you needed on your team.” (Whit, 07:55)
• The hosts share how “truly heartbreaking” it is for the community and reflect on Lemieux’s fierce fatherhood, mentorship, and the stigma around mental health for men and pro athletes.
• Whit and Biz highlight how players like Bobby Holik and Ken Danico immediately checked in on teammates. Danico shares how Lemieux was the first to reach out to help him with his own off-ice issues.
• Keith movingly describes seeing Lemieux’s family at the draft and how Lemieux “was one of those guys that when the puck dropped, it was game on… but he was an absolute gentleman and a great guy and a family guy.” (Keith, 10:50)
• Whit introduces upcoming guest Michael Landsberg as “one of the people that was ahead of it all… he’s dealt with a lot of mental health struggles on his own… to give you resources if you are maybe dealing with something.” (Whit, 12:44)

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2. Talking Mental Health and the “Code” in Hockey

Segment Timestamps: 12:45–15:00; Full interview 91:32–130:30

• The hosts stress the importance of men checking on each other, opening up, and de-stigmatizing mental health struggles.
• Biz: “It’s cutting your pain in half… and I think within the NHL and all pro sports leagues, it’s about reaching out to old teammates, just occasionally calling guys—‘how you doing?’” (Biz, 14:38)
• Whit echoes: “…people are going through a lot more than you think…to see that within our own community from a legend, it just stops you in your tracks…” (Whit, 14:49)
• Full Michael Landsberg Interview (91:32 onwards):
  • Landsberg gives open, raw testimony on living with depression and anxiety, why talking about it matters, and how “men live by the code” in life just as in hockey—“don’t show weakness, handle it yourself.”
  • “People with depression get really good at wearing the mask… you can’t see it on their face.” (Landsberg, 109:46)
  • “The only bad treatment is no treatment. If yoga can make a difference in your life, if meditation can, if positivity can, then that’s a great treatment.” (Landsberg, 117:22)
  • With memorable stories (including how an email at the right time—after a TV show—literally saved a life), Landsberg implores listeners to talk, seek help, and support friends.
  • Notable Quotes:
    • “If you’re really depressed and not doing anything about it, you’re giving up your life. You are alive, but you’re not really living.” (Landsberg, 98:05)
    • “Three out of four suicides are men. We’re still just plugging our ears…” (Landsberg, 115:09)
    • “You’ve got to come to grips with needing help. Talk to someone. Go to your family doctor. Don’t be too proud to make that call.” (Landsberg, 122:17)
  • Landsberg’s project with Kevin Bieksa—targeting men’s mental health—is previewed.

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3. Stanley Cup Final Breakdown: Carolina Hurricanes vs Vegas Golden Knights

Segment Timestamps: 16:54–90:00

A) Carolina Hurricanes’ Journey & Roster Build

• The panel lauds Rod Brind’Amour’s cultural transformation of the Canes; “Rod the Bod…in 97 of 99 playoff games in Carolina history.” (Whit, 18:03)
• The “master class” by GM Eric Tulsky in building the roster: savvy trades, big buy-in veteran additions, waivers (like Brandon Bussi in net), and the huge turnaround of players like Jordan Martinook and Keandre Miller.
• Notable: Hurricanes’ loud, loyal fanbase and “NASCAR-type” playoff atmosphere.
• “Shows there are so many different ways to build a team…people say you need to tank, but these teams have done it different.” (Biz, 24:54)
• Trust in their depth and four-line approach: “All four of their lines can do it…they’re not like ‘we got to hide this one line’...” (Keith, 34:47)
• “Their 6D are big, they’re long…remind you of Florida.” (Keith, 34:47)

B) Vegas Golden Knights’ Dark Side—and The Liam Blutman Rant

• Vegas gets the "evil empire" label for cutthroat management, relentless pursuit, continuous big trades, and “treats nobody well, wins at absolutely all costs and isn’t apologetic about it…they’re just an evil one.” (Quote read by Biz, 56:07)
• Debate about how Vegas is built (almost entirely via trades, signings, and the expansion draft), the role of state taxes in attracting players, and constant cycling out of prospects and first-round picks.
• The hiring of John Tortorella as head coach after firing Bruce Cassidy late in the season—“it was a miserable atmosphere, the room was gone…they needed a guy with gravitas...” (Whit, 50:44).
• Special Guest: Liam Blutman (Blutman, 43:53–68:42)
  • Outspoken Vegas superfan, notorious for his Cup “jinx” lists, joins in full “dark side” attire.
  • “The dark side, my side, is gonna be the ones that need to put an end to them [Carolina]... I want Stanley Cup merch, that’s all I’ve been focused on.” (Blutman, 45:41)
  • Betting storylines, on-ice matchups, and making predictions: “I would love for it to end in six in Vegas. That’d be…both Cup wins on home ice...”
  • A running gag about Whit getting a “Tulski” tattoo if Vegas wins, and Blutman’s refusal: “My mother will never talk to me!” (Blutman/Whit, 48:58)
  • Breakdown of Carolina’s man-on-man defense, Vegas’ neutral zone dominance, and why each feels their team will persevere.
  • Notable: Vegas finished the regular season with “more losses than wins,” but is now in the Final—a testament to the parity and unpredictability of modern NHL.

C) Key Series Matchups & Tactics

• Heavy discussion on series matchups, line management, and whose depth rules the day.
• Debate: Do you match Jordan Staal to Jack Eichel? “They haven’t had to line match… all four of their lines can do it.” (Keith, 34:47)
• Vegas' perceived edge in elite top forwards, Carolina with the “better 6D.”
• Key storyline: “Game 1 winner in the Stanley Cup Final wins the series 77% of the time.” (Biz, 41:20)
• Notable Quotes:
  • “I think this is an unbelievable matchup. Incredible storylines. I think the hockey is going to be unbelievable. Fuck right off with the ‘non-traditional-market’ stuff.” (Whit, 17:27)
  • “Their least achieving line out of the four has been [Aho and Jarvis]…” (Whit, 26:39)
• Consensus: This Cup Final has all the makings of an instant classic.

D) Playoff Format Gripes & Hockey Quality

• Panel debates the current playoff bracket (conference divisional vs. 1–8) and bemoans recent years’ conference finals being “a dud.”
• “We’re not getting these iconic conference finals anymore… When’s the last time we had a conference final go to seven games?" (Whit, 36:44)
• “Of 12 series since 2020, only seven have gone to six, none to seven—that’s fucking brutal.” (Unknown Analyst/Whit, 39:18)

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4. Quick Hits: Hockey News & Junior/Developmental Hockey Talk

Segment Timestamps: 70:15–90:00+

• Worlds and International Hockey: Canada’s poor international showing, surprising bronze loss to Norway, and positive outlook on Russia’s possible IIHF reinstatement.
  • “To come over here and leave with nothing is just a disgrace…” (O’Reilly, paraphrased by hosts)
  • “Good news for the world hockey stage… Russia could be back.” (Biz, 74:37)
• CHL/Memorial Cup, US College and Development Trends:
  • The Kitchener Rangers “are a wagon. Memorial Cup champs.” (Biz, 77:31)
  • The complex, shifting landscape where top kids choose between CHL, USHL, national team programs, and NCAA—with the money, development, and draft pick implications.
  • “If you have a mentality of staying in junior just to be a higher pick, I’d avoid that guy at all costs.” (Whit, 85:06)
• Mason McTavish and Trade Rumors:
  • Anaheim’s player movement, cap management, and whether McTavish and Zellweger are moving: “You’re not selling high right now.” (Keith, 87:41)

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5. Stats, Storylines & RA’s World

Segment Timestamps: 132:03–147:47

• Stanley Cup Final stats and obscure playoff facts—game odds, historic performances, and the contrast in “battle-tested” status between Carolina (running roughshod through the East) and Vegas.
• Debates over who’ll win it all (panel split: Vegas or Carolina, largely in six/seven games); heavy praise for Aho, Eichel, Marner, and dark horse Con Smythe picks.
• Jordan Staal: “The oldest player in the Final… looking to become the first to go at least 17 years from his first Cup to his second.” (RA, 132:53)
• Funny/Outrageous News:
  • Youth hockey parent fights and wild junior scenes (Paul-smash reference/great viral clips).
  • Roller coaster horror stories and why the guys are now “dunzo” with rides.
• Book/Movie Recs: “King of Kong: Fistful of Quarters” (RA); “Pressure” (D-Day weather movie); “The Best Years of Our Lives” (WWII/PTSD).

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6. Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Time | Speaker | Quote / Moment | |---------|--------------|---------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 07:55 | Whit | "If you wanted to win, that's, that's the guy you needed on your team..." | | 12:44 | Whit | "We just want to give you guys like an outlet...tools in case you are dealing with stuff."| | 17:27 | Whit | “Incredible storylines. Fuck right off with the non-traditional market stuff.”| | 45:41 | Blutman | "I want Stanley Cup merch. That’s all I’ve been focused on." | | 56:07 | Biz (reading) | "An organization that treats nobody well, wins at all costs… They’re just an evil one."| | 98:05 | Landsberg | “If you're really depressed... you're giving up your life. You are alive, but you're not really living.”| |109:46 | Landsberg | “People with depression get really good at wearing the mask... you can't see it on their face.”| |117:22 | Landsberg | “The only bad treatment is no treatment. If yoga helps, if positivity helps, that’s a great treatment.”| |122:17 | Landsberg | "You've got to come to grips with needing help. Talk to someone. Go to your family doctor..."| |130:33 | Landsberg | (on CM Punk) “I said, have you ever taken a real punch? And it all went downhill after that.”|

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7. Tone, Style, and Vibe

• This episode balances Chiclets’ trademark rowdy, irreverent banter with genuine reflection, vulnerability, and peer-to-peer honesty.
• The hosts drop jokes, inside stories, and sports nitty-gritty, but spotlight personal experience and emotional intelligence when it matters most.
• Language is authentic—“Fuck right off,” “gut wrenching”—with real talk about the need to “cut your pain in half” and “talk to someone.”

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Summary Takeaway

Episode 651 is a pitch-perfect window into how hockey’s top storytellers balance the game’s highest stakes with its deepest personal losses. Expect rich Cup Final analysis, Vegas-Carolina battle lines, classic Chiclets chirps, and a profound segment on mental health that’s essential listening for fans and players alike.

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For more episodes and details: barstool.link/schiclets

Transcript

[RA]

Hey Spit and Chiclets listeners. You can find every episode on Apple Podcasts and Spotify Prime. Members can listen ad free on Amazon Music.

[Biz]

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[Whit]

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[RA]

Me and Ryan have been officially welcomed to the jungle that is Barstool Sports.

[Whit]

I brought it towards the Coyotes and I asked him if it was okay if I joined the Spit Chickens podcast full time.

[Biz]

Ryan Whitney's got a pink Whitney out there now. The song man is a full time member. My religious galaxy got an assist from

[Keith]

Chris B. Whoa, we're buzzing right now.

[Biz]

What is up folks? Welcome to episode 651 of the Spitting Chicklets Podcast. And that's right, the cup finals are set. Here we come. Pinkies up. The Pinkies are gonna be up in Raleigh for game one tomorrow night. We know that. I actually was at Keith's nephew's graduation party. Shout out. Brian Yandel graduated Christian Academy school going to Lynn University down in Florida. And it was during the Champions League final where all these Chelsea fans were in the restaurant we were at watching hoping Arsenal lost Screaming at me, pinkies up. No joke. Couple great young lads. Just pinkies up with pinkies up. They don't have Pink Whitney here, but Pinky's up. And I said, I appreciate it, boys. As long as Arsenal loses, I'll be happy. And that happened. So Pinky's up to the, to the Carolina Hurricanes, the Vegas Golden Knights and Arsenal losing the Champions League. And Pinky's up to everyone else out there who, who loves drinking the P.

[Whit]

Why, why were you happy about that? Is it just because it's your Chelsea?

[Keith]

Arsenal?

[Biz]

I'm a Chelsea fan now. Am I a die hard fan? I was. And then they're not very good anymore. So, like, I'm kind of really in. When they're good, you have to root against them.

[Whit]

Is that kind of how soccer works?

[Biz]

And Arsenal's never won a Champions League. Now they did win the Premier League this year, which is right, you know, give. Give them kudos. They went to a penalty shot. Guy missed the net to keep the penalty. Penalty kick.

[Whit]

Paul missed the net.

[Biz]

Paul missed the net. That commercial, that commercial haunts more than your DraftKings ad because

[Keith]

what, what DraftKings commercial? Never seen.

[Whit]

I know. They beat the wheels off those commercials, eh?

[Biz]

Hey, you know what? You got your shirt off. You got a nice body in the shower. It's not, it's not the worst thing for your, your resume off the ice, I should say. But Pinky's up. Pinky's up. And guys, we got a very packed episode. We got Junior coming on. We might have Blutman swing by Michael Landsberg possibly. And unfortunately, we do have to start off just, just crushing news for the hockey community. And we were filming a sandbagger, I want to say, last year, with Darcy Tucker and Steve Thomas down at Panther national. And we had the chance of running into Claude Lemieux and just like amazing to see him. And he was kind of chirping us. And I think Biz, you had known him a little bit. I had never met him prior and like a really good person and the way he played and how competitive he was and how fierce of a competitor he was, like, meeting him off, I, he was just a joy to be around. And we chatted about possibly doing a sandbagger someday in a sit down interview. And to get that news, it's. It's crushing. And I've seen a lot of guys who played with him. Scotty Gomez had an awesome post about him and a picture together when they won the Stanley cup. And it's just, it's Heartbreaking. And I know Brendan a little bit feel just sick to my stomach for him and his entire family. And it was a really hard day in the hockey community to see something like that and to see a legend of the game, you know, take his own life. It's truly heartbreaking stuff. And, and we, we want to talk about Claude just a little bit here and show them up because we haven't been on since this, this news broke.

[Whit]

Yeah, I, I think I just like, like met him quickly in passing before we saw him on the golf course and buddy, like, yeah, like, that was the first time I like, truly met him. And it was just great to see how joyful he was. He had a hunter who, Who's Claudia's husband, his, his daughter's husband, Hunter. Actually. He was starting like a golf channel. So Claude reached out like three, four weeks ago asking, hey, can I. Can we do a bagger with you guys? And then maybe you come on that channel and stuff like that. And, and obviously he was always he love. He loved his kids and he would do anything for his children and just crazy that he did the torch like the game prior Game 3. And man, he looked unbelievable. Like, he looked like he could still play and he just looked so happy there. The fans were going absolutely crazy. And then to get that news, guys, like, just, oh, it's. It's brutal. It's. It's brutal. And then to see how it trickled down the hockey world and the fact that like, Freddie Anderson, like, he'd become an agent and helped a lot of these guys. You know, sometimes it's not easy navigating your career and the fact that not only was he incredible father, but incredible mentor to a lot of these players that were now trying to figure out their careers and where to sign and how to be happy and find and find placement and. And Freddie Anderson, who, who obviously got the horrible news, ended up having to start in game, in what was a game five and, you know, with a heavy heart, got the job done. The interview with Jackie Redmond was just incredible and emotional and I don't know how he, he played in the game and just, just awful guys. Just, just an incredible, incredible gamer. One of the best playoff performers hockey's ever seen. And then like, just like you. You hear all these times about like, the, the, the rivalries with the, the Red Wings and guys that he played against and how much. How hated he was on the ice, but also though, how beloved he was by his teammates. Like, we've had Scotty Gomez on here. What Three, four times. And I would say the number one guy he loved talking about and telling stories about was Pepe. Because when he got to, to New Jersey, he took him under his wing and he helped them and he helped teach him the ropes. And you know, Scotty Gomez was a very raw talent, and I think he just needed a little bit of mentorship.

[Biz]

And he got some tough love from him, too, which he loved. Like, looking back on it, he loved, he loved.

[Whit]

And I know it's, it's weighing heavy on those guys. Actually, Bobby Holik called me last night about some other stuff and then of course, that as well. And it's just like, like I said, his teammates just adored him. And if you wanted to win, that's, that's the guy you needed on your team. I don't know. Many times a guy had won a Stanley cup and then went somewhere else won a Cup, and then that team was like, ah, what's the missing recipe? And what we need to get over the hump. Claude Lemieux. And then they brought him back and then they won again, four Stanley Cups, a Con Smythe, and I don't know how many, how many players in the history of the NHL have more points in the playoffs when things mattered, than, than Claude Lemieux. So I know we're talking a little bit about his on ice, but really it's, it's, it's what he, what's what he was about off the ice. And that was a family man, an incredible man, and, and he will be surely missed.

[Keith]

Yeah, I, I got to meet him early in my career. He was, I think he had retired or stopped playing, and then he was trying to get back in shape and, and playing and he was living in Phoenix. I think he was like the GM of the Roadrunners team, the East Coast League team. So he would come out and skate with us during captain's practice, and he was kind of the first guy that I ever saw like, during a captain's practice. He was going 110 miles an hour, like, finishing checks, you know, and it was very eye opening for me as a young guy. I'm like, oh, okay, this is what it takes to win. Like, this guy won in Junior. He has already won four Stanley Cups, and he's out there giving it as well. He doesn't even know if he's going to get a job. Right? So he was one of those guys that when, when the, when the puck dropped, it was game on and it didn't matter if it was on a shiny ice or in the Stanley cup finals. A true warrior. And you know, it's almost a compliment if you're a hockey player, if someone says, I hate playing against that guy, but I love. You'd love to have him on your team. And there are certain guys that have played in this league and have that reputation and he's one of them. And I think back to those rivalries, like you said with Detroit. And then I saw a clip of Darren McCarty saying he's like, listen, I hated this guy's guts. Like, did not like him one bit on the ice. And then you know what, I got to meet him. And he was an absolute gentleman and a great guy and a family guy, like you said, Biz, like there's just, there's just those type of breeds of players that, you know, once the game starts, there's no friends. They're out there for blood. They want to win. And he did that, man. And I'm absolutely gutted. And Biz, we ran into his wife and his daughter in Vegas a couple years ago.

[Whit]

Yeah.

[Keith]

For the draft.

[Whit]

And that's where we saw him. That's where great people.

[Keith]

And Pepe came over quick. In an all time nickname. Pepe Lemieux. Pepe Le Pew, if you remember. The French skunk. Same accent. So just the all time nickname. But he always had his family around and he always, you know, they were out there for the draft, but he brings his wife, his wife's husband or his daughter. Sorry. And his wife's there and they're just great people to be around. And. And Brendan also was one of those guys on the ice that you hated playing against. And, and I'll tell you a story. And he said it. I saw him in Nantucket a couple summers ago. I think his wife has a house out there and saw him out having a couple beers and I was like, hey, I got a hockey camp going on here. That's why I'm. We're out here. Whatever. Next morning, he shows up at 8 in the morning. He's got shorts on, didn't have any sweats. Cause he's on vacation. And he learned that, I'm sure from his dad just being there for other guys. I didn't even have to ask him. He just showed up to the rink. He's like, oh, what time's camp? I said 8 o'. Clock. He was there at 8:02. It's like he's there ready to go, bringing the energy for the kids. And I'm sure he learned that from his dad just A true, true warrior of the game. And like you said, I think most importantly was a great father and a great grandfather and surely going to be missed. Man, it's horrible, horrible news for the hockey world.

[Whit]

I don't know where, if you saw Ken Danico, obviously he jumped on a few different news outlets because he loved them. Like, he was very, very close with Candanico and Ken Danico. You talk about being there for teammates. Yens. I think Ken Danico dealt with some struggles off the ice. I think it might have even been in his post career. And he said the first guy to reach out and offer help and you know, anything, anything he needed was Pepe. And that just kind of that's the guy he was and going back to like maybe what his reputation was on the ice. That's, that's like, that's so far in the rearview mirror compared to the man that he was off the ice and what he was willing to do for friends, teammates and family. So to all of his children, he's got four kids, to his wife and, and you know, all of his family members and friends, like, this is, this is gut wrenching. And we, we have Michael Landsberg coming on at the end of the show. We, we try not to talk like overbear everyone with like the mental health stuff. Obviously we do mention it once in a while because we think it's extremely important. So he's like one of the people that was like ahead of it all and was okay using his platforms initially where maybe it was like faux pas and it wasn't something that was talked about a lot. He was one of the main guys that, that started talking about it and he's dealt with a lot of, of mental health struggles on his own. So we just wanted him to, to, to bring him on because, you know, we have a, we have a lot of, we have a lot of listeners and a lot of male listeners who, who deal with a lot of stuff internally. And we just want to get, give you guys like an outlet or, or how do I say this? Tools in case you are somebody that might be dealing with stuff in order to reach out and get this type of help. So, you know, we're not, we're not professionals here. We can speak to what we deal with personally when we're going through it, but he is definitely a guy that to listen to and to talk to and to give you resources if you are maybe dealing with something. So we all got our stuff, boys. We know that. Right? We all have stuff that we deal with and it's, it's how you deal with it. So, you know, we, we love everybody listening and, and that's pretty much.

[Keith]

Yeah, I, I think the biggest thing wits are is, is just, just being there for somebody or knowing that someone could be there for you, right? It's asking for help. It's making that phone call if you're not feeling, you know, 100%, having somebody that'll be there for you. And, and I'm sure Pepe, man, like, he was probably there for everybody so much. Maybe felt like he didn't have that one person, but there's always somebody that, that'll have that lend an ear for you. And don't, don't be, don't be too proud to make that phone call, to call somebody and, you know, see how they're doing or whatever it is. And it's true, especially as men, right? You, you think you're, you got this, you can handle it, you can handle whatever comes at you. But, man, there are some things that are a little bit tougher and I think, you know, making that phone call or making that text message to somebody could really help.

[Biz]

I, that's exactly what I was going to say. And I want to talk to Michael Landsberg about that later. In terms of it's, it's cutting your pain in half, right? And it's having somebody to take away grief and struggles and pain and lean on and that's, that's the biggest thing is. And I think within the NHL and all pro sports leagues, it kind of makes me think of like reaching out to old teammates and just occasionally calling guys, hey, how you doing? Like, Biz, you've done that with me a lot. How you doing? We're talking all the time, but hey, how's everything going? And I always appreciate it. I think everyone does. And yeah, I remember seeing like a clip a while ago. Dana White, like, you know, anyone who, anyone talking about your, your struggles or your mental health is. I don't remember exactly what he said. It's like off, dude. At this point, I could not agree more that a lot of people are going through a lot more than you think or no. And to reach out and to be there for someone is a big deal. And to see that within our community from a legend, it's just like Biz said, it's gut wrenching. You just stops you in your tracks and you're. I couldn't believe it. I couldn't believe it. So we'll talk more about that later. But within the game is. It is A happy time within the NHL as the cup finals approach every year. It's special and I think within this matchup, boys, like I, I, I am 50, 50 torn. Like I, I see Carolina as the betting favorite, kind of don't understand that, but also see them easily being able to win this series. So it's, it's I, I really am having a hard. I'm picking Carolina because I don't want Vegas to win. Even though I love Hannifan, I love Eichel and the fact that one of th those two are slave and are going to have a gold medal and a Stanley cup is just amazing. Storyline kind of going in being an American but boys, it's interesting to see that both these teams have basically run through everyone and obviously Vegas had a little bit, not a struggle but it took them six games in the first two rounds and then they found everything. A shocking sweep. Carolina loses one game after 11 days off. Both teams are getting the incredible goaltending. I don't know where you want to take it base you've been on Vegas. I got to give you credit. You kind of called this and I

[Whit]

know, I think I was more like influential obviously from watching but like bluny and just like you know there, there's been a lot of influence there. But I think that if you watch enough you're like oh wow. Like it's all systems go, they're clicking. And just to like the, the coaching change and how much the morale helped for those guys wanting to play for one another and wanting to be around the rink definitely changed. I guess I'll start by saying like I've seen some tweets out there like oh the, like oh this matchup's horrible for ratings. Like it's like I think this is an unbelievable matchup.

[Biz]

Same here.

[Whit]

Incredible storylines and I think the hockey is going to be unbelievable. So as far as like the non big markets and the non traditional market nonsense like you can fuck right off like I don't care where your team is located. It's about how it's built and the culture and, and what's happening on the ice. And if you want to start in Carolina, the most shocking, not shocking, but the most eye opening stat was Rod the Bod. He has been a part of 97 of 99 playoff games in the Carolina Hurricanes history.

[Keith]

Oh wow.

[Whit]

Wow, that is fuck yeah. That, that is a wow. Did I get that stat right? I know it's like 96 or 97 like stopping something astonishing and he's like, he's Completely like rejuvenated this team and this culture. When he came in about eight, nine years ago, I think it was about nine years ago. And since he stepped in, they haven't missed playoffs and they've obviously been on this trajectory to building something to eventually win it as a coach, as he did as a player in Carolina.

[Biz]

Twenty years later, it could be 20

[Whit]

years on the nose, it could be later. And you see a lot of these videos of guys lifting the cup. Like his was like so emotional. He was, it's one of the ones that they use all the time because of it was just this like pent up emotion of all this, this work that this one individual had put in and throughout his career, whether it was in Philadelphia or whether it was in Carolina and he played, I believe he played nine years in Philadelphia and 10 years in Carolina and he was a part of that team and he knows what it takes and what type of culture needs to be built in order to win. And through years of persistence, persistency, through, through adversity, through getting spanked in the Eastern Conference finals, they were able to go out in the last, what, 18 months and make additions that have got them to where they are now. Whether it's carrier, who, who won a cup with Vegas, the Ehler signing and also like buy in to, to sign a $50 million deal and then be put on the third line and basically play there all year and be okay with that. The Keandre Miller turnaround, like basically just give it away from, from, from New York. I mean the list goes on and on and on and guys they've brought in who have helped kind of get this team to where they have. I mean Jordan Martinook basically embodies what this team's about. Got put on waivers a few years back. I know that it was for salary cap stuff but, but they could have lost him. They could have lost him. He didn't take it as a slight. He just showed up every day with his lunch pail and continue to work harder. And you know, I, I, I, I mean the Stankhoven, I mean, how much, hey, I'll put my hand up. I was like, oh fuck, that was a risky move. When they move off of nature to get ranting and then in the dying minutes before the deadline, considering Rannon wasn't going to resign, they can't lose him for nothing. And they flip him for Stankhoven and we're thinking, is this guy really going to move the needle? And at that time this guy was playing Wings and then at the Start of the year, they put this guy at center ice. Maybe his stats don't jump off the page, boys, but he stays there all year and at the deadline we're thinking, oh, here comes a big move. They're going to, they're going to push the chips in and get that second line center or nothing. And we're going really, they're not going to push their chips in. And then this guy goes on to have the playoff that he's had Taylor hall last year, people probably thought, oh, this guy's on his back nine. Okay, I guess he could help them, buddy. He might. He's probably one of their top players as far as the Con Smythe is concerned. So everything they've done from, from Tulski, from Brindemore to these guys buying in, to these older veterans who have been there a while, who have continued to stay at it and stay persistent and continue to set the foundation to win, this is a pretty special group and I'm looking forward to seeing what they could do now that they're going to get their toughest test as far as that group is concerned. So just a credit to that organization and, and the fans there, boys. Holy are they, they're crazy. They're die hard crazy NASCAR type fans.

[Biz]

That, that's what I wanted to bring up was the fans, but quickly, you mentioned a lot of these guys, but the Hurricanes point leaders this season. Halsey's 1, traded for by Tulski. Blake's 2, signed in an extension by Tulsi. That's absolute robbery. The guy's making $5 million the next eight years. Stankovin traded by Tulski. Ehlers signed by Tulski. And then Miller, Keandre Miller signed and traded by Tulski. So a master class. But with the fans and Brendam Moore said this after the Eastern Conference final, they've, they've been through a lot. And now when I say been through a lot, it's not like, you know, lottery team, lottery team, losing season, but they, they've, they've seen their team get really good and have these regular seasons and just get truck stick when, when the times got, you know that when the pressure got the biggest and the series got the most important and they stuck with them and they've been loyal and now granted, maybe when the teams weren't great, the building wasn't great, but fuck, I, I, I, I can't really chirp them for that because when the teams are good, this place is a mad house and it's really hard to play in there. So with the kind of the attitude that they've created with the tailgates and then how loud the arena is, it's like good for these people. It's been a long time since they've been in the cup final. They had an epic cup final 20 years ago against Ed. They were up 3:1. All of a sudden it's 3:3 coming back home. They get the win. And it's funny because in Brindamore I saw a clip today when he raises the cup. It's legendary, like you said. And then he gives his son a hug. His son has a Justin Williams shirt on who scored the empty net goal at game seven. You see. Oh, his favorite player wasn't even his dad, I guess then. But it's, it's a cool story. And I want to quickly, there's a tweet here. It was Adam Gretz, I found this. And it was basically how both teams were built. So he's got top five picks. He's got six through 32. First round pick, non first round pick, trade, free agent, undrafted free agent, waivers or expansion draft. You know, those are the eight ways these guys could be on the team. There's one top five pick picked by this team in the series, right? That's Svetchnikov. He was second overall. Okay. And then you got, Seth Jarvis is a first round pick. After that, non first round picks. Jackson, Blake, Ajo, Nikishin, Slavin, trade Hall, Stankovin, Miller, Stahl, Martinook, Janowski, Delorier. Then you got all these other guys that are free agents. Robinson, Mike Riley, Sean Walker, Eers, Chatfield, Gostis, Bear Carrier, Frederick Anderson. So. And then Brandon Bus, you who played a major role. Unreal here. Yeah, he's a, he's a, he's a, he's on waiver. So. And, and it's very, it's even crazier with just trades on Vegas. It's basically all trades. And it kind of brings me to think like you talk about you need to tank and we've said it, you need to tank. You need to get all these high picks the way Pittsburgh did, the way Chicago did it. These teams have done it different and it's like shows there's so many different ways and people who don't want their team to tank, they look at these teams and it's like they didn't really have to do that. Now granted, Vegas got very lucky in an expansion draft where they just, they just kind of ripped off the whole league. That makes it sound they didn't do anything. They didn't do anything wrong, but they fucking dummied the whole league.

[Whit]

And they went in there like in Braveheart, when they just pillaged the village and just took everything. Oh, you don't want me to take this guy. What. What are you giving me not to take him? Let's. Let's. The rules in that expansion draft were new rules and obviously set up this team for success. And at the time, I believe that Foley had paid what, 500 million for the team, which is the most for any expansion franchise in the NHL. Now, it's crazy. We're at a billion. The last one paid. And I believe the tag if you want to bring a new team in is $2 billion. That's what it's set at right now. So that just goes to show the growth of the league. But I love how you mentioned everybody else with, like, you talk about Freddie Anderson and the stats that he's put up. Like, this team ended up winning their division and having that. The. The draws they did in playoffs based on success from Bussy earlier in the year. And we've had him on to talk about how, you know, he was in the Florida organization and Charlotte is their AHL team. And he was driving to Charlotte and I believe at a gas station when he was filling up, he got the call like, hey, we're reroute you. You're getting picked up by the Hurricanes. Like, I think he had the best start for a goalie in the history of the NHL through his first 25, 30 games. Like 22 wins, four losses and something else like that. But like, they're. They're D. I mean, you talk about slaving like Chatfield, to me, you look at the box score and half the games. He's their ice time leader. And I love what Trip Tracy said about him. He plays and shows up to the rink every day. Like, like, I need to prove that I. I need to prove to be here. So to hear that, that was. That was pretty cool. And I mean, like that Walker, like, he's an impressive skater. Like, where did they pick up him. Him from? Was he in Philly?

[Biz]

He was at. Was he in Colorado at one point?

[Whit]

I don't know where he was, but you look at their. Their 6D and how they move. Like, Nikisha's probably lugging the. The least amount of ice, but he's this 6, 3, 64 Russian frame where he's buzzing up and down the ice. So the size and mobility of his back end, the way that it was built Is, is tremendous. And, and what's crazy about this is I would say the, and this is not a knock because I thought that they showed up a lot better towards the end of the Montreal series, but their, their least achieving line out of the four has been I would say and, and Jarvis, that has to change and it has to. If they're going against Vegas. Like, like I'm like the fact that they were able to gain that confidence and put some points up towards the end of that series against Montreal is huge. Huge. Like fetch getting that OT winner. I believe it was game three in Montreal. Like these are confidence boosts that they're going to need. But that fourth line of Robinson, Jankowski and Carrier, that's the type of fourth line you need if you're going to win a Stanley Cup. You're seeing it the exact same thing in Vegas. The third line of Jordan Stahl who. You know how long he's been there. I was shocked.

[Michael Landsberg]

It's.

[Biz]

It's pretty crazy. And to get to go back to the cup final too is like he's 14. How long is it? 12 years now for this 14th year

[Whit]

with the Carolina Hurricane. He signed before they, they put a clamp on the, the, the length of contract he signed because he. I don't. I think it was partly because he wanted to go play with his brother but also I think that he, it felt like at the time maybe he wanted a little bit of a more predominant role on a team and he signed that 10 year deal at 6 million a year and then now he's making like 3 million bucks as one of the top third line center in the league. And the fact that he gets to play with, with Martinook which we've talked about him and then that, that either signing like what a. What a great third line. What a great buy in line at the fact that a guy who just signed for 50 sheets is willing to take a back seat third line minutes and then like, like not enough can be said about this second line and what they've done throughout this three first rounds like that is. That is the biggest double barrel. Like you fucking doubted me. Fuck you. Shove it up your hoop as far as a second line. Especially when you in regards to Stank Hoven playing center for the first time in his NHL career this year to help you this lead this team.

[Biz]

Let me ask you this about Stahl. Are you putting him with. With home ice the first two games? Are you matching him with Eichel, Dora Feev and Barbershev or Carlson Howden And Marner.

[Whit]

So the, this is, this is going to be the most interesting part of this series is, is with Carolina having home ice, which is massive for them is how they're going to handle the matchups. And I don't, I don't know how much they focused on that throughout the first three rounds.

[Biz]

They haven't have to, they haven't had.

[Whit]

Right. They haven't had to. Maybe you saw it a little bit through gameplay like where they would do it for a couple shifts just to make sure. But when you start line matching you start kind of in some cases getting worried about that and not distributing the ice. And I think that Carolina's bread and butter is the fact that they're able to maintain that pace as we saw against Montreal. Like they fucking schooled them one through four and you're seeing that fourth line just like Vegas in that 11 to 12 minute range. So I don't know. But they're also boys like let's be real here. The, they're tough. Their best opponent I believe was Ottawa. Okay. They ended up sweeping them. That was probably the closest overall series as far as like how many scoring chances Ottawa was generating. Ottawa was snake bit. Like how many breakaways and golden opportunities did Steutzel and Brady have where they didn't capitalize on? So no, they haven't done it to this point because they haven't had to. But they're, they haven't been against a team who has already won a cup with that core who you're dealing with like world class players top to bottom like Jack Eichel, like Mitch Marner, like Carlson, you know, Theodore, like. So I don't know what the, what the answer is but at this point if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Maybe roll it out game one the way you've been going and then make adjustments through there. But this, that's going to be the toughest question.

[Biz]

Keith, my, my thought and tell me what you think. I think you put them on Marner, Carlson and Howden because they're a little smaller right. So it's like maybe you can really suffocate that line. Okay. And you can trust now can you trust Stank over against Eichel that that's like the issue here and that's the biggest problem for Carolina if they're to lose. I, I, I'm not, no, no Shade at Carolina. They don't have an Eichel or a Marner up front. Their 6D are better overall 6D I believe than Vegas. But in terms of star power up front, Eichel and Marner and I haven't even said Stone. They're a step above any forward on Carolina in my opinion.

[Whit]

Well, and they're. And, and Stone is now playing third line on the wing with Hurdle and then they got Sizzins in the middle. So yeah, they now have four threatening lines just as much as Carolina if not more personally. Boys, I would, I would go to a ho in that line if you are going to line match and I would say there's your guy. This is your, this is going to be your, your. This is going to be your. This will be your Mona Lisa. We don't care if you score like to the rate that we maybe expect you to, but he hasn't necessarily done that all playoffs. Your main, your main role here is can you shut down these big boys and can we just basically have that trade off and then you go to Carlson against the Stankhoven line. So it's. And I mean look at then, then you got Stall against fucking the Stone and, and, and Hurdle who all of a sudden has turned into. He's. He's turned into like the league's most. The biggest power forward going. When we were fucking chirping them throughout for the, you know, the first and half the second round.

[Keith]

Yeah, I, I think for me and I was one of those guys too saying I don't want them in the finals. I don't think that they're fun to watch through two series but I think they've proven that they are a fun team to watch and the way that they've all bought in like they. I think this series is going to be amazing. I think the first two series were a little bit of a dud because they're sweeps and it's like okay, it's just Carolina going out there and you know, winning these games very kind of easily I guess. But I, I think Montreal gave him a. Especially in that game one you saw that they can play a fast game. Obviously they lost that game but they can play an up speed game. They can make plays if they want to but they're just such a well rounded like they do everything the same exact way. That's why I don't think they have to line match. They don't have to be like okay Ajo. Every time Eiko jumps over the boards you're going. Because all four of their lines can do it. They're not like we got to hide this one line from this, you know, from the Eichel line or Hide this line from the Marner line. I think that they're all systems ago. They can put. They can put any four lines out there and be happy and be trusting that that matchup. So I just think that's the way Caroline is built in the way that Rod is, you know, built this team one through four and they're D, man, they're D are big, they're long, they're. I think Biz, you said they remind you of Florida, right, where they're, you know, they're. They're not overly physical, right? Like maybe Chatfield's the most physical guy back there. But they're not out there killing guys every shift. They're just disrupting guys. Disrupting guys. Not letting you in. In the. Not letting you in the zone clean. Like you telling me right now if Marner Eichel, guys like that when they're coming through the middle and they can't come in with possession, they got to have to make dumps. They're going to have to. And they make you make bad dumps too. Like Anderson stopping it, getting out of their zone like that can frustrate those big time, those big. The big boys, right? Like if you're Jack Eichel, you don't want to be dumping the puck in, right? You're. You're an all time player. You want the puck on your stick. But they forced these teams to play the way that they want to play and it's been a master class through three rounds so far. But the big, big question is, can they do it against this team? Because realistically they've kind of had a cakewalk to the finals, would you say?

[Whit]

I would say. I would say that that's the worry. Yeah, that's the thing.

[Keith]

Are they battle tested, right? Like they've, they've lost one game. Shout out to them for losing only one game in playoffs so far, an amazing feat. But now it's the, it's the big boys from the west and in. In Vegas I think is a little more proven with who they've beaten. They've won some tighter games closer series. So I, I think, I mean everyone had Colorado winning that series like the, the people that know what they're talking about and they work them. They absolutely work them. So I think this series is going to be incredible. I think that there's no way it doesn't go seven. Watch, it'll go four now. But I think it's one of those ones that it's going to be an

[Biz]

absolute ball if this isn't a good series. It's going to be a bummer because we're at the point now where the conference finals, for me growing up, they were legendary. I felt like boys.

[Whit]

Maybe I'm just one through eight.

[Biz]

Okay, so that must.

[Whit]

That's it.

[Biz]

They watched you in the East. It was sweet. I think it was. It was at five games this year in the East. Five games last year. Right.

[Whit]

And then it was a sweep last year. Florida swept Carolina, didn't they?

[Biz]

Was it okay, either way, it's. It's four or five games in both conferences the last few years. We're not getting. We're not getting what we hope. So you need a good cup final. And, and obviously like two years ago,

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

it was in five games.

[Whit]

Last year, Carolina beat them one game.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Yeah.

[Keith]

Was it an overtime game?

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Game four?

[Whit]

Three.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Three. Nothing.

[Biz]

Just to stay alive. But I mean, the conference finals at this point and yeah, so biz. It's just one through eight. That's what, that's what needs to get the conference finals back.

[Whit]

I. I think so. Like, I'm not like, listen, if we've kind of gone back and forth on this and it's been a huge topic and I'm sure like Gary, if he listens or, or any of the people at the NHL, they're like, would you shut the up about the 1 through 8? And, and listen, you get some iconic first round matchups in some cases in the second round, but if they want their nut and that's their March Madness and that's when all the advertisers care and that's when everybody is still more focused on hockey because we're not in June, then. Yeah, I get it. That's when you want the best series being played, but you just mention it. As a result, you're not getting these iconic conference finals anymore. Like, when's the last time we had a conference final go to seven games?

[Biz]

That's a great question because we're going

[Whit]

to look it up now. Another side note here. It was cool to see the list of conference finals winners touch or not touch the trophy and who went on to win or not win. It was interesting to see that Crosby didn't touch it the first time against Detroit. They lost and then all three other times they touched the conference finals trophy. And one. So there he's three for four when getting to the finals and all three times he touched the trophy.

[Biz]

So did you see Brenda Moore's quote when they.

[Whit]

Yeah, yeah.

[Biz]

He's like, you do whatever you want to me. I'm not playing. You know I'm not. But don't touch it.

[Keith]

If you say you can do whatever you want but don't touch it.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

That's.

[Keith]

There's only one other thing to do.

[Whit]

There's no other option. That's comedy. That's comedy right there.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

This is kind of crazy. I'm seeing 2018. The Washington Capitals and Tampa Bay Lightning were the last time conference finals went to game seven. That's crazy.

[Whit]

How. How many. How many in since 2020 have even gone to six games?

[Biz]

Carolina in the RA. Did they play the Rangers the one year they went to? No. Who would that have been? Florida and the range. Florida and the Rangers went to six. I think one year somewhat recently.

[Whit]

But of like. So if you went to. If you went over the last six years.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Wait, you're correct. You are correct. Is that the only one in 2024, Florida and the Rangers went six.

[Biz]

Edmonton and Dallas went to six.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Edmonton.

[Biz]

I think Edmonton beat him in five

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

last year and two years ago, 2024, Edmonton and Dallas went six. The year before that, Vegas and Dallas went six. But then the years. I mean, last year of 12 series

[Whit]

since 2020 have gone to six games. That's fucking brutal. No, seven and three to six. So if you want to have the one through eight argument, and then as far as gameplay, the deeper it goes in the playoffs, there's your answer right there. Nil.

[Keith]

Like the argument of the first series being amazing. The first round usually is incredible.

[Whit]

Yeah.

[Biz]

Yeah, I know. But I. I still think you're gonna

[Keith]

get the first round. Yeah.

[Biz]

I just want a better conference final like this. That was tough this year.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

I think typically, though, too, like. Like we see it in our numbers as well. Like, views kind of drain off as you go later into the season. It's every single year we see it. And it's like if. If you have better series later in the. In the playoffs, views won't go down and the interest will stay high.

[Biz]

Or is it the problem that it's like summer's arriving and then no matter what.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Exactly. And that's how you keep up with summer. You got to have good series later, Right?

[Biz]

Well, we talked Carolina. Let's.

[Whit]

I would just say if. If. If one thing for them has to be better, it's power play. And I don't know what the percentage is for Carolina right now up to this point. You go back to, I believe it was game four in Montreal. Like, they were dominant for 58 minutes. The worst part of their game is when they had that five on three. You know they looked, they looked awful, right? So against an unbelievable penalty kill in Vegas and a team that locks you down, it's impossible to get to the inside. And I'm sure it's going to be, you know, fairly low scoring because Carolina can't score at ease when they're playing against good quality teams. They got to be able to figure out and capitalize on the power play, at least not be giving up shorthanded goals like we've seen from every other team over the course of this run. And so car shout out Carolina, they got a lot of good things cooking right now and I guess we'll, we'll focus on the, the, the, the evil, the dark side of the league also.

[Biz]

Game one winner in the Stanley Cup Final wins the series 77% of the time. Oh I was surprised that that's like. And I think when the game one home team wins I think it's even higher but in terms of Vegas. So this is a tweet from Luke Fox. In less than 11 months the Vegas Golden Knights acquired the playoffs leading scorer, their stud starting goalie, a top four right shot defenseman, a new cup winning head coach and obviously a trip to the Stanley cup final. And when you look at the roster in terms of how I mentioned Carolina, non first round picks but draft picks. Korzak Dorofiev, expansion draft William Wild, Bill Carlson, Braden McNabb, trade Marner Barbershev, Stone, Hannifin Howden, Theodore Cole, Smith, Sissons Hurdle, Eichel Dowd, Riley Smith Kolasar, Jeremy Lauzon, Rasmus Anderson, Aiden Hill and Carter Hart. A free agent. It, it's wild and you have to, you have to say that being in Vegas. Ok so you're, you're not, it's not a crazy media market which some guys really love. It's great weather, it's no state tax. They are one of the cities in the league that guys are going to forever want to play. They're, they're always going to want to play there. I think of Tampa like that. Florida's like that, Dallas is like that, Vegas is like that.

[Whit]

Oh there's a lot of common, common theme there.

[Biz]

And you're no state tax thing has a legit thing. But what do you mean?

[Whit]

It's been every fucking year. I know since 2020. Go look at all the winners and all the teams that have had like Florida, Vegas, Dallas like all.

[Biz]

They're not going anywhere. Like they're, it's, it's not going to change like those teams and free Agency is not what it once was. But if you're going to trade a guy who still signed knowing that we're not going to trade for him unless he's going to sign here, which is kind of how it works. Now, you see Marner, and it was his rights. It wasn't within the season, but that's what's going to happen. And so the way they've been able to do it, I don't like them, but they have great management. Cass was a great coach there. Now Tortorella is doing a hell of a job. You, I hate them. Out of jealousy, like, that's kind of where they're at. And I think we should bring in our guy. Our guy who's been on this for a long time. A guy who has said we don't ever need to keep our draft picks because they give us more every single year. And we'll trade those away as well. Bring in Liam Block.

[Whit]

He's like officially part of the dark side. I think that Vegas.

[Keith]

Oh, yeah.

[Whit]

To management.

[Keith]

Look at.

[Biz]

He's in all black.

[Whit]

He knows. He knows where the bodies are buried. What's up, Blunt?

[Blutman]

I don't know where the bodies are.

[Whit]

Oh, yeah, right, yeah.

[Biz]

Okay.

[Whit]

You've been burying for him. Okay, man, look at you.

[Blutman]

Yeah, I'm ready to go, man. I don't know.

[Biz]

You look exactly like a guy who knows where bodies are buried.

[Blutman]

I gotta be honest, I've never seen him smile.

[Keith]

Have you ever seen him smile? He's all ear to ear. Smile, giddy.

[Whit]

I'm giddy.

[Biz]

He's itchy. He's itchy. Now, Blutman, I want to. I want to preface this for people who don't know. Blutman is an actual enormous tennis guy as well. Before the year of the playoff, before the playoffs begin, he always releases a list of teams that will not win the Stanley Cup. And if they do, he can't watch Wimbledon, which apparently is like his favorite thing in the world. One of those teams, which. It's amazing how it's come, is the Carolina Hurricane. So you have said for years they are not a threat. That has to scare you. Now you got some serious karma going on in your world.

[Blutman]

I mean, I've been right like six straight years. You know, this time it's getting dangerous. But it was dangerous with Edmonton the last two, and I was out on top. I gotta keep showing my way. Look, I'm a big believer that we. We get in the airwaves and we say a lot of things and we. We say things and we Never back it up with, with substance takes with stakes. That's all this is. I'm a believer in what I say. I, I'm going to continue a road and just so happens the dark side, my side is going to be the ones that need to put an end to them. So we're going to work on that and we're going to do it. You know what I'm saying?

[Biz]

Are you, are you worried? Like are. Are you in fear of this team? Do you actually still consider them as like note? Because to say that they can't win the Stanley cup. To me that says they get to the final against your team you still have to be like oh no, I'm not worried. I told you they can't win.

[Blutman]

Worry. That's not the correct word. I'm just very anxious. I hate the way I just ever since we won game four it was like a three minute celebration for me and I was on to game one. Game one, game one. I want to get this series. I really truly do. Like no I Western Conference champions, Eastern Conference champions, whatever it be. Don't touch the trophy. I don't want any of that merch. You know what I'm saying? I want Stanley cup merch. That's what we're playing for and that's all I've been focused on. That's all I'm thinking about. I woke up today. What was, what was Liam Blutman's first thought on June 1st the new month. Woke up at like 5:50 a day cup week. No, first thought was man Pavel Dorfe was going to have a heck of a series.

[Biz]

I thought you were saying man I'm hungry.

[Blutman]

Here we go. I got a p. No Doro is going to have a great series and you know I look back I see the two regular season means not the wyrue cares But Dorfave has three goals against Carolina in the two games this year. Oh geez got him plus 4,000 Colin Smile. They had 14 shot attempts in two games against Carolina. Woke up with the feel I think it's going to be a big Doro series.

[Keith]

Are you worried at all with like the. The odds makers have Carolina the favorite here. Do you think that or that's just because Carolina's only lost one game?

[Blutman]

It doesn't bother me. We are big favorites big underdogs against Colorado. We've been slayed the entire postseason from an odds for so it doesn't mean anything to me too much weight on regular season hockey.

[Biz]

Be non biased then and tell me why Vegas is. In terms of gambling. Vegas has Carolina's favorites.

[Blutman]

Why do they. Well, Vegas and Carolina, both those teams are pretty beloved by, like, models data, the betting stuff. Carolina's always been at the top of that. I guess that's what you get when you got a mad scientist of a GM shout out to Tolski for what he's been able to build. They. They love the. The shock one.

[Whit]

Can we put up a picture of Tulski, by the way, for those of you watching who. Who doesn't know what the mad scientist looks like, I would say, like, if. If Mark Ricci won sexiest man in. In Colorado, this guy should win sexiest man in the Carolinas.

[Keith]

Yeah, both the Carolinas.

[Michael Landsberg]

North and South.

[Whit]

Both. Both double state.

[Biz]

I agree. I agree with you on that.

[Blutman]

Wait to answer. I really think that why Vegas loves Carolina from a bang standpoint is the shot disparity and what they do defensively. And just like, you know, they're not giving the main goals. I just think that's it.

[Whit]

I'll make you a bet, Blunt. Yeah, I. I picked Vegas in six. How about I get a pinky in the brain tattoo? If. If, if. If Vegas wins and you get a Tulsky tattoo on you.

[Blutman]

Not a tattoo guy.

[Whit]

What do you mean? You're not a tattoo guy, but your fucking balls on your line. You talk about the steaks. Hey, these takes with steaks. There's your snake right there, buddy. That's a filet mignon. 20 ounces, medium rare, right in your.

[Blutman]

My mother will never talk to me.

[Whit]

Oh, yeah? Well, you don't love anyone. Doesn't matter.

[Blutman]

Biz came so prepared. Viz is dialed.

[Whit]

Oh, I'm buzzing.

[Keith]

You guys are on the same team, though, Biz. You can't be going at him like this.

[Whit]

But listen, I know we. We talked around a lot about, like, how cutthroat Vegas is and stuff like that. Like, let's go back to the fact that the coaching change. Like, there's Tulski right there. That's the tattoo bloody's gonna have right on his neck right here. I think he looked good right here. Yeah. You gotta win it. I love that pocket square. Can you zoom in on that pocket square? He's got it. It looks like a Grand Tetons.

[Biz]

I don't love that. It kind of looks like a castle,

[Keith]

and it looks like Simpsons hair.

[Whit]

That's the Grand Teton speaking to me. It's speaking to me. That's a national park right there. That is, you know.

[Blutman]

No, whoa, whoa.

[Whit]

Zoom in. Closer.

[Michael Landsberg]

It looks.

[Whit]

It looks like, like a gang band.

[Biz]

It is something.

[Whit]

Oh my God.

[Keith]

Dude, he's.

[Biz]

I could see what is ripped up.

[Whit]

He's got to be.

[Biz]

He's a Bond villain.

[Whit]

Yeah, he is. But listen to. To Gas. To Ga Gas Cassidy that close to playoffs, like, I don't dig, by the way. And we just had him on. I wish I would have known this information before we, before we let him go. But like, apparently around the room, it was kind of one of these things where it's like, if we don't make playoffs, who cares? It was just a miserable, miserable, miserable atmosphere. Like they were counting down the days to the season was over. And I know at the time, like, they were like still in a playoff spot. But the, the, the, the jubilation.

[Biz]

The room was gone. What's that saying? The room was gone.

[Whit]

It was gone. They were checked out. They. They were miserable. So we talk about how sometimes coaches like, they, they keep tightening the vice. He just, he lost the room. And for, for the. Both McPhee and I'm drawing McCrimmon to pull the trigger that close to playoffs and realize, like, I don't think this group is going to go anywhere with this guy as head coach. And then of all things to go poach John Tuttorella, like, who would have thought in a million years that that would have been the guy? But, but you know, with a room like that, they know those guys are on autopilot. They know what the fuck to do. All those guys in that room, you needed to bring in a guy who has gravitas. Is that the word that keeps getting thrown around? Why are you making that face with.

[Biz]

I was wondering if that was it. I couldn't believe that Tortorella. I thought he knew Kelly McCrimmon. Right? I'm guessing all the years. Right. He never even knew him. He never met him, never knew him.

[Whit]

He was shocked when he got the text.

[Biz]

My.

[Michael Landsberg]

Shocked.

[Blutman]

I. I thought was maybe McCrimmon poked around and asked about. Asked Eichel and Hanifin after the Olympics about.

[Whit]

And was that the case?

[Blutman]

I'm. I'm sure it was. I don't know where the bodies are buried, though.

[Whit]

It's gotta be.

[Keith]

But good for him for, for recognizing that the guys were checked out and to make that move. How many GMs would do that? Like, not like Lou Lamarillo is the one that I can think of in the last, you know, 40 years that's done something like that where it's like to recognize it and to do it just Means you have a pulse of your team and you have one goal, and that's to win the Stanley Cup. And that's what they're trying to do. And like, how good is that as a fan? Bloody.

[Blutman]

It's incredible. As a fan. I mean, I. I remember texting you guys throughout the season. And I looked back, the date that I texted with, I believe was like, February 1st. I said, I'm losing confidence in this group. And then we'd keep texting you guys and be like, it is a slog. It is not joyous at all to watch them. And it shows in their play. It was a true grind to play 60 minutes. The only good thing about that January, the mid March stretch, is how much they trailed from behind and how that's the one thing that really, really pops in their play still, is they got so much work having to grind out these games, coming from behind, all these late pushes. I mean, you guys see what they could do from 30 down against Colorado and these other comeback wins they've had. That's the one thing that I'm grateful for. But yet, like, wit texted saying, bloody. I love that move. When Cassidy got fired and they bring in Torts on March 28, Whit knew in the time that that was. That was like, the thing you needed. That was the jolt, the flip of the switch to just get the. I. I'm not surprised at all that you said that they were looking forward to the end of the regular season, win or lose. I'm not surprised at all by that. That's how it felt.

[Biz]

Well, they could have been like, yeah, if we miss he's fired. Like, at this point, like, and. And people may hear that and be like, what the fuck? But when a room's gone, it's gone. And then you got. You got groups of guys after games having dinner, and they're just like, this is fucking miserable. And it. And it happens. It happens a lot more than people think. And the crazy thing is, and it is a completely different team, but they finished the regular season with fewer wins than seven teams who missed the playoffs.

[Blutman]

They had more losses than wins.

[Biz]

It's. That's fucking wild. And they have. And they just swept the President's trophy team. Talk about a league that makes no sense. And when you say I've. I've argued, like coaching in the NHL, obviously it matters, but, like, it doesn't in a sense. And you see moments when it is everything. And this was a prime example.

[Whit]

This proves that it's more about how you're able to motivate your players as opposed to the X's and O's. Especially when you have a group like the Vegas Golden Knights. Like all these guys know how to play hockey. They know the systems inside out. Like it go. It go. I mean like it goes back to how the fact that they don't care about draft picks and developing young players for the most part. Like bloody. I mentioned last podcast, if they win the cup, Calgary Flames have the next three years. They have their first rounder like Yoink. Thanks for Hannifin and Anderson. We don't give a fuck about these late first rounders. Take them. Who gives a shit. So it's, it's, it's remarkable. And I mean we've already complimented each player and what they have as far as top to bottom lines 1 through 4, how their D are built. Would you agree with that? Whit mentioned this. Do you, do you think that from 1 to 6 that Carolina does have the edge on the back end? How do you.

[Keith]

I think it's closer than they say in bloody.

[Blutman]

I think it's pretty. I think it's pretty close that the. There they have it in the top six. I think top four is.

[Whit]

Even Carolina doesn't have the theater. They don't have that offense.

[Biz]

Gossip Bear offensively is completely fine.

[Whit]

That's. That's fair. But he ain't. I don't think he's Theodore offensively.

[Biz]

No, but. I know. But he doesn't need to play the five on five minutes, right?

[Blutman]

Like his lights keep turning off.

[Whit]

Oh, the dark side.

[Biz]

Oh my God.

[Whit]

That's where the fucking bodies are buried. I told you guys.

[Biz]

I do, I do love this. This other tweet that randomly popped up on my timeline. I do kind of dig the Vegas storyline. An organization that treats nobody well, wins at absolutely all costs and isn't apologetic about it. They're not a dirty team either. They're just an evil one. If they win the cup, hockey Twitter is going to burn to the ground.

[Keith]

All very true. Great statement.

[Whit]

Yeah.

[Biz]

Bloody. Rollback. Last question. Use code checkouts on rollback.com for generous. 20 off for your first purchase to the end of the week. C H I C L E t s on rh O-B-K.com 20% off. Polo shorts, hoodies, joggers, everything. What's the series going to end in? In games? I know you're picking Vegas, but are you thinking. We're thinking seven games. I know Biz has six. I have six on home ice, I have seven. Carolina at Home, just like they did against the Oilers in. Oh, six. What do you got?

[Blutman]

I would love for it to end in six in Vegas. That'd be. Both cup wins on home ice. Would be terrific. They could just be super cool to see the Stanley Cup. Read Vegas, Florida, Florida, Vegas. The best two teams the last four

[Whit]

years will be fucking scum of the earth.

[Blutman]

Yeah. Yeah. I. I'm hoping Vegas gets it done in six again. I just. I'm just so excited for this thing to start. And then. And then we could start talking and throw all the banter out there in between days like this. Wait up until opening puck drop is. Is brutal.

[Whit]

Why is it brutal?

[Blutman]

Because I'm just. I'm just itching. I'm chomping at the bear. I'm ready to go.

[Biz]

I know, but there's articles everywhere. It's like all you see is stuff on your team. It's the exciting.

[Whit]

I want the bet. The best thing about this series, Blunt, is both teams going in extremely healthy. That's huge.

[Michael Landsberg]

That.

[Whit]

Watching that. That Florida Vegas series when Vegas stomped them in five games when Florida was so banged up. That's not fun to me. So that I'm. I'm so fired up about. I was going to ask you. If they do have the ability to close out in six on home ice, will you be going to Vegas?

[Blutman]

I have no idea what the answer is. Yes. There were tickets for, like, a gargantuan.

[Whit]

They're not going to fucking charge you to get in the building. I'll. I'll organize. I will meet you in Vegas. If they have the opportunity to close out in six.

[Biz]

You broke a guy's fingers and then buried his body. Like, they'll give you free tickets.

[Whit]

Is that a date?

[Blutman]

That would. That would be incredible.

[Keith]

Another big, big storyline is the Siren.

[RA]

The.

[Keith]

The. Both these games are Siren.

[Whit]

I'm so happy you brought that up.

[Keith]

Hey, listen, I just. I might be.

[Whit]

Vegas stole their own thing. They're the evil villains.

[Keith]

Did you hear who Caroline is bringing out game one?

[Whit]

Who?

[Keith]

Cassidy?

[Whit]

No,

[Keith]

They're trolls on Twitter. They are. They're unbelievable. Their admin team's unreal. If I am the Carolina Hurricanes, I bring in Bruce Cassie to sign that, right?

[Whit]

I would. I would. I would. I would put him in a seat right behind Vegas's bench, too.

[Blutman]

This is incredible.

[Whit]

Hey, he's gonna have. He's gonna have that evil canavels. The costume on.

[Keith]

No, wear the Tulski. The Tulski wig.

[Whit]

That's. Oh, the best salad in the league. Bloody. What Are you from a gameplay perspective, is there anything that maybe concerns you? Like, is there anything that concerns you? Maybe line matchups, maybe pedaly kill?

[RA]

Like.

[Whit]

Like what?

[Keith]

Home?

[Whit]

I like, what is it that, like, concerns you or are you just that confident where you're like, it's all systems go. It's more about us than them.

[Blutman]

I am confident it is all systems go. I love starting this on the road. I love the opportunity to go out there and take home ice in game one, maybe even game two as well. Just want to go into Raleigh though, and take one of those first two. The one concern is it's just obvious. It's the man, man defense and how they absolutely suffocate you. I know that we got our playmakers, Eichel, Marner, Carlson, whoever it be. We've got to be quick with the puck, make some quick decisions and, you know, get out there and not. They can't. We can't let them suffocate us and grind it down. We gotta own the neutral zone and we've owned the neutral zone. Three straight series. There was a lot of talk about how are we going to be able to contain Leo Carlson. There was one moment all series where I was like, wow, look at his speed. A lot of talk about how are we going to be able to contain Nathan McKinnon. You think about the Lake Tahoe game, him playing Pietrangelo on skates. There was one time all serious, was like, wow, look at Nathan's speed. That's the. That's the deal here.

[Keith]

I think the biggest thing for them is not getting frustrated like the big guys get. Cause it's going to be a long series. There's going to be some doldrums during the games where you can't get the puck in. If those big guys cannot get frustrated and continue to play their game, I think, I think their forwards outmatched Carolina's forward. So much better.

[Whit]

That's the key man and Marner touched on it. These guys, they stick with it. They don't turn on each other. They don't start bitching whether that was a shot at. At Toronto and the way things went there and. Or Cassidy and. Or that's just the way this team is gelled and bonded over the last eight games of regular season. I mean, really all year, though. You mentioned they were the comeback kids, right? They fucking figured it out and they would. It didn't matter how many goals they were down. They were. They would figure things out. So blunt, it's interested to hear how confident you are, but I'm not shocked. I'm not shocked.

[Keith]

Well, it's like some may say too confident.

[Blutman]

No, I'm not too confident. I'm just. Yo, they're coming in here 12 and one the postseason. We're coming in here 12 and four. We have of the six series wins, we have the best series win and it's look, I love being the underdog. I love being the evil empire. I love everyone rooting against us. I, I, you know, I love being the villain. Look at this guy. I'm the big bad, the big bad boy in this situation. I'm ready to take another cup, bring it back to Vegas and let Mitchie bring his to Toronto. That's the plan.

[Whit]

I should have. I fucking wit. I, I sent you that text. I was going to put that, that Con Smythe bet in for Marner at 12 to 1. Would you say he's the, he's probably the top dog right now.

[Biz]

What the fuck you sorry line that would work. They're not going to give it to Hart and then all the writers just the Toronto. It's like it's setting up that if they win, he's going to get it. What are the odds right now? Can you zoom in on those or just read them?

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

We have Freddy at Marner at plus 165. Freddy at plus 220. Taylor hall at plus 600. Logan Stankovin at plus 85. 850. Carter Hart at plus 1200. Jackson Blake at plus 1500. Jack Eichel plus 1600.

[RA]

I love that that's his pick.

[Whit]

I at the time Marner was plus 1200. That was before the Colorado series.

[Biz]

Well, he's putting on a fucking clinic.

[Whit]

And I just think that the way that the whole season has gone and how we like joke about the script writers and stuff, I think, I think 93 is going to be bringing a cup home to, to Muskoka as well as a con speaker 2.

[Keith]

Look at all those jerseys.

[Biz]

That's like the main reason I think Vegas is going to win. Just like the fact that he leaves and the first year gone, he wins a Cup and the Con smite. It's just like a storyline that you couldn't even, you couldn't have dreamt this. You couldn't have dreamt this. As someone who can't stand the leaf so bloody. We appreciate it, buddy. I'm sure there'll be a lot of discussion, a lot of arguing on our, on our text chain throughout the next hopefully two weeks and seven games. That's What I want.

[Whit]

Do you communicate with any of the players on the Golden Knights?

[RA]

Liam?

[Biz]

No, he might stalk a couple of them. Does that count as communicating?

[Blutman]

Gary Lawless DM me though, and said I'm his favorite guy at barstool now.

[Biz]

So, so that's another storyline. Gary not coming on with us. Before the series he got me this jersey. He, he literally said, boys, I'll see you, I'll see you when the cup ends. I'm like, no, no. Gary Stoff comes on right before cup finals. Like that's our thing. You're, you're, you're stuff. You're Vegas's stuff. He's like, haha. Love you guys. Seeing.

[Whit]

I think that they're, they're. I think that maybe he's upset about the Cassidy interview. That's what I think.

[Keith]

No, he's probably, he's probably superstitious.

[Whit]

But if they do win, came on

[Blutman]

every series and they've won and you gotta be superstitious.

[Keith]

He came on. No, he came on. He came on before the playoffs started.

[Whit]

I believe he's been on twice, hasn't he?

[Biz]

I think he's been on twice before the playoffs and in the middle one of the. After the first round. No, we talked to him during the Utah series, I believe.

[Keith]

Yeah. When Carlson was coming back. Remember it got announced.

[Biz]

I don't know if he's playing this series. No, that was the Ducks. It was right before the Ducks. And then he played game one.

[Whit]

I'm not kidding either. Got me this jersey. We were game one this year. That's another, that's another crazy. You know, you know why they're going to win in six games at home? Me and Blunt started the season in Vegas. And remember when we were walking around like outside, what do you call it on the Strip? And he called the Dorothea of hat trick. He called it.

[Keith]

That's what he's calling for.

[Whit]

The Dora cocaine on the street right before you made the pick. I'm sure we have the somewhere.

[Biz]

That's what Buddy's like, do I look like a cocaine guy? I'm like, yeah, but you're not.

[Whit]

And, and what's even crazier is Marner. You know how they did the player intros where they come on the golden carpet? Not the red carpet, the golden carpet. He came onto the panel, I did the Mitchie comeback video. And there's the picture of Marner on the panel and Blunt, he's a creep right below. And then, and then, sure enough, when we were inside the building, Lawless came and Delivered this Marner jersey. It's all coming together, boys. It's all coming together.

[Biz]

And so Rod the bot cleaned you cleans and. And Jerk. What is it?

[Whit]

Jerk.

[Biz]

Press. What is it?

[Whit]

Over.

[Biz]

Snatch, clean and snatch. Bloody. Right over. Right over his head. Snaps him in half.

[Keith]

Hey, do you think there's any way that like Brendamore would call Cassidy like if they heard that interview. He was a little bit distraught like wanting to see things up. Do you think there's a chance that he would?

[Whit]

I personally wouldn't just for. I don't want that bad karma. I just want to do it the way I've been doing it. I don't. I'm sure that Cassidy's called them and been like anything you need from me. Let's go all system. I'll work for free.

[Biz]

It's so funny that a guy who a coach, he, you know, he wins a Stanley cup there and obviously he let us know he's. He's upset right now. Rightfully so. It's like he wants them to lose more than any person.

[Whit]

Everything ends in the world. Everything ends ugly with them. Look at hurry like it's just. It's toxic. Anyway. Bloody. We love you. I'll see you in Vegas for game six. And yeah, I'd come out.

[Biz]

I'd come out to that.

[Whit]

Maybe you could facilitate a Marner interview for us.

[Blutman]

I don't got the poll like that. I would love you. I would love if all you guys were there for a game six close. I'd show you the child at home. I'd show you guys around Vegas and biz. One last thing because that Vegas trip, that season opener, we blew that game in the third period to LA by still walked away knowing that was a Stanley Cup. I was texting you during the game. You were up in the panel. I was looking at you.

[Michael Landsberg]

You were looking at me.

[Blutman]

I was texting. This is a cup contest. Like this is the most talented team we had. I leave that game. Me and Uncle Kenny, we're going back and I do a video. And the last words I say in the video where I'll see you back here for a Stanley cup final this season.

[Keith]

Is this true, Biz?

[Whit]

Yeah, buddy. All this is dead. I even tucked it in that night as well after we went to the Rhino and blew Liam salary.

[Biz]

I would love to see Uncle Kenny Blutman too. That's just.

[Blutman]

That's. I FaceTimed the handle last week, two weeks ago, whenever to talk to Uncle Kenny. But he didn't answer.

[Keith]

All right.

[Biz]

Bloody all right. We'll talk to you.

[Blutman]

I love you all. As a collective.

[Biz]

Yeah. Getting him out. Get him out.

[Whit]

He said he loved us.

[Biz]

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[Biz]

Pinned is having a huge sale for Father's Day. This is a great move for any dad who likes golf up to 50% off site wide. Take advantage of the sale and [e-mail] Pin Golf is a golf tech company that makes products to help you play better golf and have more fun on the course. Rangefinder, speakers and the caddy GPS tablet. This is the best time to shop pins products and get everything you need to upgrade your golf bag this season. Keith the the package we got the one you opened of the it's the rangefinder, it's the speaker, it's the distance to the front, the back, the pin while pumping music right on the It's Incredible.

[Keith]

I think it's the best. Like, usually when you get something like that with the speaker, it's like, oh, these things are all the same. Not with pin. Dude, this is unbelievable. I used, I've used it twice now. The rangefinder is outstanding. Have you used the rangefinder yet?

[Biz]

It's amazing. No, so I haven't used the rangefinder. I got the speaker with the distance that's been used, that thing and, and the, the. The map of the 45, 000 courses all over the world that's on the caddy. It's on sale for the first time all year. Get distances and flyovers of every hole, track, wagers and Games on an 8 inch magnetic tablet that you can stick to your cart. Get your dad a range finder for Father's Day. Different color options. Magnetic. The perfect gift for the dad who's always asking you for distance on the course. It's on sale for under $200. Check out the rest of the Father's day [e-mail] pingolf.com sales up to 50% right now. Site wide. Incredible stuff. Incredible stuff. Keith Biz is off. So it's actually a hilarious time to say, I mean, what a year for hockey Canada. These guys, they didn't even get a medal though. I feel for Sid and like, I, I love Sid, obviously, I love Celebrini, but like, they lost in the bronze medal game to Norway. Norway can't happen. I know. And Ryan O'Reilly after had a quote, so Matthew Tkachuk had a quote after USA was eliminated saying, I never want to be at this tournament again. I don't think people got that. It means you're competing for the Stanley cup final and you can't be there and you can't partake. It's. It looks a lot worse if you don't think of it that way. But then Ryan. Oh, and he kind of got torched for it. Ryan O'Reilly after said, it's just it. To come over here and leave with nothing is. Is. Is just a disgrace and kind of shocking, I would say. Finland seeing Barkov out there again, I was like, oh, my God. Like the Panthers might win the cup next year. I don't think that's a huge, shocking thing to say. But Helenius can't even say his name right. I don't think it's Helenius. He's incredible. He scores the winner. Finland gets it done. But Biz, I just said as you were taking a hose. Tough year for hockey Canada.

[Whit]

Very tough.

[Keith]

Brutal.

[Whit]

Yeah, well, whatever. What are you gonna do? I, I'll, I'll be honest. Like, yes, it would have been nice to bring home a medal from the worlds, but, like, let's be honest, those guys go over there and they, they're out. They like their boo. They're boozing like they're having fun, like they're enjoying each other's company. I don't know, maybe for whatever reason, this year they took it more seriously and they were really trying to win. But, like, I don't give a. About the world. No offense.

[Biz]

That's a fair statement. That's a fair statement.

[Whit]

I've won one myself. Under 18 and the summer one as well. I won two under 18 gold medals. Not a big deal. I just, I don't give a flying fuck.

[Biz]

But a lot to Europe, Biz, had

[Keith]

they won, all the media in Canada would have been talking about, you know, sure, huge.

[Whit]

Not me, Canada.

[Keith]

But now, now everybody's going to downplay it like it's nothing. Come on.

[Whit]

Go back and listen to any spitting Chiclets about world championships, like, during playoffs.

[Keith]

Oh, I know you. Yeah.

[Whit]

Oh, okay. Well, yeah, I mean, I'm not, I, I've been very complimentary of, of, of other countries kind of raising their level of play and, and reaching Canada standards. And as of right now, we got to take a big fat look in the mirror and, and figure out, I mean, yeah, it's, it's, it's not good. We don't, we don't have many things to celebrate as a nation when it comes to sports. So, I mean, we got curling with the little finger flick and then, and then what else? Now, at this point, yeah, that's it.

[Biz]

Biz, it is possibly good news for the world hockey stage that the IIHF has decided Russia could be back. Basically, they're going event by event, which is they're going to decide before each event if Russia is allowed to play. I, I, it's kind of confusing to change. Like, I thought when this announcement would come out, it's like, they're back. No, they're not back, but they're not, like, permanently banned. So there's somewhere in between where they'll decide before. I imagine that before best on best play, it's like, okay, they can play. And then it goes back to world or world juniors, and they say they can't play. But there's a chance now we see Russia in the next best on best.

[Whit]

Yeah. And I think that that is going to be the case in, in the next World cup of hockey. In 2028, I think that they're going to have to invent a new strain of Ozempic for OV to be a part of that one. But I also believe that he will be a part of that one. Even. Even if he's not, like, barring something, I think that next year he has his, His, His. His farewell tour in the NHL. That's my prediction. And then the next year, just based on, like, I mean, guys like, he's not. He can't even skate out there. It's a fucking sideshow. Like, in that. In that regard especially, could you imagine by the end of next season, I think that maybe that following season when they do have the World cup of Hockey, I could see him playing in Russia and then representing his country at the world. And then that's it. See you. See you later. Sayonara. It would be.

[Keith]

I like that take.

[Whit]

It would be brutal. It would be brutal if we didn't have Malkin and OV at one last best on best as like a passing of the torch to the Capri Soft, to the Demidovs, to the whatever offs that are coming up.

[Keith]

Yeah, that's why it would have been nice to have them in this Olympics. Just because those guys were still, you know, playing in Geno. Who knows what he's gonna do. You want him best on best. But I, I agree with you on that because those guys do like to go back and play in Russia for a year when they retire from the NHL. Man, it would just be so good to have seen them in the Olympics with how deep they are now, the goaltending that they have. But if we can get them in the World cup like that, that is huge for hockey, and it just makes the tournament that much even better.

[Whit]

I would. I would personally sign off on OV being able to use Ozempic and the Russian gas for that World cup of Hockey. I know the whole reason everyone would. I know there's a lot of reasons as to why they're not playing, whether it's doping, whether it's like the war, like, there's a lot of things that Russia there, you know, they don't do by the code, exactly.

[Biz]

They're not exactly, you know, above the board usually, and how they go about things.

[Whit]

But for that one specifically, Russian gas, Ozempic, and whatever else that OVI wants to do, let him do whatever the fuck you want as long as he's bringing the gold card.

[Biz]

The Kitchner Rangers are a complete wagon. Memorial cup champs. They took down Everett 6 to 2. They also beat them 6 to 2 in the round robin. Sam O'Reilly. Have you guys heard of Sam O'Reilly?

[Whit]

No.

[Keith]

No.

[Whit]

Is he a player?

[Biz]

First round pick by the Edmonton Oilers couple years back. They traded him.

[Whit]

Oh, no.

[Biz]

I believe he's Ohl mvp. Ohl playoff mvp. Memorial cup mvp. He is now a member of the Tampa Bay Lightning.

[Whit]

Oh, where you at, Stall?

[Keith]

Oh, that was the Isaac Howard trade.

[Biz]

Okay, so now offer Isaac Howard incredible year in the ahl. Was dominant at Michigan State the year before that. I'm not ready to say like oh my God, disaster trade at all because Isaac Howard could play a huge role with the Oilers next year. But the way Sam O'Reilly played this season after the trade, it is a LI. I don't think I could tell the truth of saying Oilers fans aren't like, ah, you know, we're looking at a possible. I've read like unbelievable third line center in the a. In the NHL someday. So Isaac Howard is a little more pressure on him than normal based on who you get traded for. But congrats to, congrats to, you know, Kitchener. What a, what a wagon of a team.

[Keith]

Hasn't Edmonton been looking for a third line center for quite some time?

[Biz]

Well, that's the problem was that Isaac Howard be as a little bit older would be ready to play and have an impact on the oilers before Sam O'Reilly in the window that McDavid has. And I think Isaac Howard's going to be a really good player. So I'm just mentioning that he, he was traded from the Oilers and he just won every single thing I think you can win in junior hockey, individual and team. Yes. Biz.

[Whit]

I went to Kitchener for a public appearance like to like go like, like meet the team and stuff. Like no, like this is maybe two to three years ago. And the reason I was there, it was facilitated by my buddy Jeff Krizakis who's constantly messaging me about like, hey, you guys do these, these college hockey tours? You need to come to Kitchener. Like first class organization. They, they did, they did a remodel to their locker room.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Supposedly it's the nicest facility in, in all of junior hockey right now.

[Whit]

Yeah. Yeah, they have like a golf simulator in there for the boys. I think they do a lot of their like quote unquote homeschooling because like their, their schedules are pretty crazy, right? They're more hockey focused and schooling but they have like a like a school room there where they're able to like do their, their studies at the rink. Like they are just top titty as far as junior hockey is concerned. And listen, these CHL teams are going to have to start doing this type of stuff in order to compete with what's going on with all this college money.

[Biz]

So it's now just go to the CHL and then you go to college. It's just turned in. The USHL's fucked. The National Team Development program could be in a tough spot. Carter Meyer, who. I played with his dad. I played with his dad, Freddie, he left the National Team Development Program, go to the Quebec League. He needs a release. He's going to play with his brother next year. Yeah, it's a crazy story. I actually want to. I want to talk to Ramparts. I want to talk to Freddie Moore and. And, you know, before we really discuss it, But a crazy, you know, I shouldn't say crazy, but you know, something you haven't seen before, where you're leaving the National Development Program, which I've heard things are. They're at a crossroads, which it seems like the entire junior hockey landscape is at a crossroads, but it's turning into. I think there was a kid the year before, J.P. hubert, something like that, or left. He left to go to the whl. And it's a little scary for USA Hockey, I'm not gonna lie. And interestingly enough, star player on Everett, Landon Dupont. So we've talked about Mickey Dupont, who is a member of the Wilkes Penguins organization. He's a great offense, great guy in Europe as well. His kid is disgusting, nasty.

[Whit]

Like Scott Needham.

[Biz]

You're looking at, like, Quinn Hughes, Scott. Any. Any, you know, undersized, a little bit defense, and it's incredible. And now every season ends and then all the news is, where's he going to go to college? And all of a sudden, I think he's going to be going on visits and, you know, Michigan will be in the mix and, you know, all these other teams with probably big dough and big pockets will be in the mix. But the question I have, and I wonder is Keaton Verhoff, who Stoff had mentioned to us, I think was like the best defenseman to ever come out of Western Canada. He went to North Dakota. And I wonder if going into the draft, if he'd stayed in the whl, would he be getting drafted higher? Like, I think it's a. It's a valid question based that all of a sudden you've seen G and you follow this a little more closely. Like his name's dropped a little bit. I think.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Yeah, he had a Real tough Frozen four.

[Biz]

But it's a lot. It's a, it's. It's harder hock and that, that is not even a chirp. It's old way older men in college hockey. So it's probably best for your development. Is it best to play your draft year in college hockey? It's very difficult. You've seen celebrity and Eichel and certain guys be able to light it up. You've seen a lot of other guys be like, holy fuck, this is not the chl.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

So the NC Wit too is like, it's a, it's a conference of bigger, stronger, Western League type guys. The 23, 24 year old guys that are just old and big and play heavy. I mean that's why we've seen what eight of the last like 10 national championships have come from the NCHC. So I, you mentioned Landon Dupont, though I, I wouldn't be surprised one bit. You said he's going to. He could end up with a team with money. I wouldn't be shocked one bit if Denver comes in and just scoops him up here like.

[Whit]

But they don't, but they don't pay their players.

[Biz]

I heard after, I heard after that that that is kind of false. I heard that that is kind of false. We're going to have to. To do some more digging on that one. I think Denver has a little bit of money. Actually. I'm not.

[RA]

We.

[Whit]

No, they give them free Chipotle, which is basically like a million bucks, those guys.

[Biz]

But g. Right now is Landon DUPONT the consensus first overall pick for 2027?

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

No question about it right now. No qu. I love Carter Meyer too, and I think he's making.

[Biz]

He's sick.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

I think he's making a great move going to Quebec. I feel like the development program was almost too easy for him. So go to Quebec. You're playing against older guys. It'll be a little bit better for you. But yeah, I think Landon Dupont right now. I mean especially with like what guys like Quinn Hughes and Kale Makar and Zach Orinsky have done over the past few years. And you're seeing how much value these puck moving defensemen have. I think it's no question he's going to be the story of college hockey next year. Him along with the Plant, the three Plant brothers that are playing at Minnesota Duluth. They'll be the story of college hockey with.

[Keith]

Wait, I just wanted to ask you about Those guys like McKinnon and Verhoff who left juniors to, to ultimately test themselves. Right? You're Going to a tougher league with older players. And I know, I know he had mentioned it in the doc that you guys did with him. Like, he knew he wasn't going to be putting up the same amount of numbers. He knew the game wasn't going to be as easy. But at the end of the day, man, like, if you're getting yourself better, you're getting yourself to that level, who cares if you drop a pick or two?

[Biz]

I agree, but I think some people do. I. I'm in agreement with you, but

[Keith]

I think it's not like that.

[Whit]

But those signing bonuses are capped anyway.

[Keith]

They're all the same.

[Whit]

Yeah, it's all the same. It's all the same. Basically, if you're a top 15 pick,

[Biz]

I agree with you. If you drop, if you're a guy that's considered, go for going to a

[Keith]

better team, I think that if you

[Whit]

have a mentality of you're staying a junior because you want to be a higher pick, I would avoid that guy at all costs. That, that. That tells me everything, what you got between the ears. I want guys who want to challenge themselves and, like, learn, learn, like, put me against harder competition. We fucking drop the line here all the time. Iron sharpens. Iron. Iron Ryan Whitney.

[Biz]

And you're going to frat parties and football games. Probably enjoying your life a little bit more.

[Whit]

Pushed a little.

[Biz]

Better for sure than. Than. All right, so we got Michael Lansburg coming on soon. Is he ready now? G or no?

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Needs a few minutes here.

[Biz]

Needs a couple minutes. Okay.

[Whit]

Any other subjects that we could talk about in the meantime?

[Biz]

Mason McTavish's name has been thrown around as a petrol trade target for the Ottawa Senators, apparently.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Well, his dad. His dad was like the first hire. Dale McTavish was, I believe, was the first hire that Steve Staios made when he came in. So that's why McTavish Mason's name is kind of floating around the Senator's organization.

[Biz]

It seems as though being a healthy scratch in the playoffs, it's like, when that's happening to a guy who's considered a big part of that core, I could definitely see options of being traded or moving on from a guy because there's. There's something there that Quennville didn't love. Right. And then all of a sudden, like, can you. Can you work through that and can in your exit meeting, you be on the same page of what needs to happen in the summer for you to not be sitting out in playoff games in the most meaningful games, or is it kind of like we've seen many times, coach and player, they, they don't mix. And I don't, I don't know. I'm not in that room.

[Whit]

But I, I think there's room for him to get better. I think that like, you know, he's still young. Right. I think that the signs after the, the, the contract negotiation and the fact that they're going to need money, boys, because they're going to have to pay Dylan Gunther or not Dylan Gunther go. And Carlson. Like, I wouldn't be shocked if somebody offer sheets Leo Carlson.

[Biz]

Yeah.

[Keith]

And then you got Seni after that and Seni.

[Whit]

So they got those three guys up for payment. I would rather. What does, what does McTavish make? Six and a half?

[Keith]

No, I think he makes more.

[Whit]

Maybe seven.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

He makes seven.

[Whit]

I think that he's gone.

[Keith]

But do you think it's one of those things? Because they did scratch him in playoffs. They like they would have to eat some of the salary.

[Whit]

No.

[Keith]

They really want.

[Whit]

No, he's young. He's young.

[Biz]

No, but you're right in terms of. You're not selling high.

[Keith]

That's what I mean. Like, what are you going to get right now after you're there?

[Whit]

I think that a guy like McTavish, it's. I don't know, something that they can fill in in a spot where, I mean, I'm trying to think of their roster, like maybe like that might be the type of guy that you, you get rid of for like a first round pick.

[Biz]

Yeah.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

People have mentioned Pittsburgh. People have mentioned Pittsburgh. That would be a good landing spot for him.

[Whit]

I mean there's a few. Obviously Anaheim has to tinker the roster a little bit, but I feel like they got their foundational pieces and they're. And they're going to be fine. So I think that, that for sure, like kind of like with Zigres. Remember when they went through the contract bullshit. Like it just was like, oh, okay. They're not starting off on the right foot. Don't know exactly if he's. He's Quinville's cup of tea as well as. As what Verbeek knows what's going to be able to get them over the top. Like that guy making 7 million compared to what you're gonna have to pay everybody else. It doesn't work.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Real quick offer. You guys mentioned offer sheets and the Ducks. I do think Olin Zellweger, I think he's a guy who could definitely get offer sheeted this summer. Like he just, he was getting healthy Scratched at the end there. 22 years old, Puck moving D man. You know, obviously a hot commodity around the league. He actually looked good in the games he got in there, but they're just, they, they have too many guys in the back end. They're just not going to be able to fit him in there.

[Biz]

Well, we know there'll be 31 teams gunning to offer sheet dorothyv. I mean, nobody's taking it easy on Vegas after the, after the run he's

[Whit]

had and he's gonna reject them all and sign an eight year deal at seven million bucks just to be happy in a no tax day with sunshine and, and Cirque du Soleil.

[Biz]

We're gonna bring on Michael Landsberg, but we want to talk about no Bill first Biz. This episode is brought to you by Noble. I can't stop wearing my journey toos. It's just they're everywhere. Barstool's favorite footwear brand is Noble. It's a brand known for their best in class footwear. And they're everywhere right now. Walking around city to city, at the airport, grabbing coffee wherever I go. They've got so many great styles and colors, but we've been loving the journey twos. This is Noble's daily running shoe with an emphasis on comfort, support, dependability, software. You want structured where you need biz. Have they been worn everywhere by you?

[Whit]

I was just on the road in the conference finals. It's all I was wearing on my feet. Wayne was.

[Biz]

With your suit too?

[Whit]

Not with my suit.

[Biz]

Come on.

[Whit]

I just, I, I had my Noble tracks sito on. I was farting in that thing the whole plane ride. And the, the material is so good that it wasn't letting it out. So Wayne didn't have to smell my farts the entire time. So the material they use on their track seedos and some if not most people who wear them are labeling them the best shoe ever made, especially for training, running, whatever you need to do them in. They're incredible.

[Biz]

The journey I made my buddy on vacation put them on and he's like, ready? Yeah. I go put these on. And he's like, oh my God. Like I. People think we're doing an ad right now. This is straight up fact.

[Whit]

They're unbelievable.

[Biz]

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[Whit]

Two things. Have you worn the noble tracks?

[Biz]

Yes.

[Whit]

Unbelievable.

[Biz]

I have not farted next to Wayne Gretzky in mine though.

[Whit]

I know, but I'm telling you, if you ever do fart next to somebody important, it won't let the fart out because the materials are so good.

[Biz]

So that's that. To the ad read.

[Whit]

We talk constantly about who's like the journey twos, but you have to check out their apparel. It's unbelievable. And the second thing is, as far as body armor water, I get it sent to the house. A lot of people, like, they don't give it a chance because maybe they see other ones at the gas station where they're more familiar with. Everybody who tries it at my place is like, oh, my God. I didn't realize how. How good the body armor water is. It's fucking unbelievable. Like, it's. If you go, if you put a tester of all the waters of bottled water next to each other with no label on it, I bet you that's the one you're picking majority of the time. So shout out to body armor and everything they got going for us. And we got to bring on our next guest, a very special one.

[Biz]

Bring him in right now. Michael Landsberg. Mike, what's going on?

[Michael Landsberg]

Well, what's going on? Pumped for this. Already pissed off. You called me Mike. Nobody calls me Mike. Used to be the running joke. And off the record biz. Thanks for hooking me up and pleasure to be here, guys. And let me say this, that in real seriousness that you guys have the ability with your platform and with your audience and with your attitude, like, no bullshit. You know, we're. We're just talking like real guys. You guys can change the way men look at mental health more than any platform out there.

[Whit]

Well, I appreciate. I just, I thought it was important to bring you on. Like, we, we do talk about it sometimes. Michael.

[Michael Landsberg]

I gotta make sure.

[Biz]

Michael.

[Whit]

Michael. But you know, like, you know, we. We. We're trying to keep it a little bit more positive around here most of the time, and we do touch on it when it is necessary, but we just felt like bringing you on was. Was the play because, like, you've been ahead of this for a very long, long time. You've dealt with your personal struggles, and we just figured that you'd be the one to be able to get through to a lot of people listening if they are dealing with something in order to. To. To reach out to the right outlets and handle things the right way. So we appreciate you and everything that you've done in the mental health space. And ever since you were on. On TSN and talking about all this stuff before, it was like, at the time you were doing it, it was kind of like faux pas. Like, not many people were talking about this and really understood what it even

[Michael Landsberg]

was, you know, thanks for all that. It's. It's. It's funny how it just fell into my lap. I mean, I battled anxiety all my life, depression, really severe depression, to the point where I understood why people take their own lives. It just kind of happened, like, out of nowhere because we were doing a show. Stephan Riche was a guest on off the Record, and I had read that he battled depression throughout his career. So I thought that would make an interesting question. I'd never spoken about it at all. Never a single word. I just figured, what difference would it make? And people will just think, oh, yeah, Landsberg, he knows a lot of people don't like him, so he wants us to feel sorry for him. So I never mentioned it. So I said to Stefan, step out of the green room for a second, if you would. I'd never met him before. I said, would it be okay if I asked you about depression? And he said, it's painful. I don't like to talk about it. So I said to him, would it help if I talked about it? He said, sure, let's. Let's do it. I told him a bit about my story. We went on the air, I asked him, and he came up with this great answer. He said, imagine a Canadian kid born in Montreal, drafted by the Montreal Canadiens, rookie of the year in the NHL, last Canadian to score 50 goals, Stanley cup champion for the Montreal Canadiens. And not one moment of that did I enjoy. And I thought, wow, that's gotta be like the definition of depression. So he went through this, and I realized because I'm hearing the count of my ear, I'm almost out of time, and I gotta mention it because I promised him I would. So I said 11 seconds worth. All I said was, hey, Stefan, I'm sure a lot of people appreciate what you said. I know there's one other person on this set who's experienced depression, and that's me. And that was it. And the reaction to that was insane. I. I'm like reading these emails I'm showing my wife and she goes, holy, how did that happen? I wasn't trying to do anything good, but people heard that and they heard. I wasn't ashamed or embarrassed. Stefan wasn't ashamed or embarrassed. We didn't sound weak. And all of a sudden, you know, this became my new lights.

[Whit]

The tagline you always use is sick, not weak. Right? Like, that's what you always refer to. What, like, when did like, you personally start, like, getting these feelings? Like what? Like, when did they pop about, like, I would say, like, early in my life. I never really dealt with it, where all of a sudden, as you get older, life becomes a little bit more serious, you have more responsibility. And maybe that's where it creeps in.

[Michael Landsberg]

You know, the why is really difficult for a lot of people with. With really serious depression, because there is no why. It's like, I don't know how I got sick. I went to a psychiatrist the first time and I said to her, look, if you want me to come and talk about this, I'll come every day if you want me to come every day, but I need something right now. I'm fucking dying here. You got to give me something because I'm not going to make it. And that was sort of my start on this journey. Why did it happen? I don't know. Did I have anxiety as a kid? Yes. Did I fear things other kids didn't fear? Absolutely. Did I ever talk about it? No. Did my daughter develop a chronic eye condition that was really serious and vision threatening? Yes. Did I handle that poorly? Yes. I became obsessed with it. And the more I thought about it, the more I fell into this hole of depression.

[Keith]

But here's.

[Michael Landsberg]

Here's something, guys. You gotta understand. It happens so slowly, you don't know what's happening. It's like this tiny change in your life to who you are. And I heard my father in law one day say, wait, well, Michael has changed more than anyone I've ever met. And I. And I thought, is he talking about, like, have a change? And then I started to think about it. Look at all the things I used to do that I didn't do anymore. All the Things that used to bring me joy, all the confidence that I had, I used to look into the camera and I would know that I was born to do this. I was 100% sure that I could do whatever it was we were going to do that day and that I could interview guys and not be afraid of them. And then I realized, oh, my God, that guy is gone. And I, I have left and being replaced by this person. I hated him. I hated who I was. I hated everything about me. And that was kind of the start of this journey.

[Biz]

That's, that's interesting to hear because it does make a lot of sense in terms of having all the success, success you've had, having all the success Stephane Riche had. It does, it doesn't matter. Right. And when you first saw the psychiatrist and then moving forward, like, did it take different psychiatrists? Did it take medication? Like, how long was this something where you feel like, maybe now, and I hope you do have, have a little bit more of a grip on it.

[Michael Landsberg]

Oh, I, I, yeah. So I, I, it was medication for sure. And I'm not here to be an advocate for medication. Right. I'm only here to be an advocate for, do whatever you have to do. Because if you're, if, if you're really depressed or really anxious and anything else mental health related and you're not doing anything about it, you're giving up your life, man. You've given up your life. You, you, you, you, you are alive, but you're not really living. So she wrote a prescription for me, went downstairs to the drugstore, filled the prescription, bought a bottle of water, took my first pill at that point, and two weeks later, I was doing okay.

[Biz]

Not cured.

[Michael Landsberg]

This amount of time later, do I still battle? Absolutely. But am I satisfied with what I get to do in my life and how I get to feel about it? Absolutely.

[Keith]

And I know for me, Whit and Biz, when we came into the league, like, even talking mental health, like, it wasn't really a big topic. And I feel like the last handful of years, it's gotten more into the language. You see guys taking time off from mental health issues and stuff like that, where it's, it's, it's kind of one of those things. It's like you've said you're injured, you're hurt. It's part of, you know, if you're not feeling mentally strong, you can't go out and play in an NHL game or an NFL game or NBA game. Like, what, what have you been most proud of seeing that progress the last few years of guys, you know, at least speaking it out so other people know.

[Michael Landsberg]

Well, just, just you alone. Like, you played almost a thousand straight games, right? You played through like bizarrely horrible injuries, but that was okay because they were physical injuries, right? So. But if, if, if that was something mental and you said, I'm just going to play through it, you'd be fucked. I can tell you. You would be. Because people who try to just play through it never get better unless they address it. So what I'm, I, I'm really proud of the fact that we just talk a bit more about it, but I'm kind of worried that, but men in particular, you know, like, men, like we're still really shitty at it, you know, like, like we just don't talk about stuff the way women do, right? Like, like we look at Claude Lemieux. I mean, I, I knew Claude really well when we did the show and he was on like, I don't know, 25 times probably. He was on my all time favorite show, maybe with Darren McCarty. We put those two guys on together and they'd never been together since they went at it on the ice. And I said to Claude, you know, would you do this? And he said, absolutely. And we said to Darren, would you do it? And he didn't say absolutely that quickly, but just the two of them together talking about it was amazing. And Lemieux was like, I know it's one of the reasons why he put me on was Claude's death by suicide. It's just he was one of those guys and I'm sure you all have it right, guys that you expect to be a dick and he's not. He was that guy, I thought, you know, like Clothemu, like, what's it gonna be like? He was an awesome guy and he knew that I battled. But we never talk about it because, I mean, back then I don't know what was going on with him, but I think that we could do way better. And just now, like on this show, we're making a difference because we're not talking about it. Like, if you say to men, hey, join us on Spitting Chitlets next week when we'll talk about the symptoms of depression. No one wants that. But now we're talking about, you know, Claude lemieux and Darren McCarty and we're talking about other stuff and somehow it finds its way into the conversation. That's why I say you guys have this amazing power.

[Biz]

I appreciate that. And I think there are, I don't think I know right now. There's guys listening or have turned it off, like pussies. And I really don't care because I think there's a lot of people listening that are truly listening, like, holy. Like, the line you just said is, you're not living your life, and you don't. Nobody deserves that. And that's why I don't care about people who say, I have no interest in that. You're being a bitch, blah, blah, blah. Because if it reached one person, yeah, it really makes the world of difference to us. And I think it. I think it truly does.

[Whit]

And to hop in there, Michael, Like. Like, I almost envy people who, like, they don't deal with that. Like, it never occupies their mind. It's. And they're. When you talk about it, they're like, like, what are you talking about? That's. That's. And. And they move on. Hey, to those people, I would shake their hands and saying, hey, man, you're. You're obviously living a lot better than a lot of people, and. And your ability to shut that off, hey, I commend you. But the other side of the coin is, like, there's a lot of people that do deal with it, and there's a lot of people, especially men, that deal with it in silence. And you've kind of said a few things where you've mentioned depression and anxiety and. And there's a lot of different things that surround it. It's not just one thing. It's not very linear either. So can you maybe elaborate a little bit more on that? And what. What also do you think about the guys like Dana White who are, like, talking about that stuff is pussy shit,

[Michael Landsberg]

you know, I. Dana, if you were to say to me, hey, Michael, who was your favorite guest on off the Record? I would say, you know, like, we did, like, thousands of shows, so it's not like one guy comes to mind. But Dana would have been one of the guys.

[Biz]

Absolutely.

[Michael Landsberg]

Because he had thick enough skin that you could challenge him. You could, like, you could say, what the fuck are you talking about? You know, and he. He wouldn't be pissed off. I'm disappointed. I actually asked him. Not a couple years ago. I asked him, would you work with me on a men's mental health program where we tried to talk to men in a way that wasn't focused on mental illness. It was focused on the stories, the people, and somehow we weave it in there. And he said, absolutely. And then I find out, you know, he's saying that, you know, that it's pussy to, you know, like, this kind of stuff. And that's disappointing. But, you know, live and learn. I still like the guy and I still like the fact that he was such a great guest because you, you could, like, fight with him.

[Biz]

Yeah.

[Michael Landsberg]

Like, you guys must know this. Like, like guys that you fight with and they sulk, that's no good. But if you can find someone who you can fight with and debate with and argue with and you can tell them you're a fucking idiot and they're not going to get mad because it's showbiz, then that kind of stuff is gold.

[Whit]

And going back just to the other question there about, like, it not being necessarily linear either, because there's probably people listening right now that are, are dealing with different types of mental illness stuff. Like, what's your expertise in it? And like, what, like what different lanes are there? And. And maybe like, how do these people who are listening who are like, I, I can't find an answer. I can't find an answer like, what is it?

[Michael Landsberg]

You know, the first thing you have to do is you have to think about it. Men don't think about their mental health because people don't tell us to think about our mental health. And it's an awareness that shit happens, right? You know, you see these stats about how many people actually are living with mental illness, and you go, holy crap. Then you gotta think to yourself, okay, well, if one out of five have it, if one out of two experience mental health challenges by the time they're 40, then why would I assume it's not me? But we do assume that it's not us because we have no clue what it is. And one of the things I say, I mean, I. I've traveled around this country and a lot of the US talking about mental health, and one of the things they say is if you haven't been through it, you can't understand it. No matter what, you can't understand it. People think they can, right? Because we use the word depression to, to say, oh, you know, my dad passed away like four years ago. You know, I'm depressed about it. It's not the same as the illness. So there's an awareness that we need. And I tell people, you gotta understand it's not what you think it is, right? If you think that someone with depression is gonna look, you know, sad and they're gonna be crying all the time, Fuck. Men don't do that. You know what men do? They get pissed, they get angry, they yell at their Kids, they yell at their wife, they act like assholes because they can't show the real pain they're in. They can't show. Like, in. In hockey, you couldn't show sadness, right? You could show anger for sure, but you couldn't show sadness. And so understanding what an illness like depression or anxiety or. Or bipolar or ocd, you know, they kind of all grouped together. Adhd, it's kind of like this big mess in our heads. And some people get a little of this and a little of that, but it's. I think it's. It's understanding the fact that it's. It's not what you think it is. You know, I thought a lot about this before coming on, and I thought hockey is maybe the best example of how to talk about mental health. Because you guys, you know, had a code, right? You played with the hockey code, and the code told you certain things. I mean, we all know about the code. I didn't play hockey, but I know about the code. Talked about the code all the time. And then one day I realized, you know, we men live by that same code. Like, whether you played hockey or not, you live by the code. You know the rules of the code. Handle it yourself.

[Biz]

You're a man.

[Michael Landsberg]

No one's coming. Don't show weakness ever, because you're a man. Act like it. And all of these rules that existed in hockey exist in a man's life. And we need to accept the fact that we're living by these ridiculous rules. They were great in hockey, right? You know, like, they keep guys on the ice. They keep guys playing all kinds of shit. But when it comes to men living their life.

[Whit]

No, Michael.

[Keith]

What would be a sign, whether you could see in yourself or in one of your friends that they're acting off, and it's not one of those things where it's just, oh, he's having a bad day or he's having a bad week, where, you know, you could really tell something's going on.

[Michael Landsberg]

You know, that's. That's a great question. Thank you. And there's no. There's no real great answer to it because everybody's different. But, you know, how do you see? Let me put it this way, okay? I'll give you an example of how tough it is. I did probably in my career, a thousand shows, severely depressed, where I just. I hated everything about my life. I hated everything about who I was. Now when I say I hated everything about my life, it's how I related to my life. And it was. It was so obvious to me that it was on my face, right? Like, I would do a show and I would think, oh, my God, people are going to call ambulances. They're going to, you know, like, let's get Landsberg some help. Not one show did anyone actually ever say to me, are you okay? Not one. And in 2008, this is kind of like I have this tattoo on my arm. 1128 YUL and H5210400, November 24, 2008. YUL is the Montreal airport code. Marriott Hotel, room 521 4am we were there shooting off the Record at the Great cup, and I sat on the edge of my bed and I thought, I understand why people take their own lives. It was like I was in so much pain. It wasn't that I didn't love my wife and my kids and my parents at the time and didn't love my job. Like, all of that was like, check them off. I was, you know, I, I was so blessed, but I was in so much pain at that point that I was way more afraid of having to try to live with that pain the next day than I was of dying. And that taught me so much. And the next day when we did the show, no one said to me, like, you okay? You don't seem like yourself. So, Keith, it's really tough to understand what's going on in someone's head if they don't want you to know, because we all get the ability to wear the mask. And people with depression get really good at it.

[Keith]

And so it wasn't, it wasn't people not noticing it. It was more so you doing a good job of hiding it.

[Michael Landsberg]

Totally. Totally. I mean, if, if I would have acted the way I was feeling, everybody would have known. I mean, I would just be in there, you know, when they talked, wouldn't have done anything. You know, I just wouldn't have been. Me and guys like all of us in this conversation who work on camera, you get really good, right, at acting how you think people want to see you as opposed to how you're actually feeling, right? You don't go on the air if you've had a bad day. Well, you might talk about the circumstances of the bad day, but you, you know, if you're sad about something, you know, you put a face on and you do it. You, you, you watch, you. You watch MSNBC and Ari Melba. And every night he seems like the same guy, but he has good days and bad days, but he learns how to look just like, he thinks you want him to look, and that's where it gets really tough to see through it. So, Keith, my answer is, first of all, the number one symptom that we all experience, whether it's anxiety or whether it's depression, is the desire to get the fuck out of here. The desire to retreat, the desire to, like, wherever you are, you want to be someplace else, and mostly you want to be on your couch at home. And I can't explain to you why that is, but being around people and being. Having to. Having to be yourself and to talk was so painful. And I've, like I said, I've given a couple of hundred speeches. Every single person, every single person in the audience who's had this kind of illness has said, me too. Like, that's unbelievable. So when you watch people that you care about and all of a sudden they're not doing the things that they used to do, or even more importantly, you don't think they want to do those things. Like, you can show up for something and not want to be there, but that doesn't mean that you're still mentally healthy. So it's what you're thinking, do you want to be there? And, like, for me, my wife knows that the first sign that I'm struggling is I'm on the couch. Well, actually, I'm on the coach anyway. But there's different reasons for being on the coach. Like Sunday afternoon when NFL's on, like, I'm on the fucking coach. And that doesn't mean I'm depressed, but just the whole idea that you retreat, that you are trying to get away from everything and everyone. Keith, I can tell you that that is the biggest thing.

[Biz]

I'm wondering if you have a theory based on. I think a lot of it is the Internet, but you'd be an example of maybe somebody who. That's not the case of the upper uprise in this, or is it? Actually, it's always been around and it's just talked about more because I. I'm guessing it's a little of both, where now you're hearing about it more, which is a good thing. But people will say, like, look at these guys. We're on Memorial Day. We're talking about people who fought for their country and what they did and, like, what they're going through. But now it. It just seems to be more prevalent. Is that. Is that what's going on in today's culture and today everyone's lives, or is it just. Just always been here?

[Michael Landsberg]

You know, in your opinion yeah, it, I, I, it's kind of like, Like, I'll answer any question about lived experience, about how I dealt with it, how it feels like that's like, the most important thing is, like, what does it feel like to alert people that, hey, maybe you're not doing as well as you thought? But, fuck, I, that's above my pay grade. Like, knowing is there more now than there was? But there's way more communication that exists, right? Like, there is, as you said, you know, there's the Internet, and if you're struggling, you can put it out there to the world. You know, I, I think, though, the world is probably more complicated today than it was, say, 30 years ago or 40 years ago. But even just, just think of this, like, Memorial Day. Like, I have very few hobbies in life. One of my hobbies is World War II. Fascinated by World War II. Do you know that, like, in America, millions of men and women came home with severe PTSD but never spoke about it? So you could have said back at that time and the years afterwards, well, you know, I guess war didn't mentally affect a lot of people, right? But it was because they never spoke about it. As a kid, I had this thing, this fear. And I guarantee you, with your audience being the size that it is, there's people who are going to nod their head. Right now. I had something called emetophobia, the fear of throwing up. Now, like, you could say, well, you know, nobody likes to throw up. I was desperately afraid to be around someone. I wouldn't ride on a bus to go to camp because I was so afraid. And in the speeches I give, I would say half the time there's someone that puts up their hand and says, me too. So when I was a kid, I never spoke about it. I thought I was the only one on the planet. And then later on in life, you find out there are people. So is there more now than there was? Probably. Are we talking more about it? Absolutely. But are we helping people more? For sure, a little bit more. But when it comes to men, you know, like, this show is all about positivity, right? So, you know, I hate to mention it, but three out of four suicides are men, right? Like, we still, we're still just plugging our ears and pretending like it doesn't exist.

[Whit]

Yeah, I. No, I mean, yeah, that's the thing you just mentioned that we try to, like, keep it positive because we're trying to be an escape for people to come and enjoy time. And I mean, like, there's a reason that we wanted you to come on and talk about this one because you've lived it through experience. And we also, like, I mean, I could speak on behalf of all the guys, like, we really appreciate your vulnerability because I think that that's what it takes in order to have like a true conversation about this. And I don't know how many people are willing to put themselves out there the way that you are, Michael. So we, we one, we thank you for that. And I, I just like anytime that I've personally dealt with it, I've had people like maybe say, hey, try this medication. I don't want to get on anything. I try to deal with things a natural way. Do you find that like, like moving and getting exercise and doing things and kind of getting these small victories helps way more than maybe any type of, of substance would.

[Biz]

Because meditation too, I, I think that's

[Whit]

a big thing, more about being like, like present rather than being in the hamster wheel. Because you mentioned when you're going through stuff, you kind of just sit on the couch and maybe you let things fester where, you know. Typically I find the same thing too. Whenever I'm going through stance, I tend to just kind of sit around and I'm not as active or doing things.

[Michael Landsberg]

You know, I call it tied to the couch syndrome. It's like you're feeling shitty, so you lie on the couch and then you're there for three hours and you realize you haven't done anything. So now you feel even more shitty, right? So it kind of magnifies it. Keith, you, you mentioned meditation. I, I was a little bit more narrow minded when, when I first started talking about it and someone asked me in a speech, what do you think of yoga as a treatment for depression? And I said like, I, I kind of scoffed at it. And now my answer would be if it helps you, like, if, if yoga can make a difference in your life, if meditation can make a difference in your life, if positivity as you're talking about this can make a difference in your life, then that's a great treatment, right? Like there's, the only bad treatment is no treatment. And treatment, as you guys said, can be a million different things. But the bottom line is you gotta

[Biz]

do something that's a great send off and we appreciate it, Michael. And I'll tell you, a buddy of me and Keith's just texted our group chat guys, there's a new documentary on the History channel, World War II with Tom Hanks. It's incredible. I don't know if You've seen it yet? I'm two episodes in. So you mentioned you're a big fan, so check that out if you haven't.

[Michael Landsberg]

I, I've, I've watched the first. I think they posted the first three episodes. I also saw on the weekend, I saw Pressure, which has gotten a fair amount of publicity, although I said to my wife, you know, like, they don't publicize movies anymore. And then I realized I don't watch tv, right? I mean, you don't watch conventional TV ever, unless it's a sporting event, so. But they still do, I guess, advertise. But Pressure was, was really interesting story, and I, I, I know you're trying to wrap this up, but.

[Whit]

No, no, no, no, no, not at all.

[Michael Landsberg]

It's so weird to be doing something that has no sort of time.

[Whit]

I know. I was going to mention that, like, tsn, you got you. It was here, like, we could talk for another 20 minutes.

[Michael Landsberg]

You know, I just, I think that you guys, because you're not telling people in advance, and every once in a while you talk about mental health, but when you do it, it's so effective because you haven't told people, okay, well, this is mental health talk. You know, it becomes part of a story. And that's what I'm trying to do is, like, when I go out to speak, I say, look, hey, I can make jokes about mental illness because I got a mental illness, so too fucking bad if you're going to be, you know, offended by it. And I can make Jewish jokes, right, Because I'm Jewish. So I think that bringing a sense of humor to it, unraveling it in a story, is a huge thing. Lyndon Byers, you guys obviously all know Lyndon Byers. He was, he was kind of, I loved him, right? We put together a segment on, off the record for him and Rob Ray together, and it was, it was, it was genius. Like, any idiot could have hosted a segment with Rob Ray and Linda Byers talking. And I knew because Lyndon and I stayed very close friends until, until his death. And I knew that he knew he had cte. I knew that he knew that he, he was slipping away and sliding away, yet he could bring a sense of humor to it in a way that there wasn't anyone else that I've met that was like that. And that's where you do the real good. Because, like you say, you know, if it's sad and somber, people are gonna turn the show off, turn the podcast off. But guys like you guys like this, I mean, you're One of those guys who people want to listen to and they want to hear, and when you can slip in something of value, I think it makes a huge difference. Did you ever meet Lyndon?

[Keith]

Never met lb.

[Michael Landsberg]

None of you guys did?

[Keith]

No. No.

[Biz]

But I remember hearing him on the radio here in Boston and, yeah, our, our, you know, our co hosts here. Ra. He had mentioned when he passed, we talked about him, was brutal. And then, you know, I saw, I think it was Alan Walsh who just tweeted the other day that it had come out that he, it was grade three, I think, cte. And you mentioned. And he knew that. Yeah, that's just, that's tough stuff.

[Michael Landsberg]

He told me, he said, you know, I used. He said this on the air. He said, you know, you know, I, I drive still. And that wasn't necessarily going to continue for a long time, but he said I would. All of a sudden, I'd find myself parked 50 miles from my house and I'd have no idea how I got there. None. And that was, like, really creepy. But it really hit the seriousness of, you know, taking hits to the head. Right. You know, we don't know what was going on in cloth labus brain. It's, it's, it's so hard to understand CTE for sure, but mental illness in general, because there's no proof of it, right? Like, if I say I'm really, really down and I'm feeling, you know, like, I, like, I don't necessarily, you know, I don't want to wake up tomorrow morning. I can't prove to you that that exists in my head. I, I have no evidence. Right. But other illnesses, you could do a biopsy or a blood test or an X ray or mri and you could say, hey, take a look at this. But when it comes to mental illness, I got, I got no proof. You know, Keith, all of your injuries and all the things that you played through, if you were so inclined, you could have like a scrapbook of X rays for that. Right? You can't do that with mental illness. And that's why I think in a lot of ways, people doubt that it exists.

[Whit]

Well, like, I mean, I know that you, like, we're, we're obviously going to move on from this, but the conversation about all this doesn't stop here. Like, where, if anybody's listening and they're really struggling, like, where can they find you to have more of this conversation? Like, where can they go? Is it. You mentioned you have speaking engagements. Like, what are some easier resources for people to, like, reach out to. Or find in order to. To. To help them out if they're listening.

[Michael Landsberg]

You know, the biggest thing that, that, yeah, I always tell people is that you got to. You got to come to grips with the fact that you need help. And once you do, like many people, like I do some work for Greenshiel. It's. It's a benefits provider in Canada. And everybody that gets benefits in Canada has some kind of mental health allowance. Right. They have access to it, eFap. And men don't use them. Like, literally, men will ignore the fact that, you know, they could actually without any expense whatsoever, speak to a psychologist. So it's like, find out what you've got access to. And the first step for many is go to your family doctor. Right. But talk to someone and. But it's not just those that are struggling. It's those that care about someone that's struggling. Right. Like, I spoke to a group last week. They were all sort of hardcore work outside guys who never would talk about this. And I said, how many of you guys would talk to your supervisor if you thought, you know, I'm not doing well, I think I could use some help. Not one guy put up their hand. It's. It's 20, 26. Not one guy put up their hand. And it's. It's also about how do you handle someone that you care about up. Right. Because we all have people in our lives that are going to struggle with mental illness and how do we handle it? And that's another thing that you could learn a lot about. So talk to someone. Go to a family doctor. And you asked me what you could do. I think what you could do is. And I'm kind of selling myself because the message is everything but put me back on. You know, because, like, I, I kind of. You know what, maybe I should take that back. I don't know.

[Whit]

But no, well, you. So I know that right now you got something in the works. Kevin Biexa. And I know he's big on the mental health conversation because he was very close with Rick Rippon and that hit really close. Well, there you go. I didn't even notice that shirt there. You. And that hit close to home for him. And I know, like, we ended up meeting up for. For lunch when I was there doing. Doing sportsnet before Hockey Night in Canada. And that's kind of where, you know, the conversation started again. Obviously, I'd been on. Off the record and. And you mentioned that you have this project coming up.

[Blutman]

Yeah.

[Michael Landsberg]

And it's all directed at men Because I, I. Because we're just not good at it, and men are dying, and they don't. I mean, you can't. You can't solve it. You can't cure the problem. But I promise you that in the good that we could do, that we've done today and that we could do in the future, that we're going to save a life. As, as Whit said, one life. Like, it's amazing when. When I spoke about it on off the Record with Stephane Richet, two and a half years later, I got a letter from a guy. And the guy said, hey, Michael, I just want to let you know you don't remember me. I did. It's Tyson Williams from North Battleford, Saskatchewan. I remembered him. He said, what I didn't tell you when we communicated after that off the Record show. And then he added, which, by the way, I didn't really like the show. I thought that was really funny that he said that and slipped that in. But he said, what I didn't tell you and I should have, is that I was in my closet with a belt around my neck and I was going to end my life. And then the computer went, and it was you responding to my message. And we went back and forth six times, and I didn't know any of that was going on. But at the end, he said, you know, you kind of convinced me that I had nothing to lose to go to talk to someone. So here I am, two and a half years later. And then I ended up being the best man at his wedding. Can you imagine that? Never met the guy before in my life. And I was the best man at his wedding. Like, how. How unbelievably cool is that?

[Biz]

That.

[Michael Landsberg]

So I don't know how I got into that story. Oh, yeah. It's the power of the ability to. To make a difference in someone's life.

[Whit]

Michael, thank you so much for coming on and talking about this. We appreciate your vulnerability. And, yeah, it's his. Yeah, it's wild times. Yeah, for sure.

[Michael Landsberg]

And it's, you know, like, keep talking about it, but, you know, not in a somber way, but in a way that, you know, kind of just slip in the message. And by the way, Wade Be, like was one of my best friends. The only guy that I ever really became friends with who was a guest on the show was probably Wade Be Like. I mean, he was. He talked to me about his struggles, and it's still, like, one of the biggest heartbreaks of my life. And I just think that we need to keep Doing what we're doing here today. And so, guys, thank you so much for this chance.

[Whit]

Thank you, man.

[Biz]

Thank you, thank you.

[Michael Landsberg]

And this. My daughter said you're supposed to order cookies from her, and you have not done that.

[Whit]

Oh, yeah, that's right. Well. Well, okay, we'll have to get that one.

[Biz]

Cookies.

[Whit]

No, they're not. I, I don't. Did you. I don't think you brought any. Last time we had lunch together, you mentioned that she was doing it.

[Michael Landsberg]

Yeah, because BXA ordered some for the.

[Whit]

Can you get them to the States?

[Michael Landsberg]

I can for sure.

[Whit]

Okay. Wow. Okay, here we go. Here we go. And maybe we can get a little bit of some cushion there, you know? Yeah, for sure.

[Michael Landsberg]

And then you could talk.

[Whit]

That'll help with my mentals, at least.

[Michael Landsberg]

You know, you. You told me about how when you retired, you. You really struggled, and that's huge, right?

[Whit]

It was. I, I talk about it, like, because. Because I would imagine that a lot of people, like, deal with this on a daily basis for longer periods of. I got back from St. Louis with, like, I was so happy in St. Louis. I was with him. We talked about this show, about creating this and making it a YouTube. And I. It just came over me where I, like, I. It took over me physically, and that was the first time that it ever happened. And you mentioned the couch thing. Like, I was on my couch for three weeks. I called the NHL doctors. I didn't want to take any medication. They said I was going for like four or five walks a day. I was pumping vitamin D and D and. And whatever, you know, supplements they told me to get on. And thankfully I ended up getting a job with not only the Coyotes farm team, but then also the Manchester Monarchs. Mike Feuda stutters. I talk about those guys all the time. That whole group of guys, they literally changed my life and turned it around for the better. And I'm forever grateful. So that's my experience with it. That's why I'm like, I don't mind talking about it because that was the first time in my life where it, like, like to, like, we all go through our ups and downs, through everyday life. Like, I'm not. Never have I ever came close to what I was there, but it was crazy how it had taken over me physically, where I was like, oh, my God, like, this is something that needs to be talked about. And for those people that are going through that, that are listening now, like, I, like, I. I'm so sorry that you're going through that. That's why when the Dana White comments come about, a credit to all those people that have never. That have never happened, to where they're able to.

[Biz]

To.

[Whit]

To go on through life day by day, where it never affects them like that, and it's water under the bridge, any adversity that comes your way. But I'm talking about for the people that it has affected, like you and anybody else who's listening, you know, let's just be free.

[Michael Landsberg]

I. I think free to talk about it. I. I just. So you guys know, if I wanted to extend this conversation longer, I could, because that's what I do. But I'm going to be very kind with you guys and say you've been very kind with your time with me, so I'll just shut up. And next time, ask me about CM Punk. Ask me about my. My CM Punk story.

[Keith]

I was gonna. Really epic, epic feud.

[Michael Landsberg]

It was. And the best thing about that story is after he, like, hated me. So is there anything wrong with this? I. Here's what I asked him. He was going from WWE to ufc, and that's when we got him. And I said to him, have you ever taken a real punch? And he went, what? And I said, yeah, have you ever taken a real punch? Because, you know, like, you were a professional wrestler, one of the most dangerous things out there. So I'm not demeaning what you did, but you don't punch guys, right? Have you ever taken a real punch? Because that's what you're going to get in ufc. And it all went downhill after that. Is that a reasonable question?

[Keith]

Seems it, yeah.

[Michael Landsberg]

Yeah, he didn't take it. So two weeks later, we were at ufc, whatever number it was, in Vegas. Dana gave tickets to me and my wife and kids, and who's sitting four seats over. Oh, no, punk. So I decided I'm gonna. Going to be like, what? I'm. I'm not scared of him. So I went up to him and I said, hey, cm, I don't know if you even know what I look like, but it's Michael Lansburg. You and I talk a couple. He gave me this look. I actually have a picture of it, because I told my son, you take the picture. And I told my daughter, you come with me, because there's no way he's going to punch me in the head.

[Whit]

Bring him cookies.

[Biz]

Oh, my God.

[Whit]

By the way, what is the website for the cookies for your daughter?

[Michael Landsberg]

Sweetsies. W. It's on Instagram. Sweet seeds. There's an S in the middle. And. Yeah, I'm not selling anything, but.

[Whit]

No, I know, but I figured we'd just give her a plug because good plug. Got to give her a little plug. Come on. That's what we do around here.

[Michael Landsberg]

Thank you. I don't want to overstay my welcome.

[Whit]

We got Ra's World coming up. Landsberg, thank you so much.

[Keith]

Thank you very much.

[Michael Landsberg]

Thank you.

[Whit]

We love you.

[Biz]

A great chat.

[Whit]

That was awesome. Boys.

[Biz]

At a time where you know us certainly and a lot of people need to hear it in the tragic news about Claude Lemieux. So let's bring in Ra's World right now. Foreign.

[RA]

Hello everybody. Welcome to Ari's World here in the Spitting Chiclets podcast. Tomorrow night, eight o' clock Stanley Cup Final. Can't wait. Carolina minus 155. Vegas plus 130. Personally I think it's a pick em. I think that line is whack. Both teams in their third Stanley Cup Final ever. Both seeking their second championship. Vegas in its ninth season of existence. Carolina in its 46th. 28th as the Hurricanes mock stone right now has the most playoff points from the 2010 draft class. What's wild, he was taken 178 overall in the sixth round. Got 123 points after him. Tyler Sagan, then Tarasenko and then Hyman. 37 year old Jordan style. The oldest player in the Stanley cup final looking to become the first player to go at least least 17 years from his first cup to his second one. And him and William.

[Biz]

That's a great stat.

[RA]

Yeah. And him and William Carrier. The only two Hurricanes that have dressed for at least one game this postseason and have staling cup final experience. Vegas has 13 of those guys tail hall is the most regular season games played without a cup. 989. Thomas Hurdle on Vegas is 873. He's second.

[Whit]

So without a cup or without cup A cup game like without a cup?

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Without.

[RA]

Yeah, without winning. Without winning a cup. Also there have been 28 game time or go ahead goals in the final 10 minutes of regulation this postseason. Tied for the second most ever at this juncture. 76 games played. And if we do get to OT Anderson five zero in overtime so far this playoffs hot three zero in overtime and just interesting this if.

[Whit]

Wow. Both undefeated.

[Michael Landsberg]

Eh.

[Biz]

The Hurricanes have won every overtime dream three two.

[RA]

Yeah that's, that's even wilder too. And you know obviously we don't, we don't want to see any, anybody get hurt. But just an interesting note. Aiden Hill back up. His Last game was April 9th. Brandon Boosie's last game was April 14th so if they have to go to the backup goalies man those guys might be a little bit rusty.

[Whit]

So who, who, who, who goes to their backup first boys?

[Biz]

Well neither one of these guys has been pulled correct?

[RA]

No. Yeah. Hot and Anderson have played every second as a goalie the playoffs so RA

[Biz]

Quickly Biz has Vegas in six, I have Carolina in seven.

[Keith]

Yans, you were Vegas and six and

[Biz]

so what's just so we have it, what's yours?

[RA]

I get Vegas in seven. I, I mean I was just looking at the lineups on Puckpedia and it's so evenly matched but, but the difference is, is that Carolina doesn't have a Jack Eichel and I think like he's you know the most maybe dynamic best two way player in the game today but certainly today I think the way he's been playing the playoffs and Carolina that's going to be tough for them to match. It's. I'm so psyched man. Two division winners. I know people have been bellyaching about you know that the, yeah the last conference finals haven't been great but this has the makings from an all time Stanley cup final I think right now. So yeah, Vegas and seven. Very much looking forward to it. And how about Logan Stankhoven too his first three seasons he was in Western conference finals his first season, Eastern conference finals his second season and here in his third season Stanley cup final and he's been unreal. Man what a deal Tulsi made there. They got him a 1st and 26, a 1st and 28, a 3rd and 26, a 3rd and 27. They haven't signed until 2034 at 6

[Biz]

million per Brandon allowed them to get Hall.

[RA]

Yep. Yeah and random is going to be 30 in October making 12 million till 33. So just an unreal deal.

[Whit]

What was Tulski Master class, baby.

[RA]

Yeah, absolutely. And of course mine.

[Keith]

You're on Vegas.

[Whit]

No, I know but I so I mean there's a common theme here. I, I was a little critical of, of that move not knowing that ran in would sign but that, that was like Houdini escape expert style of what he was able to do and his body of work. Like you have to say that he's easily the top three GM in the league year over year.

[RA]

Yeah, get, get that bounty and they

[Whit]

don't have a big, big budget I think, I think right now they're like 12 million under the cap so they're not even spending up to the cap really. This is buddy, this is Tulski Tulski. Master class.

[RA]

Impressive stuff. It's a great read too, from Jason Demers. He put out his first sub stack. You know, the little columns that people write, so.

[Biz]

Oh, I read that this morning. It was awesome.

[RA]

Yeah, good stuff. Basically, like, you know, he went to his first two seasons. He was in the conference finals both times. And, you know, you think, oh, I'm going to be back here. And I think it was Trent Yanni was his coach. He's like, man, you, you. There's no guarantee this is going to happen again. And he's like, I wish I, you know, listen more. But he goes into detail about what guys go through and the, and the pain and getting shot up and stuff. But, yeah, give that a read if you get a chance. It's on Twitter. Jason Demers. Follow him out there. Good stuff.

[Whit]

You gotta have. We've had him on. Haven't we

[Biz]

been on, I think a long time ago.

[Whit]

Yeah, okay, we'll get him. We gotta get him on again now.

[Biz]

He's all over NHL network. Yeah, job.

[Whit]

He's a funny bastard.

[Biz]

It's funny reading that reminded me, I've said before that in the cup finals in Pittsburgh, Gary Roberts gave just a speech I'll never forget talking about when I was in Calgary. I thought that this would be constant and it's been forever and I'm back. And just because it's happened once and when you're young, it. It doesn't mean, like, you'll. You can easily never get this close again. And that's kind of what the Mares was talking about. Trent Yanni said, like, don't just think, oh, I'm young. Next year, year after that, I'll be back. Because it's not. Nothing is guaranteed in this game.

[Keith]

Look at Jordan Stall, right? I'm sure he's given that same speech to his crew this week. Like, yeah, would you say it's been 17 years? The guy. And, you know, he. For. For a player like him too, with the teams that he's been on, you'd expect that he's been in a couple finals or whatever, but it, it doesn't happen to everyone.

[RA]

And obviously Mana had, you know, previously blocked a trade at Carolina, but he's got 21 points leading the NHL and playoff points right now. But I looked. Seven of his goals came in just four of the 16 games he's played and a third of his points. Seven of his 21 points came in just two games versus Anaheim. So it just, you know, kind of like, look, took a Little, little closer. Closer. Look, obviously I think he had three assists versus Colorado playing, you know, great two way game. And obviously you don't have to get on the scoreboard to have a great game.

[Keith]

That's why, like you sound like a Toronto media.

[Whit]

Yeah, Jesus. That's why I think that like, like aside from the media probably picking Marner just for that storyline, I think that that's probably why most like hockey truist would say Jack and what he does and how many hard minutes he has to lug and. But either way, both guys have just been absolutely stellar, especially Martyr on the pk. We talked about his primary assists. Four of them. There's only like Wayne Gretzky and like two other guys that have done that hockey history throughout a playoff run.

[RA]

And he's still the chalk for the con smite. But I think some value right there. Like Dorothea, he's 50 to 1 right now. Howden's 100 to 1. Each of these guys has 10 goals. Goals. Howden's got three game winners. Like if one of these guys has, you know, a four or five goals Stanley cup final series, how do you not give it to a guy with 15 goals, you know what I'm saying? So I see tremendous value there. If you're looking to throw a little action down. 50 to 1. Like I said, Dorothea, 100 to 1 on Howden also. I don't know if you guys saw the clip when you guys had started. Brendan Gallagher, very emotional. He had a press, well, press scrum today acknowledging his time with the Canadians has come to an end. Obviously he's a ufa and yeah, you know, it's tough to, tough to see a guy, you know, upset. But, but like we just talking. Mike Lindsberg, Michael, I should say, great interview by the way, guys. It was great to have him on after what's transpired the last few days in hockey. But you know, it's, it's okay to, you know, for a guy to show his emotions like that. But yeah, Brendan, it was a tough.

[Whit]

I would say if, if I'm like Vancouver, he's from there that, yeah, that's already.

[RA]

They already asked him basically about that, you know.

[Whit]

Oh, did they? Okay, yeah, I was gonna say like you gotta. They got a young team of guys that need to learn. Learn how to be pros and, and how to handle business. Bring him in as like a mentor. I mean, they're not going to be close to the cap, so take care of them. Yeah, sorry.

[RA]

Vancouver, obviously. Yeah, we mentioned Claude Lemieu earlier So I went back and I watched unrivaled Detroit vs Colorado. You could find that, you know, on the Internet somewhere and you know, sort of a tribute to Claude. You rewatch it because, you know he had that sit down with Darren McCarty that kicked off the documentary and how they became close friends. So if you get a chance, give it a, give it a watch. And I, I like also how they point out, you know, I mean, obviously Claude played the way he played. That was his style. But you know, he, he with the hit on Draper, people forget like what preceded that. And Adam Foote, you know, basically getting the party kiss from Kozlov. I mean Kozlov smacked his head off. He got 20 stitches head in his head. That place he started everything and you know, kind of up the ante where things get kind of nasty there. But was funny now. You know, Shanahan and Claude played early in Shanahan's career. And that's why clothes son is Brendan. He's named after Brendan Shanahan. And the first game they were head to head, Colorado, Detroit. He looks at Shannon, he goes, you're a loser. You've never won anything. You know, just to get in his head, he's like, that's how much of a competitor was. He's like, my kids named his kids named after me. And he called me a loser who's never won anything. Just like to do the psychological warfare. So a lot of good stuff. Just the history too that goes into it. It's, it's legit. One of the best hockey documentaries like you can watch. So it's. Yeah, unrivaled. Detroit versus Colorado. Give it a look, see if you can. And also too shout out to Vladimir Konstantinoff when you watch that. Obviously what happened with him. I mean he only played six NHL seasons. You could have told me he played 10 or 12 with the impact he had on that team. He was second in Norris voting too, like before he had the accident there. And you know, he, I think he had three goals and 35 assists back when Norris voters didn't emphasize points all the time was about the, you know, the two way ability of defenseman. So just while I was mentioning that, want to give him a shout out.

[Whit]

RA Came fucking humming today, boys.

[RA]

He's humming right now, you know, get a finish with a flourish here. And speaking of misbehavior at the rink, dude, it's gotta, we gotta stop banning parents from, from these rings. You guys must have saw the clip down South Shore the other day. Oh yeah, yeah, it was One parent walking by just like melting off to another guy. And then the other guy said, oh, your whole family's trash. And I think the guy, the, the guy who's like, basically instigated, I think he waited till he's far away, figuring people might like, oh, like hold him back. Like, oh, you're lucky to hold me back. But no one did. And he had like the lower ground, they tumbled down the stairs. It was just like, bro, you guys are adults. But the funniest part, where was that? That kid come over, he was probably a 10 and he gunned his drink off the dude's head and send me this clip.

[Whit]

I gotta watch this, buddy.

[Biz]

It's ridiculous. And if, if, unless an adult ever like put their hands on one of my kids, if I'm at a fight in the stands at a youth hockey game, just take me out back and put me out to pasture. Yeah, it's insane. Like these guys are rolling around the rink in the stands, fighting each other on a May weekend in a youth

[RA]

youth hockey tournament, like getting soaked by whatever elite team. Their kids aren't paying more money.

[Biz]

Like, what are we doing?

[Whit]

Wow.

[RA]

And it was another, you know, another viral clip up Canada last week. A guy climbing on the glass. It just, I don't know. And I feel bad, man. I feel so bad for the coaches and, and the referees who have to have to deal with this idiocy. And you know, a lot of them are not making a lot of money volunteering. But yeah, they got just like throw these people out, you know, get them out of the fridge.

[Biz]

The all time clip is way to go, Paul. After the smashes the glass with his wedding ring.

[RA]

So, yeah, grow the fuck up out there. You hot?

[Whit]

She just sent it to me.

[RA]

Yeah, brutal. Just, just obnoxious. But you guys been watching any, any of the College World Series? Either the baseball or the softball.

[Biz]

I watched Kansas, Arkansas last night with Ryder. Arkansas was up 5 nothing. And in one inning, all of a sudden it was, I think it was 6, 5 Kansas. They won 13, 10. College World Series. College baseball's incredible. I don't understand how they're still using metal bats. These guys are pounding the ball. I guess, you know, that's just still what you do. But it's a, it's electric. And I last year or the year before got into the, the actual World Series when they get to Omaha.

[RA]

It's awesome. Yeah, great.

[Whit]

I was following Williams, Jason Williams drama with the women's and how his daughter transferred from Florida to. Was it Texas A M Texas Tech. Texas Tech or Texas Tech?

[Michael Landsberg]

Yeah.

[Biz]

He's unreal.

[Whit]

Am I quite crazy that.

[Biz]

He's hilarious.

[Whit]

Oh, he's hilarious. Did he. Well, we're talking about fans getting our parents getting into it in the crowd, then all of a sudden we transfer over. Did he also play at both those schools as a.

[Keith]

No, he went to Florida. Just Florida.

[Whit]

Okay. Because somebody posted a. Maybe it was like a AI thing of him with the Texas Tech with a basketball.

[Keith]

Daughter plays.

[RA]

Oh.

[Keith]

Oh, no. Yeah.

[Michael Landsberg]

Oh.

[Keith]

Because I think. I think in an interview that he did, he said, like, he's done with Florida now.

[Whit]

Okay. Okay. Yeah.

[Biz]

Done with, like, their basketball program, too. Are you separating? There's women's softball. He's like, I'll never step foot on that campus again unless one of my daughters is playing softball there. And he was kind of. I mean, was he. Did they win at all when he was there?

[RA]

No, his daughter.

[Whit]

His daughter got beamed five times in like a. A best of three series. What's the old. Why do they hate her just for transferring?

[Keith]

Probably. Who knows?

[RA]

Yeah.

[Biz]

I don't know. We're not in that room.

[RA]

Yeah. Yeah. He. He.

[Keith]

I turned on the. I turned on the game last night and she went, yabo. She absolutely crushes the ball.

[Whit]

Oh, yeah.

[Biz]

She hit one last night, too.

[Keith]

Yeah, I. I just happened to turn on the TV and it was on. I think it was on espn. And as soon as I turned it on, it was like one pitch, then boom. Absolutely smashed one to center field.

[RA]

And I. I love the exuberance on, you know, when they get. Get a hit. Like the way they wave into the dugout stuff. So in the same vein, it's like, did you see the. The dude in the. In the. The baseball, the College World Series, the dudes, he hits a home run and he totally hot dogged the whole, like, you know, run around the bases. They threw him out of the game, like, just for hot dogging. Yeah. And then the coach come out. They threw the coach out, too. Like, brutal, dude. Like.

[Biz]

Yeah, yeah.

[RA]

The girls. I mean, I think the girls, like, it's great. They're excited. They kind of hot dog it a little bit. So then to see the dude get tossed like that, I don't know, kind of a horseshit call, I thought. But yeah, it's been. It's been fun to watch the big complaint this week. Biz, like, growing up, I love roller coasters, buddy. Like, I. It's my 20s. If I'd get a passive bush. God, you go there. Like, I like roller coasters it's like being, it was like having the park to yourself. Unlimited. You couldn't pay me a million dollars to get on one of these things today. It seems like every week one of them gets stuck. You know, it's obviously like some, whether it's computer error or human error, but did you see the one Thursday, Galveston, Texas biz. 100ft up, it got stuck. It was eight like high school kids there. So the firefighters had to come in. They had a 105 foot ladder. From the ladder truck they had to extend up and you know, they had like body cams on. And these poor kids, I mean, you know, they were like, you know, 13, 14 year old girls. They're like like literally is high at the highest point on the roller coaster, like facing down like this, like petrified and then, but go watch some of the clips Biz. The way these firemen talk. Firefighters talk to these kids and calm them down and say, look, you, you're okay with me. And they just kind of bring them down. They had to walk them all down this 105 foot ladder. It took four hours to take eight kids down, man. Absolute bananas. So yeah, roller coasters is dunzo you could get me on. I'd rather go on a carnival ride.

[Whit]

Yeah, I, I, I'll say. I haven't been on many. And then we went to that, that carnival and Whit's got a goal, by the way. He's got to go back. So why don't say bye to witty boy.

[Biz]

Love you guys.

[RA]

See you, buddy.

[Biz]

See you on Thursday.

[Whit]

See you Thursday. When I won that banana, man, there was a couple there and I was like, not a chance. I'm getting on one of those things at one of these, these janky pop up carnivals. Yeah, no, that's pretty crazy how we went from, from hockey to, to Texas Tech baseball to now carnival rides.

[RA]

No, no, this is a legit. Like, like a six flag. Like a legit. Yeah, but, but when you watch the clip, it's just like again, shout out. Shout out to the firefighters. But I, I get sweaty palms just watching it. Cut a classic recommendation for this week. One of my favorite documentaries ever. It's big part of Bastool Law to King of Kong, Fistful of Quarters. It's a documentary about the chase and the high score on Donkey Kong.

[Whit]

I've seen it.

[Keith]

I've seen that.

[Whit]

I've seen it.

[RA]

Phenomenal.

[Whit]

Like did the one guy have it in his house?

[RA]

Yeah, yeah. Steve Wiebe the nerd. The nerdy guy who was sort of like, the protagonist and Billy Mitchell is the. Was the villain that he's chasing the score. Like you. You think it sounds goofy, but you're on the edge of your seat. If you've never seen this movie, it's phenomenally made. It's like. Like good versus evil about freaking Donkey Kong. So, yeah, come out.

[Whit]

I don't exactly remember the ending, but.

[Keith]

Yeah, I gotta rewatch that.

[Whit]

Spoiler. Spoiler. Don't listen to this if you don't want to hear maybe how the ending goes. Isn't he, like, almost gonna set the record? And then the machine, like, stalls or, like. Or, like, goes black or whatever.

[RA]

There's some. Some. Some fishy things that go on, some home cooking. It's. Again, it. You don't think a video game documentary is, like, Is going to have you on the edge of your seat, but it's a fascinating doc. Definitely give it a look, see if you get a chance to see it. So. And also, I know Mike, Michael Landsberg just mentioned that movie Pressure. I'm actually gonna go see that tomorrow. It's about D Day, and I think it's about the. The weather guy who had, like, sort of make the call because they had a. Delayed the invasion on Normandy because of weather concerns. So I'm gonna check that out. But I also want to mention we talked about movies on the Memorial Day last week. There was a movie. He mentioned ptsd. It's called the Best Days of Our Lives. It's an old one, 1946. It was the very first movie, I think, that ever dealt with ptsd, which they called it Shell shock back then. So it's. It's a great tribute to World War II, folks. And there was actually a guy from Cambridge, He. He won two Oscars for the same role. He basically even wasn't even in battle. He was doing a teaching class on, like, explosives, and he. And his hands got blown off. So back then, you know, they would put metal hooks on. On your hands. So this guy, he played the veteran in this. In this movie. God, I wish I could come up with his name. And he won an Oscar for the performance, and he. They gave him another Oscar because he was such an inspiration to veterans like, around the world, because this is right after World War II. So. Yeah, great movie. The best years.

[Whit]

Wow. They gave him like a. Like a. Like a. Like a lifetime achievement type type Oscar.

[RA]

Well, just like a special Oscar, specifically.

[Whit]

Wow.

[RA]

Because of. Because of. Yeah, because of like, the. The, you know, the way he uplifted other veterans out there. But yeah.

[Whit]

Has that ever happened, like, other than that instance, like a specialty Oscar?

[RA]

No, he's the, like. Well, they have. They've given special Oscars, but he's the only one to get two Oscars for the same role. Like the one that. The traditional Oscar. And then, you know,

[Whit]

is that. Is that where the term shell shock came from?

[RA]

Yeah.

[Whit]

And the facts of, like, shell casings from guns before.

[RA]

Before PTSD was.

[Whit]

I never knew. I never knew that.

[RA]

Yeah. Harold Russell, his name was. He was actually, I believe. You know what? He was born. I believe not Somewhere in Canada. It was either Newfoundland or Nova Scotia. He was born and then his family relocated to Cambridge, Mass. Right across the street from here, so. Because he's got, like, a very much.

[Whit]

I gotta take a quick hose.

[RA]

Yeah, go ahead, buddy. No, absolutely, pal.

[Whit]

We've gone deep.

[RA]

Yeah. They'll be wrapping up in a sec. Keith, you gonna watch any of the NBA Finals at all? Did you catch game seven the other night?

[Keith]

I didn't catch game seven. Where the hell was I? When was that? Saturday night?

[RA]

Yeah, Saturday. Yeah.

[Keith]

Oh, I was actually. I went to the Kid Rock concert. My daughters had a. A tournament in Tampa and went to the Kid Rock concert with one of the dads on. The team's good friends with Kid Rock. And we went there, went after, and got to meet Rick Ric Flair after, which was unreal.

[Biz]

No, he was the man.

[Keith]

Yeah. Just like. He still looked unbelievable, I thought, like, you know, just those wrestler guys, they age like milk, so. But he looked unbelievable.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

You guys see the video of Victor Wembayana holding a baseball? It actually looks like. Like us holding the golf ball. It's like, completely takes over the ball. It's unlike anything I've ever seen.

[RA]

Oh, yeah, he's a treat to watch. 23 years old. I mean, he's the. I think it's like MGA LeBron WEMBY. I think, though, the way this kid. What we've seen at him so far. But one of the. Oh, another thing going back to Carolina real quick, the. That shot they got of Keandre Miller on. On the bench, like, well, after.

[Keith]

Yeah, that was cool.

[RA]

Sitting there with his newborn baby, just soaking it all in. And he probably didn't even know he was on camera either. Man, that was. That was one of the best images we've seen so far. The playoffs. So good stuff. And also at the end of the game seven the other night when the dude dunked it, I mean, it was. You know, spurs were up six already 4.1 seconds when he dunked that. That put the game over. The overrun was 212 and a half, and that last leg dunk put the game over.

[Keith]

So did you take the over? Is that why you showed?

[RA]

No, no, I did. I did. My. My brother texted right after he goes that. That dunk, like his most. You know, 90% of the time, guys just dribble up the clock, you know, up six. But he went home and stuffed it with four seconds left. And, you know, I mean, you know, most people bet the over, so you always root for that.

[Whit]

But I wonder what this. This final will get for viewership with Nixon Wemby in the mix. I bet you they're doing like 15 million a game.

[Keith]

It'll be monsters. Yeah. New York. I mean, you see the streets, like, the interviews after, like, the man on the street after these games.

[Whit]

It's been crazy.

[Keith]

Yeah, crazy.

[RA]

Like, if y'.

[Biz]

All.

[RA]

If you visit Manhattan and have no idea, like, what's going on. If you go by MSG after a game, like, it's. It's bananas. You think it'll probably was a riot or a parade or something going on, so.

[Keith]

Yeah, when was the last.

[Biz]

Last.

[Keith]

What was the last championship in New York, like, the whole.

[Whit]

The last time they won 72?

[Biz]

No, no.

[Michael Landsberg]

Any.

[Keith]

No, I'm not them.

[Michael Landsberg]

I mean, anyone.

[Keith]

Like the 90s.

[RA]

The Yankees.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

Yankees won in 2009.

[Whit]

Oh, yeah.

[RA]

And then the Rangers.

[Keith]

But then when did the Giants win, though? They.

[Michael Landsberg]

They won 2011.

[RA]

Trigger 1. Trigger 1.

[Unknown Sports Analyst]

We forgot that one.

[RA]

PTSD, bro.

[Keith]

So it's been a little while for New York. So if they get a championship here, man, I'm not even being, you know, Boston sports fan. I'm actually. I'm rooting for the Knicks in this one.

[RA]

I really. Huh. Yeah, no, I'm gonna watch. It should be, you know, and it's good. They don't, you know. Yeah. Every night you gotta either cut the cup or the NBA. So obviously they talk to make sure they don't conflict at this point, but. Yeah. Boys, anything else before you wrap up here? Always a fun chat coming on.

[Whit]

No, no.

[Keith]

I told R.A. i met RIC Flair this weekend.

[Whit]

Holy shit.

[RA]

He.

[Whit]

How old is he?

[Keith]

We looked it up, like 73. 2. Yeah, I thought 70 look great. I know, dude. He looked pretty good in person.

[Blutman]

Really.

[Keith]

Unless it was an AI version, probably on the Peptides.

[Whit]

Eh?

[RA]

Imagine how much his body hurts, dude, doing that, the beating those guys put on.

[Whit]

But what a. What a legend. What does he do now? He just kind of cruises around, just doing appearances and stuff.

[Keith]

Probably. Yeah.

[RA]

His finances I think are, are messed. I remember, I remember there's a big article yeah A few years back if

[Whit]

I'm that age it's kind of like whatever, just give me my 10, 15K every public appearance.

[RA]

There we go.

[Whit]

As long as I got the Rolex on my wrist.

[RA]

All right, boys.

[Whit]

Well, Stanley Cupboard, first week, we good

[RA]

Tomorrow night everybody's fight up can't wait to get it rocking and rolling Great show and everything starts Tuesday. We love you. Yeah. Tuesday night, 8 o'. Clock.

[Whit]

Okay, see you there.

[RA]

All right, love you guys. Love you gang. Adios.

[Keith]

Peace.

[Biz]

It won't happen Won't happen Won't happen again it won't happen Won't happen Won't happen again

[Blutman]

A bad habit worth breaking

[Keith]

but it's taking time I don't know

[Blutman]

it don't matter it's going to happen

[Biz]

it's gonna happen again. Wanna.