Corporate Responses to Minneapolis 1/27/26

Summary

Squawk Pod – “Corporate Responses to Minneapolis”

Date: January 27, 2026
Hosts: Becky Quick, Andrew Ross Sorkin
Key Guests: Bill George (Former Medtronic Chairman), Stephen Fulop (President & CEO, Partnership for New York City)

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Overview

This episode examines how top executives and corporations are responding to ongoing unrest and fatal police shootings in Minneapolis, discussing the role of the business community in addressing such crises. The conversation expands to include the intersection of politics, social issues, and corporate responsibility, as well as a look into the challenges facing New York City’s new mayor and business climate. Insights from Bill George and Stephen Fulop provide a real-time look at how business leaders balance advocacy, policy engagement, and risk in an uncertain climate.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Latest Economic and Trade News (02:30–06:37)

• EU-India Free Trade Agreement
  • The EU and India reach a landmark free trade agreement after nearly 20 years, dubbed the “mother of all deals.”
  • Expected effects: Significantly increase trade, especially in labor-intensive Indian exports hit by Trump-era tariffs.
• US–South Korea Tariffs
  • President Trump announces surprise tariff hikes on South Korean goods (from 15% to 25%), affecting autos, pharmaceuticals, and lumber.
  • Official reaction: South Korean officials caught off guard; impact noted in tumbling shares of Korean automakers like Hyundai and Kia.
• Antitrust Scrutiny: Netflix and Warner Bros.
  • Senator Mike Lee voices concerns about Netflix’s acquisition of Warner Bros. assets, prompting a subcommittee hearing.
• Meta & Corning Fiber Optic Deal
  • Meta enters a $6B multi-year agreement with Corning, aiming to boost US manufacturing jobs (06:17).
  • Andrew Ross Sorkin (06:20): “We can build it. There’s a huge amount of demand… But you’re going to have to help us pay for producing the stuff to feed into that demand.”

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2. Minneapolis Crisis: Corporate Leaders Push for Calm (07:22 & 21:42–30:12)

Background

• Second fatal shooting of a US citizen in Minneapolis sparks renewed unrest and calls to action.
• Sixty CEOs of leading Minnesota-based companies co-sign a letter urging for calm and action, representing a collective business front.

Guest: Bill George (Medtronic, Harvard Business School)

• On CEO Sign-On Letter
  • Bill George (22:30): “CEOs did the right thing putting out a statement... They had to tread a narrow tightrope between upsetting the White House and negotiations going on—and being advocates for significant change. But they got it done.”
  • Significance: Every major Minnesota company signed; took several days to build consensus.
  • Tipping Point: The murder of Alex Preddy catalyzed the response.
• Impact on Business Environment
  • Bill George (25:10): “Your obligation is to provide a safe, secure place of employment... That’s been in many ways shattered.”
  • Concern over Minnesota’s reputation—impacting talent recruitment, productivity, and innovation.
  • Fear among CEOs of political retribution, especially under the Trump administration’s aggressive use of the “bully pulpit.”
• Advice to CEOs
  • Bill George (28:07): “Advise people—stay below the radar. No sense tweaking the bear... Stick to your business and focus on the issues.”
  • Cautions against reactionary swings, referencing the overcorrection post–George Floyd in 2020: “There was a big swing to really focus on DI and it went too far. And I think that pendulum may have gone too far the other way.”
• On Employee Pressure
  • Bill George (29:31): “I think you better listen to your employees. Not enough people have done that. That worries me.”
  • Heavily contrasts Target’s struggles (“really hurt by that”) with Costco’s value-driven public messaging.

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3. New York City: Corporate & Political Leadership Amidst Uncertainty (09:59–19:24)

Guest: Stephen Fulop (Partnership for NY, Former Mayor of Jersey City)

• Mayor Mamdani’s Early Tenure
  • Mayor praised for snowstorm response but faces skepticism over budget management.
• Business-Government Relationship
  • Stephen Fulop (11:11): “My interaction has been very positive. He’s been proactive and listens… But we’re kind of in uncharted territory.”
  • On Transition: Comparing the move from activist to executive (“There’s a reality to math when you are the mayor…”).
• Where Business Can Help
  • Childcare policy, bureaucratic reform, technology—areas where corporate insights can drive efficiency.
• Tax Policy & Economic Competitiveness
  • Fulop repeatedly critiques tax-increase proposals.
    • (12:04 & 16:45): “New York is one of the highest tax places in the country... You could see in California, there is a tripwire. At some point, people say, ‘I have options elsewhere.’”
    • The risk isn’t with big corporations leaving overnight, but with wealthy individuals and incremental loss of jobs (“Death by a thousand paper cuts”).
• Budget Solutions & Political Will
  • Advocates for identifying “zombie programs” before resorting to tax increases.
  • Asserts business can provide insight on budgeting, remarking on rare city/state fiscal divergence.
• Corporate Engagement
  • Partnership for NY intends to be “more assertive in the advocacy space,” emphasizing collaboration rather than antagonism.
  • Stephen Fulop (13:31): “My background is being more active. And I think it’s important for us to be assertive… I think it’s important for us to be engaged.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Bill George on CEO Letter in Minnesota:
  “I think it is the tipping point in Minnesota. I think the president, being a businessman, has trouble ignoring all 60 CEOs of major companies in Minnesota. Not one failed to sign on.” (22:30)
• On Corporate Silence vs. Action:
  “Stick to the business aspect. This is very negative for every one of their businesses... Your obligation is to provide a safe, secure place of employment for your employees...” – Bill George (25:10)
• On the Peril of Overreacting:
  “[Post-George Floyd] there was a big swing to really focus on DI and it went too far. And I think that pendulum may have gone too far the other way.” – Bill George (28:07)
• Stephen Fulop’s View on NYC’s Fragility:
  “If you look at New York City, it’s a very fragile environment right now and I think it’s important for us to be engaged.” (13:31)
• On the Tax Dilemma:
  “I think the starting point needs to be looking at those zombie programs, looking at things that aren’t working… I think the business community needs to be part of that conversation.” – Stephen Fulop (14:15–16:10)
• Risks of Hitting the Wealthy Too Hard:
  “You don’t need 1,000 [wealthy people] to leave. You need only a handful to have a massive impact on the budget. It takes a lot of Stephen Fulops to make up for one of those people.” – Stephen Fulop (17:33)

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Key Timestamps

• EU-India Free Trade Deal & Tariffs – 02:33–04:09
• Netflix/Warner Antitrust Concerns – 04:09–06:17
• Meta-Corning Fiber Optics Deal – 06:17–06:37
• Minnesota Unrest & Business Response – 07:22 & 21:42–30:12
• NYC Business & Political Climate (Stephen Fulop Interview) – 09:59–19:45
• Bill George on Minneapolis, CEOs, & Political Crosscurrents – 21:42–30:12

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Tone & Takeaways

The episode’s tone is pragmatic, frank, and occasionally cautious, blending real-world business considerations with nuanced takes on leadership, policy, and civic duty in times of crisis. Both Bill George and Stephen Fulop press for an active, values-driven but risk-aware approach to leadership—stressing engagement, honest analysis, and the critical importance of considering both employees and the larger community.

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For listeners seeking to understand how major companies and city leadership are navigating today’s overlapping social and political stress tests, this episode offers candid assessments, real corporate dilemmas, and strategies for engagement in a polarized environment.

Transcript

[Becky Quick]

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[Becky Quick]

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[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

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[Interviewer/Host]

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[Bill George]

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[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

The February 2025 Nielsen report.

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[Interviewer/Host]

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[Becky Quick]

This is Squawk Pod and I'm CNBC producer Cameron Costa. On today's episode, Minnesota businesses calling for calm in Minneapolis after the second fatal shooting of a US Citizen. Former chairman of Minnesota based Medtronic Bill George.

[Bill George]

This is very negative for every one of their businesses.

[Becky Quick]

The cost of silence and the power of the C suite in politics.

[Bill George]

I think it is the tipping point in Minnesota. I think the president, being a businessman, has Trouble Ignoring all 60 CEOs from.

[Becky Quick]

Minneapolis to New York. Mayor Mamdani is almost a month into his administration. New partnership for New York president and CEO Stephen Fula on the mayor's relationship with Wall Street.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

If you look at kind of New York City, it's a very fragile environment right now and I think it's important for us to be engaged.

[Becky Quick]

But first, Meta's new deal for fiber optics. Antitrust scrutiny on a big media deal. And after two decades of negotiations, India and the European Union have reached a free trade agreement. Plus, President Trump is threatening higher tariffs for South Korea.

[Interviewer/Host]

Officials in Seoul saying the announcement caught them by surprise.

[Becky Quick]

It's Tuesday, January 27, 2026. And Squawkpod begins right now.

[Interviewer/Host]

Stand Becky by in 3, 2, 1.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Q please.

[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

Good morning, everybody. Welcome to Squawk Box right here on cnbc. We are live from the NASDAQ market site in Times Square. I'm Becky Quick along with Andrew Ross. Sorkin Joe is out today.

[Interviewer/Host]

Meantime, some new news for us overnight. The European Union and India said they have reached a Free trade agreement. This after nearly two decades of negotiat President of the European Commission calling it the, quote, mother of all deals. It's expected to double EU goods exports to India by 2032 and open up the European market to labor intensive goods produced by India that were hit hard by President Trump's tariffs, including apparel, jewelry and footwear. So you can see some of the shifting alliances that we've been talking about coming into play here. President Trump meantime, is raising tariffs on South Korea, he says because the country's legislator has not yet approved a trade deal with the United States reached last summer posted on Truth Social that the rate in autos, pharmaceuticals and lumber from South Korea would rise from 15% to 25%. Officials in Seoul saying the announcement caught them by surprise. One member of Parliament telling reporters the trade minister just met with the U.S. trade Rep. Jameson Greer in Davos and quote, didn't hear a word complaint. Take a look at shares of Hyundai Motor and its subsidiary Kia. They're tumbling after President Trump's post, but paired losses. We're also watching shares of General Motors, which produces about half a million cars in South Korea per year and exports most of those to the United States. And I keep getting hearing these rave reviews about that Kia Telluride. And now it's going to cost more.

[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

Yeah, prices go up. The chairman of the Senate's Antitrust committee is raising concerns about the Netflix deal to buy Warner Brothers assets. In a letter, Senator Mike Lee said that the deal appears likely to raise serious antitrust issues, including the risk of substantially lessening competition in streaming markets. Senator Lee also said that he's concerned that the deal could operate. That the deal could operate in a killer non acquisition by weakening major competitors while the merger review process is pending. He warned that Netflix could obtain competitively sensitive information under the guise of due diligence. A subcommittee hearing on this deal is scheduled for next Tuesday. In the meantime overseas, the FT reports more than a dozen UK politicians and former policymakers are calling on the country's competition watchdog to launch a full review of Netflix bid. In a letter, the group suggests that the deal, in its words, will, quote, cement an already dominant player in the TV streaming market. We've also got some breaking news from Meta this morning. The tech giant announcing a multi year agreement with Corning to supply fiber optic cables for its data centers. That partnership is valued up to $6 billion and it will be used to support US manufacturing with a 15 to 20% increase in jobs at Corning's North Carolina facilities. Take A look at shares of Meta this morning. They are up by about a quarter percentage point. Shares of Corning, bigger deal for them, they are up by about 3.5% on this right now. You can read much more on this story on cnbc.com and a programming note for you, Cornwall Corning CEO Wendell Weeks will join us right here tomorrow. We'll talk to him about this. And much more. Very interesting on this. My quick read on this is, you know, anytime you look at a deal where they're kind of propping each other up, you think circular deals. But this sounds really like Corning says, sure, we will give you a lot of the fiber optic cables that you need, but you're going to have to take on some of the risk in terms of making sure you're helping us pay for those things with a $6 billion investment. That's just my quick read on this. But we'll talk more to Wendell Weeks about this tomorrow.

[Interviewer/Host]

And right now, Corning shares, circularity or.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Not, I don't know if this is.

[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

Circ popularity as much as it's yeah, we can build it. There's a huge amount of demand for it. But you're going to have to help us pay for producing the stuff to feed into that demand to make sure that it doesn't disappear overnight. You're going to be helping us do that. So again, those shares are moving on that by about four and a half percent.

[Interviewer/Host]

Now the latest from Minnesota this morning. President Trump posting on Truth Social. Yesterday, Governor Tim Waltz called me with the request to work together with respect to Minnesota. It was a very good call and we actually seem to be on a similar wavelength. President sent border czar Tom Homan to Minneapolis and ordered Border Patrol Commander Gregory Bevino out of the state. That pivot coming after Republican lawmakers and other Trump allies raised concerns about losing public support as those shootings seem to be overshadowing the president's immigration agenda. Meantime, Senate Democrats refusing to fund the Department of Homeland Security without new safeguards in place. That's raising the odds of a partial government shutdown as Friday's funding deadline approaches.

[Bill George]

Teas will be next.

[Becky Quick]

Coming up on squawk pod, the new president and CEO of the Partnership for New York, Stephen Fulop on how the business community he represents is working with Mayor Mamdani almost a month in.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

I think we disagree on the tax policy that he's kind of put out there already. I mean, New York is one of the highest tax places in the country. And if you look at trends on job data here. I think you would see that we're headed in the wrong direction.

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[Becky Quick]

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[Interviewer/Host]

New York City Mayor Zoran Mondame facing his first test leading the Big Apple as it faced one of its biggest snowstorms in a decade. Joining us right now to discuss the state of New York City for business, Stephen Phillip. He's the partnership for New York City president and CEO. He just took over the helm of that organization last week and joined Squawk Box this morning in his first TV interview on the job. So good morning to you, sir.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Morning. Good to be here.

[Interviewer/Host]

Let's just. Well, let's just talk storm for a second. Looks like they did pretty well. Give him a good grade.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

I do.

[Interviewer/Host]

How much credit do you get for that?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

I was a mayor of Jersey City. I think he did a good job. I think it's tough to step in. You know, there's a bureaucracy in place, but.

[Interviewer/Host]

So does he get the credit for that? In your mind, does the previous mayor get the credit? The bureaucracy of.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Look, I think being the mayor, he gets blamed for a lot of things unfairly. So he could take credit for this and I think that's fair game.

[Interviewer/Host]

So the next sort of puzzle piece.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Yeah.

[Interviewer/Host]

Is he has a whole bunch of objectives that he's going to be putting forward, putting budget things and a whole lot of other elements to this. And the business community has to have some kind of relationship with mayor or maybe doesn't. I don't know. What is the current state of that relationship?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Look, I think my interaction has been very positive. He's been proactive and listens. Kind of how that manifests itself, we don't know yet. We're kind of in uncharted territory. I think this country hasn't seen a socialist in an executive position since probably Bernie Sanders in Burlington, Vermont. So, you know, we listen to what he says. I think we're going through a transition from being kind of an activist to an executive or a legislator to.

[Interviewer/Host]

So what does that mean in practice to you?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

What does that shift mean? I think that, you know, there's a place for an activist on the outside throwing bombs. There's less accountability. You know, there's a reality to math when you are the mayor or the president or the governor. And I think that there's going to be some transition. Our job is to be supportive and try to be helpful where we can and disagree where it's necessary.

[Interviewer/Host]

So where can you be helpful in this moment, do you think, and where you disagree in this moment?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Yeah, I think it's a good point. Look, I think when you have issues like childcare important, right. I think 350 CEOs at the partnership, 500,000 employees, many of them provide childcare. We have a unique place with regards to an understanding of what works and what doesn't work. So we can be helpful there. I think on technology, on bureaucracy, we could be helpful there. Look, I think we disagree on the tax policy that he's kind of put out there already. I mean, New York is one of the highest tax places in the country. And if you look at trends on job data here, I Think you would see that we're headed in the wrong direction as it relates to New York City, specifically on the job front.

[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

How much of a relationship is this going to be? A relationship where there is some giveaway and take, or do you think that this is going to be a contentious relationship?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

I don't think anybody's looking for a contentious relationship. I think one thing that the partnership is looking to do is get more assertive in the advocacy space. Last year, they put $10 million into a C4 to be more assertive with regards to policy. I think the starting point shouldn't be from the business community. Just don't hurt us too bad. I mean, that's not a reasonable place to start. So, you know, we're part of the conversation. Most of those CEOs get vilified unfairly as it relates to tax policy. They're really Talking about the 500,000 employees that work direct for them and how to create an environment that's better for them. So I think that they just want to be more part of the conversation that's going to be dictated by how the mayor kind of approaches them.

[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

But more active versus passive.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

More active, for sure. I think that the tone is going to be more active. I think my background is being more active. And I think it's important for us to be assertive. I mean, if you look at kind of New York City, it's a very fragile environment right now, and I think it's important for us to be engaged.

[Interviewer/Host]

So let me ask you this.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Yeah.

[Interviewer/Host]

The mayor, I imagine if you were sitting here right now, he'd say, look, we have a budget problem.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Yes.

[Interviewer/Host]

In this city in particular. And as a result of the budget problem that we have, we can do one of two things. We can either raise taxes so that. To pay for the things that we want.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Yeah.

[Interviewer/Host]

Or we can cut services so that we can try to balance the budget.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Yeah.

[Interviewer/Host]

What do you say to that?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Yeah. So I was mayor of Jersey City for 12 years. I have a perspective on this multibillion dollar budget. It's the same sort of dynamic. I think the starting point needs to be looking at those zombie programs, looking at things that aren't working on where you can cut.

[Interviewer/Host]

Okay. So what are the. What are those things? Because I imagine you're going to be hearing about tax raising, taxes on either the wealthy or corporations. Like, that's. That's where this is going to say.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Two things on that. Right. So if you think about the talking point of the city and the comptroller last week saying that you have a $2 billion budget gap and a $10 billion next year budget gap. And at the same time, you look at Governor Hochul, who's been very pragmatic, very responsible in a tough environment, saying that they're going to be able to achieve a lot of the things they want to achieve without raising taxes. The question that I would have as a starting point is normally a city and state trend in the same direction. It's very rare that you'll say one saying things are going great or in a better direction and one saying the sky is falling. And so the starting point is you should probably bring some of those CEOs into the conversation. They have billions and billions and billions of dollars in budgets them selves. They could be helpful.

[Interviewer/Host]

So. But when you look at the budget right now and you know, these quote unquote zombie programs, can you identify money well that you think should be cut so that you're not getting the tax raise on the other side?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

The short answer is the budget hasn't been introduced yet by the mayor. So I think it would be kind of a little bit premature for me to say what his priorities are and what his priorities are. Right. I think that's fair.

[Interviewer/Host]

But I think we can assume that he is going to intend to. To raise taxes. He has said that well, and he believes that there are things that he wants to do in this city and he believes I, look, I'm projecting onto him. One of the reasons I think he was so vocal about trying to make sure that the streets were clean was during this snowstorm, was he wanted to be able to say, what you're paying for as a taxpayer is clean streets. We're going to execute. Because part of the problem is if you're not executing on what you're doing, nobody wants to pay for it.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

I think people understand that what they're paying for. The question is, what are you getting for that value? And when you look at the budget and the amount that it's increased over the last five and 10 years, there's questions about that. And the starting point is that the business community needs to be part of that conversation. You said that earlier. And I think that that is a fair place to be. Whether he includes leadership, I can't speak on that.

[Interviewer/Host]

How important in your mind is the corporate tax issue versus the wealth tax issue or the millionaire tax issue, meaning the on the individual, the income tax, income tax issue?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Well, look, I think both of those are problematic. I think that the starting point for us on both of Those is that we are not willing to go down that road. I think that New York City and New York State is already one of the highest taxed environments in the country. And you could see in California, there is a tripwire. At some point, there is a place where people say, look, I have options elsewhere. And maybe you're not going to see bank of New York leave New York tomorrow, because it's not. But people will make decisions to relocate jobs elsewhere. So over time, it's death by a thousand paper cuts. And that does impact the budgets.

[Interviewer/Host]

How much do you think it's on the individual level, though? So I agree with you. Companies, companies. Hard for JP Morgan, which just built a beautiful big building on Park Avenue, to move so quickly, that's not going to happen.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Look, I can't.

[Interviewer/Host]

But that is, I imagine, also what the mayor is banking on.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Well, he would probably bank on that. What I think has lost some time in the activist community is, let's say you have 3,000 people that are super wealthy here, right? You don't need 1,000 of them to leave. You need only a handful to have a massive impact on the budget. And, you know, everybody has their own kind of place where they're ultimately going to decide to leave. But if you have 5, 10, 15, that is a problem because it takes a lot of Stephen Phillips to make up for one of those people. Right.

[Interviewer/Host]

Given that you actually have spent time with budgets, do you think that there's a lot of money lying on the table that could ultimately be cut without hurting the services of the state?

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

I think there generally are efficiencies that can happen when new administrations come in. I think over time, people get comfortable in zombie programs. I think looking at those, I think you need to have fair conversations and be able to mediate between unions and labor and service and obviously the private sector. I think that if the starting point is that you're on picket lines and you're protesting and you're still in that activist space, it's going to be very, very hard to kind of move the private sector in a place that's constructive. I think you've got to find that balance. And, you know, it's been three weeks, so it's hard to kind of say, he's good, he's bad, he's going to be great, he's going to be very poor. We'll see. But, you know, we're trying to be supportive.

[Interviewer/Host]

One last question just on the affordability issue, because that is a huge touch point for the whole country. But in particular, in New York, where I think we can all agree it is not that affordable for just about anybody these days. And so part of the argument that he's made repeatedly is he wants higher incomes for people. He wants people to be able to afford stuff. And so, you know, if a union is doing the work on the subways, I imagine his answer is not, let me try to cut back on the union. His answer is, I need more money from the wealthy and the inequality that's in the city. That's his argument.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Yeah. I would go back to what I said at the beginning, that we are in uncharted territory on a socialist mayor. And again, every socialist that has been elected or DSA member has been on the legislative side. So there's very little accountability. You could throw bombs. We will see how that kind of moves over the next couple months. It's too early to say. And I'm not going to criticize him again after that.

[Interviewer/Host]

Okay, Stephen, it's great to see you. Appreciate it.

[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

So you sound like you're prepared to go.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

Well, I mean, I was mayor for a long time. I kind of have some familiarity with this. I hope so.

[Becky Quick]

Still to come on squawk pod Bill George. He's former board member at Target and he's the former chairman of Minnesota based Medtronic, a company whose current CEO is one of the 60 Minnesotan executives calling for calm in Minneapolis.

[Bill George]

Some people thought it was too soft and wasn't specific enough. I think they had to tread a narrow tightrope between upsetting the White House and the behind the scenes negotiations going on and being advocates for significant change.

[Becky Quick]

We'll be right back.

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[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

Life is short and you just gotta think big to accomplish big things.

[Becky Quick]

Julia Boorstin hosts CNBC Changemakers and Power Players new episodes every Tuesday, wherever you get your podcasts, this is Squawkpod.

[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

You're watching Squawkbox right here on cnbc. I'm Becky Quick along with Andrew Ross Sorkin. Joe is off today after the second.

[Interviewer/Host]

Fatal shooting of a US Citizen in Minneapolis at the hands of an ice age. And a collection of 60 CEOs of Minnesota based companies co signed a letter calling for common their state. Joining us right now is Bill George, Harvard Business School senior fellow and a former chairman of Medtronica company whose current chief signed onto that letter. Good morning to you. We've all been trying to make sense of what we've been seeing on, on screens, on television and social media, but also about the role that business leaders have played historically in terms of speaking out publicly on, on issues of political and social importance. Clearly the world has shifted over the last several years about companies speaking out in these moments. And I'm curious what you think the right call in these, these polarized circumstances should be.

[Bill George]

Well, I think Clearly, Andrew, that CEOs did the right thing and putting out a statement. Some people thought it was too soft and wasn't specific enough. I had to tread a narrow tightrope between upsetting the White House and the behind the scenes negotiations going on and being advocates for significant change. But they got it done. And I think it is the tipping point in Minnesota. I think the president being a businessman, has Trouble Ignoring all 60 CEOs of major companies in Minnesota. Not one failed to sign on. They did take a few extra days to get everyone to sign on. And I think Alex Preddy's murder on last Friday, I think that or Saturday, that kind of turned the tide and but I think it's had a very positive impact. And you see the president now taking action not just solely because of this, but he's at least moving, moving Homan in and moving Bovino out and some of the other people. And he said, he said he had very positive calls with Governor Walz and, and Mayor Fry. And I've been in touch particularly with Walls and Ellison. So I'm encouraged.

[Interviewer/Host]

What do you think? Can I ask you somebody something, someone who knows this state well and knows this city well. What do you think is going on here? Because we do have a number of viewers who continue to point out this, this continues to be a problem in, in this particular place. It is a sanctuary city. There is a history of protesting and the like. But what, what, what's your sort of if you take 30,000ft back looking at.

[Bill George]

All this, well the protests have been remarkably peaceful and there's been a huge community coming out in different areas where people are working together. So they've been quite in contrast, Andrew, to what happened after George Floyd's murder. When they typically 11, 12 o' clock at night, they turn violent. We've not had any of that. So I think students have been very respectful. Look at that one downtown with 40, 50,000 people when it was minus 21 degrees. So I find that encouraging. I think this particular group of CEOs is a little more hesitant than some of the ones in the past to really step into these things. And they'd rather work behind the scenes and work through their own contacts rather than coming out publicly.

[Interviewer/Host]

And so what is the right approach here? You know, here I was, we talked about it on television yesterday. I said, you know, this is, this is one of those moments that CEOs have an opportunity. It's not an opportunity, maybe a moral obligation to say something if they think that there's a problem. Having said that, clearly there is a polarized country on issues that for some seem obvious and others seem very different.

[Bill George]

Yeah, Andrew, I say stick to the business aspect. This is very negative for every one of their businesses. First of all, your obligation is to provide a safe, secure place of employment for your employees, a sense of well being. And that's been in many ways shattered. Particularly those have retail stores like Target. So that, that's a very serious thing. Clearly Minnesota, these big global companies like Cargill and 3M, Medtronic, Ecolab, General Mills, all move people in and out from all over the globe, all over the country. They have to attract from east coast, west coast. It's, it's cold there. But you. We've had a very high quality of living. And I think I'm very concerned that this will deter people from wanting to move to Minnesota. I think that's a big negative. And I think the third is the impact on both productivity and innovation is quite negative. And hopefully the president finally recognizes this. But look, they don't want to get right in the middle of politics for fear of retribution. I understand that and I know you.

[Interviewer/Host]

Make on the other side of this, if you, if you go online, even in the past 24 hours, there's been a lot of consternation in the tech community, interestingly about Apple and Tim Cook, the CEO of that company, who was at the White House celebrating the documentary premiere of Melania on the same, you know, on Saturday. And there are people out there saying they're not buying iPhones. Do you believe that? And do you think that's going to impact things?

[Bill George]

Well, it certainly can. I don't think it's a big impact, no. There have been boycotts against companies. I don't think those hold very well. But you know, let's face it, there are companies, the tech community, which has a direct access to the president, others, wealthy business people have that access. The people that signed a statement, allies, they don't have real access to the president directly. They're not going to mar a lago and having dinner. So they're more one step removed from that. But they do. There is some fear of retribution. I'll be honest in talking to people. But again, I think I'm concerned. I say stick to the business issues. These are big. It's very negative for the business environment, I can tell you that. And not just locally for Target stores and things like it's negative for your ability to attract top talent. And Minnesota has to do that. It's cold in the winter, so the only way you can attract people is with a great place to live.

[Interviewer/Host]

Bill but there is an issue which is if you talk to a lot of CEOs, some of who spoke out on other issues in the past, they say two things. They think, look, I was burned by doing some of that in the past. There's a sort of go woke, go broke concept. And then secondarily, or maybe even, maybe even more in the forefront is the issue that this administration, I think, unlike other administrations, has used the bully pulpit of the administration to go after companies that they disagree with.

[Bill George]

No doubt. And that's a people fear they don't want to be. And I actually advise people stay below the radar. No sense tweaking the bear and stay below the radar. But I think what happened, Andrew, let's go back to Minnesota because in 2020, when George Floyd was murdered, there was a big swing to really focus on Di and it went too far. And I think that pendulum may have gone too far the other way. And I think now people are trying to figure out what's the right place. And again, I think the feeling is stick to your business and focus on IT issues. But this is hurting business. And so I think a lot of them don't want to be in the spotlight. Yes, the tech guys are way out in the spotlight. They're way out in front. But I don't think that the business leaders I know who signed this letter and I know all of them did not want to be out in front. They don't. But they, I think There was a certain collectivity and frankly the associations have not set. You haven't seen the business Roundtable now. So do we have the business owner partnership, the people. The guy really got this gun. It was a guy named Doug Loon who's with the Chamber of Commerce.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

He.

[Interviewer/Host]

And that's my question to you. So obviously you could say this is a, I don't know if you think this is a local issue or a national issue. So locally that group spoke, spoke out, spoke about it, did it as collectively. What do you say to other CEOs around the country who's employees are saying to them what are you doing here? Or customers?

[Bill George]

Yeah, I think first of all the associations have been very reticent. This is a big era for lobbying. So. But I think you better, you better listen to your employees. A lot of people say let's just listen to, you know, stay out of the way of the government. But I think you better listen your employees. And not enough people have done that. That worries about Target's been really hurt by that. Compare that with Costco that just said this is who we are. We're going to say who we are. We're going to be that. And that's what I encourage. I do not respect people that change their values because of political pressures. Look, the government changes every four years. These companies want to be around for another hundred years and they have to figure out how to navigate through that and not flip with the wind because that's where you lose respect.

[Interviewer/Host]

Bill, it's always good to talk to you. We appreciate you joining us this morning. Thank you.

[Becky Quick]

That's Quack Pod for today. Thank you for listening as always. Ways Squawk Box is hosted by Joe Kernan, Becky Quick and Andrew Ross Sorkin. Weekday mornings on cnbc starting at 6am Eastern. To get the best bits of that three hour TV show right into your ears. Follow Squawkpod wherever you're listening now. We'll meet you right back here tomorrow.

[Bill George]

We are clear.

[Interviewer/Host]

Thanks guys.

[Andrew Ross Sorkin]

Foreign.

[Stephen Fulo (Stephen Phillip)]

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