Joe Kernan (1:39)

The hell does that mean? Driving billionaires out of the state might feel good in the short run because.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (1:43)

Those people don't like the billionaires.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (1:45)

It's Tuesday, January 6th, 2026. Squawk Pod begins right now.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (1:52)

Stand Becky by in three, two, one.

Becky Quick (1:57)

Good morning, everybody. Welcome to Squawk Box right here on cnbc. We are live from the NASDAQ markets at in Times Square. I'm Becky Quick, along with Joe Kernan and Andrew Ross Sorkin. Hail, hail, the gang's all here and we are ready to go. Once again, happy birthday.

Joe Kernan (2:13)

And it is.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (2:13)

I thought we'd do this later, but happy birthday.

Joe Kernan (2:16)

We're not going to do anything, believe me. But life moves pretty fast. That's all very.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (2:20)

See, that's the only reason I.

Joe Kernan (2:23)

A great philosopher once said, life moves pretty fast and you better stop and take a look around once in a while or you could miss it. Do you remember who that great philosopher was? No.

Becky Quick (2:31)

Was it Yogi Berra?

Joe Kernan (2:32)

Nope. It was Ferris Bueller.

Emily Wilkins (2:35)

I do remember it.

Joe Kernan (2:37)

But January 6th is a special day because of the epiphany. And I looked at what it meant and I think maybe you'll appreciate this quickly because when Jesus was born, he was born. He was the king of Israel. And at that point that was the chosen people. Nobody else was invited in. I didn't realize the three kings were Gentiles. And that represents. Everybody can be part of. This is. I mean, this is what's written anyway, if you believe it. I don't know whether you believe it or not, but that's what Christians and Catholics believe. That that's when everybody was invited. Then they bought frankincense, which gold and myrrh. Gold was representing kingmanship. Frankincense was divinity and myrrh was the future suffering that he's gonna go through. Anyway, that's what I'd like to. And it's Norman Reedus birthday, the guy from Walking Dead. So those are the two things I.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (3:28)

Want to celebrate that's worth celebrating.

Joe Kernan (3:29)

Those are what I want to leave you with. The Trump administer and just that we're all getting older and there's just no stopping it. It's almost like a freight train, is it not? I mean, some of us older than others, but.

Becky Quick (3:41)

But the years are pretty fast. Ferris Wheeler was.

Joe Kernan (3:45)

The years are going by.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (3:49)

Our next guest here to weigh in on Venezuela leader Nicolas Maduro's ouster and the impact on oil on crypto. As we were just discussing the commercial break and so much more. Joining us is Daniel Ocerio. He is Andean Capital Advisor, president and founder. Good morning to you.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (4:05)

Good morning.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (4:05)

So help us understand what you think is is going to happen here next before we even get into all the other details.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (4:11)

Well, I think to put it in context, this is the biggest thing that has happened in US foreign policy to Latin America in 65 years since the Bay of Pigs. You know, the Trump administration has clearly said the hemisphere matters and it is of grave national importance to the United States and we will act accordingly. And we saw that over the weekend.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (4:31)

But what do you think ends up happening in Venezuela as a result of it? I don't know if you saw by the way the State Department put out. I think it was on Instagram or on Twitter, it says this is our hemisphere. Do you see that?

Joe Kernan (4:40)

Yeah.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (4:40)

And I wonder what that means in a more broader sort of perspective in terms of what do you think all these other countries are thinking now?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (4:46)

Well, I mean, we've never, we haven't spoken about the Monroe Doctrine as much as we have in a long time. Believe it's the Donroe, the Don Row Doctrine. Right. I'm still getting Used to that.

Joe Kernan (4:56)

Yeah.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (4:57)

It's going to impact macroeconomic stability in the region. It's going to impact elections. I'm originally from Colombia. There's an election this spring. The election in Colombia has already been decided. The leftist leaning candidate is going to lose.

Joe Kernan (5:09)

I mean, did we have a claim that were the. It's our hemisphere was de facto the United States. It is because of its influence, power, economic power, military power. It is the hemisphere where the US Is dominant. And China would admit that they are over there. You don't even have to say it for it to be true.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (5:28)

You don't have to say it. Brazil's largest trading partners, China. China built the largest port in the. In the. In South America in.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (5:35)

I mean we do have to say it.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (5:37)

You have to show it.

Joe Kernan (5:38)

So you have to. So this is not a bad thing.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (5:40)

You have to show it.

Joe Kernan (5:42)

It's interventionist. It kind of looks like. And it's a. It seems like a return to a different era.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (5:46)

It's a return to a different.

Joe Kernan (5:47)

Is it a good thing?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (5:48)

I think it is a good thing, I think. But I think to stop this kind of mass migration, to stop flow of people and funds that are confusing, it's important to talk about how much do.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (6:00)

You think though this is about immigration? How much do you think this is about oil? How much do you think this is actually about drugs?

Joe Kernan (6:07)

But Dan, you say he was from Colombia. I didn't realize how many Venezuelans in Colombia.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (6:13)

So Venezuela is a country of 28.

Joe Kernan (6:15)

Million people and how many 8 million people?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (6:16)

It should be 35, 36. 8 million people left Venezuela. It's the largest migration I think since the Second World War. And they've gone. There are 5 million of them in Colombia. They've gone all over Latin America. And these aren't, you know, they get painted with a bad brush. These are not bad people. These are people looking, but they need care, they need health care, the education. They arrive with no money in Colombia, throughout the hemisphere, largely in Colombia. Now you can imagine what that does to a developing economy when 5 million people show up saying, I need shelter, I need health, I need education.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (6:48)

So what do you think the prevailing view is in Latin America about what's happening here? You think they're happy about this? They're unhappy about this?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (6:56)

I can, I can frame it to you.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (6:57)

There's a sovereignty issue, right?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (6:59)

I can frame it to you this way. Every Venezuelan, with the exception of a few thousand people that used to run that regime are ecstatic. So whenever there's a debate of should we have done this? Should we have done that? The Venezuelans are ecstatic because they're going to get their country back.

Joe Kernan (7:13)

There was a. I think the question is what.

Becky Quick (7:15)

What comes next?

Joe Kernan (7:16)

Right, right.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (7:17)

Well, I think there's going to be some, you know, some power sharing. What do I mean by that? There is obviously Delsey Rodriguez, the vice president, who's now been promoted to the top spot. She's part of the old Maduro regime. It's undoubtedly as are the leaders in there. I think the Trump administration is going to have them run potholes and traffic tickets and the Trump administration runs security and oil.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (7:42)

And when you say that, when you say we're going to run all those things that mean boots on the ground, I think it's. I think, how else can we run this?

Joe Kernan (7:49)

Boots are technocrats.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (7:51)

I think boots. Technocrats can't be there without boots.

Joe Kernan (7:53)

Okay, Right.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (7:54)

And I think it's not one of those jobs. You can work from home.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (7:57)

So you believe we're going to have boots on the ground in Venezuela?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (7:59)

I think the US Embassy is going to reopen. It's going to be a massive effort. There's going to be technocrats.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (8:05)

Well, there's a difference between opening a US Embassy and there's a difference between having thousands of troops on the ground.

Joe Kernan (8:10)

Are you saying thousands of troops or opening an embassy?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (8:12)

I think it's impossible to reopen a massive embassy without having thousands of troops protecting settings.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (8:16)

This is where this is going. Okay, Right. So now, now it gets interesting. If you're right, then there's the oil piece. So the president has been out publicly. The White House said it today in the Wall Street Journal that they believe that US Oil companies are ready to go in there and invest big. And yet on the other end, it's not clear that the US Oil companies are willing or want to do that right now, given the price of oil and everything else. So where do you see that piece of this?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (8:41)

I mean, U.S. oil service companies were up 7, 8% yesterday. The Venezuelan defaulted bonds were up 30% yesterday. I don't care. Both defaulted bonds, even defaulted bonds don't move 30% in a trading session.

Becky Quick (8:53)

But it may not be the big majors. It may be other investors that step in and do that.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (8:56)

I mean, Schlumberger, Halliburton, those were on the move yesterday. Is this, is this oil patch big enough for. To move Exxon? It moved it a little.

Becky Quick (9:04)

We had a former Chevron executive who was with us yesterday who's raising his own fund, who is. Is Thinking he's going to have a lot of money coming in and that it may not be the majors who do it first, it may be others that kind of bring that money in.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (9:17)

And before Chavez arrived, Maduro's mentor 98, 99, Venezuela produced three and a half million barrels of oil a day. They now produce 900,000 barrels a day. And they produce 900,000 barrels a day doing everything wrong. Corruption, brain drain, lack of technological innovation, us.

Becky Quick (9:36)

And they've allowed the infrastructure to collapse.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (9:39)

There's some of it that needs a good coat of paint. There's some of it that needs a lot of money. So there's a bit of everything. The thing about Venezuela, you can still pull the stuff out of the ground for 13 bucks a barrel, right?

Joe Kernan (9:49)

Like that's unbelievable.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (9:51)

They have 300 billion barrels of proven oil reserves.

Becky Quick (9:54)

And their oil reserves are the heavy crude, the sour crude, that. There are a lot of refineries in the United States, especially along the Gulf, that refine that. Not the stuff that's coming out of the Bakken.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (10:04)

Exactly. It's high viscosity. It can be refined here. So there are U.S. companies, asphalt, diesel, there are U.S. oil companies and U.S. oil service companies. They're going to make money on exploration, production and refining.

Joe Kernan (10:17)

We need a SWOC fund. We should. At $13 a barrel. You sat down and talked about. Bitcoin is not, is not popular down in Venezuela because of an investment. It's a usage case. It's absolutely essential if you want to buy something.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (10:34)

One of the fascinating things that has happened in Venezuela, not out of intellectual curiosity or out of portfolio diversification, but out of necessity, is how so many people within that country have used crypto for survival. They use certain, certain cryptos to buy a sandwich. They use Bitcoin to save. Because imagine if you have a currency that literally dissolves out of your hands.

Joe Kernan (10:56)

After you work for a week, it's gone.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (10:58)

You work for a week and it's gone. You have huge inflation, you have massive currency devaluation, you have to get it into something else. And there are no dollars. It's very easy to say, well, why don't you just buy dollars? There are no dollars there, right? So crypto has been the answer. So another a slight pivot away from just the oil interest, the geopolitical interest, is what can we learn as we're learning more about crypto adoption with what has happened as Venezuela as a base case? And it's fascinating because.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (11:25)

Well, but let me ask you a different question. If you believe the US is coming in and is going to clean up Venezuela. You would argue that bitcoin, the use case of bitcoin, should actually be less, not more. Right.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (11:39)

I think once people have gone through the 25 years these folks have gone through, it's going to take a long time to convince them things are fine.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (11:46)

But why is that view? That view is completely at odds with the other view you just provided around oil and everything else that has to happen. You just said that the whole country is, is that there's a big investment case to be made in the country. Everything, you know, we can go in and do all these things. And bitcoin is the opposite view. Bit the coin is the view that for 25 years people are so, you know, psychologically scarred by this, that they can't do anything and they'll never trust real money.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (12:13)

No, it just takes time.

Joe Kernan (12:14)

Right.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (12:14)

You can't be, you know, so myopic to think that this is going to get fixed in a week, two weeks, three weeks. It's going to take some time. In the meantime, people are going to protect their assets by maintaining.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (12:25)

So there's a short term bet on that would be a short term bet. I'm saying is the assuming. If you believe the US is so great at taking things over and doing all these things, you would think that bitcoin shouldn't have the value that it has. By the way, I'm not making the case one way or the other. I'm just.

Joe Kernan (12:40)

You seem to quite a bit.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (12:41)

But.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (12:42)

Well, here we are making. He's arguing.

Joe Kernan (12:45)

I don't support trying to understand. I don't get that.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (12:48)

Yeah, but I think there's going to be a ton of money flowing in. I think there's going to be the equivalent of a Marshall Plan for Venezuela. It's going to be paid for not by us, but by. Through Venezuelan oil. US companies are going to come in, they're going to increase exploration, they're going to invest in oil infrastructure, they're going to invest in infrastructure.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (13:05)

And do you think that's going to get that? Do you think that we are going to be either reimbursing folks or financially incentivizing companies to do this? Meaning that do you think this ultimately is going to have to come. You're saying it doesn't come from the US taxpayer, but if you talk to some of these oil execs and others, there's a view that like maybe we wait around and people do stuff for us.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (13:23)

I think there is going to be a increased activity. The international Debt capital markets. Once the Venezuelan bonds and the PD bonds, the oil company bonds gets restructured, the Venezuela will have access to the debt capital markets, they'll borrow money, they'll get that country moving again. Oil companies will come in and make their own investment and then they're going to get a revenue share of what they, I think a pretty favorable revenue share of, of the oil that comes.

Joe Kernan (13:49)

Out of the ground.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (13:50)

And it's not going to be a.

Joe Kernan (13:51)

Dollar denominated economy down there, but more so than it was in the past, I guess. Right. I think the currency will improve. The Venezuelan, we're seeing it with the bonds or there'll be a reset.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (14:03)

The bonds are denominated in dollars, they'll be reset. The question will be does it just become, if I was a central bank governor of Venezuela, might just be easier to dollarize the economy.

Joe Kernan (14:11)

That's what I mean.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (14:12)

And just say, hey you know what, we're a dollar economy and this is the way this thing works now.

Joe Kernan (14:16)

But I would. But I don't think that that means no one has bitcoin. That's the point. I don't think it means that all of a sudden everyone just, I'm not.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (14:24)

Saying everybody sells all their bitcoin. I'm saying but economy. Less people would, I think, I think.

Joe Kernan (14:30)

It'D be, I think it's already, it's, it's out of the horse, left the.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (14:34)

Barn already in terms of be a combination. I think people would welcome the chance to have earn in dollars and also be able to save another.

Joe Kernan (14:42)

I just don't think the unbanked people talked about bitcoin a lot about around the world, the unbanked that work all week and then have nothing to show for it at the end. And this is I think a concrete example that it's actually happened. You've seen it happen.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (14:57)

And until people have gone through hyperinflation, you don't know what that feels like. Exactly what you just said. You work all week and then all of a sudden the money's gone.

Joe Kernan (15:03)

We did have the Biden administration.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (15:06)

I don't think there was hyperinflation during the Biden administration.

Joe Kernan (15:09)

Nine percent pretty hyper. Got people pretty hyped. They're still hyped up about it. The affordability question, that's from the 22% in that administration. That's what it's from. Right, right.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (15:20)

Daniel, thank you for coming.

Joe Kernan (15:21)

Thank you.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (15:21)

It's great to see all of you. Tease will be next.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (15:27)

Coming up on Squawk Pod. What happens when the Democratic mayor of Silicon Valley's largest city council comes out against a so called billionaire's tax in California, the Golden State and fractured tech politics. Next.

Joe Kernan (15:41)

Why don't they like the billionaires?

Andrew Ross Sorkin (15:42)

Because they think that the world is unequal, which it is.

Joe Kernan (15:50)

What made you confident that you could do something that hadn't been done before?

Becky Quick (15:54)

I have no fear of failure.

Joe Kernan (15:56)

Trailblazing women, changing the game. One of my favorite pieces of advice.

Emily Wilkins (16:01)

Think about what your boss's boss needs.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (16:04)

Leadership can look in many, many different forms. It really does come down to just trusting yourself. Life is short and you just gotta think big to accomplish big things. Julia Boorstin hosts CNBC Changemakers and Power Players. New episodes every Tuesday. Wherever you get your podcasts, you're listening.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (16:23)

To Squawk Pod stand Anderby in 3, 2, 1. Qander. Welcome back to Squawk Box. The Democratic mayor of Silicon Valley's largest city speaking out against a proposed tax on billionaires net worth. San Jose Mayor Matt Mahan writing on X. We need a rising economic tide to lift all boats, not a political plan that is going to sink California's innovation economy. New York Times has reported that investor Peter Thiel and Google's co founder Larry Page have considered leaving California. Mahan said that driving billionaires out of the state might feel good in the short run, but working people will pick up the tab for this political ploy. It's interesting because Peter Thiel already opened an office. I don't know if you saw in.

Becky Quick (17:04)

Miami put out a release about it.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (17:06)

Put out a press release about it. You do that in part because you might be saying you've already moved, if you will. And then there's, you know, I don't know if you saw Ro Khanna. I know you're doing this, you know, Rojo campaign together. But by the way, he said good riddance.

Joe Kernan (17:24)

I know roast.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (17:25)

He took to Twitter and said good riddance.

Joe Kernan (17:26)

I was thinking about this. All politics are local. And I understand this gentleman even as a Democrat, but I don't. He can't help himself though. What the hell does that mean? Driving billionaires out of the state might feel good in the short run. That's a stupid comment.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (17:39)

No, no, no.

Becky Quick (17:40)

He's saying that to defeating the populace.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (17:41)

He's saying to the no to the people who are taxes.

Joe Kernan (17:45)

Right. Why would it feel good in the short term?

Andrew Ross Sorkin (17:47)

Because those people don't like the billionaires.

Joe Kernan (17:50)

Why don't they like the billionaires?

Andrew Ross Sorkin (17:52)

Because they think that the world is unequal, which it is.

Becky Quick (17:55)

But then you're going to have the issue where a rare number of people pay the majority, like 30% of the tax base. And if that disappears, they can't get.

Joe Kernan (18:02)

To the point of where they see houses.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (18:05)

They clearly can't. That's why they're so.

Joe Kernan (18:08)

Did all these people inherit the money? Why can't they? Why can't they see that when you do something like that and create that wealth, that there's taxes involved, there's shareholders involved, there's technology that's involved. You sure?

Andrew Ross Sorkin (18:21)

Yes.

Joe Kernan (18:22)

Billionaires are a good thing. I am a good thing, and Roe knows that.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (18:26)

I'm not disagreeing with that.

Joe Kernan (18:27)

Roe can't help himself because the geographic center of that crazy Democratic Party at this point is so far left that he can't be. If you're John Fetterman in this Democratic Party, you almost have to become an independent. You can't say normal, reasonable things anymore. Andrew, it's going to change. We're seeing it change. I think at this point.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (18:49)

Well, I don't know. You might be seeing a change the other way. That's the other piece of this.

Joe Kernan (18:53)

You say maybe every generation we have to go through that.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (18:55)

I think there's a lot of folks who look around. This goes back to the question about affordability. And they say, you know, and they look at the billionaires.

Joe Kernan (19:02)

Remember in G1, every once in a while there's got to be like a total battle and, you know, the mattresses come out, a lot of people, bad things happen. Then you can start fresh again. But we gotta learn.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (19:15)

Well, but then there could be a real battle. I mean, that's this. Go. Now you're into the Ray Dalio Civil war kind of situation.

Joe Kernan (19:21)

No, I was just kidding about the Godfather.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (19:23)

But one of the things that he's talked about for a long time is that when you get this kind of inequality, you do have to believe the inequality piece is not good. That is true. Forgetting about whether you like billionaires, you don't like billionaires. We want everyone to become a billionaire.

Joe Kernan (19:37)

We do. But he also said no one can do what he did anymore. Like he's those specialists. There's still possibility of much harder. I'm not. I think that we need to equalize opportunity, not equalize outcome.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (19:48)

But, but, but the opportunity for that outcome today is lower, a lot of reasons than it was globalization.

Joe Kernan (19:56)

And that's going to make it even tougher.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (19:58)

Sure. And so then the question is, how do you. This is a political question. How do you fix that?

Becky Quick (20:03)

We have a politician waiting on the other side of this, well, I wouldn't.

Joe Kernan (20:06)

Look for government to fix it.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (20:09)

Next On Squawk Pod, CNBC's Emily Wilkins on Congress. Busy return to Washington. And from Venezuela to Greenland, we're diving into President Trump's new interpretation of the centuries old Monroe Doctrine with Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (20:26)

I think that when he looks at Greenland, he says, look, we've got a defense, a national security interest in Greenland. We have a defense treaty that's in Place since 1941. We've got soldiers in Greenland. We can do more. We can offer Greenland more than Europe is.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (20:41)

We'll be right back.

Joe Kernan (20:47)

Hey, Fidelity, how can I remember to invest every month?

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (20:52)

With the Fidelity app, you can choose a schedule and set up recurring investments in stocks and ETFs.

Joe Kernan (20:59)

Oh, that sounds easier than I thought.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (21:01)

You got this?

Joe Kernan (21:02)

Yeah, I do. Now, where did I put my keys?

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (21:06)

You will find them where you left them.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (21:10)

Investing involves risk, including risk of loss.

Joe Kernan (21:12)

Fidelity Brokerage Services, llc Member nyse, SIPC what made you confident that you could.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (21:19)

Do something that hadn't been done before?

Becky Quick (21:21)

I have no fear of failure.

Joe Kernan (21:23)

Trailblazing women, changing the game.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (21:26)

One of my favorite pieces of advice.

Emily Wilkins (21:28)

Think about what your boss's boss needs.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (21:31)

Leadership can look in many, many different forms. It really does come down to just trusting yourself. Life is short and you just gotta think big to accomplish big things. Julia Boorstin hosts CNBC Changemakers and Power Players. New episodes every Tuesday. Wherever you get your podcasts, this is Squawk Pod.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (21:53)

You're watching Squawk Box right here on cnbc. I'm Andrew Osworkin, along with Joe Kernan and Becky Quick. And the big news of the morning is it is Joe Kernan.

Joe Kernan (22:01)

No, no. We were gonna do that once when.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (22:03)

No one was watching, wish him a very happy birthday.

Joe Kernan (22:06)

We did that at six to get it out.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (22:08)

Joe Kernan, the birthday boy. We'll get you a hat. We'll get streamers in a moment.

Becky Quick (22:12)

I won't continue the.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (22:14)

And wait, I thought we got on today's other top stories, President Trump says he thinks US Oil companies could get major operations up and running in Venezuela in under 18 months and they would be reimbursed for their expenses either by the US Government or with new Venezuelan revenue. Unclear whether that's a possibility given some of the comments we've been hearing from oil executives about that prospect.

Joe Kernan (22:38)

The Trump administration briefing top congressional lawmakers about the US Operation in Venezuela. Emily Wilkins joins us now with more live from Washington. You can if you see Eric Trump down there. It's his birthday too, Emily, just in.

Emily Wilkins (22:52)

Case you're, you're wondering, well, happy birthday, Joe. I guess. Happy epiphany as well, you know. To celebrate, top lawmakers had a two hour briefing last night with a number of cabinet officials. This is of course on Venezuela. And they left with Republicans feeling very confident on the path forward. Here you had Speaker Mike Johnson, who, who said after leaving the briefing that he does not anticipate American boots on the ground in Venezuela and he does expect elections to be held.

Joe Kernan (23:21)

This is not a regime change. This is a demand for change of behavior by a regime. The interim government is stood up now and we are hopeful that they will be able to correct their action. They cannot participate with narco, terrorist and very dangerous international criminal organizations that harm and target Americans, frankly, and traffic all of these dangerous drugs into our country that do all this great harm to our country. They cannot continue that activity.

Emily Wilkins (23:49)

Democratic leaders did remain skeptical after the meeting. You had Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer saying the meeting left him with only more questions.

Joe Kernan (23:59)

Their plan for the US Running Venezuela is vague, based on wishful thinking and unsatisfying. I asked for, I would have liked. I did not receive any assurances that we would not try to do the same thing in other countries.

Emily Wilkins (24:17)

Senator Tim Kaine will be forcing a vote in the Senate later this week on blocking further US Military action in Venezuela. A few other Republican lawmakers have spoken out against Trump's moves in Venezuela, but so far the majority of Trump's party party seems to be on board. They are waiting to be briefed later this week. Trump is going to be speaking with House Republicans at 10am today and then there will be full briefings for the House and the Senate. Looks like that might be on Wednesday.

Joe Kernan (24:44)

Joe? Yes, a lot going on here. I'm thinking Greenland. We're going to have Governor Landry on later today. What should I ask him? Emily?

Emily Wilkins (24:53)

Definitely, I think there's a lot of interest. I mean, I know people have put forward Greenland, I'm thinking to Congressman Don Bacon who has kind of been somewhat supportive of what's happened in Venezuela, but said, look, I don't see any upside to going to Greenland. Denmark is an ally of ours. It doesn't seem to make sense. So it would be very interesting to see them compare the two of those.

Joe Kernan (25:15)

Yeah, it's NATO too. It's complicated. But yeah, people have put it forth. I think Stephen Miller tweeted something out, a picture of Greenland with saying us over it and said soon or something. So There's a big piece in the Journal today on what constitutes international law and whether, you know, suddenly everyone's throwing around the term international law and whether it applies to Venezuela. The Journal makes a case that international law doesn't necessarily preclude something like the action in Venezuela. I would have to think that international law in terms of Greenland, if it was by force, I would have to think that that's a return to a different era where, you know, territory and imperialism and it's just, it seems like a big bridge to cross, a pretty large one. But I think, I think Trump is.

Emily Wilkins (26:05)

You'Re hearing from a lot of Republicans right now is that they do support Venezuela because they say, you know, hey, this was an action that was actually more for the Justice Department and more about going in for someone who's been indicted in the US Than it was a military action necessarily. So I think a lot of lawmakers are saying that they see it as appropriate because of that reason. Obviously, with Greenland, that would be a completely different thing. I think a lot of lawmakers are right now just trying to wrap their minds around everything that has occurred in Venezuela and what will be coming up next. I don't even imagine Greenland is on the radar for many folks yet just because they're, they're trying to figure out everything with Venezuela as well as what's coming next and what that's going to.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (26:42)

Mean for the US it is pretty.

Joe Kernan (26:45)

Amazing because people aren't thinking about it, but maybe they should be. We'll talk to the governor. He just, he was there and he's at him, he's got two jobs now, which in and of itself they wonder whether a governor can do that. But we're going to ask him that as well. Thanks, Emily.

Emily Wilkins (27:01)

He's not has nearly as many jobs as Marco Rubio yet, though he's got a few more that he needs to add up before he gets there.

Joe Kernan (27:06)

Or Andrew, in terms of we're all competing for job numbers, as many. See you later. Thank you. Denmark's prime minister warning of dire consequences if the US Tries to seize Greenland, including the possible end of NATO. Joining us now is Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry. He's a US Special envoy to Greenland working with the president on a plan to acquire the territory. And good morning.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (27:37)

Good morning.

Joe Kernan (27:38)

And thanks for joining us on set. At first glance and knee jerk reactions, I understand sort of the, I don't know what you would call it, sort of the surprise or chagrin or when you talk about in this day and age any type of what is perceived to be imperialism or. I mean, the world ran like this for centuries with countries exerting their influence all around the world, seizing territories. We just don't think that it's done anymore. Is President Trump ready to actually seize Greenland and would that be okay?

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (28:14)

No, I don't think he is. I don't think that's what he's talking about. And I can't wait to have discussions with Greenlanders about the opportunities that we can do in Louisiana. Look, we've got great things happening in Louisiana. We've got great things happening in the United States. I think the President is extremely committed to the Monroe Doctrine. It's something that has eroded. We look at what Venezuela has done in the amount of drugs that have come into the United States and the families that have been affected and wrecked by the narco trade since the 90s. He's the first president to finally do something real about the war on drugs again. I think that solidifying the Western hemisphere is good for the United States and good for the states that are in the United States, like Louisiana and Greenland is in the Western Hemisphere.

Joe Kernan (29:01)

No, and I understand all that. And I understand that I made the point earlier that international law is a term that's being thrown around. As far as Venezuela is concerned, I'm not sure that applies. But in terms of Greenland, it is. Denmark's a NATO country. This is a territory of Denmark, at least on paper at this point. So it would seem to be something where you'd actually have to look at how the courts would view it, how international law would view it, international perception. I mean, this has Europe, a lot of people in Europe talking about it almost being like Vladimir Putin in Ukraine.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (29:39)

Well, I disagree. When has the United States engaged in imperialism?

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (29:45)

Never.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (29:45)

Europe has engaged in imperialism. The real. The reason that the Danish have Greenland is because of imperialism. I think that what the President is saying is that if Greenland wanted to come to the United States, if they wanted, if they want.

Joe Kernan (29:59)

I don't think the polls, I don't.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (30:00)

Know whether the polls are correct. People of Greenland, at least thus far, do not want to do this.

Joe Kernan (30:06)

But I don't think they want to be with Denmark either. I think they want.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (30:08)

Exactly. And I think that the President supports an independent Greenland with economic ties and trade opportunities for the United States is what I've said all along. And I think that that's what the. Look, our President is a business president. He's a businessman. He wants the American economy to hum. He wants great trading partners. And I think that when he looks at Greenland, he says, look, we've got a defense, a national security interest in Greenland. We have a defense treaty that's been in Place since 1941. We've got soldiers in Greenland. We can do more. We can offer Greenland more than Europe is. And so, like, what's wrong with that?

Andrew Ross Sorkin (30:46)

Well, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with it. The question, I think, is, you know, over the last 30 years, the United States has actually pulled back military bases, pulled back developing things in Greenland when. When the opportunity is sitting there to do that. And, by the way, still exists to do that without necessarily taking it over.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (31:03)

Well, for the last 30 years, we've allowed the Monroe Doctrine to erode. And look what has happened in Latin America. Again, I think that what you see is a new. In this president is a new doctrine or a renewed sense of the Monroe Doctrine that I think is good for the American economy and those inside the Western Hemisphere. And so, again, I think that this is an opportunity for Greenlanders and say, the governor of Louisiana do business with Louisiana, with other states as well. I was talking to the governor of.

Becky Quick (31:32)

Alaska talking about doing business. So this is just us going there and doing deals with them, or is this us taking it over because President Trump has spoken pretty differently?

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (31:40)

Well, I think. I think that the President is one of those people that says everything is on the table. Right.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (31:44)

And again, are you saying everything should be on the table?

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (31:47)

I think we should go to Greenland and say, hey, what kind of opportunities would you like? What. What are we doing? What can we offer you that Europe is not Governor, but the Right.

Joe Kernan (31:58)

But the big difference is the there. And I'm back to the Godfather again, there's a. There's a. There's a way of saying, inducing someone with a carrot to do what you want. And there's another way which says, I made him an offer he couldn't refuse and where someone held a gun to their head and said, you're going to sign this contract and let Johnny Fontaine out or your blood's going to be on this contract. Are we talking about an actual use of force with troops to seize?

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (32:25)

If you try to compare Venezuela to green.

Joe Kernan (32:28)

No, I'm not.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (32:28)

Think that's an unfair. I really do. Because again, again, again, I think you go back to the Monroe Doctrine. You go back to what has made the United States successful and its allies and its.

Joe Kernan (32:43)

You think we could seize Greenland by force? Would that be okay?

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (32:47)

No, I don't. I don't think. I don't think.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (32:49)

And you don't think that's what the president.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (32:51)

I think that we can open a more robust trading opportunity. We can offer Greenlanders a path for their independence and a neighboring country where they can join the strongest, most advanced economy in the world. It's not happening. You write. Here's an interesting thing. I love your comment because let's think about this. A year ago, nobody was talking about Greenland. Nobody, not even Europe, not even the people who claim to care about Greenland were talking about Greenland. And here comes President Trump. He mentions it when, when, when I got appointed as a special envoy. I can tell you in Louisiana, everyone I talk to you is like, when can I go? What's going on over there? I'd love to go to Greenland. I think that that's good for the Greenlanders as well.

Joe Kernan (33:37)

I mean, maybe money, money always is the way to do. I mean, Louisiana purchased. We didn't own Alaska. We had. We didn't own Manhattan. Well, look, we got it for a song.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (33:48)

Look, we were neighbors to Greenland. Right. The cages were right next door.

Joe Kernan (33:53)

How would you do it with money? How would you do it economically? You'd have to get it. You'd have to have the people of Greenland say, this is what we want.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (34:01)

Absolutely.

Becky Quick (34:02)

And would you pay attention to what NATO members are saying on Tuesday? The leaders of France, Germany, Italy, Poland, Spain, the UK and Denmark all say that Arctic security remains a key priority for Europe and that this has to be done in conjunction with NATO allies.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (34:16)

Are they right?

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (34:17)

Security should be a major concern for the United States.

Becky Quick (34:21)

Should we do it in conjunction with NATO or spider.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (34:23)

I should ask the Greenlanders. How about that? Why do we. Why do you think we have an issue? We'll ask the Greenlanders, but we will not again. I think this is a great opportunity for Louisiana. I think it's a great opportunity for the United States. I think that what the President is cementing in the Western Hemisphere is good, good for our country.

Joe Kernan (34:43)

It's historically been a good thing not to listen too much to Europe. But I see your point. I see your point, but I'd like to just dismiss it out of hand. But I know you can't. You can't. You can't dismiss it out of him.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (34:56)

But I'd like to.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (34:57)

Yeah, I think. I think, again, I think it's a great opportunity. Look, I'm excited to see some of the things that the President is doing around inside of the Western Hemisphere altogether. I mean, people should be jeering that what's going on in Venezuela is something that's much needed as an attorney General, I have been with the families of.

Joe Kernan (35:17)

Of.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (35:17)

Of.

Joe Kernan (35:17)

And you've invited the National Guard. And it's helped it. I mean, we've obviously helped in other.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (35:22)

Support a war on drugs needs to be seriously addressed. It's been going on for 30 some years. We spent ungodly amounts of money. There's. We were losing 100,000Americans a year to the opioid crisis. 100,000 a year. I mean, think about that's 800,000 since 2015, dead Americans because of the narco trafficking that primarily has been coming out of the southern Latin American countries. And this president says, okay, I got enough about it.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (35:52)

And then let me ask you one other question.

Daniel Osorio (Andean Capital Advisor) (35:54)

Sure.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (35:55)

I don't know if you saw the State Department put out a. I don't know. It was a tweet on X. It says, this is our hemisphere. And, you know, there's some people in America who might say, that's great. We want to own the world and we want to own the hemisphere. And then there's others who said, well, this is not your hemisphere. What do you make of that? That sort of public. Again, the public rhetoric, because you're saying something that's actually very nuanced, Governor, about how to approach Greenland, for example. Right. About trying to attract them in, giving them opportunities, hoping that they actually come to us. Some of the language that the president using, some of this kind of language that, you know, this is our hemisphere, is the opposite. It comes from a different side of saying, we basically own you, given our scale, size and power.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (36:42)

I mean, the Monroe Doctrine has been around for how long? Okay, so like to all of a sudden say that it doesn't exist anymore, or to reinforce it and say, well, it's an outdated doctrine, the United States shouldn't care. We shouldn't worry about national security issues, especially in our hemisphere, I think is irresponsible. I think that presidents who have. Who have allowed the Monroe Doctrine to erode were acting irresponsibly. And so we're in a position now where we have to reinforce it. And again, I think that having a discussion with Greenland, I think. And I'm hoping we're going to bring some culinary diplomacy and will be good for Louisiana and the United States.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (37:23)

I like the culinary diplomacy. See a commander's palace.

Joe Kernan (37:26)

Yes. What's going on with Louisiana? You guys got some important people coming from that state. Don't you run in the country? We do.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (37:35)

We do. We do. We got some great things happening in Louisiana.

Joe Kernan (37:37)

I mean, speaker, you got the speaker you got.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (37:40)

We've got about $80 billion worth of private investment that has come into the state of Louisiana in the last 24 months. And that's historic. We've diversified it. Meta's building the largest AI data center in the world right in north Louisiana.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (37:54)

Look at this.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (37:58)

This is a twins king cake.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (38:00)

Oh, my goodness.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (38:01)

Just for you for your birthday.

Joe Kernan (38:02)

Is there a. Is there something in there?

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (38:05)

Yeah, there's a.

Joe Kernan (38:05)

No.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (38:06)

Twin baby you got.

Joe Kernan (38:07)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (38:09)

Let me know who gets it because they got to buy the next one.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (38:11)

Good luck.

Becky Quick (38:11)

Right?

Andrew Ross Sorkin (38:12)

Yeah, absolutely.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (38:14)

Look at that.

Joe Kernan (38:14)

The dingo ate your baby. That's from Seinfeld. Governor Landry, thank you. Appreciate it very much. Thank you.

Louisiana Governor Jeff Landry (38:23)

Yeah, we do appreciate it. Happy birthday.

Host/Producer (Katie Kramer) (38:28)

That is Squawk Pod for today. Thanks for listening and happy, happy birthday to our Joe Kernan. Tune in to Squawk Box weekday mornings on CNBC at 6 Eastern. Or get the best of our team TV show right into your ears when you follow Squawk Pod wherever you like to get your podcasts, we'll meet you right back here tomorrow.

Andrew Ross Sorkin (38:49)

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Andrew Ross Sorkin (39:08)

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Joe Kernan (39:17)

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Andrew Ross Sorkin (39:19)

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