Standard of Truth Podcast – Episode S5E15: "Guess Who's Coming to Dinner? It's Elijah"

Release Date: April 10, 2025

Host: Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat, Associate Professor of Church History and Doctrine at BYU

In Episode 15 of Season 5 of the Standard of Truth podcast, hosts Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat and Dr. Richard Leduc engage in a lively and insightful discussion centered around church history, personal anecdotes, and listener-submitted questions. This episode delves into the integration of Jewish traditions with Christian beliefs, the historical context of the Book of Mormon, and addresses common misconceptions and challenges regarding prophetic visions within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.

1. Introduction and Passover Traditions

[00:01 – 02:44]

Dr. Dirkmaat opens the episode with a warm welcome, introducing the podcast's mission to deepen understanding of Latter-Day Saints history and bolster faith through historical analysis. Joined by his colleague, Dr. Richard Leduc, the hosts segue into a personal discussion about blending Jewish Passover traditions with Christian Easter observances.

• Dr. Leduc shares his family's initiative to adopt the "Resurrection Seder," merging the Passover Seder with Easter's focus on the Resurrection and the Atonement. This innovative approach symbolizes the intertwined nature of Jewish and Christian faiths.

• Notable Quote:
  Dr. Richard Leduc (00:49): "We’re doing the Resurrection Seder instead of the Passover Seder."

The conversation humorously touches upon cultural mishaps, such as Dr. Leduc's attempt at a Passover-related joke in a Sephardic synagogue's gift shop, highlighting the challenges of integrating traditions across different faith communities.

2. Listener Email: Elder Carter's Missionary Experience

[02:55 – 05:19]

The hosts read and discuss an email from Elder Carter, an Australian missionary stationed in Norway, who humorously describes the struggles of missionary work in a region characterized by long, dark winters and a cultural affinity for defense mechanisms against existential dread.

• Dr. Dirkmaat playfully critiques Elder Carter's reference to Vegemite, an Australian spread, emphasizing the cultural disconnect and the humorous attempt to relate it to missionary challenges.

• Notable Quote:
  Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat (04:19): "It's terrible. It's the worst thing that ever has happened."

3. Listener Email: Rebecca on Naming Traditions

[06:49 – 15:32]

Rebecca sends an email exploring the historical practice of naming daughters after their mothers, questioning its prevalence compared to modern naming conventions. The discussion reveals:

• Historical Context: Dr. Dirkmaat explains that in the 19th century, larger family sizes made the repetition of names more common, citing examples like Joseph Smith Sr. and Lucy Mack Smith.

• Cultural Shifts: The hosts note that with smaller contemporary families, the practice has waned, though it still occurs occasionally.

• Notable Quote:
  Dr. Richard Leduc (14:21): "There are examples like Joseph Smith Sr. and Lucy Mack Smith, who named their daughters Lucy."

This segment underscores the evolution of cultural practices within the Church and provides listeners with a nuanced understanding of historical naming trends.

4. Listener Email: Joseph's Inquiry on the Book of Mormon Title

[20:51 – 23:05]

A listener named Joseph poses a question regarding the original name Joseph Smith may have used for the Book of Mormon before translating its title page. The hosts navigate this scholarly inquiry by examining:

• Scriptural Evidence: Dr. Dirkmaat references Doctrine and Covenants Sections 3 and 10, which mention the "record of Nephi" and "the Book of Mormon," respectively, highlighting the ambiguity surrounding the initial title.

• Historical Variables: The discussion acknowledges gaps in historical records, such as the lost 116 pages, which contribute to uncertainties about the book's original designation.

• Notable Quote:
  Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat (22:35): "It's part of how historians write things that no one ever wants to read, because what you want to hear is, nope, no one said it before this."

This analytical exchange provides listeners with a deeper appreciation for the complexities involved in historical documentation and the formation of sacred texts.

5. Listener Email: Gabe Challenges Elijah's Visitation

[29:20 – 39:40]

Gabe's email questions the documentation of Elijah's visitation within the Church, asserting a lack of evidence until the 1850s and suggesting it was later added to the Doctrine and Covenants. The hosts engage in a robust rebuttal:

• Historical Accuracy: Dr. Dirkmaat refutes Gabe's claims by pointing to Joseph Smith's journal entries, specifically noting that the account of Elijah's appearance was documented before the 1850s by Warren Cowdery, a prominent early Church member who later apostatized.

• Canonical Evidence: They explain that while the Doctrine and Covenants was canonicalized in 1876, the original accounts existed earlier, debunking the notion that Elijah's visitation was a later fabrication.

• Critique of Antagonistic Arguments: The hosts dismantle the premise that undocumented events are inherently false, drawing parallels to other religious scriptures where miraculous events were not contemporaneously recorded.

• Notable Quotes:
  Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat (31:54): "This is a perfect example of really bad anti Mormon arguments that sound really good."
  Dr. Richard Leduc (35:57): "So starting off the name conversation with your wife as, you know, the name, I absolutely refuse. Rebecca. I hate that one."

This segment serves as a comprehensive defense of the Church's historical narratives, emphasizing the importance of primary sources and scholarly interpretation.

6. Listener Email: Dennis on Protestant Claims of an Enduring True Church

[45:22 – 58:40]

Dennis, a recent convert to the podcast, questions Protestant assertions that a core of true believers has always constituted the true Church of Christ. The discussion explores:

• Protestant Doctrinal Claims: Dr. Dirkmaat and Dr. Leduc analyze the Protestant argument that faith alone is sufficient for salvation, without the need for organized authority or specific ordinances, contrasting it with LDS teachings.

• Historical Critique: The hosts argue that Protestant claims often lack concrete historical evidence, especially regarding isolated true believers who maintained pure doctrine amidst widespread ecclesiastical corruption.

• Theological Differences: Emphasis is placed on how LDS theology emphasizes both faith and works, along with ordained authority, as essential for salvation and true church membership.

• Notable Quote:
  Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat (53:54): "We believe in the wrong Jesus, that's the thing."

This conversation highlights foundational theological distinctions between LDS beliefs and mainstream Protestantism, encouraging listeners to critically evaluate doctrinal claims.

7. Conclusion and Final Remarks

[59:00 – End]

As the episode winds down, Dr. Dirkmaat reflects on the passionate exchanges, particularly regarding Elijah's visitation, and stresses the importance of historical evidence in affirming faith. The hosts reiterate their commitment to addressing listener questions with both scholarly rigor and personable dialogue.

• Final Thoughts: They encourage listeners to seek out accurate historical records and to approach theological disputes with both reason and faith.

• Notable Quote:
  Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat (60:15): "Thank you so much for listening, Rebecca. We really, really, really hope things went well with the birth."

The episode concludes on a lighthearted note, maintaining the balance between academic discussion and relatable, everyday conversation.

Key Takeaways:

• Integration of Traditions: The episode underscores the value of blending cultural and religious practices to enrich personal faith experiences.

• Historical Documentation: Emphasizing the significance of primary sources, the hosts defend the authenticity of church teachings against historical skepticism.

• Theological Clarity: Clear delineation between LDS doctrines and those of other Christian denominations fosters a deeper understanding of unique beliefs.

• Engagement with Listeners: Through addressing emails, the podcast fosters a sense of community and encourages active participation in theological discourse.

Listeners of this episode gain a nuanced perspective on foundational Church history topics, challenged misconceptions, and reinforced the importance of faith grounded in historical truth.