Standard of Truth Podcast - Episode S5E18: The Pope and Mary Magdalene
Release Date: April 24, 2025
Host: Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat
Guest: Dr. Richard Leduc
Description: This episode explores the historical portrayal of Mary Magdalene, particularly examining how Pope Gregory the Great influenced her reputation within Catholic tradition. Dr. Dirkmaat and Dr. Leduc dissect the origins of these characterizations and their implications for understanding church history.
Introduction
Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat welcomes listeners to another insightful episode of the "Standard of Truth" podcast, where he is joined by Dr. Richard Leduc. The hosts set the stage for a deep dive into the portrayal of Mary Magdalene and the role of the papacy in shaping religious narratives.
Mary Magdalene: Historical Perspectives
The Origins of Mary Magdalene's Portrayal
Dr. Dirkmaat initiates the discussion by addressing a listener question about the conflicting portrayals of Mary Magdalene—as a prostitute or as Jesus's wife with children. He emphasizes the lack of scriptural evidence supporting these claims.
Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat [44:29]: "I don't believe either of those things, and I'm not a scriptorian of any kind, but I wonder where those ideas came from."
Pope Gregory the Great's Homilies
The conversation shifts to Pope Gregory the Great's homilies from 591 A.D., which are identified as the primary source for the traditional view of Mary Magdalene as a sinner.
Dr. John Gregory the Great [14:49]: "Whose heart is so stony that this sinful woman's tears wouldn't soften it with her example of repentance."
Dr. Leduc critiques this interpretation, highlighting that early Christian writings do not support Gregory's conflation of Mary Magdalene with other biblical figures.
Dr. Richard Leduc [39:53]: "Mary Magdalene is the same person that Gregory the Great identified her as, based on his homily, which was never explicitly stated in the early Christian writings."
Impact on Catholic Tradition and Popular Culture
The hosts explore how Gregory's portrayal has permeated Catholic tradition and influenced popular culture, referencing the movie Sister Act as an example.
Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat [57:57]: "If you're following along, it's Mark, chapter 16... she is actually the sinner woman that was apparently a woman of the night talked about in Luke."
Dr. Richard Leduc [65:31]: "This idea is perpetuated in Catholic sermons and has seeped into popular media, affecting how Mary Magdalene is perceived in general."
Listener Mailbag: Challenging Traditional Views
Addressing Misconceptions
A listener named Phoebe Draper Palmer Brown poses a question challenging the traditional views of Mary Magdalene. The hosts address the misconceptions, reiterating that there is no scriptural basis for Mary Magdalene being Jesus's wife or a prostitute.
Dr. Richard Leduc [36:54]: "Mary Magdalene was no stranger to sin... it's very offensive to me."
Historical Accuracy vs. Tradition
Dr. Dirkmaat emphasizes the importance of distinguishing between historical facts and evolved traditions, urging listeners to critically assess long-held beliefs.
Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat [81:44]: "Mary Magdalene's true biblical portrayal is as a devoted follower of Jesus, not a figure tainted by later traditional mischaracterizations."
The Role of the Papacy in Shaping Doctrine
Evolution of Papal Authority
The discussion broadens to examine the historical evolution of the papacy and its influence on Christian doctrine, including the perpetuation of certain characterizations of biblical figures.
Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat [47:57]: "The selection and authority of popes have shaped many traditions, some of which lack historical backing..."
Papal Succession and Influence
Dr. Leduc provides an overview of how papal succession has been established and its implications for maintaining doctrinal consistency or introducing new interpretations.
Dr. Richard Leduc [65:31]: "The role and authority of popes have influenced Christian doctrine and traditions, including those about Mary Magdalene."
Insights and Conclusions
Critical Examination of Traditions
The hosts conclude by stressing the necessity of scrutinizing historical sources and traditions to foster a more accurate understanding of church history and biblical figures.
Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat [82:00]: "Understanding the true historical context is essential for strengthening faith and knowledge."
Encouraging Informed Faith
Dr. Leduc echoes the sentiment, encouraging listeners to seek evidence-based understandings and remain faithful while being informed.
Dr. Richard Leduc [82:27]: "It's important to question long-held beliefs and seek evidence-based understandings of biblical figures."
Notable Quotes
- Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat [14:49]: "Mary had seven demons... seven indicating totality of vices."
- Dr. Richard Leduc [39:53]: "Mary Magdalene is the same person that Gregory the Great identified her as..."
- Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat [57:57]: "If you go to John, chapter 12... it's a different story of someone different anointing Jesus's feet."
- Dr. Richard Leduc [65:31]: "This idea is perpetuated in Catholic sermons and has seeped into popular media..."
- Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat [81:44]: "Mary Magdalene's true biblical portrayal is as a devoted follower of Jesus..."
Conclusion
In this episode, Dr. Gerrit Dirkmaat and Dr. Richard Leduc provide a critical examination of the historical narratives surrounding Mary Magdalene, highlighting the influence of papal teachings on her portrayal. By dissecting these traditions, the hosts aim to foster a more informed and faith-strengthening understanding among Latter-Day Saints listeners.