Podcast Summary: Standard of Truth
Episode: S5E33 Atheism Part 2
Release Date: August 7, 2025

Hosted by Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat and Dr. Richard Leduc, this episode delves deep into the challenges posed by atheistic critiques of faith, particularly focusing on the Problem of Evil. The hosts employ historical analysis, theological insights, and spirited discussions to address and counter atheist arguments, enhancing the understanding and faith of Latter-Day Saints listeners.

1. Doctrine and Covenants Section 87 Prophecy and the Civil War

Dr. Dirkmaat initiates the discussion by referencing Doctrine and Covenants Section 87, highlighting its prophetic insights related to the Civil War. He emphasizes the skepticism surrounding prophecies, especially when critics argue that such events were foretold by "everybody."

• Dr. Dirkmaat (02:42): "Can you name me one major political or religious figure in the United States that believed that there was going to be a major bloody civil war? It couldn't. But of course everyone believed that."

He challenges the notion that the Civil War was a commonly predicted event, pointing out the absence of substantial evidence supporting widespread prophetic awareness prior to the conflict.

2. Historical Context: Nullification Crisis and Secessionist Movements

The conversation transitions to historical events like the Nullification Crisis and the Hartford Convention, illustrating that secessionist sentiments were often rooted in economic disputes rather than moral issues like slavery.

• Dr. Dirkmaat (10:30): "If Joseph Smith had predicted the war would be about taxes and tariffs, critics might dismiss it as contextual rather than prophetic."

This segment underscores the complexity of interpreting historical prophecies and the importance of understanding the underlying causes of historical events.

3. Humorous Interlude: VAT Tax Discussion

In a lighter moment, the hosts engage in a playful banter about Value Added Tax (VAT), particularly focusing on its implications in different countries. This segment serves to break the intensity of the prior discussions, showcasing their camaraderie and ease in handling diverse topics.

• Dr. Leduc (16:42): "We'Re going to get to that. We're going to get the crack research after the bottom of that."

• Dr. Dirkmaat (18:52): "But the real question that this entire argument about atheism and Christianity, and we're gonna have to cover this in the next episode because I'm not gonna be able to cover it all here."

4. Listener Mailbag: Addressing Listener Comments

The hosts respond to listener feedback, particularly regarding Dr. Dirkmaat's frustrations with atheist arguments.

• Dr. Leduc (21:57): "The Phoebe Draper Palmer Brown mailbag starts us off with Lindsay. Dr. Dirk Mott's embarrassment about the dander meter or the dandometer does him credit."

• Dr. Dirkmaat (24:12): "Boy. Is that a compliment or a shot?"

This interaction highlights the personal challenges faced when engaging with opposing viewpoints and sets the stage for deeper theological debates.

5. Main Discussion: The Problem of Evil

The core of the episode revolves around the classic theological dilemma: If God is all-powerful and all-good, why does evil exist? Dr. Dirkmaat and Dr. Leduc dissect various atheist arguments and Christian counterpoints.

a. Atheist Arguments on the Problem of Evil

• Unknown Speaker (25:27): "The problem of evil... natural disasters have ripped through entire species... starvation and misery... seem to be the norm throughout evolutionary history."

• Dr. Dirkmaat (28:00): "They're so excited to grab the fruit off the tree that they're not recognizing that they're standing in quicksand with alligators pulling the fruit."

The speakers critique the reliance on free will as the sole explanation for evil, especially in cases of natural disasters and suffering not directly caused by human actions.

b. Christian Rebuttals and Philosophical Counterarguments

• Dr. Leduc (31:05): "But even the existence of agency at all, that's also the problem that I don't feel like the atheists here are making that strong of an argument that they're."

• Dr. Dirkmaat (34:57): "We know we have at least one listener in Djibouti."

They argue that while free will explains some aspects of evil, it fails to account for gratuitous suffering and natural evil, such as diseases and natural disasters that do not result from human choice.

6. Rebuttals from Philosophers and Theologians

To further enrich the discussion, the hosts present rebuttals from notable Christian thinkers, examining their perspectives on evil.

a. Frank Turek’s Ripple Effect Argument

• Frank Turek (41:05): "Evil is actually an argument for God... Evil only exists as a lack in a good thing. The ripple effect is his main argument..."

Dr. Dirkmaat critiques Turek’s idea, acknowledging its validity in a general sense but pointing out its shortcomings when addressing individual tragedies like the Holocaust.

• Dr. Dirkmaat (45:40): "But the real question is actually not about mortal suffering... the problem is almost no one's going to heaven."

b. John MacArthur’s Calvinist Perspective

• John MacArthur (54:35): "God allows evil to exist to showcase his glory... Everything is for the sake of the Name."

Dr. Dirkmaat expresses respect for MacArthur’s clear and logical approach but disagrees with the notion that all evil ultimately serves God’s glory, especially considering specific historical atrocities.

• Dr. Dirkmaat (56:19): "We know that God is good because that's the definition of God. We know that God is all powerful because that's the definition of God. Therefore everything that happens must be good because that's God's will."

7. Critical Analysis of Rebuttals

The hosts critically analyze the effectiveness of the presented rebuttals in addressing the Problem of Evil.

• Dr. Dirkmaat (58:34): "I disagree on that point as well. That all evil is the absence of good. No, in fact, their own theology should say that it's not that."

They argue that explanations like the ripple effect and glorification of God fall short when confronting real-world instances of immense and seemingly purposeless suffering.

8. Global Implications and Theological Concerns

A significant portion of the discussion focuses on the vast number of non-Christians globally and the theological implications of eternal punishment.

• Dr. Dirkmaat (68:22): "But you won't find a Christian who will say that all people claiming to be Christians are all true Christians. You won't find that."

He questions the fairness of eternal damnation in light of diverse beliefs and the sheer number of individuals outside the Christian faith.

9. Theological Contradictions and Future Discussions

The episode concludes with the hosts identifying unresolved issues and setting the stage for future discussions on divine hiddenness and the eternal nature of the soul.

• Dr. Dirkmaat (71:54): "We believe in a premortal life and we believe in our own eternal nature and we believe in progression. So we'll have to talk about that in our next episode."

Key Takeaways:

• Problem of Evil: The hosts explore both atheistic critiques and Christian rebuttals, emphasizing the complexity of attributing all evil solely to free will or divine purposes.

• Historical Prophecies: They challenge the validity of prophetic claims regarding historical events like the Civil War, urging a nuanced understanding of historical contexts.

• Global Christian Demographics: The conversation raises concerns about the theological implications of widespread non-Christian populations and the fairness of eternal punishment doctrines.

• Future Topics: Upcoming episodes are set to delve deeper into concepts like divine hiddenness and the eternal progression of the soul, promising continued exploration of faith-related challenges.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. Dirkmaat (02:42): "Can you name me one major political or religious figure in the United States that believed that there was going to be a major bloody civil war?"

• Frank Turek (41:05): "Evil is actually an argument for God... Evil only exists as a lack in a good thing."

• John MacArthur (54:35): "God allows evil to exist to showcase his glory... Everything is for the sake of the Name."

• Dr. Dirkmaat (56:19): "Therefore everything that happens must be good because that's God's will."

This episode of "Standard of Truth" offers a rigorous examination of atheistic arguments against belief in God, particularly focusing on the Problem of Evil. Through detailed analysis and engagement with prominent Christian thinkers, Dr. Dirkmaat and Dr. Leduc provide listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the theological defenses against common atheistic critiques, reinforcing their faith foundations.