A (51:53)
At any rate, you know, that's where that comes from. Of course, I think there are more plates. You know where they are. I think it's very clear just by Mormon's explanation of what he's doing is that there are lots of records. There's apparently enough records that after he's written half of his book, he searches the records and finds the. The small plates of Nephi. Like they're undoubtedly many wreckers. Where they are, I don't know. I know you'll find all kinds of people that are more than willing to tell you exactly where they are, but I think we have to deal with things in terms of what do prophets think we need to know about them? Clearly, those prophets and apostles thought we needed to know that that vision or that experience took place and that there certainly were more records. Whether you could get an excavator and dig to the center of the hill Cumorah and find it, I find that almost impossible to believe, because I believe God protects those records, and only those that God wants to have them will have them. And maybe as David Whitmer said, it's not even in the hill Cumorah, but it's in a nearby hill and they were on their way to the hill Cumorah, and that's when it happened. I don't know. I know that there's other records, they'll eventually come forth, but I do think it's always good to pause and stop and say when people struggle with their testimonies, when this world starts to get to them, it is never because we just don't have the sealed portion or because we just don't have the lost 116 pages or if only we had more of those writings that, you know, the hundredth part that Mormon couldn't include, the 99th part of the hundredth that he couldn't include, it's that people aren't embracing the Book of Mormon that we have. God has promised that he will give greater light and knowledge to us, and I think that is true. But he's not going to give greater light and knowledge when we aren't even using the sources we already have. I am stunned when I meet with people who have lots of questions about church history and they have not read one word, not one word of the Saints volumes, not one word. And what's driving their concern is church history questions. Well, the church spent ridiculous amounts of money and man hours putting together an accessible, easy to read history. And, and that wasn't enough for someone to get engaged. I, I, it kind of makes me think about, you know, Brigham Young talking about, you know, the whole time, especially during the American Civil War, lots of people like Brigham are about, is it, is it time? Is it, is it go time on Idol? Are we, are we on our way back to, to Jackson County? And Brigham Young kept having to reiterate over and over and over again, you aren't ready for the second coming. You aren't ready to go to Zion. You're still lying to each other, people are still fornicating, you're still drinking whiskey in order to plow your field. You guys want more and you haven't even done what you could do with what you have. And I think there is a danger that's associated with this. People think that if they had a greater experience, a powerful experience, that that would change them and they would believe. It's almost like asking to see the plates. If I saw the plates, then I would believe I have something that came to my mind. I know Richard's mad because we're supposed to be done a long time ago. I'm sorry, Richard. You're just gonna have to be angry. But when Wilford Woodruff joined the church, his parents did not. Okay, now you might be thinking, no, wait. I'm pretty sure his parents were members of the church. They were members of the church eventually. And I don't mean eventually like, you know, because we got him in a St. George baptistry, you know, proxy wise. I mean, they eventually joined the church, but in 1834, his parents are writing to him. And to say that they are skeptical of Mormonism is an understatement. They think their son has been deceived. They think Joseph is a false prophet. And they think that Wilford is being led astray. And so Wilford writes them a letter. And I can't read the whole letter because, like his journals, it is lengthy. But I want to read a portion of it because it talks about this very thing, about seeing the plates as part of it. He says, let's see here. I feel to rejoice to behold the candor which you manifest in your letter to me informing your opinion respecting the work in which I've engaged. Dear parents, I do not wonder, neither should I think it strange, if you did believe me to have embraced grossness of late. Even walking in paths would lead me to ruin and destruction. When I consider the report which is abroad in the land respecting the church of Christ, where of the Latter Day Saints, which is called by the world Mormons. When John came neither eating nor drinking, they said he had a devil. The son of man came eating and drinking, they said, behold, a gluttonous wine bibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. And there is in the last days of all manner of evil spoken against the servants of God falsely. So look, he's using the example from the New Testament. Look. For people who are critical, they can't actually be satisfied. John didn't eat or drink. Oh, he must be possessed. Jesus came eating and drinking. Well, look at him. He's a wine bibber. Allow me to ask you one question. Who is a proper judge of the work in which I've engaged in and of the character of Joseph Smith and of the revelations which have come through him, and of the members of the church and of the laws of the church are the same. And those who are an eyewitness and personally acquainted with those things? Is it those who are an eyewitness and personally acquainted with those things or those who are not? I believe that I have had the privilege of becoming sufficiently acquainted with the work in which I'VE engaged and also with the character of Joseph Smith and of the revelations which have come through him in order to know whether these things are from the Lord and the kingdom of light or from the devil and the kingdom of darkness. I have traveled nearly 1,000 miles in company with Joseph Smith and I believe him to be a man of truth, a man of God, yea, a prophet which the Lord has raised up in these last days. And I believe that he holds the keys of the kingdom as Peter in the days of the apostles. I have heard his teachings, and if I'm acquainted with truth and the Spirit of God, and his teachings have been the pure gospel of Christ that have attended with that Spirit of God. And I have frequently seen him when I think he have been clothed upon with a great degree of the Spirit of God. As it respects the former life of Joseph Smith, I am altogether unacquainted with it as it respects the certain persons you spoke of. I'm ignorant of that circumstance and the paper that you allude to because his parents were saying, well, we read that Joseph Smith was a drunkard. His parents are attacking Joseph and I expect it was a publication of the world. I have not the least idea that Joseph Smith ever promised to show those plates to any person. Now, one of the claims that was made in Mormonism unveiled was that Joseph promised to show the plates to Nathaniel Lewis and then refused to show the plates to Nathaniel Lewis. So I'm sure that's what his parents are referencing, that he had promised to show the plates to any person to whom they were not shown. You ask why those plays were not plates were not exposed to public view, that they should not be in doubt. Those plates were once common to mankind before they were hit up in the earth, as also was our Savior. Let me ask you, why was not our Savior after his burial again made common to mankind instead of just appearing to a few witnesses? Even as Christ has appeared and been made manifest universally to mankind, it is not at all probable that they would have believed on him any more for this. Neither do I believe that the opposers of this work would believe any more for their having the privilege of seeing those plates. But they were shown to witnesses sufficient to bear testimony as those witnesses for Christ to whom he appeared. And then he goes on to apologize that he spoke so harshly to his Father. But his point being, look, God has withheld these things for a wise purpose in order for people to exercise faith. And anyone who says, well, if only I found some physical evidence, than I would believe is someone who would never actually believe. And it's a great question. I mean, Wilford's a much better arguer than I am. Why didn't Jesus appear to the entire world all at once as a resurrected being? Obviously that would convince more people, because that's not the purpose of this life. So thank you so much for joining us. Read your Book of Mormon, follow the prophets. Maybe we'll someday get the sealed portion. Thanks so much for joining us. Thank you for listening to the Standard of Truth podcast, hosted by historian Dr. Gary Dirkmot and Dr. Richard Leduc. If you know of anybody that could benefit from the material in this episode, please share it with them. Until next time.
