Cosmic Queries - Flat Universe

Summary

StarTalk Radio: Cosmic Queries - Flat Universe Host: Neil deGrasse Tyson | Co-Host: Chuck Nice | Release Date: August 12, 2025

In the August 12, 2025 episode of StarTalk Radio, astrophysicist Neil deGrasse Tyson teams up with his co-host Chuck Nice to delve into a series of intriguing listener-submitted questions under the segment "Cosmic Queries". This episode, aptly titled "Flat Universe", explores a wide array of scientific topics ranging from quantum physics to the shape of the cosmos, all while blending humor and pop culture references.

---

1. Quantum Particles: Gluons vs. Gravitons

Listener: Jordan Senarth from Boston | Timestamp: [03:08] - [05:32]

The episode kicks off with Jordan Senarth's question about the nature of gluons and gravitons compared to photons. "A photon, because it has no mass, must then be pure movement, momentum, or energy," Jordan posits, prompting a detailed discussion from Neil.

Neil explains that gravitons are hypothetical particles associated with gravitational waves, and although not yet detected, they are essential in the quantum gravity framework. "The gluon is the mediating force of baryons and quarks within the nucleus of the atom," Neil clarifies, emphasizing that gluons hold protons and neutrons together despite their repulsive electromagnetic forces. Both gravitons and gluons, unlike photons, embody particles with mass-energy equivalence, as described by Einstein’s famous equation E = mc².

---

2. Gravity of Small Masses: CO₂ Molecules Orbiting a Person

Listener: Chuck Betlatch from Texas | Timestamp: [05:53] - [07:48]

Chuck Betlatch raises an intriguing question regarding localized gravity: "Can a small mass, such as a CO₂ molecule orbit a larger mass, such as a person?" Neil responds affirmatively, noting that while individual particles possess gravitational pull, the thermal motion of gases typically prevents such orbiting in practice. "You just give it the right speed at the right distance in the right direction, and there you have it," Neil elaborates, highlighting the delicate balance required for molecular orbiting.

---

3. Alien Communication and Time Systems

Listener: Larry Infante from San Antonio, Texas | Timestamp: [07:53] - [11:20]

Larry Infante critiques the portrayal of alien communications in science fiction, questioning the logic behind hostile aliens giving humanity a constrained time ultimatum based on Earth's 24-hour cycle. "If they said we'll be back in 47 gloops, that's not helpful," Neil notes, emphasizing that intelligent extraterrestrial beings would likely adopt a time system familiar to humans to facilitate communication. The discussion touches on human circadian rhythms and the inherent 24-hour cycle, reinforced by Neil’s reflection on experiments with human subjects living without natural light cues.

---

4. Pineapple on Pizza: A Humorous Interlude

Listener: Alex Row from Northeast England | Timestamp: [16:18] - [17:56]

Injecting a dose of levity, Alex Row poses the classic culinary debate: "Do you agree with pineapple on pizza?" Neil staunchly opposes the idea, "Pineapple belongs in a piña colada and not on a pizza," creating a playful exchange that underscores the show's signature blend of science and humor.

---

5. The Shape of the Universe: Flat vs. Spherical

Listener: Hugh Kaley from Richmond, California | Timestamp: [17:57] - [19:44]

Hugh Kaley seeks clarity on cosmological models: "If the universe is flat, does moving in a straight line bring you back to your starting point?" Neil confidently answers "No, you don't come back; it's forever," explaining that a flat universe lacks the curvature needed for such looping trajectories. He contrasts this with a positively curved, spherical universe where continuous straight-line movement would theoretically loop around back to the origin, similar to walking around the Earth. "It's got to have no edge," Neil summarizes, invoking Carl Sagan's metaphor of Earth's surface as "the shoreline of the cosmic ocean."

---

6. Time Dilation and Interstellar Travel

Listener: Joe Boone from New Zealand | Timestamp: [20:01] - [23:16]

Joe Boone's question intertwines relativity with science fiction: "In reality, wouldn't there be no travel time at light speed, making cryopods unnecessary for interstellar voyages?" Neil affirms Joe's understanding, "You get there as soon as you left," and chuckles at the notion of cryopods being a mere storytelling device. The discussion delves into the limitations imposed by physics, emphasizing that traveling at the speed of light remains theoretically impossible for objects with mass, thus reinforcing the necessity of cryopods within narrative contexts.

---

7. Neutron Star Material: Extreme Density and Its Implications

Listener: Lorraine Berdu from Montreal | Timestamp: [23:28] - [24:46]

Lorraine Berdu's imaginative query explores the properties of neutron star material: "Would Mount Everest come rushing out of a spoon if we brought neutron star material to Earth?" Neil debunks the scenario humorously, explaining that the immense density of neutron star matter "flattens everything," rendering the idea of mountainous structures rebounding on Earth implausible. "Neutron star flattens everything," he reinforces, illustrating the uncompromising nature of such extreme matter.

---

8. Energy in Water Dissociation: A Propeller's Motion

Listener: Emory from Florida | Timestamp: [24:54] - [28:34]

Emory presents a thought experiment comparing traditional water electrolysis with a novel method involving propeller-induced cavitation for hydrogen and oxygen collection. Neil emphasizes the fundamental physics: "Hydrogen and oxygen are very tightly bound," and dissociating water requires significant energy input. The discussion acknowledges the innovative idea but reiterates the energy-intensive nature of breaking molecular bonds, highlighting that any alternative method must account for energy conservation laws.

---

9. The Asteroid Belt and Planet Formation

Listener: Scott W. Peterson from Denver | Timestamp: [43:14] - [45:27]

Scott W. Peterson inquires about the potential for the asteroid belt to coalesce into a new planet. Neil addresses the historical context, referencing early planet discoveries like Ceres, Pallas, Vesta, and Juno, which were later reclassified as asteroids. "If you take all those fragments and glue them together into one object, you get something about 5% the size of the moon," Neil explains, assessing that the remaining mass is insufficient to qualify as a planet, thereby categorizing the asteroid belt as cosmic debris rather than planetary formation.

---

10. Many Worlds Theory and Universe Splitting

Listener: Tom Isaac | Timestamp: [29:38] - [31:33]

Tom Isaac delves into quantum mechanics with his question on the Many Worlds Interpretation: "Where does all the energy and matter come from to create new universes when the universe splits?" Neil acknowledges the complexity, stating, "The Many Worlds hypothesis is an attempt to make rational sense of something that's otherwise completely irrational." He candidly admits the speculative nature of the theory, noting that the practical origins of energy and matter in this context remain unresolved within the scientific community.

---

11. Universe Expansion: Observable vs. Total Universe

Listener: Mile Milkovsky from Macedonia | Timestamp: [31:38] - [33:24]

Mile Milkovsky seeks clarification on Neil's book statement regarding the universe's expansion: "Are we referring to the observable universe expanding or the total universe?" Neil concedes a degree of semantic looseness but confirms both interpretations are valid. "The expansion of the universe is the entire universe," he affirms, while acknowledging that discussions often focus on the observable portion due to the limitations of our telescopic vision.

---

12. Advice for Physics Majors Amidst Defunding

Listener: Jaden Peters from Utah | Timestamp: [47:03] - [51:08]

Jaden Peters voices concerns over the defunding of scientific programs and its impact on astrophysics majors. Neil offers both optimistic and pragmatic advice: "Science is going to be here no matter what," while stressing the foundational role of physics in understanding the broader scientific landscape. "Physics is foundational to... biology... chemistry," he asserts, encouraging perseverance and highlighting the timeless relevance of a physics education regardless of current political climates.

---

13. Galactic Rotation and Black Holes

Listener: Trisha Lynch from Beaverton, Oregon | Timestamp: [35:30] - [38:38]

Trisha Lynch poses a dramatic scenario: "What would happen if the Milky Way galaxy stopped rotating suddenly or gradually?" Neil responds with stark imagery, "Everything in the galaxy would fall into the black hole," explaining that the galaxy's rotation provides the necessary centrifugal force to counteract the gravitational pull of the central supermassive black hole. Ceasing rotation would result in unimpeded gravitational collapse, leading to a catastrophic convergence of galactic matter.

---

14. The Casimir Effect: Quantum Vacuum Phenomena

Listener: Monopoly World | Timestamp: [38:38] - [42:55]

Monopoly World seeks an explanation of the Casimir Effect. Neil provides a comprehensive overview: "You have two parallel plates of conducting material in a vacuum. Bringing them closer together creates an attractive force known as the Casimir force," he describes. This quantum mechanical phenomenon arises due to the restricted wavelengths of virtual particles between the plates, leading to a pressure differential that pulls the plates together. "It's a purely quantum mechanical phenomenon," Neil emphasizes, underscoring its lack of a classical analog and its significance in advancing our understanding of quantum field theory.

---

Closing Remarks

The episode wraps up with Neil and Chuck reflecting on the dynamic interplay between scientific inquiry and imaginative speculation. Their engaging dialogue not only elucidates complex scientific principles but also fosters a sense of wonder and curiosity about the universe.

Notable Quotes:

• Neil deGrasse Tyson at [03:08]: "The gluon is the mediating force of baryons and quarks within the nucleus of the atom."
• Chuck Nice at [14:23]: "Are there any signs we could theoretically look for to confirm that as our origin story?"
• Neil deGrasse Tyson at [24:46]: "Neutron star flattens everything, so we think neutron stars might be the best spheres in the universe because whatever's there just got flattened."
• Chuck Nice at [47:44]: "Einstein was gangsta. Time was defined to make motion look simple."

StarTalk Radio continues to inspire listeners by bridging the gap between complex scientific concepts and everyday curiosities, all while maintaining an entertaining and accessible format.

---

Stay curious, and as always, keep looking up!

Transcript

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[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

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[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Chuck, that might be a world record how many questions I answered.

[Chuck Nice]

Yes.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

In the time allotted.

[Chuck Nice]

Exactly. And you only got two of them.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Right. All right, coming up, StarTalk Cosmic Queries. Welcome to StarTalk, your place in the universe where science and pop culture collide. StarTalk begins right now. This is StarTalk. Neil DeGrasse Tyson, your personal astrophysicist. This is gonna be a cosmic queries grab bag. And whenever you hear that, you know who's sitting next to me. Chuck. Nice.

[Chuck Nice]

Hey, that's right. What's up, Neil? All right. Grab bag, baby.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Grab bag, baby.

[Chuck Nice]

That's right. Used to be. I don't. I. I liked it when we were galactic gumbo.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Okay.

[Chuck Nice]

You know, I don't know why we, you know, cuz, you know, that's.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I never know what the hell you're saying.

[Chuck Nice]

I love it.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Plus gumball kind of left menus. You don't see it in much anymore.

[Chuck Nice]

I see gumbo a lot. I'm going to New Orleans next week and.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Well, give me A full report.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

The first time I had it, it's like, why are there a hundred things in my soup?

[Chuck Nice]

That's gumbo in a nutshell.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

All right, so what you got?

[Chuck Nice]

This is Jordan Senarth. Greetings, Dr. Tyson and unnamed co host, hopefully, Lord. Nice.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

All right.

[Chuck Nice]

All right, Jordan from Boston here. I understand an object's mass to be the sum of its invari. Mass, rest, energy, and its momentum.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes.

[Chuck Nice]

A photon, because it has no mass, must then be pure movement, momentum, or energy. Okay, here's my question. Okay, good. You have one. He says. Thought he was just showing off.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah, that's a little bit of that too, but that's fine. But nothing wrong showing off if you got it. He says if you got it, flaunt it.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah, he says, are the gluon and the graviton then pure something else. Energy.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Well, so the graviton is the particle version of a gravitational wave.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's not been detected. It's presumed to exist if you look at it from a quantum gravity worldview.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Okay. And the gluon is the mediating force of baryons and quarks within the nucleus of the atom. So gluons hold the quarks together. Right. And glue. It's how you can get two protons that close to each. Think about it. They have the same charge.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Like charges.

[Chuck Nice]

What they should be popping off.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Exactly. Like charges repel. And so that is repelling from the electromagnetic force. But if you get them close enough, the strong nuclear force, which is brought to you by the gluon, the strong nuclear force is stronger than their urge to separate, and it keeps them together. So what we're asking here is there. Can we think about the graviton and the gluon in the way we think of as a photon. So you think as a photon is pure energy, whereas the graviton is not.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That would be a particle.

[Chuck Nice]

It'd be a particle.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. And same with the gluon. So we're stuck with the on suffix to the word making you think that they would be the same thing. But regardless, there's a mass equivalent of the graviton and the gluon.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You can always even. It's just energy. You can figure out how much mass equivalent that is using what equation E equals MC squared. Thank you. Other than the gluon and the graviton being particles and the photon being energy, I don't know what other distinctions to make there. What else you got?

[Chuck Nice]

All right. This is Chuck Betlatch or Betlock he says, hello, StarTalk team. I understand that anything with a mass also has gravity. Can a small mass, such as a CO2 molecule orbit a larger mass, such as a person? So he has localized gravity down to, like, objects?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. The answer is yes.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

However, many particles have their own. When they're in a, in a gas, they have their own motion commensurate with the temperature of that gas.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

All right. So for many gases, their motion is so high that they would just escape the system. That's why the moon has no gas to speak of. Okay.

[Chuck Nice]

I mean, except on Taco Tuesday. Sorry, I had to do it. I am so sorry. I know that was terrible.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That was terrible, terrible, terrible, terrible. So. But if you don't just isolate a molecule, then the answer is yes, it could orbit you. You just give it the right speed at the right distance in the right direction, and there you have it.

[Chuck Nice]

Then you have that one molecule, just.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's it. By the way, all the CO2 molecules in the air, they're not quite orbiting the Earth, but they're attached to Earth. So Earth drags them with it as it turns, and then it's not escaping because there's gravity. Gravity is strong enough to hold the atmosphere, so that's not orbiting the Earth, but it's carrying it with us.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You know, if you like your molecules and you want to keep them, that's another way to do it.

[Chuck Nice]

Right. Okay. There you go, Chuck.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Way to go.

[Chuck Nice]

Great name. This is Larry Infante. And Larry says hello, Dr. Tyson and all. One thing that has bugged me about some sci fi movies is their use of Earth's time. For example, they may use minutes, hours and days, saying, we'll be back to claim your planet in 24 hours. These apparently are some very hostile aliens.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

As they all are, as aliens want to be.

[Chuck Nice]

And they have given us an ultimatum for some reason, even though they have traveled across this galaxy and they.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

They could totally kick our ass. That instant.

[Chuck Nice]

That instant. Why do they have to give us 24 hours? I don't know. But clearly they're just like, you have 24 hours to surrender and we'll be back. And he says, if you had to create a system of time with no reference to a planet orbiting a star, how would you do that? Lorenzo Infante from San Antonio, Texas, great question.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So keep in mind, we evolved on a planet that has a 24 hour day, night cycle. Right. Since that is our biorhythms. Who cares if you're on Earth or near the sun, if you want to respect your biorhythms, so go on a journey to another star. Keep the 24 hour day.

[Chuck Nice]

That's what we all have internal cellular clocks that are our circadian rhythm. So whether or not you're around the time or not you're going to. Your body's going to know.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

24 hours, your body's going to know. And we. Because we evolved in that state. Now, from studies that I've seen a few decades ago, I haven't seen them duplicated, but I was intrigued. They took people, put them underground.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Living underground. Judds, you can't see day, night. They took all the clocks away, so they're just living there.

[Chuck Nice]

Wow. And so I think they call that a casino.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

No windows, no clocks, no clocks underground. So again, this is a study from many decades ago. But they found that people naturally fell into a rhythm that was 25 or 26 hours long.

[Chuck Nice]

Makes sense.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Not 24, not 24. And then I thought about that and I said, that's why everybody's groggy when they wake up.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

We need an extra hour, extra two hours. We're forcing ourselves into 24 hours when maybe the body is saying, give me.

[Chuck Nice]

I need a 26 hour day.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So they didn't to touch their snooze.

[Chuck Nice]

Bar, got me working 26, 7.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That doesn't sound.

[Chuck Nice]

It doesn't sound good at all.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

26 7. So I'd be perfectly happy keeping my 62nd minute. 60 minute hour, 24 hour day. I don't care about weeks or months or years because I'm counting days. Because we sleep on day cycles. So that's what matters to me no matter how long my voyage is.

[Chuck Nice]

Well, what about the aliens knowing the fact that we're on a 24 hour clock?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Oh, because if they said we'll be back in 47 gloops, that's not helpful.

[Chuck Nice]

So they would have done a little research.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

They do a little research, use a time unit that we know and care about. And by the way, we don't think about time in tenths of a second or hundredths of a second or billionths of a second. Unless you run track and you're Usain Bolt.

[Chuck Nice]

Right. Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

But generally that's not a thing. Right. So a second is. By the way, your heart beats about once a second.

[Chuck Nice]

That's right, yeah. I mean, if you're really healthy.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah, if you're healthy.

[Chuck Nice]

If you're healthy, you get about 60, 62.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes. 64 per minute. Right. So these feel kind of natural to me. And if the alien wants to communicate with us, it better damn straight use my units, right?

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah, exactly.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And by the way, if they land in America, they better know inches and feet and miles, too.

[Chuck Nice]

Let me tell you something. Wouldn't that be something? They come here and they're just like, we'll be back. And we're going to make sure that in 50 kilometers you're going. And we'd be like, what is this guy talking about, dude? Where are you from?

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[Chuck Nice]

Hey, this is Kevin the sommelier and I support StarTalk on Patreon. You're listening to StarTalk with Neil DeGrasse Tyson. Mike says hello, Neil. Hello, Lord. Nice. Long time listener, new to Patreon.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Welcome. Well, let me say it right. Welcome to the universe. Nice. Say that right.

[Chuck Nice]

He says, my question is about the likelihood of 2001 A Space Odyssey. In particular, the new form of life observed in the dual star system, as well as the fabricated central hub for the wormholes.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

He mentioned 2001. Yes, but I think he's referring to scenes in 2010, which was Arthur C. Clarke's sequel to 2001.

[Chuck Nice]

Gotcha.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

If my memory serves, I saw that long ago on first run when it came out. But that's my memory of it. I'm cool with if you're alien and you're more advanced, I'm cool with all that. What would we look like to our own species from a hundred years ago?

[Chuck Nice]

Exactly.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

What would we look like today? Oh, my gosh. I mean, if we are that amazing in the future compared to our own species and our own planet, imagine aliens. So I'm not gonna second guess their double star system and their wormhole factory. Fine.

[Chuck Nice]

I mean, there are binary star systems.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes. That's not a worry.

[Chuck Nice]

What about planets around binary star systems?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

They're a little unstable because their gravitational allegiance is challenged every time they try to make an orbit. Who am I closest to? Who am I far away from? Who am I?

[Chuck Nice]

Maybe you this time. Maybe you this time.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So you need a really big orbit so that the two stars are seen as one field of gravity.

[Chuck Nice]

Gotcha. Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Because only when you get really close do you.

[Chuck Nice]

Would you have the perturbations.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. If I remember, in 2010. 2010, Europa was where the intelligent aliens lived. One of Jupiter's moons.

[Chuck Nice]

That's a little too. I'm sorry. First gonna put the intelligence on the white planet.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

On. Yeah. So they're asking the plausibility of it. Yeah. I mean, double star system. Sure.

[Chuck Nice]

Yep.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Aliens that have control over that. Give it to him.

[Chuck Nice]

Why not?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Why not? Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

All right. This is Alex Row Million. He says, hey, what's up, lads? Alex from northeast England here. Simple question for you all, just for fun. Do you agree with pineapple on pizza? Inquiring minds would like to know. I love your show and have fun. I'm a big no, but guess what? I've never had it, so I can't say I'm a no.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Generally, if you do it, it's kind of Hawaiian style. And it would be pineapple with a ham thing. Because we know pineapple goes with ham.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay, absolutely.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

But I, as a native New Yorker, you know where this is. This is not gonna end well here.

[Chuck Nice]

What are you doing here with the pineapple on the pizza? What's your problem?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I'm eating over here.

[Chuck Nice]

I'm eating over here. I oughta slap you one.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I'm crossing the street here. I'm eating here.

[Chuck Nice]

Over here.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So for me, pineapple belongs in a pina colada.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And not in a pizza.

[Chuck Nice]

There you go.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Of all the things I would do with the pineapple.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Pizza is not on that list.

[Chuck Nice]

Not on the list. Yeah. Okay. All right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Okay.

[Chuck Nice]

I love it.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's my opinion.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah, you know what, I'm going to have to try it now because I, it just, I'm cringed by the whole thought of it. But I've actually never put slice to mouth to say that sucks.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Well, plus it's also hot fruit at that point.

[Chuck Nice]

I know, that's.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So that's what I'm saying.

[Chuck Nice]

Except for blueberry pie or peach.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's different.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah, yeah, that's a hot fruit thing. But that's okay. All right, here we go. This is Hugh Kaley. Hugh says hello. Dr. Tyson, Lord and Ice, Hugh Kaylee here from Richmond, California. During the most of my life. If you read a layman's book on cosmology, it would confidently state that if you somehow moved in a straight line long enough, you end up where you started. Is this still the case now that the universe is thought to be flat? Thanks.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So what he's remembering was not that statement given confidently. It was that statement given as one of the alternatives of what the shape of the universe would do for you. Okay, so I don't believe that that was stated confidently. We didn't know, but we had the formulas to tell us what the universe would look like depending on if it was saddle shaped, spherical or flat. It turns out the universe is flat.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So no, you don't come back to where you are.

[Chuck Nice]

You don't come back.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You don't come back. It's forever.

[Chuck Nice]

Just keep going.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Oh, by the way, and if it weren't flat and if it was positively curved, then the coming back happens because the universe would recollapse on itself and everything's back in the same place at the same time. So that's how you end up back where you are. It's that future space time trajectory that brings you back. Time would be in a loop in the case with the universe re collapsing.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

All right, but how about just we are here, if we're in a spherical universe, you walk straight, eventually you come right back to where you started. And it's no different from walking on Earth.

[Chuck Nice]

Right. Same difference here.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Same difference.

[Chuck Nice]

That's the way.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And when people say where's the edge of the universe in that scenario? I'd say it has no edge. It's gotta have an edge. It has no edge. Okay, let me. Where's the edge of Earth's surface? It has no edge. Right, because it has. Well, you can think of the edge as going up.

[Chuck Nice]

That's a different story.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

As Carl Sagan said, right. Earth's surface is the shoreline of the cosmic ocean. It's A three dimensional shoreline.

[Chuck Nice]

Here you go. Wait for the tsunami. It's going to be something else. And this is Joe Boone. And Joe says Kia ora. Dr. Tyson. Oh, I am from New Zealand and I have a question related to your explanation of time dilation. Specifically that time does not exist at the speed of light. In science fiction, there are often cryopods for interstellar travel, but often those spacecraft like the Nostromo from Alien travel faster than light. Therefore, shouldn't there be no travel time from the point of view of the crew? The cryopod is only necessary for Ripley in the shuttle at the end of the film because it was just drifting in space. In reality, wouldn't the people of Earth need cryopods if they ever wanted to see a crew again in their lifetime? I'd love to have your take. Apologies if I've misunderstood time dilation that.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

What's the person's name again?

[Chuck Nice]

This is Joe Boone.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Joe, you understand it perfectly and everything you said is 100% accurate.

[Chuck Nice]

Correct.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

If you are traveling the speed of.

[Chuck Nice]

Light, you don't need cryopods because there is no time. Well, there is time, just not from your frame of reference.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You get there as soon as you left.

[Chuck Nice]

As soon as you left.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Right.

[Chuck Nice]

As a matter of fact, you wouldn't know that. You wouldn't know what happened.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You don't need the cryopods. So it's a. Correct.

[Chuck Nice]

Just like a photon is born and dies the moment that it hits whatever it's hitting.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Correct. And ideally, my detector at my telescope.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And not the buttocks of someone black.

[Chuck Nice]

Behind of something nice laying on the beach, like, oh, look at these photons.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's a photon. Go through 30,000 years on the beginning.

[Chuck Nice]

Of the galaxy and then straight for my butt. Like, no, no. With the telescope. Where's Neil? Why doesn't this guy shave anyway?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Shave your butt. What? I don't even want to. No, stop there. Stop.

[Chuck Nice]

I was.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Shut up. Yeah, he's completely correct. I have nothing to add or subtract from that entire account.

[Chuck Nice]

He did a great job.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Great job. Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

By the way, the reason you need a cryopod is because. For storytelling purposes.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

1. Something always goes wrong with somebody's cryopod.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That is how science fiction stories work.

[Chuck Nice]

Right?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You go into space and something goes wrong.

[Chuck Nice]

Something goes wrong. So you need the cryopod as a mechanism for story.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

To kill people.

[Chuck Nice]

Right, Exactly.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

To kill innocent people.

[Chuck Nice]

So anyway, but one other thing.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

There's. As far as we know, you cannot travel the speed of light if you have mass.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So that would put a kibosh on that whole idea. But otherwise. Yeah. Well, in all fairness to that, go ahead. You can go 99.9999 speed of light, and it's essentially not age. But you still wouldn't need the cryopods, right? Actually, yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

So instead of getting there instantly, you get there just like, oh, man, I didn't even get a chance to get an in flight meal.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Correct. That's right.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah. All right. Elaine Berdu says this. Hello, my name is Lorraine Berdu from Montreal. Just a quick question. If a spoonful of neutron star material can weigh as much as Mount Everest easily.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

Would Mount Everest come rushing out of the spoon if we brought it to Earth very quickly? Come on, lady. This ain't Jumanji. It's densely packed.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's not a sea monkey.

[Chuck Nice]

It's not a freaking sea monkey.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's not a Chia Pet.

[Chuck Nice]

Nah, I'm joking.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Let me grow neutron star city. Open out the spoon.

[Chuck Nice]

That's so funny.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So here's the way to think about that. The answer is no, as described. But here's the way to think about it. The energy it would take to scale a mountain on Earth is the same as the energy it would take to step up onto a sheet of paper on a neutron star.

[Chuck Nice]

Wow, that is rough.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's rough. Yeah, that's rough. And so neutron star flattens everything. So we think neutron stars might be the best spheres in the universe because whatever's there just got flattened.

[Chuck Nice]

Got flattened out.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And she wants the thing to pop back up as a mountain when it comes here. But once you're flat, no, you don't go back.

[Chuck Nice]

That's it. Look at that. Once you go flat, you never come back, baby. Memory says this. Dr. Tyson and Lord Nice Emory from Florida here. I remember in high school, we would take 1.5 volt dry cell battery and hook the wires up to two inverted test tubes in boiling water, connecting hydrogen and oxygen using the collection principle, wouldn't it be much more efficient collecting the hydrogen and oxygen off the cavitation of a propeller almost free on ocean cargo ships? Oh.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Two things.

[Chuck Nice]

Go ahead.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

First.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I did not know. Is that true? I'm not denying it. I just never heard that you could. What? The word is dissociate. So hydrogen and oxygen are very tightly bound. So that's why water just go anywhere. It's coming out of the sky in the water, in the ground, water is water. Okay? To break that molecule apart requires a huge investment of Energy.

[Chuck Nice]

A lot of energy.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Do you know the evidence that it requires a lot of energy?

[Chuck Nice]

My stove. No, no.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You bring them back together.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh. And they create a lot of energy. They create a lot of energy.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's all the energy it took you to pull them apart.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's why when we go to the moon and find water, we don't say, oh, that's just rocket fuel. Which it is. But you have to put the energy in it to separate them to get that energy out as rocket fuel.

[Chuck Nice]

Wow.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's not just like oil sitting in the ground for you.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Okay. So I did not know, if that's the case, that it would be at the tip of the fastest moving part of the propeller blade, that there's high enough energy there to break apart the oxygen and hydrogen. If there is, that's kind of cool.

[Chuck Nice]

It is.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And. Yeah. Why not put a collection mechanism there?

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

But you're really after the hydrogen because oxygen is. You get that for free anywhere in the atmosphere. So if it does that, I'm intrigued by that. And you're right. There's propellers going across the ocean all the time.

[Chuck Nice]

All the time.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So I can't comment on whether that's a real thing, but if it is a real thing. Yes, do it for sure. But keep in mind, it requires energy.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

To make that happen.

[Chuck Nice]

That's what I'm saying. Yeah. Yeah.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

But the propeller's already expending that energy that they're expending. Right.

[Chuck Nice]

It's a great thought experiment, but right now, shipping companies are reinvesting in sales to. To help out the propeller, to help reduce the amount of fuel that they use. And there's a company, I believe it's called Cargill or something like that, they're making these giant sails that are controlled by computers. And it cuts, like, the fuel consumption of a tanker, like, by 50%.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So what's it getting its energy from?

[Chuck Nice]

It's a sail.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

No, people don't think about it. But sails get its energy from wind. Wind gets its energy from the unequal heating of Earth's surface.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So air moves to where it's hot or not hot.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And where the pressure is.

[Chuck Nice]

So it's really solar power.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's solar power.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's. That's what I'm getting at here.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay, gotcha.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

Everything's solar power and.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Almost everything.

[Chuck Nice]

Almost. Almost everything. So. And. But. But here's the. Here's the kicker.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

What?

[Chuck Nice]

Can't use that for energy. How are we gonna have a. How Are we gonna have a solar power, like. No, you gotta burn something. Come on. Anyway. Just so. So infuriating.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Drill, baby, drill. All right.

[Chuck Nice]

Drill, baby, drill. Yeah, that's it. Anyway, that's what I told somebody. I said this last week to somebody when I was. Oh, Florida. I was down in Florida, and I said, so that big thing up there, it's 93 million miles away. It takes eight minutes at the speed of light for the light to actually get here. And yet you can lay on that beach and it will burn your ass. But, yeah, you're saying that it's not effective because they were saying, like, solar power doesn't work. It's. It's too expensive and it's not effective.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's called brainwashing.

[Chuck Nice]

You know what? There you go.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's really that simple.

[Chuck Nice]

I really didn't think of it until you just said that. And I'm. Now I'm like, why did you argue with that idiot? Like, why would you argue with that dude? Dude.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

If an argument lasts more than five minutes, then both sides are wrong.

[Chuck Nice]

And so I'm.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Clearly.

[Chuck Nice]

I was right. Because you know what? I said that to him, and he was like, no, it doesn't work when he said that. And I was like, okay. That was the end of the argument.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

I was like, okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

All right, here we go. This is Tom Isaac, and Tom says, hi. I have a question about the many worlds theory of quantum physics. The question is, if every quantum measurement causes the universe to split into multiple universes, where does all the energy and matter come from to create the new universes? It just materializes out of what?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. I can't comment philosophically on this, but I can comment from practical terms.

[Chuck Nice]

All right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

The Many worlds hypothesis is an attempt to make rational sense of something that's otherwise completely irrational. To understand experiments in quantum physics, you invent a whole universe so that the other result goes into the other universe. That's the result that you didn't see, but might have seen, but didn't see. And. Okay. But I don't know what I can add or subtract from that. Because if you're gonna create a whole universe. Yeah. Where does it get the energy from? I don't know.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Maybe they've thought about it. I don't know the answer.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And I'm perfectly happy to say we forged our sensibilities, our senses and sensibilities on the plains of the Serengeti trying to not get eaten by lions. And there's nothing about our primate brain that prepares us for quantum physics. So when quantum physics doesn't make sense, I recite the opening line of my book.

[Chuck Nice]

The universe is under no obligation to make sense to you.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Thank you.

[Chuck Nice]

Here you go.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Thank you.

[Chuck Nice]

Yep. All right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And by saying, there's many worlds, you're forcing it to make sense to you. But it brings out other issues as well that go unresolved.

[Chuck Nice]

All right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

So this is Mile Milkovsky or Millie Milkovsky or.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

They didn't give you help.

[Chuck Nice]

That's weird. Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Melee sounds good.

[Chuck Nice]

I like Milay. Maybe we'll say. All right. So he says, hi, Neil and Chuck. My name is Mile. No meal. Oh, no, he's. He gave it to me. Me, Lyle. He gave it to me phonetically and I still can't say it.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Oh, that's bad. Oh, that's bad. I. Chuck, you can't pronounce the word nor the phonetic spelling of the word.

[Chuck Nice]

I cannot. Okay, Mile, I'm gonna go with that. From Macedonia, Balkan Europe. Okay. He says, neil, in your last book, to Infinity and Beyond, in the chapter to the Edge, do you mean that when we talk about the expanding universe, we are referring to the observable universe expanding? I thought that when everyone talks about the universe expanding, it's about the total, total universe expansion.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's also that.

[Chuck Nice]

Please explain what I'm doing wrong.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

No, no, you're not doing anything wrong both counts. The expansion of the universe is the entire universe. But when we speak about it in practical terms and what your telescope can see and we see, quote, the edge of the universe with your telescope, that's the observable universe.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

But we. I myself as well, have been a little sloppy there, distinguishing the universe from the observed universe. And I get a little sloppy. I ask forgiveness there. The whole thing expands. But the part that's expanding, that matters to us, is within our horizon.

[Chuck Nice]

Right. Okay. I hope, Mile, you're right. And you're right. There you go.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's right. You're right.

[Chuck Nice]

And you're right. That's all there is to it.

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[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

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[Chuck Nice]

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[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

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[Chuck Nice]

This is Trisha lynch who says hi Dr. Tyson and Lord. Nice. This is Tricia lynch from Beaverton, Oregon. What would happen if the Milky Way galaxy stopped rotating both suddenly or gradually? Wow. Thank you for everything that you do.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I think I. I drove by Beaverton, Oregon.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh, really?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Last year.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh, okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Or earlier this year.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh, is it that kind of place you just gotta drive by? No. Oh my God.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

What's that over there? No, I was visiting. I was visiting Ashland, Oregon.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh, okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And I think Beaverton is somewhere in the area there.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And I went to see the Shakespeare festival there in Ashland, Oregon.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh, wow, look at that.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Just saying.

[Chuck Nice]

And you know, I guess Central park was not good enough. Central Park, New York, I guess left all. You left left Manhattan to go to Beaverton, Oregon. Because you know, that's where the good Shakespeare is. Forget Shakespeare in the park. Yeah. All right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So now I forgot the question. Now what was it?

[Chuck Nice]

So basically she's saying if we stopped the rotation galaxy from spiraling either very quickly or slow down to a stop, what would happen?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Oh, that's a good one.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay, okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

The fact that we are rotating is the only thing preventing us from falling into the central black hole.

[Chuck Nice]

Wow. So at the center of our galaxy is a black hole.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes. And if we stopped rotating, it means we're no longer orbiting that black hole. That black hole. And so we just descend.

[Chuck Nice]

Damn.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Everything in the galaxy would fall into the black hole.

[Chuck Nice]

Wow.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Everything. That's right. By the way, that's no different from saying, here's the space station, let's just stop it in its orbit.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

What's it gonna happen? What's gonna happen? It's gonna fall, right? Yep.

[Chuck Nice]

Yes, exactly.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So be glad we have orbits even around black holes.

[Chuck Nice]

So. Oh, wow. That's a tenet of physics.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes, it is.

[Chuck Nice]

Spin stabilizes so well, no, it's a different. I know that's a physics here on Earth, but I'm saying.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

No, no, no. Spin stabilizing is a different phenomenon all together. Oh, yes. Football is spin stabilized.

[Chuck Nice]

That's a spin stabilized. But this spin is not stabilizing us.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's.

[Chuck Nice]

What I'm doing is interpolating.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's preventing us. I'm affixing falling into the middle. It's preventing that. It's just preventing our sideways motion. That's correct. And you can say, oh, look, how perfectly the galaxy.

[Chuck Nice]

You said it differently now. And that's the difference. It's not spin. It's sideways motion.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Well, it's orbiting. It's an orbit.

[Chuck Nice]

That's what an orbit is.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

Sideways motion.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Correct, Right, correct.

[Chuck Nice]

So, yeah, so we're falling around a black hole. Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And by the way, any matter that was there that didn't have the proper speed.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It fell in already. Right.

[Chuck Nice]

So we're actually falling. We just have sideways motion that keeps us from going in.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Correct.

[Chuck Nice]

There you go. I got you.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You got it?

[Chuck Nice]

I got you. Okay, cool. Great.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And if it slowly came to a stop.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Then slowly, the orbits would just sink in.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Until it came to a stop. And then everything would just rapidly fall.

[Chuck Nice]

Right?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

Damn. Slow. Yeah. So one's a slow death. There you go. Monopoly World wants to know this to whomsoever it may concern.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Ooh. All right.

[Chuck Nice]

What do you think? You just. What do you think this is, Science Friday? No, I just put this question out to everybody, and whoever picks it up, please answer it. You know, I don't care who gave me Concerns Friday. Brian Greene. Just. To whom's the. All right, all right. He says, please explain the Casimir force. I saw Harold Sonny White on Joe Rogan talk about it, but I need your version.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Well, thank you. Thank you. Okay, so let me give what I think is my best account of that.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I don't think I'm missing anything, but I might.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Okay.

[Chuck Nice]

I'm gonna be Joe Rogan now.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Okay.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay. Here you go. Go ahead.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So you have two parallel plates of conducting material.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Metal, let's say.

[Chuck Nice]

And what's metal?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Metal conducts electricity.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay. All right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

One of the properties of metal is that it conducts electricity, but there's other properties that define it to the chemist.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay, I only have three hours here, so let's talk about that.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So all Right.

[Chuck Nice]

Go ahead.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Two plates, very flat metal plates.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And there's air in between them.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So why don't I evacuate the air? So there's no. Nothing going on, Nothing between them at all? Nothing between them.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

There's no vibrations from the mole. Okay. So there they are. Now there's a vacuum between them. And I just slowly bring them closer and closer together. There is a distance within which they will feel an attractive force and pull together. And pull together as a Casimir force.

[Chuck Nice]

Correct.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I think this is correct. The interpretation is it is so close that the particles on either side of the vacuum. We're now so close to each other that the distance between them rivals the wavelength of the particles in the parallel plates to begin with.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay. The distance between them, between the two rivals the wavelength.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Right.

[Chuck Nice]

Of the particles that comprise the plates. Oh, okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So. So. So you're now contained within a wavelength of the subatomic material.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh, that's fricking amazing.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It's freaking right. The fact that someone would even do that experiment and find that that's the result.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's crazy.

[Chuck Nice]

That is incredible.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So that's the Casimir effect, and it's a purely quantum mechanical phenomenon. It doesn't have an analog in classical physics.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

That is really, I gotta tell you, some of the creep freakiest crap right now as I'm thinking about right now. That is really freaky, man. Because there is nothing between them.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes.

[Chuck Nice]

But what you're saying is the wavelength of the particle now becomes like a pressure.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes.

[Chuck Nice]

And that pressure of the wavelength of the particles itself, even though there's nothing between them.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Right.

[Chuck Nice]

Creates this force that mimics magnetic attraction. But it's not magnetic attraction. It's not. It's the two coming together now.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I'm just thinking about this out loud.

[Chuck Nice]

Crazy.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

No, it is. It is.

[Chuck Nice]

I love it.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

If I got something wrong in that explanation, it might not be the particles on the plates. It could be the wavelength of the virtual particles that exist in the vacuum.

[Chuck Nice]

In the vacuum itself.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's between them. Well, yeah, but a similar difference.

[Chuck Nice]

It's the same principle.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It'd be the same principle.

[Chuck Nice]

Whether you got that part right or not.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It doesn't make a difference.

[Chuck Nice]

We're talking about the. The phenomena itself.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes.

[Chuck Nice]

That's amazing.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. It's just a whole new phenomenon.

[Chuck Nice]

Gosh.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. I think he won the Nobel Prize, so. That's a testament to people asking questions and doing experiments.

[Chuck Nice]

It really is.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

Wow. How. I heard about the. Damn.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You didn't know about the cashmere Effect.

[Chuck Nice]

That's. But, I mean, it's brilliant. What a brilliant experiment. I love it.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So, yeah. So that's the Casimir effect.

[Chuck Nice]

Wow, that's pretty cool, man.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

All right. Pretty damn.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

What's next up?

[Chuck Nice]

All right, this is time for one.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Or two more questions.

[Chuck Nice]

All right, Scott W. Peterson says this. Hey, gang. Scott from generic suburban Denver. Very nice. Very nice. On a re. On a recent episode, Dr. Tyson corrected the movie idea about the density of objects in the asteroid belt.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes.

[Chuck Nice]

We just go through. Don't have any. Constantly twists and turns to avoid things related. If the asteroid belt ever got it together, how large an object would it be? In other words, would we have another planet? Or would Neil end up putting it in the dustbin like Pluto?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

People still haven't gotten over Pluto.

[Chuck Nice]

No, they. No, they never.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

All right, so a couple of things.

[Chuck Nice]

All right?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

If you look at the distances between the planets, Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Jupiter, There's a huge gap between Mars and Jupiter.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And people saying this should be a planet there.

[Chuck Nice]

Right?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Let's look. This is in the 1700s. Let's look. There's gotta be a planet there. And we discovered a planet there. We discovered planet Ceres. And then Pallas and Vesta and Juno, the first four planets discovered in the asteroid belt. If you look up in 1805 textbooks for how many planets there were in the solar system, it was Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pallas, Vesta, Juno, and the fourth one I forgot. What. So they would count as planets until we said, wait a minute, they're all in the same place and they're kind of different, and they're really small. They're kind of rocky. They're not planets. They're asteroids. They're star like asteroid, star like star, like, because they're tiny dots of light just the way stars are. Because they have nothing to do with stars. People presume there's a planet there. They found these fragments and they're very excited about that. However, if you take all those fragments and glue them together into one object, you get something about 5% the size of the moon.

[Chuck Nice]

Well, that ain't a planet. That's all I'm saying. That ain't even.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That was never a planet.

[Chuck Nice]

That ain't even a moon. You kidding me?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

It was never a planet.

[Chuck Nice]

Right, Right. So it's an excellent question. It's. It's a great question. So it's basically just. It's. It's trash. It's just leftover trash from the creation of our solar system.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes.

[Chuck Nice]

That's all.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes. That's what? Debris. Debris, yeah.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay. Excellent. All right. This is Rye Guy. And Rye guy says, Greetings, Dr. Tyson and Lord Nice Ry Guy here from Arlington, Virginia. Is it possible that space and time existed separately to one another prior to the Big Bang? And the Big Bang is the result of separate dimensions violently merging? Are there any signs we could theoretically look for to confirm that as our origin story? Is there anything that exists that would explicitly disprove that possibility?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So this. This. Which possibility again?

[Chuck Nice]

The possibility that space and time itself were separate, the Big Bang itself fused, and now they're inexorably tied.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

But you have never noticed a time unless you were at a place.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And you've never been at a place without having noticed a time. Right. So why should we believe they were ever separate? What would it even mean for them to be separate? To be separate? It's not clear.

[Chuck Nice]

Well, I think what he's getting at, because we've talked about this before. In a higher dimension, we're free from the constraints of time. In this dimension.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yes.

[Chuck Nice]

So what he's saying is, is it possible that this is some kind of derivative of that higher dimension where we were free, where we're free from time.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Okay.

[Chuck Nice]

And now we're bound by time.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. So I can't imagine a higher dimension where you can move freely in the time coordinate. That's what you're talking about.

[Chuck Nice]

Yes.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. And so that's a good fact if we lived in a place such as that.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I gotta quote Einstein here.

[Chuck Nice]

Go ahead.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Time is defined to make motion look simple.

[Chuck Nice]

Damn. Einstein was gangsta. Time was defined to make motion look simple. That is so profoundly simplistic that it's scary.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. Yeah. And the scary part is that it might be correct.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

So I don't know what it would mean to have a universe without time.

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

How do you have events that follow other events?

[Chuck Nice]

Right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Is it just frozen there forever? I don't know.

[Chuck Nice]

Interesting. You're right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Right.

[Chuck Nice]

Right. Because the motion itself connotes time.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Correct? Correct. And so. Yeah, I'm not convinced.

[Chuck Nice]

Right. This is Jaden Peters who says, greetings from Utah. Jaden here, longtime listener. My question is a simple one, but simultaneously complex will be the judge of that. Jaden. All right. He says, what advice would you give to a physics major currently in college, particularly considering today's political climate and the defunding of scientific programs? I have great apprehension of completing my degree in astrophysics. Thank you so much. Wow. I was joking when I said that. But that is a really serious question that Jaden puts. Puts forth for you.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. So I. I'll give a cop out answer, then. I'll give a real answer. My cop out answer is, and this too shall pass.

[Chuck Nice]

Okay. Right. Science is going to be here no matter what.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That's true.

[Chuck Nice]

When we went through, there were dark ages.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

You can say, I don't want to fund science, but somebody will.

[Chuck Nice]

Somebody's going to do it.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Somebody's going to. Somebody's going to play the tune. And you have to dance to that tune. Because whether or not it is we, there are other countries in the world that value science on a level that makes our investments look bad. So. Yeah, but anyhow, I would say physics is foundational to. There is no understanding of biology without chemistry. And there's no understanding of chemistry without physics. I have chemistry books from the 1800s. You open them up, it's like, well, add three parts pitch blend and two parts sulfur and you get. Next page. Add one part hydrogen. What's up? There's no. It's kitchen recipes for chemistry. Not until we understood the periodic table of elements. Why is it periodic? Why do elements in a column make the same kinds of molecules? What's going on? It's all explained with physics. All of it. And don't judge any future of anything based on what's going on in the present. When you're still in school. Yeah. If it was 80 years ago, you say, oh, what's the good industry we'll be in 20 years, I'll tell you that.

[Chuck Nice]

Plastics, son. Plastics.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah. I mean, back then the things didn't move as fast. So your whole career could be planned out and you'd know exactly what you'd be working on today. I mean, oh, my gosh.

[Chuck Nice]

Right?

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

I think we're good there.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah, man, that's great advice. Science is going to be here no matter what.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Well, especially physics.

[Chuck Nice]

And physics. So stick with physics.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Just stick with it and go for it. Then as a physicist, you understand matter, motion and energy. And there's nothing going on in the world that doesn't tap into at least one of those three.

[Chuck Nice]

There you go.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

And most of it involves it all.

[Chuck Nice]

Nice way. Nice way to end it.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. Another installment. Galactic gumbo.

[Chuck Nice]

Matter and emotions. That's right.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Are there any high pitched galactic gumbo voices?

[Chuck Nice]

There can't be. There can't be. There's nobody in New Orleans who's walking around going, damn, gotta be like this. I know. I'm saying.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

All right, all right, that's that's all the time we have, Chuck.

[Chuck Nice]

Oh, man. That was good though.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That was a fun one.

[Chuck Nice]

That was fun.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

That was fun. That was fun. I'm glad I never got through that many in my whole life.

[Chuck Nice]

Yeah, that's it.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Okay. All right. This has been Another installment of StarTalk Cosmic Queries grab Bag edition. Or according to Chuck, Galactic Gumbo. Always good to have you, man.

[Chuck Nice]

Always a pleasure.

[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

All right. Neil DeGrasse Tyson, four star talk. As always, bidding you to keep looking up. Riley herbst from 2311 racing. Checking in. Got a break in between team meetings. Sounds like the perfect time for some fast paced fun at Chumba Casino. No waiting, just instant action to keep you going. So next time you need a pick me up, fire it up and take a spin play [e-mail] let's Chumba.

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[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

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[Chuck Nice]

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[Neil DeGrasse Tyson]

Com.