StarTalk Radio Episode Summary: "The Elements of Marie Curie with Dava Sobel"

Release Date: January 14, 2025
Host: Neil deGrasse Tyson
Guest: Dava Sobel

1. Introduction and Guest Background

The episode begins with Neil deGrasse Tyson warmly welcoming Dava Sobel, celebrating her as the first-ever guest of StarTalk Radio. Reflecting on their long-standing relationship, Tyson remarks, “[...] Dava Sobel is a fixture on the landscape of science writing and has gone places that others haven't or haven't even thought to go” (01:30).

2. Dava Sobel’s Journey into Science Writing

Dava Sobel shares her early career experiences, mentioning her time as a journalist for the Binghamton Evening and Sunday Press in upstate New York and her brief stint as a technical writer for IBM. She connects her passion for science writing to her educational background, noting, “[...] I didn't even know it was called science writing. And I wish somebody had told me about it sooner because it would have made my journey a lot more direct” (03:57).

3. Overview of Sobel’s Notable Works

Tyson highlights Sobel's significant contributions to science literature, particularly her acclaimed books:

• Longitude: Described as a "runaway mega bestseller," this book narrates the story of John Harrison, who invented the first seaworthy chronometer (04:32).
• Galileo’s Daughter: Focuses on Virginia "Suor Maria Celeste" Galileo, emphasizing the pivotal role of women in early astronomy (05:24).
• The Glass Universe: Explores the contributions of 45 women at the Harvard College Observatory, challenging the previously held misogynistic views within the scientific community (05:39 - 12:14).

4. Deep Dive into Marie Curie

Sobel discusses her latest work on Marie Curie, aiming to shed light on the often-overlooked women in Curie's laboratory:

• Discovering Unrecognized Contributors: Sobel uncovers records from the Picuri Museum in Paris, revealing approximately 45 women who worked under Curie’s mentorship. She explains, “[...] this was something I knew that nobody knew about Madame Curie” (10:37).

• Marie Curie’s Dual Nobel Prizes: Curie’s unique achievement of winning two Nobel Prizes—one in Physics (1903, shared with Pierre Curie and Henri Becquerel) and another in Chemistry (1911) solely for her discoveries of polonium and radium—is highlighted. Sobel emphasizes the significance of Curie receiving the second prize independently, stating, “[...] she didn’t share it with anyone” (16:17).

5. The Science of Radioactivity

The discussion delves into Curie's groundbreaking work on radioactivity:

• Discovery and Isolation of New Elements: Curie’s methodical testing led to the identification of polonium and radium, elements that were previously undiscovered. Sobel notes, “[...] she found out that thorium also” (21:11), and further elaborates on the challenges of isolating these elements from vast amounts of ore.

• Impact on Medicine and Geology: The application of radioactivity in medical treatments and dating geological samples is explored. Sobel explains how radioactivity became a tool for determining the Earth's age, significantly revising previously held beliefs (28:13 - 28:55).

6. Personal Struggles and Scandals

The episode does not shy away from Curie's personal life:

• Scandal and Public Perception: Curie's affair with a married man became a media sensation, leading to public vilification. Sobel recounts, “[...] she was vilified. She was called a homewrecker and a foreigner” (35:22). Despite the scandal, prominent scientists like Albert Einstein defended her, urging the Nobel Committee to separate her personal life from her scientific achievements (35:05 - 35:15).

• Nobel Prize Acceptance Amidst Scandal: The episode covers the dramatic moment when Curie chose to accept her Nobel Prize in Stockholm despite the ongoing controversy, asserting, “[...] I fail to see any connection between my scientific work and scandalous attacks on my private life” (36:35).

7. Curie’s Legacy and Influence on Women in Science

Sobel emphasizes Curie’s role as a pioneer and mentor for women in science:

• Educational Initiatives: Curie’s efforts to train women as X-ray technicians during World War I are highlighted. Sobel states, “[...] she created a mobile X-ray unit and trained 150 French women” (40:23).

• Enduring Impact: The lasting influence of Curie’s work is acknowledged, with Tyson remarking, “[...] every X-ray technician owes her a debt because she created their job” (41:00).

8. Reflections on Sobel’s Research and Future Endeavors

Sobel discusses the extensive research involved in her book, including accessing digital archives of Curie’s personal notebooks and weekly publications of the Academy of Sciences. She reflects on the untold stories of many women scientists and the importance of recognizing their contributions (41:49 - 42:56).

Tyson concludes the episode by praising Sobel’s dedication to uncovering these hidden narratives, stating, “[...] your people are pretty well informed about that part of our own history in astronomy” (05:46) and “[...] no, it's hard work. And scientists who are committed have done this, often without reward” (43:24).

Notable Quotes

• Neil deGrasse Tyson: “If you need incentive to get back to StarTalk, write another damn book.” (45:10)

• Dava Sobel: “The Nobel committee decided that maybe it would not be a good idea for her to come to Stockholm to accept the prize in the midst of this scandal.” (36:20)

• Chuck Nice: “You have become your mother.” (32:30) (Humorous interjection highlighting Curie’s legacy through her daughter)

Conclusion

The episode offers a comprehensive exploration of Marie Curie’s scientific achievements, personal struggles, and enduring legacy, while also highlighting the often-overlooked contributions of women in early science. Dava Sobel’s insights provide a nuanced understanding of Curie’s life, and Neil deGrasse Tyson’s engaging hosting ties the historical narrative to contemporary discussions about gender and recognition in science.

Key Takeaways:

• Marie Curie’s unparalleled contributions to science, including her discovery of polonium and radium, significantly advanced our understanding of radioactivity.

• Curie faced substantial societal and personal challenges, including public vilification due to her personal life, yet she remained steadfast in her scientific pursuits.

• The legacy of Curie extends beyond her own achievements, serving as an inspiration and foundation for countless women scientists who followed.

• Dava Sobel’s research uncovers the hidden narratives of women who worked alongside Curie, emphasizing the collective effort behind scientific breakthroughs.

Timestamp Guide for Notable Sections:

• Introduction of Dava Sobel: 01:22 - 02:48
• Discussion on Longitude: 04:16 - 05:11
• Exploration of The Glass Universe: 05:39 - 12:14
• Marie Curie’s Scientific Work: 16:02 - 29:06
• Curie’s Personal Life and Scandal: 33:49 - 37:09
• Curie’s Legacy and Impact: 40:23 - 43:24
• Closing Remarks and Future of Women in Science: 43:24 - 46:42

Note: Timestamps are indicated with placeholders (e.g., 01:22) for reference. Adjust according to the actual timestamp format as needed.