
Does time always move at the same rate? Neil deGrasse Tyson and Chuck Nice break down things you thought you knew about time dilation, gravity assists, the north star, and your zodiac sign.
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Chuck Nice
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Neil deGrasse Tyson
Hello, Star talk ins. Coming up, we've got another things you thought you knew episode. This time, Chuck and I riff on Einsteinian time dilation, the mysterious gravity assist that space probes get, and the North Star. Spoiler alert. It's not all it's cracked up to be. Coming up on StarTalk. Welcome to StarTalk, your place in the universe where science and pop culture collide. StarTalk begins right now. I still lose sleep over this fact. Okay. I still lose sleep over it. And I want you to lose sleep, too. I don't want to be the only one staring at the ceiling at night.
Chuck Nice
I've got to tell you, a lot of things already beat you to that.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Sure mean the asteroid strike.
Chuck Nice
That could happen. Or the. Exactly.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Or the global warming, or. So here it is. You may remember, or you may have heard that Einstein's relativity.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
More specifically, you learn this in special theory of relativity, where the faster you
Kennedy Space Center Announcer
move,
Neil deGrasse Tyson
the slower time ticks for you, as others view it, relative to the observer. Relative to the observer. Correct. You don't know anything's happening.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Your clock still ticks as far. You still got your heartbeat. All of this. Okay, so this is not a physiological thing. It's an actual property of the fabric of space and time under those conditions.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay.
Chuck Nice
That is fascinating.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It is. It's completely fascinating. It's completely. So I watch you fly by, and the faster you go, the slower time ticks for you. Okay.
Chuck Nice
But my time stays the same to you. To me.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Right to you. So not only does speed do this, also the strength of a gravitational field will help have the same effect on you. The stronger the gravitational field is the slower time ticks for you. And that wasn't formulated until his general theory of relativity 10 years later. That took a lot more math and deeper insights into the universe, but once
Chuck Nice
again, it makes sense because you're dealing with the fabric of space time.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It's the fabric of space time. Correct. But initially, when formulated, you're thinking it's just because you're moving, but it's actually way deeper than that. And that's why that one. Oh, by the way, his original special theory of relativity was not called that. The title of the research paper was on the electrodynamics of moving bodies.
Chuck Nice
What?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. That was the title. We would later call it the special theory of relativity because it was a special case of what would later then be called the general theory of relativity. Okay. So the geosynchronous satellites are like middle orbit that is far enough away from Earth's source of gravity for them to have a difference immeasurably different spacetime condition. Oh. So that their clocks tick faster than our clocks on Earth's surface because they're farther away. And so remember I said the more intense the gravitational.
Chuck Nice
Gravitational.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
The slower time ticks. So they're farther away. Their time ticks faster relative to us.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
But we get precise timings from geosynchronous satellites. So how does this work? We pre correct the time signal from the GPS satellites to compensate for Einstein's general theory of relativity, so that by the time the time reaches us, it's been properly corrected and it matters to us and our space time continuum, not the one that's in middle Earth orbit.
Chuck Nice
Oh, my goodness.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So GPS couldn't work as accurately as it does.
Chuck Nice
However. Wait a minute.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
What?
Chuck Nice
I'm sorry, just for me, you would have to have a standard in order to pre correct something.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You know, the rate at which its time is speeding up because you can calculate what the gravitational field is up there.
Chuck Nice
There you go. There you go. Okay, okay, okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And once you calculate that, then you do and you say, oh my gosh, we're. The formula works. Einstein was right. This is not just something on high theory, by the way, hypothesize that may or may not be true. It is true.
Chuck Nice
I just want to be there when that phrase is uttered. Oh my God. Einstein was right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. These aren't just cult heroes that we wish they were right. These are real. This is real. Okay? This is the real universe we're talking about here. Okay? So now watch. Let's keep going faster and faster. Let's go half the speed of light. 3/4 of the speed. 90% the speed of light. 99% the speed of light. Time is ticking slower and slower and slower for you. You will watch the whole future history of the universe unfold in front of your eyes as fractions of a second go by for you as you go. 99. There's a formula for this, of course, but. 99. 99.9. 99.99% the speed of light, because you're
Chuck Nice
the observer of that.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
But that.
Chuck Nice
But for you, your time has slowed to the point where as you observe the things that are not moving at the speed of light, you see them speeding, you see them unfold.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Correct?
Chuck Nice
Boom. Got it?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Correct.
Chuck Nice
That is insane.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So now watch.
Chuck Nice
Oh, my God.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Wait, no, watch. Okay. Wow. So I didn't even get to the part where I lose sleep.
Chuck Nice
Okay, okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That's what happens. By the way. By the way, there are particles that decay. You've heard of like radioactivity, right?
Chuck Nice
Yes.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Right. One part decays and becomes another part. It releases often deadly energy.
Chuck Nice
Yes, okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Radioactivity. All right, Some particles. Let's take for example, the proton or the muon. One of these decays in like six minutes. When it's left out in the wild, when it's not part of an atom, when it's not in captivity. I forgot which of these. It doesn't matter. For my example, decay isn't like six minutes. Okay. Okay. What happens if you take that particle and speed it up in a particle accelerator? So you take a community of these particles, speed them up, calculate. Wait a minute. The internal wristwatch on these clocks says they should live longer. And sure enough, their decay time takes longer.
Chuck Nice
Wow. That's. Oh, my God.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes. Yes.
Chuck Nice
Oh, wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes.
Chuck Nice
And that becomes living proof of what Einstein said. Yes.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Because we can't go half the speed of light. But you can accelerate a particle to do that. An internal built in clock that decays after a certain amount of time. And there they are taking longer to decay and in the exact amount that Einstein predicts.
Chuck Nice
That is genius.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So we don't make this stuff up. Okay? Yes, it is genius. It's like triple genius. All right, now let's take this to an extreme level. Let's go so fast that we're going the speed of light itself.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Well, we can't do that because we're made of material substance and there's no way to do that. But there are things that, that travel at the speed of light. And what is that?
Chuck Nice
Those would be photons.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes, those would be like your finger gesture. That would be. I would say, what travels at the speed of light? Light does.
Chuck Nice
Yeah.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay.
Chuck Nice
I was about to say light.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So if photons had a clock, the clock would never tick.
Chuck Nice
Nice.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Which means when I go to a mountaintop, as I did in graduate school, to observe the center of the Milky Way galaxy for stars that emitted their light 30,000 years ago, traveling through the gaps of interstellar space. And they move through space, come through Earth's atmosphere, they come down into the telescope, they reflect, go back to my detector and land on my CCD chip. That photon, when it was born
Chuck Nice
at
Neil deGrasse Tyson
the star that emitted it, was detected at my telescope in the same instant.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
According to the photon itself, live fast, die hard. The photon has no knowledge of that trip.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Because time did not exist for it.
Chuck Nice
Oh, that's great.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And I'm saddened that many of these photons, like, hit people tanning on the beach, you know, and to have. Imagine traveling 30,000 years and land on someone's buttocks when you could have. With the telescopes I collected, I'm now decoding the nature of the universe. And some photons go right on by Earth and are still moving, but they have no internal time clock.
Chuck Nice
Wow. And they're just traveling through. Like, I hope when I'm born, I hit a telescope. Bam.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You're born and you hit a telescope.
Chuck Nice
Yeah, yeah.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That would be an interesting. But what do I want to be when I grow up? Or the instant I am emitted, where am I going to be?
Chuck Nice
Where would I like to be?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Right, right, right. And so just the idea that light can move across the universe and have. No, no. And not age. This is a fascinating fact to me.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So, yeah, that is.
Chuck Nice
That is more than fascinating. That is. I mean, that's mindboggling. Yeah.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. So that is light, the age of light. It's like it doesn't age at all.
Chuck Nice
I am convinced that all of you guys secretly micro do and smoke weed. I'm just.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That's another episode. That's all I'm saying.
Chuck Nice
Another episode.
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Chuck Nice
I'm Alikan Hemraj and I support StarTalk on Patreon. This is StarTalk with Neil DeGrasse Tys.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Do you like these, these explainers?
Chuck Nice
Of course I1 because Neil splaining has always been good. Neil splaining has. That's a good thing.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. For me. Okay. You know, all other splainings are not good.
Chuck Nice
Man, splaining, mansplaining ain't good. You know what I mean? Black splaining, white splaining ain't good, but Neil splaining, it works.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That's a whole other thing. Yeah. Thank you for that, those words of encouragement. So I'll just continue.
Chuck Nice
Cool. And what do you got?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So I got today, we've all heard of gravity assists for a spacecraft.
Chuck Nice
Yes. That was in Space Jam. Right. It's a gravity assist. Oh, that was. Oh, that's it, people. I just retired. It's over. Because that was the worst I've ever done in my life. Jesus.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So a gravity assist, the way people typically think about it is you, you send out a spacecraft and you want it to give it more speed than it currently has. Right. And so you find some planet that it sort of falls towards and of course it'll speed up as it does that. And we think of it as kind of a slingshot where obviously it falls not towards it, but towards the side of it.
Chuck Nice
Yes.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Otherwise it's not a gravity assist, it's a gravity crash.
Chuck Nice
Exactly.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So you want it to sort of swing by and it picks up speed in so doing. And it flings out the other side. And if you angle it right and position it right, you could head towards your next destination. And as a result, you can have multiple destinations in the same voyage. So famously, Voyager 1 and 2, this is back in the 1970s when it was launched, they had trajectories that. Well, let me say that differently. The solar system's planets were configured in such a way that it could get multiple planetary assists, multiple gravitational assists, and by the time it was done, it had so many gravitational assists, it had enough energy to leave the solar system entirely.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And you could end up doing that without using a very big rocket to begin with.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So you're basically exploiting the gravitational attraction of planets rather than for your speed, rather than spending money on fuel. Poor man's way to get out of the system.
Chuck Nice
It's basically cosmic drafting.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Drafting, I like that.
Chuck Nice
Cosmic drafting is just like, why should I pedal? Let this sucker pedal for me.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Think about this. As you approach a planet and its gravity attracts you, everyone has said and believes and thinks that it pulls you in and then flings you out the other side. But wait a minute.
Chuck Nice
Yeah, just like. Just like there used to be from me with women at a nightclub.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Oh, is that how that worked for you?
Chuck Nice
There was an attraction. Pull me in and they'd be like, oh, no, nah, nah, nah, nah. You got nuh out the other side.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
See you brother, completely symmetric picture there, Right?
Chuck Nice
Exactly.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So the problem with thinking of it that way is the same gravity that's pulling you in is also preventing you from leaving, right? Okay. So you'll speed up as you fall in. But now as you try to escape the gravity, saying, no, I'm pulling you back.
Chuck Nice
Right?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So it turns out if you look at the pure gravity picture, it is exactly symmetric to the planet, right? Okay. The planet pulls you in, you gain speed, you have maximum speed, Right. When you're passing the planet now, you want to exit the planet, the planet starts pulling you back, right? So every time I try to get out, your speed falling in, and your speed going back is an exact mirror image of your motion.
Chuck Nice
Okay? So then the question is, how do I end up getting all this damn speed where this slingshot effect, okay, this
Neil deGrasse Tyson
is something that's hardly ever explained, and that's why we have these explainer videos.
Chuck Nice
Cool.
Kennedy Space Center Announcer
So.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So here's the answer. It turns out if you approach a planet from behind, okay, okay, there it is orbiting the sun, right? And you approach it from behind in its orbit.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Not only will the gravity pull you
Chuck Nice
in,
Neil deGrasse Tyson
but you will gain speed just to catch up with the planet in its orbit.
Chuck Nice
That makes sense.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
How are we going to catch up? How are we going to hit the planet? Come near the planet. Unless you have the planet's orbital speed.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
The planet's orbital speed has nothing to do with the planet, with the planet's gravity.
Chuck Nice
Correct.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. So even though the gravity is symmetric, all the speed and energy you gain falling in the planet takes back away from you. That's symmetrical. But the speed you get from catching up with the planet in the orbit is not symmetric.
Chuck Nice
Rah. Look at that.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. And so what actually happened is you were tugging on the planet, okay. As the planet was moving, and you were speeding up because of this. But what it means is you stole some of the planet's orbital energy to do this. Wow. They don't tell you about that?
Chuck Nice
No, they don't. So you basically, you approach the planet from behind and you just like, don't make a ghetto.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
No mugging out of this.
Chuck Nice
Yo, yo, give me some of that speed. Don't turn around. Don't look at my face. Don't look at my face. Look at my face. Just give me the speed. Nobody needs to get hurt here.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And then you take it and you
Chuck Nice
keep going and you got the thing. And it doesn't.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And it doesn't have it. You have it.
Chuck Nice
So
Neil deGrasse Tyson
this is the art of the slingshot.
Chuck Nice
Dude, that's pretty amazing. That makes sense.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You can slingshot off of anything. We've had planets orbit the sun, launched from Earth, and then slingshot around Earth twice.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Wow. Okay, now it takes longer, Right? That's if you're not in a hurry. You do this and it use Earth to slingshot. You could slingshot off the moon, you can slingshot off of Mars.
Chuck Nice
Okay?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It doesn't matter what planet you want a slingshot from.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
In the case of Voyager, Voyager 1, I think it was. It's slungshot. What's past tense of 2? Slingshot. It's slung shotted.
Chuck Nice
Slang shot.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Slang shot.
Chuck Nice
It was slang shot.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It's slang shit off of Jupiter. And so people think, well, Jupiter has big gravity, will get a huge speed. It's only getting Jupiter's orbital speed. Just make that clear.
Chuck Nice
Look at that.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And Jupiter's traveling slower than planets that orbit closer in.
Chuck Nice
So the gravitational pull cancels out, but the orbital speed is what's left over. And that's what you ended up stealing in order to get the speed to go.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And if you want an inverse mugging, which no one will actually want to do in space, if you. You can fall towards the planet right opposite the direction it's traveling.
Chuck Nice
Oh, wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. And if you do that, then you have sped up the planet, it eats some of your or your trajectory's energy, and you'll come out the other side moving slower than you did before.
Chuck Nice
Oh, so you could actually use it as a break?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
As a break, that's correct.
Chuck Nice
Oh, wow. Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
This is.
Chuck Nice
That's fascinating stuff.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
If you need it to break in space, that's a way. And it takes a long time to line up and make it all happen. So there you have it.
Chuck Nice
Wow, look at that. Cosmic drafting and space breaking. That's amazing.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And so the more times you do this, the more energy you have, the more speed you accumulate. And that's how we leave the solar system. Cool. Yeah. And you might ask, but you didn't. If you slingshot off of Mars like 20 times, like, what happens to the Mars orbit itself if you're taking away its energy? You haven't asked that.
Chuck Nice
No, I don't.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Because you don't care.
Chuck Nice
I was gonna say, you know, I'm not worried about Mars.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay.
Chuck Nice
I think Mars is gonna be okay. But anyway, what does happen? Let's say over, over, over, over, over. I mean, you're basically siphoning off a tiny little bit of energy.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Siphoning off a tiny little bit of energy. So, okay, so here's the thing. You know, maybe in a trillion years, if you did this every day, it would matter. But the mass of these objects relative to the mass of our measly probes. Okay, that ratio is so huge that it's like a gnat flying full speed ahead into an elephant. The elephant doesn't say, watch out. The elephant. Quit your shoving. The mass difference is so huge that it's not relevant. It's not important in what's going on in the solar system. But in addition, take Earth, for example. In any given day, we plow through a hundred tons of meteors every single day.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Tons. So this stuff falling and this stuff. So don't worry about it. We have other things we should be worrying about, like climate change.
Chuck Nice
Yes, tell me about it.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So if you worry about. Oh, my gosh, how about Mars? Worry about your own damn planet.
Chuck Nice
I'm all about that. Speaking of Mars, you said, worry about your own planet, don't worry about Mars. And so I got both of them in one. I got a Mars pack from the out of this World collection from Soul Guard. Right. And check this out. Every single suitcase that they make pulls about 229bottles of plastic out of the environment. Really? Yes. So here we are with Mars, and we worried about our own planet at the same time. Boom.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Wait, wait. So you're saying I should drink more plastic bottles so you can make more of that luggage? No, nothing to take away.
Chuck Nice
No, I'm saying for the idiots that drink plastic bottles, this is part of the solution. And for the smart people who want to buy this in health, that's what they should do.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay, so it's not only gets the bottles out. If you like the universe, if you love the universe. You got one that looks like Mars.
Chuck Nice
Yep. That's right. That's right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Very cool.
Chuck Nice
12 million plastic bottles pulled in 20, 21. Right. See, that's what we're doing here.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Wait, Chuck, do I recognize Valles Marineris on that?
Chuck Nice
Really?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Don't pretend like I'm like.
Chuck Nice
Because here's what I'm saying.
Sponsor/Commercial Announcer
Do you? No.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It looks like a high resolution image of Martian surface. It's not just like red pretending to be Mars. It is Mars. It's got very good detail on the surface that's highly recognizable. If you're Mars fluent, which apparently you're not.
Chuck Nice
No. Okay. I don't speak Martian. I'm sorry.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Valles Marineris is basically the Mars Valley, and it's a huge canyon, way bigger than the Grand Canyon here on Earth. And it's a very striking scar in the Martians. Clearly, Mars has had a whole lot of activity long ago, shaping and forming and reshaping its surface. And that's one other bits of evidence of it. So that adds to the authenticity of what you got in your hands there.
Chuck Nice
Very cool. I'm just gonna let you talk while I sit here and play. Black van or white?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Is that how that goes? But I need a vowel, though.
Chuck Nice
Yeah, I got a few of them right here.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Oh, yeah. There you go. I can tell you this, that there's nothing more boring than people's luggage.
Chuck Nice
So think about it. You're absolutely right, by the way. Speaking of that.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So now there's a piece of luggage that, like, that's good. I want one.
Chuck Nice
There's some exciting lugs, by the way. The cool thing about this, not only is it like, it's Mars right here, which means that when it comes.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Can't argue with Mars, it comes down the chute, right?
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Mars down the conveyor belt.
Chuck Nice
Mars is coming down the conveyor belt. You'll be able to recognize yours. And as a matter of fact, you can turn to somebody and go, get your ass to Mars and.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
But don't take my luggage while you do that. Okay.
Chuck Nice
Very cool.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
They're working on. Good stuff.
Chuck Nice
Gotta love this.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
All right, Chuck. So that's all we have.
Chuck Nice
That was great. I love it.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So now you know. And I never thought to analogize a gravity assistant with a mugging.
Chuck Nice
I'm glad I could be of service.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. Thank you, Chuck.
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Chuck Nice
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Neil deGrasse Tyson
What's the brightest star in the nighttime sky?
Chuck Nice
Are we talking my career here, Neil? Just saying. I've been waiting for us to get around to this.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
How bright is your star, Chuck?
Chuck Nice
Yeah, no, if it were me up in the sky, I would just be a dim spot in the Milky Way.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It is funny that a fundamental word in all of Hollywood is derived from my profession, astrophysics.
Chuck Nice
It is the most fundamental word.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It is Are you a star? Meaning, are you burning thermonuclear fuel in your core?
Chuck Nice
Exactly right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And the Walk of Fame. It's a star.
Chuck Nice
It's a star. That's all.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Astro.
Chuck Nice
Yeah, well, it's Said that from everything I've ever heard, that's the North Star. That's what people say. Well, that's the North Star. You can always find your way home because it's the brightest star in the sky. Just follow the North Star.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. So in my experience, 9 out of 10 people will say that, right?
Chuck Nice
Yeah.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. They'll see the first bright star after sunset and then assert that it's the north star when in 100% of those cases, they're looking at a planet.
Chuck Nice
Well, that makes sense. Cause a planet is right there.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. Well, planet's right in front of our noses.
Chuck Nice
Planets are right here, man.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
But for me, the funny part is they'll make a wish on the, you know, star. Bright starbright. First star I see tonight. Right. And then they make a wish. And of course, the wishes don't come true because they're wishing on planets. That's why. You never knew that.
Chuck Nice
Okay, I want to explain that to any kid now. Just.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And then if you're not wishing on the star and because you know that they're planets, it means, you know, enough science not to be wishing on stars.
Chuck Nice
That's pretty cool.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It all balances out.
Chuck Nice
And it's so funny that you say that. It just popped into my head what a culturally entrenched sentiment that is, wishing on a star. I mean, there's songs about transcends, you know, geography and culture. You know, you have it and pretty much all kinds of writings. Wishing on a star. That's pretty wild.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. And I'm honored that my field supplies this level of cultural referencing to all that we do.
Chuck Nice
So.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. So the North Star is not the brightest star in the night sky.
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
I just want to make that clear.
Chuck Nice
Okay, now. So now here's the thing.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah.
Chuck Nice
Cause what is the North Star then? Like, what is the North Star? And why is it.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So let's get.
Chuck Nice
Why is it of any significance if it's not the brightest star?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
There you go. So we'll get to the brightest star in a minute. So the North Star is the star in the sky that's. That's closest to where Earth's axis points on the sky. So you have a rotating Earth and it's just sort of rotating.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And the axis is just sort of sitting there as Earth spins around it. That axis is pointing to a spot in space. Okay. In the sky.
Chuck Nice
Gotcha.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So we say, is there a star near to that spot? Because then we'd always be pointing in that direction.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Right. So the star closest to that spot is The North Star. And the North Star has a name. Did you know this?
Chuck Nice
I want to guess because the only star that I hear the name of all the time is the Dog Star.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah, no, that's not.
Chuck Nice
Okay, well, there you go. I said there was a guess. It's not serious. It's not serious. The Dog Star. Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah, yeah, yeah. The Dark Star is Sirius. Sirius is the Dark Star, not the North Star. So the name of this star is sensibly Polaris.
Chuck Nice
Oh, for the pole or the axis. Polaris.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Polaris. And in fact, that was the name, I think, of America's first nuclear submarine, Polaris, that could launch intercontinental ballistic missiles.
Chuck Nice
I'm about to drop a star on you. So American.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That's so American.
Chuck Nice
Okay, we about to drop a star on you
Neil deGrasse Tyson
that produces energy to vaporize you just the way the centers of stars do.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It's the same thermonuclear mechanisms going on. So anyhow, so it's got a name. Polaris. Now, the Big Dipper. Okay. The lip of the Big Dipper. This part right here. Okay, the lip. So there's a handle and then there's the cup. And the lip is the front edge of that cup.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That points to the North Star.
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. That's how you can always find the North Star. Because the Big Dipper is very obvious in the Northern Hemisphere.
Chuck Nice
Absolutely.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay, so you. And then it points and you go like four segments up and then boom, there it is. Okay, so there are a couple of issues with this. First, the North Star is not exactly above the Pole. Okay. You can fit two full moon widths between it and the exact spot over the North Pole.
Chuck Nice
Gotcha.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
All right. Which means if you took a camera and a long exposure photo centered on the North Star, the North Star will not be pegged in the middle. You'll see it make a circle.
Chuck Nice
Interesting.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So it is not exactly above the North Star.
Chuck Nice
And the reason why you're seeing it make a circle is because you have the long exposure and the Earth is rotating where you're.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes, exactly. And so otherwise, if you just take snapshots, you just get the stars where they are, but if you take a long time exposure, you get the stars blurring, basically, but they blur with the rotation of the Earth.
Chuck Nice
Gotcha, gotcha.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And so you'll see that it actually would trace a circle around the actual North Pole because people are saying, isn't it amazing that we have a star exactly over the North Pole? What are the odds? Well, it's not exactly.
Chuck Nice
The odds would be Zero. That's a bad bet. Yeah.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It's not exactly over the double. Not only that, the lip of the Big Dipper kind of misses the North Star. If you did an exact line, it's off. So there's a lot of fakery going on. Not bad fakery, but just people want the sky to have more meaning than it actually does. Wow. And so you say things that are sort of partly true just cause you feel better about what it is you're talking about.
Chuck Nice
Okay, so the North Star is kind of like, directionally. It's kind of like getting directions in the hood.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
He's kind of over there. Yeah.
Chuck Nice
Yeah, man. So what you want to do, you want to keep on down there. You want to keep going and going. Right? Right. You gonna come to. So it's a car. Right. But one of the wheels is up on a crate. Yeah, make it right there. Right there.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
All right.
Chuck Nice
You gonna keep going, right? Just keep going and going, right?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That's right. Directions on the sky from the stars are exactly like that. So now let me tell you how bright the North Star is. It's not the brightest, but let me tell you. Take a guess.
Chuck Nice
I'm gonna say it's a B student bright.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. It's not understanding.
Chuck Nice
First of all, how do you measure brightness in the night sky? I really don't even know that.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
But we have meters that do this. This is science. You don't have to worry about that. We.
Chuck Nice
All right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And even if you didn't have meters, you could say, yeah, that's brighter than that and that's dimmer than that. Yeah, we got this. Okay. We've had this even since before there were telescopes. Okay? So it is not in the top 10.
Chuck Nice
Oh, no.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It is not in the top 20.
Chuck Nice
Oh, goodness.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It is not in the top 30.
Chuck Nice
Dad, North Star. What are you talking about?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It is not even in the top 40.
Chuck Nice
Oh, my God. The North Star is like the United States with respect to math and science. We say we're number one, but we're 47.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
The North Star is the 49th brightest star in the night sky.
Chuck Nice
Oh, my gosh.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It is completely uninteresting. It is easily missable. It is. Does not call attention to yourself. That's why you need the lip of the Big Dipper to find it.
Chuck Nice
To find it. Cause you actually need a pointer. Because it really isn't remarkable at all.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It is not remarkable. Not remarkable.
Chuck Nice
Wow. It kind of reminds me of somebody I know.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You sound like you should have your own TV show. Reminiscences. Of everyone. You grew up with stories. So, yeah. So the North Star is just lame. I mean, it's just embarrassing. And meanwhile, people think it's the brightest star in the night sky. And that's what's weird about it to me, because they've never checked. And so this is the lore overriding people's curiosity.
Chuck Nice
I wonder how Venus feels about that.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You know, Venus is the most mistaken object for the North Star because it's the brightest in the night sky, the morning sky.
Chuck Nice
Venus is sitting around like. Just like a man. Just like a man. Here I am, just as bright as I can be every single night I come out.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Is that what Venus sounds like?
Chuck Nice
Look at me. And you know what they say? Oh, my God, look at the North Star. Once again, a man just taking my credit for the hard work that I do. Okay?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And no, there doesn't happen to be a star in the South Pole. It's just a big empty spot. There is a star closer to the South Pole than the North Star is to the North Pole, but it's even.
Chuck Nice
And we don't call that the South Star.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You can, but it has a name. It's called Sigma Octans. And it's very unassuming. And nobody cares.
Chuck Nice
I don't. You know why nobody cares? Because its name is Sigma Octaves. Don't nobody want to talk about Sigma Octaves.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Sigma Octave. Because there's a constellation called Octans, which is an octant, which is an early version of a sextant. And there's a lot of navigational instruments among the constellations of the Southern Hemisphere. You know why? Because when Europeans got to the Southern Hemisphere and decided to map the stars, we had already begun the Industrial Revolution. And so they weren't thinking centaurs and Greek mythology. They were thinking, oh, my gosh, I'm gonna put some badass equipment here. So there's an architect's table, there's a telescope, a microscope, a sextant, and an octant.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It's all there. These are all constellations of the 88 in the night sky.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So, one last thing about the North Star, so you can picture this. If you are Santa Claus looking straight up, what star do you see?
Chuck Nice
Looking straight up, you see a dead spot?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Well, yes, because we just learned that. Right.
Chuck Nice
I thought it was a trick question.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
No, that's not true. No, you look up, Santa Claus will look up and see the North Star.
Chuck Nice
The North Star. Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. So how many degrees up is that? From the horizon?
Chuck Nice
Yeah, from the horizon. Well, that. No, that should be nothing. He's already there.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
No, no degrees from the horizon to straight overhead for Santa Claus, Let me see.
Chuck Nice
Because he's at the top of the world. So the degrees on the horizon.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
No, forget that. It doesn't matter. Just. Yes, Santa Claus is on the, quote, top of the world, sure. But now he wants to know how high up is the North Star for him. Above the horizon. So how many degrees is that?
Chuck Nice
Oh, that's straight up. That's 90 degrees.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
90 degrees. What is the latitude of the North Pole?
Chuck Nice
360 degrees.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
What is the latitude of the North Pole?
Chuck Nice
90 degrees.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
90 degrees.
Chuck Nice
Thank you.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay.
Chuck Nice
I just love. No, I said that. Cause I wanted to see. This is what I love. This is what I love, you being the educator that you are. Because I'll do that. And I'm just waiting for the reaction. Because if it were me, I'd be like, man, what the hell is wrong with you?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You dumb question.
Chuck Nice
And you do this.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
I gave you a second chance. I gave you a second chance.
Chuck Nice
I always do this. You're.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Like I said, my boy knows better than this. I'm gonna give him a second chance. I'm not gonna say a damn thing. He's gonna fix his own damn mistake.
Chuck Nice
Right? But I love it. I love it. Go ahead.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
The North Star is 90 degrees up when you're at the North Pole, which is at a latitude of 90 degrees. That is not a coincidence. Okay? If Santa Claus marches south, the North Star will get lower and lower and lower in the sky. Santa Claus gets to the equator. The North Star is on the horizon. The latitude of the equator is zero. The elevation of something on the horizon is zero. So the elevation in degrees of the North Star above your horizon is your latitude on Earth.
Chuck Nice
Oh. Because it follows all the way down.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It follows all the way down.
Chuck Nice
It follows all the way down. Yeah, that. Well, that's pretty interesting.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes, Very interesting. And so this was an important navigational tool that makes sense for everybody. Right? Right. And of course, the Underground Railroad. Follow the North Star because if you just walk towards the North Star, you'll eventually reach Santa Claus. But Ohio is good enough.
Chuck Nice
Who knew that the North Star was such a poser?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Very much a poser, actually. It's not its fault. It's. People want it to be so special, and it just isn't. So I have more to tell you about how unspecial it is.
Chuck Nice
Oh, awesome.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
We're 49th.
Chuck Nice
We're 49th. We'm 49th.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes. For those who missed it, the north star is the 49th brightest star in the night sky. And in the night sky. It's not saying here I am. It is not doing that. All right, so. But wait, there's more. Earth spinning on its axis, and it's at its north pole points upwards, close ish to where the North Star is on the sky. All right. What I didn't tell you is I don't know. No one has them anymore. You ever play with tops as a kid? I did. That's how old I am.
Chuck Nice
Of course.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You play at the top. And it spins and then eventually begins to wobble.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. We have an official term for that. It's called precession. That is wobbling. Precession. That's an official term. So Earth wobbles.
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Do we spin once and how often. How long does it take to spin once?
Chuck Nice
24 hours, I guess.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Thank you. Yeah. If you want to be Precise, it's actually 23:56:04.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
In case. But that's another explainer. Well, you know, why do we think it's 24 hours when it's actually that. Okay, I will. That's a whole other. We'll save that.
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. All right. So we Spin once in 24 hours, and we wobble. And the wobble takes 26,000 years.
Chuck Nice
The wobble takes 26,000 Years.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Correct. So we've only really completed one wobble since caveman days.
Chuck Nice
Right. Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You know, 30,000 years ago.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So that's slow. And it took some very careful measurements and brilliant thinkers throughout the last thousand years, 2,000 years, to figure this out, that this is actually happening in the actual sky. All right, so now, because we're wobbling, it means the North Pole of Earth isn't always pointing towards the North Star.
Chuck Nice
Aha.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And we called it Polaris. But wait a minute. If it's no longer. If later on, it's not going to point to Polaris, not only is it not the North Star, should we keep calling it Polaris or just sort of grandfather in. Well, that's what I once was back in the day.
Chuck Nice
Exactly.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So if you look at that circle, the diameter of that circle is, in degrees, is 23 and a half degrees.
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. Because that's how tipped we are from vertical.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. That's Earth. That's what gives us our seasons, the fact that we're tipped. So we tip that, and then we process around that central point. All right. So if you draw that circle on the sky. Yes. It will go through the North Star, because that's what it is now. But any other stars that it comes near. One of the stars in the night sky, I think you've heard of. It's called Vega.
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Vega is one of the brightest stars of the night sky. It's about 30 light years away.
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
We think there's a planetary system forming around it. We see a disk of material that's not quite discrete planets, but it's kind of. It's working its way towards forming planets. So we know some stuff about Vega. In 14,000 years, the wobble will take the North Pole axis close enough to Vega for that to be our pole star.
Chuck Nice
Gotcha.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And in ancient Egypt, that was long enough ago, you know, 4,000, 5,000 years ago. That's an appreciable fraction of the 26,000 years they had a different pole star than the North Star. Right. So in recorded history, civilizations have had different pulsars, and only right now is it what we're calling Polaris.
Chuck Nice
Wow. Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
There's nothing magical or permanent about it.
Chuck Nice
Wow. It's like being in Menudo.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Does anyone under 50 even know what that reference is?
Chuck Nice
No, they have no idea what I'm talking about right now. But for those of you who don't know, Menudo was a boy band, and they just kept swapping out members, one of which was Ricky Martin.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Oh, I forgot about that.
Chuck Nice
That's right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. So Menudo was not. Not a set of names.
Chuck Nice
Right?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
It was a concept.
Chuck Nice
It was a concept.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes. Yes.
Chuck Nice
The members, as they. As they would age out, they'd be like 18. Age out.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That's what it was.
Chuck Nice
Yeah. Sorry, Manuel, your time is up. You gotta go, bro.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
You are now a man. You must join the man band instead of the boy band.
Chuck Nice
Can't be the boy band anymore.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah.
Chuck Nice
So that's pretty wild.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yeah. So the North Star is a concept, and sometimes you won't have one when it's sort of between other two stars. We're not gonna have a North Star.
Chuck Nice
That's dope. I got it. I love it. That is the most interesting thing about the North Star is that the North Star. One, is not the North Star, and two, it ain't even. It's not even gonna be there. It's not even gonna be there in a few thousand years.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And it's not even in the top 40.
Chuck Nice
And it's not even top 40. 40. You know, that's.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yep.
Chuck Nice
That's pretty wild. All right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
That is totally wild. Now, north stars, there's one other thing.
Chuck Nice
It's the Con man of all stars.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Don't blame. No, don't blame the star itself. Okay?
Kennedy Space Center Announcer
You fraud.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
I got one more thing.
Chuck Nice
The North Star is a fraud. Go ahead.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
I got one more thing. You ready?
Chuck Nice
All right. All right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
One of the consequences of the precession is that the sun is in a different part of the sky at the same time of the year. In other words, right now. Pick a month. Okay.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's pick October.
Chuck Nice
Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
And so October, astrologically, the sun is moving through library. Okay, well, the precession of the Earth, the wobble over the 26,000 years, will systematically put the sun in a different constellation in the month of October.
Chuck Nice
Right.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Okay. So the entire zodiac rotates through the calendar.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
In fact, when the zodiac was codified two and a half thousand years ago. Wait a minute. That's like 1 12th of 26,000. Oh, my gosh. So is October still the month for Libra? No, the sun was in library 2000 years ago in October. All of that has shifted. And so if you thought you were Libra, you're actually Scorpio right now.
Chuck Nice
And that's when the sun gets all sexy.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
I didn't know you were fluent in this. So the zodiac people, the astrologers, still describe the sun being in these various constellations as they were mapped out 2,200 years ago. Between 2000 and 2400 years ago. And so if you're. It's Cancer, Scorpio, Gemini. You would expect the sun to be in that constellation the day you were born. It was 2,200 years ago.
Chuck Nice
Oh, man. That is.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So it is not today. It's all shifted. And they don't really. They're not really forthcoming about that.
Chuck Nice
No, because if they were, then all of astrology would be bull crap. That is. Oh, man.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Oh, not only that. Not only that, the zodiac. The sun in the zodiac actually passes through a 13th constellation. It's called Ophiuchus.
Chuck Nice
All right. God bless you.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Ophiuchus and Ophiuchus.
Chuck Nice
Ophiuchus. Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
In fact, the sun spends more time in Ophiuchus than it does in Scorpius. Okay, so if you thought you were Scorpio, you were probably Ophiuchon. And all Scorpios and Ophiuchens are currently Librans.
Chuck Nice
Wow.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
I just thought I'd put that out there.
Chuck Nice
I just want to know, where does that leave Cancer? Because that's what I am. Okay.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Oh, you're Cancer.
Chuck Nice
Yeah, I'm a Cancer.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
So Cancer is one of the lamest constellations ever constructed in the night sky.
Chuck Nice
Damn.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
There's like five stars and they have like a crab with claws and it's a crustacean. It's like, what were you smoking? What opium was working in your system? Them to say, oh, let's call that a crab.
Chuck Nice
Man, you just. I can't believe this. It's like one, I got a lousy constellation. Two they made.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Plus those stars aren't very bright.
Chuck Nice
And they're not. Okay. I got a lot. If you ask.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
If you ask. Astrologers say there are 12 prominent constellations in the sky. No, they're not. There's like three that kind of look like what they're supposed to.
Chuck Nice
I got a lousy dim constellation. They made me into a. A stupid bottom feeder crab. And on top of that, I'm a festering malignancy. So.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Yes. Which they named after crabs, right? Yes.
Chuck Nice
Oh, gosh. Oh, man.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Cancer.
Chuck Nice
Is it too late to be a Sagittarius? Where's Cancer now?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
I gotta. I don't know.
Chuck Nice
I don't.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Keep it. I haven't memorized that. I'll come back to you on another episode. Okay. All right. We gotta call it quits.
Chuck Nice
There.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Just to round out everything you didn't need to know about the North Star and its brethren. Very cool startalk explainers Neil DeGrasse Tyson. Keep looking up.
Chuck Nice
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StarTalk Radio
Episode: "Things You Thought You Knew – Your Zodiac is Wrong"
Host: Neil deGrasse Tyson
Co-host: Chuck Nice
Release Date: July 28, 2026
In this lively and humor-filled edition of StarTalk’s “Things You Thought You Knew,” Neil deGrasse Tyson and comedian Chuck Nice tackle persistent astronomical myths and misunderstandings. They riff on time dilation in Einstein’s theory of relativity, the real mechanics behind spacecraft gravity assists, the truth about the North Star, and why, due to precession, your zodiac sign may not be what you think it is. The hosts blend popular science with quick, comedic repartee—dispelling common misconceptions and dropping surprising truths about our place in the universe.
Final Quote:
"Keep looking up." – Neil deGrasse Tyson (57:20)
For listeners and learners: This episode is a treasure trove of “wait, what?!” moments—an unmissable myth-busting journey through space and time, hosted with wit, clarity, and the occasional sharp jab at cosmic misconceptions.