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Stay Paid Podcast
How to Lead 40,000 Agents Without Losing Balance | Chris Kelly, CEO of HomeServices of America
00:38:58
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- [00:05]
A
Welcome to Stay Paid, your number one sales and marketing podcast, on a mission to help you close more deals, keep more clients, and build the life of freedom you're working towards. But that can only happen if you're willing to take action today. My name is Josh Dyke, Chief Marketing Officer here at Reminder Media. As always, joined by Luke Acrey, president of Reminder Media. With us today, Chris Kelly. Chris is the President and Chief Executive Officer of Home Services of America and the nation's premier provider of residential real estate services. With more than two decades of experience, Chris joined Home Services of America in 2007 and has had several leadership roles, including serving as president as CEO of Abby Halliday Williams True, and Dave Perry Miller Real Estate. Chris, welcome to Stay Paid. Thank you so much for being here.
- [00:47]
B
It's awesome to be with you guys. Thanks so much for the invite. Really appreciate it.
- [00:50]
C
So we have a legend on the podcast. You really are a legend in the space. I don't know if anybody's told you that or not, but top 200 for sure. And in real estate influencers. And I'm just so excited to be able to pick your brain on where the industry's headed. But I want to start off with a selfish question because, you know, I'm trying to balance Reminder Media. I'm trying to balance, you know, I have two kids, young kids at this point, trying to balance all the other businesses we're doing in real estate and then also my personal life and just staying fit in my faith and all this stuff. And, you know, I was just reading up on you and there's two things I've heard throughout the industry. I've met a lot of people. You know, we've interviewed Gino, Alan Dalton. We've connected in similar circles. But I've never had the privilege of meeting you, Chris, But I've heard some incredible things about you. One thing that has stayed true in all the people is that you're an incredible leader. And when I was reading up on you, I also learned, okay, you have kids too. You're also doing these triathlons, which is like, mind boggling to me. I think you ran like 26 miles and you biked 112 miles and I don't even know what you swam, but something like that. You're leading too far. Ye, exactly. You're leading this massive organization in real estate, multiple companies underneath the brand. How do you balance that all? How do you lead well in all of those areas? Because your reputation precedes you. People have said you're an incredible Leader, how do you balance that? How do you lead?
- [02:13]
B
Well, yeah, it's a great question, and it's very nice of folks to say that. And someone said this once, and it really resonated with me and I've. And it stuck with me, which is if you're seeking balance as an entrepreneur, as a business leader, like anyone who's in the sales organizations, like you all assist with trying, balance is almost kind of a fruitless cause. And someone said what you're trying to find is harmony, right? So instead of, you know, work life balance, you're looking for work life harmony. And that allows that pendulum to swing in different ways at different times. And so that really kind of relieved, like, almost like a pressure valve release for me where, like, okay, I didn't have to keep it in these neat percentages where it's 50, 50 or a third or third or third, whatever it may be, that it can fluctuate. So there were times over the last, let's say, year and a half, like as we went through, like the massive real estate litigation, you know, my harmony was. Was leaning towards. I was really involved on the work side during that period of time. You know, lots of evenings and weekends I was spending, you know, still having to have the computer out and working. There's other times when things are a little bit more relaxed and it's just kind of a normal flow and it allows you to spend more time on the family side and maybe your hobby side that keeps your mentally, you know, acuity going. And so I think that's helped me just compartmentalizing it that way is that I'm not striving to seek some type of percentage balance, that it's a harmony. And harmony can look different month to month, season to season, even day to day at times. And so I love that this past week, I got to go spend dad's weekend with my oldest daughter at college, right. And. And I really got to put work away for. For a couple of days, which was nice. And then you come back and you. You recalibrate and you kind of lean back in the other way for a couple of days to balance it back out. But that's. That word harmony, to me was. Was really great. As opposed to balance.
- [03:55]
C
Yeah, I love that because I have not found it possible to really have an even balance. You know, I've tried probably in my younger years, I tried a lot more. And it's just like almost eat you alive almost, because then you have the guilt. It's like, oh, gosh, I'm not Doing as much and then you're trying to be even versus seeing it as seasons. You know, I'm curious because you went through such a hard season. You got, I feel like you guys got the roll into the, the deal too. Even though the whole commission law thing was terrible, you know, for a lot of brands. I feel like you guys really got hammered there. How did you, how do you let those go? How do you lift that? Like, for me, I would get, I kind of get angry with things. It's just like I feel like it's not right or it's unfair, you know, and you know, we don't have to go into the whole litigation of the lawsuit. But I'm just curious, like, how do you mentally just not let that affect you? Let it go, learn from it, move forward with a positive attitude.
- [04:47]
B
That's a great question. And it's. I wouldn't say that it was easy because, you know, we certainly were somewhat targeted because of our parent entities. Right, right, exactly. Of right. Being part of a certain parent structure gives you more resources than others. And it's like it doesn't work that way. But what we did, and this really helped me and we did it for our team. We had an in person May leadership meeting. We brought all the leaders from all of our operating companies together in May and we brought in a gentleman who had climbed Everest. And if you haven't seen this show on Netflix, there's a great show on Netflix where the earthquake hits while people are on Everest, the Nepal earthquake and you're stranded there. And what he talked about because like, look, we had had our lessons in resiliency. Like we went through two years where everyone got our lessons in resiliency. What we wanted to talk about was how do you pivot out of that, right? How do you take that and then move on from crisis? And it was a really good lesson of what he kind of brought to, which was like, look, we were here to summit. It's not going to happen. So now you reprioritize about what the next best thing is. And so what we really talked about was if you live yourself in crisis mode as an organization or as a person for an extended period of time, it just creates a host of issues, right? Burnout, health issues, the organization suffers from it. So we really made a conscious effort of saying we are turning the page on the last couple years. We're now looking forward. We're going to take the lessons learned and the silver linings that came out of that challenging period. And we're going to focus on that part moving forward. But you almost had to, like, like, literally, consciously and physically turn the page. And we did it as a team together, right? We brought in somebody who could kind of put some perspective on things, right? Like, look, this was really challenging over the last two years, but we didn't go through an earthquake. Earthquake while sitting on Mount Everest, right? It could have been a lot worse. And so I think that helped us all mentally turn the page and be like, look, we will only suffer the longer we're continuing to look backwards as opposed to looking forward.
- [06:41]
C
Isn't it amazing, though, how perspective is such a powerful tool to get you in the right mindset? Because oftentimes we have the victimhood mentality instead of the victor mentality, as the saying goes. And the only way to get yourself out of victimhood sometimes is actually to take a step back and get perspective to go, hey, it's actually not as bad as you think. It could be worse. I know it sounds terrible, but it's like almost imagining the worst that it could be to trigger what I think is gratitude, because then you have gratitude, and then that gratitude puts you into the right mindset to be able to move forward. And so maybe it is actually about triggering gratitude when I'm speaking it out loud, but perspective allows you to get that gratitude. Is that what you found when you brought in the Mount Everest person and that whole story?
- [07:26]
B
Yeah. I mean, I think what we do is. And you all know this, right? The high achievers very rarely look behind their shoulder at all their accomplishments. It's always kind of what's next. And what we did was to say, let's take a moment here. And I always love that Mark Twain quote where it's like, the rumors of my death have been greatly exaggerated. And I said, let's take a minute and just pause and think about what we have all done over the last five years, right? Like from COVID to where are we going to sell a house again? And then it took off like a rocket ship. And even that had stressors involved with it when the market was going crazy. And. And then as fast as it went up, it was turned off like a spigot. Then we had the real estate litigation through settlement, and then we had all these rule changes that happened to our industry. But we're all still here. We're still standing, right? Every single one of these things could have knocked, you know, a normal person out, a normal enterprise out. But we're still here. We're still standing. So just take a minute to Appreciate what you've come through over the last five years to kind of say, look, we're still on solid footing here. That gives us a great way to move forward going into the future. And again, I love the fact that entrepreneurs and sales folks are always looking for the next thing. But, yeah, you want to just. Just glance over your shoulder every once in a while just to appreciate what you have accomplished, to give you that confidence as you move forward.
- [08:37]
A
Yeah. How do you see. So Home Services, obviously one of the largest, you know, organizations. Like, how do you see that positioning in. And in terms of, like, the competition, who do you see as the real competition for your brand, for your agents in the space?
- [08:52]
B
Yeah. So, you know, a couple things that we're seeing right now is anytime that you. My perception has been anytime that you see antitrust efforts applied to an industry, you actually get the inverse and you start seeing consolidation. Right. So if you think of airlines and the railroads and media, Telecom. Right. Every time antitrust would come in, whether it's through regulators or through just legal actions, you start seeing consolidation. And we've certainly see that in our industry over the last six months. And so what you're kind of seeing is a race to duplicate what the foundational DNA of home services has always been, which is this whole idea of, like, let's give the consumer everything they need in one place to buy or sell real estate. And physically, we've done that really well over the years. Right. You walk into a real estate office. I have my real estate professional, I have a mortgage person, I have a title, I have insurance, all physically there. But as you guys know, like, we're in a digital world now. And so what we're trying to create now is how do we take what we've done really good physically and then recreate that in the digital space so the agent and consumer can utilize that where they're meeting today, as opposed to maybe how real estate was done 10, 15 years ago. But when you see what Rocket's doing with the purchase of Redfin and Mr. Cooper, it's all about creating these closed ecosystems. And so one of the things I like to tell sales professionals is you can no longer be agnostic on what other services your consumer, your client is out there using. Doesn't mean you have to force them into things. But in the past, you could say, I don't want to upset the apple cart, so I'll let them go get their mortgage from wherever they want. But if they go get a mortgage that falls into the Mr. Cooper world, which now is the rocket world. Your ability to get that consumer back down the road has become, you know, 100x more difficult because they're going to say, look, hey, you, you list, you get your mortgage through Rocket. Redfin will list your house for 1%. Right. They've said they want to cut out the cost of the, of the real estate professional. And so what we want to tell our solar professionals is really like just you've got to be careful about who you're introducing to your client because it really matters for the future. There are folks that want to protect that relationship you have and there are folks that want to get between you and interfere with that relationship that you have. And so those are some of the competitors. But the other thing I like to point out to our agents, and I was just out in California with our, some of our agents out there and we talked about, you know, consumers rarely neatly compartmentalize their experiences by like, this is my retail, this is my restaurant, this is my magazine, this is my real estate. They just mix it all together. And so really your biggest competitor is the last best place your client received incredible experiences at. So that could have been Disney World, it could have been at a five star restaurant, it could have been on an airline where they were treated amazingly at a resort or something like that. And so really it's a low bar to say I want to be better than the agent across the street. The real bar is I want to be, I want to be better than the last best customer experience that consumer ever got. When you think of it that way, you get inspired in a lot of different ways and stuff. And there's so much more inspiration from outsider industry as opposed to inside.
- [11:51]
C
Oh, I agree with that 100%. We were able to interview and his name is slipping me. It's been a few years now, but he was like one of the experience officers for Disney.
- [11:59]
A
Exactly. You're talking about.
- [12:00]
C
And he wrote the book.
- [12:01]
B
Yeah.
- [12:01]
C
What, what would your business look like if Disney ran your business? And it was pretty insane how they thought about the details. Like even hired people full, like their whole job is to just go up to kids that are dressed up in their superhero outfits or in their princess outfits and freak out and ask the kid for an autograph because they knew that would make the kid feel like a million bucks and it would make the parent feel even better because they're spending all this money.
- [12:29]
A
John Formica was his name.
- [12:31]
C
Yeah, he was, he was amazing. But it is in those little details. It's like where you create Raving fans is in like over delivering. It's like going above what people expected. It's almost like you could phrase it doing the unexpected. So when you do the unexpected, you create raving fans out of people, sometimes negative when you do the unexpected the wrong way. But when you do the unexpected where you've over delivered, you create raving fans. How are you thinking about this whole idea of the closed ecosystem? Is it a tech play for you guys? Is it a really centralized in on the real estate agent to over deliver at the relationship level? How are you trying to navigate this whole world and then you have AI on top of that coming in and where that, where is that going to play in? What are your thoughts there?
- [13:19]
B
It's a little bit, I think the right answer is it's a little bit of everything, right? So when I start with AI, what I'd like to think about it and what I'm hopeful about it is that AI will free up the incredible sales professional to lean into being more human. Right? The things that are detracting me from spending more time with a client and having those human interactions I can offload onto AI that will take care of some. So in the real estate perspective, if I can upload a 200 page inspection report and it's going to tell me, here's the five to 10 things that are most important that we address, you know, in the transaction, great, that saves me an hour. That's an hour more I can be on the phone reaching out to clients and people and talking to them. How are you doing? What's going on in your life? And so from our view, Dana Strandma, who's our general counsel and been with Home Services since day one, I love this analogy. He said, look, home Services has been a really efficient strip mall, mortgage brokerage, title and insurance lined up very conveniently next to each other at that strip mall. But I have to exit and walk down the sidewalk and then re enter the door. Then re enter the door. And what we're really trying to create through the digital process is, is I'm a consumer, I need to go to one place when I'm working with that agent. And these different steps naturally occur at the right time. And that is a digital process and human process combined. And so it's really deconstructing the silos between our business segments so that when that data comes in from a consumer, okay, this is the appropriate time to introduce mortgage. This is the appropriate time to introduce insurance. You know, when I talk to folks who bought a Tesla and they go through that online experience. It's designed very nicely for how they introduce the different things and it's add ons, it's different services, whatever it may be, but it's introduced in a really timely fashion when it would make sense to the consumer. And that's what we're trying to duplicate from a digital perspective. On the home services side, it's just using all of this amazing information we have about our clients. We just haven't connected the dots in a way that really will improve the experience for the consumer as they kind of go through a buy or sale process.
- [15:19]
C
Yeah, that makes so much sense. You guys are at such an advantage because you have all that data and when you connect it and then obviously with the power of AI to see intent and to do correlations of what people need when they need it. I mean that is going to be massive. I know it like Tesla, the first one ever was bought and driven to the house all online buy the Tesla. Like I don't know if you saw this or not. It was like the first ever to happen where the person goes on the site, buys the Tesla. The Tesla drove itself off the lot to the person's house all by itself. So they ordered their the car online. I mean it's insane. So you go, man, is that going to ultimately happen in real estate? Here's the question that everybody says or ask, and I'm curious your take on it, which is will the real estate agent be ultimately replaced by this concept of a super app? And I'll frame it a little differently, maybe they won't be reflect replaced but will be, will they be reduced to the W2 employee that's really just showing a someone a house from where you see the industry headed. Because I know there's a lot of fear and there's a lot of people asking that question out there in the industry right now.
- [16:33]
B
Yeah, I think the only way that happens is if the industry brokerages and real estate professionals allow it to happen to themselves. Meaning they're their own worst enemy. Because what I see from the data is and NAR puts out some really good generational reports every year and they always ask this report, ask this question, you know, how will you conduct your next real estate transaction? And it gives you, you know, laundry list of options to select from. Number one by far, 88% is through a real estate agent. If you break it down by age cohorts, the largest percentage to say yes, I'm going to use a real estate professional. My next transaction are folks that are age 22 to 35 and it's 91%. So actually, the younger the consumer, the more likely they are to say yes. And I'm going to use a real estate professional. And I think the answer to that is the reason why behind that is we have overwhelmed them with information. Right. I mean, if you think about it, if I go online and say Santa Rosa beach real estate, New York real estate, I am going to be washed over with so much information, I don't know how to make sense of it. And so there was a point where we were very fearful of the Internet, right? Like, oh my gosh, if consumers can see listings online, what do they need me to do? You know, I have my MLS book. That's my value. Well, we realized that really wasn't the value proposition. And now knowledge, you know, yes, you need to be knowledgeable. Yes, you need to be an expert. But knowledge is going to become a commodity increase.
- [17:56]
C
Yeah, it's commodity with AI on my.
- [17:58]
B
Phone and just ask chat gbt the question about what's going on, on. And so really it comes down to that relationship side. And when we've seen happen, and you guys might have noticed the same thing, I have siblings that are 10 years younger than me, and I remember sitting with them at a holiday and they, and they were talking about how they used a travel agent on some of their recent travels. And I'm, I'm Gen X. I'm like, what are you talking about? Like, what? And they're like, yeah, you pay them a fee and they create the whole experience for you. It's amazing. And that was like, oh, my God, like, that's what it is. Like that younger generation, they, they, they will pay for value. Right? And so the quote that I love is like, price gets attention, experience creates devotion. And that's what I think. If we as a real estate community continue to lean in and make the process, it's easier to work with us than without us, then I think, I think everything will be fine. What makes me nervous is right now, a lot of the infighting and conversation happening in our industry is about what's best for me and not maybe what's best for the consumer. And I think that's the biggest risk we face. At some point, a consumer could be standing in the middle of the street going, how many people do I have to talk to to find out what's actually for sale in my city anymore? We do that to the consumer. I think that's where there's separation that starts to occur.
- [19:12]
C
Yep. I've Always seen, and I know a lot of people see this too, is like the biggest problem in the real estate industry is the model of the industry is a little bit messed up because of the quality of the agent they allow to do transactions. And everybody knows it, but it's very hard to fix. From the business models of the industry, from the associations to the mls, I mean, we just all know that to be true. And so I think that, I think you're hitting the nail on the head that the biggest risk to the real estate industry for realtors is Realtors themselves. And it's the quality of the service and where they focus their time and how they do it is going to ultimately make or break them. And if you think about it, all that, you know, Rocket is doing is trying to streamline for and focus on the consumer. They're focused on the consumer. Hardcore Zillow focused on the consumer. Hardcore agents are the like. If you think about Rocket, Rocket was a mortgage company and now they're getting into real estate with Redfin because they know, hey, I got to get to consumer. And the real estate agent has the consumer. So the real estate agent is the biggest, best position person right now. But they got to get their eyes off themselves and get their eyes onto the client, which is, you know, classic in the business. I want to switch gears a little bit. You know, this is again, selfish question, but it's just I don't normally get to talk to great leaders like yourself. And I would just love to know, like, how do you structure your day? I think you have like, what is it, 49 or so companies under the brand. And obviously now you're a leader of leaders of leaders of leaders all the way down to the ranks. How do you structure your day to be productive? So when you, when your head hits the pillow, you know you're driving the appropriate things in your business. Because my struggle is like I find myself working, but I'm just like, oh man, am I. Driving is like classic stress revenue generating activities or priority activities. Like I'm struggling to balance and I'm just like a little small dot on the radar of what you lead. How do you balance priorities and lead so many companies and choose where you're going to focus your time?
- [21:25]
B
Yeah, And I think our organizations are very similarly structured in the sense of the number of people that you serve. Right. Because you know, our, our, we have 5,000 employees, but our big workforce, our agents, is about 40,000. And the consumer base you serve is very similarly structured. And so one of the things I Learned was. And my friends at Abby Holiday remember this very clearly. When I first got down there in 2018 was I had this beautiful spreadsheet color coded. I mean, like, all the different. The hundred things that I wanted to get done, you know, as. As we took over there. And I very quickly learned like, wow, this is a waste of time, right? Like, pick two. And so that was kind of my lesson for me was like, look, you can have a hundred great ideas. And Jeff Bezos talks about releasing the work. Like he talks about when he's at Amazon. He had all these ideas, but he was overwhelming his team. They didn't know which. Well, what is the real priority? Because yesterday you were talking about this, today you're talking about that. So I really learned, like, we have to narrow this down and really focus on out of this list, what are the two things? If we got those done in the next six months, it will move the needle the most. Once those two things are done or they're in the process of being done, what are the next two and then bring them up. So I had to learn that lesson the hard way of if you're focused on everything, you're focused on nothing. So it was really kind of prioritizing. And then, and then for me too, I have always been blessed and benefited by surrounding, being surrounded by an incredible team. Those that try to go it alone, those that are worried about from an ego perspective, I need to get the credit for this. I need to make sure everyone knows I'm the one that came up with this idea. I think just make their lives so much harder. And so I rely on my team heavily to determine these are the things that we view are the most, are the priorities, and that's what we want to lean into and that's what's most important. So that kind of sets the priorities of it. And then as I make kind of my. My list for the week of what the things I need to do, I attach them each to those primary goals, right? Because, okay, I do. I admit I'm one of those people that gets a little bit of a dopamine hit when I do a check mark on something. But that also can mean I can make a list of just right and just check mark a bunch of nonsense, right. I try to make sure that my work, my week and work structure is. Is all ratcheting up to whatever we currently have as our two or three big priorities, so that I'm not just filling my day with things that feel good to make a check mark to, but it really didn't make a difference, you know, whatsoever. And then the other thing too is for me, what helps me do that is I have a regular cadence of communication out to our team to hold myself and ourselves accountable for actually making progress on these things so that we don't just talk about it at a meeting and then no one hears about it for six months. Like what's the status with that? I guess it just went away. Like the group projects that we all had to do in school and you know, who's doing what. And so regular communication and accountability around that has really, really benefited me and I think our team as well, so that we know what's going on and what we're focused on.
- [24:16]
C
Does that look like a, like weekly they're chatting in, where they're at or there's a report. I know, like if you follow like Alex Hermos and Layla Hermosi. Layla talks about at the end of every week on a Friday, each of her leaders will send kind of their. I forget exactly what she called it, but it's think of it like a one pager of like here's where we're at towards target type idea. Is it similar to that concept where there are people are chatting in or.
- [24:42]
B
Yeah, it's similar. I have found for our group, you know, the, our operating company leaders, you know, they are all performing at such a high level that what we do is depending on the project. So we have several working groups right now that are individually tasked with, you know, some of these priorities. And what we'll do is twice a month we have the leaders of those working groups, we all get on a call together. They let me know how it's going, what's going on with that, what the latest is. And then once a month we have everybody. So not just them, but the entire team on that working group. They're also on an all hand call and they do the similar thing. That way we're cross pollinating where the other working groups are hearing, oh, they're working on that. And what we found is you think these things are independent. You're like, oh, there's a lot of crossover here. And that's where they learn like, okay, we need to have our own little meeting over here. Make sure what I'm doing and you're doing, we're connecting on that. And so that's how we've kind of structured. We've done it the more formal way in the past. And I felt like it was time to kind of mix it up a little bit because it can become, you know, it can become stale after a point where everyone.
- [25:40]
C
Yeah, like busy work. Exactly. And it also then also can give a lack of trust. Like, it's just such a balance and sometimes you just have to weave away so it's gets fresh again and come back. It's like a little back and forth.
- [25:54]
B
Yeah, yeah. When. When is it a kick in the pants and when is it a pat on the back? Right. And, and, and I've found that for most of our operating company leaders, they, they are operating massive businesses on their own. If you just acknowledge that, hey, if you're in that role, you're. You're a high performer and we're going to treat you like a high performer. And I think that goes a long way.
- [26:13]
C
That, that makes so much sense. Yeah. I think the biggest struggle for myself and I, I would imagine agents listening to this is staying committed to one or two things and saying no to all the other blue ocean opportunities is. I mean, we see this in Legion like crazy. Like, it blows my mind. Like, we've made our living off of trying to help agents connect to their relationships and drive referral and repeat business. This is where the whole concept of the magazine's about and everything else we do. And it's just amazing to me as I talk to more and more agents, how agents will try 20 different legion things but not stick to. To something. And they try. It's like they go referrals and then they jump to Geofarm and then they jump to paid advertising, then they go to Zillow and they slowly spin their way out of the business. And again, it's the same fundamental problem. Luke Acreage suffers with that reminder media. It's just like, oh, man, we're doing this magazine. We're doing really well. Oh, but what about this? This, this is also something we could do. And before I know it, I wake up and I have four things. I'm driving and I'm working 100%, but I'm moving the balls down the field 20 to 25% at best.
- [27:18]
B
It is so difficult, and I think all of us suffer from it because I think all of us are in our roles that we're in, because we are. We get excited by that. We get excited by opportunity, we get excited by ideas. And, and I, and I've, I've. I've shared this, that Steve Jobs so many times. It's like focus is saying no to something that you really, really want to do. And so, so that's how we kind of have to do it like, oh, that is a great idea. And it's not a no, it's a not right now. Right. Like we're going to put it on the list. And there is something therapeutic about having an idea, but determining it doesn't replace one of our current priorities right now. But we are going to write it down. We're going to write it down and we're going to build something around it. But we're going to then say that comes after we all agree that we have fully achieved this or it's in process on its own and we now have the time and resources to pull something back now a new thing up into the priority list. But that is a challenge, I think for all of us. But it's like having a map, right? Like if you don't have that map. And I think that's what helps. If you have written down and you have clearly articulated these are our priorities, whether it's for the quarter, the half year or the full year, or your five year plan or ten year plan. If you have that communicated out and you have it written down, it is easier to say not right now to those other ideas that pop into our head or that come around because you say, look, this is the map we're trying to get from from here to there. And if we keep doing all these different things, we're going to wind out in the middle of the desert and you know, and not know where we're at at that point.
- [28:42]
A
Yeah. What about for the agents on the ground? Like kind of taking that to the next step. Like what are some habits or behaviors that you're seeing that are, that the top performers are doing?
- [28:52]
B
Yeah, I mean, so it's. So that's probably my favorite part about this role and all of my roles I've had with home services is to really kind of sit and listen from some really amazing top real estate professionals out there. And I think the ones that are truly great are the ones that understand what the client, the type of client that they are trying to serve. I think where we as agents, we as brokerages or companies get into problems is when we try to twist ourselves into a pretzel of trying to be like, I want to be the brokerage for everybody. Right. And I want to be an agent for everybody. And it doesn't mean you have to only be in one price point, but it's kind of like, look, Nordstrom's knows who their clientele is. Walmart knows who their clientele is. Target does, you know, Ritz Carlton knows who their Clientele is, I think, as an agent, when, you know, like, this is my bread, but these are the people that I can do excellent work for, and they're the ones that are going to tell others about me. I think those are the ones that are really, really successful. They're not, I think back to Luke, to your point, they're not trying to just jump around like, okay, now I'm going to chase Zillow leads, and now I'm going to do this, and now I'm going to try to get relocation business. Now I'm going to got to go now. I haven't talked to anybody in my sphere for six months. I need to jump back in there. It's the ones that just so, like, this is what works for me, and I'm putting all of my energies there. It's the, it's the truly focused and consistent agents. The ones that I think can always. They're your top performers, and you can do that without having to be in the business all that long. You know, we all see it, right? There's, it's, there's a high turnover rate in our business, but there are always those folks that, like, every year someone joins one of our companies and within a year, they're the rookie of the year. And then all of a sudden, they're just on the top agent list for the rest of their careers because they figure that out pretty quickly where to lean into and where to be consistent.
- [30:32]
C
Yeah, consistency is literally almost the requirement for success. So few agents are able to stay consistent. Oftentimes, it comes down to their mindset. It comes down to their purpose. When you think about, like, attracting the best agents to home services and attracting and trying to develop and coach up these agents, how do you try to, what do you, what do you try to look for in a great salesperson and a great business person? And then how do you try to challenge them to apply themselves? Because we literally said an interview earlier today where we were talking about these new agents. It's just like, you know, the lady was saying, you know, what are you doing? Like, apply yourself. You got to apply yourself. And, you know, my question is, yeah, but how do you get somebody to apply themselves? Because that's all the battle for a broker, owner, and a team leader. So how do you recruit the best agents? What do you look for? And then how do you try to get them to apply their talent?
- [31:30]
B
Yeah, I think, you know, in the past, Mike Frazier, who is the CEO of Reese Nichols for us, and he and I started on the same Day at Reese Nichols in 2007. And, you know, you go through this belief or like, you know, I can spot it, right? Like I can spot somebody who's going to be a great real estate agent by the way they're dressed or the way they do this, way they do that. And what you find is, gosh, I mean, it just covers the map, right? You know, the person that you might have cast off because, you know they were in jeans and a button down or something, you're like, that's not really the look. And then they're just, they go off because that's their clientele, right? And so it's not a look. It's not necessarily feel. There's a. There's a little bit of grit. I mean, part of it is grit, right? Just the person that is not going to get dejected quickly are oftentimes very, very successful in this business. And then the other big mistake that we see happen, that we try to coach out of people that are coming into this business is the syndrome of, I'm getting ready to get ready. If I just do one more thing, then I'll put my name out there. If I just do one more class, then I'll do this, right? The getting ready to get ready is the one that, you know, that kind of delay of action are the ones that I think really kind of end up harming themselves in the long run. What we try to say is, look, our model is to surround you with an amazing team, put that name badge on, go to the grocery store, you know, do all the things. Make sure that everyone in your, in your friends and family and neighbors know you're in this business, ask them to help you. They love you, they want to see you successful. And if, God forbid, the scariest thing that happens is a client calls you up and says, I think I want to list or I want to buy. And you're like, I haven't done this before. We will help you through it, right? We have an entire team built around to do that, right? And so I think it's, it's. You're looking for that kind of. And again, it's hard to test it, you know, to figure out what it is. But it's grit. And then the person that is not going to be paralyzed by getting ready to get ready, that if you say, look, we have equipped you with the right tools, we're not going to throw you out there uneducated to harm clients at all. But when we say, look, you have learned enough, you're prepared for this, you then need to take that step and you got to get out there and do it.
- [33:28]
C
Yeah. So well said, man. So well said. Okay, I got to ask you, this is a classic stay paid podcast question that we ask a lot of guests, but I want to hear your answer. You know, knowing what you know now, what would you go back and tell younger Chris? You know, think about that college age kid, you know, all the experiences you've had, the successes you've had. What. What advice would you give to that person?
- [33:48]
B
I think I would just tell him, because this is a kid that was, you know, graduating from undergrad with an English degree, goes to law school, because, like, what else are you going to do with it, right? If you're not going to be a teacher, I think it would just be. Be open to all the opportunities that you could never predict are going to come your way. You know, coming out of law school, I work for a firm in Kansas City, Thought that would just be my life. I went. My sister, my older sister was a real estate agent with our company in Kansas City, and her and her team were going on a trip to Cabo, and they were taking their broker, their office broker, their office manager with them, and they said, hey, why don't you come along? And so for just kind of randomly went along with them. In 2006, I met the broker, and she's like, you know, we were looking at hiring a lawyer at Reese Nichols and stuff like that. And, you know, and we were kind of the adult, felt like the adult chaperones on this trip. And then that, that one little trip turned into meeting a connection who then connected me with the leaders at Reese Nichols, which then changed my entire trajectory of my professional life, even my personal life, because I met my wife at RE Snickels, you know, and stuff. You know, I was the lawyer that started and started dating employees, right. So. So, yeah, I had to marry her so I wouldn't get in trouble, right. With HR and like, it's those types of things. Like, there's. Wherever you end up in life, you've got to be open to these opportunities that there's no way that you could have ever predicted them five years in the past, even sometimes 10 days in the past. So I would just say, like, be ready to be open to these opportunities that you're not quite sure are going to come along. And when they do come along, lean into them and go quick.
- [35:17]
C
Yeah. So good. Last question. Okay, so you've got to be a huge Kansas City Chiefs fan. I'm assuming yeah, exactly. What do you feel about the Taylor Swift, Travis Kelsey? Is she ruining, you know, the sport for you guys or do you love it? Are you a fan? Are you a Swift?
- [35:35]
B
I'm all in. I'm all in. And this is why, because my, I've got three kids, my oldest in college. My middle daughter is 14 total swifty. And she will actually watch Chiefs games now because there you go. So I'm like, I'm all in for that. That's.
- [35:50]
C
I thought it was so funny how Travis Kelsey opened up this year and he was terrible, but now they're coming alive. So I, I can't wag on him too much, but I was just like, oh, he's doing so bad. I love this because, because I'm not a Kansas City chief fan. But yeah, he's coming alive now. Now they're doing well. I think you guys just destroyed the Raiders, if I'm not mistaken.
- [36:06]
B
My 10 year old son, unfortunately, he. I have passed along all of my neurotic sports fandom on today, which I'm actually quite proud of. It annoys my wife, but I'm very proud of the fact that when we lost the Jaguars on Monday night, he went to bed angry and crying and I was like, yes, I've got another one with me in the house.
- [36:24]
A
Mystery Loves Company. Chris, thank you so much. Really, really honored to have you here on the show today. Before we close out, do you want to let people know how they can connect with you?
- [36:33]
B
Yeah. So, yeah. Chris kelly@homeservices.com and then socials are just my full name that when I'm in trouble with my mom, Christian Kelly on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, all those and so look forward to connecting folks. And Luke and Josh, thank you so much for having me. Honored to be with you guys.
- [36:48]
A
Love it. Thank you so much and thank you all for listening. You can get the show notes, the video and any links that we mentioned in the over@staypay podcast.com and if you enjoyed this episod, we would love to have you go subscribe to our YouTube channel. So YouTube.com reminder media make sure to give this video a thumbs up. Leave us a comment and if you really want to support the show, share this episode with somebody that you know. If you want to get hold of me or Luke, you can email us@podcastremindermedia.com and of course you can find us on social media as well. We are at Stay Paid podcast for this episode of Stay Paid. I'm Josh Dyke.
- [37:19]
C
Guys, I'm Luke Acre. Chris, thank you so much, man. I really appreciate your advice. It did not disappoint. Very, very good. I would encourage everybody listening to this, go, rewind, listen this episode again and again. There's so many golden nuggets. I want to leave you with an action item like we always do because you know, you can listen to things all day but if you don't actually take action, you'll never change your life or your business if you rewind back, right? One of the biggest struggles that I've had in my life in business is trying too many things and not being focused on the main priority. And Chris gave a great tip which I'm actually taking back for myself is going. It's so much easier to say no to the opportunities when you have a plan written down and a target of what you're trying to accomplish in the next quarter, in the next six months, in the next year, even three years, five year, ten year plan. And I want to challenge you this week is at the very least, get your 12 month plan on paper, get your target on paper and then commit to the priority that drives you to that target. Because if you don't find yourself saying no enough, then you're probably not focused enough. Remember, the difference between top producers and mediocre producers in every business is top producers take action. Take action on that today.
- [38:44]
B
Sam.