Output Vs Input (w/ Jake Woolf)

Summary

Staying Alive with Jon Gabrus & Adam Pally

Episode: Output Vs Input (w/ Jake Woolf)

Release Date: February 19, 2026
Guest: Jake Woolf
Producer: SmartLess Media

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Episode Overview

This episode of "Staying Alive" features fashion writer, influencer, and lifewear enthusiast Jake Woolf, who joins hosts Jon Gabrus and Adam Pally for a candid and fun conversation about personal style, fashion’s influence on self-esteem, balancing creativity with content demands, and the realities of being a modern "taste-make," especially in the menswear world. The discussion weaves between lighthearted anecdotes, deep reflections on authenticity, and broader questions about how people approach dressing, creativity, and mental health as part of staying "alive" in every sense.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Spontaneous Guesting and Social Media Connections

• Jake was a last-minute guest, stepping into a podcast slot and a lunch date at the same time.
• The hosts discuss the awkwardness of "knowing" people via Instagram, and the blurred lines between real friendships and digital acquaintances.
  • Notable quote:
    "I feel like I've seen... Now I gotta, like, follow up and just know a little bit more about him for real."
    — Adam, on social media friendships (01:21).

Early Fashion Memories and Personal Style Evolution

• Jake reflects on how, even as a little kid, costumes gave him an early understanding of the link between how he dressed and how he felt or was perceived (03:17–04:25).
  • Jake’s words: "Remembering that feeling...if I wear something that's cool, like, I'll sort of get attention or...people will want to talk to me" (04:09).
• The trio swap stories about their teen style identities—Adam’s skate-and-surf, Jon's grunge, Jake’s J.Crew-infused preppy look (05:08–06:25).
  • Funny moment: Adam dreams aloud of wearing a J.Crew gray roll neck sweater to impress the "Belles" of school (09:14–09:49).

Social Pressures and Self-Expression as a Young Man

• Adam and Jon open up about the judgments and sometimes homophobic taunts directed at "stylish" boys in their eras, with Jake admitting it was tough, especially commingled with being a musical theater kid (14:22–15:14).
  • "If you liked anything too much that you would get called [gay]...It didn't matter." — Adam (15:25)
• The guys agree that having the ability to express yourself authentically through clothes is important for confidence and mental health.

The Work of a Modern Fashion Writer/Influencer

• Jake shares the realities of content creation—balancing exclusives, picking the right format (video or writing), and resisting the relentless push from platforms for "more" (20:58–22:58).
  • "The nature of Instagram wants you to feel that way. Like, hey, cool post, where's the next one? And they're like, wake up Jake, it's time for another post." — Jake (22:13)
• Discussion explores the joy (and minor exhaustion) of being asked for style advice at parties or online, and how this compares to the classic “tell me a joke” request for comedians (26:06–27:56).
  • "It's like being a doctor at a party...There's a man, The Rock, is in the front. Does anyone have size 15?" — Jon (27:03)

Authenticity: Dressing for Yourself vs. Dressing for the Internet

• Jon explains his journey from seeing clothes as a chore to embracing style that feels authentic—citing his love for "Tevas or some whack shit like that," and the liberating advice from Adam to wear what feels good, not just what's "in" (24:52–25:45).
  • “If you like bright colors and that’s what you want to wear...that’s going to do better for you than anything that is quote unquote stylish.” — Adam (24:56)
• The crew grapples with the reality that even as a "taste-make," Jake must strike a balance between personal taste, audience expectation, and the exploitative "endless novelty" grind of social platforms.

Mental Health and "Staying Alive" Rituals

• Jake’s main wellness strategy: Therapy. He talks openly about weekly sessions, how his therapist is always available, and the importance of keeping mental health routines flexible (29:28–30:16).
  • “A big one is therapy. I do therapy to stay alive.” — Jake (29:38)
• Walking—especially in Central Park for Jake, and hiking for Adam and Jon in LA—is praised as both exercise and a potent mental reset (32:24–34:11).
  • “You sort of hit a groove and just mentally...you could be listening to a podcast...taking [the dog] through Central Park...good for the body and the mind.” — Jake (32:30)

Navigating Output vs. Input: The Creative Cycle

• The hosts and Jake discuss the dangers of too much "output" (daily posting, viral chasing), and not enough "input" (living, learning, experiencing).
  • "We're kind of talking about output versus input at this point...at some point you have to be putting fuel in there." — Adam (39:27–40:09)
• They reflect on the ways some creators lose their original passion, shifting from authentic voice to whatever content grabs attention (40:09–40:34).
• Jake prefers Substack as a more sustainable, direct connection to a genuinely interested audience, not shortcut by algorithms or viral trends (37:29–38:32).

Trends, Tastes, and the State of Men’s Fashion

• Jake champions the rise of small independent designers and responsible consumption, highlighting favorites like Evan Kinora and boutiques like Venspace (42:12–43:06).
• There's a shared satisfaction in supporting local crafts and knowing precisely who benefits—a more ethical, rewarding shopping experience (44:16–45:00).
  • "For me, shopping...feels better to be like, oh, I'm, you know, giving money to this guy who has this one store in Brooklyn, and then in turn, he's buying clothes..." — Jake (44:42)

Role Models and the Career Arc

• Jake underscores the importance of designers like Aaron Levine, who model the path from working at big brands to forging independent, authentic creative identities.
  • "He seems to be nailing it on all fronts...the way that he's been able to...go out on his own and build his own path is also something that...I really admire." — Jake (46:20)
• Adam and Jon point out the parallels with their own comedy/entertainment careers: grinding in obscurity before gaining autonomy to create work true to their own sensibilities (50:08–50:46).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Social Media Friendships:
  “If I ever run into the guy, I’m going to feel uncomfortable.” — Adam (01:50)

• On the Ritual of Personal Style:
  “Remembering that feeling...if I wear something that's cool, like, I'll sort of get attention or...people will want to talk to me.” — Jake (04:09)

• On Parental (and Societal) Judgments in Youth:
  “If you liked anything too much that you would get called [gay]...It didn't matter.” — Adam (15:25)

• Content Creator Struggles:
  “The nature of Instagram wants you to feel that way... Like, hey, cool post, where's the next one?...They’re like, wake up Jake, it's time for another post.” — Jake (22:13)

• On Finding Style Confidence:
  "If you like bright colors and that's what you want to wear and you feel good in it, then that's going to do better for you than anything that is quote unquote stylish." — Adam (24:56)

• The Centrality of Walking:
  "You just sort of hit a groove...walk through Central Park...good for the body and the mind." — Jake (32:30)

• On Output vs. Input:
  “We’re kind of talking about output versus input at this point...at some point you have to be putting fuel in there.” — Adam (39:27)

• On Small Brands and Conscience:
  “It just feels like, for me, shopping...feels better to be like, oh, I’m…giving money to this guy who has this one store in Brooklyn, and then in turn…he’s buying clothes from this one guy in Queens making the clothes.” — Jake (44:42)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• The Spontaneous Guest and Social Media Friendship — 00:47–02:14
• Early Fashion, Style in Youth, and High School Stories — 03:17–06:25
• Influence and Confidence: From “Uncool” to Style Inspiration — 10:03–10:56
• Content Creation, Publishing, and Mental Exhaustion — 20:58–22:58
• Authenticity: How to Dress for Yourself — 24:52–25:45
• Therapy and Walking as Wellness Habits — 29:28–34:11
• Output vs. Input in Creative Work — 39:27–40:34
• Men’s Fashion Now: The Indie Designer Wave — 42:12–45:00
• Mentors, Models, and Building a Career as a Taste-Maker — 45:41–49:44
• Closing Reflections on Passion as the Key to Health — 54:41–56:18

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Closing Thoughts

Gabrus and Pally wrap the episode with reflections on passion—how having a genuine, sustaining interest (in clothes, comedy, neuroscience, or anything) keeps you "alive." For Jake Woolf, style is both self-expression and self-care; for the hosts, that lesson stretches well beyond menswear.

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Summary by PodcastSummarizer.AI
For listeners new and old, this episode delivers laughter, sharp cultural criticism, and valuable life advice—whether you're getting dressed, recording a podcast, or just taking a walk.

Transcript

[John Gabris]

Smart.

[Adam Pally]

Last me.

[John Gabris]

We don't do intros or anything, so, like. Okay, it's already starting.

[Adam Pally]

And we have people that are constantly moving around.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. This is like a test for your blood pressure. These guys, they're not fixing things. Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

Are we doing a. Like an mri?

[John Gabris]

Yeah, this is an open mri. You stand in the middle. We're actually capturing your image.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah. We're gonna scan you and we're gonna use you as an AI guest for every episode. So if you read this sentence here.

[Jake Wolf]

That'S what I signed out there. Yeah.

[John Gabris]

That's the least of it, pal.

[Adam Pally]

We're in New York.

[John Gabris]

In New York.

[Adam Pally]

I went, you know, it's a town. To meet a friend for lunch.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

You have plans to meet a friend for lunch. And we also happen to have an empty slot in our booking schedule.

[John Gabris]

In our booking schedule. And I said.

[Adam Pally]

And our. Our crew was so gracious to be like, it. We'll work two for one.

[John Gabris]

We're going to get out at the same time. We would have.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, we just would just talk the whole time.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. The intros and outros would have been.

[Adam Pally]

Longer, but your buddy Jake was coming over lunch. You're like, why don't you come an hour earlier and be on our podcast?

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

I'm so happy to have gotten.

[John Gabris]

Yeah, it was gracious and informative and looked cool as all hell.

[Adam Pally]

I do a dude I know via your Instagram. You know like, when sometimes, like, someone shows up on your friend's Instagram enough that you're like, all right, well, I should know who Jake Wolf with two o's is.

[John Gabris]

I often consider those people friends in my mind. Dude.

[Adam Pally]

That's part of what it was, too, is like, I feel like I've seen. Now I gotta, like, follow up and just know a little bit more about him for real. And then you follow them on ig and you're like. Now you're like, hey, man, congrats on the baby, or whatever. And they're like, who are you? And you're like, I'm Adam's friend.

[John Gabris]

I've done that to, like, celebrities.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah. I follow Ike Barinholtz because I started to know too much about his life. And I'm like, if I ever run into the guy, I'm going to feel uncomfortable.

[John Gabris]

Oh, yeah, no, I've done. I've done that with a couple of actresses.

[Adam Pally]

Do you know Gianna Michaels?

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Stop following her on Only Fans.

[Adam Pally]

I had to stop following her because I got too into her personal life and not because my wife saw the Credit card.

[John Gabris]

She actually. Actually, it wasn't. The state said I had to stop following her.

[Adam Pally]

Now, this doesn't have to be part of Jake's intro for his own sake, but I just want to discuss some of the only fans. Models who are mostly just posting trailers for things you also have to buy is kind of frustrating. I'm paying to get in there.

[John Gabris]

Classic strip club model. I mean, only fans that you have to go in with. Strip club mentality.

[Adam Pally]

Right. You're paying the COVID And then you're also going to have to pay $12 to see this Peggy video.

[John Gabris]

Beef with only fans is the Apple watches. Too many Apple watches. It's just like, the most unsexy thing. It's not what I want.

[Adam Pally]

You're a watch guy.

[John Gabris]

It doesn't matter. I don't like seeing them on normal people, but I excuse it if they're. If it's like, in the working class. Like, the last thing I want to.

[Adam Pally]

See is a performer who's got, like. Who's also keeping track of their heart rate and another subscriber. Yeah, Doggy style getting emailed. Doggy style is when the email is.

[John Gabris]

Delivered directly to your ass.

[Adam Pally]

All right, Jake, Wil, everybody. We're doing it wolf style.

[John Gabris]

So when did you realize that that feeling good about yourself had to do with how you looked and your clothing?

[Jake Wolf]

Oh, super young. I mean, I was a kid who, like, really enjoyed dressing up in costumes as, like, a little kid. And, you know, I would wear a Superman costume, like, every day. And so, like, were you, like, one.

[Adam Pally]

Of those kids that the teacher had to be like, okay, Superman, let's see your homework. You were, like, identified as a. Like, you came home and changed into.

[Jake Wolf]

I think it was like, it was more like preschool age. So I don't think there was any homework at the time. So it was. People were pretty, like, tolerant of me wearing, like, a Superman costume to daycare. Like, but like, even just like, wearing like a. Like a knight costume, like a knight in shining armor costume, like, to the mall and then being. And like, getting a lot of attention. I mean, it probably was also somewhat, like, damaging to my psyche. Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

Chicken or egg.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, exactly. You know, just being like, oh, but. But just remembering, like, literally remembering that feeling of being a little kid and being like, oh, if I wear something that's cool, like, I'll sort of get attention or. Or people will want to talk to me or all those kinds of things. But, like.

[John Gabris]

But it's like. It's like costume, right?

[Jake Wolf]

It's like, for sure, but I think, like, in some. To some degree, like, even as you get older, you know, like, and you start discovering other things. Like, you know, and then I. I'd say, like, real clothing, you know, is probably more like in high school getting into like, Menswear 1.0, like, Lumberjack Workwear style.

[John Gabris]

You in, in high school, were you a. Like, what was your thing? Because I feel. And we're. We're way older than you, so like, there was. It was a little bit like.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, let's go through our high school things. Yeah, that's really. That's really intriguing because I was like, skate and surf. Because it was like late 90s, so I was in like airwalks, Rusty quicksilver, billabong, exclusively. And I have not changed. Right.

[John Gabris]

And I was. And I was like alternative grunge kid. So I had like ripped jeans and Doc Martens and like a flannel around the waist thermal under a T shirt.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

And I also. Baby, I also haven't changed that much.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, totally.

[John Gabris]

But, like, what were you. What was your thing?

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, I mean, I would say probably the most prevalent thing was like, I discovered J. Crew in high school and so I just like went to the mall and literally just like bought and do stuff at J. Crew. Like, I.

[John Gabris]

Huge.

[Jake Wolf]

Well, yeah, I remember.

[Adam Pally]

I remember literally, like Pacific Sonwear to me.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

Was how much I stood out in high school just by being like a guy who wore a peacoat to high school. That was like, Right.

[John Gabris]

You know, you were a big peacock guy.

[Adam Pally]

You had to be. Peacocks were big in the 90s and.

[Jake Wolf]

Early, like, everyone, like everyone in my high school just wore like a North Face puffer coat. And then so, like, for this guy to show up with like a collar popped on, a pico and like a button up shirt and like chinos and desert boots, like, which were like, all from J. Crew. But like, we're all very much inspired by, you know, like some like the classic menswear images that you're seeing online at the time, like Paul Newman and those types of figures from back in the day. And just like discovering those for the first time being like, I want to emulate that. And then J. Crew sort of being like this spot.

[John Gabris]

To the closest thing that you could get your hands on to.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, exactly. Because at the time, you know, like, I'm. I'm from Connecticut and so like, the closest just I could come into the city to, like. And I did eventually, like, you know, come into the city to get like, very specific things that I had read In GQ magazine, Your bridge and tunnel.

[Adam Pally]

Cool.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, exactly.

[Adam Pally]

And we're the tri State area right here. Connecticut Jersey.

[John Gabris]

All the recycling bins, all.

[Adam Pally]

The different styles of trash.

[Jake Wolf]

You could be all the people who come to the city to, like, be cool for a day. You have to go back to their.

[Adam Pally]

Reality, go to a next game and have Thai food for the first time.

[Jake Wolf]

For me, it was like, to go to, like, ESPN Zone.

[Adam Pally]

I'm gonna go see Beauty and the Beast on Broadway with my mom, your.

[John Gabris]

Mom, and your aunt.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, yeah, real cool.

[Adam Pally]

Day, 5:00pm Huge.

[Jake Wolf]

Possible.

[John Gabris]

Yeah, your mom's like, your aunt Flo is the one that's gonna give you culture.

[Adam Pally]

We're gonna go see Beauty and the Beast.

[John Gabris]

Beauty and the Beast on Broadway. You see, the story is she can't love him cause of the way he looks.

[Adam Pally]

Hey, I need to get some desert boots from J. Crew. I could fuck Bell, too.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, for me, it was like, ESPN Zone. And like, hell, yeah. I got a baseball glove at Modell's when I was, like, in seventh grade in the city. And it was. It was such a. I got made fun of. It was such a dumb glove. I don't even want to get into it. Try angel stuff for your tushy.

[John Gabris]

It's made by Angels.

[Adam Pally]

Soft and strong.

[John Gabris]

Budget friendly.

[Adam Pally]

The choice is simple.

[John Gabris]

Pick up a pack today.

[Adam Pally]

Angel Soft.

[John Gabris]

Soft and strong.

[Jake Wolf]

Circle.

[John Gabris]

You mentioned something that I want to ask you about, which is getting made fun of. And like, you said you were one of the only stylish kids in your high school, which is not surprising. Kids in high school are notoriously so unstylish. In fact, I was on a flight recently where there was, like, a high school baseball team on the flight with me and my family. And they. All the, like, young kids, haircuts now are wildly bad. They're all, like, pushed forward in this, like, booth.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's, like, very short on the sides and back, but then, like, there's a lot of just weight in the front.

[John Gabris]

Yeah, it's like, all, like, third year Jimmy Butler. Like, all these kids. Like, it's like, really?

[Adam Pally]

I think I'm curious because we didn't have Instagram or stuff to be like, this is who I want to dress like. It was, like, half what your mom would buy for you and half what someone, one of the cool kids in school would have.

[John Gabris]

Right?

[Adam Pally]

Or a store that you liked. Like, when you would go to J. Crew, you'd see on the. Because all I ever wanted, and I finally got it when I was in Junior high was the gray roll neck J. Crew sweater like 1998. I got that.

[John Gabris]

Why was the gray the best color in that? Because that gray is never the best color. But in that roll neck sweater, gray is the best, you know? You know it's the best. I just saw the row do a thing with like a roll neck sweater.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, it's gray.

[Adam Pally]

There was a kid on my swim team who, who had a very cool outfit and I. He went to a different school. So I went and bought the exact. And it was orange Abercrombie and Fitch track pants and a gray roll neck sweater. He wore that fire fit and I was just like. And I just was like, I went home and like, I was like, mom, this is what I want for Christmas. Like, this is what Kevin wore to swim practice. I mean, I still like talented Mr. Ripley.

[John Gabris]

Weird when you showed up and you.

[Adam Pally]

So I could finally fuck his wife dress just like he was the coach.

[Jake Wolf]

Kevin, the original influencer, though.

[John Gabris]

Yes.

[Adam Pally]

He influenced me by accident, one person at a time. He had zero followers. But.

[John Gabris]

Well, isn't that. It's. That's such a nice full circle thing that you go from this guy, this kid in high school who's like made fun of for it.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

And then now you are like a, A influencer. You are in the most positive sense of the word. Like, I feel like that word gets thrown around pejoratively, but it is like you're, you're a style, a taste, a taste maker.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Like people look to you. My son is an enormous fan. And like he, he talks and like that's. He. He's dresses better because he reads like you're like denim under, you know, a price point column. And like that is information that a young kid, like, he's a fan that's. He's 13. That's wild to me. But it's cool for sure. And so like that must feel amazing to you that you are now the, like an arbiter of taste like that.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, it definitely, it definitely feels good. And it feels, I would say it feels good to just like be passionate about something that from that age of being a teenager and then actually being able to like parlay it into like what I get to do on a daily basis. Yeah. Is like. And I mean it really started with just like, I just really liked, you know, seeing product in person and like trying stuff on and, and you know, experiencing, like seeing. Seeing a product online or like in a magazine and going and actually like seeing it in person and trying it on and Just experiencing it in that way. And, you know, I pretty much still do that to this day. I just now, like, film it is.

[John Gabris]

And you get paid for it and.

[Jake Wolf]

I get paid for.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, I mean, we can relate. I've been doing dumb bits on the bus since I was in, like, second grade.

[Jake Wolf]

Exactly.

[Adam Pally]

Doing dumb bits on microphones that say. Serious.

[John Gabris]

A sketch show in high school.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah. I was our public access. We had a public access show in high school called the Hammerheads.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. We had. The. More. We had the morning show, which. No AM Wired. You're not the morning.

[Adam Pally]

You're still suing.

[John Gabris]

Yeah, well, I'm suing the cast.

[Adam Pally]

That's where the money is.

[John Gabris]

Yeah, for sure. They knew what they were doing.

[Jake Wolf]

What was surprising about what you said before, though, is how you said that you saw high schoolers and they still were dressed poorly. Because I think you were getting at. Is like, they have so much more information now than. Than we did. And, you know, someone like your son can know what all these cool brands are like, that I would have had no idea at the age of 13, right.

[Adam Pally]

At the Roosevelt Fuel Mall in Long Island. I did not know totally.

[Jake Wolf]

Or wasn't in the East Bay catalog. I had no idea, like, what shoes and stuff were out there.

[Adam Pally]

But you see, the young kids, like, I feel like there's a lot of, like, cosplaying as, like, a style. Here's an example I use. I went to my nephew's Little League game. Now, again, this is Long Island Little League. So it's a little different vibe than I'm assuming in most of America. But every single one of the kids had, like, neoprene sleeves on chains on the outside of their thing. Half of them had mohawks or, like, they all dressed like Aaron Judge. And because they see these guys, they got eye black. They got like, you know, a. The Tommy John sleeve. Gloves, sliding gloves, cle. Like these expensive bats. And I'm like, oh, that. I. I didn't have anything to aspire to. It was like, Bill Romanowski wears the neck collar. I gotta get one of those.

[John Gabris]

It's like Ken Griffey Jr. Wore his fitted hat backwards.

[Jake Wolf]

For me, with basketball, it was the. It was the finger bands Allen Iverson wore that.

[John Gabris]

That was Iverson up. Iverson was a huge change because Iverson, like, obviously the Jordans were a big deal. Like, when Michael was playing, everyone was like, you get the Jordans. But then when Iverson came in and with, like, baggy shorts and tattoos.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

And cornrows and chains and, like, diamonds during the game and stuff, it was.

[Adam Pally]

Like, finally a good A.I.

[John Gabris]

I mean, just compared to the Steven Spielberg movie. But, like, it was like, it was truly a change in fashion to the. Because I think sports is, like, the first thing you get as a kid. In fact, it's like you have access to.

[Adam Pally]

Well, because. And this. When we were growing up, we didn't have that bus footage that athletes like.

[John Gabris]

Oh, no, we just had Andre Agassi. That's cool.

[Adam Pally]

The 70s had Namath with the fur coat on the sideline.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

That, like, that would be iconic in a way. And, like, we didn't have. We had red carpet coverage of celebrities, but, like, not like you do now, where it's like, here's exactly what so and so is wearing.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. You like Joan Rivers.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Which was amazing. And. And joking about it and stuff, but it was, like, less serious. And also, I will say, I don't know if you felt this, but, like, there must have been gay panic associated with people making fun of you, because at the time that. That we grew up to be a. A young kid in fashion, into fashion. I mean, it must have been endless.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, for sure. I mean, it was. I mean, it was that. And also it was like a combination of that. And, you know, I did, like, musical theater in high school.

[John Gabris]

Oh.

[Jake Wolf]

So.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

So, yeah, it was like, that was like, the number one thing. And.

[John Gabris]

You'Re like, no, but that's where the girls are.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah. Like, you know.

[Adam Pally]

You know, you're like. You spend your 20s and 30s doing.

[John Gabris]

Musical theater, and they're like, they're not there anymore.

[Adam Pally]

I think it's more me that they don't like.

[Jake Wolf]

No, that was definitely just a part of the time, for sure. Just being like. Like, you know, into musical theater and dressing well and.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

He also liked girls, though.

[John Gabris]

Right?

[Jake Wolf]

People were, like, skeptical of that.

[Adam Pally]

If you liked anything too much that you would get called.

[John Gabris]

Yeah, it didn't matter.

[Adam Pally]

I was like a movie buff. And my parents were like, I think Jonathan might be gay. Exactly.

[John Gabris]

No, completely. They would be. Yeah. Like, even sports, they would be like, Adam knows every stat of. I think something's wrong with him. You know, like.

[Adam Pally]

Well, when I joined the swim team, I played football, and I was like, now my dad likes me. Then I joined the swim team. My whole family's like, when I quit.

[John Gabris]

The basketball team, it was like, they put a vigil. Don't quit. I got caught.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah. I also quit playing football after my freshman year because that was because I broke my collarbone. And I was like, that's Enough of that.

[Adam Pally]

That's a good one. To shut it down.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

Three more years of that would not change your life now.

[Jake Wolf]

Exactly. Like my. I already suspected at age 14 I wasn't going to make it. So.

[John Gabris]

So what's the hardest part of. Of your job now? Is it. Is it actually like whipping out the camera in a store? Is it making. Is it like, do you ever feel like, ugh, I'm sorry, I have to do this, or.

[Adam Pally]

Or as people who've monetized our passion.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

Whether it be consumption or talking about wellness. Like, has. Has anything lost any luster for you? Yes.

[Jake Wolf]

No. Like, when I'm actually doing it and. And, you know, I've been. I started this new series recently where I'm basically going around to, like, local. Local and smaller businesses and talking to the owners about, like, like the new stuff they have in and telling people about the. The stores. And so I've done it three times now. I've done it with 316 with an. Son and with. And with 18 east and three 16.

[Adam Pally]

Former guests of the pod. Right. Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Andrew's on the pod.

[Jake Wolf]

Oh, sweet.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

And.

[John Gabris]

And my cousin, Full Disclosure runs and son.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Technically works there and my son works there as well.

[Jake Wolf]

So. Yeah, he's telling me that Cole's there like a couple times a week at least. Yeah.

[John Gabris]

But I had the. We all went there as a family because, as we often do, to hang out. And Daniella was like, so what are Cole's hours? And DJ cousin Ben goes. Cole's more of a vibe worker.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

He kind of floats in, he'll grab a coffee, he'll walk around soho, he'll come back, he'll ask if anyone needs anything, and then he'll kind of like, walk outside and take a phone call. We were like, oh, he's really just hanging out here. Truly.

[Jake Wolf]

When you. When he first started going there, was it under the guise of, like, this can be his first job, 100%.

[John Gabris]

And it was like. And DJ cousin Ben was like, I'll pay him. I'll put him to work. And now I think DJ cousin Ben just likes having him around. He's a good hang.

[Adam Pally]

You know, it's like there's a definite lineage of, like, what DJ cousin Ben is to you. Cole could be that to him.

[John Gabris]

100%.

[Adam Pally]

Where he gets to kind of like, roll the bullshit downhill. A little bit of, like, call, shut your phone off in this big meeting.

[John Gabris]

100%.

[Adam Pally]

100%. To have someone that he could. D.J. cousin Ben.

[Jake Wolf]

Yes.

[John Gabris]

And hopefully it'll turn out as positive. Cole will open up a business that.

[Adam Pally]

Is that blossoms faster than the entertainment industry.

[John Gabris]

Yes. Yes. Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

Before all the algorithm fed blah and the endless sea of dupes, shopping used to feel more fun.

[Jake Wolf]

But here's a confession, fashionistas.

[Adam Pally]

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[John Gabris]

You worked at GQ and Rob Report and, and a bunch of like acclaimed editorial places like do you ever have to like, do you ever feel like, well maybe I will hold this piece or like are. Is it. Is there ever an advantage to not putting out content? Or is the machine so heavily like.

[Adam Pally]

It'S based on like novelty and new.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. That you just have to keep feeding it.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah. I mean I think you just have to keep feeding it. And in terms of like giving, you know, stuff to different publications or whatever, I mean it just depends on, on really just like the story and where it's going to be the best fit or like, like. But there are some times where it's like, well, would this be better as a video or would this be better as like a substack post? For me, you know, I just did a post yesterday that was about like my favorite heavyweight tees because I'm a big like. Especially when like T shirts are the only thing that I'M wearing during the warmer months of the year. I just like a T shirt with like a little substance.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, I'm, I'm kind of happy that T shirts, the, the bigger kind of heavier T shirts have come back into play. Yeah, the ones that like, don't show your nipples if you happen to have A or B. Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Like soft vintage T shirts have kind of flown away.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, yeah. And it's, it's back to like, sort of like the meaty like beefy tees or whatever.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And like the classics like the all style tees or things like, things like that. But so I, I was thinking about doing that as a video at first and then I realized like, I probably have more to say about each one of these than I would be able to say in a quick 60 second video. So I'm just gonna do it as a substack post instead. And also just like, like, just a matter of like, well, what needs attention right now? Do I have, do I have enough videos right now or do I need to write something instead? And you know, because I have two different avenues for content writing and.

[John Gabris]

Wow, that's a lot. It's a lot of self generation. I mean, like, it's exhausting. Just, I, I empathize. I probably, I'm thinking to myself, like, God, I do nothing.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah. I mean, but you, but you do, you do.

[John Gabris]

But it's like the amount to, to do what you do is like, no, that's an insane.

[Adam Pally]

I couldn't, I couldn't have it. I would drive myself crazy. Like if I had to, like, I would get in my own head about I'm not doing enough or I'm doing little or.

[John Gabris]

I mean, that must be hard as well.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, I mean, that's the thing is like you feel like, you definitely feel like you could always be doing more with content or like, you know, you could be posting more or things like that. But you know, it's, it's, you know, that's sort of a, like the nature of Instagram wants you to feel that way. Wants you to feel that way. Like, hey, like, cool post. Like, where's the next one? You know, and they're like, wake up.

[Adam Pally]

Jake, it's time for another post.

[John Gabris]

Tell us about crop codes.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, then it's scarf weather. Well, they're like, there are little things where like the app will tell you, like, here's how your post, like did like, you know, like you got 21.

[Adam Pally]

New followers from that reel.

[Jake Wolf]

Exactly.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

Like that kind of stuff. So it's like, do it again, you know, so you get even more followers.

[Adam Pally]

You're like, yeah, you know, like, it's.

[John Gabris]

Like chasing that dopamine 3 chips.

[Adam Pally]

You were hot from that post. Really?

[Jake Wolf]

Okay, exactly.

[John Gabris]

Was it the soft T shirt?

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, Visible nipples. I had the AC blasting in here. Can I take a second here?

[John Gabris]

Yeah, go.

[Adam Pally]

Because I, I was always kind of a chunky kid and my mom made like fashion very frustrating because it was like she wanted us to dress a certain way to look proper. It was just the 80s and 90s, so she didn't know what she was doing to us, but like forcing us. And I always start. I started to hate trying on clothes. I hated clothes. I eventually found this like surf wear style that made me happy because I like shorts and I like short sleeves and I like like open collars and stuff because I think I get a little cl. And later on in life, I became friends with Adam, who's got a great sense of style but also is agnostic and can discuss. And I was like, yeah, man, you dress so cool. I want to dress like you, blah, blah. And he's like, well, dress however you makes you feel good. And I was like, yeah, but it feels crazy to dress like. He's like, no, if you like bright colors and that's what you want to wear and you feel good in it, then that's going to do better than any for you, than anything that is quote unquote stylish or in the. And for me, that it's been since 101 places like I've been into my clothes now for the first time in my entire life, I care about what I'm putting on in the morning now. It's still like frequently short shorts and a button down and, you know, Tevas or some fucking whack shit like that. But to me, I feel great when I put it on. And I'm like, this is an aspect of my life that I never took time to consider because it was such a trigger point. And then I find, find a designer, find Tommy Bahama that fits. Double XL fits. I go on the store when I have, when we got a new job and I got a store, I go, this one, this one, this one, this one and this one. Send them to my house, right? And I feel great because it's.

[John Gabris]

Because it's your choice and you're like presenting something that you. And I'm happy to.

[Adam Pally]

And I'm like, I feel like I look good in this and that makes me feel good.

[Jake Wolf]

It's authentic.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah. And I didn't realize how much of a part of that. And then when, like, I have to wear a suit to something, I feel. All of a sudden I start to feel, like, antsy and weird that I'm in this suit. And then like, we presented at the Creative Arts Emmys, I was like, could I wear, like, a Hawaiian shirt with no tie open, but if I wear, like, tuck shit around it, a tuxedo?

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

Everyone's like, yeah, I think so.

[John Gabris]

And I was like, it was a banger.

[Adam Pally]

And for me, and I looked great and I got complimented on it. And to me, it like, opened my mind of, like, oh, I don't have to conform fully. And. And I didn't realize how important that was. And now I truly feel better about myself, both physically and mentally from dressing how not more expensively or not like following blogs, but finding what makes me happy and doing it.

[John Gabris]

And you don't want to necessarily conform. Right? Right. You want to, like, enhance.

[Adam Pally]

Yes.

[John Gabris]

You want to, like, take what you're seeing and put it through your filter. And it's like, the things I like that I'm seeing, this is how I would, would, would put them together and use them. And having that be another way to, like, express yourself.

[Adam Pally]

Right.

[John Gabris]

And then, and then, and there must be an exhaustive point for you sometimes because the same way that people are, like, to us, tell us a joke at parties, like, getting dressed is something you have to do every day. And so people, it's your job inherently. There must be a point of like, Billy Joel at a party, like, play piano man. Is that exhausting?

[Jake Wolf]

I wouldn't say exhausting. I mean, maybe if in the future it gets super overwhelming. But right now I'm pretty much happy to oblige. Most people who will, like, just ask me for, you know, like, a recommendation about a product or like, you know, hey, they tell me a situation like, hey, I'm looking for X, Y and Z thing. I have to go to this wedding or whatever. And like, I'm pretty happy to oblige. I mean, they're probably. I could, I could imagine a world where in the future it's so much.

[Adam Pally]

That, like, being a doctor at a party, and you're now you're looking at people.

[John Gabris]

Even worse. You're on the pop this, you're on a plane. And like, is anyone a stylist here? There's a man. The rock is in the front.

[Adam Pally]

Does anyone have size 15?

[John Gabris]

We need a size 15 red wing in two color options.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, like, I'm on eBay they'll be.

[John Gabris]

There when we land.

[Adam Pally]

Is the other end of that. Of that exhaustion. Potential exhaustion is like when you're going somewhere, if you don't got that shit on, you might feel like, you know what I mean? Like, you're not going to roll to like a friend's party and be like, I'm just going to throw on whatever I got. You have to kind of, of once. Once. Everyone's like, jake Wolf better have that.

[Jake Wolf]

I mean, I guess, I guess it depends on the party too.

[John Gabris]

Clearly he didn't think that today.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, exactly.

[Adam Pally]

Well, I just, I'm going to call you out on something that to me is what I'm learning about menswear guys and especially in the workwear style. I heard them say, like, if you want to hang your jacket up, you can. And you're like, no, it's okay. And I'm like, I can't wear that many layers without fucking passing out on camera.

[John Gabris]

Right.

[Adam Pally]

But when, when we went to Sundance and you and Dave Franco both had like sweaters with jackets over it, I was like, oh, that looks cool. I'm like, oh, yeah, that's how you're supposed to dress.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. So I remember that Dave and I had these like leather jackets on that were part of the fit that we had put our stylist had put together.

[Adam Pally]

I had like a button down shirt with a fucking winter coat that I would like, take off everywhere we went because I didn't want to get my photo taken in my winter coat. These guys could all get photoed in their layers.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. It's another way to get the picture. Good. It does. I mean, that's that Kanye quote, right? Like, I'll, I'll. You know, I'm only quoting his stuff lately.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah. I mean, I saw Kanye quotes scrolled on the subway wall.

[John Gabris]

What's that Kanye quote about bloodlines? About like pure bloodlines? I'm forgetting it. It's not Blood on the Leaves that's the song. But there's like a. He just said it recently. I'm really more into his new stuff.

[Adam Pally]

I'm into the new Kanye. Just like the old Europe. Now, Jake, we ask all our guests this, but what do you do? What does Jake Wolf do to Stale? By the way, you have the perfect name to say first and last always like, you know, it's two one symbol names and it's fucking like you run Dun dun.

[John Gabris]

Yeah, yeah. It's law. And it's a law and order name.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

It's literally like Dick Wolf. Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

So Jake Wolf, what do you do to stay alive?

[Jake Wolf]

What do I do to stay alive?

[Adam Pally]

Whether that means what you consume, how you behave. Like, what do you do for yourself that helps you. You feel healthy and stay alive and stuff.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah. I mean, a big one is therapy. I do therapy to stay.

[Adam Pally]

Hell, yeah.

[John Gabris]

Once a week.

[Jake Wolf]

Once a week.

[John Gabris]

That's a healthy dose.

[Jake Wolf]

Once, once a week. At certain points in my life, I've gone up to twice a week when I got an as needed basis.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, I'm twice a month, twice a month. But right now I'm at once a week.

[John Gabris]

I'm at twice a month, and I'm keeping it. Okay, but they're. In the last couple weeks I've started, I've had a couple phone calls.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, no, like, that's. I'm on that system too with my therapist. He's like, he's like, I know I'm not gonna see you for a week, but, like, just, you know, if you need anything. Yeah, like, you have my number.

[John Gabris]

And you know what's so surprising?

[Jake Wolf]

And then I'm like, are you gonna bill me for that if I call, though?

[John Gabris]

Yeah. And I'm so. I'm always surprised. My therapist is never surprised to hear from me. Like, when, Whenever I. I'm like, oh, actually, I think we need to skip an extra week because I'm gonna be shooting or something. She'll always be like, no problem. But if you. If you want to call him here. And then anytime I've called, she's like, I had a feeling this was coming, you know? And you're like, what?

[Adam Pally]

She like you just. Your vibe is off. Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

I was expecting to hear from you, actually.

[Adam Pally]

I can't believe you took this long to finally call.

[John Gabris]

With Venmo Stache.

[Adam Pally]

A taco in one hand and ordering.

[John Gabris]

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[Adam Pally]

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[John Gabris]

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[Adam Pally]

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[John Gabris]

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[Adam Pally]

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[John Gabris]

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[Jake Wolf]

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[John Gabris]

So here's the idea.

[Jake Wolf]

Idea.

[Adam Pally]

You get it now, you call it.

[Jake Wolf]

An early present for next year.

[John Gabris]

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[Adam Pally]

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[Jake Wolf]

Per month when network is busy.

[Adam Pally]

See terms.

[Jake Wolf]

I'm a big walk guy, especially now that I'm like in, in New York, you know.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, like, just like, like getting the steps in.

[Jake Wolf]

Getting the steps in. Yeah. And that both from a physical standpoint, obviously it's just good for you to, to, you know, move your body, but then also like, yeah, you just sort of hit a groove and just mentally like you could be listening to a podcast. You could be doing anything. Like I have a dog, so he, I have to walk. And then so just taking him like through Central park on a long walk is always just like good for, good for the body and the mind.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, we were talking about that like a walk is like a double banger. You get those steps in. But if you get to engage in nature or see beautiful people while you walk down the street or SM cool food, like that's all good for your brain to just have all that stimuli. But then also the fact that you're getting X amount of steps in is also important for sure.

[Jake Wolf]

And I mean, that's the beauty of being somewhat near Central park like I am because, you know, you do get out of the sort of concrete.

[Adam Pally]

It feels like you're leaving the city.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, it feels like you're leaving the city just enough, you know, like with trees and actual grass and enough of that to remind you that like you live on the planet.

[John Gabris]

There are some angles in Central park where you can't see the buildings. Like there are some especially up towards like the tip, you can be like walking through and you can't see and.

[Adam Pally]

You could be deep enough and you could be not trying to. Like, that's like. Because that's, like, you know, I'll hike. I'll hike in Los Angeles where I'm. Where I live. And you'll. It's pretty easy to just, like, see the Capitol Records building the whole time or whatever. But if you keep yourself in Griffith park, you could be in.

[John Gabris]

Griffith park is easier than run.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, well, Runyon is like a parking lot that's running.

[John Gabris]

Running is like running next to a, like, Hollywood Hills touring van.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

You know, it's like, I was always.

[Jake Wolf]

A Griffith guy in Los Angeles.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, that's my. That's my.

[John Gabris]

I like Fry. I think Fryman.

[Adam Pally]

Fryman is awesome.

[John Gabris]

There's just lions there sometimes.

[Adam Pally]

Lions.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

Mountain lions.

[John Gabris]

No, I'm no, like, a cougar.

[Adam Pally]

Oh, okay. Wait.

[John Gabris]

Where are these cougars hanging out in Fryman Canyon.

[Adam Pally]

A wi.

[Jake Wolf]

Away.

[John Gabris]

A wee. Oh, a different kind of cougar.

[Adam Pally]

The wild night.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. The John Mellon Camp. The John Cougar Mellon Camp. I think he's in Indiana in a little pink house with.

[Adam Pally]

With his roommates, Jack and Diane.

[John Gabris]

Did you think that John Cougar Mulligan was gonna throw up? Old jacket thing.

[Adam Pally]

Two American kids.

[John Gabris]

Jake, thanks for still being here.

[Jake Wolf]

We're nine minutes deep on her about.

[Adam Pally]

Sucking on some chili dogs outside the Tasty Freeze.

[John Gabris]

So what's. What. What's up? What's. What's some stuff that you're, like, excited about for yourself? Like, where do you. Where do you see yourself going next? Like, is. Do you like design? Do you think you see that?

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, like, I'm thinking about that a little bit, and, you know, doesn't necessarily mean, like, doing my own thing, but. But, you know, like, maybe working with some other people out there who do clothing really well to bring that to life would be a really, really awesome experience if I got the opportunity to do that.

[John Gabris]

Does that feel like shifting over the line from, like. Like, media to artist or politician? You know, like, it's going, like, from.

[Adam Pally]

Film critic to director to director.

[John Gabris]

You know what I mean?

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Which. There is a pipeline of. Yeah, it happens.

[Jake Wolf]

But, yeah, no, I. That's. That is a good analogy. Yeah. I would say, like, if I've thought about things that I like, I would want to design, you know, it Even. Even just in the thought of doing it, you're like, oh, yeah, this is hard, you know? Yeah. You know, because, like, you want to come up with something that's, like, new and cool, but still also, you know, is authentic to, like, what. What I like. And it really does like hold up a mirror to yourself? Like, if I think about designing a piece of clothing, like, well, what do you actually like?

[John Gabris]

And right.

[Jake Wolf]

You know, like, it's easy to just like sort of shop around and be like, this is cool and this is cool and this is cool. But like, if you have to make it yourself, it's like, well, what does that actually mean? What is your perfect sweater?

[Adam Pally]

What is your, like if you present this to other people and be like, you should buy the Jake Wolf sweater, what does that mean?

[Jake Wolf]

What is that?

[Adam Pally]

What goes into.

[Jake Wolf]

Exactly. So it is, it is just like a different, different thought process. So if I had the opportunity to do that, that would be really cool. And then for me, like, you know, my substack has been growing a good amount and I'm really excited about that because it's just a different, different way to connect with people. But it's, I really enjoy that. It's like a direct connection with people who actually want to hear from me or anyone who has a substack can probably relate to that. It's like, yeah, I have a Patreon.

[Adam Pally]

Podcast which is like along the same line. Like, people pay to hear our podcast only. You know what I mean? People pay to read your writing only. So they are a hungry audience or a thirsty audience. They want your shit and that feels good. And then also having having like X amount of subscribers, you're like, I want to, I want to bring them some stuff. So I gotta, what, what am I writing about next? What, let's talk thick teas or whatever.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, exactly. Like, it's just nice to, to have that sort of one to one connection. And also what I really like about substack is, is, you know, it being sort of the, in that same regard, it being sort of the antidote to the algorithm based way of operating of TikTok and Instagram where like you're this person who's like kind of trying to kind of make a piece of content that will like catch the jet stream and then get sent out to like a wide number of people. And so you're, you're trying, not necessarily trying to go viral every time, but like you're thinking about such that ideal goal. Yeah, you're thinking about a much wider audience and will, will a million people find a reason to like this video? Whereas if I'm writing a substack post, you know, I have like, like close to 16,000 subscribers. It's, I'm not really, really thinking about, you know, it needing to be a viral moment. I'M just trying to do something that that group of people will deliver for your audience. Yeah, yeah. And I just think that that's a. It feels like a much healthier way of operating, I might say, than trying to always be like, oh, like, will I catch someone's attention in the first three seconds of this video?

[Adam Pally]

Do I have to say unalive and segs and stuff like that?

[John Gabris]

Yeah. Does it feel like that. Like, that would come to an end eventually?

[Jake Wolf]

Which one?

[John Gabris]

The everyday feeding the. The beast style, content creation. Because eventually, if you're doing that every day, what are you collecting? Like, you know, you're talking about getting.

[Jake Wolf]

As a body of work.

[John Gabris]

As a body of work and an experience because you're talking about, like, getting outside and, like, looking at the nature and stuff and, like, walking your dog and, like, seeing movies and stuff. But if you're putting out a video every day about boxy tees, doesn't that eat up the time that you could be seeing a different cut of a T shirt that you might like better?

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, sure, sure. And. And I think that is, like, part of the balance that I'm. That you are trying to find, or, you know, someone in my position is trying to find is like, like, you know, how much time you're spending on, like, making the videos versus, like, actually experiencing the things that you're talking about in an authentic way.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, we're kind of talking about output versus input at this point where, like, at some point you have to be putting fuel in there of, you know, whatever that means for whatever you're doing, whether it's new experiences. Like, I feel like you find that with some comedians sometimes who are like, my jokes are about airplanes. Comedians and airplanes, like, and travel and hotels, rather than, like, a wider breadth of life experience. And if you're, you know, like the. The one thing I. You see with some of the. The people who are making money on Instagram and Tick Tock is their start off as a fashion person or start up. Start off as, like a fitness person, and then they're like, we're here seeing the Minions, you know, Then all of a sudden it's like, you're just like, doing whatever it takes to.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

You stay viral.

[John Gabris]

You can always see that moment happen, too, in a social media account. Like, there'll be an account like that I follow, of like, a husband and wife team that eat together.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

You know, and like, you're like, wow, they are always, like, eating at cool spots. And then the next thing you know, they're like, we're at Bubba Gum Shrimp in Orlando, Florida. Taste testing all the restaurants at Disney, you know, and you're like, or, or skip that one.

[Adam Pally]

Or they have like a kid and they become like kid influencers and you're like, oh, you just want to be in it. You're not in love with food, you're in love with the, with the camera. Yeah, yeah.

[John Gabris]

And that must be a thing too. I mean, I do. I, you should, we should have checked.

[Adam Pally]

This Tik tok before. He said the most recent one is just you absolutely selling out.

[John Gabris]

I mean, you're, are, you're not in love with the camera. You're a writer.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, I mean, I, I would say like, I, I, what, what I like about it is being able to actually like, share knowledge and, and you know, educate people. I think. Like, although the, you know, the sort of, what do you call it? Like the. I'm trying not to like, use like a rising tides, like analogy, but say Reaganomics. Yeah, exactly. The baseline of like men's clothing knowledge is much higher than it was probably a long time ago for sure because of the Internet. And more guys are, are into it. But like, for the most part, like, I think that a lot of guys still, I don't want to say like they need help, but like, would benefit from like having and are open to it and want help in terms of like just, you know, I don't, I don't necessarily have the time to go to a store and try on 16 pairs of pants, but like, Jake does and Jake likes doing it. Yeah. So he'll go to the store and.

[Adam Pally]

He can articulate specifically what I might not like.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

And yeah, so for me, that's, that's like the, the real joy of it, I would say.

[John Gabris]

Who are you into right now? Like, what are some things that you like now in this stage of Jake Wolf? Like what do you.

[Jake Wolf]

I think that it's just a really, and you know, I'm not the first one to say this, but I think it's just a really big moment right now for small independent designers that are making really, really cool stuff and that people who are into clothes are, are also appreciating and buying. I think you see it in the success of a brand like Evan Kinora, or you see it, you know, which sells out super, super fast. For those who don't know, he's a designer out of San Francisco, works with really amazing textiles and a lot of limited run products. Like, he'll make 20 to 25 of a shirt and, and you Know, it'll sell out pretty fast. Or the success of a store like Venspace and Carroll Gardens, where they carry, you know, they do carry some. Some like, designer brands like the Row and Dries Van Noen, but then they'll also have a brand like, like Slowboat New York, which is like, I believe just one guy out in Queens, like, making clothes and using amazing fabrics.

[Adam Pally]

That's cool.

[Jake Wolf]

So. But I do think, like, that that energy of, you know, people being into those smaller brands who are making really high quality product is. Is. Is prevalent right now, in a way.

[Adam Pally]

You said something that me as an outside observer, one thing I really like that that's kind of I've seen. Seen in men's fashion, and to a degree, I'm not as plugged in on women's fashion, but the desire to wear quality stuff too. Yeah, like, stuff that's well made, stuff that's American made, stuff that's handmade. Like, that kind of is very, very exciting to see because, like, we just lived in fast fashion for, like, so long and arguably to the detriment of the planet Earth.

[John Gabris]

Planet. Yeah, yeah. I mean, like, H M killed the planet.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, like, there's like a canyon full of H M size mediums in, like, in Zimbabwe or some. But the. I love this, like, push towards quality that you're seeing. Like, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, denim and quality. People are like, realizing that someone would spend the right amount of money on a jacket if they knew that that jacket would not fray or not be worth fixing it. Because, like, some. Some went down with it. Like, or.

[Jake Wolf]

Or just the knowledge that, like, the. The. That like, it sort of goes back to what I was saying about, like, what I like about Substack is like, if. If you buy from one of these small brands, like, if you buy the, you know, oversized linen trucker jacket that Slowboat made, it's like, it's going directly to. To Chris at Venspace who owns the business and his workers, and then it goes directly to the guy who owns the brand. And there's like, sort of something.

[Adam Pally]

There's no, like, shareholders that are like, we should make more money on the people.

[Jake Wolf]

It just feels like for me, shopping, like, a lot of times, like, that just feels better to be like, oh, I. I'm, you know, giving money to this guy who has this one store in Brooklyn, and then in turn, he's. He's buying clothes from this one guy in Queens. Making the clothes.

[Adam Pally]

Right.

[Jake Wolf]

As opposed to it just like, shooting money into, like, the void you know?

[Adam Pally]

Yes.

[John Gabris]

No, that, that's conscience. Conscious consumerism.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah. Well, it's like when you go to like a craft fair and buy like the, buy your candle from like a lady who makes candles, right? Like that guy. Hi, this is Wendy's Candles. You know what I mean? You're like, oh fuck, I was gonna just go to Bath and Body Works or whatever and grab two candles. I would much rather buy something that a person spent their time.

[Jake Wolf]

When you said Wendy's Candles, my mind went to like the fast food.

[John Gabris]

My brain also frosty and fry. That sounds good. Who are your guys? Like who. Who. If you're, if you're my son's guy, which I think is adorable. Who's. Who are your. Who. Who are your guys?

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

What's your input?

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah, yeah. I mean it would, I would just say like a lot of like the designers and, and there that I really like are sort of the people that I look to, you know, like, you know, like Aaron Levine would probably be one of my guys.

[John Gabris]

Love Aaron. He's the Rick Rube. Yeah, he's my Rick Rubin.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

You know, like and, and just super, super tasteful and, and you know, looks really, really cool in the stuff that.

[John Gabris]

He always looks cool.

[Jake Wolf]

Always, always looks cool. Always has like the best version of like a car Detroit or like the best version of like a beat up T shirt or like hat or, or whatever and just puts it together really well. Has really nice watches too. I look up to his watch collection.

[John Gabris]

Really good watch collection.

[Jake Wolf]

His car collection is great. Like, like he, he's, he seems to be nailing it on all fronts. Like every aspect of his life seems to be very.

[Adam Pally]

Well, he's all around good taste.

[Jake Wolf]

All around good taste. And you know, he's got the Porsche and he's, and he's got the, the nice watch and the cool clothes and, and also. But not even just like from a stuff perspective but just you know, know like the way that he's been able to after being at Abercrombie where he was as like the head designer to now go out on his own and like sort of like build his own path is also something that, that for me as someone who, you know, without.

[Adam Pally]

Black and white shots of guys with six packs climbing out of a dock.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah. Like, yeah, he was, he was, he was sort of part of that, that Abercrombie sort of revival that you know, is still going strong these days. Days, but after post that, you know, being able to sort of find a new path through this same world that he's so passionate about. And for me, that is something that I really admire as well as someone who.

[Adam Pally]

Finding a new path while remaining authentic and not just taking a left to. Take a left to be like, the money is in this kind of style right now. To do it still to. To what you care about or what you.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah. And just. And just be able to, like, you know, stand on his own two feet and sort of do. And, you know, works with several collaborators. It works with. Works with different brands. Brands. You know, I. I was like, I did a shoot with. With him and a few other guys with. For some work he did with madewell. That was really great. But also, you know, now having his own brand with his own name on it, being the sort of culmination maybe of a lot of that is just. Is just super cool. Just to be able to, like, leave the big corporation, you know, spend a few years, like, building your name and your reputation up as like a solo designer and people really respecting you by being super authentic to yourself and then, you know, finally being able to, like, all right, this is my vision now. And so for me, you know, as someone who, you know, was a staff writer at GQ and, you know, then was like, have been like a freelancer sort of writing for Rob Report or GQ or some other places, and now, like, having, you know, my own TikTok and Instagram and substack is sort of.

[Adam Pally]

Like, for me, that's the route of the. Of the writer, the critic, or the enthusiast versus the creator. Like, you're doing the exact same pattern of, like, working at the GQ is kind of like working at the big company that's paying attention. Then you go out on your own, figure out some shit, writing for some other people. Then you're like, well, now I have a voice, now I have an idea. Now I want to share, like, this specific thing. And that's cool that you're able to do that because I think that's probably crossoverable to almost any art form.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. I mean, I think it's the thing that, like, I think it's the reason that I. That you. You trust certain critics more than others.

[Adam Pally]

Right.

[John Gabris]

Is like, there's a certain element of someone who's written before.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

And. And critiques writing.

[Adam Pally]

Not a guy who's like, rich dad died, gave him a shit ton of money and was like, I'm just going to buy a sick fit and then post about it and talk about how cool I am and how much I spent on it.

[John Gabris]

Exactly.

[Adam Pally]

And like, you're someone who did the work, did the research, and now became trusted because of your back, like your time spent. And now people are willing, 16,000 people are willing to read your writing, you know, because you've earned, you've earned it. You deserve it.

[John Gabris]

Yeah, that's, yeah, that's a cool, that's a really, I think that's a really admirable thing. And I feel like more people on both sides should think about it because I think it wouldn't hurt even people who create to like, think, take, zoom out, out, and like, take a look at where they fit in the bigger picture, you know, will help them the way they create sometimes, you know.

[Adam Pally]

Well, yeah, I mean, I feel, I feel like and, and the parallels between, like, us, it's like 10 years of improv on stage for not making much money, but building up, like, who we are comedically, you know, then we're auditioning for other people's things and happy to be part of it, and being a hired gun and learning from different other actors and directors and producers and, and, and, and then you eventually you get to turn the your and become an EP on your own show or your podcast with your buddy, like your, or your travel show. And then you get to use all the stuff you've earned and be like, this is actually a presentation of what I want. And I'm not just like a newbie. I've got my 20 years of experience behind it. And that, that's so funny that, that, that parallels, like, with everywhere, you know?

[John Gabris]

Yeah, completely. Jake, it's been awesome to, to have you here. Thank you for coming in and talking to us and giving us some perspective on, on, on this area and how you and, and how basically what I'm taking from your life hack is like, walk.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, I mean, it cannot, which is.

[John Gabris]

Can, which is, I mean, we're in.

[Jake Wolf]

Like, the best city to do it, right?

[John Gabris]

Truly. I, I, I drive everywhere in the city. I'm like Seinfeld in the show. And I forget sometimes how nice it is to just, like, leave the car.

[Jake Wolf]

Well, well, to be fair, like, there are definitely times in the winter when, like, not only do I not want to walk, but I have to because of my dog, and that's like, a bummer. But, like, the time we're entering right now is about to be peak walk, like, jacket season.

[Adam Pally]

With the exception of, like, two hot months, we have like, five great walking months coming up.

[John Gabris]

Yes.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah. And it doesn't even have to be necessarily, like, in a park or whatever, although that's like, probably my favorite way to walk, but, like, you know, it's. For me, it's often I'll end up getting a bajillion steps just by meeting up with, like, friends downtown. And then we just. Just, like, meander around the Lower east.

[John Gabris]

Side for a while, you know, Shop walking.

[Jake Wolf]

Shop walking?

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Jake Wolf]

You just sort of hit all the spots, you know?

[John Gabris]

Yeah. Love a shop walk.

[Adam Pally]

I do the same thing, but in far for food, stop at, like, 12 different carts. I got my 10,000 steps in and 18,000 calories.

[John Gabris]

Well, thank you so much for being here, J.

[Jake Wolf]

Appreciate you, bud.

[Adam Pally]

That's awesome. Appreciate you coming by.

[John Gabris]

That was such a fun, fun conversation. And he did really well with the amount of people coming in and out and talking throughout. He kept his composure, which is better than a lot of our guests.

[Adam Pally]

It's easy for us because we're pros and we're. I'm used to people getting up and leaving while meltdown.

[John Gabris]

I've seen guests throw knives.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, we had Christian Bale on, and he flipped out. He's fucking walking back and forth, man. You and me, pal.

[John Gabris]

We're done professionally.

[Adam Pally]

Hey, you, McG.

[John Gabris]

Sit down, Mick. I love that moment. Mick G gets up to walk away. Sit down, Mick. You got to hear this.

[Jake Wolf]

Got to start that.

[Adam Pally]

Okay, sure. No worries. No problem.

[John Gabris]

I don't want to do that run again.

[Adam Pally]

No, never will.

[John Gabris]

It's a bummer that they missed it.

[Adam Pally]

What a great guest.

[John Gabris]

So awesome. So it's so fun and. And. And what an interesting, like, world. And I love any. Any. Anything that has been so negatively, like, splashed. When people are, like, g influencers. I love that. It's like, well, hold on. You know, like, let's. What. What does that really mean, to be an influencer?

[Adam Pally]

One thing to influence me with what we're doing, but another thing is to be, like, trying to influence me to buy a product. That being said, said, staying alive is brought to you by hims. Insert a product here, we'll get one eventually.

[John Gabris]

Hims. Tequila. Get it while you drink.

[Adam Pally]

Get drunk.

[John Gabris]

Honestly, first person to invent a liquor with Viagra in it, you win the billion dollar lottery. And we will be the faces of it.

[Adam Pally]

I'll be. We'll be the hog.

[John Gabris]

Call me George Clooney and Randy Gerber.

[Adam Pally]

Oh, what a deal. I hope I get to be Randy.

[John Gabris]

Dude, 50 million.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, I know. I mean, I'll be.

[John Gabris]

I hope I get to.

[Adam Pally]

Richard Kind, just former Clooney's roommate.

[John Gabris]

They gave him $1 million. He gave Richard.

[Adam Pally]

That's So awesome. Right? He did it for, like, 10 friends. Right. Is that something crazy? Like, that's so awesome.

[John Gabris]

The way Richard tells it, he's like. He's a very nice man. We gotta get Richard on.

[Adam Pally]

We need to get in that. We need to get George Clooney on and then get him.

[John Gabris]

Well, you get George through Richard.

[Adam Pally]

Our guests are frequently inspirational to me, and Jake is inspirational in a different way. Obviously, I'm familiar with the idea of walking as a health concept, but his, like, the way he talked about fashion, the way he really. He turned my brain on a little.

[John Gabris]

I think, to me, one of the things I'm loving about doing this podcast is that we're meeting people who are passionate about something, and that almost feels like the kids key. The, like, the. The unsaid thing about staying alive.

[Adam Pally]

Some sort of passion.

[John Gabris]

Yes. To have a passion and a drive. Because a lot of the people that we've spoken to who seem relatively healthy all seem like they're enjoying the struggle of life.

[Adam Pally]

Well, the passion is the reason to stay alive, too.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

Like, if your passion is to travel, like, the longer you live, the more places you get to go. Sure. If your passion is to do comedy.

[John Gabris]

If you cut it short, is neuroscience, and you want it, and you want to learn why. Why the brain is operating at its best, and when you know, it's probably.

[Adam Pally]

Best that your brain is operating and.

[John Gabris]

You divest all your energy in that. And so it's. It's just nice to talk to people like Jake who, like, has an interest that maybe we didn't think of as that.

[Adam Pally]

Right. And, yeah. The more we talked about fashion, like, the more I realized, like, that's a mental health thing of, like, if you're looking good, you feel good, or if you're comfortable.

[John Gabris]

Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

And then you feel good and not.

[John Gabris]

And comfortable. Comfort doesn't just mean comfortable in your clothes. It means, like, comfort in the situation you're walking into.

[Adam Pally]

Right.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

There's a lot of factors because. Yeah.

[Adam Pally]

You could be underdressed and feel uncomfortable at a place.

[John Gabris]

Yeah. Even though you're like, balls are free.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah. You're like, ah, finally, I'm wearing leisure wear, but I'm the only one.

[Jake Wolf]

Yeah.

[John Gabris]

Like, when I wear my sweatpants to the strip club, it is technically underdressed.

[Adam Pally]

Well, that. See, here's the trick. You got to wear two pairs of sweatpants so you could throw out that bottom pair.

[John Gabris]

Really? You go through both.

[Adam Pally]

What I wish. No, no. You wear Adidas pants underneath.

[John Gabris]

Oh, your trap pants. Yeah. That catches. Everything. Polyester Lulu in tights. Yeah, you. Lemon tights as plasters. Then you're being used as an adhesive.

[Adam Pally]

I turn them inside out and stick them to the wall. Gabris was here and there's like 50 other. Stay alive. You have been listening to Staying Alive with John Gabris and Adam Pally. A Smartless media production in association with Sirius xm.

[John Gabris]

Produced by Devin Tory Bryant and Anne Harris. Engineered and edited by Devin Tory Bryant, who also wrote the music, associate producer.

[Adam Pally]

And video producer is Maddie McCann. Social media producer Tommy Galgano, assistant engineer Kyle McGraw.

[John Gabris]

Special thanks to Jared O' Connell at SiriusXM.

[Adam Pally]

Executive producers are John Gabris. Ooh, me. Adam Pally. Ooh, you. Will Arnett, Jason Bateman, Sean Hayes, Richard Corson, and Bernie Kaminsky. Do us a favor. Just rate and review the podcast. It actually helps.

[John Gabris]

Just so everyone knows, we do not have a discord.

[Adam Pally]

Don't reach out to us.

[John Gabris]

See us on the street. Walk the other way or you'll catch hands. One second.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, guys, we can hear going on out there.

[John Gabris]

All right.

[Adam Pally]

This is an audio medium, right? Is everything okay? You guys are talking louder than we are.

[John Gabris]

It's no joke. It's like when there's. Like when the doctor. Doctors are watching a surgery.

[Adam Pally]

John, we just want to make sure you're cool.

[John Gabris]

Your hair looks awesome.

[Jake Wolf]

We just want to make sure you're aware of.

[Adam Pally]

Yeah, yeah, that's fine.

[John Gabris]

All of that was about John's hair.

[Adam Pally]

Smart. Less. Ever walk past a place for rent and wish you could just take a peek inside, Maybe even explore the layout. Envision the natural light streaming through the windows. Or plan where your vinyl record collection would go. At apartments.com you can. With tools like their 3D virtual tours, you can see the exact unit you could be living in. Really envision yourself in your new home. With apartments.com, the place to find a place.