EPISODE 22: Libraries, Angels, and Anxiety

Summary

Podcast Summary: Strangers on a Bench – EPISODE 22: Libraries, Angels, and Anxiety

Host: Tom Rosenthal
Guest: Anonymous Stranger
Release Date: February 10, 2025

---

Introduction

In Episode 22 of Strangers on a Bench, host Tom Rosenthal engages in a heartfelt and introspective conversation with an anonymous guest who recently relocated to London. The discussion navigates through personal routines, emotional struggles, career transitions, and the complexities of relationships, offering listeners a deep dive into the guest's journey of self-discovery and adaptation.

Favorite Day and Ideal Saturday

The conversation begins with Tom asking about the guest’s favorite day of the week. The guest responds:

“Favorite day of the week? It’s probably Saturday. That seems so cliché though, doesn’t it?” – [00:49]

This leads to a discussion about societal norms, with both agreeing on their dissatisfaction with the traditional five-day workweek. The guest elaborates on their ideal Saturday:

“Saturday always starts with a little bit of a lion, but not too much.” – [01:53]

For the guest, an ideal Saturday includes coffee and brunch, a peaceful walk in the park, knitting a sweater, and enjoying a good book or audiobook. They express a love for fresh sheets and the comfort of bed, highlighting the importance of self-care and routine.

Navigating Life in London

Having moved to London three weeks prior, the guest shares the challenges of finding good coffee and dining spots, which are significant comforts from their life in New Zealand. Despite struggling to find their favorite coffee, they appreciate London's historical architecture:

“I love all the old buildings and all of the history behind it all.” – [04:00]

Walking around the city allows them to compare London's history with New Zealand's, providing a sense of connection and reflection.

Relationship and Personal Sanctuary

The guest describes their relationship with their partner as an "angel" who enhances the comfort of their personal space. They maintain a bedtime routine together, emphasizing mutual support and adaptability:

“We go to bed at the same time... We’ve been trying to get better at not being on our phones.” – [05:10]

This routine fosters security and warmth, essential elements for their emotional well-being.

Struggles with Anxiety and Career Transition

A significant portion of the conversation delves into the guest’s battle with anxiety and depression during medical school in New Zealand. They recount experiencing their first panic attack:

“I started for the first time in my life experiencing anxiety and I had no idea what was happening to me.” – [15:26]

This led to deferring their studies and eventually leaving medicine, feeling that both they and their colleagues deserved better. The guest reflects on the challenges of finding a new career path in London, with finding a job being their biggest worry:

“Biggest worry is finding a job.” – [10:00]

Despite completing their medical studies, the guest felt unfulfilled and struggled with the pressures of the medical profession, leading to their decision to seek a different path.

Aspirations Beyond Medicine

When discussing future aspirations, the guest reveals a desire to become a pilot, inspired by a memorable gliding experience in New Zealand:

“It was insanely cool. I mean obviously spectacular views, really quiet because there’s no motor. You’re just gliding.” – [21:40]

They also mention an interest in engineering, feeling it aligns more with their cognitive strengths.

Coping Mechanisms and Self-Care

The guest emphasizes the importance of talking to people as a way to manage worries, believing that sharing problems can alleviate them:

“A problem shared is a problem halved for sure.” – [08:13]

Engaging in activities like knitting and listening to audiobooks serves as a distraction and a method to process thoughts without overwhelming themselves.

Reflections on Relationships

The discussion turns to the dynamics of maintaining healthy relationships. The guest shares their experience with commitment issues, ultimately deciding to end a relationship out of fear, only to later recognize its value:

“I broke up with him... I was scared.” – [25:49]

They highlight the lack of tools and skills taught for sustaining healthy relationships, advocating for more open conversations and professional support.

Moving Forward

In concluding the conversation, the guest outlines their plans to continue exploring London, seeking meaningful work, and embracing the experiences the city offers. They aim to balance self-care with the pursuit of new opportunities:

“Keep muddling along until I find something that excites me.” – [28:51]

Notable Quotes

• On Career Struggles:
  “Biggest worry is finding a job.” – [10:00]

• On Anxiety:
  “I just remember the feeling of it. Genuinely believing I was dying.” – [16:18]

• On Relationships:
  “You’re supposed to learn this stuff completely.” – [26:43]

• On Coping:
  “A problem shared is a problem halved for sure.” – [08:13]

Conclusion

Episode 22 of Strangers on a Bench offers a poignant exploration of one individual’s journey through mental health challenges, career shifts, and the pursuit of meaningful relationships in a new city. Tom Rosenthal skillfully navigates these intimate topics, providing listeners with insights into the resilience and adaptability required to forge a fulfilling life amidst uncertainty.

---

Listeners who haven't tuned in yet will find this episode both relatable and inspiring, as it underscores the universal struggles of finding one's path and the importance of kindness and self-care in overcoming life's challenges.

Transcript

[A]

Hello. Sorry to bother you. Can I ask you a slightly odd question? I'm making a podcast called Strangers on a Bench where essentially I talk to people I don't know on benches for 10 or 15 minutes. Are you up for that? Do you want to give it a. What's your favorite day of the week?

[B]

Favorite day of the week? It's probably Saturday. That seems so cliche though, doesn't it?

[A]

It's okay. It's society's fault.

[B]

Isn't it just. I am a firm disbeliever in the five day working week but have had to confirm to it.

[A]

Same bro, same. Have you tried fighting it?

[B]

I have. I've tried very hard to fight it. Which leads me sitting on a bench on what day of the week is it? Wednesday. So Wednesday usually my least favourite day of the week. So I'm doing something right at the moment.

[A]

Let's think of a Saturday. From getting up to going to bed. What is an ideal Saturday for you? But we can't have any fantasy in there. You're not suddenly getting a helicopter somewhere, whatever. Unless of course, you're a helicopter pilot, which you may surprise me if you are.

[B]

I wish I was. I have thought about it.

[A]

Still time.

[B]

Yes, there is still plenty of time. Perfect. Saturday always starts with a little bit of a lion, but not too much.

[A]

Yeah. Are we talking 8:00?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

8:30. And then food is like always the first thing on my mind. Coffee and brunch, which I've yet to find since I've arrived in London.

[A]

Good coffee anywhere?

[B]

Yeah. No food. There's no food here. Us Kiwis love our coffee and it's been. Been a bit difficult. Haven't yet found one I've loved. So working on that, I think then it would involve something outside, like a walk in the park, being in nature, hearing the birds, all the beautiful things that we skip during the week when we're stuck working and all that. With a book. All my knitting. I was just about to grab my knitting out when you.

[A]

Oh no, I stopped. What were you gonna make?

[B]

A sweater. A winter sweater.

[A]

For yourself or someone else?

[B]

I knit a lot faster when it's for myself.

[A]

Because. Because you love yourself.

[B]

Because I know I'm gonna get to wear it.

[A]

Okay, so it's knitting or book.

[B]

Yeah. In the park.

[A]

Not at the same time.

[B]

I can do both at the same time.

[A]

You need someone to turn the pages for you?

[B]

No, I invested in a Kindle.

[A]

Clever.

[B]

There's no stopping me now.

[A]

Yeah, that's cool.

[B]

Either that or an audiobook. At the same time of knitting, I just have to distract my mind. And then I feel like an afternoon catching up with friends, finding somewhere lovely to have dinner. I love dining out and haven't really been able to do it since arriving in London.

[A]

Because it sounds like you've not managed to do anything yet.

[B]

Well, I've been here three weeks.

[A]

You haven't found a good coffee or, you know, to eat out?

[B]

Well, I've tried lots of coffee, but they just haven't been that great.

[A]

Oh, no. We're letting you down as a nation.

[B]

I mean, I didn't have high expectations. I feel like everyone's like, why are you going to London? You love nature and the outdoors and you love coffee.

[A]

You didn't listen to those naysayers. You said, I will go to London.

[B]

Yep. And it's beautiful. It's beautiful in a different way. I love all the old buildings and all of the history behind it all.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

My favorite thing to do at the moment is walk around and compare when a building in London was built to New Zealand's entire history. That is quite funny, which is amusing because most of the buildings pretty date our colonial history anyway.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So catching up with friends and an early night. I just love my bed so much.

[A]

Early night. What is it about your bed that you love?

[B]

Security, warmth, coziness. Oh, I just love it. It's just.

[A]

Total package.

[B]

Y.

[A]

Anything in particular about your bed that kind of stands out?

[B]

Nice sheets. It's like, you cannot put a price on the crunch of, like, fresh sheets. Feather duvet. Just like that sound that it all makes. Heavenly.

[A]

Yeah, I'm with you.

[B]

And then so you can, like, have the window open a bit so you've got the fresh breeze coming in. But you're snuggly.

[A]

You could sell sheets I'm very passionate about. Maybe this is.

[B]

We spend. We should spend about a third of our life in bed.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So we have to do it right completely.

[A]

Does your partner kind of, like, ruin this sanctuary at all for you?

[B]

No, he adds to it.

[A]

That's nice.

[B]

Yeah, definitely.

[A]

That's very sweet of you to say.

[B]

Oh, no.

[A]

Well, I mean, so he doesn't. Because the way you described it sounded like this was your own personal paradise.

[B]

It is, because he's the only.

[A]

Oh, that's very sweet.

[B]

It was my paradise before I met him. We've been together, what, five years now? And he loves being in bed, too, so.

[A]

Fantastic. Do you have a routine together around the bed?

[B]

We go to bed at the same time.

[A]

Yeah. Give me that time. 9:30.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Knew it.

[B]

Probably not his routine if he had his own way.

[A]

Oh, I see.

[B]

But he's.

[A]

He's learned to adapt.

[B]

Sort of. Yeah. Because I also would probably be even earlier if it wasn't for him. So it's somewhere.

[A]

There's a compromise there.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Do you get in at the same time?

[B]

No, I'm usually in bed first and then he comes in and we just. We've been trying to get better at not being on our phones.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Aren't they awful? They are bad.

[A]

They are bad.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

How do you get better at not doing. How do you get better, do you think?

[B]

We don't have our chargers like right next to our beds. They're across the room. So like we put our phones on them and you have to get out of bed to get them rather than just having it in.

[A]

I think that's very sensible. I actually think that's very sensible. And may I inform you also that I have started doing that in the last few days.

[B]

Yeah. And then. Yeah. We just have a cardinal and talk about whatever comes to mind and he rolls over and falls asleep within like 30 seconds. Starts snoring, you know, shows off that he's fallen asleep real quickly. And I just lie there thinking about my day.

[A]

Well, that's annoying, isn't it? There's people who can do that.

[B]

That's alright. It's not this fault.

[A]

But it's the speed of it.

[B]

It's impressive. It's incredible. We could be talking about something really intense and just falls asleep. Which I can be jealous of. But I'm happy for him.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, I wouldn't take it away from him. She was trying to get us to work out.

[A]

Do you have quite intense conversations with him? Quite a lot?

[B]

Yeah, I think so.

[A]

You don't seem very intense.

[B]

Don't I?

[A]

No.

[B]

Oh, I'm very intense. I think about things very deeply. I worry a lot. He also worries a lot.

[A]

Not as much.

[B]

We worry about different things. Things. I think my worries are more existential.

[A]

Yeah. How do you soothe yourself when you start feeling worried?

[B]

That's a really good question. I love talking to people. Cliche. But a problem shared is a problem halved for sure. Even solved or even solved. So often the case and just trying to rationalize things. I think so often we can get caught up in worries and things that might happen that actually the chances of that aren't real or aren't big. And I think I try to keep a bit of a routine with self care and stuff. Although that's been a bit shabby recently by knitting or listening to a book or reading a book or doing both at the same time. So there's no room to think about anything else. Give myself the space to, like, process something without having to think about it all at once.

[A]

Yeah. Good answer. May I ask what the last thing you worried about? That now seems slightly irrational.

[B]

I feel like a lot of my worries actually are realized at the moment.

[A]

So just going about realizing those worries left by the center.

[B]

Like.

[A]

Let'S go through the worries. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's make it more fun by doing a top three in the charts. I'll do a theme music.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

What would be the theme music if you're a worry chart?

[B]

Something like Jersey. Yeah. Something fun at 3. 3, as in the least of my big worries.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Oh, gosh.

[C]

Three.

[B]

Let's go from one. I think we have to go one.

[A]

Okay. We're going top bow.

[B]

Biggest. Biggest worry.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Is finding a job.

[A]

That's a good one. It's a good. That's a good start.

[B]

So the context of that is I was a doctor back in New Zealand and for many reasons, for a very long time. I haven't really enjoyed that and have thought about finding a new job for a long time.

[A]

Helicopter pilot, for instance.

[B]

Maybe not a helicopter pilot, but I've always wanted to be a pilot.

[A]

Have you actually.

[B]

Yeah, you actually hit the nail.

[A]

I was just completely joking, but I was somehow. That's weird.

[B]

Probably just planes. Helicopters are a bit intense, but you're pretty close.

[A]

Wow. So it was a doctor. Now you're like, no, we don't want to. We don't want to heal anyone anymore. We've done that.

[B]

Not for me. As I said earlier, very selfish and also not good for the work. Life balance.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So it's trying to figure out being in a new place and trying to figure out what I want to do with my life, probably.

[A]

I mean, it's going to take some.

[B]

She's a big one.

[A]

It's going to take some beating. Probably one. Although actually, let's not rule out whatever problem the tea comes. Okay, here we go. Problem two. Problem two. Okay, you go for it.

[B]

Starting to miss my family and friends back home. 24 hours on a plane is a pretty decent time to go visit anyone. And my grandad's been a bit unwell the last few weeks and he just seems to be getting a little bit older every time I talk to him. And on a similar note, my nieces and my nephew who are the coolest, the absolute centre of my world. So just being in the big city and like loving that and being excited for it, but also wishing I was experiencing it with people I know and love beyond my partner.

[C]

Of course. Yeah.

[A]

And so that's two. Should we just shove a third one in there?

[B]

I'm trying to think of something really trivial. Oh, okay. My worry currently is what wine glasses am I gonna buy? Because I want to love them. I want to love drinking wine out of them, but I don't want them to be really expensive.

[A]

I mean, what do you drink wine out of now? Just hat your hands.

[B]

A mug.

[A]

A mug.

[B]

It's pretty dire.

[A]

That is quite. There is something depressing about wine, isn't there?

[B]

Yeah. Or Guinness glasses nipped from the pub.

[A]

Whoa. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Maybe don't. Yeah, you cut that.

[A]

They'll be around in the morning. Okay, we've got you three problems there.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Problem one, basically your entire life choice.

[B]

Problem two, whoa, you're making it seem real big.

[A]

Problem two, missing friends and family.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Problem three, missing good quality wine glass. I think, I think wine glasses. It will come good. Like obviously missing first. Nothing you can do about it.

[B]

I mean it's just call them, annoy them.

[A]

That's it. Yeah, write a letter.

[B]

That's romantic.

[A]

Get the old hand out.

[B]

What does the stamp cost here?

[A]

I would say first class stamps may be. This is gonna sound terrible.

[B]

First class, what does that mean?

[A]

Oh, well, they just go the fastest, the things you send.

[B]

That's a profound concept to me.

[A]

Oh really? You don't have first and second class both? No. We're all obviously plebs or not. Or you're really.

[B]

Or we're all first class.

[A]

There's one speed that things get around.

[B]

In Zealand and it's slow.

[A]

I mean that probably says a lot about our country that we do separate these things out in terms of, you know, you pay more, you get there faster.

[B]

Intriguing. This requires research.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Cuz I feel like first class is only going to get it to the airport and then from then on it's just.

[A]

Oh, no, good point. Oh, sorry.

[B]

New Zealand speed.

[A]

I take it all back. I mean, I mean if you're sending stuff New Zealand, it's. You have to go to the post office and they tell you what to do. Sorry, I just meant internally. That was terrible postal advice. That's the worst postal advice I've ever given anyone.

[B]

I've never actually received any postal advice, so that's the best postal advice I've.

[A]

Ever Received my worst was your best there. So that's good. I'll try and carry that on for the day. Okay, so two things I want from Dr. You. What was the moment where you decided, you know what, this whole doctor thing, it's not for me.

[B]

I don't know that it was any singular moment. The time that I started questioning it was in my third year of medical school. So third year is that last year of the pre clinical work. The content is painfully dry. You still haven't even met a patient yet. Halfway through the year my mood got really low, I got very depressed and I started for the first time in my life experiencing anxiety and I had no idea what was happening to me. Remember sitting in the library late one night studying for an exam that was coming up and had my first full blown panic attack and God, it was.

[A]

Just in the middle of the library. Yeah, sugar, what do you like? How did that play out?

[B]

I was with a friend at the time, bless her, she was dragging me to the library every day because she was like, you are not failing on my watch. She was doing the best that she knew how to do. But I was like saying to her I really don't feel good, like something's wrong. And she was like, oh, just sit down and like, just relax, you'll be alright. So I like put myself in the corner of the room and sat on the floor in fetal position and waited for it to pass.

[A]

Just light. Just you just lying down in the library?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Was she kind of guarding you or she.

[B]

No, she was just watching a link. Just watching there's study that needed to be done. I don't think anyone could see me. Like it was quite late, it wasn't busy.

[A]

Do you remember what you were thinking about when you were in the fetal position in the library?

[B]

I just remember the feeling of it. Genuinely believing I was dying. Still thinking about the fact that I needed to hurry up and get back to studying.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And things sort of progressed from there. I ended up deferring my studies for a year which at that point I knew it probably wasn't for me and thought I wouldn't go back to med school. So I travelled and worked and just kind of chilled out for the year but sort of got towards the end of that time and just decided to go back and finish it because I didn't really know what else I wanted to do. So I just thought I'll go back and finish it. Made my way through and it was fine.

[A]

The panic attacks didn't come back?

[B]

No, I was Too scared of getting back to that point. So I didn't let medicine mean as much to me. Got to the end of med school and became a doctor. Got my registration and did that for two and a half years, which was until, yeah, halfway through this year. And dreaded going to work some days and would enjoy work occasionally. And I just don't think me or my colleagues or my patient deserve a Kate who is only enjoying work every few weeks.

[A]

Do you think your body was right the first time then when you were in that library when it was saying.

[B]

Something, this is so wrong for you? Yeah. Yeah. Would I have done things a bit differently? Maybe. But I think all these experiences are going to make me whatever I'm going to be one day.

[A]

Can you think of your kind of most euphoric moment as a doctor?

[B]

I don't know that I've ever had a euphoric moment as a doctor. My scale of shit and that sucked and I never want to go back to work through to I had a good day is very skewed towards the negative. A good day would be as small as one interaction with a patient and their family. Knowing that I did something. Was able to take the time to explain something or connect them to a service or a provider. That might not have happened if I wasn't there. Which. Our system back home is quite similar to the nhs, just not quite. Quite as on its knees yet. But it's headed in the same direction. There's just less time and resource to be able to give that time and resource to patients that they need. And it's. Yeah, it's not something I really want to be a part of.

[A]

Let's imagine like time wasn't an issue. You had enough money to kind of really not worry about for a bit or to really let yourself kind of explore all possibilities regarding your future scenarios. What's the wildest thought that's come to you? There's also like just about possible.

[B]

I think this is so backwards. I think I'd still want to be a doctor. I think I would attempt to get into surgical training. I really enjoy aspects of surgery. I love surgeons. I think they're great.

[A]

What's so great about surgeons?

[B]

They have a way of just being really straight to the point that I appreciate. They identify a problem, they can either fix it or they can't. Obviously there's a lot more to it than that. But compared to medicine where you're just trying and failing, doing different things and altering medications and whatever it is. I am really attracted to surgery. The Problem is people in the training program and even consultants are still on call and things like that. I want to have babies and I want to have time for my family. So that's not really congruent with what I want. But I still think it would be cool to train.

[A]

Whoa. Yeah, Interesting one. And then how about wild away from, away from medicine?

[B]

If time wasn't, I think I would go back and do engineering. Just think that's kind of more how my brain works. Or as we talk about pilot. It would just be so cool.

[A]

What is it about being a pilot that would appeal? And is it something you've just always had in mind?

[B]

Yeah, just kind of always sat there. I don't think it's very rational. When I was thinking about this. Down in the south island of New Zealand over the Southern Alps there is a gliding club. So I went gliding.

[A]

How was that?

[B]

It was insanely cool. I mean obviously spectacular views, really quiet because there's no motor. You're just gliding.

[A]

What were your emotions when you were up there?

[B]

Is just very freeing. Peaceful, beautiful colours. The like contrast of the blue sky and the snow covered peaks and it's. Yeah. Just makes you feel so grateful and it's. Yeah, it's just moments like that you're like, holy shit, how is this my life?

[A]

What was it like in the plane when you were taking off to come here?

[B]

What was going through your head? I was just super excited. So we traveled Europe for just over three months.

[A]

Okay, cool. Did anyone come to the airport to wave you off?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Who came?

[B]

A whole bunch of my partner's family.

[A]

Was anyone there? You're like, why are you there?

[B]

No, fortunately not.

[A]

It's the neighbor or something. I love the idea to say it.

[B]

Although my father did a very in keeping with him thing. He realised when we were planning to go and ended up booking a flight to Australia at the same time so that we could go to the airport together and him and my mom could come through. So.

[A]

Whoa. Wow, that's so sweet. They went on an entirely pointless flight.

[B]

No, no, no, no. They spent a week in Melbourne. So like he was planning a holiday anyway. He just, I think from him it's like, oh, we can share an Uber. That's money saved.

[A]

Oh, wow. Did anyone give you any last, like last words of kind of wisdom? Is your father like, don't forget the something?

[B]

No, dad, bless him, he's like the most stoic person. And he at the gate he got like all choked up and I was like, oh shit, this is serious.

[A]

Oh God, oh, no. You know, when dad started to go, there's an issue.

[B]

Oh, God.

[A]

So you just couldn't look at him.

[B]

Yeah. My boyfriend's mum told us to be kind to each other and I didn't think much of it at the time, but obviously travelling together for three, four months and finding jobs, finding flat, all of that, like, you know, it's all stressful and so there have been times where that advice has popped into my head. To be kind.

[A]

That's a really good one.

[B]

Yeah. I think we're so good at being kind to strangers and people that, you know, we're acquaintances with, but the people that are closest to us and mean the most to us, it's easier to not always be kind.

[A]

You're right. Well, it sounds like your. Your partner's quite angelic.

[B]

He is an angel, so that's quite.

[A]

That must be quite a bonus.

[B]

Very patient and very, very beautiful person.

[A]

Was it a tricky business, finding such an angel? How does one find them? How do you spot. How do you spot them?

[B]

How do you spot an angel across the bar?

[A]

Love it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Who spotted who first? You spotted each other?

[B]

He spotted me. I was out with friends. He was out with friends. There was a mutual friend that was having a birthday and he saw me and asked his mate about me and they introduced us and he was a sober driver and I was too many tequilas deep and tried to get him to join me on the tequila. The rest is history.

[A]

Any mountains to climb?

[B]

Oh, plenty. Yeah.

[A]

What was the chief one?

[B]

My commitment issues.

[A]

How did you climb that mountain?

[B]

I broke up with him. Well, hadn't let us put any labels on anything at that stage. So we'd been seeing each other for a few months and then I just told him I didn't want to see him anymore.

[A]

Wow. Just out of pure fear.

[B]

Yeah. I didn't know that it was that. I just thought that. Yeah, I don't know what I thought. Spent a few weeks being miserable and reflecting on what our relationship had been and then realising that actually there was a lot of really good things and I was just scared. And fortunately, he wasn't too pissed off about it. He was. No, he wasn't even pissed off. He was very kind about it.

[A]

That's. Well, that's. Yeah, I think that's quite a common thing, isn't it? Like, people, you know, there's a moment you're like, oh, God, like, what does this mean?

[B]

Yeah. And then, especially when you know you've got something really good because you're like. But you Know, we worked through that. And I think everyone. I think it's so tough that people are expected to maintain relationships when all we ever learn is from our parents and relationships around us as we've grown up. And we either say, I like the look of that relationship, I want to have a relationship like that, or I don't like this relationship like my parents or not mine. My parents have a beautiful relationship, but other people. Yeah, but we've never taught the tools or the skills to have a healthy relationship. And so know why it's not more common for people to speak to therapists and professionals in their relationship? Because we're all meant to learn this stuff completely.

[A]

My dad once said to me that the thing about relationships and no one ever tells you is that, you know, they're meant to have problems. And if they. And the people you, the people you can't trust are the people who say they have no problems.

[B]

Yeah, this is so funny.

[A]

And we think problems equal equals bad. Must be bad. That must be a terrible thing. This must be awful. I must leave, jump overboard. And actually, often it's quite the opposite. I mean, not always, obviously, but that's just what happens. That's just. Is the nature. I mean, they're. They're insane things to try and pull off relationships, really, if you think about them like. Yeah, yeah. Okay, last question for you. It's easy and it's hard at the same time. You can answer it in two different ways. What are you going to do next?

[B]

Well, I think I'm going to go for a little walk, see, get the blood pumping. It's chilly. Then I've got my knitting with me, so it'd be rude not to do some knitting. And I'm halfway through a chapter on my. I'm listening to Harry Potter at the moment, audiobooks. Finish off my chapter and find something delicious to eat and continue my search for that coffee. And in the bigger sense, just keep muddling along until I find something that excites me. Try not to put too much pressure on it and just find some work and experience. London and being in this part of the world where we can travel and things are closer and stuff, rather than being in the middle of the ocean. Yeah, I think that's me.

[A]

Thank you very much.

[B]

Most welcome. Been good chat. This is like so wholesome because it feels very London. It feels very cool.

[C]

Me at my worst, you at your best. Another goodbye. Flying the nest. The better it is, the harder it gets. That's how you know not to regret. Well, I told you the problem Shed is a problem Heart gentle words of belly love Choking on beside the gate Saying best be off we hope you Wherever you go I think of you there Lying and waiting in the evening Finding your way I make in our home Mountains to climb Just don't go it alone A little older every time we talk first they call and then.

[A]

They walk.

[C]

Still I never know quite what to do and I'm so far, far away from you and it's easy to be kind to a stranger and harder to be kind to yourself but try not to forget us when you're so far away.