EPISODE 23: The Balletic Lawyer

Summary

Strangers on a Bench: Episode 23 - The Balletic Lawyer

Host: Tom Rosenthal
Guest: The Balletic Lawyer (Anonymous)
Release Date: February 17, 2025

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In Episode 23 of Strangers on a Bench, host Tom Rosenthal engages in a profound and introspective conversation with an enigmatic guest known as The Balletic Lawyer. Over the course of their exchange, they delve into topics ranging from personal identity and career transitions to familial relationships and the impact of societal constructs. This detailed summary captures the essence of their dialogue, highlighting key discussions, insights, and reflections.

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Introduction to The Balletic Lawyer

Tom Rosenthal initiates the conversation with a simple yet intriguing question about the guest's favorite day of the week. This prompts a deeper exploration of the guest's perception of time and existence.

Notable Quote:
B: “Every day is Tuesday. There you go. Every day is Monday, every day is Wednesday. You see, the days of the week is only put there for a commerce calendar.” [00:52]

This response sets the tone for a discussion that challenges conventional notions of time and societal labeling.

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The Ideal Day and Pursuit of Peace

When asked about the ideal day, The Balletic Lawyer paints a picture of simplicity and serenity, emphasizing peace and connection with nature.

Notable Quote:
B: “Peace. Live in peace, man. That's it. There's too much.” [01:33]

He describes a day filled with activities that foster mindfulness and tranquility, such as feeding ducks, reading, and assisting his father with chores, culminating in an early bedtime to maintain a balanced life.

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A Turning Point: Martial Arts to Ballet

At around 18 years old, the guest identifies a pivotal moment where he sought inner peace and self-discipline through martial arts and later transitioned to ballet and contemporary dance. This shift underscores his journey towards self-discovery and personal growth.

Notable Quote:
B: “When you're dancing, you're in a different space completely.” [03:02]

His engagement with various disciplines reflects a multifaceted approach to understanding the self, blending physical discipline with artistic expression.

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Astrology and Personal Destiny

The Balletic Lawyer shares insights from his astrological studies, particularly focusing on his natal chart's north and south nodes, which he believes dictate his life's journey.

Notable Quote:
B: “My north node is in Pisces, which is become a guru, live in Thailand as a monk.” [03:02]

This belief system influences his decisions and career path, aligning his actions with what he perceives as his destined purpose.

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Navigating Education and Early Life Challenges

Reflecting on his youth, the guest discusses the lack of discipline in his schooling environment, which nearly led him down a path of delinquency. However, intervention through after-school programs steered him towards a more constructive trajectory.

Notable Quote:
B: “You've got to know thyself. And if you're not knowing the Right, knowledge then how you meant to make moves forward.” [05:23]

This realization emphasizes the importance of self-awareness and the role of mentorship in personal development.

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Complexities of Identity and Race

Being of mixed race, with a Jamaican father and Yorkshire mother, The Balletic Lawyer navigates the challenges of not being fully accepted by either community. This duality has shaped his understanding of race relations and personal identity.

Notable Quote:
B: “I can see the problem what's happening between the blacks and the whites.” [22:27]

His experiences highlight the nuanced struggles of belonging and acceptance in a racially divided society.

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Relationships and Emotional Connections

The guest opens up about his approach to relationships, marked by non-attachment due to a history of transient friendships. Despite having many acquaintances and professional connections, deep personal connections are scarce.

Notable Quote:
B: “You're the emotional one, you're ruled by the moon and the moon is your emotions.” [07:35]

His designation as a Cancerian underscores his emotional depth and empathetic nature, further complicating his ability to form lasting bonds.

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Dedication to Ballet and Physical Discipline

Ballet remains a cornerstone of The Balletic Lawyer's life, serving as a means to maintain physical flexibility and youthful vitality. Despite an injury that derailed his dance career temporarily, his commitment to ballet persists.

Notable Quote:
B: “Dance is the key to youth.” [10:55]

He recounts a significant injury during his second year at ballet school, which forced him to pivot yet continue integrating dance into his daily routine.

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Family Dynamics and Parental Influence

The conversation delves into the guest's relationship with his parents, particularly the impact of his father's longevity and his mother's passing. The mixed-race background adds layers of complexity to these relationships, influenced by societal racism.

Notable Quote:
B: “We all love our parents. Do we? Well, I don't know everyone. Not everyone.” [16:11]

His father's permissive parenting style allowed for personal freedom but also led to occasional disruptions, reflecting the balance between autonomy and familial responsibility.

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Coping with Loss and Legacy

The guest reflects on his mother's death and the emotional distance he felt, compounded by societal pressures and racial tensions. This loss underscores the themes of isolation and the quest for self-understanding.

Notable Quote:
B: “I think she knew before that something was wrong and something was happening.” [21:13]

His mourning process was intertwined with his efforts to reconcile his identity within a racially charged environment.

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Future Aspirations and Self-Discovery

Concluding the conversation, The Balletic Lawyer emphasizes the ongoing journey of self-discovery and decision-making, balancing his artistic passions with his professional inclinations.

Notable Quote:
B: “I'm sorting out. That's why I come here. Sit down and get into myself to know me.” [23:28]

This introspection signifies his commitment to personal growth and aligning his actions with his true self.

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Conclusion

Episode 23 of Strangers on a Bench offers a deep dive into the life of The Balletic Lawyer, a man whose multifaceted experiences bridge the worlds of law, dance, and personal identity. Through candid dialogue, the episode explores themes of race, family, discipline, and the enduring pursuit of peace and self-awareness. The Balletic Lawyer's narrative serves as a compelling testament to the complexities of modern existence and the relentless quest for authenticity.

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Notable Lyrics Recited Towards the End:

Running. Rise to the outside
Watch the birds glide by
See the strangers hand in hand
In a city I know so deeply
Thinking of another I haven't
now dance to stay young
Now d.
Dance.
Till I'm gone
Not dance.
In the winter sun
Think about all the things that I sa. [23:55 - 24:42]

These reflective verses encapsulate the guest's desire to remain youthful and connected through the art of dance, symbolizing his enduring spirit and commitment to self-expression.

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Closing Thoughts

Tom Rosenthal's Strangers on a Bench continues to illuminate the diverse and intricate lives of London's park bench dwellers. In this episode, listeners gain valuable insights into the interplay between personal identity, cultural heritage, and the pursuit of inner peace. The Balletic Lawyer's story is a poignant reminder of the resilience required to navigate life's multifaceted challenges.

Transcript

[A]

Hello. Sorry to bother you. Can I ask you a slightly odd question? I'm making a podcast called Strangers on a Bench where essentially I talk to people I don't know on benches for 10 or 15 minutes. Are you up for that? Do you want to give it a go? What's your favorite day of the week?

[B]

That's a good question. Do you know that because every day is the same. There is no week. It's just a day. Daytime, nighttime, that's how I see things. I don't put a label on something.

[A]

Every day is Tuesday.

[B]

There you go. Every day is Monday, every day is Wednesday. You see, the days of the week is only put there for a commerce calendar. So I can't have a favorite day completely.

[A]

I like that you've completed it. You completed the question. What is given that you know, all the days can be anything. It's all just every day is a day. What is your idea of a day really well lived?

[B]

Peace. Live in peace, man. That's it. There's too much. I mean, I do the legal and law stuff, so I see the fictitious world and the illusion that we actually live in rather than reality to say. I also read the Bhagavatas, I read the Vedanta, I read the Atma Bodha to understand the self. And if you don't know the self, the outside world, is it just an illusion in that certain sense?

[A]

If you could take me from more, I want some few practicalities.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Take me from the morning and waking up to going to bed. Obviously, you've got to move around.

[B]

Perfect. Okay, so what would you.

[A]

What's the. What's the idea of a perfect day? Live?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Can you describe it to me?

[B]

Getting up, having a juice, jumping on the bike, taking a little ride. By the way, I Gap at 4am so just do some relaxing work, think about the day before, come here to the park, feed the ducks, read the book, go home, look after me dad. Well, do bits and chores for me dad, because I'm at home with my dad as well, helping him. And then, yeah, by that time, evening times coming, settling down, read bed by half nine. Really? That's kind of like a perfect day.

[A]

What was the point in your life where you thought you wanted to find more peace? I mean, there must have been a turning point where you thought, you know what? I'm gonna look more inward and figure this thing out.

[B]

I think that's when I was about. I think I was about 18, I went into martial arts and that was kickboxing just to find My inner self and my peace and discipline myself. Then I went and studied ballet, contemporary dance. I'm a ballet contemporary dancer. Sadler's World used to dance for them, study a little lab, and everything's about that is dance. I'm a dancer, so everything's inward and everything's focused. Because when you're dancing, you're in a different space completely. But I study a little bit of astrology and stuff and I've done my chart. Now, when you find out what your north node and your south node is, that's kind of like your journey. Your south node brings you into this life, what you came in with, and your north node is that you're heading towards now. Everything I'm doing, as I said, different legal and about the laws and getting out of the system and blah, blah, blah, etc. Now that's my south node because my south node is in Virgo. So that makes me responsible and organized and everything's in order and get this done, get that done. But I'm heading towards my north node in Pisces, which is become a guru, live in Thailand as a monk. But now I understand why I took and made them decisions when I was younger, because that's my journey I'm heading towards. But it's all about discipline. And I think. I think it was about 18. Yeah.

[A]

Is there something that happened where you decided?

[B]

Not actually happened, but because of the school and stuff? I went to. I went to a bad school. I can't say what made it bad because the teachers weren't disciplining the young ones. We all ran haywire when we was younger.

[A]

Do you see what kind of stuff we talking?

[B]

Just don't even go school, come around here, smoke weed, whatever, blah, blah, blah. When we was younger. So it's like, okay, we've got to get out of that because all that's going to end up to what we're seeing nowadays is the young people and they're ending up in prison with me. I was the surrounding. And what I was surrounded by and got myself into, I could see myself going that way. So I was put into like a group after school. I think that was kind of like a turning point to say, well, look, because I take knowledge from my elders as well. Just say, I'm 54 now, but my elders, when I was younger, they would always try and keep you on path in a certain sense. But you've got to do that for yourself.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So you've got to know thyself. And if you're not knowing the Right, knowledge then how you meant to make moves forward.

[A]

Where do you stand in your life now? You say you're 54, what does it mean to be 54 now to you're.

[B]

Old man, look at that old geezer, do you know what I mean? But I was talking to a friend of mine yesterday actually similar thing and I'm mixed race, so my father's from Jamaica, my mom's from Yorkshire, so I've always been on the middle. I've never been accepted by the blacks, I've never been accepted by the whites, even though I am white, even though I am black. Do you see? In that certain sense. But I've never been accepted like that when I was at school. So I've never really had too much of close friends in a certain sense. And again when you go through nursery into infants, into juniors, into secondary, you're losing friends and you're gaining friends and you lose friends and you gain friends and that's a constant thing. But through that I saw that you can't keep friends because friends will always go in and out of your life. So you're always on your own. Especially when you grow up, you might meet a partner, your friends around you, you might go out drinking with the lads, just see when you're in your 30s or whatever and then they depart because they've built their families or whatever. Do you see what I'm saying? So it's non attachment, you can't attach yourself.

[A]

So you're saying to me that you feel like you don't quite have enough friends at the moment.

[B]

I've got loads of friends.

[A]

Oh, you have lots.

[B]

So I don't, I won't say acquaintances who I have. A lot of them are my students, a lot of them associates. Do you see what I'm saying? There's not many people I can sit down with and have a meal with and talk with like me and you. Now there's a few you say you've.

[A]

Struggled to or like, you know, naturally you haven't formed too many attachments. Right. But has there been anyone that you have formed a really strong attachment to which didn't work?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Anything that kind of burnt you?

[B]

Ex girlfriends?

[A]

Yeah. Any in particular?

[B]

Well, most really. Because I'm a Cancerian, you know, I wear my heart on my sleeve.

[A]

What's the trademarks of a Cancerian?

[B]

You're the mother of all the signs. So you're the emotional one, you're. You're ruled by the moon and the moon is your emotions. So I'm ruled By emotions. I'm an empath.

[A]

So you. Are you checking the moon regularly about the movement?

[B]

Well, in a way, yeah. Always. Full moon was last night. It's emotional. You feel it? It's more of a feeling. It's really difficult because it's just coming back to finding the self and knowing what the self is. Everything else doesn't matter and that's why we're distracted on the outside world, so we don't get to know ourselves. Everybody's attached to their name. You don't have a name. You can't attach yourself to your name. That's what gets you into trouble. You don't have a name in law. That's the problem. Show me a lawful certificate.

[A]

I don't have one.

[B]

There you go.

[A]

Well, not on me.

[B]

No, you don't have one because the documents you have are all legal. But who gave you that? The system gave you that.

[A]

So what should I. What should my parents do?

[B]

Your mum and dad should have gave you your name, but they didn't. They gave you your name to the birth registrar.

[A]

Oh, I see.

[B]

Do you see?

[A]

So you think ideally, just don't hand it in.

[B]

Well, they shouldn't do because. But they're told and they're threatened. You're going to get fined if you don't give the child name.

[A]

So what happens if I did? So let's rewind. If I didn't hand in my birth certificate.

[B]

There you go. You're not in a legal. One can do anything to you. No one can do anything.

[A]

I'm totally untouchable.

[B]

You could. Basically. That's what I am now. I went and claimed back my name.

[A]

Oh, I see. So you went and asked for it back.

[B]

There you go.

[A]

Are you allowed just to be like, can I have it back? Yeah, they don't have any problem.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

Well, now that means you can just do anything.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

As in. What do you mean by anything?

[B]

Anything. No one can touch you because everything on the face of the earth is done by contracts.

[A]

When did you become aware of all these things?

[B]

30 years ago.

[A]

When did the penny drop?

[B]

In 2015, when I went and bought my name as a limited company. I broke every contract. You haven't claimed that name.

[A]

So does that mean you got a new name now?

[B]

I went out. No, I got the same name. I went to company's house and bought my name.

[A]

So all this, but also ballet.

[B]

Yeah, ballet.

[A]

What a funny. What an amazing combination of things.

[B]

But that's what I'm saying to you, the ballet players. I went and studied There you go. I went and studied all my different subject. Now I'm not really doing any of them jobs. When I look at my chart, I'm meant to be a lawyer, really. And everything I'm doing is what the chart says I'm doing. Do you see? There you go.

[A]

Slight change, but not a huge change. If we can drift towards ballet for a minute, sure. What did ballet teach you and would you recommend it to people? Imagine someone listening and they're like, oh, ballet, gotta do that.

[B]

All right.

[A]

What would you say to them?

[B]

I'm gonna perfectly ask you this one. There's a couple of things. First of all, understanding your body and know what the body can do. You ask a brother to put his leg up there, man, it's like, you see, like breaking his back, man. I'm still, what, 54? And I'm still nearly. What, Nearly in full splits.

[A]

Yeah, that's a full splits. That's incredible to see.

[B]

But that keeps my body limber and it keeps me feeling young.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And that's the. That's the key.

[A]

So you're saying dance is the key to youth.

[B]

Perfect. Perfect.

[A]

How often are you dancing?

[B]

Every day. That's why I'm here. I'm waiting for a young lady now to come here and so we can just practice our dancing. She's always late.

[A]

Well, thanks to her. Otherwise we wouldn't be able to touch chat. You know what's been your most most memorable ballet moment in your life?

[B]

Would you say my injury, because it took me out of my dancing?

[A]

Oh, no.

[B]

End of my second year at ballet school, went down, tore my cartilage ligament, had two thirds of my cartilage and ligament cut out.

[A]

Oof.

[B]

And that actually put me out for the next year.

[A]

If that never happened.

[B]

Oh, I'll be on, because I was. I was dancing with Sadler as well. Lillian Bayless Youth Dance Company, just before performing in Sadler's Wells and stuff. It's been a good journey, but that was.

[A]

So that was the moment.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because how long did it take you to recover mentally from that moment?

[B]

I'm still not over it. Yeah, still not over it. You'll never.

[A]

Is that such a blow? Especially what you might have become in that field?

[B]

It is, but as I said, my natal chart told me I was meant to be a lawyer or solicitor. So did that happen for me to come out of that.

[A]

Sometimes when I'm doing these things? Because obviously people listening, they've got no idea, like, where we are. We don't need names of the place, but in Terms of like what's around us.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Can you describe what you can see in front of you and then what it makes you feel?

[B]

Okay, so we've got a lake with ducks, geese, Canadian geese, English geese, Egyptian geese. We're sitting under pine trees and children in the distance in the playground, couples walking, holding hand. And it's peaceful and it's nice, you know, it makes you feel at one with the oneness. If I could say it like that. One with the oneness.

[A]

One with the oneness. Do you have children?

[B]

No.

[A]

Is that a decision or was that just how it's.

[B]

Yeah, that was a choice. That was the decision.

[A]

Can you take me through that decision?

[B]

I mean, again, I need to understand me first. I can't start running around trying to look after something that I don't even understand me.

[A]

Sounds like you understand yourself quite well now. So maybe you're ready now.

[B]

Maybe, maybe. But again.

[A]

So you wouldn't say no if I.

[B]

Wouldn'T say no, I might if I find a young lady or whatever, cuz I'm single at the moment. So if in front of a young lady I could say, well, okay, cool. And have that understanding of becoming a father. That's the only difference between me and my brothers in a certain sense is that they are fathers.

[A]

Interesting. Do you think that separates you guys in some way?

[B]

Definitely. Yeah, definitely, definitely.

[A]

You a good uncle? Well, what kind of uncle do you try to be? It's a funny role.

[B]

It's weird one, because children, animals, they.

[A]

Just come to me like me, just the energy and just normal. Not animal, not a child. But I still come.

[B]

And I think it's the energy and the frequency you have.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

With. With kids and stuff like that. And I'm very. I'm very playful like that. Anyway, yeah, it's all dancing.

[A]

Like the kids, they're all dancing.

[B]

There you go. I bring my speaker down every Saturday. We're down at the park, everybody's there, dancers are coming down. Do you know what I mean?

[A]

So do you feel any responsibility as an uncle? Like, do you feel like.

[B]

Again, yes, but again, no. It's hard to talk. It's hard to talk about because in one respect, like with my brother, he knows what I'm like with kids and he knows that kids come to me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So is that sensibility. Do you see what I'm saying?

[A]

Because that's complicated for you.

[B]

It is. It can be. Even though me and him.

[A]

Sounds like you're.

[B]

Put it this way, them two, my two brothers were into football. I've Got a sister. She's the eldest. Now, my sister wanted another sister when I was born.

[A]

Did she get one?

[B]

No.

[A]

No.

[B]

So she used to dress me in ribbons and knife.

[A]

You were the other sister.

[B]

There you go. So I was brought up by my sister and I'm very understanding, emotion and feminine because me and my sister were always together. I used to plait her hair and everything. And that's why I think I went ballet school, because I was always surrounded by women. Not being a player or anything like that, but I understood women because it was my sister.

[A]

I mean, it sounds like you've just always had a fairly tricky relationship with your brothers.

[B]

Yeah, totally.

[A]

So they've been in one kind of cabin, you've been another.

[B]

Completely different upbringings for me and my brother.

[A]

So it pushed you further apart, do you see? Do you think your relationship with him. Well, with your brother. So do you think they can be kind of healed?

[B]

There's nothing wrong. There's nothing wrong with our relationship. That's the thing.

[A]

It's just where it is.

[B]

It's just who we are as human. And they're living different lives, but we are very close when we come together, we're very close and we're very loving. But when we're apart, it's just like, okay, he's over there, he's over there, whatever.

[A]

We don't have to come together, me and my brother.

[B]

We live at home with my dad. My dad's fine. My dad's about 92. Oh, well, yeah. He's still up and walking around in the house anyway.

[A]

How'd you get on with him? What's your relationship?

[B]

I mean, I don't.

[A]

What do you think about him?

[B]

We all love our parents. Do we? Well, I don't know everyone. Not everyone. Well, okay, you. You love them. To giving you life. Out of order, them. Billions of sperm. You made it. See what I'm saying? I made it. We're sitting on the bench now, so we've got to thank you for that at least.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because we're here to do a purpose. We're here to have a purpose or whatever. Yeah.

[A]

What is a dad's purpose? But do you think.

[B]

I'm not sure. I think the thing about it, I don't really know. I don't really have a strong relationship with my father in a certain sense.

[A]

What did your dad think of your life generally? Like, what's he ever saying anything about? Obviously, like, you sound like you have quite a different kind of life and a very, really varied life.

[B]

Well, the Thing about it, I mean like he's, he's, he's never kind of like put any rules on us, you know, he's allowed us to just go and do what we do.

[A]

That's good.

[B]

But don't bring the police to the house.

[A]

Is that the big rule?

[B]

Just eat, don't bring. No.

[A]

That's quite a low bar, you see. Yeah.

[B]

And that's it. Do yourself, do what you're going to do.

[A]

But did anyone ever bring the police to the house?

[B]

Yes, me, my brother. But it was nothing major, do you see? That's the thing, it's just silly thing, it tastes good.

[A]

I mean at the time when you were young. So obviously, you know, it's 50 years ago this is it. Having a white mother and a black father was that unusual for them. How rare was that?

[B]

A lot of the black families or a lot of white families, they would go into church but we didn't go to church. Do you see?

[A]

It was very hard because it was.

[B]

Racism and all that business back in the day, man.

[A]

I mean like how did they, how did your parents deal with it?

[B]

Well they just had to deal with it the way they dealt with it in it.

[A]

What was that way?

[B]

Just staying in. All right, if we went out anywhere we'll probably go with my mum. But for me it was a bit easier because my eldest brother and my sister, well there's one year between them two, then there's ten year gap, then there's one between, between me and my brother. So it was starting to get a bit easier. So I didn't see it as strong as what my oldest brother would. That's why I'm doing a little documentary of all. It's like the windrush. I've interviewed 30 people and there's like most of the older generation from Caribbean, different parts of the Caribbean, telling the story on what it was like when them came, what was the racism like, what was this like, what was the food like this and that. So I'm working on that at the moment. And then I've interviewed like the first generation of children who was born out of them. Like as you're talking about now, what was it like for them? So that's like my brothers age from when my dad, my dad came over in 52.

[A]

Yeah. Again have you asked him? I guess.

[B]

Well I mean like you hear it from all, all the relatives and I'm hearing a lot from documentary stuff. My dad's very held back on that certain sense.

[A]

Is he held back because it was difficult or Held back because he just doesn't want to talk about it.

[B]

When to sell back because he doesn't want to talk about it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Do you see in a certain sense, I mean like what would his opinion be to a group of black people while he's married to a white woman? Do you see?

[A]

Sure.

[B]

Do you see back in them day with the racism we've got to look at then. But yeah, it has been hard. I think it's hard for most people really in that position.

[A]

Were your parents together forever?

[B]

Yeah, they met when my dad came over and my mum passed in 2015. Yeah, 2015 and they were together. We've been a family all together and we've lived in the same house. See, I'm still there with my dad in the same house.

[A]

What was the experience like of your mum dying for you? What that means? I mean what was the impact?

[B]

It was. It wasn't bad because I lived all my life with the rest of her days. She was born in 27, I came in 70 so I didn't live all her life but I was in her life for all the rest of her life but because I was the youngest I was always seen as the trouble so my relationship with my mum was different. I wasn't really close with my mum I was more close with my sister. My sister was my mum even though we lived in the same house and also as well, the reason in a certain sense for that which I think scolded my mum is that when I was born they cut her from here all the way down and to get me out because I was born two months premature, you see and I was a caesarean and Sarah's then went from here to here the day I walked into the room accidentally on my mum to go and put some cream on her back Just before she passed she turned around and the scar, that's the first time I ever saw her oh really? In my whole life and the scar, I was like.

[A]

I was like what the fuck was that?

[B]

And I'd never seen it before. That's the thing.

[A]

Did she say anything to you before she died?

[B]

Yeah, no, I wasn't there when she died.

[A]

Is that a regret at all?

[B]

Yes and no. Yes and no. I think she knew before that something was wrong and something was happening because she went missing for about a week or two I'm thinking what the fuck's mum do you know where's mum gone? So I think she must have went up to north to see her family, the rest of her family what was up there because remember back in them days, a black man with a white woman, they would have scolded and said, nah, just we don't want to know. And they probably disregarded and threw her out or whatever. Or she had to move away in that sense just because of the racism. So it is. And that's. That's what happens. Unfortunately for the younger mixed race children, well, the older mixed change girls and who was young then and ex and had to experience that. A lot of the families got broken apart. He was never really surrounded by both.

[A]

What about your relationship with Jamaica? Have you been.

[B]

Been a few times.

[A]

How do you feel when you go again?

[B]

It's just. It's just a set. It's another home. But I don't know it. It's foreign to me. Yeah, I've always lived here. England is my home.

[A]

Yeah. The home's always been around here.

[B]

Home's always been around here. So how I see it, and it will be forever is even though I might break into Jamaica or whatever and the patois and all this business, it's like that's been taught from being here with all the different families being here now, all the ingredients, especially as we're all growing and it's moving forward, everybody's starting to see clearly in that we can all get together in that certain sense. That's what I feel. Being a mixed race guy, I can see the problem what's happening between the blacks and the whites. And that's what makes it difficult because most people see me as a black person or an Indian person because the color of my skin. How you doing? You see, this is the one I've been waiting for to dance with.

[A]

I want to read my book. I don't.

[B]

What is this?

[A]

Okay, I'll ask you one more question and then I'll let you dance with your friend.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

What are you going to do next?

[B]

That's what I'm sorting out. That's why I come here. Sit down and get into myself to know me. All right. What do I want to do and what are my decisions next? In that certain sense, that's the thing.

[A]

So you're going to do that and you're also going to dance?

[B]

Of course. Always. She won't. She won't let me not dance.

[A]

Well, thank you so much. I'm going to let you guys crack on.

[C]

Running. Rise to the outside Watch the birds glide by See the strangers hand in hand In a city I know so deeply Thinking of another I haven't now dance to stay young Now d.

[B]

Dance.

[C]

Till I'm gone Not dance.

[B]

In the.

[C]

Winter sun Think about all the things that I sa.