EPISODE 38: Casinos, Cheating, and Chamomile

Summary

Podcast Summary: Strangers on a Bench – Episode 38: Casinos, Cheating, and Chamomile

Host: Tom Rosenthal
Guest: Anonymous Stranger
Release Date: June 2, 2025
Duration: Approximately 39 minutes

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1. Introduction

In Episode 38 of Strangers on a Bench, host Tom Rosenthal engages in a deep and revealing conversation with an anonymous guest. The discussion traverses various aspects of the guest's life, including personal habits, family dynamics, relationships, work, hobbies, and aspirations. The anonymity of the guest fosters a candid and intimate dialogue, providing listeners with authentic insights into the guest's experiences and philosophies.

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2. Favorite Day of the Week and Ideal Friday

The conversation begins with a light-hearted inquiry about the guest's favorite day of the week. The guest expresses a clear preference for Friday, valuing the onset of the weekend and the opportunity it provides to reconnect with friends and unwind from the past week.

Guest [00:56]: "I favor the Friday... I favor the Monday. I favor the Friday."

When delving into the guest's ideal Friday, a vivid picture emerges of a leisurely morning without alarms, enjoying a hearty breakfast at a favorite greasy spoon café. The guest emphasizes comfort and indulgence in this routine.

Guest [01:27]: "Perfect Friday to me right now would look like waking up with no alarm... have a nice greasy spoon breakfast."

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3. Health Consciousness and Dietary Choices

Despite a fondness for greasy food, the guest reveals a growing awareness of personal health. This shift is partly attributed to experiencing unexplained physical pains, which led to a conscious effort to adopt healthier eating habits, including the introduction of mushrooms into breakfast meals.

Guest [02:35]: "I just started becoming a bit more health conscious about myself... eating better, then all of them just kind of went away."

Tea drinking becomes a significant part of the guest's daily routine, serving both as a comfort and a means to reduce smoking habits.

Guest [03:25]: "I love tea... interested in herbal medicines and herbal remedies... the western world views medicine is by the head of the snake."

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4. Family Dynamics and Personal Growth

A substantial portion of the conversation focuses on the guest's relationship with their family, particularly their grandparents. The guest shares a heartfelt commitment to spending quality time with family members, driven by a desire to avoid future regrets.

Guest [07:23]: "I don't want to spend the other three quarters of my life regretting the first quarter."

The guest reflects on the wisdom inherited from grandparents, acknowledging the generational gap but appreciating the traits passed down, such as cleanliness, persistence, and hard work.

Guest [09:22]: "They think I'm good now. But not before... I was just getting up to trouble."

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5. Relationships and Lessons Learned from Cheating

The guest candidly discusses past relationship struggles, highlighting a significant turning point that stemmed from cheating. This experience catalyzed profound self-reflection and an ongoing journey toward personal improvement.

Guest [13:05]: "It took me cheating on someone and finding out their reaction to it... that's a big lack in morals."

The emotional aftermath of being caught was fraught with regret and a realization of the importance of honesty and maturity in relationships.

Guest [15:14]: "It was just regret, kind of. But then as it got into the months, I started doing some more deeper thinking."

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6. Work, Hobbies, and the Value of Hard Work

Shifting gears, the guest elaborates on their work ethic and diverse job experiences. They value hard labor over mundane tasks, finding fulfillment in physical work such as gardening, which also serves as a form of therapy.

Guest [26:03]: "Sticking to whatever job is at the moment... making sure the house is clean, making sure the dogs walked and fed."

The guest shares a childhood memory that encapsulates their early understanding of hard work and collaboration, reflecting on the effort and enthusiasm even at a young age.

Guest [24:04]: "We found an old pedal boat... we all wanted to fix it and take it out into the ocean."

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7. Gambling and Casinos: Thrills and Lessons

Casinos feature prominently in the guest's narrative as sources of both thrill and financial loss. The guest recounts their first experience at a casino, describing the adrenaline rush and subsequent habit of regular visits despite frequent losses.

Guest [28:07]: "I've gone to the casino... feel like money's an important thing to me... Release adrenaline, dopamine."

This behavior underscores a complex relationship with risk and reward, highlighting the allure of the gambling environment.

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8. Outdoor Adventures and Camping

A passionate advocate for camping, the guest describes solo camping trips with their dog as essential for mental clarity and personal enjoyment. They articulate a longing to embrace a wilderness lifestyle, inspired by childhood experiences and a desire to live harmoniously with nature.

Guest [30:45]: "I just forget about everything and live with nature, basically. This is the best feeling ever."

The guest shares a harrowing yet triumphant story of surviving a treacherous mountain hike, emphasizing resilience and the profound bond with their dog during adversity.

Guest [32:26]: "We spent that night in just agony, like pain... it was the worst conditions ever."

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9. Aspirations and Future Plans

The guest expresses a strong aspiration to live off the land in remote wilderness areas, such as South America and East Asia. This dream reflects a yearning for simplicity, self-sufficiency, and spiritual fulfillment.

Guest [36:15]: "I have dreams... going into the mountains and just living off the land."

While realistically acknowledging the challenges, including familial expectations and safety concerns, the guest remains steadfast in their vision, viewing it as a natural progression of their personal journey.

Guest [37:15]: "I saw it... just like most solid parents would be... They want me to keep in contact."

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10. Conclusion

The episode wraps up with the guest contemplating their next steps, underscoring a philosophy of survival and thriving. Tom Rosenthal thanks the guest, who remarks on the enriching nature of the conversation.

Guest [39:16]: "Survive and then thrive."

The closing musical segment features evocative lyrics that echo the themes of self-reliance, reflection, and the quest for personal meaning.

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Notable Quotes

• Guest [03:25]: "I love tea... interested in herbal medicines and herbal remedies..."
• Guest [07:23]: "I don't want to spend the other three quarters of my life regretting the first quarter."
• Guest [13:05]: "It took me cheating on someone and finding out their reaction to it... that's a big lack in morals."
• Guest [24:04]: "We found an old pedal boat... we all wanted to fix it and take it out into the ocean."
• Guest [36:15]: "I have dreams... going into the mountains and just living off the land."
• Guest [39:16]: "Survive and then thrive."

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Final Thoughts

Episode 38 of Strangers on a Bench offers a profound exploration of an individual's journey through personal struggles, growth, and aspirations. The guest's openness provides listeners with relatable insights into balancing life's pleasures with the pursuit of deeper fulfillment. Through themes of health, family, relationships, work, and dreams, the episode encapsulates the universal quest for meaning and connection.

Transcript

[Host]

Hello. Sorry to bother you. Can I ask you a slightly odd question? I'm making a podcast called Strangers on a Bench, where essentially I talk to people I don't know on benches for 10 or 15 minutes. Are you up for that? Do you want to give it a go? First question is. Nice and easy, man. Really easy starter. Is there a day of the week that you favour?

[Guest]

I favour the Friday. I favour the Friday. Just the beginning of the weekend. Weekend signals when a lot of your mates and stuff like that are gonna be free as well, so you kind of forget that you had the past week and then back to reality on Monday. So, yeah, I favour the Monday. I favor the Friday.

[Host]

So definitely, almost definitely don't favour the Monday. So tell me, what's an ideal Friday lived for you? What's the dream?

[Guest]

Well, perfect Friday to me right now would look like waking up with no alarm straight off the bat. Wake up when the sun's coming through the windows, and then make some food for myself or go to one of my favorite breakfast spots, have a nice greasy spoon breakfast.

[Host]

What's on your greasy spoon?

[Guest]

This. You just got the whole shebang. The mushrooms. Mushrooms. I've just started liking the mousse.

[Host]

All right. Just coming out.

[Guest]

Exactly. If I'm feeling extra greasy, which is a bit of abomination, but I'll have the chips on it as well.

[Host]

The abomination chips, exactly. No, I think if you're there, you're there.

[Guest]

Yeah.

[Host]

What makes you feel extra greasy on the whole?

[Guest]

I don't know, I just like the greasy food. The mind craves for greasy food, I'll be honest. Oh, the sausages. If I haven't said that.

[Host]

Yeah, yeah, you haven't said sausages.

[Guest]

Okay. I definitely gotta have sausages there. And you got the toast as well, with the English breakfast tea on the side. That's what it's looking like.

[Host]

Out of interest, what was the moment the mushrooms came in? You said that was like a late bloomer, you know? Hang on a minute, I'm gonna put that in my mouth.

[Guest]

I don't know, I just started. I feel like. I feel like I started becoming a bit more health conscious about myself. So then even when I was eating these greasy spoon breakfast, I was still trying. I might as well get the veggies in as well.

[Host]

Yeah. What triggered that? Suddenly thought about your immortality.

[Guest]

I know, exactly. Yeah, exactly. Because I'm quite young, I'm in my 20s, so up till about a year ago, I thought myself was invincible. I guess many people do. And then you start Getting the health scares, like randomly. And most of it was self induced just through overthinking. But I started getting pains in my back and just random pains. And then when I started just to take it easy and just start eating better, then all of them just kind of went away on their own accord.

[Host]

It's amazing what the mind can do to the body.

[Guest]

Exactly, exactly. Yeah. Anything else you introduced? Yeah, well, just loads of tea drinking. So I drink tea a few times a day while trying to cut out the smoking, which is still kind of on and off for me.

[Host]

Yeah. What's the tea about?

[Musician]

Tea?

[Guest]

I don't know. I just. I love tea, I'll be honest. And I love different types of teas. I like that there's so many of them all around the world. A lot of them. Exactly. And they've all got their own uses. And I've started getting very interested in herbal medicines and herbal remedies and just that whole area of alternative medicine. The way that the western world views medicine is by the head of the snake. It doesn't go to the root of the problem, in my opinion. If you come in with a consistent recurrent cold, let's just say, for example, the doctors will just tell you that you've got a cold. But what they won't tell you is that this may be linked to a deficiency in certain nutrients that you aren't consuming, which literally just translates into you not being able to have the power to fight off these infections.

[Host]

Very true. So you're feeling better now after these revelations?

[Guest]

100% now.

[Host]

Like, how many teas a day?

[Guest]

I mean, sometimes I'll be on a crazy one. I have four to five, four to five. Sometimes I'll just manage one.

[Host]

Sometimes when you're drinking them, like, how are you, how are you honoring these teas?

[Guest]

Right? Oh, that's a good question. I mean, I just bring the tea with me, whatever it is I may be doing. So if I'm doing some work for something, I'll have my tea there. If I'm maybe playing a game online or something, if I'm gonna go have a smoke or something, I'll have a tea there. Exactly.

[Host]

Are there any that combine, you know, when you're playing a game, you make yourself an oolong. Are there the combinations?

[Guest]

Yeah, let's say if the friends come over, so the guys have come over and then I'm thinking, you don't want something that's just gonna put everyone to bed. You want something with a bit of stimulation and I'll get Some chai ready. So a bit of black tea in there, even if it's late.

[Host]

So the first time, first thing you think, let's get the tea.

[Guest]

Yeah, definitely. And then let's say if I wake up, I have myself an English breakfast with a bit of lemon.

[Host]

I've not heard of that.

[Guest]

Have you tried it?

[Host]

I've not tried it.

[Guest]

Definitely tomorrow morning I'm going to try it. Try. Cut out the milk. Just put quite a bit of lemon and a bit of sugar in there. And it just does wonders if I put lemon in there. No milk.

[Host]

Lemon and milk seems like a funny compound.

[Guest]

Yeah, I don't think I could see that one.

[Host]

So it's got to be lemon without the milk.

[Guest]

Exactly. If I want a bit of energy, I'll have something with ginseng, with ginger, those type of things. I just have quite a fiery nature.

[Host]

What would you do if you're having like a really difficult moment in your life and you're thinking about stuff, what would you get then?

[Guest]

I think I'll just put on a camera.

[Host]

Yes.

[Guest]

To calm down. Be in a better state of mind.

[Host]

Okay, so back to the. The. You had your breakfast?

[Guest]

Yeah, after that, I have a dog. So I'll go probably take out my dog for a walk and probably come to this park here and, yeah, take it easy for the day. And then I'll go to pay my respects in some sort of way, whether it's to family or to God, just to be grateful.

[Host]

What is the manifestation of that? What does that look like?

[Guest]

Well, with either go see my family. So I've got some cousins or grandparents or uncles and aunties who are around to spend some time with them because I've realized recently that they appreciate that a lot more than we think. But as I got older, I started to realize that they're not going to be here forever. And a lot of them are quite old. So I don't want to spend the other three quarters of my life regretting the first quarter. So I do it for the love, but at the same time, the fear of regret. Keeps you on your toes.

[Host]

Yeah. When you're spending time with them, with the elders, what are you doing with them?

[Guest]

Just a whole bunch of things. We might be playing games like dominoes or cards, traditional games. Or we could just be eating. Like usually the elders in the family, they'll prepare some food and then everyone will get together and I'll just talk about stories from back in the day and who knows how long those grandparents will be alive for? So it's just nice to be around that.

[Host]

Do you kind of ask your grandparents big questions? Do you ever open any big doors?

[Guest]

Yeah, I definitely do, but very, very rarely.

[Host]

When does that happen?

[Guest]

I mean, my family, my grandparents back in the day, they went through some hardships during the war and so sometimes it's very difficult to talk to them about those type of questions. They, they really don't like talking about them. They just get unwillingly uncomfortable around those type of discussions. So I just.

[Host]

What are we talking about?

[Guest]

Just war related stuff.

[Host]

Okay.

[Guest]

Yeah.

[Host]

Are there kind of a lot of mysteries?

[Guest]

Not really any mysteries. They're good people, of course, but they just went through a lot. So a lot of the things that maybe would help me get the clearest picture, I don't feel comfortable asking, so. And I don't ever see myself in that position.

[Host]

Yeah. Do you feel like you're like them? Like you see a kind of pattern from them to you?

[Guest]

I don't know. At the end of the day, they're 60 years older than me, so our similarities are going to be very limited just because of that. But then some of the traits that let's say my grandma has are very clean and persistent and hard working. I like to see myself as having those as well.

[Host]

What do they think of you?

[Guest]

Oh, they think I'm good now.

[Host]

Now?

[Guest]

Yeah.

[Host]

But not before?

[Guest]

No, before, definitely no. I mean, maybe they did, but I was just getting up to trouble, you know?

[Host]

What is that? Come on then, what's trouble like?

[Guest]

Just being a kid, fooling around, staying out late, meeting girls.

[Host]

Oh, so nothing too bad?

[Guest]

No, nothing crazy, but it's just you're allowed to meet girls, of course, but when you're growing up, it's a bit of a problem.

[Host]

Is there anything you look back on and go, I was really stupid then?

[Guest]

I think that everything I went through resulted in me being the man I am today. So it was worth it.

[Host]

So there's no like particular now. That's the end of that cycle of my life and I'm now a man.

[Guest]

No, no.

[Host]

What is a man?

[Guest]

That's the thing.

[Host]

How does one become one?

[Guest]

He has to die. That's the irony in it. You'll never know because you're always learning until the day you die. So.

[Host]

There'S lots of theories out there about how someone becomes a man.

[Guest]

Learning how to accept pain, that's interesting. Pain comes in all shapes and sizes. I mean, you got, let's say, emotional pain from grievances from loved ones or friends passing away. Or you could have Physical pain from illnesses, worrying pain. There's so many different types of pain. So once you can realize how to see those thoughts as not you, but just your problem and just kind of separate those two, then I feel like you have the ability then to become a man quite easily.

[Host]

What's been the greatest pain of your life, would you say?

[Guest]

I'd say letting myself down, I lost some parts of myself that I'm still working on getting back.

[Host]

Okay.

[Guest]

All in all, being more in touch with myself, being more in touch with my feelings, my emotions, my state of mind, knowing when and where I need to do something. The way I expressed my love to other people, those, those aspects of myself.

[Host]

I'd say, what was it that made you lose touch with those things?

[Guest]

Well, trying to cut them off, actually. Those feelings, those connections to my emotions. Younger me thought that that was the way you had to become a man. I felt like I had to cut off my emotions. One example would be where I thought that I had fallen in love with someone and I was wrong. But not necessarily about them, but about myself and about where my feelings were lying. So after it all went wrong, I kind of spent a lot of time trying to feel nothing.

[Host]

Are you good in a relationship?

[Guest]

I mean, I always enjoy the beginning of it very much as I think most people do. And then it kind of quite nice.

[Host]

Okay.

[Guest]

It's just the end before.

[Host]

Why do you think your relationships in the past have failed?

[Guest]

First, simply, I was just immature.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Guest]

I didn't know how to treat a woman. Just my whole perception of what someone deserves was kind of mixed up.

[Host]

So when was the turning point? We realized, okay, that's actually maybe how I should be treating people.

[Guest]

Well, it took me cheating on someone and finding out their reaction to it, that kind of.

[Host]

They weren't happy about it.

[Guest]

Yeah, definitely not.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Guest]

That made me realize that it's wasn't right.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Guest]

And I'm quite strong on morals. I pride myself on having morals, especially now. So if I don't know how to treat a woman properly, then that's a big lack in morals.

[Host]

Yeah. What was it like being found out? I mean, what was that emotion like?

[Guest]

It was just annoying in the beginning. It was just annoying that I got caught because me and my girlfriend at the time, we were at her house.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Guest]

And then she basically sent me to the shops to go get something. And then while I've been gone, she's gone on my phone. She somehow logged into my account, then just seen messages. Yeah.

[Host]

So you come out from the shops and I Was like bosh.

[Guest]

Yeah, exactly. I was caught and I didn't know what to do. I had no plan in my head for the moment.

[Host]

You're someone that likes to have a plan. Yeah, exactly.

[Guest]

Yeah.

[Host]

So this was really like your kryptonites. This wasn't a good time.

[Guest]

Exactly.

[Host]

So you're back from the shops. She's found out.

[Guest]

She started with questions. She hasn't necessarily given me a chance to own up for it, but she just wants to see if I'll admit to it. If, like, through slight questioning.

[Host]

I see.

[Guest]

And I haven't.

[Host]

I see. I see.

[Guest]

And then it's just got just shitter and shitter from there. Because I just kept on lying. Oh, no, because I lied from the beginning. But then by the time it got to the point where she lie and.

[Host]

Lie and lie, it all gets very messy.

[Guest]

And by the time it gets to the point where she's showing me messages, I'm just lying for no reason. Realizing that fucked up.

[Host]

Yeah. And, like, when she had gone and in the days of time after that, what do you remember feeling in those following days?

[Guest]

It was just regret, kind of. But then as it got into the months, I started doing some more deeper thinking into the whole situation and onto me as a character and my traits. And then I started realizing it's not a thing where you can just think for a bit about how to be a better person and be a better person. It's a constant lifelong thing. Like, there's always room to improve. There's always ways to be a better person.

[Host]

But yet she. She did change you in some way.

[Guest]

Yeah, I'll say that. Definitely. And it's good because she made me realize how maybe wrong I've treated girls in the past as well before her.

[Host]

Does she know that she's helped you with that?

[Guest]

I don't think so. I mean, I wouldn't admit it to her.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Guest]

Sorry. There's no way that she can say for certain, but maybe she's. Maybe she's had a hint. I don't know. Maybe. To be honest, it's kind of backwards because now I don't really talk to women that much anymore because I'm in that mindset that the next person I talk to I want to marry. So if I. Yeah.

[Host]

Wow.

[Guest]

Yeah.

[Host]

Hang on. Just. Let's do a little rewind for a minute. When you say talk to.

[Guest]

Oh, when I mean talk to. I mean, to get into a relationship, I don't really see the relationship. I just see, like, a partner. Yeah. That's a Big responsibility.

[Host]

Well, yeah, it's like. It's a big call in terms of like, you know, the next person I'm in a relationship, that's my like.

[Guest]

I'm not saying it will be, but.

[Host]

I'm saying you're taking it seriously.

[Guest]

Yeah, exactly, yeah. Because I don't see any point in waiting any longer and I'd rather be with someone from younger than later, if you get what I'm saying.

[Host]

Have you got any potential people in mind?

[Guest]

Nah, not really. Not yet. Not yet. It'll come if it's meant to.

[Host]

So where do you find people generally? Where are they?

[Guest]

Nowhere, man. They ain't around. Not about. But when I do meet people, usually at night, either club or something like that.

[Host]

You a good dancer?

[Guest]

Not really. I'm quite stiff when it comes to dancing.

[Host]

Do you put in an effort or just.

[Guest]

Yeah, if I'm drunk then I'll put in the effort.

[Host]

But just loiter around the edges.

[Guest]

Yeah, exactly. I just be like, this is not my life. Exactly.

[Host]

Are you good at Seducer, would you say?

[Guest]

I couldn't tell you. I mean, I think I'm alright but I just go based off on their vibe and I just try and match that if I'm feeling it. But I don't have a specific go to.

[Host]

So you go to clubs but you're not a big clubber?

[Guest]

I'm not a big clubber, no. We've all kind of grown out of it. We never really had that experience though that you hear the older generations talking about. My kind of friendship group. We never really had the club experience, the nightlife experience where just everything was crazy. Like the pre cell phone era. Because I grew up in a time where the iPhones started coming out around the time when I was in secondary.

[Host]

So you're the peak. Bad timing.

[Guest]

Yeah, exactly. Just when they've proper started coming out and they're becoming a bit more affordable.

[Host]

Do you wish you lived in an era without them?

[Guest]

Oh, definitely. Really? I wish that every day. Every day.

[Host]

That's big.

[Guest]

It just makes you so reliant. And I read a little part of a book recently called the Anxious Generation, which I didn't buy nothing, I just seen it and I've read a few pages and just talking about how a mix of social media and smartphone use have deteriorated everyone's ability to think for themselves and kind of made everyone just fall in line with social norms. And they have no attention span because they're used to going on social media and scrolling every two seconds and. Yeah, so if you could press a.

[Host]

Button and, like, just wish them away. Would you press the button?

[Guest]

Yeah, I would, definitely.

[Host]

And everyone's cell phone free. It's gone.

[Guest]

Yeah, you do it. That's a serious idea. Definitely. Because we were living before without them, we could live today without them. But you just rely now on technology and the simple answer. Yeah, I would, I would.

[Host]

Do you feel a bit annoyed that it's like. Do you feel a bit like a kind of guinea pig?

[Guest]

I think we're kind of set up, honestly, as young people these days. We're going to secondary school and primary school, just taught how to be straight as a ruler. There's no creativity in most of the things you do. And then we saw this lie about how unis the most important way of life and I don't know, there's just too much stress. When I was a kid, it's like so much of the things that I was learning, they've just never helped me in any way. And I get it, you need them to get your qualifications and so forth. But what about the 50%, at least of the workforce who don't use their university degree?

[Host]

Do you wish all your schooling and everything was different then?

[Guest]

I feel like school is essential to life and growing up because you need the socialization, you need the social skills. That whole experience, it just prepares you for later on in life. And so I kind of feel school is essential, but you also need to kind of encourage certain things and not put as much emphasis on STEM subjects, which are all good. I agree with them all, of course.

[Host]

What were you good at at school?

[Guest]

I was good at science.

[Host]

Oh, science.

[Guest]

Yeah, I was quite good at science.

[Host]

Nice. Has that carried on?

[Guest]

No, it hasn't. Oh, not really.

[Host]

What carried on from school?

[Guest]

Not much. Not much at all. Except for social skills. And you could have got those at home. Yeah, exactly. Nah, not at home. No way. Come on.

[Host]

Talking to your parents.

[Guest]

Nah, you need the laughter, you need the jokes, you need the character building you go through as well. You see, it's like captive animals that get released into the wild. They just like most of the time there's a specific age limit where you can release them, because if you release them when they're too old and they haven't been in the wild, they'll just get, like, obliterated.

[Host]

Were you with the cool gang at school?

[Guest]

Were you one of the cooler ones? I had my batch. I had my batch of friends batch of cool ones. We had about, I don't know, like 1. 8, 9899 10.

[Host]

Still you still see them?

[Guest]

Yeah, yeah. Still friends with.

[Host]

Bach is strong.

[Guest]

Yeah, Bach is strong. Circles tight.

[Host]

That's lovely. You'll look out for each other?

[Guest]

Yeah, of course. Always. Always.

[Host]

How often do you see each other?

[Guest]

Well, some of them I see minimum two, three times a week. But some others I won't see for two months at a time. It's fine because everyone's just focusing on their own things. So I'm not gonna hate you for trying to better yourself. That's the biggest favor you can do to me, trying to better yourself.

[Host]

I like that. All batch men.

[Guest]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host]

You know where we've talked about what a man is and all that stuff? Do you talk about that with your batch of men?

[Guest]

Yeah, some of them have the opinion, they think quite that traditionally, which I also agree with that being strong and being able to fend for yourself. But they focus too much on, you know, traditional macho man, which I get as well and I respect because I lack in that part. I would like to go to the gym more, working, more macho. Not necessarily macho, my eyes, but it's just more fit because health is wealth at the end of the day. So they're doing themselves the best favor that they can by doing that. But at the end of the day, if you're putting all your eggs in that basket, then you're not giving yourself any space to grow in other ways.

[Host]

Yeah, it's very true. Very true. So what are you good at?

[Guest]

I don't know. I consider myself a hard worker. I'm to my mind, something again.

[Host]

Do you remember your first time? You really worked hard at something.

[Guest]

I remember one time when I was a kid, I was on holiday with some of my cousins and we found an old pedal boat. You know the ones that have the two seats in the front that they use to pedal and the pedalo.

[Host]

Is that what they're called?

[Guest]

I don't know. God knows. We found one of those that was washed up on the shore and it was like abandoned. No one was using it and we all wanted to fix it and take it out into the ocean. And so we thought, yeah, cool, how are we going to do this? And I've come up with the idea to just all of us go sell our things. So we've got together like all of our possessions at that moment. I remember I was 5 years old when this happened and all I've had is my sandals and a book on spaceships and we all chipped in our own little thing. God knows what else was there. I Just remember my sandals. And the book. So we've gone around on the beach just asking people like, would you want to buy these things? And then everyone's just ignoring us, ignoring us, ignoring us. Until one woman just bought everything off us. And then she told us, oh no, keep the things. So she's obviously just felt bad for us and disrespected it. And then, I don't know, we got about €10, 15, €20 from this. And we've tried to talk our parents into taking the money to go fix the boat but yeah, of course they knew that €20 wasn't even nowhere near what they needed to fix that. And so we've just taken the cash and gone to a bar down the road and each had our fanners and yeah, that was it.

[Host]

That's a good. That's great.

[Guest]

Yeah, I remember working hard for that we like when I was in my five year old mind. Yeah, I just remember. In the boiling sun with your sandals. Exactly. Like it was mad. It was mad.

[Host]

And so what does hard work mean now then? That was then. And what's the modern hard work?

[Guest]

Sticking to whatever job is at the moment, whatever you say you're going to do, get it done. Making sure that my responsibilities, the basic ones, are taken care of so the house is clean, making sure that the dogs walked and fed, making sure the family's alright. That's hard work. And that's the best type of work as well, in my opinion.

[Host]

Do you work for people?

[Guest]

Yeah, you could say I work for people.

[Host]

And is it kind of long work?

[Guest]

Yeah, some of it's tiring. When I take a gardening shift, it won't be much of gardening, it'll just be a bunch of heavy labour, which is fine. I definitely am the type of person who enjoys hard labor more than mundane tasks. Standing behind the cash register or something like that.

[Host]

Sitting behind a computer.

[Guest]

Computer, yeah, exactly. That's not me. I couldn't do that.

[Host]

You need to be on the back.

[Guest]

Exactly.

[Host]

So it's a bit of gardening.

[Guest]

Yeah, that's just. Yeah, that's one of them.

[Host]

You've got gardening. Give me a little hint of another barista. So you like doing loads of different stuff?

[Guest]

Yeah, that way I don't get bored as well of what I'm doing. It's always a different type of group, different crowd, different types of new people. That's interesting. I like that aspect of it.

[Host]

Who do you meet? Gardening.

[Guest]

Gardening. I don't really meet people like that, but I like that about it. I just get to Work me, whatever it is I'm shoveling and my thoughts. That's kind of like therapy.

[Host]

It is. That's what. That's the best thing for you, is it gardening? It's just the space to do it. Most people don't have the gardens to garden.

[Guest]

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

[Host]

Everyone should have the space.

[Guest]

100%. 100%.

[Host]

You know, it shouldn't be a fight. I think it's quite clever of you to get lots of different gigs and just figure out what you actually are passionate about, what really helps you. Do you feel like you're going to do that for a while, do a lot of different stuff, or do you feel like there's a point you're going to specialize?

[Guest]

I'd like to specialize, I'll be honest, but when I find the thing that I want to do, I'll just do it. I spend a lot of time rushing, so now I just want to take my time and let it all come to me.

[Host]

And just what do you spend your money on when you've got your money?

[Guest]

For example? Sometimes I go to the casino. Oh, that's.

[Host]

That's interesting.

[Guest]

I'll be down and all.

[Host]

Oh, hello.

[Guest]

Yeah, exactly.

[Host]

Casino.

[Guest]

Literally, I just go and lose 200, 100 in a night.

[Host]

How often do you do that?

[Guest]

Nah, not often.

[Host]

That's happened every now.

[Guest]

Again, every few months.

[Host]

Have you ever had a good experience?

[Guest]

Yeah, that's why I go back, of course.

[Host]

Hit me with the high. Come on.

[Guest]

It was the first time I went where I just never been before, and I was freshly 18, going to the casino, one of my mates, and I've literally just put 20 pound down and we've ended up on the roulette table for the next, like five hours. And I've just gone up, down, up, down, up, down. Like, the casino would not let me go until I'd gone to about, I think, 200, 240, something like that. And I just cashed out and I've left. That was just mad.

[Host]

What was the highest you were at any given point at that time? Do you remember?

[Guest]

Oh, I don't think I went above 300. So, like, I wasn't in any crazy ranges. I was just going up, down, up, down.

[Host]

So that got you into it.

[Guest]

Yeah, exactly.

[Host]

And then since then, it's more the thrill.

[Guest]

I enjoy the thrill of losing money and, you know, feeling like money's an important thing to me.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Guest]

And just enjoy the thrill of being able to win more and possibly losing it.

[Host]

Yeah, yeah.

[Guest]

I don't know what it is, I guess. Release adrenaline, dopamine, but whatever it is.

[Host]

What's the weirdest thing you spend money on?

[Guest]

The weirdest. I buy camping equipment or something.

[Host]

Yeah, that's not weird.

[Guest]

Yeah, that's something. So you go camping here and there. Okay, Enjoy it.

[Host]

Where'd you go? Do you remember your first time?

[Guest]

I've gone before when I was a kid, of course, my parents. That's how I started it. Yeah. And then as I got older, I just started going by myself.

[Host]

Really?

[Guest]

With my dog.

[Host]

That's sweet.

[Guest]

Yeah, that would be nice.

[Host]

Sell camping to me. Slash, anyone listening who's like, oh, never go camping. Have you seen Nuts in May?

[Guest]

Nuts in Me Now. What's that?

[Host]

It's one of the best films ever about camping. Anyway.

[Guest]

No way. I need to watch that one.

[Host]

It's incredible. Nuts in Me. Anyway, let's go back. Sell camping to me.

[Guest]

I know loads of people that have experienced camping, but they don't enjoy it. But I feel like they don't enjoy it because they're seeking comfort through the camping. But a lot of the comfort in camping comes from the unpredictability of it and not knowing in how long you're gonna have your next meal because you're on this hike or whatever trying to get firewood to do this and you've got to do it all yourself. And I don't know that feeling of just surviving off. I feel like the modern young man needs to just get out and just like build a fire, have some food over it, maybe catch his own food through fishing and just chill by the fire and just. That's the day, that's the night for you. I don't know. Have I sold it to you?

[Host]

No, that was pretty good. I think you've done a good job there.

[Guest]

I just forget about everything and live with nature, basically. This is the best feeling ever. It's just, what's it like taking it alone?

[Host]

What's that feeling like?

[Guest]

Well, I mean, I don't know. I really enjoy it alone. Just because it's just me and my thoughts and I have so much time and so much motivation to think. And it's not false thinking, it's just the flow of thinking that makes it so nice.

[Host]

How big's the tent?

[Guest]

Small. Proper small.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Guest]

It's a one man, one man tent. Yeah.

[Host]

What about the dog? Sure the dog gets in there.

[Guest]

Yeah. Summertime, he sleeps outside.

[Host]

Oh, yeah. Fair play.

[Guest]

He likes outside. He hates coming in a tent.

[Host]

Oh, really?

[Guest]

Absolutely hates.

[Host]

I have never thought about dogs in tents. Yeah.

[Guest]

Yeah, exactly. Like even the bigger ones with maybe a bit of ventilation, a few open ends and that, it would be better. But my little tent with the smallest little holes of ventilation don't do them. Nice. Oh yeah, amazing.

[Host]

Have you had any kind of great disaster that you've kind of come through the other side and like felt great accomplishment?

[Guest]

Definitely. Well, I've gone up this mountain with two of my mates and my dog in the beginning of February.

[Host]

Oh, so it's cold.

[Guest]

It's the coldest. Exactly. So we've gone to the top, hiked it.

[Host]

Can I ask which mountain it was.

[Guest]

In the league district.

[Host]

Yeah. Okay.

[Guest]

We didn't check the weather or nothing. We just said fuck it, let's go. And on the way up it was alright. It wasn't too bad. It was raining like shit weather for a hike, but wasn't too bad. When we got there we wanted to have a fire because it's just so cold. It's just freezing. And we've gone on a little expedition to find wood to burn. So we've set off, I don't know, it must have been about two or three o' clock or something and walked for about 20, 30 minutes. And as we found some logs to burn, it started to rain. We're there trying to break up this fallen log and chop it. So we're there just hacking away with a hatchet until we finally got a piece. But it just gotten dark, like completely dark. And the problem was that to get back to our camp we had to cross a river. And the only way across the river was just by stepping on stones. And during the daytime it's scary, but during the night time it's even worse because you can just about see where you're stepping. We've got to the river. And not only that, we've had this.

[Host]

Oh, you got wood on your.

[Guest]

Exactly. We've got all this fat tree on us that we're trying to take over the river and the fog has started so you can't even see more than a few meters in front of you. And the water is proper, proper, like fast flowing. You're definitely dying if you fall in that. We've got no other choice, so we have to cross. We managed to cross it somehow with this tree on our backs. We finally got him back and my friend was just like. He was just amazed to see us. He thought we were dead. He literally thought we were dead. He didn't know what to do and he was just there with my dog. And the next few hours we spent Trying to light the fire didn't work. Strong winds, strong rain and fog. So it was just the worst conditions ever. Going to sleep that night and breathing in and just feeling like my lungs were covered in ice. Like it must have touched the minuses. It must have. And so, yeah, we spent that night in just agony, like pain. Oh, no. And then we were planning to stay for two days, straight away, next morning, straight back down, and that was the end of that.

[Host]

I mean, it's impressive that you just lasted a night.

[Guest]

Yeah. But we couldn't go back down during the night. That would have been probably even worse.

[Host]

Oh, man. You have to, like, huddle up together for walk.

[Guest]

No, I was in my own tent with my dog and this night I just grabbed him and I threw him in my tank and they were in their tent. So, yeah, I was just there with this smelly, wet dog next to me. But he did provide a lot of warmth, I'll be honest, a lot of warmth.

[Host]

Incredible. So you thank your parents for the camping time?

[Guest]

Exactly, I thank them for introducing me to it.

[Host]

Oh, very sweet.

[Guest]

Yeah, it's proper.

[Host]

What else do you thank your parents for, apart from making you?

[Guest]

They've shown me right from wrong. That's the most important thing to know, right from wrong.

[Host]

Here's a big question for you. You like camping, right? Could you just live like that forever? Do you know what I mean? I didn't know. Do you ever think about that?

[Guest]

Honestly? All the time. All the time? Yeah, literally. I've dreams, just. I don't know, going to a wilderness, Tibet or something and just. It's that classic dream of just going into the mountains and just living off the land. I do see myself doing that and I wouldn't be surprised if that. That's where I turn out, really. And I don't think I'd be annoyed at all. I love it.

[Host]

What's stopping you? Doing it sooner rather than later.

[Guest]

Trying to sort my family out of it. Give back to my parents.

[Host]

Would they understand, though, if that was, like, in you, like most solid parents would be like, well, if that is your thing and that is your spirit, then it's hard to hold that back.

[Guest]

My mom would stress a lot. They want me to keep in contact. Of course. Of course. But they'll be stressed. But I thought they'd accept it.

[Host]

You could take a lo. Air tag.

[Guest]

Yeah. Exactly.

[Host]

How far do you have to be?

[Guest]

They're probably gps, so must be worldwide.

[Host]

There you go. Yeah, get an air tag.

[Guest]

I saw it.

[Host]

Look, he's up the mountain. Again.

[Guest]

Oh, look, he's at the bottom.

[Host]

He's in a river. Could have quite a lot of fun.

[Guest]

Yeah. Literally, he's making bets on me.

[Host]

So what's your dream? Wilderness.

[Guest]

I want to see everywhere. I want to see three places specifically. I want to see South America, East Asia, northwest of Asia as well, so towards Kazakhstan. And all the stones up there, I currently name them right now.

[Host]

See every stone you can. That's what I say.

[Guest]

Exactly. And I've seen videos on the wilderness in all three of those places. And I just want to see the way of life and nature and just like the world. And I like seeing different ways of life and taking what I can from them. I like the sun, so I need to go somewhere that's got some sun.

[Host]

That's absolutely fair. You can always just do a bigger trip and just see how you feel in that bigger trip. And then do a couple of months somewhere.

[Guest]

Exactly.

[Host]

And then see how you feel after that.

[Guest]

That is the plan. That is the plan.

[Host]

That's the plan, exactly.

[Guest]

Yeah.

[Host]

Amazing.

[Guest]

Just to see. See how it is. Save up some money, go for a bit.

[Host]

And also you can be a huge inspiration to other people, not just yourself. Like, think of all the people you meet and what you then give them spiritually through how you live. You know, there's a lot you can pass on.

[Guest]

No, 100%. That's it. That's why I just always try to explore different ways of life and different ways of thinking about things and going about things. Yeah.

[Host]

Yeah. Well, I hope it works.

[Guest]

Thank you. Hopefully it works as well for you, too.

[Host]

What are you gonna do next?

[Guest]

I don't know.

[Host]

That was a long old pause for I don't know.

[Guest]

This is such a good question. Survive and then thrive.

[Host]

Beautiful. Well, there we go. Thank you very much for your time.

[Guest]

Thank you for the questions. Gave me a lot to think about.

[Host]

That's the dream.

[Guest]

That's it. Man.

[Musician]

Might go outside today See where it gets me. Sometimes a man's only built for himself Boots and a stick I can stick to myself I was born inside on the sofa by the telly so comfy I died in it deep where the woke up with 40 years work and a hangover My head was cool.

[Host]

Couldn'T.

[Guest]

Get in.

[Musician]

Sometimes a man has to be his own shoulder to crown Climb off that hill that boy said that you'd die on Got too cold up there. It's fine. You got thick skin. Sometimes a man is to simply get older get straight like a soldier and send me off into the wild what can this man do to fix what that boy did? Sometimes a boy has to look love himself first. Sometimes a boy ends up treating you worse. But I'm going outside and I'm up on my feet. I've enough to survive if there's enough room for me. If there's room for a fire and there's somewhere to sleep. There's nothing to do and there's no one to see. There's a hill or a mountain with a river downstream. You just keep your head up. Cause the drop's kind of steep. Sometimes a man can forget what that means. Jump in some river and see where it gets me.