EPISODE 85: Where All The Trouble Lies

Summary

Strangers on a Bench

Episode 85: Where All The Trouble Lies

Host: Tom Rosenthal
Date: April 27, 2026

---

Overview

In this episode of Strangers on a Bench, Tom Rosenthal sits down with an anonymous older man in a UK park, who shares candid reflections about his colorful, tumultuous life. The conversation winds through stories of dangerous encounters, love and loss, infidelity, aging, family complexities, work, and the beauty of everyday pleasures.

With Tom’s gentle curiosity, the interviewee speaks honestly about trauma, regret, and resilience, delivering both raw confessions and humour. The episode is a rich patchwork of narrative — at turns thrilling, funny, poignant, and deeply human.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. On Time, Days, and Work (00:04 – 03:05)

• The interviewee describes how, at his age, days blend together:
  • "Can't say I do, really. They're all pretty much the same. Sometimes I wonder which day it is, you know?" (00:51)
• Shares fond memories of working in an ice cream factory:
  • Joyful atmosphere, free ice cream, and humorous police encounter involving transporting tubs home.
  • "It was all bright and sunny in there and everyone was sort of happy. It was ridiculous." (01:29)
  • Recounts getting stopped by police when carrying ice cream through a park:
    • "'It's ice cream. What do you expect to find?' And he's going, 'Well, could be diamonds. It could be any. Ridiculous.'" (02:38)

2. Encounters with Danger and Violence (03:05 – 10:23)

• He tells story after story of brushes with violence, especially involving knives:
  • Being stabbed in leg, buttock, and arm by an outraged husband while decorating a flat.
  • "There's a fucking geezer with a knife, big carving knife. And lunged at me, stabbed me in the leg and the buttock." (03:41)
  • The traumatic aftermath: paranoia, job loss, and fear for his life.
  • Additional violent episodes: near-fatal fights in laundrettes and pubs; saved by the intimidating reputation of his "bank robber" brother.

3. Family, Aging & Health (10:23 – 18:40)

• Reflects on aging and physical health:
  • At 75, with half his lungs surgically removed after lung cancer:
    • "I've only got half my lungs left. I had them taken out. Is that 10 years ago?... Actually, no different." (12:14 – 12:27)
    • Smoking since age 10; recognizes both the damage and solace it provided.
    • "Some geezer in a pub... said, 'I hope you get lung cancer…' And, yeah, got what he wanted. I hope he fell down a fucking drain hole." (13:36)
  • Takes 32 pills each day as a result of his operation and age-related ailments.
• Finds pleasure in small things:
  • "I take pleasure from little things in life." (17:02)
  • Enjoys observing nature in parks: crocuses, birds, trees, and neighborhood dogs.

4. Love, Marriage, and Loss (18:40 – 24:08)

• Discusses his late wife:
  • Married 47 years; describes her as stoic and underappreciated until after her passing.
  • "It's true when they say you don't appreciate what you got until it's gone." (18:58)
  • Recounts her quick decline from throat cancer, his shock, and devastation.
• Shares the sometimes-comic, sometimes-dangerous origins of their relationship, involving a love triangle and another knife threat.

5. Extramarital Affairs, Regret & Reflection (24:08 – 43:34)

• Admits to a number of affairs, flings, and one-night stands:
  • "A fling and a fair... A fair few months. Long term? Yeah." (27:14, 27:23)
  • When asked about numbers, admits to "5-7" one-night stands, "4" flings, and "1" proper affair. (27:44-28:20)
• Regrets infidelities:
  • Explains motivations: feeling excluded during child-rearing years, temptations at work, and the allure of being desired.
  • Wonders if wife might have reciprocated, but is "as sure as you can be" that she did not.
• Most regretted: failing to communicate and drifting during critical family periods.

6. Parenting and Estrangement (43:34 – 54:55)

• Father to two, grandfather to six; daughter died recently after 25 years estrangement.
• Details heartbreak after daughter ran off, substance abuse, and his perceived failings as a parent.
  • "It was like she died and I did all my grieving for her that year. And after that I just didn't think about her. She just meant nothing to me." (55:25)
• Candid about being emotionally distant; reflects on regrets about granting daughter "permission" to have a boyfriend at age 12 while distracted by his own affair.

7. Identity, Solitude & Self-Searching (43:34 – 49:02)

• Voices a need, now in late life, for solitude and self-understanding:
  • "I've had to be a worker, had to be a husband, had to be a father. I want to find who I am… I want to get back to who I could have been. I don't know. It's in there. I need to draw it out before I die." (46:12)
• Expresses simultaneous resignation and acceptance:
  • "This is my life. How can I be anything different?" (46:56)

8. Life's "Paths Not Taken" (36:40 – 42:23)

• Shares story of a four-year affair with a millionaire’s daughter—turned down her proposal, fearing being "posh" would be a lie.
  • Notes taking each other for granted as the death knell for relationships:
    • "That's the worst thing you can do in a relationship. That's where all these troubles fucking lie." (42:59)
  • Reiterates marriage was his "staple"—his anchor to normality.

9. Work and the Simple Life (49:02 – 52:46)

• Hosted numerous odd jobs; left one after just half an hour as warehouse "manager" when he disliked the environment.
• Finds pleasure in giving and receiving small things—most notably, receiving a tin of sardines from Tom as "payment" for the chat.

10. Reflections on Legacy, Mortality & Funerals (59:58 – 62:13)

• Indifferent to funeral arrangements:
  • "Take it. Get burned… Chuck [my ashes] up here." (60:24, 60:33)
  • Wants to be scattered, possibly "like stardust" from a rocket, or on a favorite park bench.
• Recounts scattering his own mother's ashes (amid comical uncertainty about location).
• Engages with the idea that, perhaps, his whole conversation is an act—a performance:
  • "I'm on stage, mate. This is by act... I'm just sharpening it up." (62:42)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On surviving trauma with humour:
  "I managed to kick him off. Bent the knife in half and while he was trying to straighten the blade that's took me, Charles. I could run out…" (04:01)
• On nostalgia and change:
  "When I was young you could go out and get a job any day if you didn't like it, you could pack it up in the morning, go get another job for the afternoon." (50:01)
• On infidelity and regret:
  "I always looked upon my marriage as one staple thing in my life I could rely on that would keep me from my madness..." (43:34)
• On simple pleasures:
  "I take pleasure from little things in life." (17:02)
  "This is nice. This is like having an ice cream." (49:09)
• On coming to terms with life:
  "How can I be anything different? How can you not be sitting doing this? You just have to." (46:56)
• On parenthood and changing times:
  "When they asked me, I mean, it weren’t a done thing. It was just coming into happening. I had to get all gowned up. Time they'd done that, she had it." (31:05 – 31:36)
• On legacy and the limits of change:
  "What I do like is the idea of going up in a rocket and then exploding. Scattered in space. Yeah, that'd be like stardust." (61:43)
• On the interview itself:
  "I'm glad I met you, because, you know, I'd just be wandering aimlessly about… Which path shall I take?" (36:27)

---

Timestamps of Key Segments

| Segment | Timestamp | |------------------------------------------------|-------------| | Favourite days & ice cream factory story | 00:04-03:05 | | Knife attacks, trauma, police stories | 03:05-10:23 | | Aging, lung surgery, and views on smoking | 10:23-18:40 | | Love, wife, grief and origin stories | 18:40-24:08 | | Affairs, infidelity, reflections, regret | 24:08-43:34 | | Children, estrangement, grandkids | 43:34-49:02 | | Odd jobs, sardines, and the nature of work | 49:02-52:46 | | Legacy, mortality, funeral wishes | 59:58-62:13 | | Final reflections and sardines as payment | 62:13-end |

---

Tone & Conclusion

The conversation is frank and earthy, colored by black humor, nostalgia, and a streak of gentle bitterness. Tom’s warmth and curiosity draw out stories that are both extraordinary and everyday, painting a vivid picture of one man’s complex journey through work, love, violence, and aging.

This episode is a masterclass in oral storytelling — both a confession and a celebration of a life not lived always wisely, but always fully.

---

Memorable Closing Exchange:
Tom: "How have you found the experience of talking to a stranger on a bench?"
Interviewee: "All right… been okay. Sweet." (58:51)

"And I got some sardines. Fuck me. They won't believe this when I go home. I met a bloke up at the park. He gave me a tin of sardines." (63:39)

---

(End of summary)

Transcript

[Interviewer]

Hello. Sorry to bother you. Can I ask you a slightly odd question? I'm making a podcast called Strangers on a Bench where essentially I talk to people I don't know on benches for 10 or 15 minutes. Are you up for that? Do you want to give it a. Do you have a favorite day of the week?

[Interviewee]

Can't say I do, really. They're all pretty much the same. Sometimes I wonder which day it is, you know?

[Interviewer]

Do you know what day it is today?

[Interviewee]

I was going to say Sunday, but it's Monday.

[Interviewer]

There we go. Can you remember the best Monday of your life?

[Interviewee]

No.

[Interviewer]

Can you remember a time in your life when you enjoyed Mondays the most?

[Interviewee]

I've had a few jobs where I couldn't wait to get back on the Monday year.

[Interviewer]

What were those jobs? If you could think of one particular job where you were most excited to

[Interviewee]

get back, one that comes to mind straight away is I worked in an ice cream factory.

[Interviewer]

Well, hey.

[Interviewee]

And it was. It was all bright and sunny in there and everyone was sort of happy. It was ridiculous.

[Interviewer]

Why was it ridiculous?

[Interviewee]

Well, it's like a scene from a Carry on film, you know, all enjoying yourself and. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So what was your. What was your role in the ice cream factory?

[Interviewee]

Just chucking all the ingredients together in a big vat and hope for the best. Turn the switch and stir it all up, clean up afterwards.

[Interviewer]

Did it change your relationship with ice cream?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, it was great at first. And you could buy a cheap chest freezer, brand new, like for 30 quid or something because you got like four tubs of ice cream every week.

[Interviewer]

All right. You gotta give it as an added bonus.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Did you manage to get through these four tubs?

[Interviewee]

No, that's why we bought the freezer.

[Interviewer]

So you just left with endless time to put it all in?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. I got stopped by a police one. I went home one lunchtime with the ice cream. I had to cross this little park and he was chasing after me. Stop, stop. Anyway, wanted to see what I'd got in my little package, you know. And then I said, well, it's ice cream. What do you expect to find? And he's going, well, could be diamonds. It could be any. Ridiculous.

[Interviewer]

Could be diamonds in the ice cream, I suppose.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, exactly.

[Interviewer]

Maybe that's a place to hide.

[Interviewee]

D.

[Interviewer]

Talk about police. Is that the only time a policeman has stopped?

[Interviewee]

No, no. God, no.

[Interviewer]

Oh, you've had a few.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, I've had a few, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Oh, exciting. When was are in any particular notable ones? The most thrilling one.

[Interviewee]

Thrilling ones according to when I got stabbed, I guess.

[Interviewer]

Okay, right, okay. Can you tell me about that?

[Interviewee]

I was working in a flat, decorating. I just finished packing all my tools up and the flat was empty. It was dead quiet. And I heard this little rattle on the letter box.

[Interviewer]

Rattle.

[Interviewee]

Like someone looking through the flat, you know, I'll go and have a look at this. And Casino went through the glass. I opened the door and there's a fucking geezer with a knife, big carving knife. And lunged at me, stabbed me in the leg and the buttock.

[Interviewer]

In the buttock?

[Interviewee]

My right buttock? Yeah, a couple of times. And slashed me across the arm like a defense spoon, I guess. Anyway, I managed to kick him off. Bent the knife in half and while he was trying to straighten the blade that's took me, Charles. I could run out and so getting back to the police.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, so what? The police came.

[Interviewee]

I ran into a factory which is nearby and they put tourney k and phone the police. And then I got whizzed down to the hospital in the back of the police car with the sirens and everything going 90 mile an hour. Yeah, it was wicked.

[Interviewer]

Do you remember. Sorry. Do you remember enjoying going through the traffic on the police car?

[Interviewee]

I remember sort of going down this hill there and we sort of took off through the lights. Push. This is great, you know. And the cop was holding me arm up.

[Interviewer]

Amazing. By the sounds of it. It sounds like it would have been quite a traumatic event. But you remember also the joy and

[Interviewee]

knocked it off, you know?

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Do we know why this particular person attacked you?

[Interviewee]

Thought I was having it off with

[Interviewer]

his old Mrs. Oh, you see, that was the reason.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Okay. And were you?

[Interviewee]

No.

[Interviewer]

No. Okay.

[Interviewee]

No, no.

[Interviewer]

But why did he. Why did he think it was you? Because would she do so with another decorator?

[Interviewee]

I wouldn't be surprised. I wouldn't be surprised. So I'm guessing she wanted to get away from him. Anyway, that was. That was the nuts and bolts of it all.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. When he was attacking you, were you saying was. Wasn't me, no.

[Interviewee]

Just saying help. You know, I'm in an empty flat, there's not a stick of furniture enough. Enough to defend myself with. And he's got his whacking great long knife slashing and stabbing at me like a maniac.

[Interviewer]

Crikey.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. I thought, this is it.

[Interviewer]

Up until that point. Was that the most in danger you felt? You know, is that a new thing to go?

[Interviewee]

A new thing? No, I've been in that situation a couple of times.

[Interviewer]

Oh, what? Okay.

[Interviewee]

It was just like he used to slash it. Yeah. He didn't care.

[Interviewer]

Which made it a bit easier to defend yourself or not.

[Interviewee]

Well, yeah, it was frantic.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

That I did think I'd add it because he was not stopping.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Was your life different after that event? I mean, did that.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. It changed everything. Yeah. I had to give the job up, obviously.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. You weren't gonna go in the next day after that?

[Interviewee]

No. He could track me down. And for a long time after that, I was paranoid, looking over my shoulder and any sort of noise. It was mad because he'd waited nine months since it was all over, sort of thing. He found out because she told him. And nine months later, he's attacking me in this empty flat, you know? Yeah. Oh, God.

[Interviewer]

So you thought, oh, he could actually just still come back anytime.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, he's that sort of.

[Interviewer]

How old were you when this happened?

[Interviewee]

29. Yeah, 28. 29. So you.

[Interviewer]

You said before you've been in situations where you've also been under attack, but in a more calculated manner.

[Interviewee]

I've had knives held to me throat

[Interviewer]

and do you think you. You go to them, then come to you.

[Interviewee]

It's just situation.

[Interviewer]

It just happens.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Was in a laundrette once because it was pouring with rain outside. So he took shelter in this laundrette and this woman was in there, obviously doing a washing. And she had like two or three or maybe four kids with the little kids all running around. And we had this flash kit in our little gang. Thought he was the bee's knees. Very smart dresser. And he objected to all his kids running around his new overcoat, whatever it was. Yeah. Anyway, the mum said so. He said so back. And then it was. And she left, you know, with the ump. Obviously, we left and we settled in this cafe and next thing there's two blokes coming. Anyway, was you having a go at my missus, blah, blah, blah. But it's. And the Murphy one, he was sat in a corner, like me and a couple of blokes up at the bar, and he's saying, come outside, like for a fight, like, come outside. And he wouldn't go. He was going, nah, nah. Because he's a big bloke. Yeah. Anyway, next thing, a knife slips down his. His sleeve, big hunting knife, and he just goes. Cuts him right open.

[Interviewer]

Oh, Christ.

[Interviewee]

And like, we're all sat there horrified. You can imagine. Yeah. Who's next? You know?

[Interviewer]

Oh, God.

[Interviewee]

And he come to me, was right up close. And then he went, I know you. You're so and so's brother, ain't you? Now? I'm thinking, do I say yes? Does he like my brother or what

[Interviewer]

was going through your mind at that point then?

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You're thinking, do people generally like your brother?

[Interviewee]

Well, he was a villain, you know. Bank robber, actually. Of course they had enemies. There was gangs, you know. I didn't know what the. I thought, fuck it. I went, yeah, that's right. Yeah, I know you won't say nothing. And off he trotted. Big sigh and let's get out of here. Hello, doggy. Well, you're nice and soft.

[Interviewer]

So you see your brother was a bank robber.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Did you ever. Do you ever want to join in?

[Interviewee]

No, no, it's too young. I saw that they weren't successful.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Interviewee]

It's always getting nicked, that.

[Interviewer]

Wow. So a lot of quite dramatic events. And this is all around the same time of your life.

[Interviewee]

I know when you think about. Just all came, you know, Seemed natural to me. Do people go through life just going to the library and back and work at home and telling.

[Interviewer]

Are you asking a weird question?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

I mean, some, you know, a lot of people do. Not you, by the sounds of it. Do you still have the drama now?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. More domesticated now, isn't it? Oh, I met this old geezer when I came in like an hour ago. Ain't got far,

[Interviewer]

he's dark. Do you consider yourself an old geezer?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, yeah, of course.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. When you look at another old geezer,

[Interviewee]

I'd love to know how old he is. Really.

[Interviewer]

Oh, is that a thing?

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Do you want me to go and ask him?

[Interviewee]

You would at all, wouldn't you?

[Interviewer]

I would. You know I would. Can I ask how old you are?

[Interviewee]

75.

[Interviewer]

75? Yeah. I reckon he's. I think he's early 80s be my guess.

[Interviewee]

I thought about 84. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Are you?

[Interviewee]

I fucking hope so.

[Interviewer]

The age you hope he is.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So you're looking around?

[Interviewee]

Well, I talk to some people and they look at death's door. Do I look at death's door?

[Interviewer]

No, you look fit.

[Interviewee]

I hope so. I mean, I don't look great. I know that.

[Interviewer]

How are you feeling?

[Interviewee]

I feel all right.

[Interviewer]

There we go.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. I've only got half my lungs left. I had them taken out. Is that 10 years ago?

[Interviewer]

What's it like to have half your lungs taken out?

[Interviewee]

Actually, no different.

[Interviewer]

Oh, you didn't even need him in the first place.

[Interviewee]

Well, I recommend it to anybody, you know, but I was never much of an athlete anyway, so.

[Interviewer]

Was that. Another kind of dramatic moment, the lungs coming out.

[Interviewee]

It wasn't.

[Interviewer]

It wasn't. I was quite relaxed.

[Interviewee]

Not for me.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. I'm guessing you had some kind of condition.

[Interviewee]

I didn't.

[Interviewer]

Oh, no, he's wanting them out.

[Interviewee]

No, no, no, no, no. When I retired, I don't know, it seemed to trigger something in the nhs and I kept getting all these letters inviting me to come to the hospital and have this and that other test, so I thought, why not? And I went for them all. And, you know, one of them was for lung cancer and pop. I'd got it in both lungs, but it was early stages and I could chop them out

[Interviewer]

and they did it

[Interviewee]

and they did it and. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And you're still here.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, of course.

[Interviewer]

Fantastic.

[Interviewee]

And I don't feel any different. I mean, I shouldn't smoke still. I was like an idiot, but I can't help it and I enjoy it.

[Interviewer]

I suppose once you got to where you are now, you might as well enjoy your life.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, exactly. That's my thoughts exactly. I'd smoked all my life, since I was about 10 and I've been expecting it. Everyone's telling you you get lung cancer. And I did. Some geezer in a pub as he was leaving, slurped his pipe, banged it on the table and said, I hope you get lung cancer. And off he went. And, yeah, got what he wanted. He got what he wanted. I hope he fell down a fucking drain hole. Anyway,

[Interviewer]

so since you were 10?

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

That's early though, isn't it?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, but everybody smoked. Everybody smoked. You could smoke on buses, in a cinema, in fucking hospital. You could smoke up.

[Interviewer]

It's amazing in hospital. Yeah.

[Interviewee]

Doctors used to say it'd be good for you. One advert for cigarettes, taste of the countryside at some point, my life.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, it's absolutely. It's unbelievably criminal. Criminally untrue.

[Interviewee]

It was coming across as saying, healthy and everybody smok.

[Interviewer]

Do you think? You know, I'm not. Obviously I'm not going to endorse smoking here, obviously. Has it been good for your lungs? We know that.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Has any part of it been good for you in terms of processing things about, thinking about things about like. If you think about how it's actually, like, benefited your life, what would you say?

[Interviewee]

Well, it's a great stress reliever, isn't it? That's what it is. I can also see it's not necessary. It could be, yeah.

[Interviewer]

It could be something else.

[Interviewee]

This could be, say, oh, I gotta have an elastic band around Me wrist and just ping it.

[Interviewer]

You could be doing some knitting. Ever done some knitting?

[Interviewee]

I did once.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I did. Fantastic.

[Interviewee]

I'd try.

[Interviewer]

You got a try. Fantastic. What did you knit? Do you remember what you knitted?

[Interviewee]

No, just.

[Interviewer]

No, you just told me you just gave it a go once.

[Interviewee]

You know, you can do it. You sort of don't have to carry on, do you? Hey, don't have to knit fucking pajamas and things.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah. Do you wear pyjamas?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, of course.

[Interviewer]

Fantastic.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Do you have a bedtime routine? What's your bedtime routine?

[Interviewee]

Cup of tea.

[Interviewer]

I like a cup of tea. Fantastic.

[Interviewee]

Take me pills.

[Interviewer]

How many pills are we taking?

[Interviewee]

Probably about six or seven.

[Interviewer]

That's quite a lot of pills. Is that for the lungs or for other people?

[Interviewee]

Take about 32 a day.

[Interviewer]

32. How do you remember all that? I just got them all lined up.

[Interviewee]

Lined up.

[Interviewer]

What's your point? Once you. I mean, at what point are you like, that's too many or is it. Is it a point where like it

[Interviewee]

is too many now? Because I got to find the time to take them.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

All day long I'm sort of popping pills.

[Interviewer]

32, that's incredible. And they're all doing a job.

[Interviewee]

Well, I guess they're still here. I ain't gonna stop taking them, that's for sure. Just in case.

[Interviewer]

Did most of these come after the big operation?

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Right. And so after this operation, if you would have been dead without it, right, and then you're alive, did it give you any new perspective on being alive?

[Interviewee]

You'd think so, wouldn't you? Thing is money kind of all dumbs down to money then.

[Interviewer]

It does, yeah.

[Interviewee]

If you've got money, yeah, you can go and do all this stuff, but I ain't. So hence here I am walking in the park, having a. A smoke. Yeah. I take pleasure from little things in life.

[Interviewer]

Tell me about these little things. What gives you the greatest pleasure? Top three little things going to be a rundown.

[Interviewee]

Oh, nature, yes. Yeah, that's about it really.

[Interviewer]

Just Nate. But what bits of nature then?

[Interviewee]

Just seeing what you can see. Look, there's crocus. They've just all come up in a little bed. There's a couple of black birds there. I was looking at all the trees the other day, how different they are and how the angles they. Some trees grow in and the bark and ah, just all. It's all interesting. Look at this ugly dog. Looks like he's got a right hump, don't he?

[Interviewer]

It's so true. What can we do? Remember the cat chased the dog. Oh, the dog chose the cat. It's funny, isn't it? I'm totally with you. I don't get why you would want a dog that looks like it's constantly frowning.

[Interviewee]

Because they're cute when they're little.

[Interviewer]

Oh, that's it.

[Interviewee]

They're all cute and cuddly.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Who's been the most important pet in your life?

[Interviewee]

I ain't into pets.

[Interviewer]

Never had one.

[Interviewee]

Well, I have had a little Yorkshire terrier, but that was for the missus. If I weren't interested. We had a cat, she weren't interested. Just come and eat her food and then slink off in her little room. And that was it? Yeah.

[Interviewer]

That was your. With your. With your wife?

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Are you still together?

[Interviewee]

No, she died 10 years ago, so.

[Interviewer]

Around the same time as the operation?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. She died the year before? Yeah.

[Interviewer]

What was she like?

[Interviewee]

She was lovely. What can you say? Very stoic person. It's true when they say you don't appreciate what you got until it's gone. And I think that applies to everyone. Of course, you could see all those things that were there in the first place there all along, and you're so busy. Whatever. Can't do nothing about that either.

[Interviewer]

Where did he meet?

[Interviewee]

Where did we meet? Can I just say, it was a dance. I don't think so. I don't remember dancing there. Some sort of club.

[Interviewer]

Some sort of club, yeah. Did you approach her? Did she approach you?

[Interviewee]

I went out with her mate first because her mate was dead keen on me and sort of velbird her out of the way. I did the dirty on her. Oh, it was another knife incident.

[Interviewer]

Okay, right. Yeah, tell me about that one.

[Interviewee]

A few weeks later, there was another little discotheque we used to go to. I was making my way around there Saturday night, suited and booted, get stopped on the corner by me mate. He says, don't go around here. So and so. They're looking for you. So I turn around and go back. I see him, wait the next day, said, hell, he said that geezer had him up against the wall, my mate with a knife at his throat. He said, she's been messing about with so and so, wouldn't you?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

Nobody messes her about. He's going, no, I'm not him. I'm not him. Close shave.

[Interviewer]

Close shave. Another close shave.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, yeah. Oh, but I've had that as well before. Another bloke, yeah. His car pulls up, two blokes jump out and Run up to me, he goes, that's my coat you've got on.

[Interviewer]

Was it? Yeah, it was, yeah.

[Interviewee]

Somebody had popped his window of his car a few nights before and pulled this sheepskin out. Anyway, some days I'd met, he said, you want to buy a sheepskin? Yeah, lovely. Don't think I had it a week.

[Interviewer]

Did you give it back?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Quick, sharp, mate, with a knife at your. Yeah, I did, yeah. I wouldn't mind, but it was snowing, man.

[Interviewer]

Oh, snowing as well.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, that's right.

[Interviewer]

And then you were cold.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, See me shirt sleeves now, aren't I?

[Interviewer]

So go back to your. How you met your wife. Sorry? You were with her friend, but then cheated on the. On the friend with the wife.

[Interviewee]

Didn't really cheat. I never, Never told her. I sort of chickened out more like, and just started going out with her mate. And then, you know, she got a message. I should have told her.

[Interviewer]

I mean, you know, you ended up with her, so that's good. You ended up with the right one.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. 47 years was together.

[Interviewer]

It's good going.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. And she goes and dies on me just as we're coming up every time. She would have retired that year, so. And me.

[Interviewer]

When you think about her, what images come to mind?

[Interviewee]

What do you see in those times, in those early days?

[Interviewer]

What was her death like?

[Interviewee]

Horrible. She got throat cancer and she kept saying that she was finding it hard to swallow, hard to eat. And like I said, she was stoic and she just kept it to herself. And months went by and she ended up like skin and bone, man. And I never noticed. So we got to the doctors and by then it was too late. Straight up the hospital and straight in her bed, like she could die any minute. And she did, a few days later. It was a shock, man. Terrible shock. I felt completely lost afterwards. The am I gonna do now? I've got to have another fag. I'm sorry.

[Interviewer]

You know, you can try it now. Yeah, that's absolutely fine. No problem at all.

[Interviewee]

Good.

[Interviewer]

So, after your wife died, did your approach to being alive change at all? I mean, Is she talking to.

[Interviewee]

You're so square. She said.

[Interviewer]

You're so scared. Maybe she's talking to us. No, I don't think she was. You don't seem very square to me. How do you feel about runners?

[Interviewee]

Runners? It's up to them, isn't it?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, it's good. I had to go once.

[Interviewer]

Were you running away with someone with a knife?

[Interviewee]

No. Oh, yeah, done that. No, I did. You know with the old trainers and shulks and all that.

[Interviewer]

Oh, you're good to go.

[Interviewee]

Nonsense. Yeah, I was that last week for a while, 1981 or two.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. And then this. I was decorating this house, met this woman and she wanted. Could she come running with me. I said, yeah, sure. Anyway. What a fucking calamity run. I could walk faster backwards.

[Interviewer]

So she was slowing you down?

[Interviewee]

Slowing me down. I was walking.

[Interviewer]

How is this. How was this in a romantic way?

[Interviewee]

Not exactly romantic. Sexual. Not romantic.

[Interviewer]

So let's just rewind a minute. This is whilst you're with your wife still?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, unfortunately. Okay. Yeah. I was working in her house and

[Interviewer]

she was saying, you write down.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, man.

[Interviewer]

But that didn't stop you.

[Interviewee]

It did stop me going in the end. It put me right off.

[Interviewer]

But not off her.

[Interviewee]

No, it didn't put me off her for a while because she introduced me to her mate. And she didn't want to go jogging. She didn't want nothing to do with jogging. So that was it. How I hung me votes up.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, he might have been some kind of professional, otherwise he could have run many marathons.

[Interviewee]

Well, I did enjoy it, you know. I wouldn't have been smoking, that's for sure.

[Interviewer]

Can we talk about extramarital business? Can I ask you about it?

[Interviewee]

Morning. You sure you don't know me?

[Interviewer]

I really don't know you.

[Interviewee]

Go on.

[Interviewer]

Can I ask you how many affairs you've had? Or is that. Is that.

[Interviewee]

I try to.

[Interviewer]

Oh, you had a little think. Okay.

[Interviewee]

I got a coffee in that bag. Have you?

[Interviewer]

I haven't, sadly. Sorry. I've got a tin of fish, lots of sardines.

[Interviewee]

No, I tried the sardine sandwich a couple of weeks ago.

[Interviewer]

All right.

[Interviewee]

I must have been in the cupboard too long, man.

[Interviewer]

Oh, okay. I haven't got a sardine sandwich. I've got sardines. No, you can have to. Straight from the tin. No, I've got a fork.

[Interviewee]

It put me off sardines for ages. It smelled like an old dust bin.

[Interviewer]

Okay, so whilst you're having these sardines, do you.

[Interviewee]

You.

[Interviewer]

Oh, no, that wasn't. So the other day you were thinking about how many extra marathon affairs you have had. Did you count them up?

[Interviewee]

Means you pull one night stand.

[Interviewer]

It's hard to know, isn't it?

[Interviewee]

An affair? An affair to me is longer than that.

[Interviewer]

A fling and affair, two different things. I suppose.

[Interviewee]

A fling and a fair.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, no, I suppose. I think it would go for me. One night stand is obviously one night. Fleeing would be a Few nights? Yeah, a fair few months.

[Interviewee]

Long term? Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Minimum.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So can we go? Should we do it in that order? Like how many? Let's do the three. So how many, how many, how many one night stands?

[Interviewee]

I would never tried to top them.

[Interviewer]

Just give me a brief.

[Interviewee]

Give me a. I just tried to top the women.

[Interviewer]

Just give me a little. Give me a little. What do you think? One night stands? What do we think?

[Interviewee]

Fine. Seven.

[Interviewer]

Five to seven. Not 57?

[Interviewee]

No, 57.

[Interviewer]

Okay, five to seven. Then we got flings. How many?

[Interviewee]

Four.

[Interviewer]

Four. Okay, great. And then affairs. You going to say 25?

[Interviewee]

No, I'd say one.

[Interviewer]

Okay. Obvious question. Did your wife know about any of these ones?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, once you did?

[Interviewer]

Yeah. What was the outcome of that?

[Interviewee]

Nothing, really.

[Interviewer]

Oh well, nothing at all?

[Interviewee]

No, never spoke of it.

[Interviewer]

So how did she know about it?

[Interviewee]

It was her mate.

[Interviewer]

Okay. Right. This wasn't the one right at the start. This is a different one.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. This was later on.

[Interviewer]

And she just said nothing about it?

[Interviewee]

No.

[Interviewer]

Do you know why?

[Interviewee]

Preferred not to, I guess. Didn't want to know. She thought it was daft.

[Interviewer]

Do you feel that she might have had similar affairs? No, not at all. You're sure about that?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. That as sure as you can be?

[Interviewer]

Sure as you can be, yeah.

[Interviewee]

I mean, you never know, do you?

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So how do you. When you look back now, do you feel any guilt? Do you feel joy? Do you feel.

[Interviewee]

I feel regret, yeah. I wish I hadn't.

[Interviewer]

Can you think of why you did? Does that make any sense? Is that an obvious question, really? Yeah.

[Interviewee]

You know, say this about most women. Once they get a baby, they've been nine months carrying this egg and all this bollocks. Of course they're very attached to it. And when it's born, they gotta look after it. It's so precious and don't mean to, but men just feel completely left out of it. I know the woman's busy with the kid and that and the baby takes a lot of time and effort and all that and you sort of wander then. And then some bird comes up to you and you've had a few pints and working in people's houses all day. You do get close.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. There's opportunities. Can I ask, when you became a parent, what age were you?

[Interviewee]

25.

[Interviewer]

So that's 50 years ago.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

That's a very different time.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I was a parent at 26. So I. I get being young and being a parent, but there's very different expectations now of male involvement.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So I was Quite involved quite quickly. But I can see how that might be really complicated if you feel kind of pushed out.

[Interviewee]

Sorry. Of course, you were there at the birthday.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. But I wonder if these things actually have quite a big impact.

[Interviewee]

Well, when they asked me, I mean, it weren't a done thing. It was just coming into happening. I sort of undernard for a bit and then I said, yeah, all right. And I had to get all gowned up.

[Interviewer]

Full kit.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, full kit. Time they'd done that. She had it.

[Interviewer]

She'd had the baby to get the kit on.

[Interviewee]

She was sitting up in bed with a cup and tea and a saucer and the baby was in a crib thing by the window. Yeah, it was all done, I believe.

[Interviewer]

Well, word up for, you know, you wanted to be there.

[Interviewee]

Well, I weren't keen to put it that way.

[Interviewer]

When you first held your kid, how did you feel?

[Interviewee]

What do you mean?

[Interviewer]

What I mean, when you first held your child, how did you feel?

[Interviewee]

Great. Yeah, terrific. Oh, I was proud as punch. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

How many kids did you end up having?

[Interviewee]

I have two. Boy and a girl.

[Interviewer]

And none of these things or affairs.

[Interviewee]

Who knows?

[Interviewer]

There could be hell there.

[Interviewee]

Who knows? Because I do know for a fact that two of the women were after having a baby. They was getting to that age, you know.

[Interviewer]

Okay, so you think outside chance, there's other children that you've made that are out there today?

[Interviewee]

I think there's a good chance.

[Interviewer]

A good chance even. Give it a percentage. 70. Yeah. Whoa. If you wanted to just be annoying here for a minute. Do you know how to find them?

[Interviewee]

I suppose I could. There could be three of them.

[Interviewer]

There could be three of three.

[Interviewee]

One bird, she was getting married the next fucking day.

[Interviewer]

Okay. Right now, that's the story.

[Interviewee]

Well, we'd sort of made a date. I didn't know any of that before.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Interviewee]

I just thought I was going out with this Bertha and getting me head

[Interviewer]

away, but at what point does she say I'm getting married? In the morning. So do you think there's an outside chance there that she's. What do you reckon she thought?

[Interviewee]

Well, I'm just making sure, you know,

[Interviewer]

double chance of the baby pregnant by

[Interviewee]

as many as I can before. Get married.

[Interviewer]

Get married, have the child with the.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Poof. And they could have a baby and it's your kid. It could be any fuckers. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Including yours.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Then you never saw her again after that?

[Interviewee]

No. Thank fuck. I could have been murdered in my fucking bed. Lots of places are fast asleep in someone else's Bed. The old man comes home and I think about it. Fuck. Makes me.

[Interviewer]

The things people do for sex, eh? Do you know what I mean? So could you find out who this person was and track them down? See if you see if you got these kids out there.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Would you be up for it? No. What if these kids are, you know, doing great things or great people.

[Interviewee]

Interested?

[Interviewer]

You're not interested?

[Interviewee]

Be honest.

[Interviewer]

You would be cool. You've got to be. You've been your own job. If they knocked on your door.

[Interviewee]

Ah, that's different.

[Interviewer]

Oh, that's different.

[Interviewee]

That's different.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

I ain't going looking for nobody. Yeah, good luck to him. And she got a job to do. What?

[Interviewer]

My job.

[Interviewee]

You've got homework.

[Interviewer]

Do you mean now?

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Is this the job?

[Interviewee]

You get paid for this?

[Interviewer]

No, I don't. It's. I. I made money in music. Very lucky to make good money. Music.

[Interviewee]

So you're just amusing your bloody self. No, no.

[Interviewer]

Well, I'm not. Well, it's amusing myself, but also people listen. So it's amusing everybody. I say not amusing. Some. What are you? What, to talk to people on benches?

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Well, it's just. Just an exciting thing, isn't it? There'll be people listening to you now, not to freak you out. All over the world have never have heard a voice like yours or seen anything as a Skrull. You know, like, heard stories like yours. You know, it's just like opening people's eyes. That's the plan.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. But I wouldn't believe me.

[Interviewer]

You wouldn't believe me. Well, I mean, that's up to them. I mean. What do you mean, you wouldn't believe you? Well, because they're so. Mad, you mean? But there's these things, as you say, these things happen in life. They occur.

[Interviewee]

Well, as I asked you previously, do other people? And you said, no more or less. Jelly and.

[Interviewer]

Oh, well, I mean, I do that. So I do all these. I do all kinds. This was a big mix.

[Interviewee]

Well, that's okay. I only came out to smoke my.

[Interviewer]

To have a smoke.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, exactly.

[Interviewer]

And instead you got lots of questions.

[Interviewee]

I'm glad I met you, because, you know, I'd just be wandering aimlessly about.

[Interviewer]

Perfect.

[Interviewee]

Which path shall I take?

[Interviewer]

Which path? Yeah. Well, talk about paths taken.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Is there a path in your life you didn't take that you regret now?

[Interviewee]

Oh, God.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, go on.

[Interviewee]

I could have married the daughter of a millionaire.

[Interviewer]

Is this with this one of the flings?

[Interviewee]

No, this is an affair.

[Interviewer]

The affair. You could have married her.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

The daughter of a millionaire.

[Interviewee]

But, you know, you didn't. I'd be made, as I would say, if I was a bum. I still am. And, you know, I'd just be pretending, wouldn't I?

[Interviewer]

But what would you be pretending at?

[Interviewee]

Being posh, you know.

[Interviewer]

Oh, I see. Okay, so let's. Let's talk about this daughter of the millionaire. How did you meet?

[Interviewee]

Working in her house.

[Interviewer]

Okay, again, Again. This is.

[Interviewee]

This, see, like, this is. It's like the window cleaner story, innit? Is that true? And the milkman, you know.

[Interviewer]

No, but there's a reason why it is fucking true. Of course it's true. This is just what happens. I think it's deeply believable.

[Interviewee]

I sort of don't believe. When I look back, I think, can't

[Interviewer]

believe that was you.

[Interviewee]

Is that a film I watched or something?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but it's your life. Okay, how so you were. You were working on in her house. Was she with someone else at the time?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, yeah, married.

[Interviewer]

Okay. How did this affair start, do you remember?

[Interviewee]

Just typical story. Housewife at home, kids start, school board shitless, nothing to do, husband's at work

[Interviewer]

and there you are. There I am, fitting paintbrush in hand.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, working away. Start chatting while you have your tea and biscuits. All bollocks. A lot of chatting, not a lot of painting. And that's how it started.

[Interviewer]

But then at some point, well, I

[Interviewee]

just come to the end of the job, packed up and said goodbyes and that. And as she was going up the stairs, I saw. I thought, it's now or never. And I reached up, touched her arm and she spun round and me and priest and violins and. Yeah. Oh, man, I floated away.

[Interviewer]

Floated up those stairs, probably.

[Interviewee]

Oh, damn.

[Interviewer]

I doubt it.

[Interviewee]

Thanks, Minnie. She was naked on the sofa. That shook me up. You know, always a bit of romance before a little kiss on her.

[Interviewer]

Oh, I see. I was just straight to naked.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, the paranoid sort of thing.

[Interviewer]

Did you just not do anything then?

[Interviewee]

And I think about it, my life's been a choice of do I or don't I?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, and you did now?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, of course I did. I was unsuccessful because I already banged two people that morning.

[Interviewer]

Okay, right, okay, okay, okay. Let's rewind a minute. What point of the day is she naked on the sofa here? Afternoon, evening.

[Interviewee]

Morning.

[Interviewer]

It's so. It can't still be in the morning.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, because I didn't know.

[Interviewer]

What kind of morning have you had here? She was naked in the morning?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, about 11 o'. Clock.

[Interviewer]

Okay, but you just said you had already made love to two people.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Morning. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So what was that?

[Interviewee]

That's a one off, wasn't it? The wife in the morning.

[Interviewer]

A wife in the morning. Got it.

[Interviewee]

And then. Then ran to the jogger we mentioned earlier.

[Interviewer]

Wow. Yeah, wow. And then what, an hour later then

[Interviewee]

to go around so the other ones have finish off and get paid.

[Interviewer]

Well, that's. That's a.

[Interviewee]

Well, I had to come back to her in the afternoon.

[Interviewer]

That's a morning.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, it was.

[Interviewer]

But then you did make love to her in the afternoon.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Interviewee]

I said I'll come back later.

[Interviewer]

Wow, what a day. What a day. Clearly you've had some interesting sexual times in your life. Feel free to bat this question away if you want, but I feel we're here now. Any particular sexual encounter you've had in your life that you. That you remember very fondly? Do you kind of, you know anyone that you can return to?

[Interviewee]

Our wife.

[Interviewer]

Oh, well, that I'm. I'm glad. Which encounter?

[Interviewee]

Our wedding night. And although we'd had sex before and now that wedding night was completely different. It was a wedding night and it was. Yeah. Lovely. Yeah, I can think back to that. Just like that. Coming in. Nuts of May. Yeah. Just a young un looking at the squirrel.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Interviewee]

Used to have red squirrels up here. They were nice.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. How long ago do they die out, the red squirrels?

[Interviewee]

As soon as the red glaze came, park keepers used to put up notices. I think it was ten bob a tail. They'd give you kids and there'd be several kids up here with catapults and things.

[Interviewer]

What? How? Well, to kill the.

[Interviewee]

To kill the gray squirrels.

[Interviewer]

Oh, I see.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

But it didn't do the job. There weren't enough catapults.

[Interviewee]

No.

[Interviewer]

So wedding night was great. That's good to hear. It's good to hear. And back to one more question. A couple questions about you, the millionaire daughter.

[Interviewee]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

So then you. So then you. You started an affair after that with her.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, four years. Four years. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

That's a while, isn't it? Yeah. And so when you say you could have married it, like she wanted to marry me. She wanted to marry you?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Good job. I didn't in it. I knew I weren't good enough. All right.

[Interviewer]

Why, why did you say that?

[Interviewee]

She had no concept of money or anything. I couldn't keep up with it all flows. Dining out every few days.

[Interviewer]

And so how did it end with the millionaire's daughter?

[Interviewee]

Oh, like anything, it just sort of start taking each other for granted. That's the worst thing you can do in a relationship. That's where all these troubles fucking lie. That's where it starts.

[Interviewer]

So you look back at all these affairs, all the moments which, like. Are you saying to me that ideally you would have done none of them? How much regret is there, really, with my marriage? Yeah, they happened outside your marriage that, like, you know.

[Interviewee]

No, I always looked upon my marriage as one staple thing in my life I could rely on that would keep me from my madness sort of thing, if you know what I mean.

[Interviewer]

What would you have been without it?

[Interviewee]

I needed her to keep me straight.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

And she did. She did that. And, yeah, it was selfish. I know it was like a springboard to go off and do what I wanted because she weren't interested in doing at all. I think looking back on it all, she. She had a child. What else was she gonna do? Where was she gonna go if she left me? She had no money. She only had her mum, who lived miles away and didn't want to know. She didn't want to go there anyway. What's the alternative? So you put up with these things, didn't bother her. That's how I think it was. Thank folk for that.

[Interviewer]

Do you think, in your heart of heart, do you think there's a good chance that you just knew what you were doing?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, yeah, of course you do. Women know these things, don't they? Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Would you say is a different. I mean, look, you're talking about, obviously a different era as well, in terms of your friends and other marriages you knew about. Was it a kind of. Generally, like you got a done thing.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Across the people you knew.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. And it gets icky when you do it to your mates.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewee]

That was all that. Of course she did. She got a chance.

[Interviewer]

How do you get on with your kids now?

[Interviewee]

My daughter died a couple of years ago. I was estranged from her for 25 years. I get on all right with my son, although it's turned a bit awkward lately because. And now I don't want to say no more.

[Interviewer]

Okay,

[Interviewee]

we're all right. I just want to be on my own now. I've got to this age. I mean, I ain't got long to go. I know that. And ever since I was like, 15, I've had to do something for somebody else. I've had to be a worker, I've had to be a husband, I've had to be a father. I just. I want to find who I am. I want to get back to who I Could have been. I don't know. It's in there. I need to draw it out before I die. I need to be on my own. I think this is what. This is my life. How can I be anything different? How can you be anything different? How can you not be sitting doing this? You just have to.

[Interviewer]

Very true.

[Interviewee]

I mean, what would you be doing different, eh?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

You already look a tight to be out on a fucking oil rig and then all seal, you know, maybe that's

[Interviewer]

what's next for me. You think I couldn't pull it off? No, I couldn't. You've got it right. I've done it. I would annoy people by talking to them all the time.

[Interviewee]

I like all these toys and things these kids got nowadays.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, there's so many, aren't those.

[Interviewee]

They've got things just clip on the prayer. Yeah. And it rocked his one and it rocks the pram, doesn't it? Oh yeah, it's great. It's called a rocket. Leave it unattended for a moment while you go and do this. So you put the rocket on and it's. It's just a comforter. And I think there's another setting on it where it is.

[Interviewer]

How do you know these settings so well?

[Interviewee]

It's sort of because I've got a five month old baby living with me at the moment.

[Interviewer]

You've got a five month old living with you?

[Interviewee]

His grandson. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Your grandson's living with you? Oh, lovely.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

How many grandchildren do you have?

[Interviewee]

6.

[Interviewer]

Oh, wow. This is your son's? Your sons?

[Interviewee]

My sons, yeah.

[Interviewer]

How wonderful.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

What's it like? A good grandfather?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, I'm all right. I keep it out of the way.

[Interviewer]

You must have some encounters if it's in your house.

[Interviewee]

No, because I smoke, see?

[Interviewer]

Oh, I see. That's why you got to be in the park.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. I sort of pray for the sunshine, you know.

[Interviewer]

I do too. It's hard to talk to people on benches when it's raining.

[Interviewee]

Oh, I'm staying at a bus stop while it's busy with rain, you know, just to have a puff. So this is nice. This is like having an ice cream.

[Interviewer]

It's like having an ice cream. Exactly. Were you having ice cream today? No, no. What do you eat, by the way? What do you eat now? Does that mean you used to like your sardine sandwich? Not anymore.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, no, I'd still like one, but it's got to be a nice one. My son and his misses went to Portugal, I think. Sardinia. Anyway. Come back with a tin of proper sardines are a neighbor.

[Interviewer]

I've got a really nice brand of sardines in my bag. Would you like one? Consider it a payment for your time.

[Interviewee]

Oh, good.

[Interviewer]

Then maybe it was destiny.

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

That I would get two packs. That's for you.

[Interviewee]

Oh, thank you very much. It's really tasty and I love them in olive oil.

[Interviewer]

Oh, there you go. It's called Sea sisters. It's the UK's only cannery.

[Interviewee]

They're still doing that sort of thing. See, that's what I used to love when I was young. You could go out and get a job any day if you didn't like it, you could pack it up in the morning, go get another job for the afternoon.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewee]

And I've done it and you know, some interesting jobs.

[Interviewer]

There you go. Maybe get. Get a new job in a cannery.

[Interviewee]

Well, I worked in. It made me think of when I worked in a distillery with all the bottles and all that. It was interesting to see how it was all done. I used to squash all these raisins up for ginger wine. And when you undid the press, they came out like sheets of cardboard ever. So they ended up in Garibaldi biscuits.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Interviewee]

Yeah. It used to tickle me just to invite me down.

[Interviewer]

What's the quickest you've left the job?

[Interviewee]

About half an hour.

[Interviewer]

What was it?

[Interviewee]

I don't think it was even that. I was supposed to be the manager of this warehouse. Anyway, I got the job, gets there and going, introduced to this kid in the warehouse and he's like got the asshole marched off. And I thought, ah, because he's been here for years and ain't got the job, you know, I'm looking around and I think, well, what am I supposed to do? And I'm freezing cold. He got his shutters up and out. I said, I'm gonna go and get a jumper in my motor. Outside spot right opposite. He goes, oh, you can't go out, you have to ask permission. I thought that. I've been working on my own, like for 20 years. Ah, can't even cross the road. I crossed the road, got in my car off. Simply with toasting a squeezer. Yes, squeeze a lemon, mate.

[Interviewer]

The sardines look good. Just you're checking them out. Do you approve?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, I do. Thank you very much.

[Interviewer]

Fantastic.

[Interviewee]

Canned in Dorset. It's got batch numbers. Best before January 28th.

[Interviewer]

There you go.

[Interviewee]

You've got a couple.

[Interviewer]

You've got a couple of years to polish them off.

[Interviewee]

What's this? The pineapple Estate Bridport. I like everything about it, even the address.

[Interviewer]

Good.

[Interviewee]

Thank you very much. Thank you.

[Interviewer]

Absolute pleasure. Absolutely. I really hope you enjoy them.

[Interviewee]

I will.

[Interviewer]

Can I ask you a difficult question? Go on about. Can I tell you about your daughter?

[Interviewee]

Go on.

[Interviewer]

So you're estranged from her for 25 years?

[Interviewee]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

When she died, were you no longer estranged or were you still estranged?

[Interviewee]

Well, when my wife was put in hospital, like I said, she died within a few days.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

I felt obliged to phone her and in case she wanted to see her mum before she died and she just thought everything was forgiven. And bowls up at the hospital with five fucking kids in tow, which was completely not what we expected or none wanted. She, like I said, thought everything was okay and I didn't say it wasn't. I just sort of went along with it all. But there was no affection there on my part. It's weird.

[Interviewer]

But then at some point she died.

[Interviewee]

Yeah, about two years ago now. The fellow buggered off and it really broke her. I think that really cut her up. And she started drinking and you couldn't have her around, man. She was trouble. And drugs and. And that's what done her in, man. That was obviously going to happen.

[Interviewer]

Were there any kind of. I don't know, were there any kind of things that you might have done differently as a parent or is that you feel like you is out of your control?

[Interviewee]

I mean, what can you do when your daughter runs off with a bad person? Plus she nicked all my clothes and all my gear and everything and buggered off and in the night, so to speak. I was heartbroken. It was like she died and I did all my grieving for her that year. And after that I just didn't think about her. She just meant nothing to me.

[Interviewer]

So she just. You mean, so she just. She took your stuff and left, is that what you're saying?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Going off with this fella. Okay, that's it.

[Interviewer]

And so that was it? That was the start of the 25 years?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. It bumped into her once or twice. Once she just scooted away. Another time she just waved to us. It was in a supermarket and carried on walking. I thought, fuck it.

[Interviewer]

What was she like as a kid? What was your relationship like then?

[Interviewee]

Oh, it was terrific, you know. And she come to me when she was about 12, this is one of my first regret as a parent, and asked could she have a boyfriend? And she's standing there with her mate. It's like the same age old, maybe a bit younger. And they're both Giggling and that. And yeah, I thought to myself, it's, you know, it's daft. And I thought it was going to be like a little boy. I said, yeah, right. But it weren't. And it was this dopey. When I see him, he was right dopey looking. I thought, well, he's fucking harmless. How wrong can you be? Anyway, he started her on a sex path that went on for a few years. And then she met this geezer who used to work for me. And I knew all about him and known him for years. He was married, he was a lot older. Anyway, there you go.

[Interviewer]

So what you're saying.

[Interviewee]

So I. What I regret is saying, yeah, you can have a boyfriend. Because I thought they were so young and it was just going to be silly.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Interviewee]

I said, yeah, but I took my eye off the ball and I was having a. An affair that I regret.

[Interviewer]

What do you think to be the greatest day of your life?

[Interviewee]

Having my first kid, I guess I felt great then. I felt great. When I come out, I seen 2001 A Space Odyssey on the big screen. Sat right in the front there. I was high on lsd. I'd taken a load. Me and my mate sat there, could not fucking believe it. This film. Know if you've ever seen it. But you know what?

[Interviewer]

I haven't. That's going to say I've got to. I've got to go and watch them now.

[Interviewee]

You will go and watch it up front on the big screen.

[Interviewer]

Big screen man with some LSD as well. Should I show it later? Yeah, why not?

[Interviewee]

Or have a puff or something. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So that is. That and the birth of your child. That's got. That's a great combo. Two great days. How have you found the experience of talking to a stranger on a bench?

[Interviewee]

All right?

[Interviewer]

All right?

[Interviewee]

Yeah, been okay. Sweet.

[Interviewer]

Good. Any glaring misses Would.

[Interviewee]

Would I like to lend you some money? How about that?

[Interviewer]

Should I ask you that? I just whip it out.

[Interviewee]

I know. Good with money.

[Interviewer]

It'll be wasted on you anyway.

[Interviewee]

What do you mean? What do you mean?

[Interviewer]

You just said you're no good with money.

[Interviewee]

I ain't. I don't covet money I've never had. Yeah. That's why I got none.

[Interviewer]

And you would only go on a cruise. I mean, do you need a cruise?

[Interviewee]

Not really. You can't get off, can you?

[Interviewer]

There you go.

[Interviewee]

If you don't like it.

[Interviewer]

Exactly.

[Interviewee]

No, I was all. I tried sailing once, can't even swim. But you know, now and then I went on a big yacht and it weren't until I had to go below decks. Oh, man, I feel sick. Oh, I never felt so ill in my life. It was all I could do to climb a step to get up. Oh, that's made me feel queasy thinking about it.

[Interviewer]

You're back on that boat now.

[Interviewee]

Well spun round, man.

[Interviewer]

How did you end up on a boat?

[Interviewee]

My brother wanted to try it. All right.

[Interviewer]

You know, same as the bank. Rubber one. Different one.

[Interviewee]

No, no, no, he wouldn't. Oh, scared of the sea. Hell, he only died a couple of weeks ago.

[Interviewer]

Oh, yeah? Were you close?

[Interviewee]

Not really. He was a loner and all.

[Interviewer]

What do you want your funeral to be like?

[Interviewee]

All right, I'll give a monkeys. Take it. Get burned and. Yeah, man, that's it.

[Interviewer]

Do you want your ashes scattered anywhere in particular?

[Interviewee]

Chuck them up here.

[Interviewer]

Yes, I'm on this bench.

[Interviewee]

My mum's on a bench up Parliamential fields.

[Interviewer]

Oh, fantastic. Did you like that particular bench?

[Interviewee]

Yeah. Oh, great. Well, see that too, now.

[Interviewer]

That's where she is.

[Interviewee]

We was doing it all furtive, like, you know.

[Interviewer]

So were you on the bench when you scattered her, actually, or just scatter them around? You sit first. You just scatter them?

[Interviewee]

Did scatter them around,

[Interviewer]

yeah.

[Interviewee]

Is it best to scatter them? Because when I was taking it, my mum's first, we. We were walking through this little copse and I still thought, yeah, this is nice. I started and then I thought, nah, she's probably never been here.

[Interviewer]

Quickly, back in the jar. Back in the jar.

[Interviewee]

So I made it to the bench and I scattered the rest. So forever after, been thinking, you know, she wondering, where that off? Where's my arm?

[Interviewer]

Then you got to give clearance. That means you've got to give clear instructions for whoever scares your rattles.

[Interviewee]

And what I do like is the idea of going up in a rocket and then exploding.

[Interviewer]

That's fun.

[Interviewee]

Scattered in space. Yeah, that'd be like stardust. Yeah, that does appeal. Like fireworks.

[Interviewer]

Well, thank you very much. Talk to me.

[Interviewee]

You're welcome. Thank you for the distraction.

[Interviewer]

It's been a lot of everything. A lot of things I won't forget in a hurry, that's for sure. And neither of you.

[Interviewee]

No, this is all bollocks, you know, I just make it happen.

[Interviewer]

I'd love it if you. This is. You've just invented an entirely different life. That'd be amazing. In a way that would be equally as impressive.

[Interviewee]

I'm on stage, mate. This is by act.

[Interviewer]

This is it.

[Interviewee]

I'm just sharpening it up.

[Interviewer]

Last question. What are you going to do next?

[Interviewee]

Who knows? They'll be moving out soon. I'll be all on my own and I can do what I want. I ain't had that chance yet. I was getting close to it, and then they moved in and it all went to pot. I. I can't even find a salt and pepper now. I don't know which cupboard it's in. I don't know where these sardines are gonna go. I better eat them straight away. I reckon I'd be out of four.

[Interviewer]

I reckon. Eat the sardines today and then. And then you'll feel better about, you know. You'll be like, that's a good day. I talked to a guy on a bench. Got my sardines for lunch. Yeah, wicked solid day.

[Interviewee]

I'll have a tomato with them and I'll.

[Interviewer]

Well, thank you so much for your time now.

[Interviewee]

It's been a pleasure. And I got some sardines. Fuck me. They won't believe this when I go home. I met a bloke up at the park. He gave me a tin of sardines.

[Singer]

So you're getting married tomorrow. You could have said before we did that. We kissed and wept on time we borrowed like two strangers in a plane

[Interviewee]

crash

[Singer]

now the sea we loved is

[Interviewee]

empty

[Singer]

I've had some years to find some peace I heal very well that's the nature of grapevines Like a bat from hell you flicker past my mind Better left unsaid the misdeeds and I like eyes I'd rather leave it there and thank you for that night before your wedding night.

[Interviewee]

Sam. Sa.