Behind the Scenes Minis: Opera and Joyous Research

Summary

Stuff You Missed in History Class: Behind the Scenes Minis: Opera and Joyous Research

Released on August 1, 2025 by iHeartPodcasts

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Introduction

In the latest episode of Stuff You Missed in History Class, hosts Holly Fry and Tracy V. Wilson delve into the intriguing intersections of art, science, and personal transformation. This episode, titled "Behind the Scenes Minis: Opera and Joyous Research," explores the life of Eadweard Muybridge, the influence of Philip Glass's opera about him, and the broader implications of head injuries on personality, all while intertwining personal anecdotes and research challenges.

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Eadweard Muybridge: Life and Photography

[02:25] Holly Fry: “We talked about Eadweard Muybridge this week.”

Tracy and Holly introduce Eadweard Muybridge, a pioneering photographer renowned for his motion studies, particularly the famous sequence of a horse galloping. Initially unfamiliar with his name, Tracy quickly connects Muybridge's work to the iconic images of motion that have permeated both art and scientific communities.

[04:02] Tracy V. Wilson: “I'm scrolling through Google image results of just his name and so many of these other motion studies I have for sure seen before.”

They discuss Muybridge's significant contributions to photography and motion capture, highlighting how his studies are frequently used in educational materials about film history and motion science.

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Philip Glass and the Opera "The Photographer"

[05:24] Holly Fry: “So of course Philip Glass wrote an opera about Edward Muybridge called The Photographer.”

Holly shares her passion for Philip Glass and reveals that he composed an opera centered on Muybridge's life. The minimalist staging of the opera underscores the profound connection between Muybridge's visual art and Glass's musical composition.

[06:08] Tracy V. Wilson: “So, I could not in any way describe myself as, like, a Philip Glass devotee just because there's a lot of stuff to experience in the world and finite time. But Philip Glass wrote the score to the movie Kundun.”

Tracy acknowledges her less fervent enthusiasm for Glass but concedes his pivotal role in creating compelling scores that complement historical narratives, such as his work on Martin Scorsese's Kundun.

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Phineas Gage and Personality Changes After Injury

[14:52] Tracy V. Wilson: “This also reminds me a little bit of Phineas Gage, who...”

The conversation shifts to Phineas Gage, a railroad worker whose dramatic personality changes following a head injury have made his case a cornerstone in the study of neurology and psychology.

[16:08] Holly Fry: “Most researchers who have kind of examined his case think that he had an injury to the orbitofrontal cortex, which controls things like the regulation of emotion.”

Holly explains the scientific basis behind Gage's behavioral shifts, emphasizing the impact of orbitofrontal cortex injuries on emotional regulation and personality.

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The Trial of Muybridge: Murder and Acquittal

[19:02] Holly Fry: “What? It would make me very scared to go to Northern California in the 1870s.”

The hosts recount the infamous trial in which Muybridge was acquitted for murder. Despite witnesses and evidence, the jury accepted that his actions were justified, reflecting the societal norms and legal interpretations of the era.

[18:35] Tracy V. Wilson: “It also feels like not exactly the same thing as jury nullification, because usually when we're talking about jury nullification, the idea is that the law in question is unjust. And at least from what you have said, that doesn't seem like where they were coming from.”

Tracy differentiates Muybridge's trial from typical cases of jury nullification, suggesting that the jury's decision was influenced by personal sentiments rather than a belief in unjust laws.

---

Evolving Menstrual Protection: Beatrice Kenner and Mildred Smith

[26:16] Tracy V. Wilson: “We talked about Beatrice Kenner and Mildred Smith and their various inventions this week, which meant we talked a lot about menstrual protection.”

The episode transitions to the innovations of Beatrice Kenner and Mildred Smith in the realm of menstrual hygiene. The discussion highlights the transition from sanitary belts to adhesive pads, reflecting broader societal changes and the challenges faced in menstrual product development.

[37:00] Tracy V. Wilson: “Beatrice's first patent for the sanitary belt also included a term that I don't know if I've ever encountered before—catamenial.”

Tracy introduces the term "catamenial," relating to menstruation, and ponders its decline in common usage, possibly due to the stigma surrounding menstrual topics.

---

Personal Anecdotes and Research Challenges

[26:26] Holly Fry: “Yeah. And. And Holly, you and I came of age to start menstruating during the transition from sanitary belts to adhesive pads.”

The hosts share personal memories of the shift in menstrual products, providing a relatable context to the historical innovations discussed.

[33:45] Tracy V. Wilson: “But it also included a very significant error, which is it said that Beatrice had gotten married to heavyweight boxing champion Jack Jabo Johnson. Jack Johnson, a famous black heavyweight boxer, was dead when Beatrice Kenner married James Jabo Kenner, a completely different person.”

Tracy elaborates on the difficulties encountered during research, including misinformation and the challenges of verifying historical facts. This segment underscores the complexities historians face when piecing together accurate narratives from fragmented sources.

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Concluding Thoughts

[37:38] Holly Fry: “After my own heart. Let’s try to make it so you're not having to hunt for the end of the toilet paper.”

The episode concludes with light-hearted remarks about everyday annoyances, tying back to the theme of problem-solving showcased by historical figures like Kenner and Smith.

[38:34] Tracy V. Wilson: “Buzz and I will proceed into the...”

Tracy hints at upcoming content, maintaining the episode's engaging and conversational tone.

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Notable Quotes

• Holly Fry [04:45]: “I feel bad cause I didn't notate what article I saw it in but someone described Edward Muybridge as looking like a mix of Walt Whitman and Zeus.”

• Tracy V. Wilson [17:25]: “Yeah. It just seems like the... that's where it gets kind of wild to me.”

• Holly Fry [37:07]: “This moment, and that is how it was referenced throughout the patent.”

---

Conclusion

In "Behind the Scenes Minis: Opera and Joyous Research," Holly Fry and Tracy V. Wilson offer a rich tapestry of historical exploration, blending in-depth research with personal narratives. From Muybridge's groundbreaking photography and the artistic interpretation by Philip Glass to the psychological impacts of head injuries exemplified by Phineas Gage, the episode provides a comprehensive look at how individual lives intersect with broader cultural and scientific advancements. Additionally, the focus on menstrual product innovation by Kenner and Smith highlights the often-overlooked contributions of women inventors in history. Despite the research hurdles and occasional misinformation, the hosts successfully weave a compelling narrative that is both informative and engaging for listeners.

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Listen to more episodes of Stuff You Missed in History Class on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you enjoy your favorite podcasts.

Transcript

[Tracy V. Wilson]

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[Holly Fry]

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[Holly Fry]

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[Unknown]

Listen to America's Crime Lab on the iHeartrade radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[John Lithgow]

Hello, I'm John Lithgow.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

We choose to go to the moon.

[John Lithgow]

I want to tell you about my new fiction podcast about Buzz Aldrin, one of the true pioneers of space.

[Unknown]

You're a great pilot, Buzz.

[John Lithgow]

That's the story you think you know. This is the story you don't. Buzz, starring me, John Lithgow, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or your podcasts.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

There'S stuff they don't want you to know.

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Every Monday, we break down the news, make connections, and reveal the stuff they don't want you to know.

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[Holly Fry]

Welcome to Stuff youf Missed in History Class, a production of iHeartradio. Hello and happy Friday. I'm Holly Fry.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

And I'm Tracy V. Wilson.

[Holly Fry]

We talked about Eadweard Muybridge this week.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yep.

[Holly Fry]

Oh, Edward Muybridge.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

So I will confess, this is not a name that I recognized. Yeah, but as soon as you started talking about the photography he did, I immediately could bring to mind that horse running. The horse running especially.

[Holly Fry]

Yes, 100%. Yeah. He's a fascinating one. I'm glad I got into this. This one was one that almost became a two parter, but since we just did the sewing two parter, I was like, holly, slow your roll. They can't all be two parters and.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Then unearth two parter immediately after sewing.

[Holly Fry]

Right. And I was like no, but I could have gotten. You know, there's part of me that wants to read every trial document because that was such a wild thing. And I want to talk about that in a minute. But one of the things that just came up in my research that I hadn't thought about and I was like oh duh. Was that his work was contextualized in one of the books. I read that book, river of Shadows by Rebecca Solnit in terms of how a number of people were writing about how to be cultured and how to bring culture into your home, including like Louisa May Alcott. And one of the things that they suggested was, you know, to have landscape imagery in your home because that suggested you were refined and they would. I think there's a Louisa May Alcott article where she mentions she name checks both Muybridge's photography and Bierstadt's paintings in the same group. And I was like, oh, I didn't even think about the fact that I've been on a landscapey the landscape y kick. That was just a magical accident.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

I'm scrolling through Google image results of just his name and so many of these other motion studies I have for sure seen before. Just a ton of them.

[Holly Fry]

I mean they're really, really interesting and famous and they get used a lot in like as stock footage in things where people are talking about motion and film history and whatnot. We read that kind description of Leland Stanford. We did not read just this one line. I feel bad cause I didn't notate what article I saw it in but someone described Edward Muybridge as looking like a mix of Walt Whitman and Zeus. And it tickled me so much and it's so accurate.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Uh huh. I agree.

[Holly Fry]

I also mentioned at the top of the show that I would talk about having this revelation that oh, I know this story and where I know it from, tell me. And it is from one of what is perhaps depending on your point of view, my most pretentious interests which is the work of Philip Glass. Okay, give me those half step arpeggios for 10 minutes at a time all day, every day. I love Philip Glass. Einstein on the beach blew my mind when I first heard it when I was in high school and I have been a devotee ever since.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Okay.

[Holly Fry]

So of course Philip Glass wrote an opera about Edward Muybridge called the Photographer. Wow. That I had forgotten I had seen clips of. It was initially started that project by a man named Rob Melach of the Netherlands. I don't know if I'm saying his name correctly, but he wrote the. I don't know that he wrote the libretto, but he wrote the story of it. And then Philip Glass made an opera around it. That is the one staging I have seen footage of is a very plain, very minimalist staging. And it. It almost tickles me knowing how some of these things were playing out.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah.

[Holly Fry]

But listen, I will never, never apologize for loving Philip Glass, because I love him.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

So I could not in any way describe myself as, like, a Philip Glass devotee just because there's a lot of stuff to experience in the world and finite time. But Philip Glass wrote the score to the movie Kundun.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Which is, if you are not familiar with this movie, it is a biopic of Tenzengyatso, the 14th Dalai Lama by Martin Scorsese.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Which my understanding is that that movie was almost kind of buried when it came out because of all of the social and political issues involving the United States and China and Tibet and the diplomatic relationships among all of them. But it. I like. I don't. I can't really comment on, like, the. The. The cultural appropriateness of all of these particular people making this film together. But if you are talking about somebody needing to write a movie score for a religious figure in a religious context that involves a lot of chanting and repetitive. Repetitive actions and thoughts and, like, ritual things with a lot of ritual significance, it makes a lot of sense for Philip Glass to be the person writing the score for it.

[Holly Fry]

Oh, he's so great. Again, like, it's not for everybody. I have had people in the car with me who are like, can we flip to anything else, please? I beg. But for me, it's very. It's cool and it's Zen, and I love it, and it's beautiful. And often the vocal punctuation of it is really sharp and staccato, which I love. I mean, I'm not an expert on opera by any means. I feel like a big dum dum whenever I'm actually talking to people who know a lot about it. But I just emotionally connect to his work so deeply and so instantly. And I love all of it is so good. Anyway, that's my brief foray into my Philip Glass fan. The thing that I find interesting about all of this, and it's been written about a lot by a lot of people, is that there are a lot of folks who basically sum. I won't say they sum this up, but they examine Edward Muybridge's life as an example of a head injury that changed history.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Okay.

[Holly Fry]

Because he was. I mean, we talked about it in the episode that he was characterized as having changed significantly in personality after that happened and how, you know, he became very driven in a way that was different than his behavior before, when he was pretty happy to have a lovely little bookshop. And suddenly he was like, I must take all of the risks. I must go out and do crazy things. I must wander. I must never settle. And it has been really interesting. There are a lot of papers. I did not get into it because I feel like you get into a whole other part in terms of psychology and medicine and psychiatry and also the diagnosing of a person who is deceased.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Right.

[Holly Fry]

But there are a lot of, you know, very well established and respected experts in, you know, things like head injuries that are like, yes, his behavior shifts are very much in. Concurrent with someone who has had head trauma.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Holly Fry]

And it's just a fascinating thing to me because we don't know if he ever would have gotten those photographs and invented the zoo praxiscope if he had not had that incident happen.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Right.

[Holly Fry]

He may have just been a nice guy who had a bookshop in San Francisco. And we never learned his name as, like, an important historical figure.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Well, and especially because it sounds like from his description of his, like, what he experienced after that injury, it like, it sounds like he was having kind of a double vision phenomenon for a while.

[Holly Fry]

It got better. Yeah. But it may have changed how he perceived things that he views.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah, right. That may have been part of what gave him the idea on how to do some of this. Yeah. A foot washed up, a shoe with some bones in it. They had no idea who it was. Most everything was burned up pretty good from the fire that not a whole lot was salvageable.

[Unknown]

These are the coldest of cold cases. But everything is about to change.

Every case that is a cold case that has DNA right now in a backlog will be identified in our lifetime.

A small lab in Texas is cracking the code on DNA Using new scientific tools. They're finding clues in evidence so tiny you might just miss it.

He never thought he was going to get caught. And I just looked at my computer screen, I was just like, ah, gotcha.

On America's Crime Lab, we'll learn about victims and survivors. And you'll meet the team behind the scenes at othram, the Houston lab that takes on the most hopeless cases to finally solve the unsolvable. Listen to America's Crime Lab on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[John Lithgow]

Hello, I'm John Lithgow.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

We choose to go to the moon.

[John Lithgow]

I want to tell you about my new fiction podcast.

[Holly Fry]

That's one small step for man.

[John Lithgow]

It's about Buzz Aldrin, one of the true pioneers of space.

[Unknown]

You're a great pilot, Buzz. As far as I'm concerned, the best I've seen.

[John Lithgow]

That's the story you think you know. This is the story you don't predisposition.

[Maria Hinojosa]

To depression, alcohol abuse and suicide.

[John Lithgow]

We'll see Buzz try to overcome demons.

[Unknown]

What do you say, Buzz? Another beer.

[John Lithgow]

And triumph over addiction.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Here's to you, Buzz Aldrin.

[John Lithgow]

Good luck to you and become a true hero.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Buzz and I will proceed into the.

[John Lithgow]

Lunar module not because he conquers space, but because he conquers himself.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Buzz, we intercepted a Soviet radio transmission.

[John Lithgow]

Starring me, John Lithgow.

[Unknown]

Can you put it through?

[John Lithgow]

Can you Translate on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Holly Fry]

Colombia.

[Unknown]

What's up, guys? Welcome to Agusto Papa. The go to spot for everything. Musica Mexicana. We're proud Mexican Americans who live and breathe this music. We started this podcast to share and discuss our views on musica Mexicana. Whether you like Peso Pluma, Los Alegres del Barranco, Ariel Camacho or Ivan Cornejo, when you get in your feels, then this podcast is for you. We deep dive into music reviews. Puerto Pluma show last year, everything was a 10 out of 10. Fashion and lifestyle inspired by the roots of musica mexicana. The craziest controversies and Cheeseman.

[Holly Fry]

I don't have nothing against Puerto and I don't think Joe Pete should be mad at me.

[Unknown]

Song and artist comparisons, competition in the scene. There is competition, there is sides to this. There's special Pluma, Double P and there's J O P Street Mob. I think at the end of the day, it's business, it's all competition, and of course, our personal stories and opinions along the way. This isn't just a podcast. It's a movement for fans who live musica Mexicana every single day. Listen to Augusto Papa as part of the Michael Tura Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Maria Hinojosa]

When I became a journalist, I was the first Latina in the newsrooms where I worked. I'm Maria Hinojosa. I dreamt of having a place where voices that have been historically sidelined would instead be centered for over 30 years now. Latino USA has been that place. This is Latino USA, the radio journal of news and Cultura. As the longest running Latino news and culture show in the United States, Latino USA delivers the stories that truly matter to all of us. From sharp and deep analysis of the.

[Unknown]

Most pressing news, they're creating this narrative.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

That immigrants are criminals.

[Holly Fry]

This is about everyone's freedom of speech.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Nobody expected two popes from the American.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Continent to stories about our cultures and our identities.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

When you do get a trans character like Emilia Perez, the trans community is gonna push back on that colorism.

[Maria Hinojosa]

All of these things that exist in Mexican culture and Latino culture, you'll hear from people like Congresswoman aoc. I don't wanna give them my.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

I'm not gonna give them my fear.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Listen to Latino USA as part of the My Cultura podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

This also reminds me a little bit of Phineas Gage, who.

[Holly Fry]

He is often invoked in a lot of the papers about Edward Muybridge's.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

So if you are not familiar with Phineas Gage, I'm saying this from memory. Phineas Gage was working like a railroad worker and his job involved setting an explosive and something went wrong and the tamping iron blew out of the hole and threw part of his face and head. Yeah, we did an episode on this. It was a Saturday Classic on May 23rd of 2020. And a lot of it is about, like, number one, the fact that he survived that injury wild in an era where there were not, like, modern antibiotics, and also the fact that his personality seemed to have some changes afterward. Although it's. If I'm remembering correctly from that episode, some of the writing about it makes it sound more extreme than it probably actually was. But that becoming part of, you know, the more knowledge about, like, how the brain works and how the brain works after an injury and that kind of thing.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah, it's super fascinating. Most researchers who have kind of examined his case think that he had an injury to the orbitofrontal cortex, which, you know, controls things like the regulation of emotion. And, you know, you can get this injury without it being easily visible because it's right near the bony ridges that are. Oh, yeah, you know, that make up your eye socket. Like, it's right behind those ridges that form the eye socket. And so you can actually cut into your orbitofrontal cortex without knowing it and have these changes in your behavior, even though you are recovering seemingly outwardly, that aren't necessarily as easily discernible to Even medical professionals, they're like, great. His vision's getting better. Like, he can function on his own. He can travel, he can make decisions. But really, he is a different person than he was before. All of this as kind of evidenced by the fact that he was like, well, I gotta go kill that guy. But then I'm like, I don't know. Is that brain injury? Because everybody else was like, yeah, you had to go kill that guy.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah. I mean, it just. It seems like the. That's. That's where it gets kind of wild to me. And, like, I know in earlier eras, and especially in this context, like, earlier eras, in places that were in the western part of North America.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

There was, like, more of a culture of that kind of violence being used to solve problems and that being seen as just sort of how it worked.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

And I don't know if that's related to that at all. That's absolutely speculation on my part. But the fact that the jury also ultimately came to agree that, yes, he was justified in killing someone who had had an affair with his wife.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

After being instructed the opposite by the judge. Yeah.

[Holly Fry]

That's the part that really gets me, is that the judge is like, do not. Do not think about that part, because that's not part of it. We know that happened, but still, somebody's dead. Like, that's not. This is not an eye for an eye kind of situation, you guys. And they're like, yeah, it is.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

It also feels like not exactly the same thing as jury nullification, because usually when we're talking about jury nullification, the idea is that the law in question is unjust. And at least from what you have said, that doesn't seem like where they were coming from. It wasn't that. Oh, a law making it illegal to murder people is not unjust. Yeah.

[Holly Fry]

No. They literally were like, I would do the same thing, so I can't condemn him.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Right.

[Holly Fry]

What?

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Okay.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah. It would make me very scared to go to Northern California in the 1870s.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah. Well, there are also cultures in the world still today where, like, honor killings are kind of.

[Holly Fry]

Yes, a hundred % a thing. 100%.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

I don't know. It's. It took me totally by surprise.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

It's.

[Holly Fry]

Cause it's wild. It's interesting because Flora and Harry are talked about in a number of different ways. Like, I read a death announcement for Flora that's kind of like. She kind of had a checkered past, you guys. Like, it's. It's a little defamatory in a very Gentle sort of way. The way they write about it, they're like, well, she was married at 17 and she was actually living away from her husband for a while before she divorced him. And like, there's definitely some characterization of her as having taken advantage of Edward in some way in getting him to help her out of her first marriage and then marrying her. I mean, listen, he was at the time already a famous photographer, so he probably would have had a number of women who would be interested in him as a potential high earning mate. But I don't know. Listen, his friends during the trial were like, no, he was really super in love with her.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Right.

[Holly Fry]

So I don't. Which is possible. He could have been super in love with her and she could have been taking advantage of him. That is possible. But also this was at a time when women got characterized as sneaky weasels with very little provocation. So I don't know. And Harry Larkin's life story is bananas. Like bananas bananas. When you read about his life before he got to San Francisco, it's like he had all these wild adventures and feats and people are like, I don't actually think most of this is true. A lot of historians are like, I think he made some of this up. Like, so we don't really know what actual hijinks he got into. But it didn't end well for him, obviously. And then there's the midwife, Susan Smith. What a story. Anyway, the statue of Edward Muybridge at the Presidio is beautiful. If you go see it. That's the guy who murdered somebody in.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Cold blood and was acquitted.

[Holly Fry]

And was acquitted for it and went on to have a very, very successful rest of his life, which is a little mind blowy, but also, I mean.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

I just, I feel like I'm going to get hate mail for saying this, but usually when that happens, today it is a cop that kills someone and then is acquitted.

[Holly Fry]

You're, you're not wrong. Yeah, but in this case, just Edward Muybridge, a famous photographer. I don't know, I don't know. I don't know if his fame factored in to the jury's decision.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

A foot washed up, a shoe with some bones in it. They had no idea who it was. Most everything was burned up pretty good from the fire, that not a whole lot was salvageable.

[Unknown]

These are the coldest of cold cases, but everything is about to change.

Every case that is a cold case that has DNA right now in a backlog will be identified in our lifetime.

A small lab in Texas is cracking the code on DNA using new scientific tools. They're finding clues in evidence so tiny you might just miss it.

He never thought he was going to get caught. And I just looked at my computer screen. I was just like, ah, gotcha.

On America's Crime Lab, we'll learn about victims and survivors. And you'll meet the team behind the scenes at othram, the Houston lab that takes on the most hopeless cases to finally solve the unsolvable. Listen to America's Crime Lab on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[John Lithgow]

Hello, I'm John Lithgow.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

We choose to go to the moon.

[John Lithgow]

I want to tell you about my new fiction podcast that's one small step for man. It's about Buzz Aldrin, one of the true pioneers of space.

[Unknown]

You're a great pilot, Buzz. As far as I'm concerned, the best I've seen.

[John Lithgow]

That's the story you think you know. This is the story you don't predisposition.

[Maria Hinojosa]

To depression, alcohol abuse and suicide.

[John Lithgow]

We'll see Buzz try to overcome demons.

[Unknown]

What do you say, Buzz? Another beer.

[John Lithgow]

And triumph over addiction.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Here's to you, Buzz Aldrin.

[John Lithgow]

Good luck to you and become a true hero.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Buzz and I will proceed into the.

[John Lithgow]

Lunar module not because he conquers space, but but because he conquers himself.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Buzz, we intercepted a Soviet radio transmission.

[John Lithgow]

Starring me, John Lithgow.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Can you put it through?

[John Lithgow]

Can you Translate on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Holly Fry]

Columbia.

[Unknown]

What's up, guys? Welcome to Agusto Papa, the go to spot for everything. Musica mexicana. We're proud Mexican Americans who live and breathe this music. We started this podcast to share and discuss our views on musica mexicana. Whether you like peso pluma, los alres del Barranco, Ariel Camacho or Ivan Cornejo, when you get in your feels, then this podcast is for you. We deep dive into music reviews. Pizza Pluma show Last year, everything was a 10 out of 10. Fashion and lifestyle inspired by the roots of musica mexicana. The craziest controversies and cheesemans.

[Holly Fry]

I don't have nothing against puerto, you know, and I don't think Jo P should be mad at me.

[Unknown]

Song and artist comparisons, competition in the scene. There is competition, there is sides to this. There's special pluma double P and there's J O P mob. I think at the end of the day, it's business, it's all competition. And of course, our personal stories and opinions along the way, this isn't just a podcast. It's a movement for fans who live Musica Mexicana every single day. Listen to Augusto Papa as part of the Michael Tura Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast.

[Maria Hinojosa]

When I became a journalist, I was the first Latina in the newsrooms where I worked. I'm Maria Hinojosa. I dreamt of having a place where voices that have been historically sidelined would instead be centered. For over 30 years now, Latino USA has been that place. This is Latino USA, the radio journal of news and Cultura. As the longest running Latino news and culture show in the United States, Latino USA delivers the stories that truly matter to all of us. From sharp and deep analysis of the.

[Unknown]

Most pressing news, they're creating this narrative.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

That immigrants are criminals.

[Holly Fry]

This is about everyone's freedom of speech.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Nobody expected two popes from the American.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Continent to stories about our cultures and our identities.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

When you do get a trans character like Emilia Perez, the trans community's gonna.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Push back on that colorism. All of these things exist in Mexican culture and Latino culture. You'll hear from people like Congresswoman aoc.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

I don't want to give them my fear. I'm not going to give them my fear.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Listen to Latino USA as part of the Mike Cultura Podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

We talked about Beatrice Kenner and Mildred Smith and their various inventions this week, which meant we talked a lot about menstrual protection.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

And. And Holly, you and I came of age to start menstruating during the transition from sanitary belts to adhesive pads.

[Holly Fry]

Yes.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

There also were other options happening at the same time. But the thing that caused us to have to kind of stop in the minute, in a minute, in the middle of recording to clarify something was like the. The belt to adhesive transition.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Because I think you got health class discussion at school with a video that still had belts in it.

[Holly Fry]

Well, and we also got a little sample pack that had one.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Oh, really?

[Holly Fry]

Now, granted, this could reflect on my school system. For all I know, those had been sitting there in a closet for like 10 years. I don't know, but I remember them giving us a little sample pack and being like, no, not this. Because we did know that there were better options available.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah.

[Holly Fry]

And there. Some of those better options were in that sample pack. Like, it was a wide range.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Okay.

[Holly Fry]

So I don't know if it was like a. It was kind of Like a, hey, here are options available to you. And this way you don't have to buy a box of everything to find out what you're most comfortable with.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah, yeah. So I remember like being at the drugstore and at that time, this would have been like in the early to mid-80s that the, like pads would specifically be labeled as beltless.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

And I think where I was really introduced to the idea of like a sanitary belt was reading Judy Blume's Are you there, God? It's me, Margaret, when I was a kid. And so that was first published in 1970.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

At which point adhesive pads did exist, but like they were not widespread yet. Really in 1970, I would have read it around maybe 1982 or 83, probably maybe a little bit later than that. That book has been updated today to reference, like adhesive pads. But when I read it, like, there was still this discussion of belts. And I remember an adult having to explain to me that, like, number one, that was how they worked before. Number two, that the adult in question, who probably was my mom, found the belted ones to be terrible.

[Holly Fry]

I have so many thoughts.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Holly Fry]

Like, do I disclose what a terrible child I was? Because I was. So when we had our little aside during recording where we were like, I was like, no, the belt still existed. And you were like, did you read about it in. Are you there? Got it to be. Margaret, as a kid, I had a very strong and not kind opinion of that book.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Oh, really? Okay.

[Holly Fry]

Yes. And I don't listen. This was kid Holly who was a tiny shrew. Very judgmental. But I thought that book was for babies who wouldn't look stuff up in the encyclopedia.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Okay.

[Holly Fry]

I was like, I don't need somebody to tell me a story about this. It's just science about menstruation. Yeah, it's just science and I'll learn my own way. Like, I didn't want anybody to tell me about it. I didn't want any sugar coated version of any of it. I literally was just like, just giving me a scientific pamphlet.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah, yeah, that's funny.

[Holly Fry]

Like, I. Cause I had two older sisters also.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Right.

[Holly Fry]

And I remember looking at the insert packaging in their products that they had in their bathroom and being like, oh, I understand this. And then I was like, why do people need a baby book to explain? Like, I was so catty and horrible about it.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

It's so funny.

[Holly Fry]

What an awful mean child. Tiny, mean girl.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

I feel like we all do things when we were children, right?

[Holly Fry]

But also, like, those books are Great for a lot of people at like, introducing concepts of very adult things that need to be handled in life.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Right.

[Holly Fry]

To kids in a way that is accessible and kind and like. But I was just not an accessible, kind kid. I was a mean little shrew.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah. I'm pretty sure that when I was old enough for this book to be relevant to me, there were probably still adults who were using belted pads because that was what they had always used and that was what they. You know, they were still around in stores. That was definitely never something I personally used. And so it felt a little odd to have this book. It made the book feel really old fashioned.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Even though it wasn't written that long before I was born. And as we said, like, nowadays the ones that people buy currently or read as ebooks or whatever, like, that's been updated to reflect how pads work today. On. On another note, this episode was simultaneously a joy and deeply frustrating to research.

[Holly Fry]

Well, there's so much mystery information that's been relayed incorrectly.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yes. So I think it's totally within the realm of possibility that Beatrice and Mildred both worked at the General Accounting Office. Most of what I actually read that was like, interviews with Beatrice. She said something like, I got a government job. And so part of me is like, was the government job at the General Accounting Office? Or did somebody at some point conflate Mildred and Beatrice? Which has definitely happened with other details. And like, just. And I did not try to go hunt down federal employment records from the 40s and 50s. Like, that's beyond what we are normally trying to do on our show. So, like, some of those things are possibly things that are clarified somewhere, but, like, just not in the information that I had. I listened to an episode of the Smithsonian side Door podcast that was about. About them that made reference to an article that had been published in 1993. And I went down just the longest rabbit hole of trying to track down this article. And I did all kinds of different Googling and also looking in all kinds of different databases and newspaper repositories and all kinds of stuff, including searching quotes that they read word for word in this episode. And finally I was like, okay, this probably is just something that the website that it was on is defunct now and I'm not gonna be able to find it. And then I opened a PhD dissertation that I had already downloaded. And that was what it was.

[Holly Fry]

A kind piece of fate.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah. Yeah. But also, like, what a waste of time that I spent, like, trying to find this thing that was. Turned out to be Something I already had. So this PhD dissertation was about black women inventors. Specifically, I think it might be the source of the misspelling of the San Nam Pac Company. Yeah, San. What? I don't remember. The San instead of San, I think might have come there from there. And also might have been from a transcript of an oral interview. Like, that seems like a possible thing that might have happened is that, like, the transcript of an oral interview led to this misspelling that then got repeated other places. But it also included a very significant error, which is it said that Beatrice had gotten married to heavyweight boxing champion Jack Jabo Johnson. Jack Johnson, a famous black heavyweight boxer, was dead when Beatrice Kenner married James Jabo Kenner, a completely different person. And that's such an error. I'm like, Beatrice cannot have said this, right? That cannot be, like, what she said in this interview. I'm really curious, like, what exactly happened there? Like, how did that wind up being in the text? But then that made me second guess details that were in here that were, like, in that same PhD dissertation. And there was just a lot of stuff that I would stumble over and go, okay, is this. Was this actually right? And then I would go try to track down, you know, other sources to confirm whether that was right, ideally finding, like, a primary source that was either something written on them during their lifetimes or something they actually said to a different interviewer. And so it was a whole long process of just continually stumbling over things where I was like, family traditions. I love the idea of this board game. I feel like if you repackage that today with all of the people who love doing genealogy, it would be a huge hit. Yeah. Yeah. I also know somebody who developed a board game while recovering from a serious injury in very similar circumstances. And so I just had sort of, you know, fond feelings about people in my life while researching this. And, yeah, that was a whole process. A whole process of alternately being like, man, what a great thing. And then like, is this correct? Can I confirm it's correct? Is it even possible to confirm it's correct with the resources that I have available. Available. Available to me at this time. Can I say the word available on the podcast? Beatrice's first patent for the sanitary belt also included a term that I don't know if I've ever encountered before. Yes, catamenial.

[Holly Fry]

Okay.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

A term for relating to menstruation that is apparently not as common anymore.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah, I had never heard it before.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

This moment, and that is how it was referenced throughout the patent. And that made me wonder Is this sort of an evolution in the language that is more commonly used, or was it just because there's so much stigma around periods that a less potentially obvious term was chosen for it? I don't know. I don't know. Either way, though, I love both of these sisters and their stories.

[Holly Fry]

They're very charming.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yeah.

[Holly Fry]

I love how they just solved problems with their brains.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Yep. Yep.

[Holly Fry]

After my own heart.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Let's try to make it so you're not having to hunt for the end of the toilet paper.

[Holly Fry]

I don't know why that one tickled me, but it did.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

It made me think about how often I'm just like, it's the middle of the night and I'm spinning the toilet paper roll around, trying to get the end of it to show up for me. And what I really want to do is go back to bed.

[Holly Fry]

I think I just slap it and wait for something to fly out. Yeah, I do a slap spin. Is that not how everybody does it?

[Tracy V. Wilson]

I kind of flip it with my hands, but sometimes the end of the toilet paper sticks to the rest of the roll, and it takes a little bit. I bet this depends on the brand and texture of toilet paper that a person has in their home.

[Holly Fry]

100%.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Anyway, I can't remember where exactly I stumbled onto. I think what I stumbled onto was Beatrice, and over time, the episode evolved to be about both of them. And I don't remember where I stumbled across something about Beatrice, but I'm glad I did. Hey, whatever's coming up on your weekend, if there is a minor annoyance in your life that you're able to just find a solution for, I hope you do. I hope it's one of those things where a minimal amount of money or time or expense can just resolve something. Then you don't have to deal with it anymore. We will be back with a Saturday classic tomorrow, and we will have something brand new on Monday. Stuff youf Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

[Unknown]

Every case that is a cold case that has DNA right now in a backlog will be identified in our lifetime.

On the new podcast, America's Crime Lab. Every case has a story to tell, and the DNA holds the truth.

He never thought he was going to get caught. And I just looked at my computer screen. I was just like, ah, gotcha.

[Holly Fry]

This technology's already solving so many cases.

[Unknown]

Listen to America's Crime Lab. On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[John Lithgow]

Hello, I'm John Lithgow.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

We choose to go to the moon.

[John Lithgow]

I want to tell you about my new fiction podcast.

[Holly Fry]

That's One Small Step for Man about.

[John Lithgow]

Buzz Aldrin, one of the true pioneers of space.

[Unknown]

You're a great pilot, Buzz.

[John Lithgow]

That's the story you think you know. This is the story you don't. Buzz starring me, John Lithgow, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

There's stuff they don't want you to know.

[Unknown]

Every Monday we break down the news, make connections and reveal feel the stuff they don't want you to know.

A secret deal between members of Mexican cartels and the United States government.

Residents are reporting sightings of exploding birds.

Listen to stuff they don't want you to know on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you find your favorite shows.

[Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford]

I'm Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford, host of the Therapy for Black Girls podcast. I know how overwhelming it can feel if flying makes you anxious. In session 418 of the Therapy for Black Girls podcast, Dr. Angela Neal Barnett and I discuss flight anxiety.

[Holly Fry]

What is not normal is to allow it to prevent you from doing the things that you want to do, the things that you were meant to do.

[Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford]

Listen to Therapy for Black Girls on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

This is an iHeart podcast.