Loudun Possessions

Summary

---

Stuff You Missed in History Class

Episode: Loudun Possessions

Hosts: Holly Fry & Tracy V. Wilson

Air Date: October 6, 2025

---

Main Theme

In this episode, Holly and Tracy unravel the infamous case of the Loudun possessions in 17th-century France. The story, set in a period of political, religious, and social upheaval, revolves around alleged demonic possession in a convent, the downfall of a controversial priest, mass hysteria, and the intertwining of supernatural claims with power struggles and gender dynamics. The hosts explore primary events, their historical context, aftermath, and modern interpretations, providing a thorough look at one of Europe’s most debated witchcraft and possession cases.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Origins of the Loudun Possessions

• The First Visitation
  • On September 22, 1632, three nuns at the Ursuline convent in Loudun, France, reported being visited by a spirit—always appearing as a member of the clergy.

    "This was the beginning of the most famous possession and witchcraft case that France and really most of Europe had ever experienced." – Tracy (03:01)

• Escalation of Events
  • Reports of abnormal occurrences: voices, invisible assaults, fits of giggling, and even spectral skeletons wandering the convent. (03:45)
  • A mysterious incident: the Mother Superior, Jeanne des Anges, receives hawthorn berries from a “spirit hand,” leading to convulsions and irrational behavior among the nuns. (04:16)

    “I never saw a definitive explanation as to whether they consumed those hawthorns…” – Holly (04:59)

2. Socio-Political Backdrop

• Loudun in Turmoil
  • Loudun recently suffered a plague, religious wars, and ongoing Catholic-Protestant friction.

    "Under King Louis iii, the French government wanted to tear down the walls that surrounded the city of Loudun... The Catholic population was all for this. But the Huguenot Protestants saw it as a way to ensure Catholicism... dominated their day to day lives." – Holly (05:13)

3. Enter Urbain Grandier

• Background
  • Urbain Grandier, a well-educated, charismatic priest, defied convention with anti-royalist views, Protestant sympathies, and opposition to clerical celibacy. (06:45–07:56)
  • Known for sexual liaisons, especially with women in Loudun, leading to scandal and deep local resentment. (08:53)
  • Publicly accused, tried twice—once ecclesiastically and once civilly—for sexual conduct, blasphemy, and turning the church into a brothel. Initially punished, later acquitted after evidence of witness tampering. (10:02–12:21)

    "He could 100% be a jerk." – Holly (08:53)

4. The Possessions Amplified

• Role of Jeanne des Anges
  • Like Grandier, she became Mother Superior at a young age. Her intense experiences and leadership made her the focus. (17:31)
• Demonic Diagnoses and Public Exorcisms
  • Criteria for possession: speaking foreign languages, clairvoyance, unnatural strength, levitation—all open to interpretation. (18:04)

    "Of course, those are also the same list of qualifiers to determine if you had some sort of divine interaction... a matter of interpretation..." – Holly (18:36)

  • Exorcisms evolved from private rituals to grand public spectacles, sometimes on scaffolds in the town square—becoming a spectacle and even a tourist attraction. (18:36–20:10)
• Accusations and Evidence
  • Jeanne and other nuns directly accused Grandier, presenting a “contract with the devil” he allegedly signed in blood. (20:10)
  • Church silenced dissent by legal decree—critics risked execution. (21:09)

5. Grandier’s Fate and Continuing Turmoil

• Political Manipulation and Execution
  • Grandier’s allies silenced; Cardinal Richelieu dispatched a commission. Grandier was found guilty of sorcery and burned at the stake on August 18, 1634. (22:11)
• Aftermath in Loudun
  • Public debate stifled; church authorities justified their actions, while Jeanne continued to display odd behavior—even regretting her testimony and attempting suicide. (23:02–23:35)

    "She also attempted suicide at least once and possibly twice... it was perceived as proof that she was still possessed." – Tracy (23:35)

6. Father Jean-Joseph Surin’s Role

• A New Approach
  • Surin, a young, devout priest, implemented a more therapeutic, personal strategy. Sessions with Jeanne resembled proto-talk therapy, focusing on her self-agency. (24:39)

    "A lot of the interactions between Jean and Saurain actually sounds almost like modern talk therapy..." – Holly (24:39)

  • Continued exorcisms, quieter than before; over several years, Jeanne was declared free of demons, and began displaying “holy” scars: Jesus, Maria, Joseph, and Francis de Sales inscribed on her arm. (25:48)
• Personal Consequences
  • Surin’s mental and physical health declined after claiming Jeanne's demons had entered him; he suffered hallucinations and attempted suicide. Both he and Jeanne died in 1665. (27:55)

    “During my ministry, the devil passed from the body of the possessed person and entered into mine.” – Father Surin (Letter, cited at 27:55)

7. New Accounts and Modern Interpretations

• Critical Reappraisals
  • In 1693, Protestant pastor Nicolas Aubin published an account blaming political intrigue for Grandier’s death, claiming the nuns were coached. (33:36)
  • Monsieur Danielle’s eyewitness account also dismissed the sorcery claims as baseless and politically motivated. (34:42)
• Magic and the Church
  • Danielle traced the Church’s historic use and prohibition of magic, noting the psychological power of words and rituals. (35:08)

    “In every word there is a magical influence, and that each word is in itself the breath of the internal and moving spirit…” – Danielle (Quoted by Tracy, 35:08)

• Sociological and Psychological Analysis
  • Grandier as scapegoat—his execution “purged” collective anxieties in a traumatized town. (36:40)
  • Aldous Huxley’s 1952 book "The Devils of Loudun" is regarded as a definitive modern analysis. (37:26)
  • French scholar Michel de Certeau and others interpret the possessions as mass hysteria emerging amid major societal shifts, giving women a unique voice in a patriarchal system. (37:42–38:32)
  • Historian Moshe Sluhovsky’s research (2002) emphasizes that Loudun was only one among many cases of convent group possessions, most unconnected to witchcraft trials. He suggests these events expressed complex internal and social tensions among women living in isolated, strict religious environments. (39:07)

    “These instances of mass possession are a form of, quote, female monastic spirituality… expressions of the very many tensions at play in fairly isolated communities.” – Tracy (40:53)

---

Memorable Quotes & Moments

| Timestamp | Quote | Speaker | |-----------|-------|---------| | 03:01 | "This was the beginning of the most famous possession and witchcraft case that France and really most of Europe had ever experienced." | Tracy | | 08:53 | "Yeah, there's nobody that's like, what? He was so kind. They're like, oh, yeah, he could 100% be a jerk." | Holly | | 18:36 | “Those are also the same list of qualifiers to determine if you had some sort of divine interaction… it was really a matter of interpretation…” | Holly | | 20:10 | "Diagrams were created showing where each of them was most tightly lodged. And Jeanne became the star of the show..." | Tracy | | 21:09 | "Anyone publicly criticizing the nuns’ claims or the way the Church was handling the sorcery investigation could be put to death." | Holly | | 24:39 | "A lot of the interactions between Jean and Saurain actually sounds almost like modern talk therapy, with Jeanne learning to find her own strength, which in turn was said to be weakening her demons..." | Holly | | 27:55 | “During my ministry, the devil passed from the body of the possessed person and entered into mine.” | Father Surin (via Holly) | | 35:08 | “In every word there is a magical influence, and that each word is in itself the breath of the internal and moving spirit.” | Danielle (via Tracy) | | 40:53 | “These instances of mass possession are a form of, quote, female monastic spirituality… expressions of the very many tensions at play in fairly isolated communities.” | Tracy |

---

Segment Timestamps

• Historical context and initial possessions – 02:30–06:45
• Urbain Grandier’s background, conflict, and trials – 06:45–13:13
• Mother Superior Jeanne des Anges and rise of possession claims – 17:31–20:10
• The exorcisms and Grandier’s execution – 20:10–23:02
• Aftermath, Surin’s involvement, and psychological approaches – 23:35–29:14
• Alternate narratives and sociological/psychological reanalysis – 33:36–41:41

---

Episode Takeaways

• The Loudun possessions represent a confluence of individual ambition, social hysteria, gendered power dynamics, and brutal state religion.
• The story exposes how accusations of witchcraft and possession were frequently tools for manipulating public opinion and removing political undesirables.
• Modern historians and scholars generally view the events as examples of group psychosis and mass hysteria, catalyzed by both internal pressures within the convent and external social anxieties.
• The case’s legacy continues to inspire research on the intersections of religion, psychology, gender, and authority—the lines between “possession,” agency, and manipulation remain fervently debated.

---

Overall Tone

The hosts blend scholarly rigor, dark humor, and an accessible conversational style. They consistently emphasize the tangled interplay between documented facts, unreliable sources, and modern reinterpretations—reminding listeners that history is often as much about who tells the story as it is about what “really” happened.

---

Transcript

[Tracy V. Wilson]

This is an I heart podcast.

[Holly Fry]

Listen to your elders, honey. You might know them from their viral videos, but now the old gays are pulling back the curtain with their new podcast, Silver Linings with the Old Gays, brought to you in partnership with iHeart's Ruby Studio and Veeve Healthcare. Hosts Robert, Mick, Bill, and Jesse serve their lifetime of wisdom when it comes to love, sex, community, and whatever else they've got on the gay agenda. So check out Silver Linings with the old gays on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Alena Sada]

Sacred Scandal is back, the hit true crime podcast that uncovers hidden truths and shattered faith. For 19 years, Alena Sada was a nun for the Legion of Christ. This season, she's telling her story.

When I first joined the Legion of Christ, I felt chosen. I was 19 years old when Marcia Almaser, the leader of the Legionaries, looked me in the eye and told me I had a calling.

Surviving meant hiding. Escaping took courage. Risking everything to tell her truth. Listen to Sacred Scandal, the many secrets of Martial Maciel on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

Malcolm Gladwell here. This season on Revisionist History. We're going back to the spring of 1988 to a town in northwest Alabama where a man committed a crime that would spiral out of control.

[Holly Fry]

And he said, I've been in prison 24, 25 years.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

That's probably not long enough.

[Holly Fry]

I didn't kill him.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

From revisionist history, this is the Alabama Murders. Listen to Revisionist History, the Alabama murders on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Evan Ratliff]

When news broke earlier this year that baby kj, a newborn in Philadelphia, had successfully received the world's first personalized gene editing treatment, it represented a milestone for both researchers and patients. But there's a gripping tale of discovery behind this accomplishment and its creators. I'm Evan Ratliff, and together with biographer Walter Isaacson, we're delving into the story of Nobel Prize winner Jennifer Doudna, a woman who's helped change the trajectory of humanity. Listen to on crispr, the Story of Jennifer Doudna with Walter isaacson on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Holly Fry]

Welcome to Stuff youf Missed in History Class, a production of iHeartRadio. Hello and welcome to the podcast. I'm Holly Fry.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

And I'm Tracy V. Wilson.

[Holly Fry]

And today's show is about a famous case of mass possession. The story of the loudun possessions in 17th century France has kept theologians, psychology experts, historians, and occultists frankly fascinated for four centuries. And that's because it involves a group of nuns who described some very unsettling visitations at their convent. And that developed into a story of possession, political intrigue, and a moment in time that was just rife with social tens.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

So on September 22, 1632, three nuns at the Ursuline convent in Loudun, France, were, according to reports, visited in the night by what appeared to be a spirit asking for help. This spirit appeared to each of them separately, but in each appearance, it was a member of the clergy. Those three nuns were Jeanne des Anges, who was the Mother Superior, Sister de Colombier, her assistant, and a judge, junior member of the order called Sister Marta Saint Monique. This was the beginning of the most famous possession and witchcraft case that France and really most of Europe had ever experienced.

[Holly Fry]

According to the nuns accounts, there were many other unusual happenings at the convent in the nights that followed. First, there were sounds. They heard voices. But then things escalated. Nuns, these three and others began to report being hit by unseen forces. Some of them were stricken with fits of giggling for no reason. It was just this uncontrollable reaction. And then they started seeing a skeleton walking through the convent hallways.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Then one night, the Mother Superior was handed some hawthorns by what appeared to be a spirit hand. Hawthorns are tart berries that come from a flowering shrub. Like a lot of other plants, this is related to the rose. Hawthorns have historically been used to treat things like indigestion, kidney disease, and skin condition, although there's no solid proof that they help with any of that. And some hawthorn preparations can be toxic. But for these nuns, there was another effect, which was convulsions. The behavior of the nuns also became irrational, and they started to see a clear image of a particular person they all knew.

[Holly Fry]

I will say, for clarity, I never saw a definitive explanation as to whether they consumed those hawthorns or if they.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Sort of were spiritually exposed to the Hawthorne.

[Holly Fry]

Right. But to talk about what happened next, we actually have to put this unique moment in context and talk about some of the key players in the story. So Loudun, which was founded in the 11th century by Benedictine monks, sits about 300 kilometers southwest of Paris. And in the early 17th century, when this story takes place, it had been through a lot. It had just been through a terrifying plague in which 3,000 of its residents had died. There was no way to treat the plague, and many of the doctors had left. Sometimes this is described as the doctors abandoning Loudon. But they realized they couldn't do anything and they did not want to die and not be able to help other people. And Huguenot Protestants and Catholics had also been at odds in the region throughout the 16th century in what were known as the French wars of religion. The Edict of Nantes had ended the fighting in 1598 and it had established religious tolerance on paper. But there was still friction and mistrust between those factions in the more acute sense. Under King Louis iii, the French government wanted to tear down the walls that surrounded the city of Loudun as a way to make it less isolated and to bring it into the greater fold of French centralized government. The Catholic population of the town was all for this. But the Huguenot Protestants saw it as a way to ensure that Catholicism, which was the national religion, dominated their day to day lives.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Next, we introduce Urbain Grandier. Grandier was born in Bu France in 1590. According to a biography about him written by Alexandre Dumas Pere. He was educated by his father, Pierre Grandier, and his uncle, Claude Grandier. Education was in the Sciences. At 12, he entered the Jesuit college at Bordeaux and he did really well in school. He was a good speaker, he had natural charm and his teachers really loved him. It was also there that he became strongly encouraged to put his natural gifts.

[Holly Fry]

To work with the church, and he did so. In 1617, Grandier was made priest of the parish at St Pierre du Marche in Loudun, and also was appointed as a canon at the church of Sainte Croix. That meant that he had a degree of power within the ecclesiastical governance of the region. He would, with other cannons, preside over ecclesiastical court proceedings. At the age of 27, he was considered young to have such prominent positions, particularly in a place that was not his hometown.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Grandier was an outlier among his peers in the Catholic Church. For one, he sided with the Protestant position that Ludon should keep its walls and have a degree of independence from the French cr. He was pretty generally anti royalist and he was not a fan of the powerful Cardinal Richelieu. He also wrote a treatise that stated that he believed the rule of celibacy for religious figures in the Catholic Church should be abolished. But he had enough friends in high places that for a while, although his views were problematic, he maintained his position and power. To add to his list of problematic attributes, he could also be kind of a jerk. He was very smart and more educated than most of the people in Loudun. And it seems like while he was apparently very lovely to people he considered friends or who he admired. He was really condescending to everybody else.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah, there's nobody that's like, what? He was so kind. They're like, oh, yeah, he could 100% be a jerk. He also had a little problem when it came to women. He was very handsome, and he was known to use his charms to gain the favor of women. In short, he was known to engage in a lot of sexual relationships with the women of Loudun. And this became a legal issue that was actually a precursor to the possession case. First, a young woman named Philippe, whose father, Louis Trincan, was the king's prosecutor in Loudun, became pregnant. And word quickly spread that Grandier was the father.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Then, in 1629, a man named Jacques de Thibault started telling anybody and everybody that Grandier was lecherous and that he could not be trusted. Grandier and Thibault got into a physical altercation outside the church after Grandier told Thibault that he had to stop telling everybody he was a bad man. In response to that, Thibault beat the priest with a cane. Grandier pressed charges, and the two men were soon before the parliament of Paris.

[Holly Fry]

Grandier clearly believed he was going to win his case. This was not his first time in court because he was generally pretty quick to escalate conflict into legal matters. And he generally won his cases in part because he was so well spoken and so good at making those cases. But he also made a lot of enemies in the process. In this instance, though, Thiebaud showed up with receipts. There are some versions of this story that actually include the idea that this entire situation had been something of a setup, that Thibault had actually wanted Grandier to engage with him so that they would end up in court. Because many of the men of Loudun were tired of Grandier's hold on the women of the community, and they had resolved to get him out of their town. So when they got to court, Thiebaud presented a long list of incidents in which Grandier was believed to have acted indecently with women of the town. But more than that, Thibault revealed that well respected men of Loudon had already discussed this entire matter with the bishop that Grandier reported to. And that bishop had issued an arrest order for the priest on charges that he corrupted women and girls, engaged in profanity and blasphemy, and turned the church into a brothel. So at that point, the case in civil court against Thibault was dismissed, and things shifted over to ecclesiastical court, where Grandier was the defendant and not the plaintiff.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Things did not go well for Grandier in his ecclesiastical case. After his civil case was dismissed, he made his way back to Loudon to prepare a defense and was immediately imprisoned for two months. When the trial took place, there was no evidence. None of the women of Loudon came forward to say that he had done any of the things that the men of the town had accused him of. But he was still found guilty of indecency. His punishment was that he had to fast on bread and water every Friday for three months and he was barred from performing the functions of a priest in the diocese of Poitiers for five years. That was where he served as Canon at the Church of Sainte Croix. But he was barred from performing public functions of a priest in Loudun permanently.

[Holly Fry]

Grandier did not accept this ruling and he fought it. He appealed in both the ecclesiastical court and the Parliament of Paris, and this was a very different state of affairs. As a new investigation was opened, it became apparent that some of the men who had made statements in the earlier case were inconsistent in their stories when they were questioned again. Others flat out confessed that they had been bribed for their earlier testimony. Some men, when shown their depositions from the earlier proceeding, said that their statements had actually been altered from what they actually said. Because of all of this, Grandier was acquitted and returned to his duties as priest. But there was still a lot of tension regarding him in Loudun. He had actually been offered the chance to transfer to another diocese, but he turned it down.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Coming up, we will talk about Jeanne des Anges, the Mother Superior at Loudon's Ursuline Convent. But first we will pause for a sponsor break.

[Annabe Sofa Advertiser]

There's nothing like sinking into luxury. At washablesofas.com, you'll find the Annabe sofa which combines ultimate comfort and design at an affordable price. And get this, it's the only sofa that's fully machine washable from top to bottom. Starting at only $699, the stain resistant performance fabric slipcovers and cloud like frame duvet can go straight into your wash. Perfect for anyone with kids, pets or anyone who loves an easy to clean spotless sofa. With a modular design and changeable slip covers, you can customize your sofa to fit any space and style. Whether you need a single chair, loveseat or a luxuriously large sectional, Annabe has you covered. Visit washablesofas.com to upgrade your home. Right now you can shop up to 60% off store wide with a 30 day money back guarantee. Shop [e-mail] Add a little to your life. Offers are subject to change, and certain restrictions may apply.

[Sacred Scandal Narrator]

At 19, Elena Sada believed she had found her calling. In the new season of Sacred Scandal, we pulled back the curtain on a life built on devotion and deception. A man of God, Marcial Maciel, looked Elena in the eye and promised her a life of purpose within the Legion of Christ.

[Alena Sada]

My name is Elena Sada, and this is my story. It's a story of how I learned to hide, to cry, to survive, and eventually, how I got out.

[Sacred Scandal Narrator]

This season on Sacred Scandal, hear the full story from the woman who lived it. Witness the journey from devout follower to determined survivor as Helena exposes the man behind the cloth and the system that protected him. Even the darkest secrets eventually find their way to the light. Listen to Segrit Scandal, the many secrets of Martial Maciel as part of the Mike Ultura Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

Malcolm Gladwell here. This season on Revisionist History. We're going back to the spring of 1988 to a town in northwest Alabama where a man committed a crime that would spiral out of control. 35 years. That's how long Elizabeth Senate's family waited for for justice to occur. 35 long years. I want to figure out why this case went on for as long as it did, why it took so many bizarre and unsettling turns along the way, and why, despite our best efforts to resolve suffering, we all too often make suffering worse.

[Revisionist History Narrator]

He would say to himself, turn to the right, to the victim's family and apologize. Turn to the left. Tell my family I love him. So he would have this little practice. To the right. I'm sorry. To the left. I love you.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

From Revisionist History, this is the Alabama Murders. Listen to Revisionist History, the Alabama murders on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Brown Ambition Host]

Hey sis, what if I could promise you you never had to listen to a condescending finance bro tell you how to manage your money Again? Welcome to Brown Ambition. This is the hard part. When you pay down those credit cards, if you haven't gotten to the bottom of why you were racking up credit or turning to credit cards, you may just rec create the same problem. A year from now when you do feel like you are bleeding from these high interest rates, I would start shopping for a debt consolidation loan, starting with your local credit union. Shopping around online, looking for some online lenders because they tend to have fewer fees and be more affordable. Listen, I am not here to judge. It is so expensive in these streets. I 100% can see how in just a few months you can have this much credit card debt and it weighs on you. It's really easy to just like stick.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Your head in the sand.

[Brown Ambition Host]

It's like nice and dark in the sand. Even if it's scary, it's not going to go away just because you're avoiding it. And in fact, it may get even worse. For more judgment free money advice, listen to Brown ambition on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Holly Fry]

Mother Superior Jeanne des Anges was, like Grandier, given a lot of responsibility at a young age. She was born in 1605 as Jeanne de Belsier. Her father was Louis de Belsier, who was a baron, and her mother was Charlotte de Guimard. When she was 16, Jeanne became an Ursuline nun in Poitiers, but in 1627 she transferred to Loudun to join the newly established convent there. She was only 22, but she was made Mother Superior of this new group.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Once the issues with Jeanne and her sisters at the convent escalated to the point where it seemed like a demonic possession was happening, the local clergy came to the conclusion that they had to consider exorcism. There was a list of criteria used to determine if someone was possessed, if the subject was speaking in foreign languages, exhibited clairvoyance, displayed an unnatural degree of physical strength, and performed levitation. Then to the clergy it was just an open and shut case.

[Holly Fry]

I read one interesting paper about this case that mentioned that, of course, those are also the same list of qualifiers to determine if you had some sort of divine interaction. And it was really a matter of interpretation as to whether it was a good one or a bad one. The first attempt at an exorcism at Loudun was on October 5th, so it was just two weeks after the strange events began. But there were many exorcisms performed in the following months, and they shifted from private situations that were carried out in the convent to public theatrical events. They were sometimes staged in chapels and even in people's homes, and at other times the nuns were brought onto a scaffold in the town square that had chairs arranged on it. The nuns were tied to the chairs so the assembled spectators could watch as the priests yelled their various prayers and incantations, and the nuns writhed and occasionally exclaimed. Sometimes they spoke in some sort of demon tongue. Canon Jean Mignon and Father Pierre Barr carried out the earliest exorcisms but there were soon something of a rotating cast of priests and other church officials who participated in all of this. It's been described in ways that make it sound almost like an ecclesiastical tourist destination, but it also became an actual tourist attraction. As word spread throughout Europe about what was going on. People traveled from around France and even from other countries to witness these public exorcism rites.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

It was determined that Jean des Anges had seven different demons inhabiting her body. Diagrams were created showing where each of them was most tightly lodged. And Jeanne became the star of the show. She was exercised repeatedly. She and a lot of the other nuns said very plainly that the cause of their possession was Rabin Grandier. During one event, Jean Disange clearly stated that Grandier had used witchcraft to lead the sisters of the order into debaucherous behavior. She and the other nuns even produced a copy of a contract that he was said to have signed in his own blood in a deal with the devil. The original document, of course, was filed in Hell. Good to know Satan has a well organized bureaucracy. The nuns claimed that this contract was what had started their possession.

[Holly Fry]

Things in Ludon became more tense almost instantly as people debated the veracity of these possession claims and whether or not the legal actions against Grandier were valid. But that discussion was very quickly shut down. The Church was able to get a court order that stated that anyone publicly criticizing the nun's claims or the way the Church was handling the sorcery investigation could be put to death.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

This was exhibited in the case of a man named Mark Duncan, a Calvinist doctor and mathematician from Scotland who lived in Samur, about 30 km away from Ludon. Duncan believed that the explanation for the possessions described by the nuns was way more mundane than supernatural. He thought things like fasting and solitude had led the nuns to a point where they could not discern the difference between their imaginations and reality. He had to go into hiding to avoid arrest for his opinion.

[Holly Fry]

Yeah, this of course, also becomes one of those things that is tied very keenly to the ongoing tensions between Protestants and Catholics. And it seemed like he was trash talking Catholics, at least according to the people who thought this court order was worthwhile. Cardinal Richelieu sent a commission to examine the evidence of the Loudun possessions and Grandier's part in them. Meanwhile, Grandier's allies actually tried to intercede on his behalf. But that court order, making it impossible to contradict the nuns of the Church, essentially amounted to a gag order. And it left them unable to advocate with any real impact On August 18, 1634, Urbain Grandier was found guilty of sorcery. He was burned at the stake. But this did not end things in Loudun.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

In some ways, it seems that once the frenzy of the accusations and execution were all done, some of the clergy were left trying to make sense of it all. In 1634, one of the priests who participated in the exorcisms, Father Tranquille, wrote an account of the events that were taking place at Ludon. In his version of events, he was careful to explain the reasoning of the priests who were involved in the exorcism and to justify their actions. He also chastised people who did not believe the nuns.

[Holly Fry]

And despite Grandier no longer being able to bewitch her, Jean des Anges continued to exhibit strange behavior. At one point, she told one of the town leaders who had been instrumental in prosecuting Grandier that she actually feared she had offended God with her testimony. She also attempted suicide at least once and possibly twice. It's a little unclear, but she seemed very much out of sorts mentally, and instead of anyone being concerned that she needed some sort of help in that regard, it was perceived as proof that she was still possessed.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

And then Father Jean Joseph Surin arrived in Loudun. Saurin was considered something of a wunderkind in the Catholic Church at the time. He was born in 1600 and at the age of 8 is said to have promised his life to the church and taken a vow of celibacy. His entire life had been dedicated to his spirituality, and he was the man chosen to help Ludon finally get rid of all the demons still wreaking havoc on the convent.

[Holly Fry]

Soin took an express interest in Jeanne's situation, and he created a plan to get her spiritually healthy again. This included things like prescribing specific prayers and schedules in which to say them and urging her to ignore her bodily desires. All of this was a very different approach to the situation. These were not big public shows. They were more intimate consultations. To be clear, there were still exorcisms being performed. In fact, the exorcisms continued for another three to four years. But even Jean later wrote that these were less violent and more quiet than the exorcisms that had been part of the early Ludin events. A lot of the interactions between Jean and Sehrain actually sounds almost like modern talk therapy, with Jeanne learning to find her own strength, which in turn was said to be weakening her demons. This was all very unconventional for the time, and it often put Soran in the ill favor of higher ups within the Church. They just wanted him to get rid of the demons in Ludin, do it quick and be done with it eventually.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

And with the Church putting pressure on him for results, Soran was apparently able to cast out Jeanne's demons one at a time over the course of those several years that the exorcisms continued. The case made Jean des Anges famous. When the exorcisms pushed out her seven bad demons, according to her later memoir, those spaces had filled with positive holy spirits. She'd also, as this transformation took place, had four names emblazoned on her left arm. Jesus, Maria, Joseph and Francis de Sales. Francis de Sales was an influential bishop who had died in 1622. Jeanne traveled all around France, showing people her scarred limb.

[Holly Fry]

And in 1644, Jeanne des Anges published her account of the possessions. And in it, she also describes her sexual desire for Urban Grandier. Writing quote, when I did not see him, I burned with love for him. And when he presented himself to me, I lacked the faith to combat the impure thoughts and movements that I felt. She blamed this on him bewitching her. But there have been a lot of interpretations that Jeanne's claims of possession may have been a way to actually punish Grandier for not reciprocating her interest.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

While Jeanne des Ange remained Mother Superior at Loudon for the rest of her life, as a result of her involvement in the possession and exorcism, she was often met with skepticism. In addition to her role at the convent, she came to be seen as a local mystic. In the years following the witchcraft trial and the execution of Grandier, she claimed she had direct interaction with a guardian angel who guided her in spiritual matters. This sometimes caused her to run into issues when her guardian angel gave her information that was counter to church figures, but it also put her in a position of power in these interactions. Like, how could her detractors, who claimed to be men of God, argue with an angel?

[Holly Fry]

Meanwhile, Father Sauron's time after Jean's demons were exercised was less positive. As he worked with the Mother Superior. He had prayed for her demons to leave her and inhabit him. And both she and he believed that had happened. His health declined as these alleged spirits took hold of his body. He wrote about having difficulty initially with things like headaches or just finding himself unable to catch his breath. Then his physical problems progressed to a point where he experienced uncontrollable trembling. He started having hallucinations. He described having severe abdominal pain as a final manifestation of this prolonged possession. In a letter to a friend, Saran stated plainly, quote, during my ministry, the devil passed from the body of the possessed person and entered into mine. Whether his illness had a rational medical explanation or not, Father Sorin believed that he carried a demon. His physical and psychological pain progressed to the point where he attempted to die by suicide. Although that effort failed, he is usually characterized as having gone insane in his final years. Both Jean des Anges and Father Soran died in 1665.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Coming up, we'll talk about some of the accounts that finally surfaced that ran counter to the one the church had put forth. But before we do, we will hear from the sponsors that keep stuff you missed in history class going.

[Annabe Sofa Advertiser]

There'S nothing like sinking into luxury. At washablesofas.com, you'll find the Annabe Sofa, which combines ultimate comfort and design at an affordable price. And get this, it's the only sofa that's fully machine washable from top to bottom. Starting at only $699, the stain resistant performance fabric slipcovers and cloud like frame duvet can go straight into your wash. Perfect for anyone with kids, pets or anyone who loves an easy to clean spotless sofa. With a modular design and changeable slipcovers, you can customize your sofa to fit any space and style. Whether you need a single chair, loveseat or a luxuriously large sectional, Annabe has you covered. Visit washablesofas.com to upgrade your home. Right now you can shop up to 60% off store wide with a 30 day money back guarantee. Shop [e-mail] Add a little to your life. Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Sacred Scandal Narrator]

At 19, Elena Sada believed she had found her calling. In the new season of Sacred Scandals, we pull back the curtain on a life built on devotion and deception. A man of God, Martial Maciel, looked Elena in the eye and promised her a life of purpose within the Legion of Christ.

[Alena Sada]

My name is Elena Sada and this is my story. It's a story of how I learned to hide, to cry, to survive, and eventually how I got out.

[Sacred Scandal Narrator]

This season on Sacred Scandals. Well hear the full story from the woman who lived it. Witness the journey from devout follower to determined survivor as Helena exposes the man behind the cloth and the system that protected him. Even the darkest secrets eventually find their way to the light. Listen to Sacred the Many Secrets of Marciel Maciel as part of the My Cultura Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get her.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

Podcasts Malcolm Gladwell here. This season on Revisionist History, we're going back to the spring of 1988, to a town in northwest Alabama where a man committed a crime that would spiral out of control. 35 years. That's how long Elizabeth Senate's family waited for justice to occur. 35 long years. I want to figure out why this case went on for as long as it did, why it took so many bizarre and unsettling turns along the way, and why, despite our best efforts to resolve suffering, we all too often make suffering worse.

[Revisionist History Narrator]

He would say to himself, turn to the right, to the victim's family and apologize. Turn to the left. Tell my family I love him. So he had this little practice. To the right. I'm sorry. To the left. I love you.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

From Revisionist History, this is the Alabama Mercury Murders. Listen to Revisionist History the Alabama murders on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Brown Ambition Host]

Hey sis, what if I could promise you you never had to listen to a condescending finance bro tell you how to manage your money again? Welcome to Brown Ambition. This is the hard part when you pay down those credit cards. If you haven't gotten to the bottom of why you were racking up credit or turning to credit cards, you may just recreate the the same problem A year from now when you do feel like you are bleeding from these high interest rates, I would start shopping for a debt consolidation loan, starting with your local credit union. Shopping around online, looking for some online lenders because they tend to have fewer fees and be more affordable. Listen, I am not here to judge. It is so expensive in these streets. I 100% can see how in just a few months you can have this much credit card debt. And it weighs on you. It's really easy to just like stick your head in the sand.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Nice and dark in the sand.

[Brown Ambition Host]

Even if it's scary, it's not going to go away just because you're avoiding it. And in fact, it may get even worse. For more judgment free money advice, listen to Brown ambition on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Holly Fry]

It wasn't until 1693 that the world got an account of the possessions that was counter to the Catholic narrative that was written by Nicolas Aubin, a Protestant pastor who lived in Loudun at the time of the possession and trial, but who, like others, was essentially gagged by the illegality of questioning the statements and stance of the Catholic Church. In his account, written 60 years after Albin had left Loudun, he states plainly that Urban Grandier was killed not for witchcraft, but as part of a sinister political machination.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Additionally, Aubin indicated in his account that the nuns had been coached to perform during the exorcisms in ways that would incriminate Urban Grandier. Not only did this entire theatricality get rid of a priest who was considered to be a problematic libertine, according to Aubann, it also put the Catholic Church in a position where it had publicly demonstrated its ability to conquer evil and more specifically demons and the devil through exorcisms.

[Holly Fry]

Similarly, an account written by a Monsieur Danielle, which was translated into English as the History of the Devils of Loudin, the Alleged Possession of the Ursuline Nuns and the Trial and execution of Urban Grandier, told by an eyewitness all one title states that the sorcery accusations against Grandier were absurd and they were motivated by things that had nothing to do with demonic possession.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

In this writing, Danial traces the believed origins of magic, but also notes the way that the early Christian Church molded the concept to suit its own needs. The Christian Church, at the outset of its history, forbade the practice of pagan magic, but taught what may be described as magic of its own. Both Origin and Tertullian held that mania and epilepsy were produced by the action of demons or evil spirits, spirits confined within the bodies of the sufferers, and that these were to be exercised by certain forms of words. The Church formally recognized the efficacy of exorcism in 367, when the council of Laodicea ordained that only those should practice it who were duly authorized by the bishops. Connected with magic and magical rites were the supposed curative properties of the relics of saints and the divine origin popularly ascribed to visions and ecstatic trances. It also notes that the idea of magic is easy to assign to so many normal, everyday things, even to words, noting quote, in every word there is a magical influence, and that each word is in itself the breath of the internal and moving spirit. A word of love, of comfort, of promise, is able to strengthen the timid, the weak or the physically ill. But words of hatred, censure and enmity or menace lower our confidence and self reliance.

[Holly Fry]

In sociological readings of this entire situation, the outsider Grandier is in a way a sacrifice on the part of the community. In Purging Ludin of Grandier, the frightened people of the town were also able to cope with and set aside their fears of demons, but also the fears that they had been living with during that wave of the plague and the anxiety that was tied to ongoing tensions between religious factions. A number of papers have examined this as an example of an often repeated cycle throughout history to restore order to a community when it is on edge. To the people of loudun in the 1630s, he was a villain. But when viewed through the modern sociological lens, Grandier was really the victim.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

In 1592, Aldous Huxley wrote a nonfiction deep dive into the Loudon possessions. Titled the Devils of Loudon. It has garnered critical acclaim and is considered by many people to be one of his masterpieces.

[Holly Fry]

In the modern era, many, many psychological studies of the Loudun possessions have been written. One of the most famous was written by French Jesuit priest and scholar Michel de Certeau in 1970. His work points to mental disorders as the catalyst for mass possessions, but that the context text also really mattered because these events often happened as large social and political events and transitions were taking place, particularly in instances where societies governed by theological entities were moving toward a more political or rational governing ideology. Possession, according to De Certo, enabled women, who would generally not have a voice in such times, to verbalize through a possessing entity, thoughts about what was happening around them.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Everyone from psychology students to well established psychiatrist has had an opinion about exactly what happened at ludon in the 1630s. A lot of these examinations of the facts as we know them land at the idea that this was a case of mass hysteria. Some analyses come to the conclusion that in the cases of Jean des Ange and Father Serin, there may have been a personal hysteria or mental illness as well. But perhaps the most interesting thing about the Loudon possession case is that it is not unique at all.

[Holly Fry]

In a 2002 paper published by the American Historical Review titled the Devil in the Convent, historian Moshe Slukhovsky lays out a compelling argument about the nature of such events, noting, quote, the mass possession in Loudon was only one among numerous similar group possessions in religious female congregations, and that most cases had nothing to do with witchcraft and with witchcraft accusations. Sluhovsky states that out of more than 45 such cases in Europe that have been documented, there were only five that catalyzed witchcraft accusations and that the lopsided coverage of these more sensational cases has actually done a disservice to historical research.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Slochovski traces the instances in the historical record of mass possessions in convents, the first of which appeared in the 14th century, and looks at their differences and their commonalities. All of the famous cases are clustered together in the early 17th century. He notes that feminist criticism has really changed the way these events have been perceived and that the gendered language of hysteria has often been used to dismiss behaviors of women that men have historically not really understood. He makes the case that these instances of mass possession are a form of, quote, female monastic spirituality. This was an expression of spirituality that was acutely painful but did not have anything to do with demons. Slahowski admits that there is an inherent lack of information in this writing. Quote, it is impossible to generalize about the social profile file of possessed nuns. Our information is incomplete. He admits that any speculation or assessment of this is tentative. His argument is that the behaviors that a lot of historians and contemporaries to these possessions have labeled as sexual or demonic are actually way more complex expressions of the very many tensions at play in fairly isolated communities. These were groups of women who were grappling with their relationships with the outside world, their efforts to fulfill their promises to live a life within the order, a state of alertness to avoid temptations, concerns about finances for themselves and their immediate community, and the larger issues and conflicts that were facing the towns, villages, countries and religious denominations that they were also a part of.

[Holly Fry]

I really, really like his look at the whole thing because it does acknowledge one obviously how complicated it is, but two that we don't. We can all talk about it as much as we want, but we will never have all of the information because there was probably some obfuscation of what really went on. So that is the Ludon possessions. It's been on my list for a hundred years. I have a bit of listener mail about sleep. This is written by our listener Kieran.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Who writes hello ladies.

[Holly Fry]

I just wanted to send a note because Holly's discussion on a recent behind the scenes about her lifelong sleep troubles made me feel so seen and also comforted. I've likewise struggled with terrible insomnia for as long as I can remember, as does the rest of my family, and agree that while I try to practice quote good sleep hygiene, it is far from solving the issue. Unlike Holly though, I get very cranky being so tired and restless during the night, so I loved her being so chill about it. It an approach I'm aspiring to. One thing that has weirdly helped was reading Charles Dickens A Christmas Carol and it mentioning Scrooge getting up in the night leading me down a whole rabbit hole learning about the historical trend of having first sleep and second sleep. According to some sources, in eras before artificial lighting was common, it was a practice to sleep from about 9 or 10 to midnight and then get up and perhaps do some light reading, writing, prayer, or even chores for an hour or two, then go back to bed to sleep until dawn. I love this being an accepted thing and is certainly preferable to frustratedly tossing and turning all night. There are and have been so many diverse human sleep patterns across cultures and time. And like Holly described, it's important to acknowledge that everyone has different rhythms. What works for one person may not work for another. Here's to some nice midnight reading going forward, hopefully. As always, thank you so much both of you for all you are and do. You are light in the dark and I always squeal and get so excited when a new episode uploads. Also, Holly, I too was so excited about the sewing patterns. Two parter. Thanks again Kieran. Apologies no pet tax as I do not currently have a fur baby, but I do have another scrap quilt in the works. All the best. This scrap quilt looks absolutely gorgeous. It is in shades of ivory and like deep autumnal tones and it's absolutely beautiful work. Amazing, amazing work. Thank you so much for writing this. Listen. It always helps to feel seen. As for the two sleeps thing, that's always fascinating me as well. I'm pretty sure I've talked about polyphasic sleeping on the show before, which I would love to try, but doesn't seem to really work in reality for anybody that has an inconsistent schedule. But I'm glad when people figure out a thing that works for them. I too sometimes like to just get up in the night. Usually I'm not that productive. I just kind of goof around on my phone. If you would like to write to us about your sleep troubles, your demonic possessions, your concerns about sociologically analyzing historical events, whatever you got going on. You can do that@history podcastheartradio.com you can also subscribe to the show if you haven't yet. You can do that on the iHeartRadio app or anywhere you listen to your favorite shows.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Stuff youf Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

[Alena Sada]

Sacred Scandal is Back, the hit true crime podcast that uncovers hidden truths and shattered faith. Faith for 19 years, Alena Sada was a nun for the Legion of Christ. This season, she's telling her story.

When I first joined the Legion of Christ, I felt chosen. I was 19 years old when Marcia Almasel, the leader of the Legionaries, looked me in the eye and told me I had a calling.

Surviving meant hiding. Escaping took courage, risking everything to tell her truth. Listen to Sacred Scandal, the Many Secrets of Martial Maciel on the the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

Malcolm Gladwell here this season on Revisionist History. We're going back to the spring of 1988 to a town in northwest Alabama where a man committed a crime that would spiral out of control.

[Holly Fry]

And he said, I've been in prison 24, 25 years.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

That's probably not long enough. I didn't kill him.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

From Revisionist History, this is the Alabama Murders. Listen to Revisionist the Alabama murders on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Evan Ratliff]

When news broke earlier this year that baby kj, a newborn in Philadelphia, had successfully received the world's first personalized gene editing treatment, it represented a milestone for both researchers and patients. But there's a gripping tale of discovery behind this accomplishment and its creators. I'm Evan Ratliff, and together with biographer Walter Isaacson, we're delving into the story of Nobel Prize winner Jennifer Doudna, the woman who's helped change the trajectory of humanity. Listen to on crispr, the Story of Jennifer Doudna with Walter isaacson on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Holly Fry]

What's up everybody? It's snacks from the trapped nerds. All October long, we're bringing you the horror Boogity Booty boogity.

[Sacred Scandal Narrator]

We kicking off this month with some.

[Holly Fry]

Of my best horror games to keep you terrified. Then we'll be talking about our favorite horror, horror and Halloween movies and figuring out why black people always die first. And it's the return of Tony's horror show side Quest, written and narrated by yours truly. We'll also be doing a full episode reading with commentary, and we'll cap it off with a horror movie Battle Royale. Open your free iHeartRadio app and search Trap Nerds podcast and listen.

[Tracy V. Wilson]

Now this is an iHeart podcast.