Selects: How Black Friday Works

Summary

Podcast Summary: Stuff You Should Know – “Selects: How Black Friday Works”

Hosts: Josh Clark & Charles W. “Chuck” Bryant
Date: November 29, 2025
Podcast Network: iHeartPodcasts

---

Overview

In this classic episode, Josh and Chuck dive deep into the origins, culture, and controversies of Black Friday: the day after Thanksgiving that became synonymous with chaotic shopping, massive sales, and occasional mayhem. With their trademark blend of humor, skepticism, and curiosity, they unravel the myths, realities, and unintended consequences of America’s most infamous shopping day.

---

Episode Breakdown

1. Black Friday: Love It or Loathe It?

[03:10]–[05:30]

• Chuck admits he’s never attended a Black Friday sale and “would rather go to the DMV than go to a Door Buster.”
  • Memorable Quote:
    • “It is literally, and I'm not overstating this because people always say literally when they mean figurative. Figuratively. But is literally one of the last things I would ever, ever do in my life.” – Chuck Bryant [04:23]
• Both hosts express empathy for those who genuinely enjoy the day—provided “you don’t turn into a monster like others do.”
• They touch on how divisive the day is: some people plan for weeks and relish in the intensity, while others wouldn’t dream of participating.

---

2. What Exactly IS Black Friday?

[05:30]–[07:36]

• Black Friday is the day after Thanksgiving, recognized as the busiest shopping day in the U.S.
• It traditionally marks the official start of the holiday shopping season, dating back to department store parades like Macy’s, designed to associate Thanksgiving with Christmas shopping.

---

3. The Origins of “Black Friday”

[07:36]–[10:03]

• Josh traces the term’s etymology:

  • Philadelphia Police Origin:
    • In the 1960s, Philly cops began using “Black Friday” to describe the chaos and crowding downtown when people flocked to shop and attend the Army-Navy game.
  • Retailer Rebranding:
    • Retailers tried to spin a new meaning: “going into the black” (i.e., turning a profit), aiming to make the day sound positive and attractive.
  • Chuck debunks the “in the black” myth, clarifying that stores often did not start profiting only on this day.

• Economic Impact:

  • Stores can make 20–40% of their annual profits during the holiday shopping season.
  • Statistic: In 2013, predicted holiday spending was $602 billion in just two months.
    • Quote: “Americans are going to spend $602 billion in November and December.” – Josh Clark [10:37]

---

4. Manufactured Tradition and Retail Manipulation

[12:03]–[13:30]

• Black Friday’s prominence is largely fabricated through marketing.
• Until 2004, the Saturday before Christmas was usually the busiest shopping day; retailers collectively decided to hype up Black Friday instead, turning myth into reality.
  • “It was literally created. And then the myth kind of became reality.” – Chuck Bryant [12:09]

---

5. The Spread of “Shopping Holidays”: Cyber Monday, Small Business Saturday

[16:51]–[18:03]

• Cyber Monday (2005): Created to lure online shoppers back after Thanksgiving.
• Small Business Saturday (2010): Launched by American Express to encourage spending at local shops.
• Retailers began extending sales past Friday—sometimes even encroaching on Thanksgiving itself.

---

6. Thanksgiving Encroachment & Retail Backlash

[18:03]–[20:49]

• In 2012, Walmart opened at 8 pm on Thanksgiving, kicking off a wave of retailers starting Black Friday earlier.
• In 2013, some stores (Kmart, Macy’s, JCPenney, Sears, Toys R Us) opened on Thanksgiving Day itself.
  • “Essentially, what’s happening is Thanksgiving evening is being ruined by retail.” – Chuck Bryant [19:20]
• Employees sometimes forced to work holidays, sparking criticism and even strikes.

---

7. International Perspectives & Unintended Consequences

[20:18]–[22:51]

• Other countries (Canada, UK, Netherlands) spend more overall in their longer holiday shopping seasons, which aren’t artificially bookended by a Black Friday kickoff.
  • “Without Black Friday in America, the retailers would possibly make more money.” – Josh Clark [20:49]
• Internet shopping (especially on Thanksgiving itself) increasingly erodes the uniqueness of Black Friday.
• The day has become as much a “sport” or tradition as a shopping necessity.

---

8. Doorbusters, Bait-and-Switch, and Risk

[24:44]–[26:29]

• “Doorbusters” date back to 1917, offering deeply discounted items—but in extremely limited quantities.
• The term is literal: “Doors actually being busted.”
• Chuck: “It’s a bait and switch. They’ve only got a very limited amount of these select items, which is why the violence happens.” [25:26]
• Most shoppers lure in for one deal end up buying regular-price items once the sale ones are gone.

---

9. The Dark Side: Crowd Crushes, Violence, and Viral Tragedy

[29:27]–[39:02]

• The 2008 Walmart Trampling (Valley Stream, Long Island):
  • A crowd of 2,000 surged through the doors, trampling employee Jdimytai Damour, who died of asphyxiation.
  • Local police abandoned the crowd, Walmart provided insufficient security, and a lack of crowd control led to chaos.
  • “When the doors finally opened after the festive countdown... the doors started to open and were literally busted by this wave of humanity.” – Josh Clark [32:56]
• Other incidents:
  • Toys R Us Shooting (Palm Desert, 2008): Shoppers’ husbands got into an altercation, leading to a deadly shootout.
  • Walmart Pepper Spray Incident (Los Angeles, 2011): A woman purportedly defending her children used pepper spray on a crowd; chaos ensued, but she still completed her shopping.
    • “She pepper sprays a bunch of people, affects 20 people, causes a bit of a trampling pandemonium. And then… went to the store and checked out, bought her stuff.” – Josh Clark [37:58]

---

10. The Employee Perspective & Labor Backlash

[38:34]–[39:45]

• Many employees are pressured to work on holidays with no real choice, especially seasonal workers.
• Strikes have rarely succeeded due to fear of job loss and the use of non-full-time labor.
  • “They kind of do have to work. There's a lot of ugliness on Black Friday.” – Josh Clark [40:02]

---

11. Psychology and Social Science of Black Friday

[40:05]–[41:12]

• Individuals who plan the most exhibit the highest levels of antisocial behavior (shoving, pushing).
  • “They feel like they've really put the time in and they're not about to lose that doorbuster.” – Josh Clark [40:21]
• The discussion references deadly crowd surges elsewhere (like The Who concert) to highlight the overlooked dangers of unmanaged crowds.

---

12. Buy Nothing Day and Anti-Consumer Movements

[41:33]–[44:07]

• First advocated in the 1990s by artist Ted Dave, Buy Nothing Day encourages people to refrain from shopping on Black Friday—a protest against rampant consumerism.
• Marked by stunts (zombie costumes, “sheep” costumes, credit card cut-up stations) aimed at drawing attention to the absurdity of consumer culture.

---

13. Other Shopping Holidays: China’s Singles Day

[44:11]–[45:47]

• Singles Day (November 11) in China eclipses even Cyber Monday—with $5.7 billion spent in 2013 on Alibaba alone.
  • “It’s the biggest online shopping day in the world... $160 million in the first six minutes.” – Chuck Bryant [45:17]
• Many Black Friday shoppers aren’t buying gifts but shopping for themselves—up to 41–47%.

---

14. Final Thoughts and Thanksgiving Wishes

[46:01]–[46:49]

• The hosts don’t judge anyone who enjoys Black Friday sales, but encourage safe, humane behavior.
  • “Just act like a human being. Don’t take anyone’s life. Don’t trample over somebody who’s fallen down. And most importantly, have a very nice Thanksgiving.” – Josh Clark [46:01]
• They urge listeners to cherish time with loved ones and offer the classic SYSK permission to debunk “tryptophan makes you sleepy” at the table.

---

Notable Quotes & Moments

• “I'm not, like, casting dispergence on people who... disparaging remarks. Is dispergence a word?” – Chuck Bryant [05:06]
• “Black Friday is pretty much a uniquely American experience.” – Josh Clark [05:30]
• “The holiday shopping season is when stores make up between 20 and 40% of their retail profits.” – Chuck Bryant [10:14]
• “Cyber Monday... another self-fulfilling myth... now it is because the retailers said it was and the media reported it.” – Josh Clark [17:03]
• “Thanksgiving evening is being ruined by retail.” – Chuck Bryant [19:20]
• “Without Black Friday in America, the retailers would possibly make more money.” – Josh Clark [20:49]
• “It’s a bait and switch.” – Chuck Bryant [25:27]
• “When the doors finally opened, they actually gave way and were literally busted by this wave of humanity.” – Josh Clark [32:56]
• “They and a Toys R Us [were shot] because their wives got in a fistfight.” – Josh Clark [36:59]
• “If you go to a Black Friday sale and you see a bunch of people dressed as zombies, they’re making fun of you.” – Josh Clark [43:04]
• “Be with your family, turn off your smartphone, maybe even... just be in the moment.” – Chuck Bryant [46:31]

---

Key Takeaways

• Black Friday is a deliberately manufactured retail event, rooted in both genuine tradition and aggressive marketing.
• The day’s history involves myth-making, economic manipulation, and at times tragic consequences from poor crowd management.
• Modern variations (Cyber Monday, Small Business Saturday) and international equivalents show the globalization of consumer “holidays.”
• Anti-consumer responses like Buy Nothing Day seek to challenge the inevitability and necessity of shopping as a civic ritual.
• Despite—or perhaps due to—its notoriety, Black Friday is already in a state of flux, challenged by online shopping, shifting traditions, and increasing criticism.

---

For those considering Black Friday shopping:
Enjoy the deals if it’s your thing, but remember to be safe, be kind, and maybe take a cue from the episode: don’t forget to simply enjoy Thanksgiving and the people around you.

Transcript

[Narrator/Announcer]

This is an I Heart podcast.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Guaranteed human living with an autoimmune condition isn't easy and every journey is different. That's why Season five of Untold Life with the severe autoimmune condition from Ruby Studio and Argenics shares powerful firsthand stories from people with conditions like MG and cidp. Hosted by Martine Hackett, these conversations dive into what resilience really looks like through setbacks, breakthroughs and finding strength in community. Listen on the iHeartradio appreciate Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Experience the beloved Harry Potter stories like you've never heard them before on Audible Harry Potter the full cast audio editions presents the iconic series as a truly spellbinding listening event for the whole family with a spectacular A list cast including Hugh Laurie as albus Dumbledore, Matthew McFadden as Voldemort, and many more. The first story in the series, Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone is available now, with new audiobooks in the series releasing every month thereafter. It's Harry Potter like you've never heard it before. Listen on audible. Go to audible.com HP1 and start listening today.

[Josh Clark]

It's time for Black Friday Dell Technologies biggest sale of the year. Enjoy the lowest prices of the year on select PCs like the Dell 16 plus, featuring Intel Core Ultra processors and with built in advanced features. It's the PC that helps you do more faster plus earn Dell rewards and enjoy many other benefits like free shipping, price, match guarantee and expert support. They also have huge deals on accessories that pair perfectly with your Dell PC and make perfect gifts for everyone on your list. Shop [e-mail] deals hey everyone, it's been quite a few years since we dusted off our classic episode on the insanity that is Black Friday, so we thought we'd put it out there for you again. I'm glad we made this episode when we did because Black Friday's nearly gone away since then then, so we kind of inadvertently came up with a document on a fading cultural phenomenon and I assume historians of the future will rely heavily on this. In the meantime, I hope you enjoy this episode. Welcome to Stuff you should know from howstuffworks.com. Hey and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark and with me, as always, is Charles W. Chuck Bryant. Jerry's over there and that makes this stuff.

[Chuck Bryant]

You should know that you just checked to make sure Jerry was there.

[Josh Clark]

She's very quiet.

[Chuck Bryant]

You literally turned your head and body right? Yep, she's there.

[Josh Clark]

I did the Bigfoot thing though. Like I had to turn my whole. The whole side of my body to look over my shoulder. That's how you know that was real footage.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, typically when, you know, Jerry's here because you can just smell, like, miso soup or something emanating from our right side.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Or my right side.

[Josh Clark]

Your right side. But it's not emanating from you, it's coming from Jerry.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

She stinks like miso, which is actually a very pleasant smell. Salty and umami.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's right.

[Josh Clark]

So, Chuck.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yes.

[Josh Clark]

Have you ever been to a Black Friday sale?

[Chuck Bryant]

No.

[Josh Clark]

No.

[Chuck Bryant]

And I want to say h. No.

[Josh Clark]

Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, that's not.

[Chuck Bryant]

For me.

[Josh Clark]

That's a decent qualifier, though, because it's not like an average sale. And, like, if you don't go to a Black Friday sale, there's a pretty good reason why is because you're scared.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, yeah. And I think this is one of those. A very divisive topic. You're probably either really into going or it's the last thing on earth you would rather do. I don't know. A lot of people are like, maybe I'll go check out a door Buster at 3am Sure.

[Josh Clark]

I think there are people who do have that kind of. That idea, but maybe not at 3am sure. There's. It's almost like a multifaceted creature. Like it is for some people, like, just in the middle of a normal shopping day on the Friday after Thanksgiving, they'll go to a store and it's fine, and there's some sales or whatever. But then, you know, hours earlier, these hardcore people, you know, who had bathed in the blood of their fellow shoppers.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, sadly, yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, we'll see. Had already come through and gotten all the best deals. Yeah, but. And then there's those of us, like us, who are just, like, going out.

[Chuck Bryant]

It is literally, and I'm not overstating this because people always say literally when they mean figurative. Figuratively. But is literally one of the last things I would ever, ever do in my life.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

I can't think of many. I'd rather go to the DMV than go to a Door Buster.

[Josh Clark]

The dmv?

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

In between North Korea and South Korea.

[Chuck Bryant]

No, no, no, no. That's the dmz.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. I always get those two confused.

[Chuck Bryant]

No, I'd rather go take the last ticket from the DMV and have to wait all day, then go to a doorbuster sale.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. No, I don't blame you.

[Chuck Bryant]

So that's. We'll get to more hate spewing. About this later, but.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And I should state my opinion. I feel like if this is your thing, that's awesome.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, true, true. I'm not, like, cast dispergence on people who disparaging remarks. Is dispergence a word?

[Josh Clark]

Nope. It is now, though. You're like your own, like, American dictionary, the new Chuck dictionary.

[Chuck Bryant]

We should make that up. I like it.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

We could add like five or six words already.

[Josh Clark]

Chuckisms.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah, agreed.

[Chuck Bryant]

I'm not saying, like, pooh poohing people who do it. If you're into it, great. As long as you conduct yourself in a reasonable manner and you don't turn into a monster like others do.

[Josh Clark]

Right. But there is, like, there are obvious criticisms of the day too, which we'll get into. But I think first, Chuck, we should explain what the. As you would say, h. We're talking about to the people who listen to this podcast and don't live in the United States. Because Black Friday is pretty much a uniquely American experience.

[Chuck Bryant]

It is. I think most people probably know. But just very quickly, it is the day after Thanksgiving now in the United States is known as Black Friday. And we'll get into the pretty interesting history of it. But it's the biggest shopping day of the year, and there are all these crazy specials that they run. And we'll get into that as well. But quite simply, it is the busiest shopping day of the year. Day after Thanksgiving.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And its origins? Well, the origin of the term Black Friday goes back kind of a ways, apparently to the mid 20th century. But the idea of going shopping, starting your Christmas shopping on the day after Thanksgiving actually goes back to the late 19th century, early 20th century, thanks to department stores like the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And as a part of those parades, Santa Claus.

[Chuck Bryant]

It's a Macy's parade.

[Josh Clark]

Right, Exactly.

[Chuck Bryant]

You know.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. It's still a good parade, though.

[Chuck Bryant]

Have you ever been?

[Josh Clark]

No, I haven't.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, I've never been to the parade, but a couple of times Emily and I have gone to the day before when they blow up the.

[Josh Clark]

Oh, yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Which is really neat.

[Josh Clark]

Very cool. You mean? I have a friend who's actually holding one of the floats. Oh, really? The balloons.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh, cool.

[Josh Clark]

This year. Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, it's fun to do. Although we did it, like eight or nine years ago and it was really neat and sort of crowded. And then we did it a couple of years ago and it is nuts now.

[Josh Clark]

Is it?

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, it's kind of gone overboard.

[Josh Clark]

Gotcha.

[Chuck Bryant]

The word got out.

[Josh Clark]

I think I saw. Yeah, I Saw something last year in the news.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

It's not a place to go if you don't like strollers, let's just say that.

[Josh Clark]

Oh yeah.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Oh yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Strollers with all terrain tires. Yeah. So but the idea of going, starting your Christmas shopping the day after Thanksgiving came from those parades. And they came from those parades because all of those parades pretty much to a parade featured Santa Claus.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. And usually at the end, kind of like bringing up the rear. And that means we're kicking it off.

[Josh Clark]

That's the official start of the holiday season. That's right. Santa Claus has made his first public appearance. So from the association of those two came going holiday shopping the day after Thanksgiving. That was in the late 19th century, in the 50s, they think, or early 60s. Well, the 50s calling the day after Thanksgiving Black Friday came about, but it didn't necessarily have anything to do with shopping by then. It was from factory owners who apparently coined the term.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. And there's also the other competing theory that it was the day that stores would go into the black meaning start to show profit.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

But that's not quite right, is it?

[Josh Clark]

No.

[Chuck Bryant]

So that's a fallacy.

[Josh Clark]

That's actually a. Well, it's a made up fallacy to gloss over the original meaning of Black Friday. And it came out of Philadelphia in the 60s. And the cops and the bus drivers and the city workers who worked downtown came up with calling that day Black Friday because apparently tons of out of towners would leave their homes on Thanksgiving, converge on Philadelphia to watch the Army Navy game on the Saturday after Thanksgiving. But they had a day to kill. So they all started doing their Christmas shopping because there were sales in downtown Philly every year and. And the place would be nuts. And this was where Black Friday came from. Apparently the police department wanted to basically keep people away. So they'd be like, well, you don't want to go to downtown Philly. It's Black Friday. And that was the original reason or origin of the term.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, I see you saw in here article from the AP in 1975, a sales manager at Gimbels was quoted as saying, that's why bus drivers and cab drivers call today Black Friday. They think in terms of the headaches that it gives them. So I learned something new when I read this.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

And then I had no idea it.

[Josh Clark]

Spread out of Philly. And then years later, the retail lobbies and retailers themselves said we gotta come up with a better origin story for this because we want this to be a day that people want to get out of their house and go shopping.

[Chuck Bryant]

You know, but we should point out, even though it is not the day that companies go into the black, as it were, which by the way, comes from when they did accounting by hand. You would write in red ink or black ink, depending on if you were ahead with money or behind.

[Josh Clark]

Red ink meant you were in the hole.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Black meant everything's good.

[Chuck Bryant]

Exactly. Even though it does not mean that the holiday shopping season is when stores make up between 20 and 40% of their retail profits.

[Josh Clark]

That's a lot.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. I mean, even Emily's small business, like the. I don't know about majority, but a large percentage of her yearly sales are, you know, that couple of months.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. You know, and it's not just her. Apparently in 2013, the National Retail Federation is predicting that Americans just in November and December. Chuck, are you ready for this?

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Americans are going to spend $602 billion in November and December.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's cray.

[Josh Clark]

That's a lot of cash.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

In two months.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. I don't spend like I used to on Christmas. Emily and I sometimes will spend on gifts on each other or do that like, couple thing where you like go in and just do something nice for your house. And then like the adults on my side of the family, we don't exchange gifts anymore.

[Josh Clark]

Just dirty looks.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. No, like my brother, my sister will chip in usually and get my mom something kind of nice or give her, offer her a service. Like last year we replaced her fireplace with like a gas fireplace or build her a garden fence or tile her kitchen, like something like that.

[Josh Clark]

Wow. Your mom's got it.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

She's on easy street is what you call that.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. But Emily's family, they all still exchange gifts, so I still have my Christmas gift swapping. Joan. Satisfied?

[Josh Clark]

Nice.

[Chuck Bryant]

You know?

[Josh Clark]

Yes. You get your Christmas present on.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Okay, Chuck. So the idea of shopping after Thanksgiving and then Black Friday, that day being called Black Friday, it's been around for a while and it's a really valuable day.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

You know, it kicks off that two month period where $602 billion is going to be spent on stuff.

[Chuck Bryant]

But it was created like Valentine's Day. It was literally created. And then the myth kind of became reality.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Just because they said everyone's gonna shop today, it's the busiest day. And it became that.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. It wasn't until 2004.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Usually the Saturday before Christmas was actually the busiest shopping day of the year, thanks to me. But the retail Federation and all the retailers were like, well, we can't just we can't tout that as the busiest shopping day of the year. We want to like get people spending over the course of a couple months, not the Saturday before Christmas. So they basically said Black Friday's the day. And like you said, it just kind of became true just from people saying it over time.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

I'm surprised that they haven't come up.

[Chuck Bryant]

With a catchy name for like Procrastinator's Day or something to like pump up that last Saturday again or something.

[Josh Clark]

Right. Or to keep you from it. So they call it like Shame of the Nation Day, something like that to make you like go do Black Friday. That's Black Friday Saturday. Yeah. So. And there's this website called blackfridayarchive.com it's actually like kind of cool if you like nostalgic ads or whatever. Nostalgia going back to 2007 I should say. But it's just like scans of Black Friday print ads from those years, which are kind of neat. If you're totally bored out of your mind, go check out Black Friday archive.com. Did you know Tide has been upgraded to provide an even better clean in cold water? Tide is specifically designed to fight any stain you throw at it, even in cold butter. Yep. Chocolate ice cream. Sure thing. Barbecue sauce. Tide's got you covered. You don't need to use warm water. Additionally, Tide pods let you confidently fight tough stains with new coldzyme technology. Just remember, if it's gotta be clean, it's gotta be tied.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Support for the show today comes from public.com you're thoughtful about where your money goes. You've got core holdings, some recurring crypto buys, maybe even a few strategic options plays on the side. The point is, you're engaged with your investments and Public gets that.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, that's why they built an investing platform for those who take it seriously. On public, you can put together a multi asset portfolio for the long haul. Stocks, bonds, options, crypto. It's all there. Plus an industry leading 3.6% APY high yield cash account.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Switch to the platform built for those who take investing seriously. Go to public.comsysk and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.comsysk paid for by Public Investing.

[Narrator/Announcer]

All investing involves risk of loss, including loss of principal. Brokerage services for U.S. listed registered securities options and bonds in a self directed account are offered by Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC. Crypto trading provided by ZeroHash Complete disclosures [e-mail] Disclosures.

[Guest/Interviewer (e.g., Cal Penn or Ed Helms)]

Hey, audiobook lovers. This week on the podcast I'm sitting down with musician, producer and walking encyclopedia Questlove. We're talking about Mark Ronson's memoir, Night how to be a DJ in 90s New York City. All right, like we talked about before, Mark Ronson found sanctuary in the DJ booth. What's a tool or piece of equipment in the studio or on stage that gives you the most control?

[Chuck Bryant]

So I have two microphones on stage. We have the microphone that you hear as the audience. Then we have a second microphone in which we communicate with each other. I feel like that second microphone kind of saved all of our friendships. No band likes each other after 20 years or 25 years. The Beatles broke up in seven and a half years and we're going on 35.

[Guest/Interviewer (e.g., Cal Penn or Ed Helms)]

Listen to earsay the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Josh Clark]

So Black Friday became a smashing success, like 2004, 2005. It's a relatively recent thing that it became what it is today here in the States, which is an out of control, juggernaut shopping and consumeristic frenzy. Right. But so it was so successful overnight that the retailer said, well, let's figure out ways to extend this whole week.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

So they came up with Cyber Monday in 2005.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yep. That's pretty recent. And it is the online shopping version of Black Friday, the Monday after Thanksgiving.

[Josh Clark]

And that was another thing. They just made up another self fulfilling myth that they said the workers go back to their computer after Thanksgiving on Monday and they do all their online shopping. Well, that wasn't really true, but now it is because the retailer said it was and the media reported it.

[Chuck Bryant]

And not to be outdone, in 2010, American Express invented Small Business Saturday, which is when you go out and support small businesses with your money, especially ones.

[Josh Clark]

That take American Express.

[Chuck Bryant]

Exactly. So there's, it's interesting, literally creating days to tell people, basically if you're not shopping today, you're missing out on really good deals.

[Josh Clark]

Right? Exactly. And the more days the better as far as retailers are concerned. But there's only so many days after Thanksgiving. So they started to think recently, like, well, what if we pushed in the other direction rather from Friday on. What's behind Friday? Oh, yeah, Thanksgiving. We can't touch that.

[Chuck Bryant]

For shame.

[Josh Clark]

Well, starting in 2012, they started touching it. Walmart actually opened at 8pm on Thanksgiving in 2012, and there was a general strike called that we'll talk about later because of that, because these stores are not supposed to be open on Thanksgiving. Thanksgiving is its own day. It's a day of being with family and celebrating. And up until 2012, it was sacrosanct.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. This year, Macy's and JCPenney for the first time are opening on Thanksgiving. And Sears and Toys R Us as well on Thanksgiving evening. And Kmart is opening at 6am on Thanksgiving, basically extending Black Friday through the weekend.

[Josh Clark]

41 hours.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's not a day.

[Josh Clark]

That's how long Kmart's gonna be open. Black Friday at Kmart lasts 41 hours.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

That's pretty crazy.

[Chuck Bryant]

And at shopping malls, you're gonna have some smaller stores doing the same thing. An estimated 20 to 25% will be open at 8pm on Thanksgiving Day, and two thirds will open at midnight. So essentially, what's happening is Thanksgiving evening is being ruined by retail.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

You know.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. I think the retailers would say, well, you know, we've seen that people. Right. We've seen that people start lining up Thanksgiving afternoon, Thanksgiving evening to wait for us to open like that, you know, the next morning. So why don't we just open? So, I mean, I think it's kind of. It goes both ways, but I pretty much see where you're coming from.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Well, this year it's a little trickier too, because Thanksgiving comes on November 28th, which is the latest has been in 11 years.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Is that right?

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

2002.

[Josh Clark]

Yep.

[Chuck Bryant]

So weirdly, because they still sort of have to enforce Black Friday, they're actually shortening their own shopping season a little bit this year.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Which is probably why some of them are opening on Thanksgiving.

[Josh Clark]

That's exactly why. It's six days shorter than usual this year. So just by the very existence. By making up Black Friday, they've screwed.

[Chuck Bryant]

Themselves this year a little bit.

[Josh Clark]

They have.

[Chuck Bryant]

By a week.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Because there's in other countries like Canada, the UK The Netherlands, countries that observe the Christmas holidays like we do in America, meaning everybody gives everybody else presents and things like that, and they spend money. But those countries don't have a Black Friday, a day that officially kicks off the holiday shopping season.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

Those countries spend more over the course of the holiday season because they have a longer period of time to shop.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

So without Black Friday in America, the retailers would possibly make more money. So they've definitely painted themselves into a corner by making Black Friday such a thing. And this year, it's really kind of pointing out like we may be shooting ourselves in the foot here, so what can we do? Well, their solution has been, well, we'll just take over Thanksgiving too. But that's not necessarily sustainable. And there's a lot of people who are saying Black Friday is going to go the way of the dinosaur.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. I read an interesting article in the New Yorker this morning, a finance article. I think it was New Yorker. It might have been New York Times, but this financial analyst was basically analyzing how the sales go and sort of saying that it's really not financially the smartest approach to take for the shoppers or the retailers, for the retailers to offer these huge, deep discounts and sort of blow it out in one day. A better, smarter financial approach would be to elongate the shopping season and not even discount things, maybe even raise prices. And his contention is that they're shooting themselves in the foot, Right?

[Josh Clark]

I think he's right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, he probably is.

[Josh Clark]

But at the same time, if you're one of those people like, like me, frankly, who went to the mall the day after Halloween.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And saw that the lights were up, the garland was out, Santa's workshop was ready to go after Halloween, November 1st.

[Chuck Bryant]

Wow.

[Josh Clark]

The place was totally decked out for Christmas with Christmas carols piping through.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, see, that's, that's ridiculous.

[Josh Clark]

But, see, without. But that was the great thing about Black Friday. It's like you, you know, you had a month of just kind of chilling out everything, getting ready between Halloween and, and Thanksgiving. Then you had Thanksgiving and then the holiday season started without Black Friday. It's kind of like this, this dam that's holding back the holiday season from spilling into basically October. But with retailers figuring out that it's an impedance to them making money, it probably won't start the official season any longer. It'll probably be further back from now on.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, well, I think we're in. I don't know about. Well, technically, slightly in the minority. In 2013, 53% of the population of American adults said they will shop on Black Friday. So.

[Josh Clark]

53%.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. That puts us in the minority by a bit. And in 2011, 152Americans shopped.

[Josh Clark]

152 million.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh, yeah, just 150.

[Josh Clark]

But they spent $500 billion.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. 152 really rich Americans, 152 million shopped on that day for an average of three hours at a time, which is not too long, but that's.

[Josh Clark]

I mean, three hours is like, it's.

[Chuck Bryant]

Longer than I would shop ever.

[Josh Clark]

But I saw a woman who did 16, though, like a 16 hour stretch of shopping.

[Chuck Bryant]

She better have gotten it all done.

[Josh Clark]

At least I Hope so.

[Chuck Bryant]

You know.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Like if she shopped for 16 hours and only got like three gifts.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

It's not time well spent.

[Josh Clark]

There's also evidence that the Internet is basically knocking on Black Friday's door. Thanksgiving Day is the fastest growing online shopping day.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And I think like 70% of the people who said that they're going to shop on Black Friday said they'll do some or most of it online.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

So the Internet's still there for retailers to make money. But the idea of Black Friday in store sales going extinct is probably not going to happen because it's its own thing. Like there's this one consumer psychologist or consumer analyst I think pointed out that it's, it's a tradition, number one.

[Chuck Bryant]

Now it is.

[Josh Clark]

And number two, there's a certain element of like sport to it. It's, it's more than just getting a good deal. It's like, you know, throwing a fist at somebody while you get a good deal or something to it that, that transcends the whole thing.

[Chuck Bryant]

So we mentioned doorbusters. It's a central part of the cog that is Black Friday. And it goes back in print, believe it or not, to the year 1917 and anecdotally to 1895, wherein a retailer will basically say, you know what, we have one item, or usually it's a few now, but some really deep, deep and really super great deals on just a few select items.

[Josh Clark]

So like for example, a good laptop for $180.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yes.

[Josh Clark]

And like deals like that, ipods for half off or a TV for like 200. Like really, really, like you said, very good discounts.

[Chuck Bryant]

But here's the deal. It's a scam, people.

[Josh Clark]

It's a bait and switch.

[Chuck Bryant]

It's a bait and switch. They've only got a very limited amount of these select items, which is why the violence happens, which we'll get to in a minute. And then after that, they're hoping you get in there, you don't get that laptop, but you're like, screw it, I'm at Walmart at 5am I might as well buy some stuff. Regular priced or slightly discounted items. And you know, that's how they get you in the store, that's how they get you.

[Josh Clark]

It is. And it's true that these items do exist and they are for that deal. They're there for that price, I should say say. But there's only like 10 and in the fine print it's like one per person and that deals is for in stock only. Like you can't get a rain check or anything like that. But the concept that these deals do exist for those items that are in the store coupled with whoever physically gets their hands on that item first gets that deal. Yeah. Leads to doors actually being busted.

[Chuck Bryant]

It's called recipe for disaster.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

All right, so before we get to the dark days and the bad stuff that can happen, truly, let's do a little message break.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. Stuff you should know.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Support for the show Today comes from public.com. you're thoughtful about where your money goes. You've got core holdings, some recurring crypto buys, maybe even a few strategic options plays on the side. The point is you're engaged with your investments and Public gets that.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. That's why they built an investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can put together a multi asset portfolio for the long haul. Stocks, bonds, options, crypto, it's all there. Plus an industry leading 3.6% APY high yield cash account.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Switch to the platform built for those who take investing seriously. Go to public.comsysk and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.comsysk paid for by Public Investing.

[Narrator/Announcer]

All investing involves risk of loss, including loss of principal. Brokerage services for U.S. listed registered securities options and bonds in a self directed account are offered by Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC. Crypto trading provided by ZeroHash Complete disclosures [e-mail] Disclosures.

[Guest/Interviewer (e.g., Cal Penn or Ed Helms)]

Hey, audiobook lovers. This week on the podcast I'm sitting down with musician, producer and walking encyclopedia Questlove. We're talking about Mark Ronson's memoir Night how to be a DJ in 90s New York City. All right, like we talked about before, Mark Ronson found sanctuary in the DJ booth. What's a tool or piece of equipment in the studio or on stage that gives you the most control?

[Chuck Bryant]

So I have two microphones on stage. We have the microphone that you hear as the audience. Then we have a second microphone in which we communicate with each other. I feel like that second microphone kind of saved all of our friendships. No band likes each other after 20 years or 25 years. The Beatles broke up in seven and a half years and we're going on 35.

[Guest/Interviewer (e.g., Cal Penn or Ed Helms)]

Listen to HearSay, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Narrator/Announcer]

This message is brought to you by Apple Card. Apple Card members can earn unlimited daily cash back on everyday purchases wherever they shop. This means you could be Earning daily cash on just about anything, like a slice of pizza from your local pizza place or a latte from the corner coffee shop. Apply for Apple card in the Wallet app to see your credit limit offer in minutes. Subject to credit approval. Apple card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City branch terms and [e-mail] stuff you should know.

[Chuck Bryant]

All right, let's go back a little bit to 2008 and probably the. Well, I was going to say the darkest incident, but I think the Toys R Us may be darker.

[Josh Clark]

I think this one's darker because of people were involved.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, yeah, that's true. All right, 2008 in Valley Stream, Long Island. It was at a Walmart and it was 5pm on Thanksgiving. So basically people there the day before, it wasn't one of those days where it was open on Thanksgiving. So they're there to wait till 5am so at least 12 hours ahead of time. There were about a thousand people already set up there. Some people are camping out in tents. They're waiting, they got their coffee. They're probably slugging some Jim Beam to warm the belly. And so the police came out and said, you know what, let's set up a buffer zone, a barricade, which worked till about 2am when that was breached. And the cops basically said, we're out of here. This isn't part of our job.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. The crowd had turned angry a little bit after that. One of the store employees had some family members come and they took them out of the line and took them in the store.

[Chuck Bryant]

Not a good idea.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. But even if everyone in the crowd would have been cool with it, think everybody in the crowd realized that they were family members of an employee?

[Chuck Bryant]

Sure.

[Josh Clark]

So the crowd actually turned like ugly.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, they broke through the barricade and were squeezed against. You know how the stores have the entrance and then that little glassed in vestibule area before, and then usually a second entrance to get into the store itself.

[Josh Clark]

So there was about, by this time, There was about 2,000 people waiting for the store to open. It was 4am the store's gonna open at 5 and a couple hundred were in between this little buffer zone and those front exterior doors and being pressed up, literally crushed to death. And there's this fascinating article in the New Yorker by a guy named John Seabrook called Crushpoint. And it's about not just this incident, but just crushings in general where a crowd crush somebody.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, we covered that like years ago.

[Josh Clark]

It seems like it.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, totally.

[Josh Clark]

But anyway, you should check out that article.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. People literally yelling, push the doors in. Chanting this. And just before 5 o', clock, it's a pretty bad scene. And workers in that vestibule area realized that there was a pregnant lady named Leanna Lockley being crushed against the doors. And so they were like, we got to get this lady in here. Opened the doors enough to squeeze her through. She got in, and then the crowd surged forward and it just kind of went downhill from there. And they still did the 10, 9, 8 countdown.

[Josh Clark]

Isn't that mind boggling?

[Chuck Bryant]

It's mind boggling that they didn't. Well, first of all, that the cops left.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. They said apparently in a court deposition that the cops, when they left, said, controlling this crowd's not in our job description. Good luck. Walmart had hired a security force of two for the event. One person hadn't shown up, the other one was inside the store. Not helping. So they got a bunch of their stock guys, their biggest dudes that they could find. Ye come stand this vestibule and help anybody who, like, falls down or.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's when I would have been like, dude, that's not in my job description exactly.

[Josh Clark]

Well, they didn't say that. And when the doors finally opened after the festive countdown, while these people were being crushed against the front, unbelievable. The doors started to open, and right when they opened, they actually gave way and were literally busted by this wave of humanity.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

And at that point, the employees, their little red rover line was completely ineffective.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

People are getting knocked down. Some of the workers are getting blown out of the way, Some are jumping on vending machines. It's ridiculous.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. A couple of them, like, climbed up the Coke machine.

[Chuck Bryant]

Get out of the way for safe harbor.

[Josh Clark]

One guy who was in the way of the crowd when the doors gave way. This article by John Seabrook puts it that he was blown back. So again, there's a vestibule, there's the outer doors, there's the vestibule, and then there's inner doors, and then there's the store. This guy got blown from the outer doors all the way through the vestibule, through the inner doors into the store by this wave of people.

[Chuck Bryant]

2,000 people.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Just coming in all at once, all trying to get their hands on that door. Buster.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Like an ipod or something.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

So that's not the end of the story. Sadly. People are getting crushed. This pregnant woman trips over. Some old woman. She's on the ground at this point.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Pregnant.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Leanna Lockley in danger of being, you know, trampled to Death. And then she somehow managed to get to her knees and saw an employee. Do you know how to pronounce his first name?

[Josh Clark]

Jim Tay Demore.

[Chuck Bryant]

Jim Tay Demore. He was assigned to help people in case anyone fell. Fell down next to her. The doors fell on top of him. And 2,000 people trampled over those doors and killed him.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, he was trampled to death. He died of asphyxiation being crushed under the door. And he was a Stock Guy at.

[Chuck Bryant]

6:00Am, 6:03am he was pronounced dead one hour after the festive countdown to let people get in to shop.

[Josh Clark]

And that was at the hospital an hour later. So he most likely died on the scene.

[Chuck Bryant]

Pretty awful.

[Josh Clark]

What's crazy, Chuck, if that story is not bad enough, tramplings are actually really common. Yeah. And like, somebody might not die, you might not be asphyxiated, and he might not have died had he not gotten caught under the door. But the people getting knocked down. If you want to see this, just go onto YouTube and type in Black Friday. Not even Black Friday tramplings. Just type in Black Friday and you will see tons of compilations of store security footage of people coming in right when the store opens on a Black Friday sale, just climbing over one another, knocking each other down. Some people help out other people up or drag them out of the way or whatever, but just as frequently, people just climb over the ones who are down for a sale. It's insane. I seriously encourage everybody to go check out some video of it.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. I can't believe that after this incident that there wasn't a law passed outlawing outright Black Friday sales.

[Josh Clark]

That is not happening.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, but it's ridiculous because economists and analysts have proven that you can have, like, even. It's not like they'd lose money. They would probably make more money if they didn't have these blockbuster sales. So it's not like they could say, well, you're keeping me from doing my business. I don't know. I just can't believe they can't outlaw something like this.

[Josh Clark]

So that was a pretty horrendous example of a crowd crush and a trampling. But other things do happen. You mentioned the Toys R Us in Palm Desert, California, a couple years back, right?

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, that was in 2008. These two women got in a fist fight, and then their husbands got into it. And basically, first of all, these two men were carrying guns into a Toys R Us for the Christmas shop, which is a little weird. And they started a shootout with each other, basically. And not a very skilled one, apparently. I read about it. Like, one guy forgot to cock his gun. The other guy, his didn't work either. So they start chasing each other through the store. Through the store, shooting at each other.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Luckily no one else died.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

But those two gentlemen shot each other and died.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

They and a Toys R Us, because of their wives, got in a fistfight.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. On Black Friday at a Toys R Us during Christmas shopping.

[Chuck Bryant]

I'm surprised no one else. If they're running through the store shooting.

[Josh Clark]

I think everybody cleared out of their way. Yeah, I know. I wouldn't follow them around and be like, hey, guys, what are you doing? Where's the door busters?

[Chuck Bryant]

In 2011, a woman at a Los Angeles Walmart pepper sprayed some people in the video games. Initially, the cops thought, well, this lady was some Black Friday jerk, which would.

[Josh Clark]

Make her a pretty awful person.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. But apparently the real story is, and she actually got out of it, was that her children were attacked, punched, kicked, thrown to the ground by shoppers trying to get an Xbox from these children. And so she defended her kids by pepper spraying these jerks.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And this thing still hasn't been settled. The most recent thing I saw was that a year on. So last year, the cops still hadn't filed charges, so I guess they believed her story.

[Chuck Bryant]

But she shopped anyway after that happened. Yeah. And bought her items.

[Josh Clark]

So she pepper sprays a bunch of people, affects 20 people, causes a bit of a trampling pandemonium. And then two horrible things happen after that one, like you said, the lady took her kids and her items and went to the store and checked out, bought her stuff. Second, the people outside the immediate circle where she pepper sprayed, but still in that little area, stuck around, still tried to get their hands on the sale item.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, they're like checking out and their eyes and nose are watering. They're just like, just. Just ring it up, Let me get home.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. And then, of course, Chuck, there's the workers as well.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, yeah, I mean, no one wants to work on Thanksgiving. And this year, like we said, a lot of retailers are opening on Thanksgiving, and there's really not anything they can do about it if they want to keep their job.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Which is really sad. And Walmart employees planned a strike, I think, last year in 2012, and it didn't work. Only 26 of the 4,200 stores reported striking employees. So for fear of losing their jobs, probably they had to come to work anyway.

[Josh Clark]

Well, Kmart in particular was criticized this year for opening at 6am on Thanksgiving. And Kmart Said these people don't have to work. Like, we're not forcing them to work. And their critics are saying, well, actually that's not necessarily true because you're using part time seasonal employees and there's no federal mandate that those people have to have holidays or time off. So therefore they're in a position where they either work or you can fire them legally. So they kind of do have to work. There's a lot of ugliness on Black Friday. But. But Chuck, if you are just the average normal person, like my brother in law loves to go Black Friday shopping and he'll like go at midnight and go to the doorbuster sales. But he's like, he's not crazy.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, the majority of them don't end in violence because this happens all over the country. And these are isolated incidents. So it's not like at every doorbuster sale you're gonna get trampled. But there is a risk.

[Josh Clark]

There is. And the people you want to look out for, apparently there is a study of consumer behavior at Black Friday sales, and it was a legitimate study.

[Chuck Bryant]

Sure.

[Josh Clark]

It said that you want to look out for the people who have done a lot of planning because they exhibit the most antisocial behavior, like shoving, pushing, yelling.

[Chuck Bryant]

Like they've got their plan in place.

[Josh Clark]

Exactly.

[Chuck Bryant]

And nothing's going to alter that.

[Josh Clark]

And they feel like they've really put the time in and they're not about to lose that doorbuster.

[Chuck Bryant]

Some jerk who's never done it before.

[Josh Clark]

And just showed up, who just lucked into. Into line or whatever.

[Chuck Bryant]

You know, Remember the famous who concert in the 70s where the people were trampled?

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, that's in that New Yorker article too.

[Chuck Bryant]

They got rid of general admission seating after that. Like, why can't they do something about this? You know, I think the law stepped in and said, wait a minute, you can't just open the doors to a concert venue and say, first one in gets front row.

[Josh Clark]

They still have general admission.

[Chuck Bryant]

Not for big arena shows.

[Josh Clark]

Oh, yeah, no.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Well, you know that there was like just one door open and like four others locked.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And people were getting crushed up against the locked doors. And the people inside who are working at that concert, like, just never opened the doors even though people were dying.

[Chuck Bryant]

So I can't remember what we covered that in. Man, it's so, like, vivid in my mind from way early on because we studied the. The science of crowd surges.

[Josh Clark]

I don't know what it was either, because this article's not that old.

[Chuck Bryant]

It's Just like, no, it definitely wasn't about this. It had to do with something else. But yeah, dirty, bad stuff. Or you can take another approach.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, this is a different approach. You could say.

[Chuck Bryant]

In the 1990s, an artist named Ted Dave gave birth to what's now called Buy Nothing Day, wherein people are encouraged to not buy anything for 24 hours and to fight the power consumerism by not showing up at all.

[Josh Clark]

And not just fight the power. The guy who created Ted Dave, he's a Vancouver guy who came up with it in the 90s. It was also not just to stick it to the man, which I can only imagine if nobody bought anything in America on Black Friday, what kind of crippling effect that would have on the economy. But he was also saying personally, that's a good day to not buy anything and be. Take stock of how much you do, maybe waste or spend or whatever. Just think about your consumer, your consumerism for one day.

[Chuck Bryant]

Dirty hippie.

[Josh Clark]

And during that time, like don't buy anything and don't gas up your car the night before. Don't get a bunch of milk the night before. Like just. Yeah, just be normal. And on one day of the year, don't buy anything. And that's Buy Nothing day. And it's kind of become this big thing ever since Ad Busters, the people who gave us Occupy Wall street, kind of found out about it and adopted it and just took the whole thing worldwide.

[Chuck Bryant]

It's pretty amazing.

[Josh Clark]

It is. So if you go to a Black Friday sale and you see a bunch of people dressed as zombies, they're making fun of you. They're making fun of zombie consumers. Same with the people who are dressed as sheep.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And then there's Zenta Claus.

[Chuck Bryant]

Maybe I'll do that. Maybe I'll dress up as a sheep.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. And just walk around and ba. In people's faces. Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

And then if I'm there, I might, you know, pick up a laptop.

[Josh Clark]

Right. There's also credit card cut up stations.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, yeah. Where you can get rid of your credit card and shoe consumerism.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. And then there's the. My favorite, the. What is it? The whirligig conga line.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh, I haven't heard of that. Is that to disrupt shoppers?

[Josh Clark]

The whole point is to just kind of serve as a mirror, I think, to people.

[Chuck Bryant]

Like, look at yourselves. You're ridiculous. You think I look stupid. You're the one that looks stupid.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

We're not even buying anything. But yeah, so there's. It's kind of a twofold thing. It's one like, just kind of reflecting personally, sticking it to the man as an individual consumer, like, realizing your power in the grand scheme of things. It all kind of hinges on you spending your money. And if you don't, then you're taking the power back or pointing out to other people just how ridiculous they're being as consumers.

[Chuck Bryant]

People probably be like, where'd you get that cheap costume?

[Josh Clark]

Right, Exactly.

[Chuck Bryant]

What was that on? So I've got one last thing I noticed the other day. I'd never heard of this before in China. You think we like to shop. Chinese love to shop. And they have something that they have created called Singles Day.

[Josh Clark]

Okay.

[Chuck Bryant]

And it is on November 11, so 11. 11. The four ones stand for single people. And they're basically like, hey. Because in China, I think you're encouraged to marry. So this is like, hey, be single. Go out and treat yourself to something online and buy something. Because it's Singles Day and you should celebrate being single, really. And it's a huge deal. They spent well. This e commerce platform in China called Alibaba is the one who really got behind it recently. And they spent $5.7 billion on singles day this year, which dwarfs Cyber Monday by three times, almost.

[Josh Clark]

Wow.

[Chuck Bryant]

And it's the biggest online shopping day in the world. And in the first six minutes this year, just a couple of weeks ago, they spent $160 million in the first six minutes.

[Josh Clark]

Wow.

[Chuck Bryant]

Online in China.

[Josh Clark]

Jeez.

[Chuck Bryant]

Just to celebrate being single. And they're encouraged to shop for themselves, which I don't think we pointed out. A lot of people on Black Friday when. When asked, say that they do some of the shopping for themselves. It's not all gifts. It's like, I want that laptop.

[Josh Clark]

I think 40, 47% or 41% of people who said they're going to shop on Black Friday said they'll do most of the shopping for themselves.

[Chuck Bryant]

I usually do that whenever I go out, like, genuinely Christmas shopping, I'll pick up something for myself.

[Josh Clark]

Well, these people are saying they're mostly shopping for themselves.

[Chuck Bryant]

No, I don't mostly. But I'll just. I'll just treat myself to a little something. A little something modest.

[Josh Clark]

And I want to say, Chuck, we're not. We don't begrudge anybody going to Black Friday sales, if that's your thing. Yeah, Enjoy it. That's fine.

[Chuck Bryant]

Just act like a human being.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Don't take anyone's life.

[Chuck Bryant]

No.

[Josh Clark]

Don't trample over somebody who's fallen down. And most importantly, have a Very nice Thanksgiving. Enjoy the people you're with, whether they're friends, family, old acquaintances, new acquaintances. Take some time to really enjoy this Thanksgiving Day and relax and just be.

[Chuck Bryant]

I agree my friend. It's Thanksgiving. Be with your family, turn off your smartphone, maybe even.

[Josh Clark]

Wow.

[Chuck Bryant]

Really get crazy and just be in the moment.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

How about that?

[Josh Clark]

And we give you permission to shout down anybody who says that tryptophan is what makes you sleepy. That's right, you go ahead and set them straight.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yep. So happy, happy Turkey Day, Americans and other parts of the world. Whatever you're doing, I hope you're well.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, nice Chuck. And Chuck, we should say that as usual, if everyone wants to send us Happy Thanksgiving wishes, you can send us an email directly to stuffpodcastheartradio.com.

[Chuck Bryant]

Stuff youf Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts My Heart Radio, visit.

[Josh Clark]

The iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever.

[Chuck Bryant]

You listen to your favorite shows.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Support for the show today comes from public.com you're thoughtful about where your money goes. You've got core holdings, some recurring crypto buys, maybe even a few strategic options plays on the side. The point is, you're engaged with your investments and Public gets that.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, that's why they built an investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can put together a multi asset portfolio for the long haul. Stocks, bonds, options, crypto, it's all there plus an industry leading 3.6% APY high yield cash account.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Switch to the platform built for those who take investing seriously. Go to public.comsysk and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.comsysk paid for by Public Investing.

[Narrator/Announcer]

All investing involves risk of loss including loss of principal brokerage services for U.S. listed registered securities options and bonds in a self directed account are offered by Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Crypto trading provided by ZeroHash complete disclosures available at public.com disclosures.

[Guest/Interviewer (e.g., Cal Penn or Ed Helms)]

Hey audiobook lovers, I'm Cal Penn.

[Josh Clark]

I'm Ed Helms.

[Guest/Interviewer (e.g., Cal Penn or Ed Helms)]

Ed and I are inviting you to join the best sounding book club you've ever heard with our new podcast Hearsay. The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club.

[Chuck Bryant]

Each week we sit down with your favorite iHeart podcast hosts and some very.

[Josh Clark]

Special guests to discuss the latest and.

[Chuck Bryant]

Greatest audiobooks from Audible.

[Guest/Interviewer (e.g., Cal Penn or Ed Helms)]

Listen to earsay on America's number one podcast network, iHeart Followersay and start listening on the free iHeartRadio app today.

[Josh Clark]

What a matchup we got, y'.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

All.

[Josh Clark]

This is that classic HBCU vibe? Non stop action? The band is rockin? And the fish crowd lit chance echo drum beat? Everybody showing that school pride? Game like this? Yeah, it calls for an ice cold Coca Cola.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Ah.

[Josh Clark]

Crisp and refreshing. That's a game changer right there. Yeah, that taste always hits the right note. Just like the band at halftime. And just like that, we're back at it. Passionate fans, school colors every? And in ice cold Coca Cola? That's a winning combo? No matter the sport, no matter the yard? Everybody knows fan work is thirsty work? So grab a Coca Cola and keep that HBCU pride going?

[Narrator/Announcer]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Chuck Bryant]

Guaranteed Human.