Selects: How Peanut Butter Works

Summary

Stuff You Should Know – “Selects: How Peanut Butter Works”

iHeartPodcasts | Released August 1, 2026
Hosts: Josh & Chuck
Episode Purpose:
This episode takes a deep dive into the history, science, culture, and quirky details behind peanut butter, one of America’s most beloved spreads. Josh and Chuck share personal stories and fun facts about peanut butter, examine its origins, surprising global perceptions, production, legal definitions, and health considerations—sprinkling the conversation with jokes, nostalgia, and offbeat tangents.

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Episode Overview

• The show explores the journey of peanut butter from humble legume to all-American icon, debunking myths, diving into peanut botany, industry evolution, and even government regulations around “what counts” as peanut butter.
• Josh and Chuck’s friendly banter highlights their personal connections to peanut butter, turning the episode into a nostalgic yet informative odyssey.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Peanut Butter Preferences and Personal Stories

[03:15–08:25]

• Josh: Strictly a smooth peanut butter guy (unless civilization collapses). Prefers Jif Natural and has tried just about every style, occasionally indulging by putting honey or Cool Whip on a spoonful.
  • “Almost only smooth. I will eat chunky if civilization has collapsed and that’s all I can find.” (Josh, 03:21)
• Chuck: Likes both crunchy and smooth; shares his childhood preference for giant tubs of generic peanut butter and odd combos like peanut butter and mayonnaise or marshmallow fluff (a “fluffernutter”).
  • “Peanut butter and mayonnaise sandwich is one of the best things in the world.” (Chuck, 04:47)

2. Peanut Butter's All-American Image

[09:33–11:06]

• Peanut butter is considered uniquely American, even if similar pastes existed in the ancient Americas (Inca, Aztec) and the modern product has Canadian origins.
  • “Outside of the United States, in a lot of different countries, [peanut butter] is looked upon as very weird and gross in much the same way that we Americans tend to think of, like, Vegemite.” (Josh, 09:33)
• Most American foods have European roots, but peanut butter is a true U.S. invention in its modern form.

3. The Peanut: From South America to America’s Snack

[11:06–19:14]

• Peanuts (really a legume, not a nut) originated in South America at least 7,600 years ago and spread globally thanks to the Spanish, Portuguese, and the transatlantic slave trade.
  • “Goober… comes from a Congolese word…’nguba’.” (Josh, 15:32)
• The peanut was reintroduced to North America from Africa—a remarkable, circuitous journey.
• Peanuts were long considered food for the poor or livestock—much like lobster’s infamous past as “prison food.”
• Peanuts gained popularity thanks to Civil War soldiers and traveling circuses (origin of “peanut gallery”).

4. Key Innovators and the Rise of Peanut Butter

[19:14–32:48]

• George Washington Carver: Didn’t invent peanut butter, but popularized peanuts as a solution to southern soil depletion and pushed over 300 uses for them.
• Ben Hicks: Invented a gas-powered peanut cleaner, modernizing production, and boosting demand.
• Marcellus Gilmore Edson (Canadian): Patented peanut paste in 1884, which was stabilized with sugar; essentially the first modern peanut butter. (25:52)
• Dr. John Harvey Kellogg: Created “health food” versions, serving unsweetened peanut paste at his sanitarium, but for a wealthy clientele.
  • “He was very big on chewing food until it was the consistency of peanut butter, basically.” (Chuck, 27:46)

Debut and Industrial Expansion

• Peanut butter likely first gained national exposure at either the 1893 Chicago or 1904 St. Louis World Fair (the exact origin is fuzzy).
• Industrialization (hydrogenation) enabled mass-market brands—Peter Pan, Skippy, Jif—to thrive.

5. Big Brands and the Science of Creaminess

[32:48–41:00]

• Hydrogenation: The process that made peanut butter shelf-stable and creamy, but less healthy (turning "good fats" into saturated fats).
  • “Hydrogenation… was the turning point for peanut butter.” (Josh, 32:48)
• “Natural” peanut butters require stirring due to oil separation and have shorter shelf lives.
• Brand histories entwined:
  • Peter Pan pioneered mass-market ("hydrogenated") PB in 1928.
  • Joseph Rosefield’s patented process led to Skippy and then, via new patents, to Jif.
• Jif currently leads market share, with 15+ varieties (peanut, almond, etc.).
• Culture note: Increasingly, alternatives (sunflower/chickpea butter) are used in peanut-free schools.
• Personal quirks: The hosts share humorous strategies for eating peanut M&Ms and ballpark peanuts.

6. Legal Definitions and Peanut Butter Standards

[48:37–53:49]

• The FDA’s 1970s hearings determined that to be labeled “peanut butter,” a product must contain at least 90% peanuts. This followed a 12-year debate with industry lobbyists.
  • “FDA… said, ‘90% peanuts in peanut butter. And since 1971, that's been the standard.’” (Chuck, 49:16)
• Detailed federal standards specify smooth/medium/crunchy definitions and even color standards (using samples from Agtron Inc., judged in specific light conditions!).
  • “You have to look at it at a light with a color temperature of about 7,500 kelvin... That’s the government’s standard for judging the color of peanut butter.” (Josh, 52:25)

7. Production & Consumption Stats

[53:49–55:05]

• About half of all U.S. edible peanuts go into peanut butter.
• It takes around 540 peanuts to make a 12-ounce jar.
  • “The National Peanut Board estimates… about 540 peanuts to make up one of those 12 ounce jars.” (Chuck, 54:24)

8. Peanut Butter Health and Safety

[55:05–59:16]

• Food Safety Recalls:
  • 2009: Major salmonella outbreak from a Georgia plant led to illnesses and deaths.
  • 2007: Salmonella in Peter Pan and generic brands, hundreds sick but no deaths.
• Aflatoxins:
  • Mold (aspergillus) on peanuts can produce aflatoxins—potentially dangerous in lifetime exposure, though processing removes ~89%.
  • “But what about the other 11%? And they’re like, ‘Have some Peter Pan and forget your troubles.’” (Josh, 57:10)
• Nutrition:
  • Natural peanut butter: good source of vitamins (E, B3), minerals, antioxidants, and “good” fats—but is calorie-dense.
  • Industrial (hydrogenated) PB: Less healthy due to saturated fats, sugar, additives.
  • “If you’re eating that artisan peanut butter… the non-hydrogenated… the oils… are actually good for you.” (Josh, 58:01)

9. The Peanut Allergy Question

[59:16–61:03]

• Rise in reported peanut allergies: From 0.4% (1997) to 1.4% (2008)—though self-reports are rising faster than doctor-diagnosed rates.
  • Possible trend of increased allergy “perception.”
• Early immunotherapy (feeding small children trace peanuts) may prevent allergies, mimicking Israeli feeding guidelines: “around four to six months of age, just shove a bunch of peanuts in their mouth and see what happens.” (Chuck, 61:00)

10. Oddities and Fun Facts

[61:06–62:30]

• Arachibutyrophobia: The fear of peanut butter sticking to the roof of your mouth.
  • “Which shouldn’t be a fear, because all you got to do is just keep working the tongue and that peanut butter is going to dislodge and go right down your throat.” (Chuck, 61:39)
• Indulgence tips: Josh’s calorific peanut butter + Cool Whip combination.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Peanut butter is supposed to be, like, this dumb, messy thing where you just regress in age.” (Josh, 06:53)
• “Peanut butter, just us. As far as modern times go.” (Chuck, 11:02)
• “Have you ever heard somebody outside of TV call them [peanuts] ‘goobers’?” (Josh, 11:40)
• “I eat [sunflower seed shells]—still do to this day… Sometimes I think I’m bleeding.” (Josh, 42:20)
• “Only monsters put their peanut butter in the refrigerator.” (Chuck, 34:21)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Peanut Butter Preferences: 03:15–08:25
• U.S. vs. Global Perception: 09:33–11:06
• Botanical / Origin of Peanuts: 12:34–15:56
• History of Peanut Butter Creation: 25:15–32:48
• Rise of Industrial Brands (Jif, Skippy, Peter Pan): 32:48–41:00
• FDA Legal Definitions: 48:37–53:49
• Production Stats and Factory Incidents: 53:49–55:37
• Health and Nutrition: 55:05–59:16
• Peanut Allergy and Immunotherapy: 59:16–61:03
• Fun Oddities (Arachibutyrophobia): 61:06–62:30

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Final Thoughts & Tone

This episode blends deep research and goofy food nostalgia. The hosts’ chemistry and comic timing (debates over “chunky” vs. “crunchy,” quirks about eating peanut M&Ms) are as much a highlight as the actual peanut butter info. Listeners come away with not just a solid understanding of the history and science of peanut butter, but a sense of why it’s so woven into American life—and into the hosts’ own hearts (and, yes, waistlines).

For peanut butter fans (and trivia buffs), this one’s a must-listen.

Transcript

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via virtual prepaid guard card. Typically takes 15 days after rebate submission price guarantee on Talk, text and 5G data exclusions like taxes and fees apply. Hi everybody, it's Chuck. And in Covid time, it's May 14, 2020 and on this Saturday select, we're going to bring you an episode called How How Peanut Butter Works. And boy oh boy, I remember loving this one. I think I was eating a lot of peanut butter at the time during COVID because we had a good store of it already and I love peanut butter. And I think we talk a lot about how much we both like peanut butter in this episode. It's bound to make you hungry. And the good news is now you can just go right to your store and pick it up and smile. A real smile at people that's not hidden behind a mask. So let's celebrate that, go out and get some peanut butter and smile.

[B]

Welcome to Stuff youf Should Know, a production of iHeartradio. Hey and welcome to peanut butter Jelly time. I'm Josh. There's Chuck. We haven't seen Jerry in a while. If you have seen Jerry, please tell her to call home. And this is stuff you should know.

[A]

Yeah, Jerry, she sent out a smoke signal that said send miso.

[B]

She did? She did. And we sent some on donkey back in that general direction.

[A]

Are you peanut butter or jelly in this scenario?

[B]

I want to be peanut butter. You always make me be jelly.

[A]

Well, I think we should level set here at the beginning and talk about if you like peanut butter, which is your favorite, and then what you like. How do you utilize it?

[B]

Okay. My name is Josh C. And I love peanut butter.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Almost only smooth. I will eat chunky if civilization has collapsed and that's all I can find.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I eat it any way, shape or form. Sometimes just peanut butter on a spoon. Sometimes peanut butter on a spoon with a little divot made with my tongue, filled with local honey. If you want to get tubby really fast, let me introduce you to the wonder. That is a spoonful of peanut butter scooped in some Cool Whip. Okay. But really, any kind of peanut butter anytime, I will eat it. And I've noticed that once I reach my 40s, peanut butter sticks around me a lot more than it used to. So I'm having a real struggle with it. Thank you for listening.

[A]

And do you want to buzz market your favorite brand?

[B]

We use this Jif Natural that's like. It's like in a brown container. And I like it so much. I've never. I purposely never looked at the label because I don't want to know how natural it is. But my all time favorite is Reese's peanut Butter. Like the, like, have you had it?

[A]

You mean in the jar? Yes, yes.

[B]

Oh, it's so good.

[A]

I think I've had it once, but

[B]

I was raised on Jif. Now go.

[A]

Well, I was raised on whatever the gigantic gallon tub is that you could get in 80s. Yeah, I don't remember. I don't think it was any of those name brands now. I mean, I love peanut butter. It's one of my favorite things in the world. And I will go crunchy or smooth, no matter. I love them both. I also like it with honey. I like it and I don't do this much, obviously, because it's just. I'm not 19 years old, but a peanut butter and mayonnaise sandwich is one of the best things in the world.

[B]

You know, I've never had that. Is it good? Really?

[A]

Dude, do you have any kewpie?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Do peanut butter and kewpie Sammy.

[B]

Okay, so half and half or more peanut butter than mayo or what?

[A]

It's kind of your jam. I definitely don't go light on the mayo because you gotta have that tang.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Peanut butter and marshmallow fluff I used to eat when I was a kid.

[B]

Yeah, that's good stuff.

[A]

Fluffernutter. And now I don't eat the sugary, hydrogenated types. I either have one of the. The sort of artisan natural kinds you have to mix up, or just the DeKalb Farmer's Market grinds the peanuts right in front of your face into a tub and hands it to you right

[B]

in front of your face, and it says, beat it. You can't have any of this.

[A]

So that's just peanuts, obviously.

[B]

Yeah. And maybe a little bit of salt. Do they add any salt or is it really just peanuts?

[A]

It's just peanuts.

[B]

Wow. I wonder if they salt the peanuts when they roast them then. Because I've always seen, like, peanuts with just a little bit of salt. Like, you can't have peanut butter any other way. But maybe. Maybe they figured out they've cracked the code.

[A]

Well, I mean, they may be salted and roasted. I have no idea about the peanut, but it's good. It's all good. But I have to mix. You know, I got to put a little bit of honey in there, maybe a little bit of agave to give it a little bit of a sweet.

[B]

Oh, that's a good idea. Yeah. I was going to ask you. I've not had any artisan stuff, and I did a little research and found a couple I want to try. And I didn't know, like, is it. Is it just straight up adult kind of stuff where you're like, oh, that's really good, but you're wishing that you had, like, the nasty Big three brand instead?

[A]

Well, I mean, if you don't add any sweetener, it's. It's not nearly as good as, you know, but I think the naturals are all kind of the same as far as sweetness level.

[B]

Yeah. The best I could discern is that if you're paying for artisan craft peanut butter, and buddy, you're paying, you are. Like, supposedly they have, you know, depending on the kind of peanuts that are chosen, the variety of peanuts, the way that it's roasted, almost like a coffee or a wine or something like that, there's like a sophisticated palate or terroir that you really have to pay attention to. That, to me, is kind of like the opposite of what peanut butter is supposed to be. It's supposed to be, like, this dumb, messy thing where, you know, your hair's totally normal and you start eating the peanut butter and you suddenly have, like, a cowlick and you're wearing a striped shirt that shows your gut kind of thing. You know, like, you just reg progress in age. But I also get wanting to enjoy peanut butter in a healthy way because it is, surprisingly, from. From what I saw, it is healthier than you would suspect if done right.

[A]

Yes. Not. Not a big glob of Peter Pan with kewpie mayonnaise and potato chips smashed in between white bread.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Yeah, I'm hungry now.

[B]

I am, too. I already had some peanut butter this morning, so I'm good to go. But this is like the yawning episode where I kept yawning, doing research. I just wanted peanut butter the whole time.

[A]

Well, peanut butter for me has now become my. In my. Since January, you know, I'm trying to lose some weight, so that's become my sweet treat at the end of the night instead of going and getting ice cream.

[B]

Oh, good for you.

[A]

Just like a spoonful of peanut butter and honey, and that'll satiate that desire.

[B]

I haven't seen you in a while. How's it going?

[A]

That's good. I mean, I'm down 20 since January, but what really leveled off the past month?

[B]

Congratulations, dude. That is really impressive.

[A]

Just 40 more to go, man.

[B]

No, that's really great, man. Just, Just. Yeah, yeah, it does plateau, but it picks up again. Don't worry.

[A]

Well, it plateaus because of quarantine alcoholism.

[B]

Oh, well, I was going to ask because I'm finding that quarantining has made things like we have food and everything, but we're eating it less for some reason rather than the opposite, which both you, me and I were really concerned was going to be the way it went. Are you finding it easier to keep up with food or harder?

[A]

Easier because I'm cooking a lot. Geez, I'm buzz marketing again. But I'm just having one of those Mike's mighty goods for lunch, which is very low in calories.

[B]

Yeah, it's really good, too.

[A]

And, you know, I'm just tracking the calories, and it's alcohol that's the problem right now.

[B]

I gotcha. Yeah, I've been doing one or two nights a week, tops, and then a couple of nights I've been pretty good, now that I think about it.

[A]

That's good.

[B]

Yeah. Because this has been fairly stressful, but I haven't been stress eating too much, so. Okay, anyway, peanut butter here to me, Chuck, early on, we happen upon the fact of the podcast. If you ask me, this is very jarring, if you'll forgive the pun, that peanut butter outside of the United States in a lot of different countries is looked upon as very weird and gross in much the same way that we Americans tend to think of, like, Vegemite people, like the British, the Chinese. Other countries do not think peanut butter is particularly good. They think it's a little nasty. And that just blew me away to read that.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

I'd want to talk to some people before I let some Internet website tell me that people think peanut butter's gross.

[B]

Some website. Push your brain around.

[A]

Yeah, I'd like to talk to some folks about that.

[B]

But at the very least, even if they don't think it's gross, it is an all American thing. Like, even countries that do enjoy it. I've read that Australia actually likes it a lot. It's an American concoction. So much so that, like, it might be the most American concoction there is, to tell you the truth.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, you make a good point here. You put this stuff together that Mac and cheese came from Europe, hot dogs came from Europe, sort of hamburgers, even though I would argue that the hamburger as we know it is pretty American.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

But peanut butter, just us. As far as modern times go.

[B]

Yeah. I think that the Inca in the 15th century used to grind peanuts into a paste, and then that was it until the 19th century when one of our buddies who's going to make a cameo later, got his hands on the idea. But, yeah, it was an American invention, except it was actually Canadian, as we'll see. But for the most part, people think of it as all American. And to talk about peanut butter, Chuck, we kind of have to talk about peanuts. There's really no way around it. Believe me, I don't want to, but we have to.

[A]

I think you mean goobers.

[B]

Have you ever heard somebody outside of TV call them that?

[A]

Not really, but I knew it was a thing. But I don't. It's not in the just daily nomenclature of my crowd, but it is.

[B]

It's supposedly like a Southern, and I guess an antiquated Southern word for peanut. A goober or goober pee.

[A]

Yeah, I've heard goober and that old song about the Raisinets. Goober. Well, goobers is also a candy, right?

[B]

Yeah. And there's Smucker's Goobers, which is peanut butter and jelly mixed together in A jar. It's actually good.

[A]

Is it?

[B]

Yeah. Even as a kid, I was like, this is going to be gross. And then I tried it. I was like, not bad. Not bad. Smuckers.

[A]

See, I'm pretty discerning with my jams and jellies, so that's for another day, though.

[B]

You would not like this.

[A]

I probably wouldn't.

[B]

You wouldn't like Smuckers. And if you're at all discerning, you would not like it.

[A]

All right, so peanuts is a. It's a legume. It's also called a ground nut or an earth nut. And just like a lentil or a pea, it is a little legume.

[B]

It's not a nut.

[C]

No.

[A]

I'm a big fan of peanuts, though. I like to eat them pretty much any way you can slice it from boiled to straight up, raw out of the shell. Like them honey roasted, salted and roasted, and certainly in peanut butter.

[B]

So Momo and I go and visit squirrels whenever we can when we go on walks, and we always take peanuts. And I read you're supposed to take roasted, unsalted peanuts. So we get, like, big bags of those. And if there's no squirrels out, I get to eat all the peanuts. Oh, yeah, yeah. Mo will give me a look like, those are not for you, but they usually end up in my tummy anyway.

[A]

You ever seen a squirrel stick one of those in his mouth sideways?

[B]

Yep, I have.

[A]

Darn cute.

[B]

Yeah, we'll, like. I'll shell them and then throw, like, the actual peanut, and the squirrel somehow will know that there's supposed to be another one coming. Cause they'll very. They'll frequently put one in his cheek and then, like, be like, okay, toss me the other one. Then he'll take that, run off, and, like, eat it with his two little hands. It's really adorable.

[A]

Right. Or they might stick around to see if it's one of the rare three bangers.

[B]

Right. Which is just. That's a good squirrel day right there.

[A]

All right, so these things are legumes, and we think they originated in South America. You mentioned Peru, even though we cannot prove that through the fossil record. But they have found evidence in the archaeological culture from Peru from about 7,600 years ago. And it was sort of one of these things where they found the fact that they were farming this stuff. And then when you see it in, like, artwork and pottery and stuff like that, then you know it's sort of a thing.

[B]

Yeah, right. The peanut has arrived. When it shows up on pottery, you know, for Real. They've also found them, I guess entombed with mummies from the Inca and the Aztecs. Which makes sense because when the conquistadors arrived, the Spanish and the Portuguese to South America and Central America, they found peanuts being grown as far north as Mexico. But I think the first place they encountered them was actually in the Caribbean. And they took them back with, with them. They took them to Spain and Spain passed them along to the rest of Europe and the Philippines and China. The Portuguese took it back to again to Europe, but also to India and Africa. And peanuts started to be farmed all over the world. Like the world loves peanuts. It's just not necessarily peanut butter that they're crazy about. And then in a really kind of weird, surprising twist, the peanuts were re exported back to the Americas from Africa as part of the West African slave trade. And actually that word goober, that southern word, goober, they think comes from a Congolese word or Congo with a K word in gooba.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Pretty surprising. Sure.

[A]

Goober and guba. Close enough.

[B]

Yeah. But to think like the peanut, you think of the peanut as just American as it comes and then even as Georgia as it comes. But the idea that it wouldn't have been here had it not been for the importation of African slaves that reintroduced the peanut to the Americas. That's a pretty circuitous and weird route for it to take.

[A]

Yeah. And Africa still grows about 25% of the peanuts in the world. We're just below that at about 21% here in the States. And it took all the way to 1842 that we started growing them commercially in the US in Virginia is where it first started for oil and food and to substitute out for cocoa. And it wasn't, it just wasn't like it was kind of like for people that didn't have the means to buy something better or maybe feed it to your animals or something like that.

[B]

Yeah, it was good for livestock. And the poverty stricken basically was who were expected to eat peanuts at the time.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

It just like, like lobster. Have you ever read Consider the Lobster? That's. Oh man. I want to say David Lee Roth so bad, but I know that's not his name at all. Who wrote Consider the Lobster?

[A]

I've never heard of that, but I know about the lobster.

[B]

Who is end of tour about that movie? Oh, David Foster Wallace.

[A]

Oh, sure, sure. Yeah.

[B]

He wrote this really great magazine article once called Consider the Lobster. It's good. But in it he explains that it used to be considered a food fit. Only for the poor, basically. I guess peanuts were considered the same.

[A]

That's right. You know, they were sea spiders.

[B]

Yeah. Or the cockroaches of the sea.

[A]

Disgusting.

[B]

It is kind of gross when you think of it like that. And apparently there was a law that said that you could only feed so much lobster to patients in mental asylums at the time, or else it became abusive.

[C]

Oh, wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

They didn't know. Did they try them on a hot dog bun with mayonnaise?

[B]

So one of the reasons why the peanut was viewed as such a lowly crop was that it was, again, it was used for oil, which, I mean, this wasn't necessarily just cooking oil. They would use it to lubricate machinery, that kind of stuff. So the idea of eating the same thing that your machinery lube came from was probably not super appetizing. But it was also like you would get just basically trash when you got a bag of peanuts, because there was no easy way to harvest it, stem them, clean them, and prepare them for basically general consumption. So again, you could just dump it into a trough and feed it to your livestock. Or you could spend a lot of time trying to separate it, or you could just be like, I'm not messing with this. And for a long time, they didn't mess with it, actually.

[A]

Yeah. When the Civil War happened, the Union soldiers got their hands on some of our southern peanuts and they said, these are delicious. And both armies ate a lot of peanuts. And then when the circus rolled around with P.T. barnum, Hugh Jackman, they started selling peanuts there, hot roasted peanuts. And especially in the cheap seats, they become known as the peanut gallery. And that's where that phrase came from. Which is kind of interesting.

[B]

Yeah. Because apparently if they didn't like what they saw, they would toss their peanuts that they were eating at the stage. So that's where peanut gallery came from.

[A]

Yeah. And then you've got them on the street corners, you've got them at baseball games. Peanuts are starting to get a little traction as a snack, but they were still not. It was still hard to get, like, a really good quality peanut peanuts because like you said, the way they were being harvested at the time by hand, it was just tough to do.

[B]

And then, so two African Americans around the turn of the last century stepped up and basically said, we're going to make the peanut what it is today. So one obviously was George Washington Carver, who's known as basically the father of the peanut, who actually, contrary to popular belief, did not invent peanut butter. But he did come up with more than 300 different ways to use the peanut. And I never realized like why he was so bonkers for peanuts. But one of the reasons he was trying to make the peanut or establish it as a prominent crop was because the south had depleted its soil so badly from growing cotton for so long. And then you know, at the worst of this, there was a boll weevil outbreak that just ruined the rest of the cotton crops. So the south really needed something to replace cotton. And George Washington Carver helped introduce and popularize peanuts and say not only can you eat these things, look at all this other stuff you can make out of them.

[A]

That's right. And there was another guy around the same time named Ben Hicks, Mr. Benjamin Hicks. He was from Virginia, which we already talked about being a big peanut state. And he invented a gas powered machine for cleaning and stemming these things. He got it patented like a lot of. Well, it still goes on I guess with, with the little guy and their patents. Big Farm came around and a farm equipment company challenged him. He actually had to go to court, but won the case in 1901. And this picker was a big big deal in modernizing peanut farming. And all of a sudden you could get really good peanuts a lot quicker. Doesn't take as many hands or man hours or person hours. And the demand for peanuts, for oil, for eating them and peanut butter and candy all just kind of went through the roof at that point.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Because you could get your hands on good peanuts. They were widely available and they were just delicious. Everyone saw finally how great peanuts are, but not peanut butter yet. And I propose Charles, that we take a break and then come back and really dig into the peanut butter.

[A]

Let's do it.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

This summer there are 250 reasons to join T Mobile.

[B]

Girls, trip booked and switching to T Mobile help make it happen with experience

[A]

beyond Switch and get $100 back plus $650 in value in built in plan benefits. That's $750 in your first year guaranteed.

[B]

And honestly that hundred dollars back, I'm putting it towards the zipline now.

[A]

That's how you do summer.

[B]

Exactly. Best switch I ever made.

[A]

This is just one reason to join T Mobile this summer. There are 250 reasons. Find yours. Savings based on the value of benefits included with Experience beyond like entertainment and one year of AAA Classic and DashPass on us. Benefits may require activation. See plan for details. Get $100 via virtual prepaid MasterCard with eligible ported, no cash access and expires in six months issued by Sunrise Banks and any member FDIC.

[C]

Allow eight weeks I'm Martha Stewart from the Martha Stewart Podcast. You know what I love about cooking? The endless inspiration, sharing exceptional flavors, and of course, the best ingredients. I refuse to make a dish without them. McCormick has been and is an essential in the kitchen now. McCormick's new line of signature seasonings make bringing fresh inspiration and endless versatility to everyday dishes easier than ever. There's the everyday essential garlic and olive oil, the savory sweetness of caramelized onion and globally inspired flavors like the herby with a touch of heat chimichurri and chili garlic that elevates everything from ramen to stir fry to even grilled meats. Try the chimichurri blend to make your steaks delicious. Each signature seasoning is crafted by flavor experts to make every dish more delicious. When you want to make your best, it's got to be McCormick. Find your [e-mail]

[A]

hey everyone, it's Cal Penn, host of the Audible and I Heart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast, I'm sitting down with Lily Chu, the author of the Audible original romantic comedy Just Kiss Already. It's a story about a forensic anthropologist who secretly writes mystery novels, an actress who adapts his book into a film, and what happens when a meme and a media tour collide with a slow burn romance. It's performed by Simu Liu and Philippa sue, and it is an absolute blast.

[B]

When you actually hear the performance, you realize that other people are taking your words and what you thought was kind of a straightforward sentence like the cat in the corner is black. In my head it's the cat in

[C]

the corner is black.

[B]

Not the dog, not the gerbil. But someone else might say it, the cat in the corner is black. That's always fascinating to me how they just bring in all these different nuances and really make it fun and interesting and distinctive.

[A]

Listen to Earsay, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts. Learning stuff is fun with Josh and Chuck Sunshine.

[B]

Okay, so like I said, the Inca probably had us beat as far as the invention of peanut butter went, but it was actually a Canadian who they think was probably the actual inventor of modern peanut butter, a guy who I'd never heard of before. His name was Marcellus Gilmore Edson Wallace. I'm kidding. By the last part. It was just.

[A]

I knew that was coming.

[B]

Marcellus Gilmore Edson. You just can't say the name Marcellus and not follow it up with Wallace

[A]

somewhere, you know, it really has become like peanut butter and jelly in a lot of ways.

[B]

Very nice.

[A]

So he patented a paste made of peanuts in 1884, which was described by him in his patent as at room temperature, having a consistency like that of butter, lard or ointment. Eat it.

[B]

Try this.

[A]

It sounds gross, but when you think about peanut butter, that's kind of about right.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

He added sugar to stabilize it a little bit. And this was kind of like the first modern peanut butter that we think of as peanut butter. It sold for about 6 cents a pound, which is a pretty good price.

[B]

Yeah. And if you. From what I can tell just reading about it, if you tried it today, you'd be like, yeah, it's peanut butter. Whereas if you tried some of the other stuff, you'd be like, that's the artisan peanut butter. It's punishing.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And the other stuff was first developed. So it's interesting to me that there's in the first try, right out of the gate, the guy who invents peanut butter basically invents the modern version of it, and then it takes a big step backwards or sideways, I guess you can say, depending on your viewpoint, when our buddy, Dr. John Harvey Kellogg comes along. And if you'll remember from the live show we did on the Kellogg Brothers, he invented nut butters and in particular, peanut butter. He's considered one of the main inventors of peanut butter.

[A]

Well, yeah, it was. It was right up his alley, because I think that might be my favorite live show we've done, actually.

[B]

Oh, yeah, I think so. PR Was my favorite.

[A]

PR I knew you were gonna say that.

[B]

You did?

[A]

Yeah. That was a good one.

[B]

You did.

[A]

I think those are my top two.

[B]

What about pintos, man?

[A]

What about D.B.

[B]

cooper?

[A]

Those might be the first four that I would name. What else have we done? Malls, bars.

[B]

We did the secret one that is still supposedly on tour, but on hiatus right now. I think that's it. I think that's all.

[A]

Well, I'm going to go with John Harvey Kellogg, because he. If you listen to that one, he was very big on chewing food until it was the consistency of peanut butter, basically. And so peanut butter comes along and he's like, well, this is perfect, because you don't have to chew it like that. It's already like that. It'll just glide right through your system and come out as delicious peanut butter poop.

[B]

Yeah. And it won't poison your entire body, and you won't have to spend any time in the electric light. Bath.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

Or the kneading machine. So Dr. Kellogg creates basically what we would recognize today as the. The artisan version of peanut butter. It's just ground up peanuts that form a paste. And apparently that's just a natural thing that happens. Like if you put roasted peanuts in a food processor, it's going to turn, like, gritty and everything. But if you just keep going, it eventually reaches this point, this threshold where that grit turns into this oily paste, like peanut butter, like an ointment, like Marcellus Wallace would call it. And that's basically what John Harvey Kellogg did and served at Battle Creek. But most of the people who would have been exposed to peanut butter would not have tried John Kellogg's because, you know, that sanitarium was really expensive, and it was for the wealthy, it was for celebrities. So most people experience peanut butter at one of two places. And Chuck, I really found out in researching this that the history of peanut butter is super murky. It's like a spoonful of peanut butter stirred up in a glass of water. Kind of murky, right where it is kind of gross, where it's just not entirely clear who did what, when, whose contribution has been disproportionately mythologized. But from what I can tell, John Harvey Kellogg is definitely one of the fathers of peanut butter. Mr. Marcellus was one as well. And then it gets a little murkier after that. So much so that people say, well, peanut butter made its debut at the 1904St. Louis World's Fair. And then other people are like, no, no, that's way wrong. It made its debut at the 1893 Chicago World's Fair. And I can find good, credible sources that say either one. So I have no idea where it made its debut. I believe it was sold for sure at the St. Louis World Fair in 1904. And that a guy named C.H. summers sold like $20,000 worth of peanut butter as snack items there, but that the people who ate it there had probably already been exposed to peanut butter and liked it. It might not have been something that was part of, like, their everyday thing. They weren't standing in their pan eating it off of a spoon, but they had probably had it before, and this was, like, a real treat for them to experience it. It wasn't, like, debuted in 1904, from what I can tell, right?

[A]

Well, regardless of who introduced It Initially, by 1907, thanks to companies like Heinz and Beechnut, they were selling 34 million pounds of peanut butter, up from just 2 million in 1899. So over an eight year period, that's, that's a pretty big increase. And the soldiers come into play again. It wasn't just the Civil War and World Wars I and 2. And I've had peanut butter K rations before.

[B]

Really?

[C]

Uh huh.

[A]

It's. My dad used to get that stuff a lot when I was a kid for camping and stuff at the army Navy store. So it became a big part of your army rations in the armed forces because it had a lot of protein, it was good sustenance. You could make a PB&J and that was pretty comforting if you were on the front lines or in a trench in World War I. Yeah.

[B]

Supposedly they popularized the PB and J. The troops did.

[A]

That's right. And thank them for that.

[B]

Oh, I will. I'll salute the troops for that one.

[A]

But it was pretty regional at the time. In the early 20th century. It didn't travel that great. They finally led. You know, I mentioned hydrogenized earlier. It was this hydrogenation. Is that right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That really led to the big three coming about with the industrialization of peanut butter production and three gentlemen named Peter Pan, Skippy and Jiff, which I was curious about, Jif, where that came from. And all I found was they said it's easy to spell, easy to say and easy to remember.

[B]

It's true. All three of those check and chain

[A]

had no meaning beyond that, basically.

[B]

Really? I would have guessed it had something to do with like doing it in a jiff or jiffy or something. Huh?

[A]

No, I mean, who knows? I mean you got to be in the room I guess to know where the seed came from. But they just said it was simple and super easy. And that was kind of the end of that story.

[B]

So good night. So I wanted more. No, I'm with you. I do too. I'm kind of mad right now. But we got to press on with hydrogenation, right? Because there's this guy named John Krampner and he wrote a book called Creamy and Crunchy, all about peanut butter. And he basically points that as saying like that was the turning point for peanut butter, maybe even tied for first with its invention was the introduction of hydrogenation, which takes oils that are liquid at room temperature and adds hydrogen and a catalyst usually like powdered nickel. And they, those, those bonds become infused or saturated with hydrogen and so they stick together a lot more easily. So those liquid oils have a more stable solid state at room temperature. So you go from like peanut butter with oil on top to peanut butter that doesn't have oil on top. The oil's mixed into the mixture, and it stays that way even on the store shelf, which people love, because, I mean, you know, from eating artisan peanut butter, it's kind of a pain to stir it up. Little darling.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, that initial stir is a little dodgy because it's so close to the lid.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But you just have to have the right spoon, Take your time, don't be in a rush. And, you know, shelf life stability is super important with peanut butter because only monsters put their peanut butter in the refrigerator.

[B]

Who does that? Who point them out to me.

[A]

Monsters.

[B]

Like you've met somebody who's done that before?

[A]

No, I think that was in a judge John Hodgman listener mail at one point.

[B]

Oh, man.

[A]

I don't think it was a major case, but I think it was one of their. One of their listener mail ones. But totally think it should be on the shelf. That's where it belongs. Although I will say, if you mix a little PB&J with the natural kind and you put it in the fridge because you've had your two bites and you made too much the next day, it is interesting. It's more like a Reese's cup consistency. It's kind of hard. It makes for a nice little snack, but it's certainly not anything that you can spread on bread.

[B]

Right? Right. Well, that's the other thing, too, is if the oils are mixed into the solids, that forms this creamier substance that makes it way easier to spread, which moms love. Right, sure. And then the other thing it does, too, is with all of those hydrogen atoms linked on to the fat chains, the lipids, there's not all these unused or open bonds that an oxygen atom can come along and bond to and oxidize the peanut butter, which creates peroxide, which gives it a rancid taste. So hydrogenation not only made peanut butter less liquidy, more creamy, it also made it last longer. Like sitting on the shelf before it was sold and used. It wouldn't turn rancid nearly as fast as. So it was a big deal. The problem is, is that took peanut butter, which is actually kind of healthy, with a monounsaturated fat, that liquid oil, and turned it into saturated or partially saturated saturated fat, which is really tough on the old ticker.

[A]

Yeah, that's why I stay away from that stuff. I mean, it's so good, but. Yeah, I just. I made the switch many years ago.

[B]

Good for you, Jack.

[A]

Yeah. The hydrogenated, outsold, natural. For the first time in 42 and accounts for about 80% of the current market. Peter Pan, believe it or not, I don't think I've ever had Peter Pan. It's not bad unless it was just at a friend's house or something. I don't think we ever had it in our house.

[B]

Peter Pan makes a natural one, too. And I'm making air quotes like Jif does. And it's.

[A]

I think they all do now.

[B]

It might even be better than Jif's natural version.

[A]

I think Emily likes the Smucker's Natural, but I also got some. I can't remember the brand. It's one of the other natural brands. They're all pretty good, I think. Okay, so 1928 was when Peter Pan rolled out and was the first, which I didn't know was the first major brand. It was the biggest seller at the time. It used that partial hydrogenation process that was patented by a guy named Joseph Rosefield from Kentucky. And then that's where Jif, or that's Skippy came from. Peter Pan's parent company said, I want to cut your licensing fee. He said, I'm done with you and I'm going to go out and I'm going to make Skippy on my own. And by the end of his career, he had 10 patents, not just for peanut butter, but relating to food. And he was just kind of like Chevy Chase in vacation movies. He was a food scientist.

[B]

Yeah. What was it the thing that he learned to coat a flake with that he used on the sled?

[A]

Oh, I don't know. Some sort of a non nutritional.

[B]

Oh, I can't remember. I'll figure it out. No need to email everyone. No need to email.

[A]

No, I want to hear, I want every email about this.

[B]

I think it was called a non nutritional coating is what he called it. But yes, he was very much like that. But he was also way, way, way better than anything Chevy Chase could ever be because he was a really great boss. He paid his workers really well. And in creating the Skippy brand, he broke off from this kind of this corporate overlord that he worked for was keeping him under his thumb and then trying to shortchange him and said, you know what? By creating Skippy, I'm going to not only challenge you, Peter Pan, I'm going to become the best selling peanut butter there is from like 1950 to 1980. Like, Skippy was it. And I just missed the Skippy train. So I'm wondering, like, if I had been, you know, born in 1970, if I would have been raised on Skippy. But I came along at the Jif era. Really?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

He said, in your face. And they said, I love peanut butter in my face. And he went, oh, I gotta think of a new comeback.

[B]

You know, Chuck, one thing that's always bothered me about Peter Pan is, do you remember that jingle where it's like, eat some peanut butter anytime you can. It's like, oh, that's nice. And then they follow it up with. But only if it's Peter Pan. Like, it's got kind of this, like, if I can't have you, no one can psychotic mentality to it.

[A]

Yeah, I never really thought. I never heard that song. So I never really thought about that.

[B]

You didn't watch the television in the 1990s?

[A]

I did. I don't remember that one, though. But, I mean, I was in the 90s. I was in college, so I probably wasn't. I don't even think we had cable. I didn't watch much TV in college.

[B]

Gotcha.

[A]

So Skippy is doing great. Peter Pan is just like, well, I guess I'll just have to be second banana. And Skippy and Jiff said, how do you like being third banana? Because that's where you're headed. That same year in 1955, this is when Rosefield sold Skippy to Best Foods. Procter and Gamble bought Big Top Peanut from William T. Young, also of Kentucky. And then they became Jiffy, and they held that brand until 2001. 2002.

[B]

Yeah. I did not know that.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

But wait, 2001. 2002.

[A]

That's when they sold the Smuckers.

[B]

Oh, okay. But Jif is still the number one brand today, right?

[A]

As far as I know.

[B]

Okay. Yeah. That's my understanding, too. I thought you were saying, like, it was the number one brand until then, but. Yeah, from I think, 1980 to today, it's number one.

[A]

Yeah. And they got a lot of. I think they all do. But Jif alone has 15 different kinds of peanut butter, which is kind of nuts. If you look at their list. They've got all kinds of different crazy peanut butters out there now.

[B]

Well, nuts is just one variety.

[A]

Well, they all have peanuts in them, but.

[B]

Yeah, well, they have a good almond butter, too.

[A]

Yeah, I can get down with some almond butter.

[B]

You know what, buddy? I'm going to buy you some. When we see each other again, I'm gonna be brandishing a jar of Jif almond butter for you.

[A]

You know, it's not good. What is? You know, you can't take peanut butter sandwiches into classrooms anymore or at least at my kids preschool. And of course you can't take anything in there anymore cause it's closed. But you have to make, you have to make it with what? Do cheese. I used to chew these things all the time. What do baseball players chew? Sunflower seeds.

[B]

Chickpea.

[A]

Sunflower butter.

[B]

That's good too. I've had that. It's not bad.

[A]

Oh, I do not care for it.

[B]

Oh, you don't like it, huh? I think it's all right, I guess. I'm. Wow. I really like basically any kind of butters, including just butter. Butter.

[A]

Well, yeah, butter's great but I just cannot get down with the sunflower. Is it sunflower? Yeah, sunflower.

[B]

No, it totally is. And it's definitely. There's a taste of sunflower to it. Like you could have no idea what you were eating and somebody gives it to you and you would be like, that's sunflower butter, isn't it?

[A]

I love sunflower seeds though. That was a big thing in college. For a little while we would sit around and just put a mouthful of sunflower seeds on our mouth.

[B]

Oh yeah, I remember the sunflower trend quite well.

[A]

Remember that? And you would crack. Yeah. You would crack them open with your teeth and you would spit out the shell and then swallow the seed. Chew on the seed and swallow it.

[B]

So I would eat the whole thing?

[A]

No, you didn't eat the shell.

[B]

Yeah, I would eat the whole thing. And then I would smoke a whole cigar and inhale it.

[A]

You're a very bad squirrel. And then you would drown your lawn in water.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you would sit back and say, I'm doing life just right.

[B]

Yeah, I got it all figured out.

[A]

Would you really eat the shells?

[B]

Uh huh. Still do to this day. Really? Yeah. And it's kind of dangerous because every once in a while there's like one part to it that's just a spear and it can go right into your gums if you're not careful. So I'm pretty good at it. But every once in a while I'll be like, I think I'm bleeding.

[A]

Well, here's how I eat peanuts when I go to the ball game. I stick the whole peanut in my mouth.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Uh huh. Like a squirrel. And I kind of suck on it for a second and get that salty goodness. And then I crack it open with my teeth and I pull it out of my mouth and then dump the peanuts in and throw away the shells.

[B]

And then between every bite you have to coat Your lips with lip balm because it's so dried and cracked by the salt.

[A]

Maybe it is pretty salty. But the only time I eat peanuts in the shell like that is at a baseball game.

[B]

So now I do something similar, but it's with peanut M&MS. I will like crack the peanut M and M in half and expose the peanut with your teeth. Yes. And then eat that, the freed chocolate shell side. And then eat the other chocolate shelled side from around the peanut. And then I eat the peanut by itself.

[A]

Are you kidding or are you serious?

[B]

I'm dead serious. I can't remember the last time I ate a peanut M and M without doing that with every single one.

[A]

All right, here's what I'll do sometimes with peanut Ms. Okay, we should just have a side gig where we just talk about our stupid quirks.

[B]

We do. It's part of the podcast.

[A]

And sometimes I'll just mow on them like there's no tomorrow. But sometimes I will. And this helps me eat fewer of them because I will pop one or two in my mouth and I'll just let them sit there and marinate in my saliva.

[B]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[A]

And swirl them around. And then that candy coating kind of melts away a little bit and makes it like a really soft little crunch.

[B]

Yep, I know what you mean.

[A]

You know that move.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

It's really good.

[B]

I do that too. But usually I'm a little less patient than that. It's every once in a while, maybe when I'm like, you know, I have a whole Tupperware bowl full of peanut M&MS. I might go crazy like that.

[A]

All right, so let's. Should we take a break or should we wait a second?

[B]

Yeah, let's do that. Let's take a break.

[A]

Learning things with Chuck and Jack Churning. This summer. There are 250 reasons to join T Mobile girls.

[B]

Trip booked and switching to T Mobile.

[A]

Help make it happen with experience beyond Switch and get $100 back plus $650 in value in built in plan benefits. That's $750 in your first year guaranteed.

[B]

And honestly, that hundred dollars back, I'm putting it towards the zipline now.

[A]

That's how you do summer.

[B]

Exactly. Best switch I ever made.

[A]

This is just one reason to join T Mobile this summer. There are 250 reasons. Find yours. Savings based on the value of benefits included with experience beyond like entertainment and one year of AAA Classic and DashPass on us. Benefits may require activation C plan for details, get $100 via virtual prepaid MasterCard with eligible ported, no cash access and expires in six months. Issued by Sunrise Banks and a member FDIC. Allow eight weeks.

[C]

I'm Martha Stewart from the Martha Stewart Podcast. You know what I love about cooking? The endless inspiration, sharing exceptional flavors, and of course, the best ingredients. I refuse to make a dish without them. McCormick has been and is an essential in the kitchen now. McCormick's new line of signature seasonings make bringing fresh inspiration and endless versatility to everyday dishes easier than ever. There's the everyday essential. Garlic and olive oil, the savory sweetness of caramelized onion, and globally inspired flavors like the herby with a touch of heat, chimichurri and chili garlic that elevates everything from ramen to stir fry to even grilled meats. Try the chimichurri blend to make your steaks delicious. Each signature seasoning is crafted by flavor experts to make every dish more delicious. When you want to make your best, it's got to be McCormick. Find your [e-mail] hey, everyone, it's Kal

[A]

Penn, host of Irsay, the Audible, and iHeart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast, I'm sitting down with Divergent author Veronica Roth to talk about her sprawling new novel, Seek the Traitor's Son. It's a sci fi fantasy epic about two protagonists on opposite sides of a war and a prophecy neither of them wanted.

[B]

My first book was Divergent, and.

[A]

And when that came out, like, because

[B]

it was so popular, I think it attracted, like, mostly positivity, but the negativity I sucked in like a sponge. And I think it was, like, critiques of things I liked when I was like, you know, I was 23 and I wrote this book and it had all my, like, dorky little cheesy or maybe unrealistic loves in it. And I started to feel a lot of shame about those things.

[A]

And so for the rest of my

[B]

career, I steered away from those little things that, like, make you feel pleasure when you read. But I also was, like, saying no to these parts of myself that I then was like, screw it. Yeah, so that's this book.

[A]

Listen to Earsay, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. Learning stuff is fun with Josh and Chuck. All right, so where we left off was Jiff was killing it. You and I have very weird eating habits.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And Jif starts killing it. They start putting sugar and molasses in there. Everyone else followed suit. And finally, in the 1960s, the FDA stood up and said, hold on a minute, guys. This stuff you're calling peanut butter is junk food. Now, there's one leading brand. I'm not going to name names.

[B]

I think it was Jif.

[A]

It was only 75% actual peanuts. He's like, so you got to start putting 95% peanuts in the whole thing. The peanut butter lobby said, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, Whoa. How about 87%? And they said, we're the FDA. We meet people in the middle. Let's settle on 90% peanuts and peanut butter. And since 1971, that's been the standard.

[B]

Yeah, I think like this went on for a dozen years. There's a really interesting article on today I found out called the momentous Peanut Butter Hearings. It's definitely worth reading. But it just was nuts. How literally nuts how long this went on for. And then finally, it's just kind of heartening that the FDA was like, no, 90%. That's as low as we're going. Make sure that your peanut butter has 90% peanuts. Good day to you, sir. And that was that finally. And it became enforced in 1972. And still today there is a federal legal definition for what constitutes peanut butter. And one of the first things is it has to have 90% peanuts in it.

[A]

That's right. Because that is still the standard. If it is smooth, it has to be very fine with an even texture and no hint of grainy peanuts at all. If it's medium, you can have a little grain to it, but Nothing larger than 1/16 of an inch in dimension, and then all bets are off if you're crunchy. I don't know who says chunky, but it's definitely crunchy.

[B]

Chunky, yeah, that's like a type of Campbell soup.

[A]

So crunchy can be larger than 1 16. And I guess, I mean, they're all about the same size. I'd be curious to see if there are any kind of half size peanuts if it gets that chunky.

[B]

Oh, yeah, like larger than a sixteenth of an inch.

[A]

Yeah, like a half of a peanut.

[B]

People would be like, it's too chunky. I can't take it.

[A]

Maybe. I mean, that's. That's like candy bar level.

[B]

It is, it is. So, Chuck, what you've just said is the federal government's definition of the different varieties of peanut butter as far as they're concerned. And I don't know if you said it or not, but that guy Joseph Rosefield, who was the founder of Skippy, he actually created chunky. Sorry, Crunchy peanut butter.

[A]

We both Said crunchy and now we're both saying chunky.

[B]

I know it's kind of stuck in my head. But he's the guy who, if you like chunky peanut butter, first of all, shame on you. But secondly, thank Joseph Rosefield for that because he came up with it, I think in the 50s.

[A]

Yeah, like I said, I like it all. There is not a kind of peanut butter that I won't eat. I think it's all really good.

[B]

So then I think also the. This kind of demonstrates just how seriously Americans take peanut butter. The USDA goes on to say there are other qualities that make a peanut butter either grade A, grade B or substandard peanut butter. And my favorite, it's things like color. The color has to match certain color samples that you can only obtain from a company called Agtron Inc. Of Sparks, Nevada. This is in the 1972 law that you have write to Agtron and say, can you please send me the peanut butter color standards because I need to make sure that my peanut butter matches the USDA's standards for color of peanut butter.

[A]

They're online. Get with it. Why are you writing me a letter?

[B]

Right. That's a really good point. And you email or you'd write back like, I don't know, can you please send me the website URL? And then they would. But when you get this color standard, you can't just look at it wherever. You have to look at it at a light with a color temperature of about 7,500 kelvin, plus or minus 250 kelvin or something equal to a moderately partly cloudy day. That's the government's standard for judging the color of peanut butter.

[A]

All I can think of now is somebody writing a handwritten letter to someone asking for a URL. Someone with a ballpoint pen spelling out HTTPs,://,/.

[B]

I looked up Agtron Inc. They're still around and they are on point, man. They've been in business for I think about a century. But they are all about like food analysis. If you're a coffee roaster or a barista or something, you can take their online class. I think it's online. It's like a day long class that like really teaches you all like the science behind the coffee you're selling and roasting and grinding. It's a really interesting company it looks like. But that's if you start making peanut butter, you need to write a letter to Agtron Inc. Asking for their URL and they will

[A]

send you a laminated sheet and a manila envelope.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So if you're talking peanut butter. In the United States, about half of the edible use of peanuts is from peanut butter. Obviously, peanut butter is in a ton of. It's one of my favorite parts of candy bars and stuff like that. I'm a sucker for any peanut butter ice creams, peanut butter candy bars. It's just. I can't get enough of that combination.

[B]

I'm totally with you, buddy.

[A]

Which, by the way, Joseph Rosefield was, the skippy guy, was the guy who came up with that peanut butter and chocolate combo before Reese's did. But the National Peanut Board estimates that it takes about 540 peanuts to make up one of those 12 ounce jars, which is a lot of peanuts. That kind of surprised me. It was more than I thought.

[B]

Yeah. Sit there and shell peanuts until you reach 540 individual peanuts and you will have a sudden appreciation for your peanut butter. You know what I mean?

[A]

For sure. But of course, machines do that. But yeah.

[B]

Well, if it's artisan. No. Somebody wearing like a calico sarong is doing it with by hand in Vermont. That's what I think Vermont people are like. Yeah. I think that's my conception. Prove me wrong, Vermont.

[A]

So in 2009, we're talking about health aspects. There's a couple of parts to the health of it, of whether or not it's just good for you, which we'll get to. But also there have been a couple of peanut butter incidents throughout the years in recent years that have scared people off from peanut butter a little bit. And 2009 was the second one. There were 500 people who got sick and eight people died from eating peanut butter from a plant in Blakely, Georgia, that was pretty gross and not maintained well.

[B]

I remember that, don't you?

[A]

I remember both of them. The other One was in 2007, and that was salmonella and Peter Pan and Great Value, both owned by ConAgra. And that got about 600 and change. Sick, but nobody died, luckily. But I remember both of those. It was a big deal because peanut butter is so ubiquitous.

[B]

So there's also. I didn't realize this until I started researching it. There's something called aflatoxins. Have you heard of them?

[A]

I think I did back when all this stuff happened, or maybe not, but I have heard of it.

[B]

So there's a mold called aspergillus that grows on peanuts because peanuts are grown underground. Right. And the aspergillus can produce a toxin called aflatoxins. And apparently humans are pretty much immune to its initial effects or its Short term effects. But we have no idea what happens if you eat aflatoxins, you know, over the course of a lifetime, you know what, what happens? And apparently there's studies of humans that found that it's been linked to certain types of cancer, potentially birth defects, cognitive disabilities, all sorts of horrible stuff. And peanut butter producers say, well, we get at least 89% of the aflatoxins out just by processing peanuts. You say, well, what about the other 11%? And they're like, have some Peter Pan and forget your troubles.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

So there is like a real risk of something bad happening to you, whether it's a poisoning or not. But a lot of people are like, even if it's pure peanut butter, it's, it's still, it's still not healthy for you.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, the, the major brands that are sugary and hydrogenated certainly aren't good for you. If you're going to the farmer's market and, and getting those peanuts ground right in front of your face, it's not, it's not terrible. You know, it's got a lot of nutrition, it's got a lot of antioxidants, it's got, we're talking, this is 100 grams of this stuff. You've got 45% RDA of vitamin E, 67% of vitamin B3, 16, 7%, I'm sorry, 73% of manganese and 39% of magnesium.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So it's got a lot of good stuff in there. It's got a lot of calories too. That's about 600 calories, creating 100 grams worth. But if it's, you know, I mean, that's a 100 grams is a lot.

[B]

No, it is a tremendous amount. The other thing is too, is if you're eating that artisan peanut butter, that Kraft peanut butter, the non hydrogenated, I guess I should say peanut butter, the oils and the fats in it are actually good for you. The monounsaturated fat is the kind that's good for your heart. It's that saturated stuff that becomes shelf stable. That's the stuff that can build up as plaque in your arterial walls and cause heart attacks and strokes and that kind of thing. But the natural peanut butter actually does the opposite. It helps your cholesterol levels.

[A]

That's right. Which is great.

[B]

It's basically just really calorie dense. Like if you're trying to lose weight, it's a good idea to shy away from peanut butter. But if you're eating natural peanut Butter, it's not like a non nutritious food. It's actually pretty nutritious. It's just calorie dense.

[A]

Right. And if you're trying to lose weight and you opt for a spoonful of peanut butter and honey rather than a pint of Ben and Jerry's, then you're definitely doing the right thing.

[B]

For sure, man. For sure. One thing though, that has, you know, strikes fear in a lot of people. Like you were saying in your daughter's preschool, you can't even bring a peanut butter sandwich in there anymore. Is this the rise of the peanut allergy? Like there's a survey that was conducted in the 80s, the 90s and the 2000s. I think the most recent one was in 2008. And they found that between 1997 and 2008 in this national survey of 5,300 homes that the self reported peanut allergies went from 0.4% of respondents to 1.4% of respondents. Which 1.4% doesn't sound like a lot, but that's a huge increase between like 11 years, I guess. But the thing is, is if you look at other studies, they found that yes, self reported rates are on the rise, but doctor diagnosed rates have held steady. So there seems to be an increase in perception that people have peanut allergies. That's not necessarily an increase in actual peanut allergies, which is really strange and bizarre to think of, if that's correct.

[A]

Yeah. And I have seen the trend of oral immunotherapy like feeding your very small child and your baby peanuts to a little bit at a time to ensure, or hopefully ensure that they won't be stricken with the worst food allergy of all. It's true, the peanut allergy. And there was a study in Israel that had guidelines for early infant feeding and they said around four to six months of age, just shove a bunch of peanuts in their mouth and see what happens.

[B]

Make them chew and then. Hit them with the lip balm.

[A]

Yeah, hit them with that. Hit them with the lip balm.

[B]

So one last thing. Chuck and I couldn't find a place to put it. But it has to be said there is a phobia called arachibout Arachibutyrophobia. Yeah, I think I nailed it that last time.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And it is.

[A]

Is that for me? Is that my cue?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

It's hard to tell because you're not kicking me under the table.

[B]

I'm not like doing that series of blinks.

[A]

That is the fear of peanut butter getting Stuck on the roof of your mouth.

[B]

That is a true thing.

[A]

Which is shouldn't be a fear, because all you got to do is just keep working the tongue and that peanut butter is going to dislodge and go right down your throat.

[B]

That's right. Just like John Harvey Kellogg foresaw.

[A]

Get a little whole milk and you're all set.

[B]

Nice, man. Or some Cool Whip. Don't forget the Cool Whip.

[A]

I gotta try that.

[B]

I don't know if you should try that. Like, I think I gained 10 pounds in a month just after I discovered that it's not good for you, man.

[A]

Yeah, I can't wait. Cool Whip doesn't last long in our house. We can't keep it here. It's just like, it's really hard not to just sort of. Oh, I'll just have a little spoonful every now and then, right?

[B]

And then.

[A]

Where did it go?

[B]

Yeah, it's like your hair is stuck to your forehead because you've put your whole face in the tub.

[A]

So good. And it's good frozen, too. I don't know if you ever tried that.

[B]

Yeah, I've tried it both ways. But if you do want to try it, it's about half and half peanut butter Cool Whip per spoonful.

[A]

I'll give it a shot if I'm ever allowed to go to the grocery store again.

[B]

Yeah, right. Okay. Well, I think that's it then for peanut butter. Unless you have anything else.

[A]

We got nothing else.

[B]

Okay, well, since we said we have nothing else, that means it's time for losing her mayo.

[A]

I'm gonna call this early listener that came back as an adult. Love these. Hey, guys. Last year, I. Well, what I really love is people that never stop listening.

[B]

Right?

[A]

But we'll take this. Hey, guys. Last year I started getting back into stuff you should know after a long break from the nine to 10 days. What does that mean? And a need for an educational podcast. On my long drives to Blacksburg, Virginia, from the Tidewater area of Virginia, I

[B]

think they got hit by the aflatoxin.

[A]

I think he maybe. I don't know what he means. When I first started listening, I was in middle school, and I always loved trivia, and your podcast helped me annoy other students with random facts about Twinkies and fluoride. Once I went through church camp, it was appreciated. I earned the name Random Fact Kid. You guys helped me encourage my natural instincts in the world that got me through electrical engineering and also helped me earn free beer at trivia nights because of my tendency to Remember Obscure Knowledge. I even made a friend through the podcast. Listener Lucas. I take it that's just Lucas. Listener. It's not his first name.

[B]

I hope so.

[A]

He was listening to your podcast while driving his bus, and I recognize the familiar voices, so just wanted to say thanks, guys. And that is from Listener Daniel. So maybe that's how they met. They had the same first name, right?

[B]

They're like, I never thought I would have a brother, but now I do. Daniel and Lucas together.

[A]

Listener.

[B]

You got anything else now?

[A]

I got nothing at all.

[B]

Well, if you want to be like Listener Daniel and let us know how long you've been listening, we want to hear from you. You can get in touch with us just through a simple email. Simple gesture. The gesture of wrapping it up, the gesture of spanking it on the bottom. The gesture of early feeding it peanuts and sending it off to stuffpodcastheartradio.com

[C]

Stuff

[B]

youf Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts My Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. I'm U.S. transportation Secretary Sean Duffy. We all get distracted when we drive, whether it's from our phones or kids in the backseat bickering. But how we handle these distractions can be a man Matter of life or death before you get on the road for your next road trip, please put your phones on silent and take a mental note to focus on driving. Paid for by nhtsa.

[A]

I love my phone, but not my carrier.

[C]

What do I do?

[B]

Well, there are 250 reasons to join T Mobile. Like what? You can keep your phone and your number, and T Mobile helps pay it off up to $800 per line. So I wouldn't have to buy a new phone?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yep. Plus, your plan price stays the same for 5 years on experience plans.

[C]

Nice.

[B]

Find your reason@t mobile.com

[A]

via virtual prepaid guard card. Typically takes 15 days after rebate submission price guarantee on Talk text and F5G data exclusions like taxes and fees apply. Wait, I came in for two things. How is this $47? All right, we're going to need a plan here.

[B]

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[A]

Oh, that's actually really simple.

[B]

Safe balance banking. One less thing to figure out. Learn more at b of a.com earn 100. Terms and conditions apply. Bank of America and a member FDIC.

[A]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.