SYSK’s Summer Movie Playlist: How the MPAA Works

Summary

Stuff You Should Know: SYSK’s Summer Movie Playlist – How the MPAA Works
Hosted by Josh Clark and Chuck Bryant
Release Date: June 27, 2025
Source: iHeartPodcasts

---

Introduction

In the episode titled "SYSK’s Summer Movie Playlist: How the MPAA Works", Josh Clark and Chuck Bryant delve into the intricacies of the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA), exploring its history, rating system, criticisms, and its role in the evolving landscape of digital distribution and online piracy. This comprehensive discussion aims to shed light on the often opaque processes that govern movie ratings and their broader implications for the film industry.

---

Origins and Evolution of the MPAA

Historical Context:

The conversation begins with the historical foundation of the MPAA. Chuck provides a timeline starting from the early 1920s:

Chuck Bryant [07:36]: "It's 1922 Hollywood, and Vine is a viable intersection in Hollywood at the time. Unlike now, although people are going to say no, they built that area back up."

Josh and Chuck explain that the MPAA was established as a self-regulatory body to prevent local censorship and ensure that Hollywood could maintain control over film content, thereby safeguarding their commercial interests.

The Hays Code Era:

Will Hays, the first president of the MPAA, introduced the Hays Code in the 1930s, imposing stringent guidelines on film content:

Chuck Bryant [08:19]: "He installed the Hays Code and said, 'You're either going to pass or fail. It's either going to be stamped immoral or moral.'"

The Hays Code enforced moral standards, restricting themes like government criticism, explicit sexuality, and clear-cut distinctions between good and evil. This self-policing mechanism was designed to avoid inconsistent local obscenity laws that could disrupt film distribution.

---

Transition to the Rating System

Loosening Restrictions and the Birth of PG-13:

Post-World War II, societal norms began to shift, leading to more relaxed attitudes towards film content. Notably, in 1984, Steven Spielberg played a pivotal role in the creation of the PG-13 rating:

Chuck Bryant [06:28]: "PG13 is now the strike zone... it caters to young teenage boys who apparently are the most successful at getting girls to go to movies with them."

Spielberg's films, "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom" and "Gremlins", received backlash for content deemed unsuitable for a PG rating. Urging the MPAA to create an intermediate rating, the result was the introduction of PG-13, which has since become the most commercially successful rating.

Establishment of Current Ratings:

By 2014, the rating system included:

• G (General Audience): Suitable for all ages.
• PG (Parental Guidance): Some material may not be suitable for children.
• PG-13: Parents strongly cautioned; some material may be inappropriate for children under 13.
• R (Restricted): Under 17 requires accompanying parent or adult guardian.
• NC-17: No one 17 and under admitted.

Chuck and Josh discuss how these ratings serve as guidelines rather than enforceable laws, emphasizing that theaters often require MPAA ratings for screening purposes.

---

The MPAA Rating Process

Role of the Classification and Rating Administration (CARA):

The MPAA’s rating decisions are made by CARA, a committee responsible for evaluating films based on their content. Chuck outlines the process:

Chuck Bryant [20:02]: "CARA doesn't say whether your movie stinks or not. CARA is 8 to 13 people, and they are called raiders, and they are overseen by a senior raider."

These raiders, purportedly representing the average American parent, watch films in private sessions, making notes on potentially offensive content. The decisions are notoriously secretive, with no disclosure of individual raider identities or detailed reasons for specific ratings.

Lack of Transparency and Accountability:

A major criticism highlighted is the clandestine nature of the rating process. Doug mentions how the documentary "This Film Is Not Yet Rated" by Kirby Dick uncovered discrepancies between MPAA claims and actual raider qualifications:

Chuck Bryant [22:16]: "Kirby Dick tailed these people… found these anonymous people did not fall into the requirements the MPAA said they did."

This revelation suggested that raiders often did not align with the stipulated demographics, casting doubt on the integrity and representativeness of the rating system.

---

Criticisms of the MPAA

Subjectivity and Inconsistency:

Josh and Chuck argue that the MPAA’s rating system is highly subjective, leading to inconsistent ratings:

Chuck Bryant [43:27]: "A movie like 'Philomena' was rated R while 'Hostel 2' received the same rating, despite vastly different content."

They emphasize that movies with minimal or no violence can receive restrictive ratings due to language or sexual content, while PG-13 films often contain substantial violence.

Bias and Conflict of Interest:

The MPAA’s representation of six major Hollywood studios raises concerns about bias, especially towards mainstream and major studio films over independent or foreign productions. This monopolistic influence potentially hampers diverse storytelling and equitable rating practices.

Manipulation by Filmmakers:

Filmmakers sometimes exploit the lack of standardized criteria by inserting gratuitous content to distract raiders, intending to excise such segments in the final cut without affecting the overall rating. This tactic undermines the rating system’s credibility.

Chuck Bryant [39:53]: "Filmmakers intentionally putting in things they never intend to keep… to distract from other elements."

Marketing and Ethical Concerns:

The introduction of "Check the Box" labels, brief descriptors accompanying ratings, is criticized as disingenuous marketing aimed at appealing to younger audiences without substantial regulatory oversight.

Josh Clark [37:51]: "It's like brief nudity. Come see it. PG13. Check it out, kid."

This approach is seen as contradictory to the MPAA’s purported role in protecting children, as it simultaneously markets to them.

---

Impact of Digital Distribution and Online Piracy

Erosion of MPAA’s Influence:

With the rise of digital platforms and online piracy, the MPAA’s traditional control over film distribution is diminishing. Josh and Chuck discuss how the MPAA’s attempts to combat piracy are becoming increasingly ineffective:

Josh Clark [32:26]: "The MPAA is needed more than ever because they have to lobby Congress to fight online piracy… it's a losing battle."

Legislative Efforts:

The MPAA has successfully lobbied for laws like the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), which criminalizes unauthorized sharing of copyrighted material. However, the advent of streaming and peer-to-peer networks continues to challenge these efforts.

Shifts in Distribution Models:

As theatrical releases face competition from streaming services, the MPAA’s rating system’s relevance is questioned. Films bypassing theaters for digital releases challenge the de facto necessity of MPAA ratings, potentially reducing their impact on film distribution.

---

The Appeals Process

Opaque and Unsuccessful:

The traditional appeals process for contested ratings is shrouded in secrecy and has historically been ineffective. Even after documentary revelations, the process remains closed:

Chuck Bryant [25:13]: "When you were appealing, you couldn't reference any other film. It was totally done in a vacuum."

This lack of transparency prevents filmmakers from understanding or addressing the specific reasons behind rating decisions, fostering frustration and mistrust.

---

Case Studies and Examples

Inconsistent Ratings:

Josh and Chuck cite several examples illustrating the MPAA’s inconsistent rating assignments:

• Rushmore (1998): Rated R for minor content elements that did not align with its minimal actual explicit content.
• Affliction (1997): Rated R due to brief profanity despite its dramatic narrative.
• Blue is the Warmest Color (2013): Received NC-17 for a teenage lesbian love story with minimal explicit content.
• "Philomena" vs. "Hostel 2": A heartfelt drama versus torture horror film both rated R, highlighting inconsiderate inconsistency.

Impact on Film Success:

The restrictive NC-17 rating, as seen with Henry & June (not to be confused with Benny & Joon), can severely hinder a film’s commercial performance due to limited theater screenings and audience accessibility.

---

Future of the MPAA

Declining Relevance:

With the shift towards digital viewing and the weakening of traditional distribution channels, the MPAA's leverage is diminishing. The hosts speculate on the organization’s future amidst increasing public scrutiny and the evolving media landscape.

Calls for Reform:

There is a growing demand for greater transparency and accountability within the MPAA. Filmmakers and critics alike advocate for an open rating process, clearer guidelines, and reduced bias to restore faith in the classification system.

---

Conclusion

Josh Clark and Chuck Bryant provide an in-depth exploration of the MPAA, uncovering its historical roots, operational mechanics, and the multifaceted criticisms it faces today. The episode underscores the need for reform within the MPAA to address its subjective and opaque rating processes, especially in the face of digital transformation and shifting consumer behaviors. For listeners seeking a deeper understanding of how movie ratings impact both the industry and audience perceptions, this episode serves as a valuable resource.

---

Notable Quotes

• Chuck Bryant [06:28]: "PG13 is now the strike zone... it caters to young teenage boys who apparently are the most successful at getting girls to go to movies with them."
• Chuck Bryant [22:16]: "Kirby Dick tailed these people… found these anonymous people did not fall into the requirements the MPAA said they did."
• Josh Clark [37:51]: "It's like brief nudity. Come see it. PG13. Check it out, kid."

---

Further Resources

• Documentary: "This Film Is Not Yet Rated" by Kirby Dick
• Blogs:
  • Brain Stuff by Chris (referenced for discussions on X ratings)
  • Stuff of Genius by Josh Clark

Listeners are encouraged to explore these resources for a more comprehensive understanding of the MPAA’s rating system and its broader implications on the film industry.

Transcript

[Josh Clark]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

This July 4th celebrate freedom from spills, stains and overpriced furniture with Annabe, the only machine washable sofa inside and out where designer quality meets budget friendly pricing. Sofas start at just $699, making it the perfect time to upgrade your space. Annabe's pet friendly, stain resistant and interchangeable slipcovers are made with high performance fabric that's built for real life. You'll love the cloud like comfort of hypoallergenic, high resilience FO that never needs fluffing and a durable steel frame that stands the test of time with modular pieces you can rearrange anytime. It's a sofa that adapts to your Life. Now through July 4th, get up to 60% off site [e-mail] Every order comes with a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not in love, send it back for a full refund. No return shipping, no restocking fees, every penny back. Declare independence from dirty outdated furniture. Shop [e-mail] Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Josh Clark]

Hello, Hello. Malcolm Gladwell here from Revisionist History. Did you know T Mobile for Business has an awards show specifically for their customers? It's happening October 20th in sunny Orlando, Florida and I'm encouraging you yes you to enter this event honors outside the box thinking that changes industries, communities and even the world. And if that doesn't sound great already, I'll be there as the keynote speaker. If your company did something next level using T Mobile for Business, you're eligible. Entries close July 31, so head to t mobile.com enter to learn more and nominate your team.

[Chuck Bryant]

Hey everybody. Chuck here for another summer movie playlist feed drop. Today we're going to be covering how the MPAA works. And this is from June 2014 and it delves into the ins and outs of the MPAA and how they decide on rating movies because it's sort of a dark art as far as we're concerned. So check it out. Welcome to Stuff youf should know from howstuffworks.com.

[Josh Clark]

Hey and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles W, Chuck Bryant, and Jerry, but Where's Waldo? Right over there, apparently.

[Chuck Bryant]

Man, I wish people could hear the in between stuff.

[Josh Clark]

I think Jerry was recording that last one.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh yeah, I think so. She used to give us neat little outtakes, but she doesn't do that anymore. No, those days are long gone. They exist in the vault, though. How you doing?

[Josh Clark]

Not Good.

[Chuck Bryant]

No, no.

[Josh Clark]

I don't know what's wrong with me. I am off today.

[Chuck Bryant]

Out of your.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, it's weird.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, I think this is the perfect podcast to set you straight.

[Josh Clark]

Why?

[Chuck Bryant]

Because it's something that we both have some passion about. Against.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. I think anybody who's seen the documentary, this film is not yet rated.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

That would be very difficult to not be persuaded to feel strongly about the MPAA and its practices. Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

And at least how they do things.

[Josh Clark]

But we're going to try to be objective.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. I'm going to go ahead and say up front, I have no problem with rating a film's content, so parents can decide whether or not it's appropriate. I think it's valuable, but I think there are ways to do it that I don't think the MPAA does.

[Josh Clark]

Yes.

[Chuck Bryant]

So I just wanted to float that early on.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. I think that was probably smart.

[Chuck Bryant]

Okay.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. I don't have kids, so I don't really. Whatever. But, I mean, I can understand the value of that kind of thing.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. But it gives you an idea. Like, I like having an idea what I'm about to see, too.

[Josh Clark]

I feel like I can tell just from watching a trailer preview, seeing a movie poster. I'm pretty. I'm pretty intuitive when it comes to the marketing techniques of movies.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. But I think, like, being a film nerd, it's like, is the new. Is the new Avengers movie going to be rated R? That really tells you something. It won't be.

[Josh Clark]

No. It never would be.

[Chuck Bryant]

Because PG 13 is the. That's the strike zone these days.

[Josh Clark]

It really is. Apparently PG13 movies pull in more money than all other ratings combined.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And it's a relatively new phenomenon. You want to talk about its origin?

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, let's do it.

[Josh Clark]

So back in 1984, a man named Steven Spielberg had two movies out.

[Chuck Bryant]

Who?

[Josh Clark]

Steven Spielberg.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

He directed one. Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom, and he produced another. Gremlins.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And both of them caught. He caught a lot of heat from both of them.

[Chuck Bryant]

Sure. Indiana Jones for the heart removal scene. Specifically Indiana Jones.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. But also the snake. The live snake at the feast thing.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, yeah.

[Josh Clark]

The snake babies, the eyeballs, all that stuff.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And then with Gremlins, it was just downright terrifying in a lot of different places, especially if you're a kid. And the reason he caught heat was because both of those movies were rated pg. And so Spielberg went to the mpaa, the Motion Picture association of America, and said, let's do something about this, because these clearly aren't our movies.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

But they apparently aren't PG movies either. So maybe we should come up with something in between. And PG 13 was born.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. And this was before he had all the sway in the world. He was influential, but it wasn't like Spielberg today who could have just waved his wand and made it happen.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. But I think even at the time he's important. Yeah. There were very few directors at that time.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Who could have gotten something like that done.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Too. But so that's where PG13 came from. And that, like you said, that's the strike zone now. And the reason why is because that is the kind of movie that caters to young teenage boys who apparently are the most successful at getting girls to go to movies with them.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

So if you can get a movie rated PG 13.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

You're going to make a bunch of money.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Plus it makes sense. It's right there in the middle. Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

You know, but the problem is it's become a means of almost advertising that rating rather than cautioning parents. It's a way of attracting the audience.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, true.

[Josh Clark]

It's like this isn't some kids PG movie. This is as close to an R movie as you can get in.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. And I think filmmakers try to achieve that rating by either scaling back their R rated movie or juicing up their.

[Josh Clark]

PG movie or adding more violence. Apparently PG13 movies have tripled in violence over the last few decades and they now have, according to one study, more violence than their R rated counterparts.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. And different kinds of violence that you didn't used to see.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

You know. All right, I guess we should go back in time a little bit.

[Josh Clark]

Let's.

[Chuck Bryant]

Is it Wayback Machine?

[Josh Clark]

Sure, let's go. Let's go way back in time in Hollywood.

[Chuck Bryant]

All right. It's 1922 Hollywood. And vine is a viable intersection in Hollywood at the time. Unlike now. Although people are going to say no, they built that area back up.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

And that is when the MPA was born in the early 1920s. And at the time, it was up to local authorities or your state or your municipality to either stamp something as moral or immoral. There were no ratings on movies. And thanks to a guy named Will Hays who was the first president of the mpaa. He installed the Hays Code and said, you're either going to pass or fail. It's either going to be stamped immoral or moral.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And the reason Will Hayes, who is the MPAA president, came up with the Hays Code, which was really extensive.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

It was like, if you, if you talk about the government, it always has to be good. Sexuality has to be, like, repressed. And just basically how you think about all movies from, like the 30s and 40s? Squeaky clean, basically. Sure. Like the. The division between good and evil is very clearly defined, that the good guy always wins. And if you didn't fall into that Hays Code, like you said, your movie would be stamped immoral. But the whole reason he came up with this code was because local municipalities could pass their own obscenity laws and that could be bad for business. So.

[Chuck Bryant]

As in not even get your film exhibited.

[Josh Clark]

Right. So remember in the ACLU episode where we're talking about that one, that one movie that New York just the. The Catholics said, no, you can't show that here. And the ACLU went to work getting. Getting the Catholics beaten in court.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right. Even though it was just a bad movie, something to do with. Well, I mean, it did, but it shouldn't have been shown because it was so terrible.

[Josh Clark]

Was it bad? I don't remember.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, I mean, it was supposed to be not very good.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. But it happened. Like, that kind of thing happened a lot. Like local. Local town said, no, we're not going to show that movie. So Hayes figured out if Hollywood policed itself, then they could control what, you know, what movies came out and therefore everybody could make a bunch of money.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's right.

[Josh Clark]

And that's the point of the mpaa. They're the lobbying arm of six major Hollywood studios.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

They're there.

[Chuck Bryant]

They work for them. Yeah, well, yeah, that's one way to say it.

[Josh Clark]

But they. And it's just those six, isn't it?

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, yeah. I mean, you. There's definitely an argument these days that independent filmmakers have a much rougher time with the mpa.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

But most of the indies, too, are eventually distributed by the majors.

[Josh Clark]

Anyway, I got you.

[Chuck Bryant]

You know, I'm saying. Okay, so flash forward a bit in our way back machine to the 1950s. Things changed a little bit after World War II and people. I guess the easiest way to say it is people loosened up a little bit and didn't mind certain elements in their entertainment any longer.

[Josh Clark]

Yes.

[Chuck Bryant]

A big example this article uses. Frank Sinatra got an Oscar nomination for playing a heroin addict in the man with the Golden Army. And that couldn't have happened in the 1940s.

[Josh Clark]

No. Millions of people hadn't died in World War II yet.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's right.

[Josh Clark]

I imagine that kind of loosens you up as far as seeing curse words and stuff in movies goes.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Like that's not a big deal. Like World War II is a big deal.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Get your haunches down.

[Josh Clark]

Exactly.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

That was the big one. The big first crack to the Hays Code.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And then there were. I think that you said he won an Oscar, right?

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, it was a really good movie.

[Josh Clark]

That kind of opened the floodgates so that by the end of the 50s, you got some like it hot. Tony Curtis and Jack Lemmon are dressed like women hitting on Marilyn Monroe.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And at that point it was pretty obvious the Hays Code was dead.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. I mean, they weren't passing the code, but they were still getting released. So once something is subverted like that, it's dead in the water.

[Josh Clark]

Right. So there was a. That was fine for a little while. I think the Hays Code just kind of fell to the wayside and people were releasing movies without any kind of moral or immoral stamp. But the rating system as we understand it today hadn't come about yet.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

So it's kind of a limbo period until 1968. And a store owner in New York with the last name of Ginsburg got busted for selling nudie mags to 16 year old boys. And he took it all the way to the Supreme Court saying, you can't say anything about this. There's federal laws about obscenity, not local laws. And the Supreme Court said, you know what, we really think it's up to local municipalities to decide what they want their minors exposed to or not. That got Hollywood's attention because all of a sudden local municipalities could decide whether or not they wanted to show movies to minors or not. So what was old became new again. And Jack Valenti, who was in charge of the mpaa said we need another system, another self policing system. And he came up with the rating system that we have today.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. And he, I mean, Jack Valenti was the head of the NBA for close to 40 years. And he initially the intention was to stop censorship because he feared that the movies were going to start being censored locally. And so I think the origins of the MPA's rating system were art centered.

[Josh Clark]

Art centered, but also money centered. Because again, if you have town A showing the movie, but towns B through L deciding that the movie is obscene and not showing it, then you're losing that money and B through L. So what Valenti came up with was this idea that let us tell you what is appropriate for minors or not, what movie is, and we'll just make a simple rating system. Yeah, G, pg, R or X.

[Chuck Bryant]

The old X. Yeah. And triple X, which wasn't even formally a rating. It was just marketing tool. Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Because three X's, that's like, whoa.

[Josh Clark]

I wonder if anybody ever came out with one with four X's.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Or double X even.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Okay. We cut out that one part, so we're gonna take away an X. Yeah. Christian, our colleague here wrote a great blog post about the former X rated movie.

[Josh Clark]

Is that right? Yeah, we'll have to check that out.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, that's good.

[Josh Clark]

On Brain Stuff for stuff of Genius.

[Chuck Bryant]

On the Brain Stuff blog earlier this year. And you actually recommended it on your blog.

[Josh Clark]

The X rating.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, the best X rating this week.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, I remember recommending one of his things. I just don't remember that one.

[Chuck Bryant]

It was good. I thought about asking him in here, but then I thought, nah, we got it. So yeah, back then it was G through X and. Well, we'll talk about how that changed maybe after this Message Break.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

This July 4th celebrate freedom from spills, stains and overpriced furniture with Annabe, the only machine washable sofa inside and out where designer quality meets budget friendly pricing. Sofas start at just $699, making it the perfect time to upgrade your space. Annabe's Pet Friendly stain resistant and interchangeable slipcovers are made with high performance fabric that's built for real life. You'll love the cloud like comfort of hypoallergenic high resilience foam that never needs fluffing and a durable steel frame that stands the test of time with modular pieces you can rearrange anytime. It's a sofa that adapts to your Life. Now through July 4th, get up to 60% off site [e-mail] Every order comes with a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not in love, send it back for a full refund. No return shipping, no restocking fees. Every penny back. Declare independence from dirty outdated furniture. Shop [e-mail] Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Walton Goggins]

You're great at protecting your own personal information. You probably even use things like two factor authentication, strong passwords and a vpn. But as much as you try to be in control of how your information is protected, there are lots of places that also have it and they might not be as careful as you are. That's why Lifelock monitors millions of data points every second for identity threats. If your identity is stolen, a LifeLock US based restoration specialist will help solve identity theft issues on your behalf. Guaranteed or your money back. Plus, all LifeLock plans are backed by the million dollar protection package, meaning LifeLock will reimburse you up to the limits of your plan if you lose money due to identity theft. You might not be able to control how others handle your personal information, but you can help protect it. With Lifelock, save up to 40% your first year. Call 1-800-LIFELOCK and use promo code iheart or go to lifelock.com iheart for 40% off. Terms apply.

[Unknown]

So you want to start a business. You might think you need a team of people and fancy tech skills, but you don't. You just need Godaddy Arrow. I'm Walton Goggins and as an actor, I'm an expert in looking like I know what I'm doing even when I don't. And I like the sound of starting my own business. Walton Goggins goggle glasses. But I'm an actor. I don't know what I'm doing. I needed help. Godaddy Arrow uses AI to create everything you need to grow a business. It'll make you a unique logo, it'll create a custom website, it'll write social posts for you and even set you up with a social media calendar. I don't even realize I needed a social media calendar. GoDaddy Arrow will take your idea. That sounds good and make a business that looks like you know what you're doing. Godaddy Arrow can get your business up and running in minutes. You know what that sounds like? It sounds like a plan. Get [e-mail] Aero that's godaddy.com Airo.

[Chuck Bryant]

All right, so no longer do we have X rated movies. Now we have something. I guess we should just go through what these ratings mean today in 2014. Okay, so you've got your G. G's.

[Josh Clark]

Always been G. General audience.

[Chuck Bryant]

Anyone can see it.

[Josh Clark]

Yes.

[Chuck Bryant]

And that's your family cartoon that kids love and parents are forced to go to. Right. Then you've got pg. That means no drug use, maybe a little violence because as we'll learn, the MPA has less problems with violence and more problems with language and sex.

[Josh Clark]

Huge Criticism.

[Chuck Bryant]

Huge criticism. PG 13, which we've, you know, kind of been through. Then you've got your R. And that is no. 1 under 17. This is a suggestion that no one over 17 be admitted without a parent. And these aren't laws, though. That's one thing that's important to point out. Those are suggestions. And then theaters have policies.

[Josh Clark]

Yes, let's kind of dig into that. So none of this is legally binding? No, none of them are anything more than recommendations. They're basically saying that this movie has X amount of profanity or X amount of nudity or lacks any drug use or something like that.

[Chuck Bryant]

Sure.

[Josh Clark]

And so forth. What the MPAA thinks, the average moral compass of the average American thinks about these different things like sex, drugs, nudity, all that stuff. This movie falls into this rating.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

And again, it's not enforceable. You don't even need to have a rating to release a movie. But if you want to get your movie in theaters, there's basically no theater chain out there right now, no major theater chain out there right now that will show an unrated movie.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. It's a completely voluntary system to submit your film to the MPA ratings board.

[Josh Clark]

But it's de facto.

[Chuck Bryant]

But you have to do it.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's the rub is that they say it's voluntary, but you actually have to pay a fee to submit your movie if you ever want to have it shown in theaters.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And the fee is anywhere from like $25,000 for a big budget movie to $750 for a short. Yeah. And so you submit your movie. Well, we'll get into it in a second. Let's talk some more about the rest of the ratings.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Well, there's only one more, and that's NC17, which replaced X. And that means this is in 1990, and that basically means that it's for adults only and you should not come in if you're under 18.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And also means these days that it's foreign or about lesbian or gays, basically. Yeah, not fully, but sure, it's pretty close.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And NC17, the first movie to come out with that was Henry in June.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Not to be confused with Benny in June. And it basically sunk that movie because everybody was like, oh, this is x now.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

NC17. If you jumble it all together, it looks like X. And the whole reason they came up with NC17 was to replace X because X was associated with exclusively with pornography in the minds of moviegoers.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, exactly.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

All right, so let's get into this. The. The actual ratings board, there's the mpaa. And then working for the MPAA is the classification and ratings administration, Cara. And Cara doesn't say whether your movie stinks or not. Cara is eight to 13 people, and they are called raiders, and they are overseen by a senior raider. And they sit down and watch these movies and take copious notes on what they think based on their standards is. I Don't want to say offensive, but just noteworthy.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Like, maybe they're not offended, but they think the average mom and Sheboygan might be offended.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Supposedly.

[Josh Clark]

Which is a kind of a thing. Because the whole rating system, as you just kind of pointed out, is subjective.

[Chuck Bryant]

Totally subjective. They supposedly. Here's the other rub is it's all secret.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

You can find out a federal judge's name and address, but you can't find out who a raider is for your films. It's all conducted in private. None of this stuff is released. And that's one of the big rubs in that documentary and with filmmakers in general is it's all, you know, done behind closed doors. There's never any explanations provided. These people are supposed to have kids between ages of 5 and 17, but many of them do not.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Either have kids at all or have kids that are older than 18.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

It basically frees them up from any accountability.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

To do this all in private and in secrecy.

[Josh Clark]

And until that movie by Kirby. What is Kirby's last name?

[Chuck Bryant]

Henry and June.

[Josh Clark]

No, no, The. The documentary.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh. Oh, yeah. This film is not yet rated.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Until Kirby Dick's this Film Is Not Yet Rated came out, like, all of this stuff was just conjection, conjecture and Hollywood legend.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

He was the first one to really. Basically, he tailed these people. Tailed them to lunch.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

To find out who they were and eavesdrop on them and, like, did some digging and found, like, these anonymous people did not fall into the requirements that the MPAA said they did. And so not only was it in secret, it was fraudulent, basically, this rating system. So according to the standards, you submit your film, this group of people, this anonymous group of people watch it, they rate it, then they come together and vote on a rating, and then they pass their vote along to a senior rater who talks to the movie's distributor, director or producer, says, here's the rating. Here's why we rated it like this. And then you're faced with a choice. You can accept the rating, you can edit your film as per the Cara's.

[Chuck Bryant]

Recommendations, take out these bad words, cut the sex scene a little early.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Leave all the violence.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Or you can reject the rating and just release your movie as unrated.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Which. Well, you can try to release it, but since no one will show it, it's really sort of a misnomer.

[Josh Clark]

Right. But it's becoming increasingly a thing. Again, you need the rating to get your movie shown in movie theaters.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

But what happens if you don't Care if your movie comes out in theaters, Video on demand. Yeah. Or just releasing it to the Internet.

[Chuck Bryant]

Now, I'm curious about that, how that's going to change the landscape.

[Josh Clark]

Well, right now it's a huge threat to the MPAA because all of the power they wield is found in this rating system. And if.

[Chuck Bryant]

For theaters.

[Josh Clark]

Yes.

[Chuck Bryant]

And if no one's going to theaters.

[Josh Clark]

Then the MPAA loses all of that power, which is a big deal. Especially now, because the MPAA is needed more than ever as a lobbying group because of online piracy, which we'll talk about some more. So it's a very precarious time for the MPAA right now, and it's a terrible time for them to be under as much scrutiny and public attack and critique as they are.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

So it's. I mean, they got spears sticking out every which way and their trunk is flailing and they're honking.

[Chuck Bryant]

That is true. One thing I should point out is, I said, is that there's no accountability. That's what the NPA says is the good thing about the secrecy is that it frees them up. That anonymity does it. Frees them up from accountability. I just don't agree.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Okay.

[Josh Clark]

So the. If you want to appeal, there. There is apparently a change made in response to Kirby Dick's movie.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

The documentary before. If you were appealing your rating, which is very difficult. It almost never was done.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, you never won, that's for sure.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And when you were appealing, you couldn't reference any other film. It was totally done in a vacuum. Which is pretty preposterous.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Like, that's the only way to be able to tell. It's like, wait a minute. If you said this about this, then why not this for my movie?

[Josh Clark]

Right. Which meant that there was no real standard.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

That you could point to, or there were standards you could point to. They just wouldn't be considered.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Or at the very least, if they do have written standards, they don't release them. So you don't even know what they are.

[Josh Clark]

Right. So the MPAA is. They've got their rating system. They've got the appeals process, which was also in secret.

[Chuck Bryant]

Unless that's changed. Right.

[Josh Clark]

I think.

[Chuck Bryant]

I think the appeals board. Not only was the appeals board in secret, but they weren't even just raiders. They were people from the industry.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And the Theater Owners Association.

[Chuck Bryant]

Exactly.

[Josh Clark]

Whereas the people who are raiders are supposedly unaffiliated with the movie industry and.

[Chuck Bryant]

Are just like average, ordinary parents representing your middle America. We'll Just call it even though I think that's insulting.

[Josh Clark]

The thing is though, is a lot of people criticize the MPAA and say these raiders are really representing the six major studios who rake in 95% of the $10.9 billion made in the United States in theaters alone. Just ticket sales, not DVD or anything like that.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And that's what the MPAA does in addition to rating. They are, like we said, the lobby arm for these six studios.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's right. And they. I guess we should talk about piracy now, huh? That's one of their other big. Besides from rating movies. They are heavy in the lobby against. Well, especially now with online piracy because the digital distribution network is. It seems like the way forward as far as distribution goes.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Like it's the future. It's not the future, it's the present and the future.

[Josh Clark]

And the MPAA has a. They're accused of basically trying to quell new technology by just saying like let's just keep people from peer to peer file sharing in total so that they can't steal movies. In part. And if you go back to the early 80s, Jack Valenti was known to have railed and lobbied against the legality of VCRs.

[Chuck Bryant]

People are just going to be recording things and handing them out to their friends.

[Josh Clark]

Exactly. So there was a. The MPA has a long history of basically like just doing anything it can to stifle innovation in order to protect the profits of these big movie studios. The other problem with them lobbying in favor of these six movie studios is that they inherently have a conflict of interest against the studios that are not part of these six that they represent. Yeah, but whose movies they still rate.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

So they've been accused of more scrupulously or scrutinously rating the movies of rival studios or foreign studios when assigning a rating.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, and that's why filmmakers call consistently for transparency. I don't think there are many filmmakers out there saying there should be no rating. We should just maybe some like Lars von Trier, you know, or Werner Herzog.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

They're probably like no ratings at all. Yeah, but I think they just want transparency. Like open it up and let everyone know how this is all done.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Who these people are and give us an idea on what in the world we're submitting to.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

Voluntarily, quote, unquote. Pretty interesting.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

This July 4th, celebrate freedom from spills, stains and overpriced furniture with Annabe, the only machine washable sofa inside and out where designer quality meets budget friendly pricing. Sofas start at just $699. Making it the perfect time to upgrade your space. Annabe's pet friendly stain resistant and interchangeable slipcovers are made with high performance fabric that's built for real life. You'll love the cloud like comfort of hypoallergenic high resilience foam that never needs fluffing and a durable steel frame that stands the test of time. With modular pieces you can can rearrange anytime. It's a sofa that adapts to your Life. Now through July 4th, get up to 60% off site [e-mail] Every order comes with a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not in love, send it back for a full refund. No return shipping, no restocking fees. Every penny back. Declare independence from dirty outdated furniture. Shop [e-mail] Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Unknown]

So you want to start a business? You might think you need a team of people and fancy tech skills, but you don't. You just need GoDaddy arrow. I'm Walton Goggins and as an actor I'm an expert in looking like I know what I'm doing even when I don't. And I like the sound of starting my own business. Walton Goggins Goggle glasses. But I'm an actor. I don't know what I'm doing. I needed help. GoDaddy Arrow uses AI to create everything you need to grow a business. It'll make you a unique logo, it'll create a custom website, it'll write social posts for you and even set you up with a social media calendar. I don't even realize I needed a social media calendar. GoDaddy Arrow will take your idea that sounds good and make a business that looks like you know what you're doing. GoDaddy Arrow can get your business up and running in minutes. You know what that sounds like? It sounds like a plan. Get [e-mail] Aero that's godaddy.com Airo.

[Josh Clark]

Hey.

[Chuck Bryant]

Everybody, stuff you should know. Today is sponsored by Liquid iv and I gotta tell you, it's peak hydration season and Liquid IV is a perfect companion for your hottest summer plans. I love the Liquid iv. It's super easy and convenient. You just tear it, you pour it some water, you mix it up and it tastes really great and hydrates you.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. It's also exhilarating because they just launched an exhilarating new flavor Chuck called Arctic raspberry. And Liquid IV has sugar free options. Powered by UV Hydro Science for smart hydration.

[Chuck Bryant]

That's right. Just one stick in 16 ounces of water is gonna hydrate better than water alone. And it also has three times the electrolytes of the leading sports drink.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. It's an optimized ratio of electrolytes, essential vitamins and clinically tested nutrients that turn ordinary water into extraordinary hydration. So no matter what your summer brings, tear, pour, live more. Go to liquidiv.com and get 20% off your first order with code STUFF at checkout. That's 20% off your first order with Code Stuff@liquidiv. So you were talking about online piracy and with digital distribution being a big deal now.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

The MPAA is needed more than ever because they have to lobby Congress to fight online piracy at a time when more and more people are distributing online and going around the mpaa. So it's losing its power, but it needs its power more than ever. So like we said, it's a precarious time for the mpaa. And they tried a few things. They were successful with the. What was the first one in 2000? The digital SOPA. No, the digital Millennium Copyright Act.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh, right.

[Josh Clark]

Which basically that up until then it wasn't a federal crime to share movies on peer to peer networks.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

That one did it. And they got that passed. The MPAA lobbied and got that passed.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, they've cracked down on camcorder recording.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Like when you're in New York City and someone has that brand new copy of Godzilla on a video cassette for you. Yeah, that's because if you've seen Seinfeld, someone went and sat in that theater with a camera recorder and just made a stupid, awful quality pirated version.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. And it says that those are the most common. I guess I kind of believe that they're also the worst quality. Like sometimes people will like get up and move in front of the camera, like they go to the bathroom or something.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, I've never seen one, but they're terrible. Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Much. I don't want to say more common, but probably more common these days are like copies of screeners. Like they send out DVDs to everybody who's members of the academy to vote on movies. And so around Oscar time or before Oscar time, it seems like the Internet gets flooded with way more high quality copies of these major movies that are up for awards.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. I think now they have, thanks to the npa, have something coded to your name now on your copy.

[Josh Clark]

So like they'll know who leaked it or whatever.

[Chuck Bryant]

I think so if I'm not mistaken.

[Josh Clark]

I'm not surprised by that. Apparently, if you want to show Frozen at your church.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

You better have a public performance license because it is illegal to show a movie outside of your home.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. That surprised me. But there are a lot of, especially in the summertime, a lot of community screenings. Like every city now has, you know, Atlanta shows them, and I think at Oakland Cemetery, some other places in New York, they have them all over the place.

[Josh Clark]

Sure.

[Chuck Bryant]

And technically, yeah, they're supposed to have a license to do so. I'm sure they do. The big ones.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, the big ones I'm sure do.

[Chuck Bryant]

But like at your community pool, when you want to show ET and the.

[Josh Clark]

Feds could come kick the gate down around the pool.

[Chuck Bryant]

I bet everybody, I bet they don't love HBO these days because, you know, HBO Go.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

People steal that. They're just like, hey, dude, what's your login?

[Josh Clark]

Oh, right, yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

And HBO came out and they're like, who cares?

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. People are watching it.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Like, go watch True Detective. Maybe you'll sign up for HBO because you liked it. Or maybe you'll just support the show, period, on social media.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Even though you're getting it for free. Like, we're making enough money, basically.

[Josh Clark]

Yes. And that's something that a lot of people say, you know, film industry, we don't really feel that bad for you.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Sean Austin, sit down. Because you guys made $10.9 billion in America in ticket sales alone in 2013. We don't feel that bad about this whole conundrum that the MPAA is facing.

[Chuck Bryant]

What's John Astin's deal? See voices?

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Okay.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

I don't think I knew that.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, he was. I can't remember the. There was like a whole kind of push, an anti piracy push a few years back.

[Chuck Bryant]

And he was the face of it.

[Josh Clark]

Part of it. Yeah. Yeah. And he looked really mad about things too, Rudy. But speaking of piracy, I remember there was a story that came out recently. It was, if you think about it, at first it's like, wah, wah. But then if you really kind of lend it some thought, it's really disturbing. There was a report of prisoners at a prison being shown pirated movies. And some of the prisoners were there for pirating movies.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh, wow.

[Josh Clark]

And really think about the injustice behind that. That's just crazy town. Imagine if you've been like selling counterfeit furs and you go to prison and all the guards are wearing counterfeit fur coats.

[Chuck Bryant]

Pretty swinging prison.

[Josh Clark]

It'd Be weird, but it would also be unjust.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, yeah, true.

[Josh Clark]

But in relation to this, it's just more and more widespread every day. It feels like it's a losing battle. I think that the MPAA is fighting right now.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, I think I read somewhere today that they, I think they might release a few of the Raiders names per film. Not all like 13.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

But I need to look up that, look that up again because that, I don't know. I don't see the why releasing a 3 out of 13 names does anybody any good.

[Josh Clark]

It does zero good.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And speaking of doing zero good, the this, there's kind of a new attachment to the rating system that they have now. It's called Check the box.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And it's basically a brief description of why a movie is like PG 13.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

So it'll say like intense sci fi action or something like that.

[Chuck Bryant]

Or some drug use.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, that kind of thing. And some critics of the MPAA say it's just basically like shooting a laser beam into like a 15 year old boy's brain.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Like brief nudity. Come see it. PG13. Check it out, kid. Yeah, I think a lot of people are looking at it like it's just kind of a disingenuous advertisement. Cynical advertisement. Because the MPAA is accused of not regulating or even potentially directly marketing to kids under the age of the movies that are being advertised. So you're seeing a lot of ads for R rated movies on websites that are very popular among the 17 and under crowd. There's a lot of tie INS for PG13 movies with like kids toys.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

For kids who are under, who are under 13. And so there's like this idea that there's. The MPAA is supposedly serving America's moral compasses.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

But really at the same time they're undermining that morality that they're supposedly defending.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

By marketing and exploiting kids.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. That'd be like a cigarette company having a cartoon animal as their mascot.

[Josh Clark]

Can you imagine?

[Chuck Bryant]

It'd be weird. Well, one thing about the subjectivity of it and the fact that it is a closed book and filmmakers don't even know how to tailor their movie to achieve a certain rating. I mean to within a certain degree. But they've learned how to manipulate it because there is no set standard by if you watch that film is not yet rated. And you've heard plenty of stories over the years about filmmakers intentionally putting in things that they never intend to be in the final movie.

[Josh Clark]

Oh yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Just to sort of distract from some of the other things. So they'll shoot something kind of really outrageous to get the MPA's Raiders haunches up. And what they. They were never gonna keep that part anyway.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

So they're subverting the system because there is no set standard.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. And they're just the. The stuff they want to keep in is comparatively.

[Chuck Bryant]

Exactly.

[Josh Clark]

More palatable.

[Chuck Bryant]

And if you don't have the set standard where you can go, and I wonder what those sheets look like on the interior. You know, I mean, that's the great mystery.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Surely they have their own interior standards. They're not just like, watch it and see what you think.

[Josh Clark]

Well, they have group discussions too.

[Chuck Bryant]

Man, I'd love to sit in on those.

[Josh Clark]

So the. I read another criticism of MPAA is that the difference between PG13 movies and our movies these days is the profanity and the sexuality. That they're similar in violence, if not more violent in PG13 movies. And that this is kind of messed up that the MPAA has very little problem with violence. But when it comes to bad words or sexuality of almost any nature, except for women being objectified and men being gratified, then the MPAA suddenly puckers up.

[Chuck Bryant]

Well, yeah. A woman achieving, receiving sexual gratification or a homosexual couple.

[Josh Clark]

NC17.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Virtually guaranteed. Or depending on how they do it, R. If it's coming out of like one of the major studios.

[Chuck Bryant]

So in other words, a man can receive pleasure from a woman. And of course it's scrutinized somewhat because any kind of sex is more heavily scrutinized than violence.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

But if a woman does like you said, or if it's a gay couple, it's all over. So homophobic, misogynistic, you decide.

[Josh Clark]

Right. And fetishistic of violence, you know.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Like here's one example. There's a great article called don't expect any major changes to the MPAA rating system in 2014.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

And it's basically Chris Dodd, who's the new head in the gang, digging in and saying, you know what? We talk to your average parents and we poll them and this is what they want.

[Josh Clark]

But they haven't released.

[Chuck Bryant]

No, none of those studies are released.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

None of those conversations are released. A movie like Philomena, which you saw, was rated R. Yeah. It was about a lady looking for a long lost son.

[Josh Clark]

It was so far from an R movie, it was ridiculous.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. But it had a couple of F bombs in it. So they cut those out and they bring it to a PG13. You might think who cares? Cut the F bombs, make it PG13. But there's something bigger going on here, you know?

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, There's a great A.V. club article about how just totally out of step a lot of the ratings are and they. They have 15 movies listed and basically talk about their ratings. Like the first one they talk about once.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

That romantic. It wasn't like a romantic comedy, was it?

[Chuck Bryant]

No, I would say it was a bittersweet, just a modern day romance told through music.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

It wasn't a musical, but there are a lot of musical numbers.

[Josh Clark]

Highly inoffensive love story.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah, very sweet movie.

[Josh Clark]

It had the same rating as Hostel 2, which is basically torture porn. They both got the same rating.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. We should read this first line from the A.V. club. In early summer of 2007, two films were released with R ratings. One featured a scene where a naked woman is suspended from a ceiling while another naked woman slashes her with a sith and bathes in her blood. The other featured two Dublin musicians singing songs together, falling in love and opting not to act on it. Like there was never any sex scene. They didn't even get together really. No, they're both rated R. Both rated.

[Josh Clark]

R because of profanity.

[Chuck Bryant]

Rushmore, rated R for the scene at the end, whether Max is putting on the play, the Vietnam play. And there is a shot of a couple little kids looking at. On. On the set. There's some Playboy centerfolds up in the locker.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Chuck Bryant]

Like on the Vietnam set. And these, it shows these little kids like looking at Those like a 12 year old would probably do.

[Josh Clark]

And it got an R for that.

[Chuck Bryant]

Got an R for that happiness.

[Josh Clark]

Todd Sollins, one of my favorite movies of all time. Yeah, they tried to give it an NC17 rating and he said, you know what, I'm not cutting anything. You can just go take a long walk off a short pier is what I think he famously said to them.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And he released his movie as unrated.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh, really?

[Josh Clark]

Yep.

[Chuck Bryant]

I don't think I knew that.

[Josh Clark]

Way to go, Todd Sollins.

[Chuck Bryant]

Or if you're looking at some serious homophobia, the great 1989 movie and longtime companion features no real sex acts at all, nothing explicit. In fact, the A.V. club says it could show on network TV today with just a few alterations. But it was about a gay couple and so it got an NC17.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, there's something called Afternoon Delight, which was a movie about a woman who hires a gigolo.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And it apparently is heavy on the. The woman receiving sexual gratification. It got an R rating. Yeah, despite. And it got an R rating after apparently the director cut a lot of stuff out and the director said, what the hey. After Wolf of Wall street came out.

[Chuck Bryant]

Like, have you seen this movie with.

[Josh Clark]

Like some very graphic apparent sex scenes between a man and a woman? Yeah, but Leonardo DiCaprio is the one enjoying it the most, so it's fine. It's an R. Right. Blue is the warmest color.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Last year that teenage lesbian love story, NC17. Yep. Got a lot of attention. And there were some theaters that allowed high school age kids to go see.

[Josh Clark]

That anyway because again, this isn't law. It's not binding. It's up to the theaters.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. It's just so strange that such a small group of people have such influence on such a large industry.

[Josh Clark]

The more you dig into it, the more conflicts of interest arise and the more arbitrary the standards become, the more blood boiling it is. I highly recommend you go read some stuff like Rated R for ridiculous by Kirby Dick. His little. Yeah, his little op ed about mpaa. That one US News and World Report article you wrote or suggested was good.

[Chuck Bryant]

I wish I wrote it.

[Josh Clark]

Had you been there, would have been used correctly.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh, did they misuse it? What?

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, I know, that's terrible.

[Chuck Bryant]

So the MPA will defend themselves and they say that there's no such bias and that we. All these objectionable scenes are rated on the graphic quality and how graphic it is. But if you just look at the. You'd have to be a dummy not to see these correlations.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Chuck Bryant]

And the fact that they don't seem to care that much about violence in this age where. I don't know, does it influence people to go shoot up a school? Who knows?

[Josh Clark]

Did you see that John Oliver quote that's going around?

[Chuck Bryant]

Yes, but what was it?

[Josh Clark]

It's like somebody unsuccessfully tries to carry a bomb onto a plane in their shoe. We all take our shoes off.

[Chuck Bryant]

Oh, right.

[Josh Clark]

There's like 30 something school shootings after Columbine and absolutely nothing's changed.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Or the Onion article that's going around too now is this is something that can't be prevented. Says the only country where this kind of thing happens all the time. Something like that. I'm paraphrasing.

[Josh Clark]

Oh yeah, that's the Onion.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah. Good stuff. Mpa. Keep. Keep doing the fighting. The good fight.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, Go check out like just go start reading up on it. It's funny how much we just take this stuff for granted, but when. Just start digging just slightly beneath the surface at the very least. See this film is not yet rated. It's really good. Yeah, really engrossing. And you know, for every hundred documentaries that come out, what five of them are like, really great. Most of them are pretty good. Some are terrible. So any really good one is worth seeing just in and of itself.

[Chuck Bryant]

Agreed.

[Josh Clark]

If you want to learn more about the MPAA, type those letters into the search bar. House2works.com and I said search bar. So it's time for listener mail.

[Chuck Bryant]

I'm gonna call this Wild Parrots. Josh mentioned in the tattoo podcast that he had heard parrots like to hang together when free, and I wanted to burst in the podcast booth and tell you about the wild parrots of San Francisco. I'm not going to get into it, except to say that over the course of my life, the parrots in San Francisco were a sort of living legend that one would occasionally get the privilege of spotting now and then. However, about three years ago I moved in with my aunt in the little San Francisco suburb of Brisbane and apparently the famous flocks of parrots were also making their home there. Since it was warmer and less windy, these parrots were often hanging right outside my bedroom window. Which is pretty amazing. Or no. She says amusing. I say it's amazing, but also somewhat annoying. Especially since my first son was just a little guy then and a very light sleeper. And these suckers are loud. That is true. They are very loud. Also, guys, I'm sending you the link to watch the Preview of the 2003 documentary the Wild Parrots of Telegraph Hill. So I didn't know that was a documentary.

[Josh Clark]

I've heard that. I've heard of that before. I never knew what it was about.

[Chuck Bryant]

Amy, I will check that out.

[Josh Clark]

Thank you.

[Chuck Bryant]

Thank you for. For writing it.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, thanks a lot Amy. If you have a documentary recommendation, we are always interested in those.

[Chuck Bryant]

Heck yeah.

[Josh Clark]

You can tweet them to us@syskpodcast, you can post them on facebook.com stuffyshouldknow and you can send us an email to stuffpodcastowstuffworks.com and as always, join us at our home on the web. The beautiful stuff you should know.com for.

[Chuck Bryant]

More on this and thousands of other topics visit howstuffworks.com.

[Malcolm Gladwell]

This July 4th, celebrate freedom from spill stains and overpriced furniture with Annabe. The only machine washable sofa inside and out. Where designer quality meets budget friendly pricing sofas started just $699. Making it the perfect time to upgrade your space. Annabe's pet friendly stain resistant and interchangeable slipcovers are made with high performance fabric that's built for real life. You'll love the cloud like comfort of hypoallergenic high resilience foam that never needs fluffing and a durable steel frame that stands the test of time with modular pieces you can rearrange anytime. It's a sofa that adapts to your Life. Now through July 4th, get up to 60% off site [e-mail] Every order comes with a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not in love, send it back for a full refund. No return shipping, no restocking fees. Every penny back. Declare independence from dirty, outdated furniture. Shop [e-mail] Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Chuck Bryant]

Imagine a toilet so striking it inspired a couture dress. Well, the Kohler Veil Smart Toilet in Honed Black actually inspired creative director and fashion designer Laura Kim to create a stunning chiffon dress. The Veil Smart Toilet, with its curved design, deep rich textural color, touchscreen remote control and customizable cleansing features, can transform your routine into something extraordinary. And we all deserve extraordinary design changes everything. Vail Smart Toilet in Honed Black only from Kohler Discover the Vail Smart Toilet and go behind the scenes of Kohler's partnership with Laura Kim at Kohler.com the Disney Plus Hulu Max bundle it's the.

[Walton Goggins]

Ultimate bundle for an unbelievable price plan.

[Chuck Bryant]

Starting at $16.99 a it.

[Walton Goggins]

And watch Marvel Television's Iron Heart on Disney Plus.

[Josh Clark]

I want to build something iconic.

[Walton Goggins]

A new season of the Bear on Hulu.

[Unknown]

We can make people happy.

[Walton Goggins]

And the epic A Minecraft Movie on Max.

[Unknown]

Anything you can imagine is possible.

[Chuck Bryant]

The Disney Plus Hulu Max bundle plan starting at $16.99 a month.

[Walton Goggins]

All these and more now streaming terms apply. Visit DisneyPlus Hulu Max bundle.com for details.

[Josh Clark]

This is an iHeart podcast.