Wetlands! Wetlands! Wetlands!

Summary

Stuff You Should Know: "Wetlands! Wetlands! Wetlands!"

Podcast: Stuff You Should Know
Hosts: Josh Clark and Chuck Bryant
Release Date: March 20, 2026

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Episode Overview

This dripping-wet edition finds Josh and Chuck diving deep into wetlands—what they are, why they matter, and the fascinating science and culture around them. Sparked by a listener suggestion (shout-out to Tom Peterman, “the foul-mouthed wetland biologist”), the show walks through the types, biology, history, and significance of wetlands in the U.S. and beyond, all with the duo’s signature humor and warmth.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

What Makes a Wetland a Wetland?

• Definition & Core Feature:
  Wetlands are defined by the presence of water—either permanently or seasonally—that saturates the soil, creating a unique, often anaerobic (low-oxygen) environment.

  “What makes a wetland wet? Water. And then he says, in all seriousness, that's basically it.” – Josh (04:00)

• Hydric Soil:
  Wetlands are characterized by hydric (water-saturated) soil, promoting anaerobic processes and favoring water-loving (hydrophytic) plants.

Biodiversity and Importance

• U.S. Wetlands Stats:

  • Only 5% of U.S. land, but home to 31% of plant species.
  • 1/3 of America’s threatened/endangered species live exclusively in wetlands.

  “Although wetlands make up only 5% of the land surface in the United States, they are home to 31% of our plant species.” – Chuck (04:27)

• Endangerment:
  Much of wetlands' endangered status is linked to human-driven filling, draining, or repurposing since the 1600s—losses dramatically slowed only after the 1970s’ environmental movement and the Clean Water Act.

  “It’s like looking at land or ecosystems and being like, are humans making money off of it? No. Well, then drain it and repurpose it…Luckily, since the environment movement really started in the 70s, we realized that's not necessarily true.” – Josh (06:47)

Types of Wetlands

• Coastal Wetlands:

  • Marshes: Transition zones between inland and ocean; include salt and brackish marshes.
  • Tidal Marshes: Affected by tides; support salt-tolerant grasses (“salt marshes”).
  • Mangrove Forests: Noted for their spectacular, tangled above-water roots.

    “If you've been sleeping on mangroves, welcome to reality.” – Josh (13:23)

• Inland Wetlands:
  Examples include:

  • Swamps (forested and shrub): Fed by rivers or rainfall; iconic habitats for diverse wildlife and plants.
  • Marshes: Often ephemeral, filling up seasonally with rain or snowmelt.
  • Vernal Pools: Temporary, non-fish habitats ideal for amphibian breeding.
  • Prairie Potholes: Glacial depressions in the Midwest, crucial for migratory birds.
  • Desert Wetlands: Playa lakes, rare water oases in dry landscapes.

• Special Wetlands:

  • Bogs: Acidic, anaerobic, low-nutrient peatlands (fantastic preservation for “bog bodies”).
  • Fens: Less acidic than bogs, nutrient-rich, fed by groundwater.
  • Mud flats, seeps, oxbow lakes (“billabongs” in Australia): Diverse formations with unique ecological roles.

Fascinating Adaptations: Life in Wetlands

• Hydrophytic Plants' Survival Tricks:
  • Cattails: Channel air from leaves to roots using aerenchyma, enabling roots to survive in low oxygen.

    “The cattail can have as much roots as it wants down in this anaerobic soil. It doesn't matter because it's getting its oxygen from the air through the leaves.” – Josh (32:52)

  • Speckled Alder: Has lenticels for oxygen intake.
  • Salt Marsh Grasses (e.g., cordgrass): Excrete salt through their leaves.
  • Mangroves: Employ multiple tricks—above-water roots (“knees” or pneumatophores), salt excretion, and oxygen transport.
  • Carnivorous Plants: Bogs' harshness encourages evolution of bug-eating plants (e.g., Venus flytraps, pitcher plants).

Why Wetlands Matter: Human and Ecological Benefits

• Flood & Storm Surge Protection:
  Wetlands act as natural “sponges,” absorbing and slowly releasing water, reducing the severity of floods and hurricanes.

  "An acre of wetlands can hold up to about a million and a half gallons of water. Just one acre." – Josh (40:38)

• Water Filtration ("Kidneys of the Earth"):
  Wetlands naturally filter pollutants and sediments from water—comparable to millions of dollars in water treatment plants.

• Wildlife Habitat & Biodiversity:
  Essential for fish (75% of U.S. commercial harvests rely on them), birds (migration and nesting), amphibians, and more.

• Economic Value:
  Wetlands underpin industries from fishing and hunting to eco-tourism.

Threats & Conservation

• Historic and Ongoing Losses:
  Draining for agriculture, urban development, and perception as “wasted land” have drastically decreased wetlands.
• Land Use & Policy:
  • 75% of U.S. wetlands are privately owned, with limited regulatory protection—extra local advocacy is needed.
  • Policies like stream buffers hinge on local politics.

What Can You Do?

• Personal Action:
  • Leave wetlands alone if you own land.
  • Support/contribute to conservation groups (e.g., Ducks Unlimited, Wetlands Initiative, NRDC, Wetlands International).
  • Vote for local representatives prioritizing wetlands protection.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Humor & Banter

• “Maybe these wetlands were born to run.” – Josh (03:04)
• “If you've been sleeping on mangroves, welcome to reality.” – Josh (13:23)
• “They're called prairie potholes, but they're not small like our prairie potholes.” – Chuck (15:31)
• “Little mouths, little slitty mouths.” (re: alder lenticels) – Chuck (33:23)

Insightful Explanations

• “It's anaerobic because there's water there instead of air. The air can't be in there because the water's there. Ipso facto, anaerobic. I just think that's brilliantly simple.” – Josh (31:08)
• “They call wetlands the kidneys of the earth.” – Josh (42:49)

Poignant Realizations

• “If you like gator tail, buddy, you better preserve those wetlands.” – Josh (44:16)
• “Man, if there's anything that characterizes humans in the 20th and 21st centuries, it's too much of us.” – Josh (46:26)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:37] – Episode begins; theme and shout-out to Tom Peterman
• [04:27] – U.S. wetland statistics and biodiversity
• [06:47] – Human-driven wetland loss; shift to conservation
• [08:10] – Hydric/anaerobic soils explained
• [09:33] – Coastal wetlands: marshes, saltwater, and tides
• [11:53] – Mangroves: unique structures and adaptations
• [14:02] – Inland wetlands: swamps, marshes, prairie potholes
• [17:08] – Desert wetlands: playa lakes
• [20:27] – Inland swamps, Okefenokee adventure story
• [23:37] – Bogs, fens, and the science of preservation
• [26:43] – Other fun wetlands: mud flats, seeps, oxbow lakes (“billabongs”)
• [29:02] – Wetland hydrology: how water arrives and departs
• [30:50] – Wetland plant adaptations: from cattails to carnivores
• [39:10] – Importance: flood control, filtration, wildlife, threats
• [46:34] – What listeners can do, local activism and conservation
• [49:23] – Listener mail: The first “SY5K” community event

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Resources Mentioned

• Conservation Organizations: Ducks Unlimited, The Wetlands Initiative, NRDC, Wetlands International
• Read More: Prince of Tides (Pat Conroy), WKRP’s Venus Flytrap, history of DC, Okefenokee Swamp

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Tone and Takeaways

With irreverent humor and genuine wonder, Josh and Chuck convey that wetlands are not just “swampy wastelands”—they’re vital, vibrant ecological powerhouses that deserve understanding and protection. They stress personal and community action, plus the importance of local policy, closing with encouragement for engagement on behalf of these crucial environments.

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This summary covers all headline content, major discussion points, scientific highlights, and memorable exchanges. Skipped sponsor breaks and non-content sections.

Transcript

[Josh Clark]

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[Chuck Bryant]

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[Charles W. Bryant]

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[Chuck Bryant]

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[Charles W. Bryant]

Hi everybody.

[Chuck Bryant]

Chuck back again with another edition of Leave number eight in our Think Spring Playlist. And today you're going to be learning all about wetlands because the name of the episode is Wetlands. Exclamation point. Wetlands, exclamation point, Wetlands, exclamation point.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Can you tell we love Wetlands I

[Chuck Bryant]

think you will too.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Welcome to stuff youf should know, a production of iheartradio's how stuff works.

[Josh Clark]

Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's Charles, and Jerry's over there. And this is stuff you should know. The dripping wet edition in these wetlands. What?

[Charles W. Bryant]

I knew that you would not get that.

[Josh Clark]

Is that a Seeger reference?

[Charles W. Bryant]

Oh, gosh. Why do you have to say Seeger when you always mean Springsteen?

[Josh Clark]

Was that Springsteen?

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, it's Badlands.

[Josh Clark]

Oh, okay. Maybe these wetlands were born to run.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Sure. Run water.

[Josh Clark]

I don't like myself anymore. Run water. That was a great save, Chuck. Thanks. So we're talking wetlands. I have to say we have to give a shout out to Tom Peterman, the foul mouthed wetland biologist who keeps asking us to do this episode.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Oh, is that where this came from?

[Josh Clark]

It was a Tom Peterman suggestion. Although I had already wanted to do it anyway, so.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, I mean, we love our earth sciences, man. This one was. I was just smiling from ear to ear researching this.

[Josh Clark]

Can you imagine watching a blacksmith forge something in a wetland in a flooded woodland?

[Charles W. Bryant]

No, I just. That's nirvana right there.

[Josh Clark]

It really is. So we're talking wetlands, everybody. And Dave Ruse helped us put this one together. And Dave likes to pop in jokes every once in a while. And he said. He said, what makes a wetland wet? Water. And then he says, in all seriousness, that's basically it. That the water has to be largely present at least some parts of the year in the soil in such amounts that you would call something wetland. I mean, think of the name wetland. It's about as earthy a term as science gets.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, and he front loaded this with a few stats. And I won't go through all of them, but I'll go through a few that kind of are instructive as to why I love wetland so much. Here's one. Although wetlands make up only 5% of the land surface in the United States, they are home to 31% of our plant species. Yeah, not bad. One third of America's threatened or endangered species live only in wetlands.

[Josh Clark]

I would propose that that's slightly misleading. I think they're endangered because they live in wetlands. And wetlands are endangered, as we'll see. Hmm. Mm. Think about it, Chuck.

[Charles W. Bryant]

I don't know. I took it more as like they're

[Josh Clark]

all hiding out in the wetlands because it's a terrible place to hide out.

[Charles W. Bryant]

No, it's not bad because it's got 31% of the plant species. I mean, it's a Pretty rich biodiverse area to live in if you're an endangered species.

[Josh Clark]

For sure.

[Charles W. Bryant]

All right, you said tomato. I say tomato.

[Josh Clark]

We'll have to hear from Thomas Peterman, the foul mouth wildlife or wetland biologist who can let us know.

[Charles W. Bryant]

What does he say? Like do f in wetlands already? Yes, that kind of thing. Yeah, I like this guy.

[Josh Clark]

I think that's an exact quote.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, he's my kind of dude.

[Josh Clark]

So another stat that I thought was pretty interesting that just kind of needs to form the basis or the undercurrent of this whole episode is that. So we keep talking about the US there's wetlands found all over the world of different types and varieties and different climates and different continents. Every continent except Antarctica. But in the United States in particular, we have a long history of filling in and, and draining wetlands for other purposes.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

So much so that. Let's see. I believe. I don't know how much we've lost, but in the 1600s, the lower 48 states were covered with 220 million acres of wetlands, which is 11% of the total surface area of the lower 48 states. And I think starting in the 50s, we were doing away with wetlands at a rate of about 60,000 of those acres per year.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. And it's gotten better since then. But yeah, in the boy, up until the Clean Water act, it was just like, hey, you know what would look great there? A resort with like three golf courses and a bunch of tennis.

[Josh Clark]

That's been such a driving force. Like it's. It's like looking at land or ecosystems and being like, are humans making money off of it? No. Well, then drain it and repurpose it. Set it on fire and repurpose it. Stop it from burning and repurpose it. Like, if we can't make money off of it, it can't possibly be useful. And luckily, since the environment movement really started in the 70s, we realized that that's not necessarily true. That even if you are just a heartless dummy, there's still a lot of benefits that humanity's given from things like wetlands that seem problematic or non productive, you know?

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, that was one of Dangerfield's big lines in Caddyshack as Al Servic was. Golf courses and cemeteries. Two biggest waste of prime real estate.

[Josh Clark]

That's a good one.

[Charles W. Bryant]

So let's talk about wetlands. You said that they are only. Some of them are only wet for short periods, sometimes when there's snow melt or just rain.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, those are called ephemeral wetlands, which is a cool term.

[Charles W. Bryant]

It's a great term. Some are wet all the time. And the key parts of being a wetland, or the key characteristic is that it's either permanently or periodically flooded or wet, and that the soil has got. It's called hydric soil and is dominated by anaerobic processes, meaning it loves water, and the plants there love water, which

[Josh Clark]

is weird because you used another word that shouldn't really jibe with plants, and that's called anaerobic, which means there's very little to no oxygen present. And we'll explain why later. But the fact that there are plants means that those plants have adapted to the wetlands.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yes. And it makes them anaerobic conditions, hydrophytic. And we'll talk about those plants later. It's another. Another thing I love about wetlands is just that it really underscores the remarkable evolution that something will go through to survive.

[Josh Clark]

Very cool.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Very, very awesome.

[Josh Clark]

Yep. So there's also. So. But you hit upon something like they're not necessarily wet year round. Right, right. So there's a whole bunch of different types of wetlands or wetland environments that fill those. That. Check those boxes. One of the ones that most people think of when they think of wetlands are coastal wetlands, like marshes. And a marsh is basically like this area between inland and the ocean. It's like a transition zone, a buffer zone. And because it's. Because of its proximity to the ocean, it's usually salty or at least brackish, which is a mixture of saltwater and fresh water. And one of the ones that really come to mind, if you're thinking coastal wetlands, you're thinking marshlands, and you're thinking tidal marshlands. Probably. Especially. Especially if you're a Pat Conroy fan.

[Charles W. Bryant]

What was the name of her character that he repeats over and over in a whisper?

[Josh Clark]

I think I remember Chuck. It was Bobby Jim. Bobby Jim.

[Charles W. Bryant]

This is one of those scream at the. At the Pod Player moments.

[Josh Clark]

Was it in the Prince of Tides? Yeah.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Loewenstein. Was that it?

[Josh Clark]

You're sure it wasn't Bobby Jim?

[Charles W. Bryant]

I think it was Lowenstein.

[Josh Clark]

Was it his. Oh, his shrinks? His shrink girlfriend's name?

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, Babs.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. Yeah. I don't remember.

[Charles W. Bryant]

I think it was Lowenstein. All right, so anyway, tidal marshes. Yes. Prince of Tides. They obviously, it's because they're tidal. They're going to come in and out with the high and low tide. And like you said, they're generally salt water. And the salt marshes are very nutrient rich, and they do have a lot of diversity, but obviously only the kind of things that can tolerate the salt as far as plants and animals go,

[Josh Clark]

which is a pretty short list really, because salt is not conducive to life. Instead, there are some plants that have figured out how to deal with salt. But most of the time when you're looking at salt marshes, you're looking. The plant life is basically grasses of some sort.

[Chuck Bryant]

Right.

[Josh Clark]

There's also freshwater tidal marshes, which they are either connected to the saltwater marsh, but they're far enough inland that the saltwater doesn't make its way in there. So it's a freshwater marsh, but it's still affected by the tides. And then I had no idea about this. And I used to vacation on Lake Erie, but apparently the Great Lakes are so big that they have tides themselves. You didn't know that?

[Charles W. Bryant]

I had no idea I even knew that. And I'm a dum dum when it comes to the Great Lakes.

[Josh Clark]

Well, Chuck, I think you got me beat big time.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Well, in this case, because I could

[Josh Clark]

know a million other things about the Great Lakes. And if you knew that one thing and I didn't, you had me beat.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, I knew that. And so that means that they do have those tidal marches. The Florida Everglades are another good example. And boy, Florida just. There's a lot of different types of wetlands in Florida.

[Josh Clark]

Well, there's a lot of coastline.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, a lot of coastline. And a lot of interior wetness.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, we have a lot of wetlands around our place in Florida for sure. And there's mangroves and all sorts of stuff that we'll talk about.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Well, we're at mangroves. I love those things.

[Josh Clark]

So mangroves.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Beautiful.

[Josh Clark]

I think they at least deserve the short stuff because they're one of the most amazing plants of all time. But they're, they're a. They're a type of coastal. Coastal wetland themselves. A mangrove forest where if you've never seen a mangrove forest, they're these kind of. They have a growth habit for the shrubbery on top of like the hair that Oompa Loompa has in the original Willy Wonka, the good one. And the trunks split out into these cool like long roots and legs that stick up out of the water. And they form this huge tangle, this riot of like woody shrub. And they do all sorts of amazing things to help the aquatic life and us humans as well up on land just by being present.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, they're really cool looking. And this is another good one. Sort of like the origami that if you're able and you're sitting still to look Up a lot of these things as you go. Because these mangrove forests, it looks like a shrub that's like, I really want to be a shrub, but I don't want to get wet. So I'm just going to dip my legs in a little bit.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, that's really great.

[Charles W. Bryant]

It's just very cool looking. And again, just the adaptability that these mangroves really want to live where they live, even though it's not very suited for them and they become suited for it.

[Josh Clark]

Right. If you've been sleeping on mangroves, welcome to reality.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Well, that's a T shirt if I ever heard one.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, it could use a little work, but there's the beginnings of one in there.

[Charles W. Bryant]

You also got your inland wetlands. These are not coastal. In this case, we're talking about swamps and marshes and bogs and fens, F, E N and marshes. A lot of these you'll find near rivers, near streams, lowland depressions. And they might periodically fill up depending on rain, what's going on, or different types of flooding that might happen. And they can be a few inches deep. They can be several feet deep.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Most of the non tidal inland marshes are ephemeral wetlands.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. So.

[Josh Clark]

So they're dry a lot of the year. They might fill up seasonally. They might fill up with the rains. They might fill up with the nearby river flooding.

[Charles W. Bryant]

It's like my backyard.

[Josh Clark]

And they. Oh, really? Is that right?

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. It doesn't drain. Well, I've got a drainage problem.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. To you, it's a problem. To nature, it's wonderful because we like things that drain really quickly and dry and then we can walk on them and the grass is fine. But there's a lot of like, benefits to things that take their time. Like there's something called a vernal pool, which is a kind of non tidal marsh, an ephemeral wetland. And it's basically just like say a stretch of woods that's a little bit depressed there. So that when it rains or a river floods, it fills with water. And because the underlying bedrock or clay is not very porous, it takes a while for that water to go through. But that water is also not going further downstream. So it prevents flooding from being as bad as it could because a lot of the water collects and stays there. And it also slowly recharges the groundwater. And because it does get dry, it can't sustain fish, which makes it a really great nursery for things like newts and salamanders and frogs, things that fish eat their eggs. But since there's no fish, this Is like a really great place for them to get a good foothold and a brand new life.

[Charles W. Bryant]

You've also got your prairie potholes. This is one you should definitely look up. These are usually in the upper Midwest of the United States, the Dakotas, Minnesota, maybe Wisconsin. And these are where glaciers, ancient glaciers, left these big depressions in the landscape. And they fill up sometimes during rain, during the spring, during snow melt. And they're not small like our prairie pothole. And I got a vision in my head. But if you look it up online, they're beautiful. And just they're very large though, and they're kind of interconnected, just these big round holes scattered through like a big open area full of water. And these are great for migrating birds because that could be a stopover that they might not have had had those potholes not been there.

[Josh Clark]

And when they're flying over the Dakotas, they say, look, I see Van Nostren's house, our buddy Van Nostren. And then there's also, we said that wetlands occur in all different kinds of climates. They also occur in the desert. There's something called Playa Lakes, which are these depressions that apparently no one has any idea exactly how they formed. It could have been from erosion, it could have been from an ancient sinkhole. But there are depressions that are deep enough that when the seasonal rains come, the water is held in there. And just like the prairie potholes, it's very useful for migratory birds to stop over AT can really plays a huge role in this ecosystem where there's almost no water and now all of a sudden there's water and it's in this nice little lake. So let's all go gather there and have a social hour. But responsibly. Six feet apart.

[Charles W. Bryant]

That's right. I think we should take a break and we will talk a little bit about inland swamps right after this. You know what?

[Chuck Bryant]

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[Josh Clark]

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[Chuck Bryant]

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[Josh Clark]

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[Chuck Bryant]

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[Josh Clark]

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[Charles W. Bryant]

All right, so inland swamps. We promised to talk about that. These are for my money, some of the coolest areas in the country. Because I, I think I talked about it at some point. But I took a very special fun trip many, many years ago to the Okefenokee Swamp and did one of those canoe trips where you have to rent. You know there's no place to stop in the Okepenokee Swamp. If you're like Mmm. I think I'll camp here. It's like in the water, right? So they had these camping pads built up, essentially just decks that are like six feet above the water. And you have to reserve those. They're not just wide open for anyone because there's nothing else out there. So you have to reserve them for specific nights on these specific pathways or, you know, paddle ways. And me and a couple of buddies did it one year and we canoed from deck to deck and.

[Josh Clark]

Very cool.

[Charles W. Bryant]

It was amazing. Like, one of the coolest trips I've ever taken.

[Josh Clark]

That is very cool. Was Ned Beatty with you?

[Charles W. Bryant]

No. But you do wake up surrounded by alligators. It's a little creepy.

[Josh Clark]

Yes, alligators are very creepy.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Like, you wake up on that pad and pee off the dock and they're growling at you.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. And you do not want to get too close because they can move faster than you think.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, they can. It was a lot of fun, though. But not for the faint of heart. Cause you know, you don't realize till you get out there A, how bad the sun is gonna beat you up because there's no shade, and B, how tough it is to paddle all day long without, like, you know, let me get out and stretch my legs.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Charles W. Bryant]

I mean, there is no getting out. You just go and go and go. And by the time you finally reach that janky deck, it is like, might as well be the Plaza Hotel, you know.

[Josh Clark]

Oh, nice.

[Charles W. Bryant]

But what I'm talking about in the case of the Okefenokee, I thought it was a forested or a bottomland hardwood swamp. You'd think from reading this, but apparently it's called a non riverine swamp forest. And that is a forested swamp that fills up from non river sources, basically rain or groundwater.

[Josh Clark]

Right, right. So what would make a forested swamp like a bottomland hardwood swamp is a proximity to a river that floods its banks or that so so big it kind of spills over into some of the surrounding land. And that surrounding land is swamp.

[Charles W. Bryant]

I want to look that up, though. I'm not quite sure Dave's right.

[Josh Clark]

Oh, well, it's okay. It's so it's either river fed or groundwater fed or precipitation fed. And if you're talking bottomland hardwood swamps, that's. Or a river fed swamp. There's usually also a shrub swamp, which is a transition or buffer zone between the forested swamp and, you know, somebody's backyard, which is. It's just dominated by shrubs, but it's all the. All freshwater swamp.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. I think. I bet you anything The Okefenokee has several different types of. These would be my guess because there were full on lakes that we paddled through. Yeah, so that would be my guess. And I also think if I had a country band, we would be the bottomland hardwood swamp rats.

[Josh Clark]

Oh, that's a good one.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Not bad.

[Josh Clark]

That sounds like an all star band, you know.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Oh, sure.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. So another kind of wetland that you're gonna find all over the place, especially in Europe, which when I think of bogs and fens, I think of Europe, but apparently plenty of them in the United States too. But bogs and fens are kind of their own thing. Bogs in particular are very unique as far as wetlands go because not only are they anaerobic, which by definition wetland is anaerobic soil. They're like very little nutrient and very high acidity. I've heard like the kind of acid that is put out by the peat that's created in the bog has the same acidity roughly of vinegar. Yeah, it's really, really acidic stuff. And yet some plants prefer it. Like you can grow cranberries and blueberries in a bog. Sure. You can preserve a body from the Iron Age forward in a bog.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Did we ever cover that, the bog bodies? I feel like we did. Maybe it might have been one of our videos, things on YouTube, maybe mummies.

[Josh Clark]

Because I think if I remember correctly, our mummy episode covered more than just Egyptian mummies. I think it covered like Inca mummies

[Charles W. Bryant]

and the bog people.

[Josh Clark]

I'm sure we did. We saw some then when we went to, on our, our UK trip, we got to visit some of those cats like firsthand, like right there in that, in that glass. Right. Like, you know, all you have to do is smash it with a hammer and it's yours.

[Charles W. Bryant]

You got a bog person.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Or at least whatever you can grab like a bog ear.

[Josh Clark]

Right. Just crumbles in in your hand. But I was looking, I was like, okay, why, why are the, the, the bogs so great for preservation? Part of it, from what I understand, is that acidity that the bodies are actually pickled. But another part is the, the aerobic life is so devoid there. There's just anaerobic bacteria and they don't decompose nearly as well as aerobic bacteria, so the decomposition doesn't set in and the remains are pickled. So like you can preserve a body in a really great state for a very like Toland man. His whiskers are still intact on his face. Yeah, like that was the level of preservation. And he was sacrificed Into a bog, which is a very specific kind of wetland.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. And a fen. Like I said, it's F E N. It's sort of like a bog in that it is a peaty wetland. But they're a little bit different than bogs. The water supply doesn't come primarily from rain and it comes from the ground. So it's not. It's going to be less acidic because I don't think we mentioned. I know it's partially because of the peat, but the acidity also comes from the fact that there's acid and rain that gets filling up, that fills up these bogs.

[Josh Clark]

Right.

[Charles W. Bryant]

But not the case in a fen.

[Josh Clark]

No, no. Because that groundwater is able to kind of diluted a little bit. So they're much more nutrient rich than a bog is. So they're going to have much. A much wider diverse range of plants and animal life. Yeah.

[Charles W. Bryant]

And this, I love that this next section from day was called Other fun types of wetlands.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Mud flats.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, you got your mud flat. It's another good country band.

[Josh Clark]

My favorite are seeps. These are just gorgeous little pieces of nature, if you ask me. If you have a spring that comes up out of the ground, it spills over into the ground. So the surrounding ground is wetland and it's called a seep.

[Charles W. Bryant]

That's right.

[Josh Clark]

It's where gnomes go and shower.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. And it's not like you said, it's a spring. So it's not like a creek. No, it's actually coming up from the ground. You ever drink from a natural spring?

[Josh Clark]

I did when I was a kid and I think my mom fired the babysitter that took us to drink from a spring. Yeah. She was like, what are you doing? It was either a spring or like a river in Ohio. Either way, two very different things.

[Charles W. Bryant]

If it was Cuyahoga river, then you're in bad shape.

[Josh Clark]

It was on fire while we were drinking.

[Charles W. Bryant]

But I mean, we have creeks. If you're listening. You've never been to Atlanta. Atlanta has creeks all over the place. Like all of the in town neighborhoods just are riddled with creeks. They're just sort of out of view. But we have a creek 120ft from our house.

[Josh Clark]

Sure.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Which might have something to do with our drainage. Who knows?

[Josh Clark]

And it's spring fed.

[Charles W. Bryant]

No, it's just, you know, just a part of the Atlanta probably all comes from the Chattahoochee at some point.

[Josh Clark]

Sure. So, Chuck, if that creek behind your house started meandering in a different direction and left a body of Water where it originally flowed, it would be an oxbow lake. But if you were in Australia and you were calling it its proper Aboriginal name, you'd call it a billabong.

[Charles W. Bryant]

A billabong, which I had no idea.

[Josh Clark]

What does that have to do with surfing?

[Charles W. Bryant]

Oh, I think they just probably co opted the name and it became more associated with surf and surf gear than its true meaning.

[Josh Clark]

That doesn't seem right.

[Charles W. Bryant]

No, let's take it back.

[Josh Clark]

But that's what an oxbow lake is in Australia, among the aborigines, it is a billabong, which is great.

[Charles W. Bryant]

A billabong that was some like along with OP was one of the prime T shirts to have when you were a kid in the 80s.

[Josh Clark]

Oh yeah, if you were cool. I had this amazing OP long sleeve blue shirt that I wore with my parachute pants.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, those were the best.

[Josh Clark]

My British knights.

[Charles W. Bryant]

I remember those long sleeve OP shirts.

[Josh Clark]

Yep, they were good.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Gorgeous.

[Josh Clark]

So, Chuck, one of the things we've been talking about is the kind of the, the characteristics that make a wetland a wetland. And it's not just the fact that the soil table or the ground is either flooded or almost completely flooded up to the surface level with water. That's, that's not the entirety of it. Like different wetlands are characterized by, by how that water gets to it. Like we said, you know, some kinds of swamps are fed by groundwater, others are fed by precipitation, some are tidal. So there's a whole group of scientists out there that are called wetland hydrologists. And what they study is how that water gets into a wetland to create a wetland, what happens to it while it's there, and then where it goes and how all these things kind of interact to form this very unique ecosystem.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, and we talked early on about the, the kind of soil, hydric soil is saturated with water. And so if it's saturated with water, it's not going to have nearly as much oxygen. And usually oxygen and soil are in these little tiny air pockets.

[Josh Clark]

Remember we talked about that in our soil episode.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, exactly. And in the case of a wetland, then those air pockets are going to be filled with water or just collapsed altogether. And then you've got your anaerobic condition. But if you're a plant, you need CO2 and oxygen and you'll get a little bit of that from photosynthesis in the leaves. But the roots are like, what about me down here? I need oxygen too. And if it was an aerobic soil like we talked about in the in the Soil podcast, the roots can get it from those air pockets. But in wetlands, they have to really, really adapt to become hydrophytic or water loving plants in some pretty amazing ways.

[Josh Clark]

So I just have to say that this is like a lifelong mystery solved and solved in like the simplest way possible. Like it's anaerobic because there's water there instead of air. The air can't be in there because the water's there. Ipso facto, anaerobic. I just, I just think that's brilliantly simple.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Did you get that intuitively? Because I never did. I always thought it was something mysterious. Like we're talking about a whole different type of soil or something else.

[Charles W. Bryant]

No, I think I got it.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. Well, it was. I've been around for 44 years and wondered it until just now.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Well, I'm 49, so I might have learned that in the last five years.

[Josh Clark]

So the plants that we're talking about, like they, like you said, the roots still need oxygen. So they've said. Okay, well, I really like it here. I like this wetland area. This is pretty amazing place to live. I'm gonna change so that I can stay here. And some of the ways that plants have, have adapted. Well, one good example is a cattail. Right. Cattails are pretty much synonymous with marshlands. Yeah, they're beautiful. They're that long, thin stem with like a big fat thing on top. Like a hot dog that's ready to be roasted on the fire.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, I grew up with those. I don't know if it was a southern thing, but they can be decorative items in the home. And I grew up, I feel like with a lot of cattails in vases and stuff.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. So that and wasps nests.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Hornets nests.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. So cattails have this thing called erinichium. No, I've got erenicuma, erenicima, Erenicima. I think I got it. Anyway, they're like these, these channels that basically direct air from the leaves and the stem and every other part of the cattail down to the roots. So here you go, roots. Here's some oxygen. Fresh from the leaf.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

So that, that cattail can have as much roots as it wants down in this anaerobic soil. It doesn't matter because it's getting it's oxygen from the air through the leaves.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. One of my favorites is the speckled alder. You just look up a picture of that and they have these enlarged pores called lenticels, and they allow for the passage of oxygen directly into that wood. And if you look up a picture and you see Those, you go, oh, that's what those are. That's what those are for. They look like someone took a knife. And they're just tiny little horizontal slits all up and down the Alderman.

[Josh Clark]

I gotcha.

[Charles W. Bryant]

And it's.

[Josh Clark]

It's.

[Charles W. Bryant]

They're breathing, basically.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, that's creepy as heck, but it's really neat.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Little mouths, little slitty mouths.

[Josh Clark]

So the. The grasses that we talked about growing in salt marshes, just like an iguana sneezes out excess salts as part of digestion, things like cord grass that grow in these salt marshes, they actually excrete salts through their leaves so they can sit there and intake all the nutrients they need from this salinic environment and still not get overloaded with salt. It's just pretty amazing that they can do that.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. And then to me, maybe the most amazing. And this is where the mangroves kind of come back in. Although the mangroves apparently utilize all these to stick around. But the bald cypress, they grow in those forested swamps where there's always water. And they are deciduous conifers. And they grow this root structure that they call a knee. It's a pneumatophore, but like a knee on your leg is how it's spelled. And they just sit above the water line and take in oxygen. And that's what those, I guess, mangroves. Mangroves. There's a Soul Train joke in there somewhere.

[Josh Clark]

It struck me as like a terrible jam band's name.

[Charles W. Bryant]

The Mangroves.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Charles W. Bryant]

God, you're right. That plays somewhere in Florida. Probably.

[Josh Clark]

Probably.

[Charles W. Bryant]

But the mangrove uses, like I said, a lot of these tricks. And I think certainly when you see those roots, they're using those knees.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. Which is basically. It's a way to get oxygen from the surrounding air down to the roots. The mangroves do it, the bald cypresses do it. Mangroves have all those adaptations, different species, they can do things like excrete salt. They can draw oxygen in from the environment. They have channels where they can pump oxygen from one part of the plant to the other. The one that gets me, though, I'm just fascinated by bogs. So we said that it's an acidic, anaerobic, nutrient depleted environment, and yet there's still plants that live there. And one of those plants or one kind of plant is carnivorous plants. They get their nutrients not from, like, the soil, but from eating bugs.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, those are cool.

[Josh Clark]

So they can just live there. Like a pitcher plant or a Venus fly trap or something like that.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, those are neat. Nature.

[Josh Clark]

Wasn't Venus Flytrap one of the DJs on WKRP.

[Charles W. Bryant]

That's a great DJ name.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, he. Well, he was a great DJ.

[Charles W. Bryant]

All right, so let's take our final break and we'll talk about why wetlands are important and what you can do to help them do their thing. Right after this,

[Josh Clark]

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[Chuck Bryant]

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[Charles W. Bryant]

Okay.

[Chuck Bryant]

Terms and conditions apply.

[Josh Clark]

Okay, Chuck, so just the fact that wetlands are as amazing as they are means that they should be saved. But there's also, like, a lot of benefits that we figured out. Like you said, the 50s to the 70s were a really rough time for wetlands in the United States because we were filling them in for cropland, for real estate. And even previous to that, we filled in a lot of marshland in the US and built cities over them. Like DC Was built largely on marshland. The fact that mosquitoes tend to live in wetland areas kind of justified filling in a lot of the wetlands because we were dealing with malaria at the time. So it made a lot of sense. Get rid of the mosquitoes habitat, you get rid of the mosquitoes. And it worked. But we've paid a heavy price for it because over time, we've realized these wetlands provide some really important benefits to the local ecosystems and in turn, humans who live around them.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, I mean, helping flood conditions is a big one. They are big, big natural sponges when it comes down to it. And flooding would be way, way worse. And we still have floods, obviously, but it'd be way worse if we didn't have wetlands. They'd be far more destructive if they weren't around to soak in that excess water and then kind of slowly trickle it to the water table below. And the same is obviously true of hurricanes and big storm surges. The wetlands basically operate as big storage tanks for water.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah, I saw somewhere, I can't find it now, but like, oh, there it is. An acre of wetlands can hold up to about a million and a half gallons of water. Just one acre. So you gotta think like, that water's staying put there and it's not flooding some human habitation instead, which is a good reason to keep wetlands around just for that. That buffer area or to slow down the surge, like you were saying. I also saw that we found out the same thing goes for beaver dams that they build. They're like a temporary artificial wetland, and they provide a lot of the same functions that natural or other. I Guess naturally occurring or growing wetlands provide, too. And I think we should do a whole episode on beavers, okay?

[Charles W. Bryant]

Oh, totally. I'm way into beavers.

[Josh Clark]

So water filtration is. Is another. Is it water? I'm getting you back for the origami thing. All right. So water filtration is another big service that wetlands provide. I don't remember where we talked about this, but we talked about it recently where the water. Oh, I think it was water treatment plants.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

The water's brought in, and it's got all this sediment and gunk and muck, and it's cloudy and turbid, and then it slows down. They slow it down, like running it through some grates or whatever. And as it slows down, the sediment that is making the water turbid and polluted and everything has a chance to settle the bottom. Well, wetlands provide that same function naturally. So when you have a bunch of, like, polluted water basically come through there, that it slows down when it hits all those mangrove roots or tree trunks or whatever it is, and it gives it a chance for that sediment to fall to the bottom. It gets sucked up by the tree roots and stored in the trees. Or the microbial life can break a lot of that stuff down, too. And there's definitely a limit to where you can very easily overload the. The wetlands ability to filter the water. But if you. If you gave it, like, a manageable supply, that is a major service that it does, is it cleans our water. They call wetlands the kidneys of the earth.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. And they. They've even done studies where they tried to, I guess, sort of monetize what an area of wetland might do if it were a treatment plant. And there's one in South Carolina called the congaree bottomland hardwood swamp. These are just all country bands, for sure. Is. They said that that is basically equivalent to about a $5 million water treatment plant just sitting there being a wetland, doing its thing.

[Josh Clark]

Thank you, nature.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Pretty amazing.

[Josh Clark]

I saw that beavers provide the dams that they build that end up being temporary wetlands. Somebody estimated it's worth about 100 grand. If a human tried to build an artificial one, which we do that. If you just let beavers do their thing, they will. They will do the same thing for free.

[Charles W. Bryant]

That's right. You don't have to pay them 100 grand.

[Josh Clark]

Nope. There's also. Because there's so much going on in a wetland, there's so much life, they kind of form like these metropolises for all sorts of different types of animals on all the way up the food chain, including plants, animals, microbial life, worms, fish, larger predators like dolphins and alligators, and all of them are sitting there providing food for us. If you like gator tail, buddy, you better preserve those wetlands.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. Dave points out here that the commercial fishing industry in the U.S. 75% of the fish and shellfish harvested here had fish that at least had a temporary home in the wetlands. And that recreationally, if you're a recreational fish person, fisher, person, then 90% of the US fish catch is at least the breeding ground lies in the wetlands for those fish.

[Josh Clark]

And the same thing goes for birds, too. They're enormously important habitats for birds, some permanent, but also migratory too. Because if you're flying along and you're a bird and you are a water bird and you need a place to land, not only are you looking for water, but you might really enjoy a swamp because it offers protection from predators, it offers a port in the storm. It's just an all around valuable thing for birds, too.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. I mean, imagine flying from Canada to Texas and you're going over Oklahoma, you're a little tired, you look down, you see one of those. Which ones were those? The prairie playas?

[Josh Clark]

The. No, the prairie potholes.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Prairie potholes?

[Josh Clark]

Yeah.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Oh, man, what a sight.

[Josh Clark]

Aren't you describing a scene in Jonathan Livingston Siegel?

[Charles W. Bryant]

Probably so. So the point is, we need to take care of our wetlands because they are a threatened, diverse, very useful place all over the world, especially here in the United States. And if they are threatened and if things happen, there are going to be all kinds of bad things. You know, vegetative damage, the plant life just being maybe whitened out, wiped out altogether.

[Josh Clark]

Storm surges being way worse, flooding being way worse. It especially helps to see the value in them if you consider them a buffer zone between us and the hardest ravages of nature. Yeah.

[Charles W. Bryant]

And like you mentioned, pollution, there is a limit, but they do absorb and mitigate levels of water pollution. And they just can't take too much of us, you know?

[Josh Clark]

Right, exactly. Which. Man, if there's anything that characterizes humans in the 20th and 21st centuries, it's too much of us.

[Chuck Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

You know what I mean?

[Charles W. Bryant]

What can we do, though? Well, besides donating to wetland projects, we can definitely do that.

[Josh Clark]

You can definitely do that. There's some good ones out there. I believe Ducks Unlimited is one of them. The Wetlands Initiative, Natural Resources Defense Council, Wetlands International. But apparently in the United states, something like 75% of wetlands are on privately owned property. And in the United States, we have. I mean, private property is one of, like, the fundamental tenets of American society. So if you say, I want to fill in this wetland and kill off these beavers, you're allowed to do that. Whether that's a good idea and whether that's going to affect other people, that's a different story. So if you own private property with a wetland on it and you're doing just fine with that wetland, leave the wetland alone. It's very important.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, I guess this is where it gets a little tricky in definitions, because in plenty of places there are restrictions on building near water like this.

[Josh Clark]

Sure.

[Charles W. Bryant]

I guess I just don't know. Like, you can't build in a flood zone. You can't. I mean, it depends on where you are, but in Atlanta, you can't. And then with all these creeks and streams, in Atlanta, they have what's called stream buffers. 50 foot, 75 foot, 100 foot. And I think 25 is the lowest. And for these, you have to get variances to do anything which your neighborhood has to approve. And I talked to a guy that apparently anything over anything under 75ft is pretty tricky to get approved. So I don't know if they're wetlands or not, but there are restrictions on stuff like that.

[Josh Clark]

Okay, so that brings up the next point of what you and I and everybody else can do, which is vote for people to local elected office who part of their platform is protecting wetlands. Yeah. Like all of those buffer zones, all those variances and all those prohibitions. Those are. Those came from Atlanta city councils over the years that decided that wetlands needed protecting. You don't find those everywhere, but once they get put in place, they usually don't get repealed very easily. So if you make preserving wetlands part of, like, what you're voting for, that would have an impact for sure.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

And whatever you're voting for, just vote. Okay. Vote especially local, to say that I know everyone.

[Charles W. Bryant]

The presidential elections are always the big sexy votes, but the local politics matters even more almost sometimes.

[Josh Clark]

Yeah. I vote for all of it. Take an interest in the. In your society.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah.

[Josh Clark]

Okay. Well, you got anything else about wetlands? Nope. I don't either. This is a good one. I'm pretty happy with it. And since I said that, everybody, it's time for listener mail.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. I'm gonna call this the first SY5K.

[Josh Clark]

Oh, yeah. Did you see these? Yes, man. Congratulations to everybody who took part.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah. So what happened was some stuff you should know. Listeners got together and put together a 5k stuff youf should know 5k. And we got periodic updates from Aaron, Huey, Mizel, or Mizell. Not sure how you pronounce it.

[Josh Clark]

I'm going with Mizel Mizel.

[Charles W. Bryant]

But this is. This is the. The final email about how it went. Hey guys, want to let you know that the SY5K is over. It was so nice to look at everyone's pictures and hear what episodes of Stuff you Should Know they listen to. That was the idea. I imagine some people might have fudged that and listened to Marc Maron or whatever.

[Josh Clark]

That's not like they're disqualified.

[Charles W. Bryant]

I think a lot of us have suffered from a lack of human connection at this time, and the silly little virtual event gave us something to bond over. I don't think I would have tried this with any other group of people. The Stuff youf Should Know army is wonderful and it speaks volumes in regard to you guys. The tone that you set in your podcast, interesting and funny, carries over into your fan base and has created little lovely corner of the Internet. I totally agree, Aaron. And the same can be said of the movie Crush page. Very, very good people. Not snipey or rude and going after each other on Facebook, which is kind of what Facebook seems to be all about.

[Josh Clark]

Oh yeah, it's like a garden paradise over there on the Sysk army page.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Yeah, it's great. Now, I'm not suggesting that you made these people wonderful, but the average stuff you Should Know Army Bimmer is like that. Interesting, funny, and willing to participate in a virtual 5K with a complete stranger.

[Josh Clark]

And they love stroopwafels.

[Charles W. Bryant]

I even bought 13 stuff youf should Know stickers to send out to some people as prizes. It's just a little thing, but everyone that I've been in touch with has been exceedingly kind. This is what we need right now, these small human connections. A podcast to listen to and laugh with, a walk run bear chase to do virtually with a bunch of near strangers. And a Stuff youf Should Know sticker to put on your fridge or on your laptop. If you get a chance, go to the event page and scroll through some of the posts. They're delightful. Like the woman who did our 5k at 3 months postpartum and crushed it.

[Josh Clark]

Nice.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Or the dad who pushed his adorable daughter in her stroller on the 5K while listening to his favorite episode, which was spam. We had first timers. Yeah, it was a good one. We had first timers. People recovering from injury, runners and walkers. So many smiles and stuff you should know T shirts sign off for now, but just write to tell you is a success. We might even do it again with love. And that is again from Aaron Huey Mizell and that is great. Aaron. Thank you for doing this and that really does speak to to the quality of our listeners in every single way.

[Josh Clark]

Indubitably. Yeah, thanks a lot Aaron. It's good to hear from you and everybody who participated in the SY5K. You are the champion, our friend.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Even if you listen to Marc Maron.

[Josh Clark]

But maybe not what Chuck just said. That's it. Okay, well if you want to get in touch with us like Aaron did and do something interesting, we want to hear about it. You can write to us in an email to stuffpodcastheartradio.com

[Charles W. Bryant]

Stuff youf Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio's How Stuff Works. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app.

[Josh Clark]

Apple Podcasts are Wherever you listen to

[Charles W. Bryant]

your favorite shows,

[Chuck Bryant]

You know you could be adored by everyone and still completely ignored by your cat. Trust me, I know. But if you feed your cat Sheba, you can go from being ignored to truly adored in 12 days, guaranteed or your money back. Shiba has a full menu of products, appetizers, entrees, treats, even a kitten's menu. It's so cute. So Sheba has a product for even the pickiest eater, like Shiba Puree. It's made with bone broth. They are chef inspired flavors. It's got a smooth and creamy texture that cats love and contains no corn, wheat, soy or artificial flavors. It's food that your cat's gonna love. To learn more, check out shiba.com that's S-H-E b a.com this episode is brought to you by Audi. We all know that feeling. A change of plans, a new opportunity. Instead of overthinking, what if you just said yes with the all new Audi Q3? The answer is easy. It's made for the yes life. With the power and room to handle whatever pops up. Yes to adventure. Yes to right now. Because saying yes without hesitation, that's real luxury. The all new Audi Q3 made for the yes life. Learn more at audiusa.com Military life isn't predictable, but earning your Master's degree can be.

[Josh Clark]

With American Military University's 40 flexible online

[Chuck Bryant]

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[Josh Clark]

while you get market ready.

[Chuck Bryant]

Learn anywhere, anytime with an education built to keep pace steady, reliable and always accessible.

[Charles W. Bryant]

Plus, military service members, veterans and their

[Josh Clark]

families can save up to 45% on

[Chuck Bryant]

master's tuition with AMU special rates and grants. Learn more at AMU Apus. Edu Steady Through Every Mission this is an iHeart podcast.

[Josh Clark]

Guaranteed Human.