The Release - Ep. 4

Summary

Suave: Episode 4 – "The Release"

Introduction

In Episode 4 of the Pulitzer Prize-winning podcast Suave, hosted by Futuro Media, listeners are taken through the pivotal moments surrounding Luis "Suave" Gonzalez's release from prison after serving over three decades. This episode delves deeply into Suave's transition to life outside, his relationships, and the unexpected challenges that arise as he seeks to rebuild his life.

Navigating Personal Relationships

The episode opens with an intimate discussion between Maria Hinojosa and Suave's ex-wife, David Louise Suave Gonzalez, highlighting the complexities of Suave's personal relationships post-release.

David Louise Suave Gonzalez [01:33]: "I don't think you guys have really talked about this, but we have to talk about it. Is your relationship. She is a journalist."

Luis Suave Gonzalez [02:26]: "But when that happened, I was like, I was sad. I got sad. I was almost crying on the phone with you. Cause I know what it is to lose a loved one."

This segment underscores the tension between professional boundaries and personal emotions, as Suave confronts the lingering connections from his past life.

The Day of Release

The narrative shifts to November 20, 2017—the day of Suave's release from Greater Ford Correctional Facility. Accompanied by Reverend Roger Zeppernik and Maria Hinojosa, Suave faces unexpected physical distress during the journey home.

Suave [05:28]: "I don't believe I'm embarrassing myself."

Suave's car sickness serves as a metaphor for his internal turmoil and the overwhelming nature of newfound freedom.

First Steps into Freedom

Upon his release, Suave heads to Esperanza Academy in Philadelphia's Badlands, fulfilling a personal goal to speak to the youth in his old neighborhood. His speech is a powerful apology to the community he once harmed, reflecting on the personal and financial costs of his incarceration.

Suave [07:59]: "First thing I want to do is I want to apologize to y'all, because When I was 16, 17 years old, I offended in this community."

This moment marks Suave's attempt to reconcile with his past and contribute positively to his community.

Reconnecting with Family

The episode portrays the emotional reunion between Suave and his niece, Jennifer, at a Colombian restaurant, illustrating the strain his imprisonment placed on familial relationships.

Tony [10:12]: "You know, in my business, you see these young kids get in trouble. ... I couldn't do it for my little brother."

The reunion is bittersweet, highlighting both the joy of reconnecting and the unresolved guilt Tony feels over his inability to protect Suave during his incarceration.

Establishing Independence

Suave secures a position as the director of a new drug treatment and resource clinic in the Badlands, a significant step towards rebuilding his life. Despite the unchanged challenges in the neighborhood, Suave remains determined to make a difference.

Suave [13:37]: "Because the location where we are, we're in a hot spot. We're in a hot spot."

His role signifies both his commitment to his community and the daunting reality of systemic issues that persist.

Building a New Life

As Suave adjusts to life outside, he experiences the small freedoms he once took for granted, such as choosing his meals and living independently. His relationship with Maria evolves, revealing the deep emotional support they provide each other.

Maria Hinojosa [26:59]: "I look in the mirror every morning and tell myself, you are beautiful. I love you."

This section emphasizes the importance of self-love and personal affirmation in the healing process.

Relationship with Angela

Suave rekindles a relationship with Angela, a woman from his past, sparking both hope and underlying tensions. Their reunion showcases the complexities of forming new bonds after long-term incarceration.

Maggie Freeling [19:17]: "She's got style, for sure. Like, she's got the braids happening."

Their relationship begins positively, with Suave finding comfort and understanding in Angela, who shares a similar tough upbringing.

Strains and Conflicts

Despite initial happiness, Suave and Angela's relationship faces strains as external pressures surface. Angela expresses frustration over Suave's shifting priorities and his deepening connections with new acquaintances.

Maria Hinojosa [31:35]: "You don't call anymore when you were listening. Call me at least once or twice a week."

These tensions highlight the challenges of maintaining personal relationships amidst the chaos of reintegration and emotional healing.

Clash and Downfall

The episode reaches a climax when Angela confronts Suave about his lingering connections with Maria, leading to a heated exchange that jeopardizes Suave's stability. Miscommunication and jealousy escalate the conflict, revealing the fragile nature of Suave's newly rebuilt life.

Angela [33:10]: "You're married to her now."

Maria Hinojosa [42:06]: "I'm done. I told her I found a holy boss. I'm done."

The confrontation serves as a turning point, illustrating how past relationships and unresolved emotions can disrupt progress.

Conclusion

Episode 4 of Suave encapsulates the tumultuous journey of reintegration, the delicate balance of personal relationships, and the ever-present shadows of one's past. Through Suave's experiences, listeners gain a profound understanding of the complexities faced by those released from long-term incarceration.

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Suave [07:59]: "First thing I want to do is I want to apologize to y'all, because When I was 16, 17 years old, I offended in this community."

• Tony [10:12]: "You know, in my business, you see these young kids get in trouble. ... I couldn't do it for my little brother."

• Maria Hinojosa [26:59]: "I look in the mirror every morning and tell myself, you are beautiful. I love you."

• Suave [13:37]: "Because the location where we are, we're in a hot spot. We're in a hot spot."

• Angela [33:10]: "You're married to her now."

• Maria Hinojosa [42:06]: "I'm done. I told her I found a holy boss. I'm done."

Production Credits

Suave is produced by Futuro Studios and distributed by PRX. The production team includes Maggie Freeling, Julieta Martinelli, Aaron Moselle, Michael Simon Johnson, Zoe Malik, Zakiya Gibbons, and others. Special thanks are extended to contributors from various organizations supporting the narrative.

Support and Acknowledgments

Support for this podcast is provided by the Art for Justice Fund, Rockefeller Philanthropy Advisors, and the Heising Simons Foundation. These partnerships help unlock knowledge, opportunity, and possibilities, ensuring the continuation of impactful storytelling.

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This summary captures the essence of Episode 4 – "The Release" of Suave, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to the episode, while highlighting key moments and emotional beats through notable quotes and structured sections.

Transcript

[Maria Hinojosa]

Futuro.

[Maggie Freeling]

Season 2 of Suave was made possible by the Mellon Foundation. Mellon makes grants to support visionaries and communities that unlock the power of the arts and humanities. To help connect us all [e-mail] When I founded Futuro, I imagined a home for journalism with radical transparency. I wanted a newsroom where I wasn't the only Latina behind the mic. Now Futuro is becoming a home for more voices than ever. Help grow this future by joining our new membership program. You'll get exclusive interviews, whole season binges behind the scenes chisme shape the future of storytelling. Join Futuro. Visit our website futuromediagroup.org joinplus ET not EVA.

[Progressive Insurance]

Suave is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. You chose to hit play on this podcast today. Smart choice. Make another smart choice with Auto Quote Explorer to compare rates from multiple car insurance companies all at once. Try [e-mail] Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in all states or situations. Prices vary based on how you buy.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

I don't think you guys have really talked about this, but we have to talk about it. Is your relationship. She is a journalist.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Yes, I know that. I knew that from the day I met her.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And some people might see your relationship and think that this is an unprofessional journalist, you know, kind of relationship. You can't befriend your sources. And I want you guys to talk about that.

[Maggie Freeling]

To me, it's just. I mean, to me, and I know that this is hard for you to hear. I know that this is hard for Suave to hear. But a friendship. A friendship means I can call Suave at any time and say, oyeme, Suave, Mira esto paso. You know, this happened with my son or, you know, my father died. I could never call Suave to ask for whatever I may have needed. Suave couldn't be there. He couldn't be there for me in that sense.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

But when that happened, I was like, I was sad. I got sad. I was almost crying on the phone with you. Cause I know what it is to lose a loved one.

[Maggie Freeling]

So after you came to Chicago to your question, we were talking more about this relationship between journalist and source and Suave. Actually, it was the first time that he said publicly, he was like, oh, no, no, no. I was very clear. I was becoming friends with a journalist.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Yes.

[Maggie Freeling]

And I remember being like, okay, Suave.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

It has advantage in prison.

[Maggie Freeling]

So it was a strategic decision.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

So it is almost like you both had a strategy behind what you were doing.

[Maggie Freeling]

I had a Strategy, that's me.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Well, she did too. You were her source.

[Maggie Freeling]

No, I had a strategy.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

My strategy was here's a journalist that's not scared to tell the truth. So if anything go on in the prison, I could always pick up the phone and call Maria.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

So now you're not in prison and he's not in prison. So you're not getting inside stuff and you don't need her anymore. Now what?

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

That's not the case. That's not the case. It should be that way, but it's not. Because when you invest in somebody, like for 30 something years, I said, maria can sit here and tell you, well, you know, but I always kept the journalist. But I always tell people, on November 20th, when I came home, only my true friends was there. It was Maria, my brother, my lawyer, and the chief of staff to a state rep that I was working for. So if that's what journalists do, then I appreciate that. So I know she's a journalist, and I always knew that. But I also knew that if I got out of prison, there could be a friendship.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

From Futuro Studios and prx, this is Suave, a podcast about juveniles sentenced to die in prison, told through One Man's Journey. I'm Maggie Freeling. David Louise Suave Gonzalez was sentenced to mandatory life in prison without parole for a crime committed when he was 17 years old. He was found guilty of first degree homicide. This is his story of incarceration, redemption, and an unusual relationship between a journalist and a man convicted of murder. We're back at the day of Suave's release. November 20, 2017, right before Thanksgiving. And Maria, you Suave, leave Graterford in the backseat of Reverend Roger Zeppernik's car. He's Suave's longtime mentor.

[Maggie Freeling]

You know, Suave imagined this moment so many times, like being able to look back and see the walls of greater Ford shrinking in the distance. And to get to that place that. That life that he had always imagined as a man who was free. Ish.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Yeah, he's out, but still on lifetime parole.

[Maggie Freeling]

And then like, maybe, I don't know, like 10 minutes later, the entire mood changes because Suave starts getting violently car sick. And he's basically just puking into a bag sitting right next to me.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

I don't believe I'm embarrassing myself.

[Maggie Freeling]

Like, sweetie, take a deep breath.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

You ain't got a seatbelt on.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Oh, you're an expert, right?

[Maggie Freeling]

He just took his face out of the bag to tell him to put his seatbelt on.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Eventually you guys all decide to pull over and let Suave get some air.

[Maggie Freeling]

Suave, we can stop, take another breather.

[Maria Hinojosa]

There's a place here I can pull over.

[Maggie Freeling]

Overcito, it's okay, Suave. Let it out. Oh, man.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Don't tell nobody this part.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

The first thing on Suave's agenda this very first day out of prison is to head to Esperanza Academy in Philadelphia's Badlands. And this was on his bucket list to speak to youth in the neighborhood he grew up in.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

I don't even remember walking into a school other than cutting class. So this is crazy. They got uniforms.

[Maggie Freeling]

So Suave walks into the high school and, you know, we walk into this, like, small auditorium and, you know, there's kind of like this. He's here, he's here, he's here. And Suave starts, you know, again, he gets very teary eyed, and somebody, one of the people who works in the school just comes up and gives him a hug, and then it's his turn to be on stage.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Please give a big welcome to Luis Suave Gonzalez.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

First thing I want to do is I want to apologize to y'all, because When I was 16, 17 years old, I offended in this community. Y'all feeling the ripple effect of the crime that I committed because it costs almost 35, $36,000 to incarcerate. Bill. Add that up by 31 years. How many people we could put through college with that type of money? How many books we could buy computers? So before I get started with my story, I just want to let y'all know that I failed my community. As a man, I caused a lot of harm. I hurt a lot of families. And as a leader, I failed y'all. So I apologize, and I hope y'all accept my apology. This is my first and last chance. Because if I mess up right now, I will go back to prison for the rest of my life.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

After the school visit, Suave and his welcome crew all head to lunch at a Colombian restaurant. Swavi's niece Jennifer meets you all there. He hasn't seen her since he was arrested.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

She was this high when I. Yeah, she was.

[Tony]

Yes, she was.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Jennifer, how old are you now? Sit over there. Tell them to sit over there. She was 23. She was two years old. Two years old. Two years old.

[Maggie Freeling]

So we're all eating together in this long table. I mean, it's so joyous. Like, Suave's friends are showing up, family supporters, and everyone is just, like, ecstatic.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And Suave seated between you, Maria and Tony, his cousin, who he always Called his older brother. They kind of drifted apart when he was in prison, you know, their lives were really different. Tony became a cop.

[Tony]

You know, in my business, you see these young kids get in trouble. You try to talk to them and see them the right way. And some I was able to. And I'm like, I couldn't do it for my little brother. You know, he was young man, you know, maybe able to grab him and say, you know, what are you doing? You know, and maybe he has said the right words or so I kind of felt. I've been carrying that guilt for a long time.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

For a long, long time. Here we go, man. And I know that part of it. That my family distanced themselves. The ones in New York was probably more out of embarrassment because I. I understand that, man. I embarrassed them and then I just embarrassed them by being in jail for drug dealers or something. I embarrassed by being in jail for.

[Tony]

Murder, you know, and you gotta notice. You gotta. You have to know this. I was never, ever embarrass me, ever, ever. So I don't want. Not ever. The guilt that I carried all those years, not being able to keep you out of. Out of. For what happened to you. I felt guilty for that. Because I'm older. I was supposed to protect. I did, and I'm sorry.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

A week after his release, you check in on Suave. He's moved into a halfway house and has an internship lined up.

[Angela]

Sorry.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Yes.

[Angela]

Okay, I got you.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Okay. I'm at work.

[Angela]

What I'm gonna get. You're at work?

[Maria Hinojosa]

I'm at work at the state rep's office.

[Angela]

You mean you're doing your internship?

[Maria Hinojosa]

Yes, I'm back at work. You know, regular citizen now.

[Angela]

That must feel great.

[Maria Hinojosa]

But it's good. It's good. You know, my niece. My niece took me. My knees run these ghetto beauty salon. Ghetto beauty salon. They got all these Dominican girls. They do hair and the beauty salons. So she tried to give me a haircut. And you believe this lady tried to dye my hair? I got up and left. She messed my. Messed myself up, man. I was kind of mad. I got up and left. I told her, man, you better take this stuff out my head. And I got up and left.

[Angela]

Oh, swabby.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Yeah, I know she was trying to be nice, but don't do that to me.

[Angela]

She wanted to take away the gray hair.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Yeah.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Money. I never been under no machine with hot stuff all in my hair, thinking I'm burning or something.

[Angela]

I do that every three weeks, swabby.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Within a few weeks, suave goes from Internet to manager. He's got a job as the director of a new drug treatment and resource clinic in the Badlands. He manages the staff and daily operations.

[Maggie Freeling]

And, you know, the reason why he gets this job is basically that there were people who were too afraid to take any job in the Badlands. In fact, even the contractors who were working on the building asked that before they did any work that they would have security cameras set up because they were afraid. But Suave says this is exactly the community that needs this kind of center.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Because the location where we are, we're in a hot spot. We're in a hot spot. People don't want to come down here. That's why they paid me good to come down here to work.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Suave says the neighborhood hasn't changed since he went away. Actually, the violent crime rate in Philly today is comparable to New York's in the 80s. And the Badlands still has one of the highest rates of heroin use in the whole country.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

It's almost like I'm back in 1986. There's no difference. Anything. And I just saw one of my sisters, and I was telling her this. Like, when I went in, you was getting high. And that was like, 31 years ago. I came out, and you still getting high. You know, you've grown in age, but you're still doing the same old things.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

The only thing that's really changed is Suave and how some people here view him after his release. He says, especially women.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Well, it. It's all about you came out of prison and you Superman. This is what it's all about.

[Angela]

I don't understand. What do you mean you're Superman?

[Maria Hinojosa]

Listen, I don't understand it either.

[Angela]

What do you mean they think you're Superman? Like, they want to touch you because they think you're gold?

[Maria Hinojosa]

Yes, yes, it's real funny. Just awkward. You know, I keep asking myself the same question. Everywhere you go, is somebody throwing themselves at you?

[Angela]

Come on, Swavy.

[Maria Hinojosa]

A lot of girls, Maria. A lot of girls, Maria. Believe me when I tell you I do not chase these woman. I do not chase.

[Angela]

They're not dogs, swabby.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I know, but listen, I've tried to stay away from all these girls from the past.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

So it seems like Suave's finding himself up against a different type of pressure that he just hadn't expected. He's trying to juggle all of these things after his release, getting his life on track. Work, family. And suddenly, he's also got to deal with something a lot More personal.

[Maggie Freeling]

It's this question of his manhood. Like the idea of what the world, or at least like his world and the people around him expects a man who spent three decades behind bars to be like. And Suave says, yeah, the attention from the women is flattering. I mean, he hasn't been able to really be physical with a woman in such a long time. So it's very tempting on a surface level, but it's deeper than that because Suave says that in fact, being kind of chased by women gives him anxiety. It's like he feels like he's pressured to perform so that the people around him, you know, won't have doubts about his manhood.

[Angela]

I mean, I can't believe that you just said, I don't want anybody to think I'm gay. And I'm like, seriously, Swami?

[Maria Hinojosa]

No, because Maria, somebody's a girl asked me, she said, dan, I'm throwing all this thing. You just redesigned what you get. I heard people that come from jail is gay. Then we end up having. Then we end up having like a two hour conversation about that. But yeah, people get that. Like, you've been in jail that long and, you know, and you don't want this. What's wrong with. And I'm like, no, nothing wrong with you. I just not interested at the time, you know, but you can't talk to people out here about this because they start looking at you funny, they start thinking, what's wrong with him?

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Suave says release is complicated. What he really needs right now is just someone who gets him. He says he might even like to settle down soon.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

I'm pursuing my dreams of having five kids. Five boroughs of New York. I'm gonna name one. Brooklyn, Bronx, Manhattan, Staten Island. Yeah, five boroughs in New York. I'm putting it out there, flipping the next. I say, yeah, I should have at least two kids by 2020. I should have. I want two kids.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And then one day he tells you he has a girlfriend. Suave seems to have found someone who gets him and he's happy.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I go to Planet Fitness every morning at what time? 3. About 5:00 in the morning. Me and Angela go every morning. Me and help make a perfect couple. You know, she's supportive and that's all I need.

[Maggie Freeling]

I mean, the last time we really talked about his love life was when Suave was about to get out of prison and he had these three women that he'd been, as he said, talking to. But now it's down to one, and it's Angela. Angela is the woman that he married very briefly in the early 1990s when he was in prison. They had basically completely broken off from that and gotten a divorce. But now he's back together with her, and he seems to be really happy.

[Maria Hinojosa]

The relationship is, like, starting new. It's like starting new, but, like, we know each other for forever.

[Angela]

I know. That's so sweet, Suave.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Today, Angela works in the call center for aaa, and they first met through Suave's sister. And Angela began to write Suave and visit him at Greaterford. And like Suave, Angela had a tough upbringing. She also grew up in the Bronx.

[Maggie Freeling]

So Suave showed me pictures because obviously I was curious. I was like, so who's this woman who Suave is in love with? And. And honestly, I was proud to see that he was dating someone who was age appropriate. She's actually my age, which is a few years older than Suave. And she's definitely, like, she's rocking it. She's definitely got style, for sure. Like, she's got the braids happening. She's got multiple piercings. She's got tattoos. She's got big ass glasses. She's got some, you know, like, fabulous jewelry. I mean, in many ways, they made perfect sense as a couple.

[Maria Hinojosa]

And we had our first little, if you want to call fight, because my co worker put a picture up of giving me a hug, and this lady got so jealous.

[Angela]

Oh, what?

[Maria Hinojosa]

What? She said, how the hell you gonna put a picture of another woman up there hugging you when you don't even have my picture in you hugging you?

[Angela]

And la, la, la.

[Maria Hinojosa]

And, you know, I don't know how to mess with these phones. So she hit me up on Facebook, messenger method and everything. El sent a message to, but, yeah, buddy, I'm just learning, you know, to deal with adult relationships for the first time. And it's fun.

[Maggie Freeling]

You know, when I speak to him, he says he's really happy that the thing about Angela is that she knows him. Like, he doesn't have to explain anything. And as a result, he feels kind of like, you know, like he can exhale a little bit with this person.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And then February comes, and Suave checks something else off his list.

[Angela]

Okay, you'll probably stay two nights in Chicago.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

So, Maria, for years, every week during the school year, you would travel from New York to Chicago because you were teaching a journalism class at DePaul University. And pretty often Suave would call in from prison and he would speak to your class. So going to speak to them in person was something he told you he dreamed about.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Get. Get it for two nights. Get a cardboard box. I stay in the corner. Oh, don't put me in. Don't put me in no fancy hotel Us, please.

[Angela]

So I can be there.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Can we take the bus? Scared of planes?

[Angela]

You don't have a choice.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Because I'm scared of planes.

[Angela]

You don't have a. I ain't never.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Been on a plane before, Maria, So that's almost. That's almost gonna be like caustic swabi.

[Angela]

First of all, I'll sit next to you. And I've already experienced being next to you when all you're doing is throwing up. So it's not going to be anything new for me.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

After some convincing weeks later, Suave meets you in New York to go to the airport.

[Maggie Freeling]

So how you feeling?

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Nervous. It almost feels like the first day I got out of jail. Nervous? You don't know what to expect. I left with Rhythm Wheel. Sunday, My pillow.

[Maggie Freeling]

What? You wrote a will?

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

I know.

[Natalie Moore]

You're kidding, right?

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

No, No. I researched this for three days.

[Maggie Freeling]

I had such a. I mean, I had to really allow myself to understand the deep fear that Suave had of planes. And, you know, we were kind of joking, dude. You know, you survived 30 years at one of the worst prisons in the country. But what forces you to write the will is when you're gonna get on this plane. And then we sit down and now I start to get a little concerned because it's like he's having a hard time. He's feeling dizzy. He's telling me it feels like he's back in the hole.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And then you take off.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Hold up, Maria.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Oh, my God. Everybody just relaxing. I think I'm the only nervous one here.

[Maggie Freeling]

You are the only nervous one here.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Oh, I gotta play it off then.

[Maggie Freeling]

His eyes are rolling back.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

We off this? We off the ground yet? No.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Oh.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Went so long, I don't even believe I got my feet off the ground. I'm on top of New York.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Oh, my God.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Top of the world.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Oh, my God. Oh.

[Maggie Freeling]

Good morning, swabby.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Good morning. I'm here.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Good morning.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

I was asleep for a minute.

[Maggie Freeling]

You didn't.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Ladies and gentlemen, Delta Shuttle would like to welcome you to Chicago. The local time is 6:05pm this is the first time in a while I can't even remember that I could. I'm gonna be sleeping in a place by myself. I want to see that because it's almost like. It's almost like a feeling. When I get my own apartment. This is the first day that I'm not going to share a bathroom.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I hope not.

[Maggie Freeling]

Who do you think is going to be sharing a bathroom with no folks? Welcome to Chicago. Sorry it took us so long to.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Get in and land.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

It's the best day.

[Maggie Freeling]

Okay, we're here.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

So you take a cab to Suave's hotel, not a cardboard box.

[Maggie Freeling]

The next morning at the hotel, we meet at the coffee shop.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

I took a bath. I haven't taken a bath in like 34 years.

[Maggie Freeling]

Yeah, and you smell like it, too. What was that like?

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

That's like bubble bath, y'all. Yes. Yes.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

You leave the coffee shop and head to DePaul.

[Maggie Freeling]

Now you're walking into the classroom. Hi, guys. Oh, my goodness. This is Suave. Let's make the circle.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Suave is now a pro after giving a TEDx talk and speaking to the academy when he got out. He talks to your class for about three hours. About the same well rehearsed talk he's given before his life. Redemption and prison and Maria. You literally have to drag him out of the room.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Just.

[Maggie Freeling]

Robert, we got to go.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Yes, that's the reason. We got to go. But that's the reason, man, that I'll.

[Maggie Freeling]

Tell them to hold the plane for you walk out.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Because I knew there other people in the street that support me from here.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

As the months pass, Suave is starting to get used to all the things that come with life on the outside. Like the food.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

I think I shitted everything I ate. And gratitude for the last 31 years. Out. I shitted it out. I don't have to eat the same food week after week. I have options now. If I want to eat some fried eggs, I fried eggs. If I want to eat some scrambled eggs. Scrambled eggs. It feels wonderful. This is what life is all about. And I won't trade.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And Suave tries to remind himself of that.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I look in the mirror every morning and tell myself, you are beautiful. I love you. I do that every morning.

[Angela]

I love that. That's great.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I do. I do that every morning. Because I don't need no validation from nobody else. I really don't. I love myself.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

He also gets another job. He starts working as a case manager at a Philadelphia police precinct. And, you know, now he's more comfortable with his freedom. So with a stable job and a girlfriend, he moves out of the halfway house into his own place.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I spent the first week in my own apartment.

[Angela]

So how was that?

[Maria Hinojosa]

Wonderful.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

I like living by myself. I like having my own place, my own rooms, my own little cat. I got a little kitten Named Bella. She's crossing me an awn and a leg.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I never dreamed that it would be this good. Like, it's good. Even the worst. Even the worst day that I have is good.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

But there are some adjustment challenges. Even months after Suave's release.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Sometimes I get frustrated because I'm still. I admit to you, I'm still on jail time. And what I mean by that is that sometimes I get up at 6:00 in the morning and just stand there thinking that somebody gonna come for camp. Then I remind myself, yo, you in your own place. Nobody coming for camp. Like, going to a restaurant and keeping the spoon in my pocket. I've done that a few times. I wrapped the spoon up and put it in my pocket. Listen, I'm constantly. I've done it a few times, and it's embarrassing, but I tell the people that I'm with, like, I. I trust them. I know them. Like, yo, you see me do this, Just tap.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And so around this time, you finally meet Angela. Suave brings her to a dinner.

[Maggie Freeling]

Yeah, and at first it was cool, but then I. I don't know, I started having these concerns because she was in a very bad mood that night. I don't know if they'd had an argument or what happened, but she was just very unhappy to be at that dinner. She even snapped at Suave in front of all of these guests. But, you know, I was hoping for the best because those things happen in a relationship. But still, overall, things are going pretty great for Suave. I mean, he's at peace. He's happy in his own apartment. He and Angela visit each other and stay at each other's places. But in the back of his head, he's, like, letting me know that he's kind of worried that everything happened too fast, too smoothly.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

It scares me that I'm adjusting so well. I see so many other guys suffering and struggling. I'm going up, and I know everything that go up must come down one time.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

We'll be right back.

[Natalie Moore]

I'm Natalie Moore. I fell in love with soap operas when I was just five years old, and I still watch them. They're television's longest scripted series and have zero reruns. Now, let me tell you, soap operas aren't just some silly art form. They are significant in this season of making stories without end from WBEZ Chicago. Join me as I share how the genre began, their social impact, and why these stories endure. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

We're back. It's been months since Suave has been out. And, Maria, I get the sense this is when your relationship with Suave started to change. You know, for the past year, you'd really given Suave a lot of support, helping him prep for life on the outside. You know, you were listening and giving him advice, taking his phone calls, you know, pretty much all the time. And now he's really leaning on you a lot less. Like, he's just not really dependent on you anymore.

[Maggie Freeling]

I mean, I didn't. I don't know if I felt like he was dependent on me. Right? He was. He's a grown man. But definitely, there was, like, a lot of communication. And now I'm kind of looking around, I'm like, okay, so he's got Angela. He's got his girlfriend, right? And, yeah, Suave doesn't. He doesn't need me anymore, really.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Anyway, how you doing?

[Angela]

I miss you. That's what I'm doing. It's like, you don't call anymore when you were listening. Call me at least once or twice a week. You're like, you know, Maria, it's like, I guess you're just too goddamn busy, you know? And it's like, no, no, listen. And I have something like this. You okay? Did something happen to him? How am I gonna fall? Did they come and take him away?

[Maria Hinojosa]

So how you doing?

[Angela]

I'm great. Did you see me on television?

[Maria Hinojosa]

No. What channel?

[Angela]

Msnbc. See? You don't call, so you don't know. You don't follow me on Instagram. You're too busy being on your phone to even talk to your sister.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

You're, like, really freaking out. And you actually sound like my Jewish grandma, guilting me for not calling her enough. Like, this is the first time I hear you really upset like this. I mean, were you really upset?

[Maggie Freeling]

You know, I think what was funny was that, I mean, I was upset. I was a little bit like, wow, I used to be, like, a priority, right? I mean, I was the person that Swabbie was calling all the time. And, like, now you don't call, you don't write. So I was a little upset. On the other hand, I was so happy that he was busy. That was great. But it was actually making me, like, okay, like, you know, you're not the priority anymore. He's got other people he's talking to.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

So in this call, he drops a major bomb on you.

[Maggie Freeling]

Yeah, no, that. Totally not expecting this.

[Angela]

Where are you now?

[Maria Hinojosa]

I'll be in my fiance's house. You want to say something to her?

[Angela]

Oh, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Excuse me? You're just gonna drop it like that? Is that how it is?

[Maria Hinojosa]

Oh.

[Angela]

Oh, I see. Suave. What. What kind of game are you playing with me?

[Maria Hinojosa]

What?

[Angela]

What did you just say to me?

[Maria Hinojosa]

My fiance's house.

[Angela]

What? What do you mean, your fiance?

[Maria Hinojosa]

Oh, yeah. Wow.

[Angela]

Didn't even. Didn't even talk to me. Didn't even, like, Jesus, I'm thinking about. I don't know what you think, but, you know, maybe. Nope.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Were you shocked when you heard this? I mean, listening back to your conversations, I kind of feel like I knew.

[Maggie Freeling]

It was coming, you know, I mean, it freaked me out that he didn't talk to me about this, but I was concerned because I met Angela and she disrespected him in public, and I just wanted him to make the right decision. I didn't want to. I mean, it all happened so fast, just too fast.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

I mean, did you feel like you needed to or, you know, wanted to protect him? I mean, on this call, you even call yourself cis.

[Maggie Freeling]

Yeah. So this was hard because I actually knew that as a journalist and even as a friend, like, I didn't think that my role was to protect him. But now looking back, yeah, I mean, I think I was closer to him than I realized because the dynamics had changed. You know, there wasn't a corrections officer listening into all of our calls. They weren't being recorded anymore. So, you know, Suave and I were now freer to be two people, two adults. And he was sharing stuff with me. So it was changing.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And one day, while you're in the middle of a run, you get one of those very personal calls.

[Maria Hinojosa]

My weakness is woman. You know, I'll be honest with you. It's troubled. It's troubled. It's troubled.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And his fiance, Angela, has noticed, like.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Yesterday, Angela actually, like, who such and such I was straight up, I said, no, that's the girl. They used to come visit me in prison, you know, so. And. And once somebody that you will start doing that, you can, you know, it's going to be coming up again and again.

[Angela]

I think for you to have somebody who's asking you, who is that is. Is for you. Probably reminiscent of something from prison, like a CO being able to ask you anything at any time, and you're having.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Time.

[Angela]

To answer, and you having to answer.

[Maria Hinojosa]

They don't tell you in prison when you're coming home, you want to have to face this and deal with this and deal with relationship. They do not tell you nothing about relationship. And to me, since I've been home, that's the hardest thing I've been dealing with, relationships, period.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

Suave and Angela get married on a weekend in August. That year, only a few people were there.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I think this will work.

[Maggie Freeling]

Well, listen, congratulations. Thank you for sharing the news with me.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Yes, I'm.

[Angela]

I'm not sure exactly how I feel, but congratulations to you.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

In November 2018, to celebrate his one year anniversary of getting out, Suave comes to visit with you for the first time in Harlem, where you live. And that's where the office is, too. So he came and met everyone, including your daughter, Swami.

[Maggie Freeling]

It's.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

Yeah, I finally met her.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

And your dog Walter, huh?

[Maggie Freeling]

He's a miniature pincher. It was one of those, like, dreamy days, you know, where everything is, like, going just right, you know? So here's Suave, who's now in my newsroom. He's meeting people who he had only heard me talking about. He meets my family, and we're, like, walking down the streets of New York City, like, having a great time, just owning the sidewalk. I mean, freedom.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

But that feeling doesn't last very long. Back in Philly, Suave's worried about Angela. He thinks she's set off by the trip to visit you.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Well, I'm even beginning to believe, or to think in these last few days, right? Like, you jealous of me, of what I'm doing in life? Like, really, Like, I'm really beginning to think that, like. Because it's always some negativity coming out.

[Angela]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Maggie Freeling]

It turns out that they've been fighting a lot lately, just, like, nipping at each other. And this is really weighing on Suave's mind. But, you know, he's decided, like, I'm not going to think about that now, because a full year has passed since Swavi's released. It's, you know, Thanksgiving. The year Suave got out, he didn't celebrate. But this year, he's celebrating in Philly at the center for Carceral Communities, which gives therapy to people who have been released from prison. Suave has been spending a lot of time here. He feels really at home. He wants to be with people who he can relate to, who just get him on this Thanksgiving, this is special, man.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

This is special day. You know, I'm with my people, man, with the people I care most.

[Maggie Freeling]

Yeah.

[Luis Suave Gonzalez]

So I'm blessed. America. God bless America. I'm free.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

A couple of days later, Suave calls you and says he's got something important to tell you.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Oh, good afternoon.

[Angela]

Where are you, swabby?

[Maria Hinojosa]

I'm in my house.

[Angela]

I Was concerned because you weren't answering my call.

[Maria Hinojosa]

No, no, my phone was down. I know. I didn't know I had to charge it, so I just put it in charge.

[Angela]

Okay. So I'm very concerned about what's going on here.

[Maggie Freeling]

So I see a message from Suave to me that says, if you see something strange on my Facebook, it's not really me. And so then I was like, what the hell? Wait, what is going on here?

[Maria Hinojosa]

She got this Facebook page, right, with my name that she controls, and she put all this crazy stuff up.

[Maggie Freeling]

Suave.

[Angela]

That's really weird though.

[Maggie Freeling]

Angela, apparently is like making these threats that she's going to call the cops on. Suave.

[Maria Hinojosa]

It started when I put a picture up saying I was out for a year and it was your picture and she wrote a post on it.

[Angela]

What did she write?

[Maria Hinojosa]

She write off if she's the only one that supported you. And I wrote back, absolutely.

[Angela]

Wait, what?

[Maggie Freeling]

She does have a point.

[Angela]

Let me just say, though, she does have a point. I mean, there's a point at which you could say from her perspective, like, if Herman went to spend. If my husband went to spend his one year anniversary of being out of prison with a journalist that he knew from the inside, I think I might be like, what the hell are you doing? You're going to be what? An argument could be made that she has the right to question that.

[Maggie Freeling]

And he's like, no, no, it's okay. I'm taking care of it.

[Maria Hinojosa]

No, it's really nothing. This lady want attention. And you know, my PO already know about it. And you know, she's. I know she was the crazy one.

[Maggie Freeling]

Swavid tells me that he calls up his parole officer to give a heads up that Angela is making these outlandish threats that could send him back to prison. And basically Swavi's like, maria, don't worry about it. Nothing's going to happen. It's not true. And I'm like, okay, you're, you're, you're.

[Angela]

You're married to her now.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I'm done. I told her I found a holy boss. I'm done. See, because the minute you try to jeopardize my freedom, that's over. Marriage or not, that's over. That is over. You know, with me. I ain't got no problem walking away. You know, my freedom is worth more than anything else. Oh, God. His strength.

[Angela]

My God.

[Maggie Freeling]

Suave, it was days ago that you.

[Angela]

Were telling me how you had made the decision to marry her and that that was you. What you had decided to do. I just, I'm like, oh, my God, I did.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I did. But you know what, Maria? At the end of the day, I'm we talking about my freedom.

[Angela]

I'm very scared.

[Maggie Freeling]

I got very scared.

[Maria Hinojosa]

Well, I was like, oh, my God.

[Angela]

Swab is going to go back to prison.

[Maria Hinojosa]

I was like, I'm saving sound. You know, my parole agent told me, like, listen, stay away from her. That's the best thing you can do right now. I'm safe. I'm at home watching the cnn, my favorite channel. I know it's bogus, but that's all I got. And playing with my little cat. I'm safe. And you know, I'm gonna deal with the situation. Only ways to deal with. I'm a 544. Monday morning, I already talked to my lawyer. He said, I got you.

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

But Suave wouldn't get to file for divorce on Monday.

[Maggie Freeling]

Hello? Maggie? Yeah, hi. Suave is back in prison. How the fuck did this happen?

[David Louise Suave Gonzalez]

That's coming up next time on Suave. Suave is a production of Futuro Studios and distributed by prx. It's produced by me, Maggie Freeling and Julieta Martinelli. Additional field reporting by Aaron Moselle, Michael Simon Johnson, Zoe Malik and Zakiya Gibbons. We are edited by Audrey Quinn. Our executive editor is Marlon Bishop. Our director of production and operations is Natalia Fidoholz. Our engineers are Stephanie Lebeau and Julia Caruso. Maria Hinojosa is the executive producer. Our fact check is Amy Tardif. Original music from Taka Yasuzawa and Alex Segura. Production help from Lita Halwell, Juan Diego Ramirez, Maya Cueva, Sam Bernitz, Fabian Caballero and Lily Hershey Webb. Special thanks to Marsha Levick at the Juvenile Law Center, David Santi, Suave's lawyer, Shannon Atala, Jill Settlemeyer and Claire Fitzpatrick. David Bohm. Our private investigation Jodi Kent, Karma El Moussa and Heather Renwick at Campaign for the Fair Sentencing of Youth. Support for this podcast is provided by the Art for Justice Fund, a special project of Rockefeller Philanthropy Advisors and the Heising Simons Foundation. Unlocking knowledge, opportunity and possibilities. [e-mail].

[Maggie Freeling]

From PRX.