Jay Campbell (3:30)

Seven or eight years that I was living in Southern California, I got back to playing competitive basketball. Got kicked in the testicles playing an adult men's basketball league. Eight weeks later I started being run down. I had like levels of a geriatric 29 years old about to turn 30 and I had the testosterone levels of like an 82 year old.

Scott Clary (3:44)

Some people accept life as it is.

Jay Campbell (3:45)

Jay Campbell rewrites the rules. The oldest of nine siblings, Jay's journey.

Scott Clary (3:49)

Took him through five high schools, four states and college basketball.

Jay Campbell (3:52)

But a freak injury at 29 changed everything. It led him to therapeutic testosterone sparking.

Scott Clary (3:58)

A decades long mission in biohacking, hormonal.

Jay Campbell (4:00)

Optimization and human performance. Money is not in the cure, the money is in the medicine they need. People continually hooked on allopathic medications as they get older so that they can continue to make money. 50% of men in the United States right now under the age of 25 have testosterone depending deficiency. The problem is most of these people have no idea. Reason is very simple. It's the environment. We live in a contaminated world.

Scott Clary (4:23)

Before the world caught on, Jay was living it.

Jay Campbell (4:25)

Writing the TRT manual and the TOT Bible.

Scott Clary (4:27)

Now the go to guys on the subject.

Jay Campbell (4:29)

Today after spiritual awakenings in Peru, his mission is bigger.

Scott Clary (4:32)

Helping people optimize not just their bodies.

Jay Campbell (4:35)

But their minds and souls. Let's get into it. I always tell people start low, go slow, maintain the minimum effective dosage principle because that is going to allow you to live the longest and strongest without any kind of risk to your long term health. If people understood what a myocardial infarction or heart attack would cost them, they would never not spend money on their health because one heart attack in 40, the average person, it cost them $400,000. People don't understand this dude, but this is the system that we're in.

Scott Clary (5:04)

Welcome to Success Story. I'm your host, Scott Clary. The Success Story podcast is part of the HubSpot Podcast network. HubSpot not only supports the show, but they support entrepreneurs. That's why I'm such a huge F of HubSpot. And I'm very grateful for HubSpot for supporting the show because they help entrepreneurs. And as a fellow entrepreneur, I know it takes a lot to grow your business. A lot of audience attracting, a lot of sales, a lot of marketing, a lot of lead scoring, a lot of channel management, a lot of content, a lot of long days, late nights, a lot of weekends, a lot of wishing there was an easier way. But there is with breeze. This is HubSpot's new collection of AI tools. It's easier than ever for marketers, for entrepreneurs to attract audiences, to increase leads, to score customers, and to close deals fast. Which means pretty soon your company will have a lot to celebrate. Visit HubSpot.com marketers to learn more. Jay, let's just start with your journey in health and wellness. Tease it up. Perfect. So talk to me about your origin story in health and wellness, where you came from. I know you were competitive, bodybuilder, physique champ. Obviously you care about health and wellness a lot. Where'd this sort of, this fire for this come from?

Jay Campbell (6:20)

So basically just 100,000 foot summary. Oldest of nine children. Played high school sports, was very competitive, played basketball in college, NAIA, which actually became Division 2 before I left Georgia. Southwestern University in Americus, Georgia. Very, very competitive player. Got offered to play professionally when I got out of school overseas in Austria. Spent a couple of months playing, and then my ankles were really bad from playing for so long. And so I was just like, I'm done. I came back to America. Me and my best friend moved out. I was living on the east Coast. We moved out to Southern California. And in the seven or eight years that I was living in Southern California, I got back to playing competitive basketball. And at 29 years old, I was living with my fiance in Pasadena, California. Got kicked in the testicles playing an adult men's basketball league. And six, eight weeks later, dude, I started being run down, broken. Like, what's going on with me? Low back issues and pain. I was working, working for the Los Angeles Times at that time as an ad sales guy. And I happened to just go to my PPO doctor and he recommended me. I mean again, as I like to say, there's never coincidences, only synchronicities. But he recommended me to an endocrinologist who ended up happening to be where I was living in Pasadena. A world renowned Harvard trained guy by the name of Dr. Raymond Scrugg. So anyway, he saw me and he was like, this isn't right. I'm going to measure your testosterone levels. And he did and it came back and I had like the levels of a geriatric dude. I mean I was 29 old, about to turn 30 and I had the testosterone levels of like an 82 year old. It was like something back and back then testosterone was damaged there. It could have been damage from the kick, it could have just been environmental. I mean there's a lot of things that we could, you know, hypothesize what caused it. But at the end of the day he was like, look, I can put you on a course of therapeutic testosterone and have you writer's reign in eight to 10 weeks. But before you decide yes or no, go home, talk to your fiance wife to be, you know, get her approval and everything and let's see what happens. And so of course I did and you know, I ex wife shout out to Kelly, who's long gone now, she was like, you're a smart guy. You know, we, we're not, we don't have kids or anything and you know, we're good where we are financially in the world. Let's just see what happens. So anyway, I did dude, and my life completely shifted. Like in eight weeks I went from having zero pain in my low back to just having super energy, massive vigor. My brain speed or clock speed seemed to improve. So when I went back to see him, he was like, okay, well you know, we can take you off now and put you on HCG or whatever. And I was like, whoa bro, I'm not coming off this. Like this is life altering for me. Like I'm going to become a student of this. I'm going to learn about this. So to fast forward to story over the next 10 years, I just read everything as I could read about it voraciously. But back then, this is in 1999, 2000, there was not a lot of information. The only books were Nelson Virgel, Built to Survive and Michael Mooney. I have these Inverted Testosterone A Man's Guide. And both of those guys had hiv. And so they were writing about using therapeutic testosterone, growth hormone, other anabolic steroids to survive. Because at that time, that's actually why.

Scott Clary (9:19)

A lot of them were invented. Like a lot of anabolic steroids, they're invented for. For people that were wasting away.

Jay Campbell (9:25)

Exactly. Wasting disease. Yeah, correct. And so at that time, besides those guys books, there was a lot of studies in Russian and Bulgarian because the Russians had been using hormones on their athletes.

Scott Clary (9:36)

Because it wasn't. It wasn't banned.

Jay Campbell (9:39)

Exactly.

Scott Clary (9:39)

Study it.

Jay Campbell (9:41)

Even in the States it wasn't banned. So it wasn't until the anabolic, whatever it was called, Substance Abuse act for Ben Johnson using steroids in the Olympics, which I think was in 1992 when they banned steroids and made them controlled three substances in the United States. So 70s and 80s in the underground bodybuilding culture, like the Arnold Schwarzenegger days, Franco Colombo and those guys. Those guys could legally procure them, but then they outlawed them. And so it just became this very weird navigable space where it was like, technically a doctor could write you a script for testosterone, which is what I had, but people would still look at you weird. So to fast forward what happened over the next 10 years, I became this like, just vish. I would just say, super ambitious student of it. And I obviously had a really amazing physique. And so when I would meet people, you know, in my social peer networks and stuff, they would either say, they would ask me, how do I look so good? And I would literally tell them right to their face, I use therapeutic testosterone. And I would be met with either like steroids or. Wow, that's fascinating. Tell me more. So eventually the fascinating, tell me more people kind of went out and they were like, bro, you got to write a book about this. Like, you know more about this than any doctor. Like, you got to put this information forward. So at that time, my wife and I had a residential real estate company. I was living in Southern California. I was what, 40, 41 at the time. And I was kind of like apprehensive because I knew it was still looked at as like an underground thing.

Scott Clary (11:02)

And I crt was not a thing.

Jay Campbell (11:04)

No, it wasn't. It was absolutely not a thing. But you could get like I did and men did, you know, through. I don't know if you remember the guy, Dr. Jeffrey Life. He was the old guy with abs they used to put in all the newspapers way back.

Scott Clary (11:15)

I don't remember him. I think probably before my time.

Jay Campbell (11:17)

Well, so, so, so if you, if you read the newspapers like 15, 20 years ago, they always had a picture of him on every major newspaper. And it would say, it was like a picture of an old man with rabs. And it would always be like Dr. Life. And it would be the Anti Aging Institute and the Life Extension Foundation. And so those were the people that were like, promoting this. And again, for me, I just happened to meet a doctor who prescribed me testosterone because he was a master of using it and stuff. But anyway, fast forward to when I'm 41 now. I sent an email to Rick Collins, who's now a very close personal friend of mine who happened to be like, one of the world's leading attorneys on performance enhancement. He worked for, like, the WWF and WWE and Major League Baseball, NFL football, blah, blah. And I asked him, I said, look, what would happen if a non medically trained person wrote a book on using therapeutic testosterone. And amazingly, because the guy's amazing, he literally, I was a nobody. And he wrote me back right away. And he said, well, I would first have to see what you wrote before I could give you an answer, but there would be risk. And he gave me the reason. So I sent him my white paper because I had had a white paper about it. And he came right back to me again and said, wow, this is amazing. He's like, but again, here's the risk. And so he told me what the risk. I backed off because my wife and I were doing really well in real estate and I didn't want to have any kind of unnecessary eyes on me. But I also sent it to Nelson Burgle, who wrote Testosterone A Man's Guide, and a couple other leading people. And three or four months later, I shut it down mentally. I got an email from Nelson in the middle of the night, and he was like, I don't know who you are, but this is amazing and you need to write this book. And so then I wrote him back and I said, look, I'm not going to do it now because Rick Collins. And he's like, oh, f Rick Collins. Rick's a friend of mine too. He's just being an attorney. Yes, exactly. He's like, I know. He's like, I'm on FDA panels. He's like, this information needs to get out into the world. I'm glad to help you. You're obviously very smart. You understand this from a scientific level. Let's do this. So anyway, as I always say, standing on the shoulders of giants, shout out to Nelson Virgo. He helped me write the book. My first book came out in 2015. It should have come out in 2014, but we spent more time developing it, getting more authority. Authority from doctors who, you know, submitted and helped me write stuff and make it more authoritative. And so it came out in November of 2015 and at that point it blew up. In fact, there's a lot of people, because it was, it was Amazon, you know, was when books on Amazon were blowing up. And so one year later, Jeff Bezos went from the scrawny guy to the beast, right? So a lot of people were like, oh, well, he read your book because, you know, your book's the number one book on Amazon. So it's kind of funny. We always made a joke about that. But from that moment forward, I'd say 2016, 2017, I started meeting people, I went to doctor's conferences, I started lecturing, I wrote five or six other books.

Scott Clary (14:08)

Just leaned into human optimism.

Jay Campbell (14:09)

Completely leaned into it. I mean, I was always doing it underground, but I was just a corporate wage slave guy, right. So I wasn't like doing this, but I started making the rounds. Our real estate business afforded us the luxury to travel and to go to these things and stuff like that. And then I met the right people, wrote the right amount of books, and here we are today.

Scott Clary (14:27)

What's interesting is that like on all these, because now a lot of these substances, before TRT was popular, now there's so many studies showing that like, listen, as you age, testosterone goes down and, and to live a healthy life, we're not talking about using a dose, it turns you into a bodybuilder, but just to live a healthy life, it's good to maintain it. Now TRT is like lost. It's taboo, right? The longest time, listen, I think you were in health and fitness before I was even in health and fitness. But all the research and the support and the experience, it was all, none of it was like peer reviewed, none of it was from doctors. There's a couple doctors that studied it. Then they studied bodybuilding and nutrition and drugs. But it was kind of like, you know, in these forums in the darkest places of the Internet where you had to learn about this stuff. And I felt like, I felt like, and I still feel this, I feel like doctors, they have, they do have your interests in mind, but they don't go outside of their training to try and live, help you live your best life. And it's not just about testosterone, it's about, it's about peptides, it's about nutrition, it's about literally everything. It's all, it's. What is it? They call it like sick care, not healthcare. Right? Yeah. So I think that this now we're in an age hopefully where, you know, medical professionals are going to focus on not just sick care, but optimization that's 100%. That's what the best life, you know, feel alive, feel cognitively present. Like you mentioned, you think quicker, you, you look better, you can play with your kids. You know, you're not, you're not dying at 60, 70, right? You still have a good sex drive as a man. And I'm sure there's a whole bunch of other things you have to optimize as a woman too. Like this is, this is what doctors should be focused on, helping people live their best life and be healthy. Because I actually do believe that if you optimize properly, then a lot of the disease and a lot of the things that are natural put in air quotes, part of aging, I don't think they affect you as much or as early.

Jay Campbell (16:29)

It's a hundred percent true. We could kind of just like put the dichotomy or just the line of the bifurcation is people either choose their, you know, sick care doctor, which is their, you know, their PPO doctor or their HMO doctor, depending on their business. And in their mind it's like, like this is my co payment and this is my medical treatment, or you can be like what I teach, which is like, if you can't afford to spend 10, 5 to $10,000 on your personal health every year, you have your priorities out of whack. Because even a 40 to $50,000 a year, you know, blue collar earner can come up with that money. It's just they have to like again, allocate resources effectively, you know, not waste money on beer and lattes and all these things that they throw away. But so that's kind of what I teach and so it's 100% true. But going back to medicine, you know, I always like to say what Chris Rock said. The money is not in the cure, the money is in the medicine they need. People continually hooked on allopathic medications as they get older so that they can continue to make money. I mean, if you look at the industry as it is today, it's insane, but like the average boomer runs out of money at 66 to 68, then faces medical bankruptcy and then dies within the next 12 months to two years because they don't have the money to take the pills that they've been on for 15 years through their insurance. So it's a nightmare. Nightmare. But you know, obviously we are talking about here today, like how you don't have to be connected to that system and how you can live again. What I call sovereign empowered free life, where you are in control of your personal health.

Scott Clary (17:56)

So when you think about optimization, so like the first stab at optimization for, for men in particular would be testosterone. So I was, how has human optimization sort of evolved?

Jay Campbell (18:06)

I mean, it's a great question. I mean, you know, going back to when I was first on testosterone, like you said, it was a taboo thing. You didn't talk to people about it. TRT was not recommended. It wasn't, you know, technically even understood to legal. Whereas now, I mean, there's a clinic on every corner in every major city. But here's the problem, Scott. The problem is, is that it's become a money grab. And a lot of the TRT clinics, I call them windmill clinics, are not about the patient's health, they're about making money. And it's become more like medicine. So unfortunately you have a lot of men and women do just as well on therapeutic hormones who are not getting the treatment that they ultimately would like to have because it's based on making money, you know, collecting if, if it's possible. It's rarely, if they're really smart, they can collect insurance. But it's really about like finding and following the algorithm to make money, you know, to scale that business or that brand versus personalized care and concern for that individual patient.

Scott Clary (19:04)

So what is that? Okay, so I mean capitalism exists and people are always going to try and make money. So just like to stick on that sort of first version of optimization because I think that's still a topic people really care about and are trying to figure out and navigate. So I mean you, you, you probably know the gamut of different hormones and different things that are not peptides. So in terms of testosterone, what is, I mean, can you make recommendations? Because you're not a do. Like, how do you say, like. Okay, so I. Because I don't want to get you interested.

Jay Campbell (19:33)

Yeah, no, no, no, no, I do. I mean, so I mean, I have like, I want to understand.

Scott Clary (19:37)

So say like I'm a man. I'm, you know, I'm 40, 45, 50. What should I be looking for? What are the. Or when do I start? Really?

Jay Campbell (19:46)

Yeah. So I mean, honestly dude, like this is how bad the environment is at 20. You need to take your blood, get your blood work. Kids 18 to 19 to 20 have no testosterone.

Scott Clary (19:55)

Why?

Jay Campbell (19:55)

That says the battery completely contaminated. From the blue light to playing video games to the contaminated environment. Air, water, food, everything is contaminated. There's phytoestrogens, xenoestrogens, endocrine disrupting chemicals, they're everywhere. They've leached out into the bloodstream, I mean into the water supply, they're in our blood. I mean, it's so difficult to navigate and maneuver in modern day, in modern day first world society, that you can't avoid all of these harmful contaminants.

Scott Clary (20:24)

So a 20 year old dude, test.

Jay Campbell (20:27)

One is the joking when I'm telling you this. I would say that 50% of men in the United States right now under the age of 25 have a testosterone deficiency. 50%. You get into 35 to 40 and you're now in 60 to 65%. And as soon as you get into 45 and 50 and older, you're at 75% of the population. The problem is most of these people have no idea because if they don't know somebody like you or me, or they're not connected to people that actually teach them to get their labs done and their blood work and biomarkers measured, they have no earthly idea. But I mean, again, look around society. You have so many low testosterone, you know, anthropomorphically like carrying feminized bodies and body fat levels. I mean, again, body fat, obesity is through the roof, inflammation is through the roof, and all of this really stems from a lack of proper hormones. And again, the reason is very simple. It's the environment. We live in a contaminated world.

Scott Clary (21:23)

I thought, I don't disagree with you. I think that people are, you know, their health is not good. The average, the average person is not in shape. And I know you see those like pictures of, you know, 20 year olds like 50 years ago and everybody's like, listen, they're not bodybuilding, but they're all fit as hell. And I thought it was a mixture of like bad food.

Jay Campbell (21:45)

That's part of it, it's.

Scott Clary (21:47)

But I didn't think, I never, I've never heard somebody say that a 20 year old will still have low testosterone in 20, 25.

Jay Campbell (21:53)

Dude, it's unbelievable. I mean, if you talk to doctors or actually specialists in this field right now, they tell you that every single day. Yeah, but you know what? They'll melt up.

Scott Clary (22:01)

I'm in doctors. The, the average GP will look at a low testosterone level and say, you're fine.

Jay Campbell (22:07)

Oh, you're fine, no problem. Yep. Send you home. And remember, to their credit, they don't have any schooling, there is no standard of patient care that they learn in medical school about hormone optimization. Because again, why would allopathic medicine want people to not be on meds instead of hormones, because if they optimize their hormones, they're not gonna be on SSRIs, they're not gonna be on all these other things that they take, that they make money off of. So it's real simple to understand it.

Scott Clary (22:36)

So for a 20 year old going back, that's even earlier than I thought. For a 20 year old. All right, what's the signal that, that your hormones aren't optimized? Is it like sex drive? Is it, is it depression? Is it all of it?

Jay Campbell (22:49)

It's mostly cognitive, so it's a great question. So people can really understand this. So the first line of symptomology when you have a deficiency in both men and women is cognitive decline. Depression comes next. A lack of, you know, chutzpah, a lack of energy, a lack of drive to do anything. I mean, again, look at kids today. They don't. They're not active. They sit around, they play video games. Video games and porn. If I would put two things are rewiring dopaminergic signaling pathways.

Scott Clary (23:19)

I believe that. Yeah, for sure, right?

Jay Campbell (23:21)

Because pleasure, reward is simple. You don't have to earn pleasure by courting a woman or courting, you know, your boyfriend or your girlfriend or whatever it is in society. So it just becomes simple to jerk off three or four times a day.

Scott Clary (23:33)

You get addicted to it.

Jay Campbell (23:34)

Exactly. Or to play video games and to have all of your life being lived through the cloud, you know, so that's rewiring brains so that, that bottoms. Testosterone immediately. So like, when most doctors that, you know, friends of mine and stuff that I talk to about, talk about seeing young people come in, a lot of times their parents are bringing them in. They're like, look, we need to get your. Their labs done because they have no motivation. They don't listen to us, they won't date, they won't play sports, they don't go out, blah, blah, blah. And so once they, they evaluate these people's biomarkers, they see a testosterone, a free testosterone level that's like at the floor.

Scott Clary (24:05)

What's a floor? Like a hundred? 200?

Jay Campbell (24:07)

Well, so, so total. I mean, again, there's various labs that measure, but like, if we're looking at LabCorp request, which are the two biggest ones in the United States, yeah, you're looking at like less than a hundred. You're looking at people with total Testosterone is between 60 and 90. And free testosterone is like 2 is.

Scott Clary (24:23)

That's insane. Is there. So, like, all the traditional advice about how to increase testosterone. So clean up your diet, be more active, lift more obviously. I mean, you're not watching porn, you know, three, four times a day. You're not playing video games non stop out the things that impact testosterone. You're talking about environmental, but also the actions that you take. So if you, if a young guy, and I don't know, I don't know how to optimize women's hormones, I'm just thinking about like my own experience. So a young guy lifts, you know, goes for a run, eats healthy, isn't doing all the other shit that he shouldn't be doing. Can you sort of rehab your testosterone levels naturally to a degree? Or our environmental factors, the foods that we eat, the chemicals and everything that we consume, is it just too detrimental to really make a difference?

Jay Campbell (25:14)

It's a great question. It comes down to your genetics. You know, if you do all the right things, if you live an insulin controlled life, if you train, if you eat enough protein, if you get six to eight hours of proper sleep a night, you do all the things to insulate yourself. It comes down to whether you're, it comes down to your genetics, whether you can be optimized. But I would tell you that it's probably, and I have a really smart doctor friend that talks about this and he quantifies the levels of guys, it's under 15% of men at all age.

Scott Clary (25:40)

Where they're like studying this uphill bat.

Jay Campbell (25:42)

It's almost impossible. Yeah.

Scott Clary (25:45)

Okay. Because then say you bought into the idea of some sort of therapeutic dose of testosterone. So the two sort of bigger issues that people keep bringing up is one, you're going to be shut down for life. And the second thing is that it stops you from having kids because it acts as what's, what's, what's the word I'm thinking of? It acts as contraceptive. Yeah. So is that, is that true?

Jay Campbell (26:07)

It's not true. So you. So, so if you use.

Scott Clary (26:10)

Somebody wants to go into this and they want to get testosterone.

Jay Campbell (26:13)

Yeah. Yeah. So this is a great question. I'm glad you asked. No one's ever asked this. So. So the, the truth is, is that if you use therapeutic testosterone in your 20s or 30s, during normal fertility times, you have to use what are called FSH and lh, which is follicle stimulating hormone and luteinizing hormone mimetics, which would just be other drugs to increase and make sure you have motile sperm. So you can absolutely use therapeutic testosterone along with those other drugs. And there's numerous ones. There's like five or six that you can use. Some of them are injectable, some of them are oral tablets or capsules. But you can absolutely maintain fertility. So there's no like, you know, and again, as you said, like the taboo of this back in the day, this wasn't understood as well as it's understood now. But you can absolutely maintain fertility. And so, you know, I always tell guys like, you know, you have to choose because it will shut down your body's natural production. But as far as like how much will it shut down from a therapeutic level versus like, you know, super physiological levels that bodybuilders will take, it's nowhere close. In fact, most guys who've never done anything to restore luteinizing hormone or FSH and have been say on therapeutic testosterone for a decade can come off and in six months have their sperm restored. So it's a lot, there's a lot of misinformation I would say online about like being shut down completely, but it's always a good idea. And I always tell people this, that if you're going to go on therapeutic testosterone, whether you're in your 20s, 30s or 40s, if you want to be ultimately sure, get a measured sperm count done first because it can freeze your sperm. Okay. In a worst case scenario that you can't maintain fertility because again, the environment is getting worse and worse and worse. We have the lowest birth rate right now. All these men and women are on fertility medications in their 30s and 40s because they can't get pregnant. Again, environmental factors, that's the first thing to do is to get a measured sperm count, get some sperm frozen. But again, for most men they can use my preferred drugs are hcg which is human chorionic gonotropin and hmg which is human menopausal gonotropin along with therapeutic testosterone and you should be able to maintain fertility.

Scott Clary (28:16)

What are the. And out of all the companies that offer this, because I know like now the big ones are like the hymns of the world and shit like that. Yeah. What are the, what should you look for when you're looking to work with a company?

Jay Campbell (28:28)

It's a great question. You should not work with any of those companies. And this gets back to the AI. All of those companies are not, they're not public, but a lot of them intend to go public. And so they're literally based on a, you know, a shareholder model. And so it's all based on an algorithm. So you're not going to get Personalized one on one individual health care from a doctor. You're going to end up talking to an np, which is a nurse practitioner or a pa, which is a physician's assistant. And so you're never going to get that feeling of like, oh, I'm talking to the doctor and doc gets me and he really feels cares about me. Right. So you're just going to be, you're part of the machine. You're just literally in the machine. So what you want to look for is wherever you are in the United States. And the good news is, is that you can work with pretty much anyone via telemedicine. Right. Like I have an awesome clinic here in Miami called Men's mhi and I love those guys. They have two doctors, there's two brothers that run the clinic. I send a lot of the people, I refer tons of people there to them.

Scott Clary (29:23)

But the answer is you're not going to be like just a cog in their machine.

Jay Campbell (29:27)

Exactly.

Scott Clary (29:28)

Personalized.

Jay Campbell (29:29)

The answer is you want to make sure as a man or woman when you're going to get hormon optimize that you're working with a doctor that has the minimal of 10 years of experiential body of work. And what I mean by that is they've been optimizing male and female hormones for 10 years at a minimum and there's plenty of them out there. Now you don't want to go down to your local clinic on the, you know, on the, on the corner that is SE found an SEO ad that says we do everything for 199amonth. Because what those guys end up doing is they just value add you to death and before you know it, your, Your bill is 999amonth and you don't even know what you're paying for.

Scott Clary (30:00)

They don't have any. They don't give a shit about your particular circumstances. Just like how do do as many of these.

Jay Campbell (30:06)

Exactly. It's all cookie cutter boilerplate templates. And the problem with those guys is, is, and this is what I always talk about, whenever you start therapeutic testosterone or optimizing your hormones, you really want to see what testosterone does in isolation. And those companies are adding this and this and this and this on top of your regimen. And so like in three months or in four weeks, how the hell are you going to know what's doing what in your body?

Scott Clary (30:29)

You can't tell. You can't tell.

Jay Campbell (30:30)

You have no way to know. So that's why all of these people who go down that path end up getting really effed up. And the best doctors will tell you that their primary job is un f ing the people who go to these windmill clinics who get whacked out. So that's what ends up happening with a lot of people in the United States. And that's why I told you at the beginning of the show that like, hormone optimization has become a money grab. And so you have to really be cognizant of what you're looking for when you start with somebody.

Scott Clary (30:58)

So if you, if you have researched this a little bit, you start to realize pretty quick that there's a whole bunch of different kinds of testosterone that you can use. Um, what would be the one that you think people should be recommending in like the most generalized sense? And also what would be the, what would be the advice? Like, if you get this advice, this is a red flag that you should definitely not work with that clinic because that's also important.

Jay Campbell (31:25)

This is a great question. Let me unpack this. So there's so many forms of delivery now of testosterone. 80% are worthless. The. The tried and true that work and have been used for decades in both men and women are injectable. Number one, primary. And, and again, dude, like, people freak out of needles. You know, a bonus question. Do you know what the, the word for needle phobia is?

Scott Clary (31:48)

What's the word called?

Jay Campbell (31:50)

Tyrannophobia. It's ridiculously.

Scott Clary (31:53)

Yes, I actually.

Jay Campbell (31:54)

Right. Because you're like Tyrannosaurus rex. Like, where does that come from? But that's, that's the biggest hurdle and obstacle in most men. It's not an obstacle in most women. They don't care. It's crazy. But men are afraid of needles. But testosterone now in oil, the esters of testosterone, which the primary ones are either sipinate or ananthate in the United States now propionate is available still, but it's fast acting. Most people don't get that it's in like MCT oil or sesame oil, and it's so thin that it's easily able to go through like a 29 gauge or 28 gauge needle, which as you know, is like an insulin needle. Right. So previous to that, men would complain because they would have to use bigger needles and you would leave scar tissue. Right. Inject here, up here, up here, you know, your quads, if you're really brave. But bottom line is now is like you can use really thin, small gauge needles to inject testosterone. It's not a big deal.

Scott Clary (32:46)

But injectable is what you should be looking for because there's also stuff that you put topical.

Jay Campbell (32:52)

Yeah. So I'm gonna get you that. So injectable is number one. Okay. But to talk about it deeper, it's not a big deal now because obviously you can use small needles, but the next way is transdermal. And the best way to do transdermal for both men and women is actually for men at the base of the scrotum. And for women it's like at the head of the labia or the intravaginal area. Because the reason that is is the skin is highly permeable. In fact, the base of the scrotum and the hood of the clitoris and the inter labial area of the vagina is like eight times more permeable than anywhere else in the body. So when you place it there, it absorbs readily and instantly. So it's like bottom line. And I used transcronal testosterone for five years. When I moved to Mexico, I couldn't get it anymore. So I. Since I've come back to the States, I just haven't got transcronal back to injections. And again, because the needles are so small. It's not a big deal. It's not a big deal. The other one is a newer form. So we've got injectable, we've got transcrotal or inter labial, whether you're male or female. And now the third one is a new company called Kaizatrix, and they have an oral form of testosterone, which literally is a quote unquote oral testosterone booster. And the type of testosterone is undecanoate is what it's called. And honestly, which is laughable. The European world had a product in the old school bodybuilding days called Andreal. And Andreal was testosterone and decanoate. And this was actually available through Searle, which was the pharmaceutical company in the late 70s all the way through the 80s. And then they just disbanded it for whatever reason. But for men, it never optimized them. It would like slightly boost them, but they could never feel like they feel when they're on. Like.

Scott Clary (34:29)

Is that because it doesn't get absorbed the same way?

Jay Campbell (34:32)

Yeah. So when it goes through the small intestine and goes through first pass through the liver, it doesn't. It doesn't. It's basically being deactivated, you know, in that area. Right. So it's not absorbed as well. But these guys, the created Kaiseptrics, I forget the name of their company right now, but they're constantly messaging me and they want Me to promote their company, they've, they've done something to the carrier oil so that when it goes through first pass, it's being absorbed a lot better. And so you can actually move a person, say from 150 to 400 to 500 total. And you could probably take their free from about, you know, a super low level, somewhere between, say, 5 and 10 to 20. And so in most men, that's a big mover and a lot of people are starting to take it. And again, going back to like, they don't want to inject, they don't want to put it on the balls. A lot of guys will say, like, oh, if I get on my balls, it gets on my underwear. My wife can't go down on me. I don't want to, you know, touch my kids or whatever. But it's not that big of a risk. But people complain about that. So the oral version, seemingly as they continue to perfect the actual delivery of it, because it's not perfect yet. And even the owners will tell you that because they want to be able to move the free testosterone levels the same as injectable does or.

Scott Clary (35:41)

And it wants mass market and.

Jay Campbell (35:42)

Exactly. Yeah. I mean, they're out there now, but the problem they have is they're not moving free in total because the formulation is not perfect as yet. But those are the three types. Everything else is bogus. There's patches, there's troches that they put like along the gum line, which is absolutely retarded, doesn't absorb well. Dude, there's one called Natesto. That's an intranasal. It's actually patented by this guy down here at Miami. I forget his name, but he's been on my podcast. But causes nosebleeds. It's insane. So, like, there's other formats we probably talk about, but if you're in the market, whether you're a male or female, those are your three delivery systems that are tried and true. That will work. And I wouldn't even use the. I wouldn't use the Kaiser shit because it's not ready for prime time.

Scott Clary (36:26)

If somebody's telling you different, don't work with them.

Jay Campbell (36:28)

Absolutely. So you're to answer the other question. The biggest red flag is when you go to the Windmill Clinic or you go to the testosterone center, and they want to put you on an AI. And an AI is an aromatase inhibitor medication which blocks estrogen. Now, when you block estrogen, when you're giving a therapeutic dose of testosterone, you're actually blocking the effect of Testosterone at the tissue level, it's insanity. But for some reason, and might be bodybuilding culture, we don't really know where it comes from, but at one point in time, they used to think we want a higher testosterone and want low estrogen. It's the complete inverse.

Scott Clary (37:01)

Well, man, I want me to get.

Jay Campbell (37:03)

Exactly. But here's the thing that's so crazy, and this is, like, perverse. Through all of hormone optimization, they believe that you want to push free and total testosterone higher and then keep estrogen in this narrow, confined range. And it's completely insane because the narrow, confined range, the lower you push a man and a woman's estrogen, the more negative effects they have. Brain issues, vascular issues, bone mineral density issues. So it's completely insane. If we get back into, like, why is this happening? The state medical licensing boards see this narrow range on blood markers, right? Like, think of Quest or LabCorp. And I think it's like 21 estrogen to, like, it might be 17 to 32 in men. And so doctors want to keep their patients in that confined range. And when you do that, you whack them out. But for them, it's like, well, I don't want to get audited by the state medical licensing board. And they see a guy's estrogen, like, 20 points outside the range, and so they get freaked out about it. And so that's what's going on out there. And it's obviously mismanaging patient health because they're just trying to keep them in a range that has nothing to do.

Scott Clary (38:09)

With therapeutic testosterone, but it should save their own ass.

Jay Campbell (38:11)

100. It's CYA.

Scott Clary (38:13)

You know, it's. It's so tough out there to navigate this because. Because keep in mind, like, what is the advice that you seek? First of all, if you're not listening to these kinds of podcasts and you feel like shit, you go to your GP and then you listen to a podcast, and then you bring that information back to your gp and he's like, that's. That's not correct. That's incorrect. And then you're just like, okay, so who do I listen to? This guy. This guy on the Internet or your gp? But you have to think about. Listen, you have to think about incentives. I think that when you understand incentives, I think that you start to, you know, break out of the matrix a little bit. And. And that's where you have to. That's where you have to think even when. Which is a very simple thought exercise. When you're getting prescribed a drug by A particular doctor, like, understand that there's a reason why they're prescribing that drug. There's a financial reason why they're prescribing that drug.

Jay Campbell (39:01)

The fact. Yeah, I won't even go down that rabbit hole. But I mean, I just watched something on their day. I think the rule of thumb is don't go to your GP for hormone optimization if you are depressed. If you are low energy. Again, number one symptomology of hormone deficiency is brain fog. If you have any of those things, do not. Because like you said, they will literally tell you you're fine. And in addition to telling you you're fine, they will write you a script for an ssri. I'll just take this blue pill. And then they'll give you erectile dysfunction medication if you're not having sexual function, you know, if you can't get an erection.

Scott Clary (39:33)

So it's just all drugs. It's all drugs.

Jay Campbell (39:35)

It's horrible, dude. And, and, and, and truthfully, and this is statistically proven through the studies now, and by the way, we left off statins. They'll give you a statin if your cholesterol is over 2. Right? Which is a farce.

Scott Clary (39:46)

Is that like a Lipitor?

Jay Campbell (39:47)

Horrible. Yeah. All those drugs. But those are horrible, too. But we now know the studies show that it further exacerbates hormone deficiencies because it pushes your testosterone and your free testosterone lower. So now these guys are in a vicious cycle that they can't get out of. So. Yeah, so seek a. Like I said, seek a doctor. Google them. Do research on them that has a practice where they have been optimizing hormones for a long time. The best guys out there have been doing it for 25 years. You know, so they're. And you can find them. They're available. It's not hard to find them in Google searches.

Scott Clary (40:20)

We spoke a lot about, like, optimizing for men. What are some ideas around hormone optimization for women?

Jay Campbell (40:27)

Yeah, same thing. So it's. Dude, it's crazy. That's a whole. Women are the. They are basically a lost cause in hormone optimization because basically the Women's Health Initiative, WHI, which was 25 plus years ago now, was the study where they saw all these women get uterine cancer and ovarian cancer because they were giving them equine premarin or whatever it was. I forget the drug for birth control and for hormone optimization, like postmenopausal and perimenopausal. And so all these people got these uterine cancers and stuff. Like that. So then at that point they shut down hormone optimization for women because they thought it just doesn't work. And so you have all these doctors that are like basically 60 and older out there, which there were still a ton of them practicing, who tell their women that you can't be on hormones. And so, dude, I'm telling you, it is so bad for women's. Most women today who are again, let's just say 45 and up cannot find anybody who can optimize their hormones. Like, that's the biggest email and question that I get. I mean, I get literally dozens a day between all comms of women desperate help. What can you do? Can you recommend a doctor to me? And there are some really good female optimization physicians out there. But the problem with women in those doctor's defense is they're very finicky, they're very biochemically unique and ultraly individual. And so it's harder to optimize a woman than it is a man. Like with a man, it's not boilerplate cookie cutter, but it's close to that and we kind of understand what to do. But with women, it's a little bit different because they're very, very unique. And so you have to titrate their therapy sometimes up and down and spend more time with them. And so knowing what I've told you about how all these companies, the big ones, are running things by templates, they.

Scott Clary (42:09)

Don'T help when it's even more damaging.

Jay Campbell (42:11)

For way worse for women, but.

Scott Clary (42:13)

But they should, they should still go on this journey.

Jay Campbell (42:15)

100. This is how crazy it is though. I always tell people this. There's no difference at all from a male and female physiology other than the amount of testosterone they were exposed to in utero. As you know, you give a woman hormones, you make them into a man, right? So it's like all you have to do is a woman gets older is you have to optimize their thyroid, you have to optimize their estrogen, you have to optimize their progesterone, you have to optimize their testosterone with a man. Optimize estrogen, optimize testosterone. Some men might need a little progesterone, but it's just a little bit more complicated to optimize a female. But dude, they need the same things. They just need less of it. So like, if a man, for, for example on injectable Testosterone is getting 150-175mg a week, which is most men, a woman is going to get somewhere between 5 and 15 milligrams a week of testosterone. Whether it's injectable or transdermal. It's the same thing. The problem is you have is you don't even have compound pharmacies making the formulation small enough for women. They're trying to like use men's formulations and then extrapolate like micro doses which aren't even calculable. It's insane.

Scott Clary (43:19)

That's tough. I mean, it's just, it's just, it's sad that there's not more support for women in this world because again, I can only imagine if, if people understand what a hormone optimized life feels like. Yes, it's, it's kind of sad when you look back and you realize you haven't been living that life for how many years?

Jay Campbell (43:38)

I mean, I tell people this, Scott, the difference between not being on therapeutic Testosterone in your 40s and 50s and.

Scott Clary (43:46)

Being on it apparently even earlier.

Jay Campbell (43:48)

I mean, yeah, I mean, I mean, I mean, most men and women, and again, obviously more, there are less women becoming optimized than there are men. But they look at their life as pre and post optimization. The effects, the physiological effects, the mental effects, the mood altering effects, the energetic enhancement effects, they're so much greater when this is done versus previous life. But again, for the average guy out there, and thankfully, you're exposing this kind of information to the world and the public is finding out about this and it's happening more and more every day. But for the average guy out there who doesn't know, they don't know there's a system solution. They just feel like their life sucks. You know, I say this all the time. Like if you're obese and insulin, you know, dysregulated insulin resistant dude, you're in a default state of pain and suffering. You live in a state of pain and suffering. Most people who are like that don't know what it's like to live a life optimized. I mean, think about if you woke up every single day and you have a big belly and you're insulin. I mean, you're insulin resistant. You're, you're having cytokine storms in your body at all times. And those cytokine storms are literally causing you pain.

Scott Clary (44:53)

What does that mean?

Jay Campbell (44:54)

A cytokine. Cytokine storm is basically just a massive inflammatory cascade in the body, right? So like, if you got a bunch of visceral belly fat, right, and you're like this, like again, most dudes, you're in pain. I Mean, you, your dick doesn't work, your, your, your, your sexual, you know, function is down again. Those cytokine storms are creating that cascade down there where your penis cannot get optimal blood flow. You can't get nitric, you know, oxide expansion to, to the, to the actual organ of the penis. So it's like all this stuff is leading to just this total default state of suffering and pain. And so that's why I always tell people, like when you see people who are obese and again, you know, insulin dysregulated, highly inflamed, you know, have, have sympathy, you know, respect for them because you have no idea what life is like for them. They don't know what it's like to feel good. We take it for granted, right? Like we don't wake up in pain every morning. But obese people are in pain and their default, and they're still trying to.

Scott Clary (45:52)

Go through life, is still trying to do all the same shit.

Jay Campbell (45:54)

It's horrible.

Scott Clary (45:55)

Yeah, man, Man. So outside of, like, I know now a lot of your focus is on peptides, but outside of hormone optimization, what are some other things that people should be aware of that are not peptides and not hormones? Or are there other parts of hormone optimization outside of trt?

Jay Campbell (46:11)

Yeah, I mean, there definitely is. I mean, I mean, again, so the first order of business, in your early 20s, you know, and I would say probably under 25 if you're really advanced and you're 20 or 21, I mean, anybody can do it. You can go on, you know, discounted labs, private MD labs. Like, I have a deal with private MD labs up four different panels depending on your economic situation. And I always recommend, when people ask me like, hey, I need to see what's going on under the hood. You know, I say go there and pick what you can afford. You know, the elite level is like the deepest dive under the hood and really understand it. And then from there, once you know what you're working with and a lot of guys and even women will push back and be like, yeah, but who's going to read my labs? I don't understand that, you know, And I'm like, it's not hard. You can go on Google or go on YouTube and do a simple search and in five minutes you're going to understand what you're looking.

Scott Clary (46:55)

I would bet now if you upload it to like, Chat GPT, it could give you a RE session.

Jay Campbell (46:59)

Exactly. It'll be like, well, Jay Campbell says, yeah, but like, it's. Don't even get Me going about AI. Sure to talk about that. We can work that in. Yeah. So the, so the reality is, is like, what can people do besides knowing what's going on under the hood? Live insulin control. I always say, and this is a fact, and all backed up by the studies, the greatest way to live long and live strong is by being lean. The leaner you are, the less inflammation you have, the less potential for disease. Right, because disease dis ease comes from inflammation. And inflammation over time causes physical bodily degradation. And the degradation becomes cancer, type 2 diabetes, neurodegenerative disease. I mean, you name it, it's all from inflammation. So the leaner you are, the more hormonally optimized you are going to be. Because again, remember, if you have all this fat, and again, most men carry their fat right here, that's going to break up sexual function and cause your endocrine system to go into decline faster than it does just through natural means through a degraded society. So that's like the key is remain lean, do cardio, lift weights. Obviously hormonally optimized is going to give you more energy to do that. But there are other supplements which we could talk about, you know, that my company sells. There are mitochondrial optimizing supplements that you can take without having to hormonally optimize. That will give you a little bit of push too. But as we get deeper into peptides, I always tell people the first step is understanding whether or not you have a hormonal deficiency.

Scott Clary (48:30)

Even before peptides.

Jay Campbell (48:31)

A hundred percent, 100%. No one. In fact, that's a good segue. No one should consider or think that they're going to get amazing results with peptides if their hormonal machinery is deficient. Like if they're totally dysfunctional, dysregulated, and they start peptides, they're not going to get the same results as somebody who has optimal.

Scott Clary (48:49)

I got you. So the hormone, step one. Okay, all right, so then, I mean we can talk about, I don't even know what we say, mitochondria, like energy supplements. This is not like pre workout. Let's just touch on that because that's interesting. And we can go into peptides too, because I've, I listen, I've tried every supplement under the sun when it comes to like working out and bodybuilding, but like a lot of this stuff is just like pre workout protein. Maybe there's some studies behind them. Creatine. I was gonna say there's some studies behind creatine. Yeah, that's Pretty much it, Right. Everything else is kind of garbage. Yeah. And I, I don't even know how effective.

Jay Campbell (49:22)

No, it's totally true. So, so the mitochondrial are. This is a good segue. The mitochondrial are brand new into the world. So you, you've got, I mean there's a lot of mitochondrial optimizing peptides which are amazing. But there are now basically what are known as the, the class of drugs or I mean they're technically supplements because there's, there's no FDA approval for these things. And the research companies like myself are making these because they're amazing, you know, and using with people. But there's a, there's a product that came out, it, it actually came out in the underground like four years ago, but it made its way into the mainstream in the last year. It's called SLU PP Dash 332. It's a small molecule, but it's got incredible research behind it. In fact, the University of Florida did this landmark study less than two years ago. It came out in like December of 2023. That it's the most powerful exercise memetic, or what you would call exercise in a pill. Like, dude, it's insane. I've been using it now for a year. It increased.

Scott Clary (50:16)

Not a peptide though.

Jay Campbell (50:17)

It's not a peptide. It's a small molecule, but it increases metabolic efficiency, burns fat, gives you more MTOR signaling so you can generate more force. I mean, it's insane. I mean, this is without question. I'm not hyping this up when I say this because I know there are thousands of people around the world, probably hundreds of thousands of people around the world using this now. This is the number one over the counter supplement ever. Like, if you seriously want to be somebody out there who doesn't want to use testosterone isn't going to use peptides, afraid to inject or whatever, and you want to take a supplement that is absolutely going to move the needle. It would be SLU PP3.3.

Scott Clary (50:51)

Is this replacing like a pre workout or is it used in conjunction?

Jay Campbell (50:55)

If I would. I mean, look, look, most pre workouts are worthless. I mean, I mean, I mean they will amp you up from an energy standpoint. Right. They'll make you hyper. They're loaded with caffeine or they're loaded with taurine or loaded with betaine or whatever. There's so many of them. Glutamine.

Scott Clary (51:10)

Yeah.

Jay Campbell (51:11)

I mean all those things will increase, you know, a brain signal or dopamine signaling or increase the androgenergic expects, you know, Elevate heart rate, give you more energy. But obviously using those over time is not good for you. You. Right, so like the, the, the mitochondrial enhancing and there's other ones. But just talking about sloop right now, like if you take that morning and in the afternoon, you know, the dose that we recommend and the doses that we're seeing in the studies, you will definitely have performance enhancement. As far as like what are the long term effects, we have no idea. But the studies at Florida that demonstrated it were taking massive dosages that nobody was using and there was no harm blood effects and of course they're in rats. Right, but like extrapolating to humans and obviously I work with people in the performance enhancement segment who work with Olympic caliber athletes and professional athletes. And so it, it's been being used in the underground for four or five years. In fact, what I was told like three months ago was that it was the number one supplement at the Paris Olympics. So you saw some of those freaks that were like, you know the, we say the, not the acrobats but the gymnast, that little Filipino guy. Did you see? Yeah, yeah, that dude is on a lot of SLU PP332. So you look at that, you know, you have a mental image of that and you can see that those people are very similar to performance enhancement, anabolic steroids and other peptides that would be added into that. So that would be your probably like again, if you want to call it natural, that would be your greatest enhancer by going down the optimizing mitochondrial pathway before you would get into peptides, before you would get into bioregulate.

Scott Clary (52:46)

Okay, so the other thing that I wanted to ask about because obviously peptides are very popular. What about SARMs? So are, do SARMs have a place? Because I think they also fall under the. Not really tested, but people use them for performance enhancement as well. Do you, do you consider them to be like light steroids? Do they have any utility? Are they just really not safe and just ignore them? Stick to peptides.

Jay Campbell (53:11)

They have absolutely zero utility. And here's why. They do create muscle. They do enhance metabolic firepower. They can burn fat, bro. They are so toxic to our endocrine system. They lower hdl, they increase small particles and platelets. They do so much damage to our cholesterol, hepatic function, liver function. I have spoken to so many doctors in the last five years who have told me that they have had 18 and 19 year old kids because that's who we're using them young kids because they sell them Owner, they do steroids.

Scott Clary (53:44)

They don't do steroids.

Jay Campbell (53:45)

Or they sell them over the counter in GNCs. Like they're behind the counter under the table, you know, like, hey, take this. And they do work, but they cause such poor health to biomarkers. And again, like I said, like I've talked to doctors who sent kids in, have had kids come in, they do their labs and they send them right to the, or they send them right to emergency to pump their stomach because they, they cross hdl, they crush hepatic function, they crush liver values. I mean, they're doing bad things. And when you compare them to just therapeutic testosterone, which doesn't do any of those things, it makes no sense. And then the other thing, and this is the laughable thing, of course, but we're in America, they're three times more expensive than therapeutic testosterone. So people are paying all this money to take SARMs and doing God knows what kind of untold damage to their health. I mean, look, I've known about SARMs for probably 12 years in all my books. I've never once brought them up because I know how harmful they are. I know what they do to people's health long term.

Scott Clary (54:44)

And it seems to be like you're targeting, you're targeting this young kid that doesn't want to jump into testosterone or other steroids, but they want to look good and they start working out. And I don't know, it just seems like, it seems like malicious.

Jay Campbell (55:00)

It is malicious. The people that sell them are mostly. Yeah, because most the people that sell sarms, if you go online and you do searches and stuff, and I don't want to like vote everybody under the bus. There's some good people out there, but they're not, they're just, they don't lead to anything productive. They cause long term poor health. And again, you're talking about kids, like our youth should be learning about therapeutic peptides and therapeutic testosterone and things that will actually allow them to live a long, productive, healthy life, not just, not.

Scott Clary (55:29)

Just die looking good.

Jay Campbell (55:30)

Exactly. And honestly, dude, there are definitely small molecules that some people would technically classify as SARMs that if used in the context of health and longevity in surgically precise dosages, probably aren't going to do much harm. But as you know, and Tim Ferriss coined this, the difference between a pill and a poison is always a dosage. And the young kids, more is better. We live in super sized society. So they start taking so much and before you know it, their liver is crushed. And so it's like you know, I always tell guys like man, educate yourself. It's easy to do. Now Today, don't use SARMs. If you're going to use a SARM, make sure you're using one in a very, very small dose for a very specific reason and don't use it for more than four weeks.

Scott Clary (56:14)

But I bet you could get the same results with some sort of peptide or some sort of other combination of better results. What are, what are some other, I mean I only know about peptides, SARMs, testosterone, steroids. What are some other things that people should definitely stay away from that you've.

Jay Campbell (56:32)

Seen sort of, I mean basically just again journey, you know, pre workouts, Adderall, you know, anything that stimulates the beta adrenergic system, which is the vascular system because over time that can cause heart enlargement of clenbuterol. Horrible job. No one should take clonbuterol. It literally causes aorta valve damage, it causes inner heart wall damage. So many bros and women, you know, who are in the bodybuilding or the performance enhancement or even just the competitive physique arena, there's so many of them now, it's a massive subculture. They take clenbuterol, dude, and it's so bad for you. Albuterol is a way better drug. It, you know, again, albuterol is an asthma drug, right? They prescribe it, it like, like giving candy to a baby. But like if you use that in a microdosage pre cardio you'll have fat loss from it and it won't do any of the high risk damage that columbuterol uses. But there are other small molecules out there. There are drugs called PPAR inhibitors that have shown in studies to be toxic at high dosages. Look, at the end of the day it's again the Tim Ferriss principle. Always the difference between a pill and a poison is the dosage. It's just that most people seem to think that it if some is good, more is better and it's never that way. And it's always like even in, when I, when I coach or when I lecture or I talk, I always tell people start low, go slow, maintain the minimum effective dosage principle because that is going to allow you to live the longest and strongest without any kind of risk to your long term health.

Scott Clary (57:58)

Yeah, it's smart advice. This is why you have to have more conversations, more candid conversations. People are scared to talk about this. And what happens when you don't talk about it? Did people do their own research? They go to Reddit they buy. You know. It's true though.

Jay Campbell (58:12)

I am not liked on Reddit. You should search me on Reddit dude. There's so many people that talk smack about me because I always tell people the truth. But yeah, I mean Reddit is just.

Scott Clary (58:21)

Where do people go to research if they can't talk to somebody?

Jay Campbell (58:23)

Exactly. And then they get bad info on top of bad info. You're right.

Scott Clary (58:27)

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Jay Campbell (62:20)

So peptides. So this is an interesting conversation because we have to talk about bioregulators and peptides. So the what peptides. Yeah, sure, but what? Peptides and bioregulators are basically signaling chains of proteins. The longer chains are peptides and that's why most of them have to be injected. And the smaller shorter chains are bioregulators and that's why a lot of them are oral capsules. But they're both amazing because they're mostly naturally produced in the human body. They don't cause any kind of side effects because like to understand this, you know, for the people listening to this audience and not go down on super, you know, esoteric rabbit hole. Most allopathic medications are what, what are called Rockefeller petroleum distillates. So they're basically made out of oil based drugs. And when those break down in our system, they cause side effects because oil doesn't break down in the body like a organic signaling or chain molecule like a peptide or a bioregulator does. So all those drugs, as we already talked about over time, as your person gets older and they're hooked on big Pharma, they're taking 12, 15 pills a day, right? To medicate this side effect versus this side effect, they cause death. Death. Because literally they cause system failure, organ failure, biological system failure. So over time that's what happens. But with peptides and bioregulators that doesn't happen. In fact, I've been using, which is crazy for me to think about this, but I've been using therapeutic peptides since 2004. And the true story is at the very beginning of my origin story, when I was using therapeutic testosterone, I was learning from underground forums which you already talked about. And at that time the bros and the people that I was learning from and there were a lot of really smart guys that were mentoring me and back then did everything, everything was anonymous, nobody had names, they had the handles, right? So it's hilarious.

Scott Clary (64:03)

All the bodybuilding for us.

Jay Campbell (64:04)

Yeah, dude. But I mean like back then it's funny because the biggest one was miscellaneous fitness weights and it was in Canada. It was based in Canada. Yeah, but, but, but the craziest thing is that there was this peptide that people started talking about called Ipamorelin. And the, the, the beauty of Ipamorello was like, hey man, you could take this peptide and it will increase your body's natural growth hormone production, but it will not give any side effects and it will not shut down production. So everybody's like, wow, start using it. So back then again in 2004, it was my first peptide foray. I started using it combined with therapeutic testosterone and I got leaner, you know, and I, I felt better, I had better, deeper sleep because again, growth hormone zygous peptides increase IGF1, which increases polyphasic sleep capability, improves skin elasticity. Well being all these great things that you've heard about from peptides and that was again the very beginning. And I always say like at the very beginning of drugs when they, when they circulate in the world, they're always is the best. And then as they get broken down and people find out about them and they start cutting them and they're not as good. And so, like, I always laugh because, like, ipamorelin, when I was using it in 2004 through 2007, was like, gold standard. And when I use ipamorellon today, it's not bad, but it's not the same effect, right? So it's just like, that's just kind of how drug culture works. And as companies get involved and middlemen get involved and they start cutting things and you just don't know what kind of quality you're getting. But at the end of the day, peptides and bioregulators, the difference is that bioregulators are smaller chains, peptides are longer chains. They have been used in Russia since literally the late 40s. So there's tons of peer review, there's tons of studies. There's a great scientist professor named Vladimir Kavinson, who actually died in December of 2023, who was essentially the father of peptide bioregulators. And he basically was the guy that pushed them into the Soviet Union and Eastern bloc countries in South Bulgaria, obviously Ukraine. So all those people were using these drugs, dude, forever. In fact, if you went to Russia, and I have not been to Russia, unfortunately, yet, it's a bucket place I want to go to. They're over the counter. You can just go into any pharmacy and you can buy a bioregulator. You can buy a peptide, and they're used, and they've been used again medicinally for many, many reasons. Now, to explain what a bioregulator is, and then we'll get deeper into peptides. There is a bioregulator, again, oral capsule for every organ system and biological system. So, for example, think about like this. And men can understand this. This. As a man gets older, the prostate grows, right? It hypertrophies. And so we all, at 50, 60, have to wake up in the middle of the night to take a piss because our prostate walls are pushing against our ureter. And it just makes us have a pressure of going to the bathroom. I'm one of those. Almost every guy in their 50 has to do that now. And it obviously, as it get, as you get older, it sometimes is twice in the night, so it disrupts your sleep. There was a bioregulator called Libadon, and there's two other ones, too. But just to talk about libidon, where you can take two capsules a day for 10 days in a row and it shrinks your prostate and you don't do anything else, you can do it twice a Year. Now, imagine that for the heart, for the thymus gland, for the pineal gland, for the kidneys, on and on it goes. So all of these things are literally unbelievable. Again, all you have to do is take these a couple of times a year. There's also one called a pitalon. It literally extends the length of your telomeres. So telomerase, which is obviously what breaks down your telomeres as you age. Imagine taking a pillow that will improve your telomerase expression so you don't age as fast. So there's. Dude, there's. Literally right now, like, my company right now is we have access to 23 of them. They are made in Russia. They're flown from Russia to Latvia and then Latvia into the States. And as you know from the last four years, the previous administration was not friends with Russia. So anybody who's dealing with Russia, attempting to get bioregulators in the United States was not an easy deal. But something happened in the Ukraine war in 2023. And all of a sudden, as of January of 2024, bioregulators started showing up, up on Amazon. So my buddies in the compounding world and in the formulation world had always told me about bioregulators, but they were like, oh, it's a Russian secret. Cavinson patented all the bioregulators. You can't get them in the United States. But then again, something happened in the Ukraine, Russia, war, whatever that debacle is. And all of a sudden they started showing up on Amazon in January of last year. So then, you know, my. I made calls, connections with people and stuff like that, and we found out that you could basically just sell bioregulators as a supplement. They just somehow passed it. And they just look at them because they're oral capsules as a supplement, they're technically not supplements. In Russia, they're basically considered medications. But in the United States and in the west, they're supplements. So, dude, there's a race to expose bioregulators to the American public and the Western public, because they're amazing. They're literally amazing.

Scott Clary (68:40)

So what was the reason, for years that these were not patents?

Jay Campbell (68:44)

Patents, they just completely kept them out of the list. It was just purely Russian patents. And again, I don't know that a hundred percent. I know that from the formulators and a biochemist that I've known who told me that for literally since probably 2008. But I was always. I was aware of them. It was just. It was like that taboo product that you can't get because they're stuck behind the eastern block.

Scott Clary (69:04)

Are there any health concerns with these?

Jay Campbell (69:06)

Dude, they have no side effects. They're insane. I mean, I, I know it sounds crazy. They've only been on the market for one year, but there's massive studies. If you can read Russian or Bulgarian, you can read about them. But no, there's, I mean, I mean, again, they're tissue specific, which is crazy. So when you swallow them, they target the actual organ or biological system that they're intended to target. And they have no breakdown in the body that causes side effects. I mean, honestly, when I say there are no side effects from bioregulators, there are no side effects. I mean, I've never observed a person in, you know, in knowing now for about a year and a half of people using bioregulators, I've never seen a single person who's had any more poor effects. I've seen men who literally stopped having to go to piss in the middle.

Scott Clary (69:45)

Of the night taking glutinos because they're so effective.

Jay Campbell (69:47)

It's incredible. Pinealon, which is the pineal gland bioregulator, dude, it's like if you take that with high dose melatonin, there's a whole group of people. There's a researcher named Doris Law, you can google her, she's a friend of mine and she's the high dose melatonin queen of the planet. And she's done tons of studies on melatonin, but they're taking pinealon and melatonin in their astral projecting, leaving their body.

Scott Clary (70:11)

Oh my God.

Jay Campbell (70:12)

It's incredible. Incredible. Like they're talking about this. You can google this and read about this. Now, I personally cannot use high dose melatonin. I'm like one of those outliers where like the more melatonin I take, the more it stimulates me to be awake. Which is bizarre. Right? Because most people take melatonin to fall asleep.

Scott Clary (70:30)

Yeah. But then I also feel like garbage the next day too.

Jay Campbell (70:33)

But depending on the level. Exactly, right? Yeah. So you've obviously experimented with melatonin. But that's what's really weird about melatonin is everybody's individually and biochemically unique with their experience with it.

Scott Clary (70:42)

It.

Jay Campbell (70:42)

But I've done it. I've taken it with pineal on. I have not astral projected, but I'm definitely like.

Scott Clary (70:47)

Well, I think most people, I mean most people don't care about astral projecting. Most people just want to like live longer, be healthier, feel better. But it is interesting.

Jay Campbell (70:57)

I Mean, if you leave your body, it's pretty awesome.

Scott Clary (71:02)

I have this conversation a lot, like, do you, you know what, what's your view on alternative medicine? And, and, and I do like listening. My answer is, you know, in the west, incentives drive a lot of behavior. So I think there's a lot. The issue is that there's so much stuff that could work, but it'll never be studied by the people that should be studying it because it doesn't impact their bottom line.

Jay Campbell (71:25)

Exactly. That's 100% metformin, right? Metformin is the number one anti aging drug in the history of the world. It's actually finally in a big. It's in its fourth year at the TAME trial. Barzilai, I forget the guy's name, but he's a famous Israeli researcher, is doing the study. I have been, I've been on metformin for 20 years. I wrote the world's biggest article. You know, it tied it on to Harvard and Research Edu, all the reasons why people should go on Metformin. But it's the exact same reason. Like nobody will get behind it because they can't make money. It's off patent. We're selling it from our company now. But it's the number one most studied drug in the history of the world. Right? It's a plant that grows wild in the fields of France. But Big Pharma patented it in the 40s and then they started giving it to diabetic people. And then doctors unfortunately learn in their first year of medical school that metformin causes lactic acidosis in the kidneys. And so they tell people you can't be on Metformin unless you're diabetic. But now we know that all the studies and again this trial going on that it's the most powerful anti aging drug in the world. It does all these amazing things. In fact, I tell everyone, if you're going to be on one thing as you age, you have to be on Metformin. It increases akkermansia in the microbiome. It kills and crushes systemic inflammation. Dude, people that were on Metformin during COVID never got sick. They couldn't get sick. It's such a powerful drug. But like you said, there's no incentives for pharma to push Metformin. There's no incentives for doctors to write scripts for their patients. Dude, I swear to God, I won't tell you who this person is. But you know this person, in 2014, he said to me, if Metformin and Human growth hormone were in the water supply, there would be no hospitals.

Scott Clary (73:04)

It's insane. It's absolutely insane.

Jay Campbell (73:07)

But so think about that. They don't want health. There's no money, like you said, incentives, it's profit. Don't want health.

Scott Clary (73:14)

So then the issue is, you know, I think people can buy into that idea that they should take their health into their own hands. But it's, it's a minefield of information.

Jay Campbell (73:21)

It is a minefield. Well, now it is. I mean, I mean, dude, 25 years ago when I was on the Internet at the beginning, it was nothing. Typical. Yeah. And as you know now the signal to noise ratio is so distorted.

Scott Clary (73:30)

And also people again now, now people that, okay, so we have doctors that don't know what they're talking about. We have pharmaceutical companies that are, you know, incentivized to only push the products they sell, that they have patents on. But then we have social media influencers that only make money off the products that they sell and they're not going to talk about anything else, honestly.

Jay Campbell (73:51)

And did you know me now just from Talking to me, 80% of social media influencers don't know shit.

Scott Clary (73:57)

I know that they, let's just be.

Jay Campbell (73:59)

Very honest, they've not done their homework. They might as a male or female, they might have an awesome physique and people look at them and say, why? You know, the issue does this person. Oh, it's insanely dangerous. And this is the truth too. And you know, I'm an og, quote unquote pioneer, buyer, hacker. A lot of people see me that I'll be 54 in February. I've been in this space for 30 plus years and I've been doing the work, right, Like I've been doing on myself, working with other lab rats, working with people. Like I would never recommend any drug or any supplement to anybody if I thought there was risk, right? But as you know, there's a lot of Johnny Come lately, people out there.

Scott Clary (74:33)

And they, right, they do, they do one thing and it works for them. And then they'll say that everything else is garbage. That's what they do. They become like these like, like almost like, like a zealot for like one kind of formula, one kind of diet, one kind of supplement. And they say that everything else is going to kill you.

Jay Campbell (74:51)

I feel so bad for younger people because they're coming up in a world of just complete distortion. Yeah, I know you and I, I mean, I know you're younger than I am, but like we, we did not have it as bad as they have it now, like everything for every five people on the Internet that they research for are completely bad. Bogus.

Scott Clary (75:11)

So that wasn't the case even when I was sort of like going on my own health and wellness journey. I played a lot of hockey, then got into bodybuilding and lifting. And the guys that I looked up to, they were the guys that had like. Lane Norton.

Jay Campbell (75:23)

Yeah, of course.

Scott Clary (75:24)

Like he's been around for forever. And how did he, how did he, you know, prove that he knew what he's talking about? He would cite peer reviewed scientific journals. He'd do it. You do everything himself, trying to think of other guys, like, who are some other big doctors in this space of Dr. Anthony J.

Jay Campbell (75:40)

What's the guy on, what's his name on?

Scott Clary (75:42)

These are like OG and Bear.

Jay Campbell (75:44)

Yeah, I mean, there's plenty of them out there.

Scott Clary (75:46)

And you know what?

Jay Campbell (75:46)

Like, but they don't have big social media following.

Scott Clary (75:48)

They don't have social media. They'd write, they'd back up what their beliefs were with evidence and data and science and none of that. They didn't use the latest viral hack to get a million views on Tick Tock and Instagram and build, build a following that they built a following based on the validity of their idea.

Jay Campbell (76:08)

Exactly, exactly. And now that they scientifically proved through the experiments on themselves and the people I work with. Yeah, and nowadays, like you said, I mean, it's, it's so out of control. The algorithm is a sham. I mean, it rewards garbage information. Yeah, dude, it rewards.

Scott Clary (76:25)

Because what happens to disinformation? Then you're going to have people that are going to comment that this is it, but then it's going to get shown to a larger group of people because there's so much engagement on that post. So now you have to, so now you're, you know, you're just an average guy looking on TikTok or Instagram for, for fitness or health advice. And you're just looking at the thing with, you know, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 million views and wondering, well, is this right? Is this not right?

Jay Campbell (76:47)

It's incredible. I mean, you know, I want to keep going deeper on peptides, but like, we should talk, we should talk definitely about like diets, right? Because that's become the biggest circus of all time. Keto, Carnivore, if it fits your macros. I mean, all that is utter nonsense because the truth is, is that your diet, whether you're a man or woman, should be based on your energetic demand. And Charles Poliquin, you know, I know. You know, Charles, you know, God rest his soul, I learned a lot from him. He was a mentor to me. He taught you that, or he taught that you had to remain metabolically flexible. And he would always say, you get your carbs when you deserve them. And think about how genius of a statement that was because that's how you live your life. Don't avoid protein, fats or carbohydrates. Use them in moderation relative to what you do. If you're a bodybuilder or physique athlete, you need carbohydrates. Don't be retarded. If you're a ironman, you know, triathlete, endurance performance, you can probably use a ketogenic diet, right? But like, people just get so confused and I see. And again, Instagram, TikTok, there's millions of people going down the carnivore and the ketogenic diet road and all of them fail because again, I helped write a book when I was 25 years old. The Ketogenic Diet in Theory and practice by Lyle McDonald. I was a crash test dummy.

Scott Clary (78:04)

That's another guy. Yeah, he's the one.

Jay Campbell (78:06)

Lyle is. He was a very good friend of mine. He is completely insane, but he's brilliant. He's completely insane. I mean, if he hears this is fine, but like he's a brilliant guy. But like, the truth is, is that being in a ketogenic diet long term crushes your insulin metabolism. It retards your insulin metabolism. I lived it for six months in my life. Being in a ketogenic diet for two years, I couldn't eat carbohydrates. I would go to sleep if I ate carbohydrates. So all these people who are going down these paths and again, I'll just specifically say carnivore and keto don't know what they're doing. They're being misled because you cannot avoid carbohydrates, protein and fat if you want to have a functioning metabolism long term burn. We were designed intelligently, you know, obviously to burn through all those fuel sources and there's a place and a time for each of them and to avoid one or two of them. To do one specific thing is only going to end badly.

Scott Clary (79:01)

I think that again, a lot of it comes down to who are you influenced by? And people treat diets like religion and politics. It's like I can only, I can be the only one who's right.

Jay Campbell (79:12)

So, so well said. It's so true.

Scott Clary (79:14)

And I think that it is the Most toxic.

Jay Campbell (79:16)

It is absolutely insane.

Scott Clary (79:18)

And also on top of the fact that you can be. What, what was the term? Metabolically flexible. Which is very smart. Also you should understand your own energy levels too.

Jay Campbell (79:29)

Exactly, exactly.

Scott Clary (79:30)

Like, so, for example, like I don't like doing pure keto. I like lowering carbs during the week so I don't have like a 4 o'clock.

Jay Campbell (79:36)

That's the only way that you should do it again, you get your carbs when you deserve them. Them you just lifted, you just did something intense. You need to read like it, you know, you know, but it's. You do. People make it. But like you said, I mean, it goes back to the insanity of social media. They follow one guru who does all this. I mean, look, Paul Saladino, who was Mr. Carnivore. He's to his credit to respect Paul. Shout out to Paul. He's come back, he realized, he's like, you know what? I did it wrong. I put everything into that and I stopped up, I screwed up my insulin metabolism, I have issues. And so now he's out there preaching to people to do it right. And so I think everyone has to learn that. Again, the key is not a specific diet, it's to remain metabolically flexible. And your metabolic flexibility might be different than mine. And you know, and, and, and, and again, through trial and error and research and living a clean lifestyle, living insulin controlled, you're going to figure out how many carbs you need. It's that simple.

Scott Clary (80:29)

But then you have like the, the, you know, the most ridiculous example of just bullshit online is Liver King, where he's. Whereas he lies about how much gear he takes, he lies about the cycle, he lies about being natty, he lies about his workouts, he lies about his diet.

Jay Campbell (80:46)

How amazing is that though, to think that he built up that massive cult following and this is the truth. And you know, I don't. We could go spiritual if you want, but like bro, people like to be lied to. Think about that.

Scott Clary (80:57)

Most people, it's comforting.

Jay Campbell (81:00)

It's the Jack Nicholson, Tom Cruise. You can't handle the truth. The truth is for the most sincere.

Scott Clary (81:07)

The truth is that you have. First of all, the truth is that two things can be right at the same time, 100%. And also the truth is that you have to think for yourself, which is the scariest part of the truth. Because if you have to think for yourself, that means that I have to learn about macros, I have to learn about lifting, I have to learn about hormones. I can't just take one person's advice and shut off everything else and just follow them. Like, and live my life exactly the way that social media tells me to live my life. Maybe I should be a critical thinking individual, discerning individual. And that's very scary for people because there's no, there's no playbook for critical thinking.

Jay Campbell (81:45)

I mean, you're right, dude. I mean, it's sad, but just think about Liver King for a second. Like, how deluded would you have to be if you're a man or woman in your early 20s and you've exercised to not think that he was on gear, of course. And, and to, and to listen to the lies and to follow and to get into that cult mentality or that cult of personality of like, being he's your hero. It just goes back to everything you just said. Like, you don't feel worthy as an individual to not be lied to.

Scott Clary (82:15)

Yeah.

Jay Campbell (82:15)

And that's why you're listening to that person and do. And like, you just said so many of these people. Again, I don't want to pick on younger people, but they grew up in a world where discernment and critical thinking was not taught. Dude, they ask this for the answers.

Scott Clary (82:29)

I know.

Jay Campbell (82:30)

I mean, imagine asking a screen for the answer. Dude, I tell people this all the time. I mean, I grew up in a world where I had to go to the card catalog in the library and use the Dewey decimal system and then ask the librarian to go get the book it. And then I had to read the book and then I had to take notes and I couldn't highlight it. I couldn't use a screenshot of it.

Scott Clary (82:50)

You know, it's getting even worse with AI Now. I was thinking about this the other day. This is going to be the first generation that can outsource a hundred percent of their thinking to AI. Every question you have, every email you want to write, anything you want to. Anything you want to do, you can outsource to AI.

Jay Campbell (83:07)

It's insane. I literally. It's funny you just brought that up because I was on X. I love X. That's my place to go and do my cardio and just. Just be outlandish. Yeah. And I swear to God, dude, now X has rock. Where before you send your post or your reply, you can click and it drop downs and it rewrites your whole goddamn thing and does it for you. Like you said, it's literally taking away the power of human ingenuity.

Scott Clary (83:30)

I know.

Jay Campbell (83:30)

What world. Why would any of us want to live in a world like that?

Scott Clary (83:34)

Because people because humans. But I don't know why. But I do know that humans are inherently lazy.

Jay Campbell (83:40)

Lazy. That's what my wife says. She says that people are just so lazy now that if they can outsource or doordash or Amazon or anything, but to a degree.

Scott Clary (83:51)

To a degree. So laziness serves people to a degree. Because if you are trying to build something or you're trying to, you know, be your best self, there's a lot of stuff you should delegate in your life, be efficient. But I do think that there's some things that impact you cognitively that impact your mind that you should not outsource.

Jay Campbell (84:08)

You cannot outsource. You cannot outsource your writing. You cannot outsource your thought patterns. That's insane. And you're right. And that's where they're taking this.

Scott Clary (84:16)

It's too much to the extreme. So I don't mind. Listen, if you're building a business, I mean, a lot of entrepreneurs listen to this show and this is who I spend a lot of my time around. You have to delegate to build anything meaningful. We're getting to the point, we're delegating our own thoughts. That's an issue. That's an issue. And it started with social media, but now it's like, it's gotten even worse with AI.

Jay Campbell (84:38)

It's insane. I mean, like I said, I mean, I, I, I don't bro, I'm a.

Scott Clary (84:42)

And it's also reinforced by like traditional society and now media where don't think for yourself, just listen to what we have to say. So every single part of our life, if you're not careful, is signaling outsource your thinking insane. It's very.

Jay Campbell (84:56)

I'm a writer, obviously an author, and you know, writing has always been a thing for me. And I refuse to use AI to write. I refuse. I literally like people like some, you know, like even my company, the guys that run, you know, our co founders and stuff, they'll be like, oh, well, let's send you to AI and check. I'm like, no, we're not going to do that. We have brains and we're intelligent people. Like, but, but to your point, there is a place for it. And so it's like it's separating, you know, through discernment. Like, where is the place that's not going to derail you as a human to be? Yeah, and I think that might, like you said, this new generation, how do they even, how, how do they even determine how to discern that?

Scott Clary (85:36)

Well, I hope that if they listen to enough shows like this and they realize that the people that they look up to are critical thinkers and don't outsource their thinking, then they're going to think, well, maybe if I want to emulate that person and have even a fraction of their success, maybe I should sort of follow their, their rulebook.

Jay Campbell (85:52)

That's about the only opportunity, probably the only chance.

Scott Clary (85:55)

Be the role model.

Jay Campbell (85:55)

Yeah.

Scott Clary (85:56)

For your kids, for the community, for the people that look up to you, for the people that you work with. You have to be the role model, I think. Okay, so let's talk about peptides. That's popular now. I have a couple friends that I was telling before we press record. One of my friends, he's interested in buying compounding pharmacy and he came from like the, the beauty space and he's tried every peptide sun on himself. Yeah, I always hear about like MOT C and all these others. He's tried everything. He, you know, God bless him, he. He acts like a little bit of a guinea pig. So I can't, I can't hate. But obviously these are very popular right now. You've been doing peptides for 21 years. First of all, why are they so popular now? Just as a cultural phenomenon. What made them so popular and in 2025?

Jay Campbell (86:51)

So I'm going to give you the contrarian answer. And I know this to be true, even though I had no idea. So my claim to fame in peptides is I wrote a book on peptides that published in February 1, technically, because the Amazon gain, it went live on the 28th, but nobody actually saw it until February 1, 2023. And it blew up, dude. It was the first real peptide book on Amazon. Everybody started talking about it. Obviously my name as an author for my hormone stuff helped, but it just blew up. And so I. We didn't understand what happened. And I had a research chemical company that I affiliated for that I had a bunch of short links in there and they blew up. They went from doing $150,000 a month in sales to 800,000amonth in sales and it just blew them up. And now they're doing, you know, in the 2 to 3 million a month deal. But the bottom line is, and again, this is totally contrarian and very few people are talking about this. I have talked about this on the Mind Pump podcast, dude. People are looking for alternative forms of healing from the vax. It was the perfect. It was the perfect storm. It came out in February of 2023 and people were not telling. They were not. And as you know, most people who, whether they were forced or volunteered or whatever, it's a shame thing, they don't want to talk about it. They won't even admit that they're hurting from it, you know, and we know there's massive autoimmune issues. We know there's turbo cancers. This is not conspiracy, this is fact. I watched my wife's father die of turbo cancer from vax and boosters. I watched it, I saw what happened to him. And then I also dealing with him dying for a year. I saw what was happening in the medical system in California and all these older men and women are dying of turbo cancers. It was literally, I don't want to rabbit hole, but that was some sort of a population control to get rid of the people not paying taxes. That's my opinion, but that's what I'm seeing. But bottom line is in 2023, when my book came out, it exploded into mass consciousness, you know, through Amazon, through the research chemical company that I was promoting. Everybody started talking about it, but no one was admitting that they were looking for alternative forms of healing and peptides were offering that solution.

Scott Clary (88:53)

Well, people realized how sick the population is. I think that's really it.

Jay Campbell (88:59)

A hundred percent. Well now for sure to Fast forward to 2025. But that's kind of what blew them up because they were always a sideshow in the performance enhancement arena and the bodybuilding, you know, I don't think they.

Scott Clary (89:10)

Were ever taken seriously.

Jay Campbell (89:11)

No, no, no, no. Well, they were. No, they weren't. They were taken seriously by the doctors that I was like lecturing with. You know, like the big health conferences from 2017 is when they started becoming real.

Scott Clary (89:22)

Oh, I meant like in the world of like anabolic.

Jay Campbell (89:25)

No, no, no, they still are. A lot of bodybuilders still don't understand them. They, they, they pay me to like explain it to them. You know, they, all the bodybuilding conferences want me to come and talk now. Like they wanted to put me on their main deal deal. And I spoke at the Olympia last year and now I'm doing like big fit expos and stuff like that. So it's crazy. But yeah, they, they, they, they didn't see them as like, as beneficial as they are now. But again, there's just more research now. The clinical space is obviously writing scripts and, and you know, we'll get to it. But GLP1s have become the biggest drug in the world and there's a reason for that and we'll get to that. But, but truthfully, Peptides were very easy to manufacture. They all. And you know, I want to be very honest about this because you hear a lot of nonsense. Almost all peptides originate in Hong Kong. The synthesizing labs for the actual raw materials, we call them raws, all come from China.

Scott Clary (90:17)

So why is that?

Jay Campbell (90:18)

It's just because they built all the labs.

Scott Clary (90:20)

The infrastructure.

Jay Campbell (90:21)

The infrastructure, as you know, is just so much cheaper to manufacture over there and build and technology is cheaper and stuff like that and the efficiencies of scale. But the bottom line is, is that they ship out of there and then they go to other countries and then a lot of the countries, including the usa, will manufacture them and what, you know, we call finish them, bottle them, put them in vials, and then they say they're USA manufactured. Bottom line is they're really not. Now, truthfully, my company has USA manufactured peptides. We're like the first research company to actually do it. Our lab is in California. We actually now have a backup lab in Philadelphia that within six months will manufacture all of them. They probably 80% of the rolls are coming from China right now, but event all usa. And the cool thing is, Scott, is that like, we're probably within a year of that changing because again, for what you're saying, they're becoming so ubiquitous. They're so big, they're mainstream. Everybody's talking about them. You know, Rogan's talking about them, Huberman's talking about. They're all talking about. Everybody talks about peptides now, which is a benefit for me because I know so much about them. But at the end of the day, they are a solution that offers effects with minimal side effects. They're not going to kill you if you overdose on them. They have so many applications. And again, the ultimate solution or answer for why they're so beneficial now is because they fundamentally treat the root cause. Whereas allopathic medications are band aids, right? They're wrapping up or covering up symptoms, you know, medicating your symptoms, medicating you, making you feel bad, but then causing another issue. Whereas, like use a peptide, you know, we could talk about like say BPC157, right? Because most people know what that is. It's body protective compound. We literally call it the Wolverine healing peptide because it literally accelerates healing at like seven times natural healing. That's how effective it is. You, you brain, your wrist, your elbow, your shoulder, a ligament, you know, your ankle, and you can inject locally with a microscopic, you know, insulin syringe right into the origin of the injury. And literally in two weeks we completely heal versus previous to not having that, it would take six to eight weeks. You'd have to do intensive therapy, hot, cold compression, blah blah, blah. So it's, they're, they're incredible. And then you can fast forward to like every biological organ system and you have a peptide that will help in all of them. So I think the issue is, is still just the education because like you said, there's so much nonsense out there. And, and, and again, and I always say this, and we kind of already mentioned this, but like if you are a diseased, what I call our coin dumpster fire and you do not take care of yourself, you're insulin dysregulated, you're metabolically inflamed, and of course you're probably over fat. That and you use peptides. You're not gonna get the same effect if somebody like you and I use peptides. And so a lot of people will start with peptides because again, magic bullet, magic bullet, right? And they don't get the same effect or they don't even get a good effect. And they're like, this is a scam or this doesn't work. And it's like, no, dude, you gotta have the basics and the foundation set first before you use peptides. Cause dude, at the end of the day, peptides are no different than therapeutic testosterone. They're adjuvants to a balanced and optimized lifestyle. Right? But when you're optimized in a lifestyle standpoint, and we could talk about that for a second, right? Again, living insulin controlled, you're exercising, you're getting enough sleep, you're limiting your exposure to EMFs and toxins and then you throw in peptides, it's a world changer or a game changer, right? But when you're not, you're not going to see the same effects. Now that's not to say because I don't want people to listen to this and think it's not true. Anyone can benefit from the healing pep peptides, you know what I'm saying?

Scott Clary (93:47)

But it should be part of the journey, 100%.

Jay Campbell (93:50)

It's not, it's not the origin.

Scott Clary (93:51)

I got you. So if somebody is just getting into peptides, I know that you put together, which is wild, a 93 page deck on every single peptide under the sun. But if you go through, let's go through like category by category. So when somebody's first sort of exploring peptides, first of all I would say just what should they start to look for? What are the parts of the, what are the, what are the different types of categories that they can learn about and they can start to explore?

Jay Campbell (94:19)

Sure. So again, peptides are either long or short chain signaling molecules. Most people who start off in peptides usually are for healing, right? They have an injury, tendon issue, sprain, ankles strain, teraligament, whatever. And so they look into how can I heal faster. So the biggest healing peptides, and again, probably the majority of people that listen to this podcast or who watch this podcast, who are not even familiar with peptides have heard of someone using what is called BPC157, which stands for Body Protective Compound157. BPC157 is an angiogenic peptide, which means it actually enhances red blood cell formation so that when you break a tendon or tear a tendon or sprain an ankle or whatever, it speeds the rate of heat healing. Now there's another peptide that you want to usually take along with it that we love that is known as TB500, which means thymosin, beta 500 and thymus. And beta 500 is actually the inflammation suppressing peptide. So when you take BPC and TD500 together, they work very synergistically to suppress like acute, you know, onset inflamed injury and then also speed the rate of healing. So they're both amazing. So there's a lot of companies out there, including our company, Biologe Lab Labs. Well, we'll make a blend of both TB 500 and BPC together and then people will use that to speed the rate of healing. We actually call those peptides in combination the wolverine healing stack.

Scott Clary (95:42)

Is that just for athletes or would somebody just go into the gym trying to recover for anyone?

Jay Campbell (95:47)

I mean literally 80 year old people can use it. They're that amazing. So I mean again, in our bodies we have, you know, angiogenic signaling molecules floating around, but as we get older, we lose the ability to regenerate those or to regrow them faster. So injecting BPC 157, TB 500 actually will increase the formation of red blood cell, lymph, IGF and all of that to speed the rate of healing. So you honestly, it's not an exaggeration. You literally can accelerate your wound healing again, soft tissue tenderness, healing at six to seven to eight times what it would be normal.

Scott Clary (96:21)

You know, people keep talking about like their age versus their like biological age. Testosterone therapies, peptides. Did those have an impact? Because I'm assuming, like as we get Older, if we do nothing, then all of our, all of our hormones get out of whack. They're not the same as when we were 20. And I'm assuming all these other things that peptides impact, those also decrease. So do they actually start. This is part of like the age reversing stack that everybody talks about.

Jay Campbell (96:49)

Yes, 100%. There's actually specific peptizing bioregulators that increase telomerase expression, which means that that's going to actually prevent your telomeres from shortening. And again, telomeres shortening over time is what ages us both, you know, oxidatively and also through free oxy radicals. So those peptides definitely do that. But all peptides and of course, therapeutic hormones, growth hormone. If we're living a clean lifestyle, you know, all the things that we talked about previously or earlier on this podcast will definitely improve biological age a hundred percent.

Scott Clary (97:23)

So just going through different sort of use cases. So fat law. So obviously everyone's trying to lose fat. People know about GLPs, and I'm just looking at some of the ones that you list here, the ones that you list here for fat loss. There's a whole bunch of other ones outside of GLPs, and we'll. I think we'll talk about GLPs later because I think that's a whole other thing. What are the other ones? And actually I would ask why would you use, for example, AOD 9604 or Tessa Marellin or. Or sloop. Why would you use those over GLPs?

Jay Campbell (97:54)

You would want to use them in combination.

Scott Clary (97:55)

Okay.

Jay Campbell (97:56)

To truly have the most effective fat loss. You know, protocol. But, you know, just to talk about them. Well, actually, there's a couple more I want to mention. Healing thymus and alpha one, which is the immunomodulator peptide, which is the one that we talked about that I don't. Everywhere I travel in the world, I carry with me because if you get sick, you can inject it and it literally will massively suppress whatever is compromising your immune system and have you healthy and right as rain, usually within 24 to 36 hours. It's unreal.

Scott Clary (98:24)

Uncommon cold.

Jay Campbell (98:25)

And I mean anything. A viral illness, some sort of, you know, pathogen you pick up on a plane or you're exposed to or something like that. It's profound. And then the other one, there's some, there's some bioregulators that also will help with speeding the rate of healing. But I would say for most people, as far as what's accessible and what they can actually use is PPC157 for healing TB500 and Thymosin Alpha.

Scott Clary (98:48)

I just want to take a quick break and thank the HubSpot Podcast Network for supporting Success Story for the past few Years now the HubSpot Podcast Network has other incredible podcasts like My First Million. Now if you are an entrepreneur or you are ready to turn your entrepreneurial dreams into millions, you have to listen to My First Million. It's a show that is revolutionizing business podcasting. It's hosted by Sam Parr, Sean Puri. This is a HubSpot Podcast Network original. It brings you unfiltered conversations with self made millionaires who actually tell you how they did it. If you want to learn how Alex from Mosey built his fitness empire or how Sophia Amoruso turned Nasty Girl into a fashion phenomenon, these aren't just success stories. They're the blueprints for your own journey to the top. Each episode breaks down the exact strategies and hidden opportunities that you can use right now. Don't just dream about your first million, learn how to make it. Listen to My First Million wherever you get your podcast. I just want to take a second and thank Cornbread Hemp for supporting today's episode. Now. Cornbread Hemp CBD gummies have been this really nice addition to my wellness toolkit. I don't use them every day, just when I want to unwind after those extra busy weeks, but they're perfect for those moments when you want to take the edge off and just find your balance. Really just shut off from work. And what makes them special is how Cornbread Hemp crafts them. They only use a flour of USDA organic hemp plants. That's the best part for the purest, most potent experience. No fillers, no artificial fluff, just clean full spectrum goodness in delicious watermelon, berry and peach flavor. I keep them in my nightstand for those moments when I just need a little extra help relaxing. And I love how transparent they are too. Every batch is third party lab tested so you know exactly what you're getting and they put together a special offer for all Success Story podcast listeners. All listeners can save 30% off off their first order. Just head to cornbreadhemp.com success and use code success at checkout. That's cornbreadhemp.com success code success for 30 off your first order of these amazing gummies. FreshBooks is supporting today's episode. And if you've ever wondered how successful entrepreneurs stay on top of their finances while growing their business, the answer is FreshBooks. The numbers don't lie. Over 30 million people have chosen FreshBooks, processing more than 60 billion in invoices and saving an incredible 192 hours every year on accounting tasks. Think about it, that's nearly eight full days you could get back to focus on what really matters. Growing your business. FreshBooks is more than just accounting software. It's your all in one financial command center. Create professional estimates, track time automatically, bill clients and capture expenses on the go. Plus, it integrates seamlessly with over 100 business tools you already use. All backed by award winning customer service. If you're ready to stop drowning and receiving seats and you're ready to stop chasing down payments, here's what I want you to do. Head over to freshbooks.com to start your 30 day free trial. No credit card required. And for all you success story listeners out there, I've got something special. Get an exclusive 60% off for six months when you visit freshbooks.com pricing offer. Transform your business with FreshBooks today. That's freshbooks.com pricing-offer for 60% off. Tell me the story about the peptides that probably would have been effective for Covid, but it wasn't.

Jay Campbell (101:56)

Oh yeah, so vip, which is vaso intestinal peptide, so that actually opens airways when you inject it. You can actually also snort it through a nasal inhaler. But they were actually using it in hospitals. This is all covered up. Of course you don't hear this now, but like back in 2021 when they were intubating people and killing them, some very smart doctors and obviously people in the research communities were like, no, you need to give them VIP and give them a nasal inhaler or injectable with vip. And that was literally opening people's airwaves because again, Covid was starving red blood cells of oxygen. That's what it was doing to kill people. And then we didn't know that in the very beginning and even the medical community didn't know that. So they were intubating people and killing people who. Especially inflamed comorbid people who couldn't handle the intubation. But once you started giving them VIP would open them up. If we're going to talk about vip, we should mention one other one that's very powerful and it's called LL37 and that is an antimicrobial anti pathogenic peptide. And so like TA1, which is an immunomodulator, if you get really sick, you can inject LL37 and it will literally attack the viral age, the virus or the viral invading agent or the pathogen like in the microbiome and literally it'll disable, so it's really powerful.

Scott Clary (103:06)

So these, so if you, if you carry these when you travel, when you're on flank, you never get sick?

Jay Campbell (103:11)

No. And I know a lot of people that actually do. So. So if you're gonna, if you're gonna travel and like have your anti pathogenic or anti sick or viral illness stack, you're going to carry TA1, you're going to carry LL37, you're going to carry VIP with you.

Scott Clary (103:24)

Yeah. Okay, so that's the, that's the health stack, basically. Okay, so then fat loss, talk about some of the ones that I mentioned.

Jay Campbell (103:30)

Yeah, for sure. So the growth hormone agonist peptides are the most well known for fat loss. And those would be in order of like use case and, and, and notoriety would be the first one is Tessa Morellin. Now Tessa Morellin is actually an FDA approved peptide known as as a grifta. And they created that peptide to work with men who have HIV and a specific disease that comes from guys that have HIV and it comes from taking HIV meds. But it's called lipodystrophy and it's hard visceral abdominal fat. So when you inject tesamorelin into that hard visceral abdominal fat, it, it melts it, it burns it off. So a biohacker or a longevity person looking to lose body fat will inject tesamorelin in their center mass, center adiposity. And do I, I, it's true. I say this all the time. It's like taking a hot knife through butter with fat tissue.

Scott Clary (104:20)

So is it like peptide dependent?

Jay Campbell (104:23)

I mean it's not. You could inject it pretty much anywhere. But because it specifically targets visceral body fat in the center mass, you want to inject it like right in the belly area.

Scott Clary (104:30)

That's why. Okay.

Jay Campbell (104:31)

Yeah. It's amazing peptide and that's the strongest one from a fat loss measurement standpoint. The next one, and maybe the best one overall for both men and women, specifically women, is called Ipamorello. Now that's the peptide that we, you and I talked about when I started using peptides in 2004. I used it and had profound results and success with and then I gave it to my wife when we first started dating back in 2012 and changed her physique completely. But that peptide also increases IGF1, which is interstitial growth fluid, which again increases natural growth hormone production. The amazing part about that peptide is it's the only one in scientific studies to show no increase in cortisol or prolactin. And it also does not disturb your body's natural IGF1 production. So you can take that and never disturb your body's growth hormone as you get older. The other one to mention is CJC 1295 and CJC 1295 a lot of the times is actually compounded together with Ipamorelin because it gives a stronger growth hormone like enhancement than Ipamorelin in isolation. However, some people, when they take this is the one peptide that if there's like a side effect profile that people notice and it's very mild, they might get a flushing sensation when they inject CJC1295. But those are the three primary, like 5 AOD you mentioned is also a good one. It's one of those peptides that in theory is better than it is in practice. Most people who use it don't see as a pronounced effect as the other three that I just mentioned, but it is something that you can take. We actually manufacture a supplement at Biolongevity Labs. It's an oral powder form of aod and when it's combined with some other small molecules, it actually is more synergistic for fat loss in a fasted state then I would say people who inject it and I've used it, you know, going back seven or eight years, I tried it when it first came out because I'm like I said in the science, it shows it's really, really good for fat loss. But sometimes the science doesn't show in practicality. Yeah.

Scott Clary (106:31)

I think also you have to make sure that like where you're buying it from is good. Yeah. Because I think this is the, the issue with some of this stuff. You, you don't know who's making it.

Jay Campbell (106:41)

That's why you buy from Bio Longevity Labs and you're getting GMP certification, pharma quality products. But you're 100. Right. You definitely don't.

Scott Clary (106:50)

Arnold, you know, Arnold jokes. I don't know if Arnold jokes about this, but people of Arnold's bodybuilding era joke about how the drugs they used to take, they were so pure, so they took a lot less.

Jay Campbell (106:59)

100. True.

Scott Clary (107:00)

And because they were not even illegal, that's how you could get it from a pharmacy versus now.

Jay Campbell (107:06)

Like we talked about earlier, drugs 20 to 30 years ago were way better than drugs now even. I mean if you even get into like the party Drugs. Drug. Well, right, like anybody who took MDMA, pure MDMA, 25 or 30 years ago knows that the MDMA today, unless you get it from like an actual pharmacy, which they do make pharmaceutical medicinal versions of MDMA for people with ptsd, it's, it's dirty, it's, it's, it's, it's cheapened, it's watered down with something. Exactly, it's watered.

Scott Clary (107:32)

That's the fentanyl.

Jay Campbell (107:33)

Exactly. But I mean, that's the thing with drugs is like, as more people are exposed to them, the dealers and the middlemen and all those people, they always cut things to make more money, to make it go around.

Scott Clary (107:42)

This is why, I don't get why, if drugs are not like, not talking about cocaine and mdma, but peptides and some, I mean, like some testosterone ethers that are actually beneficial to your health and longevity, when the government shuts this shit down, all they do is they create more danger for the consumer because.

Jay Campbell (108:02)

Now that you create more underground labs and more underground producers and those guys, or agree are still going to go.

Scott Clary (108:08)

Get it 100%, we're still going to go get, like Rick Collins always used.

Jay Campbell (108:11)

To say the, the famous, you know, performance enhancement attorney, he says if there's a demand, there will be a supply.

Scott Clary (108:16)

Yeah.

Jay Campbell (108:16)

You cannot, the genie is out of the bottle.

Scott Clary (108:19)

I never, I wish that there was more regulation. Not from, like, I love regulation, but when it comes to health and shit that you put into your body, you have to have quality control. So it's not, it's not about regulation, it's about not letting somebody make it in their bathtub.

Jay Campbell (108:35)

Think about this though, Scott. Like, that's the scam, right? Because like, the supplement industry is wholly unregulated.

Scott Clary (108:40)

I know it is, but the pharmaceutical.

Jay Campbell (108:42)

Industry is extremely quality controlled. But we talk smack about big Pharma because they make a lot of petroleum distillate drugs that are obviously harmful for people, especially as they age. But yet we have no control of the supplement industry. And there are literally people, you know, I won't name names, but I know them personally who are scamming people and making hundreds of millions of dollars selling fake supplements. Like, I tell people this all the time because I've been in this business in that space and I don't harbor any ill will. There's a lot of amazing supplement manufacturers and they make quality products, but for every good one, there's 10 people spiking their amino acids and literally selling bogus protein. And it's like, if you don't Know, because you're a long term consumer and you buy the right products and companies, you know, that have been in the game for 30 years, you have no way to know. Like we were talking, you know, know, previously about like young people today, there's so much. The signal to noise ratio is so high. Most people buy supplements, bro, that aren't even real protein powder.

Scott Clary (109:35)

That's insane. Well, I mean, what happened with Blackstone Labs and they were putting, well, they actually, they were the opposite end of the spectrum. They were adding drugs into the.

Jay Campbell (109:47)

And that happens all the time too. And all those guys, they know that they're eventually going to get caught because all it takes is one person to test the product, of course, but make as much money as we possibly can and then we'll move on. And that's literally what they do. And so that's why I always tell people like, you know, I don't want to rabbit hole too much. But supplements, you really have to be a wise, discerning, critical thinking end user because a lot of those companies will scam you. And if you don't understand what's in the product that you're taking, there's risk.

Scott Clary (110:13)

Yeah. And even if you do understand what's in the product that you're taking, you're hoping that they're putting that actually in the product.

Jay Campbell (110:18)

And, and, and that was the thing that always blew my mind when I was in the business myself, which thankfully I'm not anymore, is that, dude, even if you bought it from the purest source, if you don't test it every single time that they send it to you, they could be scamming you themselves.

Scott Clary (110:33)

That's scary, dude. It's very scary.

Jay Campbell (110:35)

That's the supplement industry, man.

Scott Clary (110:37)

Very scary. Okay, what about, what about sloop?

Jay Campbell (110:41)

Okay, so SLU PP332, you put it under fat loss. Yeah. So 100. So it's, it's technically a small molecule. It's known as an obesogen. It's been in the underground performance enhancement world since 2019, but no one, including myself, knew anything about it until like early part of last year. I started using it from a company that was selling it and then our company started manufacturing and now it's like everybody has it in the marketplace because it's absolutely profound. Agent. It is a mitochondrial upregulator, which means that it enhances energy production, it enhances fat loss, it improves torque generation or force production. So every, any person who lifts weights or wants to look better naked, can, can, can benefit from using that supplement it's absolutely amazing. And we're finding now that we know that there's like all different types of dosage parameters and it actually, because it's a mitochondrial optimizing supplement, you can also use other supplements or peptides or bioregulators synergistically with it to enhance its. Its effect.

Scott Clary (111:40)

And that's why. Okay, so all the. So you put m. You classify mitochondrial peptides in the same category as fat loss because it just guess they work through different pathways, but you're basically trying to achieve the same end result to a degree.

Jay Campbell (111:53)

Basically. Yeah. And we can talk about mitochondrial peptides right now anyway, but like, I see.

Scott Clary (111:58)

MOT C is another one.

Jay Campbell (111:59)

Yeah. So. So just to switch that. But to answer what you just said, so mitochondrial optimizing supplements do a lot of things, but for most people to measure what they observe or see or experience or feel, you're gonna. It's gonna be fat loss, it's gonna be energy production and fat loss loss. And MOT C, to talk about that, that's the best mitochondrial optimizing peptide for people who don't have healthy mitochondria, which is the majority of people. Right. Because they're fat inflamed, insulin resistant. So when you give those people a nice bolus of MOT C, they become like us. They become energized and they want to go to the gym. And all of a sudden the gym.

Scott Clary (112:33)

And then of course, if you're going to the gym, that's going to be a precursor for losing fat. I see. Okay. Okay, exactly. For muscle growth, is there anything. I mean, let's talk about you. You mentioned a lot of peptides that sort of activate growth hormones and they. And they help increase your natural growth hormone production. So which ones would be the most effective for muscle growth? But also, are there when people take peptides for muscle growth, are there any that even would remotely mirror like an anabolic steroid or are they much lighter?

Jay Campbell (113:09)

So the answer is yes and no. We're not at that point where they're available yet. But there's one peptide that's in that, that deck that you have called ACE031. And that is the actual first myostatin inhibiting peptide that actually works. And what I mean by that, that if you use a high enough dose which as we spoke, spoke previously or off air, it's so expensive right now that no one can technically afford it because it would cost like $12,000 for a month.

Scott Clary (113:38)

Yeah, that's.

Jay Campbell (113:39)

But literally most people does. It literally does it's probably somewhere between 6 and 12,000amonth, depending on if you're a man or woman and how big you are. But it's still too expensive. But the reality is it does inhibit myostatin, which allows people to build muscle like in site specific areas, right? So if you injected it here in your shoulder and you have lagging development, it, it would actually allow you, combined with all the other things, right, Testosterone and a growth hormone agonist peptide. It would allow you to put size in a specific area. So we're getting into like the amazing, you know, parts of like what's coming.

Scott Clary (114:13)

But relatively speaking, bodybuilders are gonna freak out.

Jay Campbell (114:16)

Oh, I mean, GLPs, when we talk about GLPs, you won't even believe it. But, but, but to answer the question about muscle building again, Tessa Morellin, ipamorelin, CJC combined with therapeutic testosterone, if, you know, combined with Sloop combined with eating a caloric surplus, right? Because I always tell people, you know, people, and this is, and you know this from back in the steroid bodybuilding using world, but there really is no muscle gain or fat loss. It's literally a, it's, all of them can work both directions. It's relative to whether you're in a caloric deficit or a caloric surplus. Right? So a caloric surplus to build muscle, you would take Tessa and ipa, or you would take IPA and CJC along with testosterone along with Sloop. And then, you know, again for fat loss, it would just be a caloric deficit and any of those things would also age.

Scott Clary (115:05)

I've seen one that you listed here that you actually didn't mention, IGF1. I've seen that in bodybuilding circles for forever. But I, I, I've always found that people say it's not worth it, it's.

Jay Campbell (115:17)

Not, it's a hundred percent. Okay, So I have to caveat this, it's never been worth it until now because now there is follow statin. And follow statin is a form of IGF1. All the IGF1 that you saw, along with what I saw, you would inject it. They sold it from research chemical companies and nobody would ever notice anything. And the reason that was is the majority of it was being denatured. So when they were putting it in the vials, it just wasn't stable as a molecule. So you weren't getting any efficacy from it. But now there is a company out there that I was telling you about, it's in Lithuania that's making follow statin and they're putting it actually in a, a reconstitution solution that has flavonoids and also a form of exosomes. Dude, it's pretty amazing. I mean, I know, I know people that are injecting, so it's doing what.

Scott Clary (116:00)

It'S supposed to do because it's table.

Jay Campbell (116:01)

Now it's literally building muscles in specific locations similar to what ACE 00:31 would do. But ACE 03:1 is obviously a myostatin inhibitor, so it's gonna be a little bit more pronounced. But yeah, IGF1, you know, they actually, it's known as IGF1 LR3 and it's kind of long receptor 3. But the, but the point of that product, it was always high, right? People would talk about it.

Scott Clary (116:23)

Oh yeah.

Jay Campbell (116:23)

And then bodybuilders would use it or underground, you know, performance athletes would use it and they wouldn't see anything. But it was always. Because they couldn't manufacture it at a level that kept the molecule stable. So when you would get it, or I would get it or anybody would get it and you would use it, you'd be like, this doesn't work. This is a scam.

Scott Clary (116:37)

Yeah.

Jay Campbell (116:38)

And that's what it was. But they, I don't think the people that were making it really intended it for that.

Scott Clary (116:42)

I just think that they just listen again, a lot of this stuff now it, it's more popular. And now you have, have, you know, smart people putting a lot of thought. Chemistry is improving. But for the longest time, when the government makes something illegal, then you have all these. It is kind of scary. People trying to figure it out. Their house trying to figure it out.

Jay Campbell (117:04)

Bathtub.

Scott Clary (117:04)

Yeah, it's just.

Jay Campbell (117:05)

And that's, you know, totally true.

Scott Clary (117:09)

The worst case scenario, obviously they make something that's actually very harmful to your health. And there's stories about people that buy stuff online.

Jay Campbell (117:16)

Steroids, for sure. Thankfully, yeah.

Scott Clary (117:18)

As we said, best case scenario, just not effective. Effective.

Jay Campbell (117:21)

Thankfully. Peptides really isn't going to kill anybody. You know, so they can make these things bad. But there's very rare, these systemic side effects. But obviously with, with anabolics, you know, especially orals like methyl testosterone or things like that, you can shut your liver down.

Scott Clary (117:34)

Yeah, yeah, I know, I know. I think that that's like something that I really want to get across because for some reason people just have this. They have this idea of if I'm injecting myself with something, I'm good, I'm gonna die. And I think that I.

Jay Campbell (117:48)

It's false fiction ever.

Scott Clary (117:50)

It's sad.

Jay Campbell (117:52)

Everybody thinks they're gonna get an embolism, right. And it's gonna go to their heart.

Scott Clary (117:56)

Well, because the average, the average like health routine doesn't include needles. Even, even like injectable B12. Is it B12? I think?

Jay Campbell (118:05)

Yeah, it's B12, yeah.

Scott Clary (118:06)

Injectable B12, which is amazing. It's, it's incredible for energy. But people are so scared of needles.

Jay Campbell (118:11)

Needles Psychobolamyl. Yeah, remember we talked about that. Tyrannophobia, the fear of needles.

Scott Clary (118:16)

So just because you're taking peptides doesn't mean you're taking some underground steroids or. No, no.

Jay Campbell (118:21)

And truthfully, to speak about that, once or twice of an injection of either a peptide insulin needle, which again is microscopic, or as we were talking now, even better. And I would call it Peptides 200 is the peptide. The medical grade pens, which are literally 4mm, which you can literally inject into your face and can't feel it. It. Right. Like women are injecting us for skin quality and skin health and beauty and stuff like that now. So where we're going, you know, and you and I were talking about it earlier too, is there's guys out there, one of your friends, they're, they're inventing a injector technologies that will literally be pain free. Right. So when we get to that level now, we're going to be talking about like, wow, this is really going to become something that everybody wants to take part because, and this is my estimate and I can't prove this, but this is just what my thoughts are on this and beliefs are 80% of the marketplace right now will still not inject themselves. The fear of injection is too much for them to overcome. Even though we both know it's nothing and it's something that anybody can overcome. And listen, I would say 95% of people initially have a fear of needles. But once you do it, it's like, I like to say it's like brushing your teeth. But you still have to get to that point where you do it. Some people. And again, women inject themselves more easily than men do. They'll have their wives or their girlfriends or some nurse or something that they know inject them with testosterone. Testosterone, right. And so they just do that, but they never do it themselves. And it's like, dude, you gotta learn to do this yourself. But that's, that's the barrier of entry. The barrier of entry is like, if I have to inject myself, I'm not going to do it. Or I love injecting myself because once you've learned how to do it, a lot of people just wake up in the morning and it's part of like.

Scott Clary (119:52)

Especially with these pens and whatnot, and you're not getting these huge needles. You're getting these tiny little like, pin pricks.

Jay Campbell (119:57)

Dude. I woke up this morning in my hotel and I injected myself four times with my four pens. I took my red, a true Tide microdose dose. I took my Melanitan one to maintain my tan and increase my consciousness for this amazing podcast. What else did I take? I took my growth hormone, which I always take. And then what was the other one that I took? Oh, follow statin. So. And again, I wish I should have brought some of them to show you because they're literally so microscopic. You, you could go like that. You could go like that. You can't feel it. You literally can't feel it. And then you just push the thing and you're done.

Scott Clary (120:27)

Let's talk about longevity. And I guess anti aging would fall into this as well. I, like, I noticed that some of these, these, some of these, like, go into different categories, like Ipamorelin, I think I've seen, I've seen it like in everything so far. But specific anti aging, what would be the, the. How do they work, what do they do and what are the best ones?

Jay Campbell (120:48)

Yeah, for sure. So when you're using the anti aging or looking at like the longevity ones, there's like three or four that are primary ones and they're technically peptides and bioregulators. So the first one, the most well known and the ones that most people have heard of or maybe even use, is called epitalide. Now epithelon is the actual telomerase extending bioregulator slash peptide. And so you people will take that for 10 days in a row, like twice a year, depending on their age. And it literally improves telomerase expression in cells. So it will literally shorten. Excuse me, it'll prevent shortening of your telomeres as you get older, which is obviously the number one reason for people to age. Now you can combine that bioregulator slash peptide with another one called thymolin. And to explain how that works, the thymus gland, as we get older is what regulates basically our biological age. And most people's thymus gland stops. I won't call it stops functioning, but malfunctions and cessates into their mid to late 40s. So it's theorized. It's probably not theorized because again, the Russians have research on it. That if you use thymolin and epithelon together, you will extend the life of your thymus gland, which again is responsible for all sorts of old all, you know, all call it all systems health in the body. So you would do the same thing. So what most people do when they dose those two is they take 10 days in a row of one day epitalon, next day thymolin epitalon. So it's every other day you're using one of them. And you know, again depending on your age and most people it's recommended to start at like 40 or 45. You would take two courses of it a year. And again a course is 10 days, so it's like 20 days. And we haven't talked about this, but bio regulars are cheap, bro. They're 39 bucks for a box. Right? So it's not even expensive. Super cheap. Right? So and again, we sell these, you can't keep them in stock right now. I mean, I mean people buy them anti aging people, longevity people, people that are into like living long, you know, extending their life or buying them left and right. But it's not expensive. Like if you compare bioregulators to peptides, you're looking at usually like a 1 to 4 to 1 to 5 cost.

Scott Clary (122:47)

Difference per monks are ashrage for.

Jay Campbell (122:50)

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. And this is from research. If we're talking about compounded, it's 1 to 15x. Right. Because again, doctors got to make their money.

Scott Clary (122:59)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course, of course, of course they do. Um, what about, okay, so there's a couple other ones here. So ones that I haven't heard you speak about would be SS31 or GHKCU.

Jay Campbell (123:12)

Okay so both amazing peptides. So SS31 is also a mitochondrial optimizing peptide. I it's interesting though because we are learning more and more about SS31 literally on, I would say by the day, by the week. I started using SS31 regularly and religiously, I want to say in April of last year. And the best way to talk about SS31 is it's an amplifier peptide. So everything that you're doing, again, provided you're doing the right things, it amplifies it. So it improves like androgen receptor sensitivity. So if you're using therapeutic testosterone, you can use lactation gas and it makes it more potent, it potentiates it more, makes it more efficacious, it also enhances your fat loss. Peptides. It just like I said, it's one of those peptides where you take it like every other day, and it makes everything feel better. The other peptide that you mentioned is like what I call the sham wow peptide. So copper peptide, ghkcu. It has so many applications. Women put it as a transdermal solution on the face to improve skin quality, eliminate fine lines and wrinkles. You can also inject it. Like, so if you're a woman and you've had work done on your face, whether it's like laser treatment or Botox or anything like that, like, injecting small amounts or surgically precise amounts will actually get the skin more healthy, improve, improve collagen synthesis. It's an amazing peptide. It can also be used to heal wounds and. And to. To eliminate scars. So, like, if you have, like, for example, I just had a miniature skin cancer. This is only. Only seven days old, and I was a pretty deep cancer removed. I've been using ghkcu, dude, and it's already.

Scott Clary (124:44)

It's already clearing out. That's insane.

Jay Campbell (124:47)

How long? Week. I had this removed when I was in Texas. I mean, Texas when I was in Mexico. I had my dermatologist down there remove it. And it was. What's today? Today's Thursday. So it was. It was. It was done on the day before. So it's been eight days. That's what it was. And that was a deep surgical seven stitch wound. And look at that. It's almost gone now from putting.

Scott Clary (125:05)

Insane.

Jay Campbell (125:06)

Yeah. So, I mean. And you can put it on. And by the way, I, you know, once it's completely healed, I'll continue to put it on. And it'll literally get rid of the scar. Yeah. And it's amazing because it's like a purplish blue powder. And whether it's transdermal or it's injectable, and it looks really cool. So it's almost like translucent when you put on your skin, but it absorbs to. To your level of melanin.

Scott Clary (125:28)

But it is a small little scar that would take care of that, no problem. That was a big. That's a big. Yeah.

Jay Campbell (125:33)

Dude. I'm serious. When this is all healed, and that would be probably like two or three weeks from now, there probably won't even be a scar. It'll probably be just a tiny line.

Scott Clary (125:40)

Wow.

Jay Campbell (125:40)

I. When I had my gynecomastia surgery in 2023, and they removed a lot of glandular tissue from here. Anybody who has gyno has a lot of glandular tissue. If it gets done right, the scar was like, from here to here. I don't even have a scar anymore. And I used ghkcu for literally 10 days after, after the surgery and it's gone. There's nothing. You can't even see the skull.

Scott Clary (126:00)

Are these are ridiculously powerful. Ridiculously powerful, yes.

Jay Campbell (126:06)

And not enough people understand or know about them yet, but obviously people like you and me are bringing this to more people.

Scott Clary (126:12)

Are the, are any of these patented? So some are because I mean like I'm thinking about like who makes money off of this stuff? Because what do you have now for scar cream?

Jay Campbell (126:23)

So we got to say it. So the fda. The FDA of course makes money off of the patented peptides. And the reason that they don't want, I wouldn't say me and my company, but compounded other peptides that can't be patented out there is because they can't make money off of them. So they're constantly regulating them. Right? So we have to say what they did. We haven't talked about this, but In September of 2023 they passed this classification known as 20 class 2 and class 2 classified. And I could be wrong on this, but somewhere between 27 and 32 peptides that are the most used peptides by the clinical space and the research space as being potentially unsafe and harmful, which is total bs, which all the compound pharmacies that made them in mass quantities and were obviously prescribing them through their clinicians fought them and sued them. And so there's just this back and forth non stop, utter nonsense. But again, anyone who's used any of those peptides knows they're not on.

Scott Clary (127:17)

Why would they do that? And set money. But why can't they make money?

Jay Campbell (127:21)

Because they can't patent and that's it, that's 100%. So again there's, and again, I could be wrong if somebody can factor me on this, but there's like 12 peptides that are FDA approved and all of them, they make a fortune on. We're going to get the GLPs, right? We'll get to GOPS. I told you about Manjaro. 4 billion last year, just Manjaro. That's how much they made off of it, right? So like we'll eventually get to a place where I would assume again and maybe, you know, shout out to rfk, he just got confirmed. But, but if, if he isn't able to pull back the restrictive policies of the FDA and all this pay for play like with big Pharma, I would assume that we'll eventually get to a place where there won't be any Peptides legal from a compounded standpoint unless they're FDA approved. Because if they can't make money, they don't want people out there using them. And again, and this is not conspiracy, Bill, you already know this. They don't want health. Sickness and disease is what makes money.

Scott Clary (128:13)

Well, even if you look at other, other sort of medical treatments that aren't approved in the U.S. i mean if you want stem cell treatment, don't you have to go to Panama or something.

Jay Campbell (128:22)

Like Mexico, Costa Rica?

Scott Clary (128:24)

Yeah, it's a joke. And then there's also, I mean now you have the ketamine clinics in the US or. But the, the natural version where you take like the, the medicinal plant based.

Jay Campbell (128:35)

Exactly.

Scott Clary (128:36)

I don't think that's allowed in the U.S. so you gotta go Mexico.

Jay Campbell (128:38)

Well, there's one and I know the guy that owns it. There's a, there's a, a. And of course it's a church. Yeah. In Colorado they just got their license to be able to legally do it. So you can go there on a retreat and get ketamine and get plant medicine and theogens and stuff like that. And it's technically legal. But they had to go through, I know the owner. They had to jump through all these hoops, dude, just to get official. You know, it's like essentially you're on indigenous spiritual property. You know what I mean? So it's like, dude, it's, it's so and so. But yeah, I mean all that is true. I mean this country and hopefully things are changing again, Maha, if it is, God forbid, I mean, God help all of us. And thankfully. But the bottom line is they don't want health here. We have not had health here. We have what they want, sickness and disease. Because sickness and disease is what makes money. Just like Chris Rock said, the money is not in the cure, the money's in the medicine. They don't want people healthy. And Peptides, while we're talking about it, treat the fundamental root cause, as do bioregulators of disease and sickness. Sickness. So you can hear someone who changes their lifestyle while they're taking those things. But you're never going to do that with, with big pharma medicines. Medicines. Because you have Band aids.

Scott Clary (129:45)

You know what's wild to me? Just if you think about other, other things that people try and solve. Like, like cancer obviously.

Jay Campbell (129:50)

Right.

Scott Clary (129:50)

And you always. In the past year or year and a half, I've seen a couple headlines around a group that supposedly cured cancer.

Jay Campbell (129:58)

Yeah, cancer then is 100% cur.

Scott Clary (130:02)

But then it just disappears, of course.

Jay Campbell (130:05)

So.

Scott Clary (130:05)

So which is wild to me. Isn't that like the.

Jay Campbell (130:07)

Shouldn't that be like on the news right now? Finn, Ben as well, I can never pronounce that word. And Ivermectin together cure cancer. There's a doctor on Twitter right now, his name is William Maccus. You can look this guy up. He is curing cancer left and right. They can't suppress him now. I mean, he's using those two drugs, which again are garden variety drugs. Ivermectin, during COVID and then Badaz, Azole. And they're basically like, they're mold suppressors. And then they're also like, they get rid of toxic conditions in the human body. You have to take high doses of them. But evidently they are finding out. And this doesn't apply to all cancers, but majority of cancers are ontological mutations of the cell. Right? And so an ontological mutation of the cell can actually be overturned by getting rid of the toxins from that mutation. And so both of these drugs together work in combination to get rid of the toxins. Bro, guys are curing their prostate cancer. Women are curing their breast cancer from it. I mean, so again, his name's William Maccus, but I would say within the next year, that's going to be the number one treatment. People who refuse chemotherapy and are like, I don't want my body. Because as you know, chemotherapy, dude, literally toxifies the body. It supposedly kills the bad cells, but it also kills your good cells. So why would you do something like that when you can just do this, which only targets the mutations.

Scott Clary (131:21)

What's wild to me is that there's not more research into it.

Jay Campbell (131:25)

Well, dude, there is. They just suppress it.

Scott Clary (131:26)

I know they suppress it because again, even if you look at, if you look at news cycles, it'll pop up for a second gone. And then it's gone. That's weird. That's weird when somebody says they. Because if they didn't cure cancer, for example, say, let's play devil's advocate, say that their, their solution was garbage. Shouldn't they be like strung up and indicted and put in jail for, for. Nope.

Jay Campbell (131:47)

I mean, look, let's give props to Elon Musk and X at this point because in the last year, X has become now this place where you can read anything. There's no suppression. Sure, they attempt to suppress things in other places, but like right now on X, it's the wild, wild west and that information is out there. And I'll tell you this right now, like, I mean, I don't want to rabbit hole too much, but cancer, you gotta change your body's alkalinity and then you gotta use these drugs that they're all talking about now. And a lot of emergent variety drugs that will attack the mutation and not kill the healthy cells, which is what they've always focused on in killing cancer. And, and so I mean, you know, does chemotherapy work? And obviously some people it does and has. But is it the best strategy? No.

Scott Clary (132:26)

But I've also seen like people have some sort of proof that switching up your diet, ketogenic diet has a masculinity.

Jay Campbell (132:32)

Exactly. Change your body's alkalinity.

Scott Clary (132:34)

But like, listen, there's a, there's a small cancer scare in my family and the doctor that the person is speaking to, like, there's not even a conversation about diet? No, no, not even a, not even, like, not, not even a conversation about, okay, if you gonna do chemo, let's do chemo. But maybe also be a little bit smarter about your diet, like how does it have, how does it hurt?

Jay Campbell (132:58)

Is what actually exacerbates tumors. We now know that sugar from the diet, which again is normal everyday Joe Public and Cindy Public, that's what they eat, is sugar, exacerbates the ontological mutations. So it's like we have to change the alkalinity of our body. We can go keto, we can do high fat, essential fats, we can do Mediterranean. There's a lot of different things to do. In addition to now taking fenbendazole and ivermectin to overload the body's toxin.

Scott Clary (133:26)

But my, my biggest issue is doctors won't even say, hey, I'm going to put you on, I'm going to put you on the approved routine of chemo. But let's also do these other things have the best possible chance of success.

Jay Campbell (133:36)

The worst part about that, which is hilarious, is like going to a hospital with somebody who's undergoing chemo and they do all that stuff and then they go down to the cafeteria in the hospital and look at the food they eat. Poisoned.

Scott Clary (133:47)

I know, Pure poisoning.

Jay Campbell (133:49)

Our whole thing is a sham.

Scott Clary (133:50)

Absolute garbage. Yes. What do you think made your body a toxic place in the first place? It's a food. Okay, back to peptides. Cognitive enhancement and focus. So what are some of the ones that you like the best?

Jay Campbell (134:06)

So nootropic peptides is what they're known as. Let's just talk about the ones I don't care for that much. Although they do provide value. Dihexa C max and what's one of my slink? So Dihexa and, and, and, and, and again, for me, the gradient is, is how do these nootropic peptides compare to Modafinil, which you and I most familiar with. Right.

Scott Clary (134:30)

Modafinil, explain what traditional nootropics. So I would say that when, when somebody goes down this journey in college, you're taking a whole bunch of Adderall to stay up and do. And then in Canada, Ritalin was very popular as well, which is like a dirtier version of Adderall, but net. Yeah, yeah. And then you grow up and you realize that all this shit is garbage because you feel like. And maybe you, maybe you passed one test, but then you start to learn about Modafinil and price tams and raised hams. And these are kind of like the, the limitless Bradley Cooper drug.

Jay Campbell (135:02)

Yes. And that's well said and well put. And that's kind of like the, the where people. The origin of nootropics, where they would start in that path. And again, you know, I have a funny story. I'm not gonna tell it for this podcast of like, when I first got exposed to Adderall, and this is going back like 22 years ago, and I was like, whoa. I took like a 30 milligram extended release and I may have been partying previous to that. And so, like, it was like my serotonin was at a low and then all of a sudden it jacked it back up and I was like, wow. But, but the bottom line is Adderall is poison. It's literally a synthetic form of meth. They give it to kids, you know, like you said, young high school and college kids, and it melts their brain. I mean, my God, I can't even get into like, how bad it's for you long term. But the nootropic peptides in comparison to Modafinil, if both of us agree that Modafinil is probably the strongest nootropic that we've ever taken, but also has nasty side effects, causes headaches, has come down, I would say that Dihexa is the closest, but you have to take a high dose. And as we've talked about on this podcast already, what goes up must come down, right? So you don't want to get addicted to taking high dose nootropic peptides because again, it's going to stimulate your brain and your brain is going to be wanting to be at that level and you don't want your brain to be that level all the time. The other ones, again, cmax and Celan don't notice as much as I do with the Dihexa. But again, everybody's different. Some people notice a decent, if not a strong cognitive improvement or, or just enhanced focus on all three of those and at much lower dosage. But again, for me, when I compare it to Modafinil, I just have never noticed them. So I stopped taking them. There's one that we do wanna mention, it's technically not a nootropic, but we talked about it off air. Tessofensi, right? Which is known as Teso. That's the one that enhances brain derivative neurotropic factor. That's the one that like people like us creators, people that live in the creative realms. Like it's an amazing, it's a, it's an oral. And again, it's not a peptide, although it's sold as a peptide. It's a small molecule. You take it and it enhances well being and improves flow state within an hour of taking it. And it's noticeable. And I would say the best part about it, for most people, if not all people, it doesn't cause receptor attenuation and you don't have like a cold, you can cold turkey come off of. And there's no, there's no, there's no come down, there's no withdrawal. The only issue with that drug is, and again, this is my pet theory, is that if you were a person that was on SSRIs because you know some depression, mood doctor or psychiatrist put you on them when you were younger, in some of those people it makes them unable to sleep. They still feel amazing on it, but they're unable to sleep. So you have to take a very low dose of that product. And right now the ones that are available are 250 milligrams and 500 milligrams. So I would tell anybody who's used SSRIs in their past start very low with that product. But that's my favorite of nootropic peptides. And again it's technically, before somebody calls me out, it's not a peptide, it's a small molecule, but it's a really, really powerful drug.

Scott Clary (137:58)

So you can take it like every single day of the week if you want.

Jay Campbell (138:01)

So here's the deal. I took it for an entire year straight at 250 milligrams. And I was like, wow, this is great. But like everybody, you know, like, I don't want to be addicted to something. I wasn't addicted to it because you could come off of it, but I don't want to be relying on on it. Right. So now I use it for things like this, which I took. As I told you, I took it yesterday and I'm. Now I'm taking it today because I wanted to be there and I wanted to be super lit and super, you know, on it. And So I take 250. But, like, for example, I'm not gonna do another podcast for probably a couple weeks. I probably won't take another one.

Scott Clary (138:30)

Do you notice when you take it, like, your. Your recall is a little bit better? You.

Jay Campbell (138:33)

It's amazing. Everything. Yes, yes. I. I should have brought you a couple today so I could have given you one. So.

Scott Clary (138:39)

Nice. Done.

Jay Campbell (138:39)

You're gonna maybe see if I leave there in Miami. I'll give you some. I was actually thinking about that this morning on my podcast, but then I forgot. I mean, on my cardio, and then I forgot to bring it to you.

Scott Clary (138:48)

Okay. It's all good. No, I.

Jay Campbell (138:50)

It's really, really powerful.

Scott Clary (138:51)

I think that's the biggest thing with creatives, and especially people that, in this audience in particular, like people that are always on high performance, people that have to show up cognitively and they want something that gives them like a little bit of an extra boost. Even if you look at Joe Rogan and. And I think he took an equity position in on it, it. If I'm not mistake, I don't know how good it is. I've never used it. Yeah, but those, those things, all those.

Jay Campbell (139:12)

I. I've used them all aquileia and on it, they're all mild compared to, like, you know, nootropics. Um, but again, we've talked about this. Like all nootropics, if you get. If you abuse them, which is using them all the time. I shouldn't say all because TESO doesn't, but the majority of them will cause receptor attenuation and will cause burnout. And you don't want that. Right. So it's like. Like you use these when you have to, but not when you want to. You know what I'm saying? It's not like every single day you wake up and you're like, oh, I'm gonna pop these. And if you compare it to coffee or caffeine, you know, I think we kind of mentioned this off air, but like, again, Sean Wells is now doing a lot of stuff with the analogs or the alkaloids of caffeine. And so now they have paraxathine and some of these others are just Kia. Cream has been around for like three or four years. These are all similar to what caffeine does, but with the left less harmful agents of the withdrawal and the addictive qualities of caffeine. So you'll be seeing a lot more of those come into the marketplace, which I think is actually good for humanity. Because as you know, as great as caffeine has been, and my dad would always say caffeine was the great industrial driver of the, you know, the industrial revolution. But we also know that caffeine is bad, bro. I mean, caffeine addiction is really bad. It screws up thyroid, it screws up your adrenal glands, it screws up sleep. I mean, long term caffeine addictions are not good.

Scott Clary (140:30)

Do you, do you drink coffee at all?

Jay Campbell (140:32)

I don't drink any coffee. I do carry, you know, those little meo electrolyte energies sometimes. So I'll throw it in like water to do it.

Scott Clary (140:39)

You don't take a pre workout before you work?

Jay Campbell (140:40)

I don't do any. No, I don't do a pre workout. Like my pre workout is Cialis at two and a half milligrams. Right. So we haven't really talked about that. But Cialis is obviously a very powerful endothelial function enhancer because it improves nitric oxide to the penis. Right. But improving nitric oxide to the penis, it also improves nitric oxide to the vascular networks, which is good. Right. You want less gunk in your vascular networks. So that's actually at a very surgically precise dose of anywhere from 2 and a half to 5 milligrams. In addition to the improved sexual function, hardening of the penis, it also improves nitrogen.

Scott Clary (141:14)

Really? I've never. I didn't know you could do that.

Jay Campbell (141:16)

Oh, yeah, no, that's actually next to metformin, that's probably the second most important anti aging drug to take a microdose of Cialis.

Scott Clary (141:23)

Really?

Jay Campbell (141:23)

Yes.

Scott Clary (141:24)

It's that powerful?

Jay Campbell (141:25)

Yeah. I'll send you an article. We wrote about it. Like a 6 or 7,000 word article. But there's massive amounts of research on that drug.

Scott Clary (141:30)

Amazing. Okay, let's talk about autoimmune.

Jay Campbell (141:34)

Sure. So autoimmune is probably the most, I would say it's probably the most diagnosed disease in the world now. And this is all stemming from COVID Right. Like a lot of people who A got Covid or A got VA or, or B got vaxed or C got both have autoimmune dysregulation now, women especially, right. It's become like a. I would call it a scarlet letter slash red badge of error to get an autoimmune diagnosis, you know, And a lot of women will get like 10. You know, I have this and this and this and this, you know, and it's like the reality is the autoimmune is something not working with the mitochondria of the body. Right. Dysfunctional mitochondria. Uh, and again, there's so many different. There's, you know, Crohn's, there's lupus, there's Epstein Barr. I mean, I can go on. There's so many of them. And again, these things have exploded, Scott. Since COVID since the vax. Right? Um, so basically, if you optimize the mitochondria, if you use the healing peptides, if you use the MIC antimicrobials like the LL37s. And again, you use them in surgically precise dosages and you use them in combination, you can literally, again, assuming that people are willing to do the things also necessary as the baselines, you can reverse a lot of autoimmune disease with peptides. Not like, I wouldn't say like, you know, you take a person who's got severe autoimmune dysregulation and you give them a peptide stack for a month where they're not going to have it, but you can probably get them back to about 80 to 90% of where.

Scott Clary (143:02)

And if you combine that with good diet, too.

Jay Campbell (143:04)

Yeah. 100 cure. Yeah.

Scott Clary (143:06)

What is it? Jordan Peterson said he cured a lot of his autoimmune with like carnivore diet. Right. Jamie say.

Jay Campbell (143:12)

Which is again, the best way to describe that is they change your body's alkalinity. Right. So they went from like acidic sugar based to a meat based or food, you know, animal protein.

Scott Clary (143:22)

So it's always like, it's. It's not just one thing. It's like you're doing all the things so people can't be looking for these band.

Jay Campbell (143:26)

You're not magic bullets. None of the stuff we talked about in this podcast are magic bullets without lifestyle intervention.

Scott Clary (143:32)

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What's the last. Gut health is important. Everyone keeps complaining about gut health. Health.

Jay Campbell (143:38)

So all the time. Yeah. So gut. So gut. I love talking about gut health because BPC 157 is also great. You can take an oral capsule, an arginine salt formation or formulation of BPC 57 helps with the gut. But the number one drug to help with the gut is Metformin. In fact, Metformin is the number one anti aging drug of all time. It's in the TAME trial right now, which again is Neil Barzilai. He's a very famous Israeli anti aging researcher. And they're probably a year or two away from coming out where now the whole world will know about Metformin, right? And it's always been blocked because most people in medical school were taught that it caused lactic acidosis and kidney problems. So they would, they would never prescribe it to people who, who really truly need it for, for longevity purposes. And I think I told you off air, a very famous doctor that you know and I know, but he won't ever allow me to tell this, to say this, because he doesn't want to get in trouble, said that if metformin and growth hormone were in the water supply, there would be no hospitals. He told me that in 2014 because that's how powerful they are, right? So Metformin is suppressing systemic inflammation. It's upregulating Akkermansia mucilus in the microbiome. So you cannot get sick if you are on a 500 milligram or 250 if you're a woman, you know, bid twice a day dosage of Metformin. There's studies probably a hundred plus us that show that during COVID people that were on Metformin didn't get Covid because it literally makes your immune system impervious to that kind of stuff, right? I, dude, I've been on metformin for 20 years. My biological age is somewhere in like the mid to low, I wouldn't say low, mid to high 20s. And again, there's three different companies testing. And you know, you've got Glycanage, you've got True Diagnostic, which is my good friend, none, just as mention this for a second. None of the diagnostic. I mean, excuse me, the biological age testing companies are ready, ready for primetime. There's issues with them and all the owners and the people involved in the companies will tell you that right now the algorithms are still being worked and perfected and stuff like that. And they also don't have enough data, right? They don't have enough people doing these tests because I've seen people that have taken them who are in super, absolutely amazing fit bodies in shape and don't do any kind of drugs or alcohol and they get like high levels and they're like, this is impossible and complain and then they redo the test and the test is like 27 years or 30 years younger than what was the first time. So there's, there's issues with it. But my guess is, I mean I still love all that. I, I feel that within five to seven years biological age testing will be perfected and it will be at a point where we can rely, we, we can feasibly rely on the actual scores that we're receiving.

Scott Clary (146:08)

When they, when they do those testing is a variety of different factors they take into consideration, but it's, I mean.

Jay Campbell (146:12)

It'S mostly just a prick test. So they're just looking at your blood levels and, and, and looking at what's going on in the cells and looking at what's, you know, technically in your DNA. But it, like I say, it's not ready for prime time yet.

Scott Clary (146:23)

Yeah. Okay. Heart health.

Jay Campbell (146:25)

Heart health. Heart is obviously critically, critically important as we get older. There is a bioregulator called I got cardiogen.

Scott Clary (146:35)

Cardiogen, yeah, I figured that was it.

Jay Campbell (146:37)

Yeah.

Scott Clary (146:37)

Because the other ones I recognize. So some of these are also like there's SS31 for mitochondria, BPC157 for vascular and cardio repair there. Retro. Retro, sorry, retrutide, which we'll talk about in a second. But that's. I know it's a GLP and then cardiogen. Yeah.

Jay Campbell (146:52)

So cardiogen is a oral peptide bioregulator against small chain, small gen. And it is got. There's a lot of people using it. People that have ventricular issues, people with aortic valve issues, people that have had stents put in their hearts. There were dumpster fires, not taking care of themselves. It has been shown to strengthen cardiac tissue issue. So it literally is, you know, again, 10 days of. 10 days in a row twice a year. It will strengthen the heart and it will strengthen a small amount of time. Yeah, that's it. I mean, I'm telling you dude, these things are profound and not enough people know about them yet because a lot more people know about peptides injectable. But bioregulators are such new Johnny come lately on the scene that not enough people know about them. And you know, we're actually going to be, I would say Biolongevity Labs, our company. We're going to be probably doing the great majority of education of the planet of them because like our whole next 12 to 15 months are about telling people about bioregulators.

Scott Clary (147:44)

Research is the biohacking community. Are they not jumping on this stuff, the bioregulators?

Jay Campbell (147:50)

So here's the thing. They are but the truth behind bioregulators, if you're not connected, it's hard to get involved because they still come from Russia. So Dr. Victor Cavinson, who's the father of bioregulators, and again there's research conducts 60 plus years in Russia, they use these things that are like sold over the counter. He put a bunch of patents on them and so they never were available in the west as of basically something. And nobody really knows truly. But at the end of 2023 in the Ukraine, Russia, US debacle, whatever the hell that is really, all of a sudden bioregular starts showing up on Amazon and this is in January of 2024. And they were always blocked. You could never get them in the United States due to the patents. But all my formulator guys and my biochemist nerd research guys would always tell me, the bioregulators are, bro, they're amazing, but we can't get them here. And then they just started showing up. So the problem still is supply chain. They're manufactured in Russia at the Cavinson Institute and whatever his manufacturing capabilities are. But his son, excuse me, Cavinson, died in December of 2023. The father and now his son is making deals with various companies. Some guys in Amsterdam, the guys that own Profound Health or Anti Aging Systems, which is another big offshore or pharmacy that is now getting involved. And so now there's more and more people getting involved in the manufacturing home. So you'll see them, I would assume like in the next six to eight to 12, 15 two years, become much more ubiquitous and much more mainstream because of their effects. But right now there's not enough people in the buyer hacking space getting involved in it because it's just too tough to get in. Exactly. It's too tough to get into the supply chain.

Scott Clary (149:29)

Are they like, does the US government care about these being shipped in?

Jay Campbell (149:33)

I think they do, based on my experience and my personal involvement with them. Because last year I was involved in selling a bioregulator cream. That's a healing cream that we haven't even talked about, which we should. That is the most profound transdermal healing product that I've ever seen. You can't use it on wounds, but you can use it on strains and sprains because it absorbs really, really quick. Indeed, it heals overnight. I mean, you injure your knee doing deads or squats or something like that, you have a twinge in there, you rub the cream on the next day that it's completely huge. No, I mean, it's incredible. And again, it's like five different bioregulators that synergistically work together. So the answer is, I don't know. The jury's out. I will. I do know this. They have labeled them as supplements. So anybody can sell them. There's no restrictions. That's why they're on Amazon. They're not considered drugs, they're not considered medications or literally considered supplements. But I mean, the Russians would tell you their medications and the way they work. And again, they're tissue specific.

Scott Clary (150:26)

Depends on how the regulatory body views them, 100%.

Jay Campbell (150:30)

All I know is, and again, I say this to people and they laugh. They're like, that's B.S. j. But they don't have side effects. They don't have side effects like you take them. They work specific on the organ system or the biological system that they target. There's a bioregulator for the heart, kidneys, the thymus gland, the brain, the prostate, the ovaries in women, the testicles. I mean, there's just. It's incredible, right? So it's just, it's giving that information out to more people so that they can take them. Because like I told you, Scott, they're not expensive. The average person can afford.

Scott Clary (151:02)

Last category before GLP is sexual health.

Jay Campbell (151:06)

So sexual health primary. Two peptides, most known, and I'll mention two bioregulators, are PT141, which is an erectile enhancing. It's really actually a melanin cortoid receptor complex peptide. Here's the problem with that drug. Drug. 40% of people are non responders. We did not know this when that peptide first came into the market in the underground back in like 2008, 2009. And very truthfully, because I heard so many great things about it, it never worked for me. And I was like, dude, what's going on? You know, I was like, he's scamming me. But then about 2016, 2017, we started realizing that people were non responders to it. Truthfully, I'm a complete non responder to it. I've used it like four times in my life now. It does not work in me. For women that are non responders and take it, they get sick. And what I mean by sick, I don't want people to freak out, but they get nauseous and usually they have like vertigo and they have to go to sleep for a couple hours because it's don't feel good. They get like that dry heating effect. But for those people that it works Bro, it's incredible. I mean, a man can maintain an erection like for six hours straight. It can come three or four times, shorten a refractory period. It's insane.

Scott Clary (152:11)

If you respond, if you respond.

Jay Campbell (152:13)

And for women, they also have a heightened sexual response to it too, too. The other one to mention is oxytocin, which I think most of your audience knows what oxytocin is. It's responsible for pair bonding. It's that kind of neuroendocrine hormone that is released during times of love and intimacy. So if you inject it, you get that same feeling. Now in some people, depending on like what's in their stomach, what's in their, in your small intestine, they may not get the same effect. But if you inject it usually in the morning on a fasted empty stomach and you want to be intimate with your partner, it's pretty awesome. Them, the other two to mention are bioregulators. And there's one called femi. Male and, and, and male, I forget the name of it that we sell both of them. And those are great for like perimenopausal women and also older men whose sexual function is declining because basically it works on the prostate, it works on the testes, for females, it works on the ovaries. So it's like, it's basically just like, again, just consider it like an overall enhancement to sexual actual function. And those are oral capsules, by the way.

Scott Clary (153:12)

So again, you don't have to worry about the, the needle. That's a concern with these. When you look at all the new peptide, because obviously, like these are the ones that you've used yourself or like you actually sell. When you look at all the peptides that are now, I'm sure there's ones that you haven't mentioned that are sort of very, very, very new that are not sort of proven out. Like I'm sure. Yeah, I have no doubt. Like, what's the, what's the, the way to figure out if they're going to be helpful, harmful, if there's no long term, if there's no long term studies on them. Like, what could be the worst possible scenario with a peptide? Like, how could it impact you in a negative way?

Jay Campbell (153:51)

I mean, it's, it's hard to know. I mean again, personally, because I'm asking.

Scott Clary (153:54)

The question that somebody who's listening to this.

Jay Campbell (153:56)

Yeah, no, that's a great question. I mean it's like anything in life, like I've been personally using now for close to 21 years. I started in 2004. I had nothing but success. I've never had any horrible negative side effects. Obviously my biological age is a lot younger than what I am. I'm almost 54 years old. I'm in great help. I'm in better. As I told you, which we get to in GLPs in a second. My biomarkers are better than they've ever been in my life. Even someone I was in my early 20s. Right. So all things being equal, I'm improving both from a biological age standpoint and then also just a physical performance standpoint. So I would just say like we don't know the long term effects of anything. Right.

Scott Clary (154:36)

20 years, that's a lot of years.

Jay Campbell (154:38)

Yeah, that's a lot of time. But the truth is, is, you know, to be honest, we don't know. But like we know that there are biological organic molecules that are formed in nature and in our bodies naturally. So what you know is the potential harm compare. If we compare them to again, Rockefeller Petroleum distillate big pharma medications which are not natural and not naturally occurring. Right. So like if you're going to compare and contrast, I would definitely put my money on peptides and buy regulators long term than I would those drugs.

Scott Clary (155:07)

Are there some that sort of are sold. You don't sell them but are sold that are actually dangerous, you know again, Tim Ferriss.

Jay Campbell (155:16)

The difference between a pill and a poison is the dosage.

Scott Clary (155:18)

I think that you, there's none that are like, don't take this.

Jay Campbell (155:20)

No, no, no. I mean, I mean, but the thing is, is like again, you know, you, you have to be judicious, dishes start low, go slow, assess your tolerance. How do you respond? What happens? You know, don't, don't start taking high dosages. For example, Fluke. There are people out there messaging me all over the world who are taking 500 times the dosage level because they're retarded, bro. More must be better, right? Super size me bigger, stronger, faster, you know what I mean? So it's like if you're not smart with what you're doing, is the risk of course worse? If you take too many aspirin or Motrin or ibuprofen, you can up your kidneys. So it's again, be judicious in how you use these things. But I have not seen anything that would like, tell me like, oh, there's super risk.

Scott Clary (156:02)

Thank you Netsuite for supporting today's episode. Now, what does the future hold for business? If you ask nine experts, you're going to get 10 answers. Bull market Bear Market Inflation up Inflation down. Honestly, I just need a crystal ball. But until we get one, over 41,000 businesses have found the next best thing. They future proofed their operations with NetSuite by Oracle, which is the number one cloud ERP. Imagine having your accounting, your financial management, your inventory, your HR all flowing together in one fluid platform. Here's what makes NetSuite different. It gives you one source of truth for your business. You get the visibility and control to make quick, confident decisions while others are guessing. You're working with real time data insights forecasting. You're basically looking into the future of your business with actionable data. Whether your company is earning millions or even hundreds of millions, NetSuite helps you respond to immediate challenges and helps you grab your biggest opportunities. And speaking of opportunities, they put together the CFO's guide to AI and machine learning at netsuite.com ScottClary this is the playbook for understanding how to use AI for your business business. The guide is free. Go to netsuite.com scottclary that is netsuite.com scottClary A big thank you to Indeed for supporting success Story because hiring people is one of the hardest things you're ever going to do as an entrepreneur, as a founder, as somebody who's trying to build a business. Because it's important to hire. Well, it's important to hire and find the right person, but it takes so much time. It's so labor intensive because like most entrepreneurs, you have a thousand things going on and there's a good chance that you just realized your business needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find that great, amazing right fit candidate fast? It's easy. You just use Indeed because you don't have to waste time struggling to get your job post seen on all these other job sites. If you're using Indeed, you can just use their sponsored jobs to help you stand out and hire fast. Your post jumps right to the top of the page for relevant candidates. It so you can reach exactly who you're looking for faster and the results really speak for themselves. According to Indeed data, sponsored jobs posted directly on indeed have 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. You know what I love most about Indeed? It really just makes hiring so fast because everything is streamlined in one place. No more juggling multiple platforms or waiting weeks for the right candidate. How fast is indeed? In the minute I've been talking to you, 23 hires were made on Indeed Indeed. According to Indeed Data worldwide. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed and listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit. To get your jobs more visibility@indoubtedly.com Clary just go to indeed.com Clary right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com Clary terms and conditions apply. If you're hiring, Indeed is all you need. Need Huge shout out to Pork Bun for supporting today's episode. They were voted the number one domain registrar by USA Today in 2023, 2024 and 2025. Pork bun helps you establish your trusted online presence with a Dot Pro domain. You can go get one there right now. The Dot Pro domain extension is perfect for any online professional, from freelancers to small business owners. It helps you show off your skills and provide instant credibility to your online portfolio. Make your experience even better when you choose porkbund.com because every domain from Pork Bun comes with features like free WHOIs, privacy, SSL certificates, web and email hosting trials, and more. After all, why are you paying for things that should be free? With a simple user interface, you can manage everything about your domain from one place. Plus, it all comes backed by personalized 5 star support 365 days a year. If you have any problem, Pork Bun's gonna help you out. Get ready to level up your professional online presence and grab a dot pro domain for only $1 for the first year at Pork Bun for a limited time. Okay, let's talk about GLPs for sure. Low so started off with Ozempic and now we have Manjaro and now there's other ones as well. But what should people know about GLPs? Because there's also a lot of. No, I see some negative. I see.

Jay Campbell (160:20)

Oh, there's tons. It's more negative propaganda than there is positive.

Scott Clary (160:22)

I just. So I just saw on Twitter somebody it was a trending news article, you know, on like the right side of Twitter you see all the trending stuff. And it said that people taking Manjaro, Trizepatide, some of them went blind. Yeah, because of blood vessels leads.

Jay Campbell (160:36)

It leads. So. So there's a lot to unpack. So to start off, GOPs have been around since 2008, which is insane to think about it because most people don't know what a GLP was until the last couple of years. But they've been around since 2008 in their very rudimentary phase. They were used in obese people and type 2 diabetics. Even then, when they were very Very rudimentary and crude. As far as their original format, they still worked. They still. What I mean by defined work, it was they lowered people's A1C. They improved blood glucose regulation, and ultimately, if those people changed their diet and lived insulin control, they lost body fat, right? And again, this is way before what we have now. Now fast forward to now, and as you and I have already talked, the average person today is so fucking lazy, bro. They wanted the lowest action, common denominator. How can I get away with doing the least amount of work, Right? So take that attitude, that mindset, and then realize that the average doctor prescribing a GLP is not even. Doesn't even know what they're doing, right? They go to a weekend class, a farm rep comes in and says, hey, you can make an extra 30 grand a month if you promote Ozemp, right? So like, these are people again, the doctors who are doing their best, I understand, who don't understand how to prescribe them. They're not giving the patient, slash the person the actual, you know, methodologies, which we'll get to of like, how do you make GLPs work? And so then what happens is, and again, remember, these people are all obese, they're all insulin resistant, metabolically deranged. They start taking them and the weight comes off because they're not eating. They're not stuffing their pie hole anymore. It suppresses their appetite, especially with go movie. And three weeks go by and they've lost like 60 pounds. But what they don't realize, by not eating enough protein, by not exercising, by not doing resistance training, they've now damaged their thyroid. They've damaged their body's ability to be in a positive nitrogen state because they're not getting enough protein. So, dude, four weeks now they're in. Their doctor has been titrating the dosage higher and higher and higher because as we've said, or as I said at various points in this podcast, Best Big Pharma's motto is start high, go higher, make more money. Exactly. And again, it's synergistic thing, right? Because the doc makes more money and Big Pharma makes more money, right? So they're both incentivized to give more. So at four weeks in giving more now the person is like at a crossroads because a. The doctor's like, well, yeah, but guess what? Now your monthly dose is just going to be $4,000 or $3,500 or whatever it is. And so they're like, oh, I can't afford this. And so they come off and now they're in a shift, they're in in shit's bill because they damage your thyroid. They have caused muscle loss and now rebound.

Scott Clary (163:13)

The resting metabolism is also lower.

Jay Campbell (163:15)

Everything is damaged. Now the rebound weight gain comes. These people are now taking to the streets, to the airwaves, to social media, and they're going to start telling everybody how bad it was for them right now. The truth, Scott, is those same people have issues with their eye, they have issues with their gallbladder, they have issues with their thyroid. They have all these, you know, wegovy.

Scott Clary (163:36)

Face is all gov woman who was taking it, who was already super skinny and she was taking it just for probably Dr. Recommended dosing, but to probably not have the food noise and the hunger pangs. And then she doesn't work out, doesn't have a good diet, and then she.

Jay Campbell (163:52)

That's why I didn't even eat for three weeks.

Scott Clary (163:53)

She broke because she had no bone density.

Jay Campbell (163:56)

Exactly. So all this happens and the again the, I, I won't mention the names I could, but some of the famous celebrity doctors glom onto it and they start saying, see, we told you so, These are bad for you long term. Don't. Then they all cause muscle loss, blah, blah, blah. And so it just gets to this point where it's just like signal to noise ratio. We're back to signal noise ratio. The noise is so high, it's negative, it drowns out all the positivity. But the positivity, which we'll eventually get to, is really what makes these drugs, the wonderkin drugs that they are. They're, as I've said, they are the single greatest medical intervention since penicillin. And I would say that within two years they will be bigger than that. They're already the highest profit, most sold most procured drugs in the history of medicine. So obviously there's good and bad with it. But the truth is, is that to get to like, how do we use these things and how do we use these things so that they are beneficial and positive for anyone, regardless if you're a dumpster fire or you're someone like you and I or a woman like you and I that wants to just eliminate food noise. So this is how we use them. We first off, start low and go slow. We microdose these drugs, which you're never gonna hear from pharma or from most of the doctors now. Now there's a ton of doctors that are microdosing them now because I know.

Scott Clary (165:11)

How the average is Take it once a week. That's the average advice.

Jay Campbell (165:14)

That's 90% of prescribers. We wanna get it towards 80%. Right. Where 20% of people are doing this. Right, right. It's the Pareto principle. But the thing is, is that for the guys and the docs and the people that are doing this right, they start with a microdose. And by the way, we have to say this, this semaglutide, which is wovi, is completely useless at this point. It's a one stage agonist. There's, there's either they're classified as single, dual or triple. The single stage agonist, which again is wegovia or semaglutide is just suppressing oic. It's just suppressing appetite. Why would you want to just suppress your appetite when you can also use one that enhances your metabolism, which is your general overall purpose anyway, of losing body fat, improving insulin sensitivity. Right, right. So for the people listening to this podcast right now, if you're using semaglutide, slash wegovy, you don't, you shouldn't personally use it anymore. Some of these people are going to be like, but Jay, my script is written for that and I get a copay and a lower payment on it because again, if they're classified as a type 2 diabetic, they're getting it through the system which is, you know, broken. And so they're going to be like, I can't afford the other one because I don't have a script, blah, blah, blah. But I'm just coming from a J. Campbell expert status of like, what are you using the best, what's going to work the best? Tirzapatide is FDA approved and that's Manjaro. And zepbound is now the miniature version of it that is so much better than using WeGovy. So I just, again, if you're listening to this and you're trying to understand, like, which GLP1 to use, if you're going down the medical route, the compounded route, you're trusting your doctor route, that's the one to use, don't use the other one, but that one to go deeper, microdosing it every other day or at least three days a week. So you would be 2.5 milligrams is the standard dose for people that do it intelligently. Now again, most docs, they're starting heavy dumpster fire, inflamed fat people at like 5 and 10 milligrams, bro, which is like, no bueno, Bad, bad, bad. But you'll see that. But if your normal dose is 2.5 milligrams, then you would want to take, take.04 to 0.5 of that dose every other day, which would be like three days a week. And so now if you do the math, and I know most people can't math, the math doesn't math anymore, that would be like 1.25, which would be half the regular dose of 2.5, which would be the standards.

Scott Clary (167:35)

You have a 1.25 spread out. That is, that is microdosing.

Jay Campbell (167:39)

That is.

Scott Clary (167:40)

So you wouldn't even hit the 2.5.

Jay Campbell (167:41)

You wouldn't even. And so why is this important? This is important because. Because you're never destabilizing your receptor sensitivity to the drug. So you can stay on it for a long time when you take two high dosages, again the pharma recommended way, you destabilize and cause receptor attenuation. And four weeks in, it doesn't even work unless you go way up and then you get hooked. You can't afford it and all the negative things happen. So if we microdose it, what else do we have to do? In addition to microdosing, this is critically important stuff. We have to eat at least 1 gram of protein per pound of our goal body weight. The scientific answer is of our lean muscle mass, right? But the average person can't compute what their lean muscle mass is, right? So like one of my smart friends was like, you just tell them it's their lean body goal weight, right? So if you're 280 pounds and you should be 220, then you're eating 220 grams of protein, right? If you're 190 and you should be 160, then you're eating 160, right?

Scott Clary (168:38)

Easy math, easy math.

Jay Campbell (168:40)

But from there, and this is even more important, dude, you cannot use a GLP1 peptide and not lift LE because they're so effective at burning through fat and muscle that resistance training is the one thing that's going to prevent the muscle loss or the muscle adaptation. Now even more important than than lifting weights would be being hormonally optimized a hundred percent. I always tell people this. And again the smart doctors again shout out to Dr. Rudy Eberwine who's down here at MHI in Miami. He's been doing these things since 2008. In my course he actually does a 90 minute lecture bonus video in our course that he talks about everything you should know from the highest level clinical side of things. With GLPs. And he's very, very professional and very intelligent guy. But basically he says tirzepatide and testosterone are, are mandatory. He's like men and women, right? Because again, you've got the hormonal optimization. The anabolic signaling from testosterone, even in therapeutic surgically low dosages with tirzepatide will enhance the fat loss, but you will prevent any kind of muscle catabolism. And that is critically important. Right? So just to recap, must eat enough protein, 1 gram of protein per pound of lean body weight or goal weight. Should be, I shouldn't, I won't say must because obviously some people are hormonally optimized, but most people should look into be hormonally optimized. And then I would also say in addition to the Tirzepatide, glp, a growth hormone and agonist peptide that we talked about, right? So a Tessa, an IPA, a CJC, or even a mitochondrial optimizing peptide like a MOT, C, SS31 or even sloop, right? So all of those in combination with your GLP is going to cause the greatest metabolic adaptation and body composition modulation that you've ever had in your life. Like I said, said, I know people who aren't dumpster fires, who are not metabolically deranged, who use a tiny, tiny dose of the tirzepatide and we'll get to rotatrutide in a second and they've completely changed their bodies. They've gone back to like the best time of their lives, right? 50 year old people who literally are now have a physique of a 25 year old.

Scott Clary (170:48)

The way that I think about it. Because if people have not gone down this path and gone on this journey yet, they're gonna be like, well, why? Why isn't like my body enough? Why do I have to sort of enhance and optimize? Because you're fighting this losing battle and the food that you eat, the environment that you live in is not the same food and environment that your parents and your grandparents were living.

Jay Campbell (171:08)

I hung up the phone with you last night. We went to STK and that was the biggest mistake ever. That food is so poisoned. That steak was loaded. I even told them, do not put salt and all the crap preservatives you put on it. They didn't listen to me. I came out, out and I couldn't even eat it. But my point is, to your point, we're everything's contaminated. You can't even go to a high level steakhouse in south beach and get something that's not contaminated in your food. So you're right, like you're doing a GLP1 in a micro dose to offset the damage that you must undergo ribbing.

Scott Clary (171:43)

Everything is damaging you, dude.

Jay Campbell (171:45)

Everything.

Scott Clary (171:46)

Yeah, that's diets being high job, 100%.

Jay Campbell (171:49)

Testosterone, biggest tool in the tool. But, well, a GLP1, a microdose of a GLP1 right behind testosterone, and then add in a growth hormone agonist peptide or a mitochondrial agonist peptide. And that are. Those are your tools. Those are your 21st and 22nd century tools to offset the environmental degradation that Scott, you cannot avoid. I don't give a shit who you are unless you're living in a Faraday cage, not going outside with your own.

Scott Clary (172:16)

Farm, your own animals, your own.

Jay Campbell (172:18)

And by the way, the farm would have to be underground because you're still being hit from the. They're dropping in the skies. It's true.

Scott Clary (172:25)

It's scary.

Jay Campbell (172:26)

It's all true, dude. I mean, it's scary if you want to be scared of it, but obviously you have to intervene.

Scott Clary (172:33)

I agree. And I think that the argument is, well, we're living longer than ever. I'm like, but are you really living?

Jay Campbell (172:37)

No. Are you really the average people, your 70s or. Ludies are not living qualitatively, they are living. You imagine.

Scott Clary (172:45)

But you know, I'm 34. Yeah, right. So imagine I'm 70 years old and I live to 100. So basically, the time that I've been on this earth, and part of it I don't even remember because I was a kid, time I've been on this earth, that's the amount of time I have to live with, like shitty hormones. Yes. No sex drive, can't go to the gym, can't go for a walk, no energy. Everything hurts. My mind's going. The time I've been on this earth. Earth. That's how long I have to deal with that. Until I die.

Jay Campbell (173:14)

It's insane.

Scott Clary (173:14)

But you don't. That's the issue.

Jay Campbell (173:16)

This is a fact, dude. This is a fact. And I didn't know this and just found this out recently and I had to fact check this myself in 2022. I'm sorry. Yeah, it was 22 and 23 men in Canada and the United States between 20 and 30, 50% of them did not have sex one time. 50% between 20 and 30 did not have sex one time. 20 and 30 United sex one time.

Scott Clary (173:40)

That is what happened.

Jay Campbell (173:41)

As to the 40D, I mean, who knows? But that is because when you really look into this, that is because they jerk off to porn and they play video games and these rewire the dopaminergic signaling pathways so the reward behavior pathways are compromised. So why would you want to court a woman, right? Like, why would you want to deal with a woman's innotionality when you can jerk off the porn three times times a day? And in your mind, that's the same thing. We, you and I both know it's not.

Scott Clary (174:07)

Definitely not.

Jay Campbell (174:08)

But. But that's what they think, right? And then it's the same thing with video games, right? Like, I can kill people in a video game and I can be like, dominant or whatever. And so that. So all that has changed the world. But if you realize that the 50% of dudes between 20 and 30 are not having sex, then you realize that things are off, which also hormones are depressed, testosterone is depressed. Mental, everything is. Again, what we're talking about is under attack. All of our systems, it's a full system.

Scott Clary (174:35)

Our body's under attack. Our, our life is under attack. Everything. And it all, it all creates a super toxic environment. Yeah, hormones, but also then cost of living. And then like everything people were defeated.

Jay Campbell (174:49)

If you don't do what you and I are talking about in this podcast, it is highly likely you do not live a life, life that is prosperous. And I mean, again, in my circles, in your circles, I mean, we know so many people that are doing the things that we're doing now because again, it's mandatory. How if you don't, you're under siege. How do you offset living in a contaminated, full, systemic assault environment? You can't.

Scott Clary (175:17)

I mean, because of the show and just my network, I deal with a lot of people that have had massive success. Success. And now everybody's everything you're talking about.

Jay Campbell (175:24)

This is what they do.

Scott Clary (175:25)

This is what they're doing because they want. They want to live good lives. They want to live good life. But what's so funny is that it doesn't actually take a lot of money.

Jay Campbell (175:34)

No, it doesn't, dude. We'll get to that before the show's over. I want people to understand because that's what they ask. They're like, oh, you guys just make too much money. Those average people can't. Dude, everything that I'm talking about, if you take ownership of this, it doesn't cost a thousand dollars a month. Who can say they can't afford $1,000 a month if you don't?

Scott Clary (175:51)

Because what you're going to do Is you're going to spend $1,000 on all the other bullshit on beer and lattes.

Jay Campbell (175:56)

I mean, the truth is, and again, I say this all the time. If you cannot spend five to $10,000 a year on your personal health, regardless of your income level, your priorities are inverted. It's not because you don't have the money. It's because you don't have the responsibility to be proactive because you waste money in places that you're not paying attention attention.

Scott Clary (176:13)

And you'll spend it more with health, healthcare, what a sick care house here, whatever.

Jay Campbell (176:17)

I mean that's. Well, that's the most important thing, right? Like, and again, that's a lecture that I do in my seminar in two weeks. But like, dude, if people understood what a myocardial infarction or heart attack would cost them, they would never not spend money on their health. Because one heart attack in 40, the average person, it costs them 400 000. Yeah, one heart attack a second heart attack is medical bank bankruptcy. People don't understand this, dude. But this is the system that we're in. Benefits don't pay for that kind of stuff. Those are acts of God and life interventions. And you don't understand like what happens to you if you have a life flight. What happens if you have a heart attack when you're driving down the road and you cause an accident and now you have to be life flighted? That's $600,000.

Scott Clary (176:57)

It's insane.

Jay Campbell (176:59)

People don't understand it. But that's like.

Scott Clary (177:02)

And on top of that, on top of that, the insurance industry is designed to confuse the hell out of everybody too, too.

Jay Campbell (177:07)

But if you live the way that we're talking about on this show, you're not going to have that happen. I mean it could, could it happen? Could, could, you know, a tragic, you know, accident occur? Of course. But statistically it won't happen to you.

Scott Clary (177:20)

But I think that also if you're. So if you're spending five to ten grand a year on your health, you know what else you're doing? You're monitoring your health and you're getting your blood and you're getting your scans and you're getting your everything done because you care about it.

Jay Campbell (177:32)

And now the people that are watching this show and the people that come on the show, like me and others, we're spending probably 25 to 50, right? But any person can spend five to 10. And that's just the facts. But like, you know, we will get to that. We'll quantify what Talking to all these things we're doing. But I'm telling you, dude, it's not a thousand dollars.

Scott Clary (177:49)

Yeah, I know, I know. And especially if you do it with not a company that's trying to take.

Jay Campbell (177:54)

Advantage of you, which is 100% what you have to do. And you obviously have to be really discerning and critical thinking to avoid those companies.

Scott Clary (178:01)

Okay, so let's talk about retatrutide.

Jay Campbell (178:04)

So Retatrutide is a Eli Lilly patented drug that is not yet FDA approved. It is expected to be FDA approved. It's a GLP1, of course. It's expected to be approved in either late 2026 or at some point in early to mid-2027, which is insane because it's been in the marketplace since 2023. In the research community. Community. Okay. Why is it the most amazing drug, and I'll just say it right now looking at the camera, is the most amazing drug in the history of mankind because it is a triple stage GLP1 agonist, which means that it burns fat, suppresses insulin, and enhances mental productivity and rewires dopaminergic, serotonergic and dendritic pathways. All for the positive, all for beneficial means. So what does that mean to somebody who doesn't understand adult? I just said it means that you will be leaner, healthier and more energized if you use it. It's that profound. I've not met a single person who's used it. And by the way, there's less than 2% of the planet has used it because even the people, and let's just call them 10% of humanity that is using peptides. They are using medical provided or compound pharmacy provided peptides. And they're not allowed to make retro Troutide yet because it's not FDA approved. Improved. Right. But the research community, which is what I'm involved in, Biolongevity Labs, and as you know, there's many other companies, Buyer beware. That's been. It's been in the marketplace since July of 2023. So I have personally been using this product now for literally 18 months. When I first started taking it, like all biohacker guinea pigs, we didn't even know what the dosage was. The studies were in morbidly obese diabetic people and they were taking 6 milligrams a week. So I was like, oh, I'll just take three. Three, right. Because I had been taking two or 1.5 or whatever with terz appetite and did what I took it it enhanced my metabolism so much that I, I was ravenously hungry. I was like, oh my God, this isn't gonna work. I mean, I mean, you felt hotter and more energized, but it was like too much of a dosage. So I personally.

Scott Clary (180:07)

Then that's actually not accomplishing what a lot of people want, which is the.

Jay Campbell (180:10)

Food and all this people it's not good for. But for like a bodybuilder, which we'll get to that application. It's insane, right? Because it's anabolic. It's actually enhancing nutrient partitioning and glycogen restoration. But the truth was, is that we just didn't know like all these drugs because it's in the experimental phase that we just had to microdose. So once we figured out that you microdose this thing, bro, it was game over. It was absolutely game over. Women are taking my wife. A lot of women I know they're taking like 0.15 twice a week. Those heals.

Scott Clary (180:41)

So it's powerful.

Jay Campbell (180:42)

Oh, it's insanely powerful. But it kills food noise. It completely changes the brain again, the dendritic, serotonergic and dopaminergic pathways so that it only rewards like there's no more craving shitty foods. There's no more emotional based eating. You get sorry or sad. Like a woman, you know, who gets emotional during her, say a period or menstrual cycle and she eats shitty, you know, foodstuffs. It eliminates that. So again, just a micro dose for healthy women is going to eliminate food noise. It's going to change body composition. As I told you. Shout out to Adam Lambert who owns Be the Wellness. He just talked to me yesterday in the morning. He's like, bro. Or it was not yesterday, it was on Tuesday because I flew up yesterday to see you. But he was like, bro, we've been using this for three weeks and my wife's body has changed. And he's. I think he wanted. He's like in his early 40s, but he's like, my body's. She looks like she's 28 again. It's in three weeks. In three weeks. And I'm like, dude, I told you, it changes everything. It's like I said. I mean, all I can say is the greatest drug ever invented. Sadly, it's not FDA approved yet. It will be, but there's no reason that anybody watching this show. And again, I'm sure there's hundreds, if not thousands of people that watch the show that are already using it. Can't Find it, we sell it. A lot of other research, chemical companies sell it. It's not expensive. I mean, let's just talk about that. You can get a 10 milligram vial for under 200 bucks.

Scott Clary (182:07)

What, what makes the price expensive or not? What? Compounders, Just compounders jacking the price up.

Jay Campbell (182:12)

And it's an Eli Lilly drug. So you can only imagine, especially with me being this untrained salesperson out there touting its capabilities, how much they're going to charge for it. My guess is when this drug is FDA approved, it will literally cost $5,000 a month. Month. Divide through compounding pathways, which is a farce unless you get a script. Right. Because you're some diseased individual that they label you as. Right. And even then it's going to be 1500-2000, which is still out of the pockets for the average American consumer. You can't afford that. A guy that has till kits and.

Scott Clary (182:43)

Exact theirs and then they.

Jay Campbell (182:45)

But I mean again, the research community is offering these drugs available. If you claim that you're a researcher and you want to experiment on yourself. Right, but again it's, we've got now 18 months of this in the marketplace. Nobody's getting sick, there's nobody dying. There's no horrible side effects.

Scott Clary (183:01)

I mean, has it acted as a thermogenic too?

Jay Campbell (183:03)

Everything.

Scott Clary (183:03)

Nutrient partitioning. I mean, thermogenic.

Jay Campbell (183:06)

It's absolutely a thermogenic because it's enhancing resting metabolic rate. So it's why I'm sitting here right now. I'm burning calories on an accelerated rate yard. Like if I took my shirt off right now and I got on camera, you'd be like, dude, that's how lean I am. So it's like. But that's what it does. And so let's talk about, about the bodybuilding and performance enhancement arena now because this is important, this drug and, and things coming and, and we, we talked off air, but there's four stages coming, bro. So there's going to be an anti catabolic component added to these three. Right. So you can only imagine. So like genetic mutant bodybuilders can take.

Scott Clary (183:39)

It and gain muscle, but you can already add an anti cat. Well, testosterone, alchemization, anti catabolic.

Jay Campbell (183:44)

You can add other anti anabolic steroid. Right, exactly. But, but imagine when they actually add an anticotabolic then on top of it. But this is completely changed.

Scott Clary (183:53)

On top of that it's not as detrimental to your health.

Jay Campbell (183:56)

So dude, that's where we're going because I want to Talk about my biomarkers. So this has radically changed the competitive bodybuilding arena as we, as we talked before, because you and I were both competitors and stuff and had bodybuilder and dead physique stuff before. Like to, to be shredded on stage, you had to become comfortable with being hungry, right? Like, that's just a bodybuilder's mantra. You knew that if you really wanted to be peeled and diced, you would have to be starving. The last two to three weeks of your competition, that's gone. Now this drug will radically lower your body fat by. All you have to do is just clean up your diet dramatically, right? Like lower your carbohydrates, eat very clean essential fatty acids, fish and stuff like that. Get green leafy vegetables, broccoli, stuff like that.

Scott Clary (184:40)

But you're not starving at all.

Jay Campbell (184:42)

And it eliminates hunger. So there's no thought of like, pizza, Pizza, Hamburgers. Hamburgers. You remember, dude, like, you'd walk by somebody and you would smell the food and you'd be like, I remember.

Scott Clary (184:53)

I remember when I used to try and diet down, like. So the girl I was dating at the time, it's so funny how people deal with dieting. The girl I was dating at the time, all she would do was want to look on Instagram at food Instagrams as to like, look at all the. She couldn't eat, I couldn't do. I would lose my mind. I. Because she'd send me stuff, I'd be like, stop. Stop sending me this shit. I'm trying to diet.

Jay Campbell (185:14)

So imagine now fast forward to now where that's a thing in the past, right now to go deeper with it because we, we talked about it. It is for people like me, for, you know, and again, people way beyond me. Advanced bodybuilders. It's anabolic, dude, because of the nutrient repartitioning, right? So like a person who has optimal genetics, you know, optimal drug regiment, optimal peptide regimen, in addition to a microdose of vertatrutide, will literally be bigger and leaner than they could have ever been doing it before that. That's how insane this stuff is, right? So we will see over the next five to 10 years. This is my, my opinion, but I, I know it's going to happen. The world of bodybuilding and acting and people that, you know, have like mutant physiques will be like, would never seen it before. Like, you will see people, like, they won't have to use CGI in the Marvel movies probably, bro. They'll probably have people That'll be like, Jesus Christ. That's like his real body. They're just doing CGI off the real body. But it's just the future for it is insane. Now let's get into the part that really matters. Your biomarkers improve. So again, I've been getting my biomarkers done since 1999 twice a year. Sometimes I would get them once a year, but for the most part, I get them twice a year. There's been years. I've gotten them three times in the last two years. I've gotten them three times a year because I really want to look, look, you know, because I was concerned that maybe these GLPs aren't doing good things. Just had my blood work done in January and I've never in my life ever been able to move my HDL cholesterol level above north of 44. I've always just had low HDL. I've had very low risk inflammatory markers. I've always had good blood labs, bro. I had 64 HDL, which for someone like me who's never been over 44, it's like awe inspiring. And it's all from a retired. I've done nothing else than what I've always done. And obviously I'm meticulous. But it improved my HDL markers by 20 points. Now, my cholesterol.

Scott Clary (187:14)

You're already low body fat, bro.

Jay Campbell (187:16)

I have no body fat. So then I year round I'm 10% or less and now I'm about 7. But literally.

Scott Clary (187:21)

So what is it? What's the mechanism that's doing that?

Jay Campbell (187:24)

It's suppressing inflammation. It's regulating insulin sensitivity. It's obviously improving nutrient partitioning. It's obviously eradicating visceral body fat, which is the number one, you know, inflammatory health marker. So it's just doing so many good things. And then the other thing is, and this is the stuff that we really don't understand yet. But dude, the brain stuff, it's doing right. So it's like it's putting you in addition to all the physiological, biological health markers that are improving, it's putting you in such a positive state. You don't have bad days when you're on retatutide, dude, like you wake up in the morning and you're just fucking red, ready to go. You know, you sleep deeper. Because remember, this is another thing is that like most people's sleep is disturbed by inflammation. Yeah, brain inflammation, gut inflammation. You don't have it when you're on retreat tide in a microdose it's gone. You go, you knock out, you're asleep. You should have told me. The one hotel last night, they have lights that come on because of the flat form. So if you move in the bed.

Scott Clary (188:24)

The light lights come on. Okay, so I do like the hotel, but that's annoying.

Jay Campbell (188:27)

Yeah, my wife and I were like, what is going on? Is there a way to turn this off? We slept really good because the bed was amazing. But like, for example, other than something like that happened, dude, you don't wake up, you laugh because you know that that happens, right? Like, is there a way to deactivate that?

Scott Clary (188:42)

No, not that I know of.

Jay Campbell (188:45)

Is that in every room? Oh my God. That is. That is an architectural disaster.

Scott Clary (188:50)

It is. Is. I like the hotel, but the hotel's amazing.

Jay Campbell (188:53)

I have nothing bad to say, but, dude, I literally turned.

Scott Clary (188:55)

Every time he stayed there, I turned.

Jay Campbell (188:57)

Over in the bed and it did it. My wife was like, what's?

Scott Clary (189:00)

No, that seems too sensitive.

Jay Campbell (189:01)

No, it literally, I, I mean, you know, I moved and I picked up my pillow, you know, and it turned on. Turn. Yeah, because it's like, it's, it's, it's emotion sensitive.

Scott Clary (189:09)

Yeah, but I don't remember being that sensitive. Last time I went, it did it for us.

Jay Campbell (189:12)

And my wife was like, what in the hell? It was like 3:00 in the morning. Sounds and the lights.

Scott Clary (189:17)

Ah, that's funny.

Jay Campbell (189:19)

I mean, not the whole thing, right? But the.

Scott Clary (189:20)

Yeah, I know what you're talking. I know exactly what you're talking.

Jay Campbell (189:22)

Yeah, but it's enough lights to turn it on, so it's like crazy. But, but yeah, so you don't have brain inflammation, gut inflammation. So everything is just improved. And again, I mean, dude, that's the thing is like inflammation is the primary mover of disease, right? It causes all disease, heart disease, brain disease, neurological disease, type 2 diabetes. All the things that people get at some point in their life who don't take care of themselves. If you don't have inflammation, you don't get disease. And remember, we talked about this already and we'll get deeper on this when we start talking about training. But the longest, the statistically proven way to live the longest is to be the leanest, to maintain leanness. Now people will ask me, jay, what does that mean? It means for women, you should be 15 to 22% body fat. For men, you should be 10 to 15. I say 12 to 15. Very few guys are going to walk around year round at 10. But I like to tell guys you should, you should stay 12 to 15. And every now and then, as a bucket list thing to do, get to 10. Right. Just because you can do it. And it's the thing where it's like, I have control over my physique, right? But like, those are the levels that if you stay in that range for the majority of your life, you will not get sick, you will not get disease. Because again, visceral body fat in the center mass and for women, it's sometimes in the hips and the low back is what causes disease, dude. Because visceral body fat causes cytokine storms. And cytokine storms are literally a giant inflammatory cascade that leads to horrible pain, suffering. Again, default state of not, not healthy.

Scott Clary (190:49)

Yeah, I know. I think that. I can't remember who told. Who was saying this, but the two markers of. Of living a long life are if you work out and lift weights and then your VO2 max, 100 multiple VO2.

Jay Campbell (191:03)

Max and grip strength determine how long you live. There's a hundred percent. And grip strength is not. Is just normally better if you lift or right. And VO2 max. I'm glad you said that because we will get to that. A lot of people don't lit. I mean, don't do cardio. They lift, but they don't do cardio. And especially as you get older, it's like bro. And, and, and, and ladies, if you don't do cardio, you can have strength in your heart. And the heart and the vascular network around the heart is the really the extender of life. Like, if this is not efficient, you can't have blood flowing and pumping, you know, as effectively as you would if you didn't. So. So you gotta do lifting, you know, again, two or three days a week of resistance, but you also gotta do cardio. You have to.

Scott Clary (191:41)

And that's the important thing too. So we can talk about. Do anything else about GLPs, because I want to talk about working out lifting, because again, I don't want people to listen to the show and then just think, oh, I'm gonna, you know, inject the whole stock and it's gonna save my life and I'm gonna be in the best shape of my life, 100%. So any. Any other thoughts about GLPs?

Jay Campbell (192:02)

No. Just as great as I've raved about them and said them. Again, they're just an adjuvant. Again, retatrutide is probably a little bit better than an adjuvant for all the things that it does. But if you don't have the basics and we'll define the basics as you're getting six to eight hours of sleep every night. You're looking to make sure that you're hormonally optimized, whether you do it naturally or through therapeutic testosterone. Again, that's men and women. That's not just men. You're using probably a growth hormone agonist, peptide, or even growth hormone itself. We haven't talked about growth hormone. We should. Good.

Scott Clary (192:31)

You're not HGH.

Jay Campbell (192:32)

Yeah, exactly. A micro dose of growth hormone at 40 and above is life extending. It's. It's absolutely life. Life enhancing. Enhancing and life altering. There's a lot of negative stigma that's been in the marketplace about growth hormone for some stupid reason. You know, people think that it shuts down your body's pituitary and your natural production. It's complete nonsense. I've been using a microdose of human growth hormone since 2021. I use a genotropin, Pfizer. Genotropin from a pan. There's millions of people on the planet. They're doing this now too. There are no side effects. You, you're not even, even at my age of 54, you're not shutting down your body's natural IGF1 levels. Scott, there are thousands of scientific studies peer reviewed using growth hormone in dwarfs, right? In children that have dwarfism or have the premature closing of the knee plates, right? And so they give them insanely high levels of growth hormone to overcome this so they can be normal sized adults. There's no side effects. They don't see cancer. They don't see metastatic tumor formation. So for whatever, whatever misinformation was put out in the medical community say 30 or 40 years ago about using growth hormone causing cancer or exacerbating tumors or anything, it's complete bullshit. Any smart anti aging or longevity doctor will tell you that a small microdose of growth hormone, both for a man and woman, is amazing if you can't afford it. And by the way, it's very affordable now because.

Scott Clary (193:54)

Okay, so my question was, was it used to be. Not question, but that it used to be way too expensive to the average anymore.

Jay Campbell (194:00)

Not anymore. There's since COVID the online pharmacies around the world, bro, you can get a 36ie pen for like 300 bucks. Well, that's generally what lasts like two.

Scott Clary (194:08)

Months and, and 10 years ago. Used to be faked all the time.

Jay Campbell (194:11)

It was. Bro. Bro. Bodybuilding stuff, Chinese stuff.

Scott Clary (194:14)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jay Campbell (194:15)

Green tops, yellow tops, all that stuff, right? Completely laughable Right. So you can get pharmaceutical graded genotropin or nordotropin, which comes from Novo Nordesk, which is the highest quality in the world, again in a pen that you can carry around with you and it's amazing. But if you can't find that, you can't afford it, which nobody really can't, but let's just say you can't, then your next best option is growth hormone agonist peptides like a tessa, like an ipa, like a cjc.

Scott Clary (194:39)

Would you take both at the same time?

Jay Campbell (194:41)

So some people will. If you have like massive sleep issues and you want to take like a microdose of growth hormone in the morning and say like a maybe a little bit more than a microdose of TESSA at night to enhance polyphasic sleep and deep restorative sleep, you can, I don't see any negative risk to that. You may be just getting a little bit more growth hormone than you technically need. But again, if you have sleep problems, it's gonna help you with sleep.

Scott Clary (195:04)

Yeah, but.

Jay Campbell (195:05)

Yeah, so that's it. So those are the basic foundational precepts along with using a GLP that everyone, as long as you follow that, you're going to get tremendous benefit.

Scott Clary (195:15)

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Jay Campbell (199:17)

Oh yeah, we didn't talk about that. So we have to. That's actually great because I don't want to forget that. So I use a product, a product, a peptide called melanitan 1. There's also melanitan 2. Both of these are what are called melanin cortoid receptor complex peptides. And what they do is, is they increase the amount of melanin in your body. So each of us has a. A level of melanin that is produced based on our ethnicity and our origin. Northern European people like you and me, we have less melanin than people close.

Scott Clary (199:45)

You used to be as white.

Jay Campbell (199:47)

I was whiter than you, bro. I started taking this in 2008 in a microdose. And there's something else about it that is phenomenal that we must talk about. And it permanently changed my skin color. So now I dose this like because I'm in Miami right now and I knew I was going to be in the sun this morning and maybe I'll be in the morning tomorrow because I. We're actually going to leave. I got to get back from my seminar. But I'll take a micro dose in the morning before I go out and I get to see tiny amount like literally like 0.1 or 0.15mg nothing. But I've been using it since 2008 in addition to changing my sun complexion. And again, so people understand this, the darker your melanin, the more protected from the sun you are. So I've actually improved my ability to not burn and to be more protected from the sun's damaging rays. Right. Again, everything again, pillow to poison. If you're going to be in the sun, which is great for you, it's minimal, right? Morning, late afternoon, when the red light from the sun is the best. Best if you're meditating or sun gazing or something like that. So that's when I get in it. But as you can see, I'm dark, bro, because of my melanin production, right? This also protects me from again, cancers, skin cancers. I mean, I have. This is just a basal cell. I've had two of these in my life. But, you know, every 10 or 15 years, almost every white person gets one of these things. And so it gets surgically removed but. Or just torn out. But it's, it's amazing. But the, but the primary benefit of melanin tan 1, which I didn't actually realize initially when I first started taking, enhances consciousness. Now I've written about this in multiple books in the last three or four years. More and more people are starting to see this. Dr. Seeds, William Seeds, who's a famous peptides doctor, he talks about enhancing consciousness with this meditation impro. Improving your mind's ability to go silent, right? Drown out the drunk monkey. And in fact, again, I never noticed it until probably like six or seven years ago when I started writing about it, but I became much more spiritual when I started injecting this like, spirituality and evolving my. And growing my soul became a focus of my life. But it was indirect, so I never tied it two and two together. And then I started reading the research, like later in 2016 and 2017, where people were talking about this and I was like, oh, you know, it was like the light bulb came on. So it's an amazing peptide. Now the other one to mention that people take, which I have to talk shit about, is Melanitan 2. Melanitan 2 is definitely one of the only peptides that even though it enhances tanning and people get really dark, a lot of competitive bodybuilders, both men and women, use it. In some people, not all, but in some, it can ex exacerbate or accelerate mole formation. So you can get like darker moles. Now that doesn't make them cancerous, but obviously darker moles can become cancerous. So I avoid melanitan 2. The other thing that I would say about melanin tan 2 that must be mentioned is that some people get nauseous taking it. Some people also because, again, the melanin cortoid receptor complex peptides just like pt141, some guys get a spontaneous erection from it too. Really? Yeah. So it's, it's. It's one of those peptides where it's like, if it works for you and, and you get really, really dark, and you just use a tiny, tiny Amit. Because you're a bodybuilder, you know, competitor, and you want to get on stage really dark and defined, then use it for a short amount of time, as long as it's not darkening moles. But for most people, the risks outweigh the rewards. You don't want to have darkened moles, and you definitely don't want to have a spontaneous fraction.

Scott Clary (203:08)

You don't need that. Ah, they're not useful a lot. Listen, a lot of the stuff we're talking about is very useful for health and wellness. This is more of a vanity.

Jay Campbell (203:17)

Exactly. Yeah. No, no. Melanitan 2 is literally created for tanning. Melanitan 1 was done for consciousness and enhancement. But the other thing is, I didn't mention this. Melanitab 1 is actually FDA approved. It's called bralaminotide, and it's outrageously expensive.

Scott Clary (203:35)

Of course it is, bro.

Jay Campbell (203:36)

No lie. I can buy it direct for $3 a vial, 10 milligram. They sell it with a script for 1900 bucks. So think of that. More cup.

Scott Clary (203:46)

Yeah, that's pharma.

Jay Campbell (203:48)

Exactly. So it's like, if you're listening to this right now and you're like me, and you use this and you're getting a script. Stop, stop. Go to biolongevity labs.com and buy it. It's not $10 because we got to make money. But it's not expensive.

Scott Clary (204:00)

It's not. It's not 1900 bucks.

Jay Campbell (204:03)

No.

Scott Clary (204:03)

Pharma makes money, man. Pharma makes the biggest.

Jay Campbell (204:07)

It's the biggest profit center in the world, bro.

Scott Clary (204:09)

What did you say? Manjaro.

Jay Campbell (204:12)

And $4 billion off of just.

Scott Clary (204:16)

Or one.

Jay Campbell (204:16)

One time, last one.

Scott Clary (204:18)

Peptide.

Jay Campbell (204:19)

And that's not the biggest. Right. Because semaglutide, which is wegovy, is the most prescribed and most.

Scott Clary (204:23)

You know, how much is that?

Jay Campbell (204:24)

That I don't know. But my estimates are it's over 10 billion.

Scott Clary (204:26)

It's more than 4 billion.

Jay Campbell (204:28)

Yeah, it's a lot more than 4 billion. Right.

Scott Clary (204:30)

All right, Last piece of the puzzle working out. So we've spoken about, you know, testosterone therapy, optimizing hormones. You know, we talked about, like, lifestyle a lot as well, and then peptides. And I think that working out is a big piece of it. And obviously, it's a big piece of both of our lives. So what are. What are thoughts about, you know, what should you do if you're going down this journey of health and wellness and say you've never Worked out ever before. Where do you start? Or you never worked out properly?

Jay Campbell (204:59)

No, it's, I mean, it's a good question. I mean, you know, I'm, I'm glad we saved this for the end because I'm, I'm very outspoken about this. But the average person who goes to a gym has no idea what they're doing. You know that. I know that. We see these people, we feel bad for them. But again, you can't go up and wave your arms and say, hey, I can show you how to do this better. Right? Right. A person has to be receptive to changing their patterns and obviously doing the work. Right. So unfortunately, most people don't understand how to train. And what I mean by that, so I can define that, is to build a muscle. To build muscle and to change your physique as you age, you have to lift to what I call positive muscle failure. Some people call it progressive overload. Right. What does that mean? Let's define it. It means that you train in a rep range, that when your set ends, you, you failed. Now you haven't total failed, like in bodybuilding where they're like, you have somebody assisting you and doing like you're doing bench press and somebody's spotting you. But as an aging person, man or woman, you're not going to have a spotter all the time. And so you want to go to a point where you cannot do one more rep in good form without using ego and momentum. Right. You're not herky jerky or something. Right. So that is how you build muscle. And again, consistently, Darren, hard over time, training deposit muscle failure will change your physique. And so many people don't understand this. Now let's talk about this and drill down and deeper into the rabbit hole. If you're not an athlete, you know, you didn't wrestle or play football or basketball or baseball or soccer or whatever. Growing up as a kid, it's probably likely that you don't have a lot of neurological coordination. Right. You didn't practice like you and I, we practiced. It was part of our life.

Scott Clary (206:32)

But also when you do those sports, if you play them at a competitive level, you do get proper weight training. Exactly.

Jay Campbell (206:37)

That's true. You get coaching. All that's involved. Right. So average person who isn't that, and that's fine. If you're like that, you don't have what we have because we learn from practice and from coaching. So what is the solution, Scott? It's not to go to the gym and fuck off for 30 years, right? Which is what most people do.

Scott Clary (206:56)

They go to the gym as like checking the box and they don't even know what they're doing.

Jay Campbell (207:01)

I'm going to church on Sundays. I dress in my finest clothes. I do all the rituals, I shake hands, I put the money in the basket and now I'm.

Scott Clary (207:09)

Now, now I'm. Now I'm religious. I've done it. Now I can be an asshole the other six days of the week. And I don't know where I am religious.

Jay Campbell (207:16)

It's so true. So it's like if you're one of these people and you're listening to this right now, you know it's okay, raise your hand, right? But it's like the truth is, is you must hire a coach. You must hire a quote unquote personal trainer. It doesn't have to be necessarily the trainer at your big box gym because you and I know most of those people, or suck, the good ones at these big box gyms aren't even going to see you anyway because they have too many clients. So find somebody that can teach you how to lift to positive muscle failure. The correct strategy, technique, sets and reps, intensity, all that stuff can be taught. And we both discussed this, in under three months, you can learn how to lift, which, by the way, is going to benefit you for the rest of your life in three months, some shorter, maybe some need six. But you cannot become dependent on your trainer or your coach to push you through your workouts. Now, I want to mention this because we talked about this previously off air. If you're a Super rich, billionaire, 100 millionaire, whatever you are, and your life is all job and you just want to literally be brain dead when you come to the gym and hire a coach to push you around, that's a different story, but for average people, which is the majority of people, and I won't call you average, but just the average person listening to this podcast. Podcast. You don't need a coach every time you go to the gym. That's insane. And besides, you should be inherently motivated and driven to go and do it, to build a better body. Not for narcissistic or vain purposes, but to be stronger and functional as you age, right?

Scott Clary (208:43)

You have. You want to, you know, run around with your kids, want to pick up.

Jay Campbell (208:46)

Your grandkids, hike a mountain. Yeah, exactly. There's no reason that you can't be in your 70s, 80s and 90s and totally physically strong. And I would just say productive, right?

Scott Clary (208:58)

You had a good stat, like the leading cause of what was it? Was it leading cause of death in elderly people?

Jay Campbell (209:04)

It's literally a hip fracture, which is a spiral hip fracture. And then a spiral hip fracture, because it's a compound fracture leads to breakdown of the biological system function, organ functioning, heart, vascular, and they die. That's how they all die. I mean, literally almost all old people who fall and break their hip die within a month because everything shuts down. And that can be easily prevented. Dude, that's all due to osteopenia encyclopedia, which is lack of muscle, lack of bone mineral density. And why, why do they not have bone mineral density? Because they sat on their ass their whole life watching the boop tube. It's like, dude, don't say that you can't afford a gym or don't say that you don't exercise. I mean, bro, as you and I know, you could literally just do standing squats, push ups and get a towel and put it around a door handle and pull and take it to positive muscle failure and do it three times a week and you will be stronger and live longer than the people that are falling and breaking their hip. Now obviously you should go to a gym because you have more access to equipment and you have better options. But for those that can't, don't come up with excuses. But I mean, look, dude, again, we said it before, we'll say it again. The key to living a long life is to remain lean. You can't be lean unless you have muscle. Muscle is the greatest deterrent to the diseases of aging. Aging. The more muscle you have, the more metabolically active you are, the more insulin sensitive you are, the more you burn calories at accelerated rate while you're sitting here. Right. So it's like muscle is the gift that keeps on giving. I think women hear that we should say this and they're like, oh, I don't want to be a big bulky bodybuilder. You know, I want to hear that. I want to be lithe, I want to be toned. I want to be sculpted as a woman. You cannot be a big bodybuilder unless you take tons of testosterone and God knows what other things. Right? Right. So you're not going to be that way. You can go to a gym as a woman and you can pump iron. Hardcore. And you're only going to get toned. You're not going to get big and bulky. So.

Scott Clary (210:56)

And it all depends on diet.

Jay Campbell (210:57)

Exactly. But stop thinking that bodybuilding or lifting weights is for men and not for women. I so many people think that Nicula.

Scott Clary (211:04)

I Believe the exact same as you. I, I've always found it so stupid. Like I, I mean I'm, when I go to the gym, it's like you structure your, you structure your lifts around, you know, bench, deadlift, squat. That's always what I've been taught. Loss. And then you have all, you have your compound movements and then you can do some isolation stuff on the side. But if you get those down, first of all, you're strengthening all your joints, all your tendons.

Jay Campbell (211:24)

You're neurologically coordinated.

Scott Clary (211:26)

Yes. And I think that everyone, women, men, everyone should focus on those lifts to a degree. And it's not like you're, you're one rep maxing and pring.

Jay Campbell (211:35)

No, and let's talk about that because I'm glad you brought that up to unpack that those three foundational movements, bench, squat, deadlift, are what everyone should learn to do. Do. And I would say do until you're 45. At 45, the body doesn't have what is called synovial fluid in the joint capsulations like it did at your age or in your 20s. So that doesn't mean you should stop squatting, deadlifting and benching. But you should not be doing it heavy and you should not be doing it like, you know, in a, in a, like you said a one or three or five repetition. You should be doing it lighter. Controlled weight, controlled moment, I mean controlled movement. Movement and doing higher reps. But the bottom line is, is you're right. If you learn those exercises initially in your 20s, 30s and early 40s, then you are stronger neurologically and you're more, I would say, biomechanically sound so that as you get older you can actually just start using Primarily like say 70% of your exercises will be machine and 30% will be, will be free weights. Right. And again, and this is important to stress as you get older and you're stronger already neurologically, machines can generate more force from a lever standpoint. Right. Than full body compound movements because you don't have to rely on the joints and the other tissues. So for example, if you're a 50 year old guy and you have a nice physique and you want to go and do chest, you're going to get more intensity from a chest, like an inclined chest machine, like a hammer strength machine, than you would if you were doing dumbbells.

Scott Clary (213:04)

So you're actually hitting the chest. Exactly, exactly.

Jay Campbell (213:06)

That's what I was going to say. You're stressing the primary mover, which is the chest versus the delt versus the elbow versus the triceps, which are all indirectly involved, but you can't. There's no shortcut. You have to do the compound movements, the dumbbell movements in your earlier years before you become really, really strong, say in your 40s and 50s. But I just like to tell people that as you get older, you can definitely rely on machines more because you can absolutely stress that prime mover or that joint, joint better than you can with machines. But a combination balance is always key.

Scott Clary (213:38)

I also think that my biggest issue with trainers and if somebody wants to get a trainer, they're, you know, they go to the gym, they go to. This is what the average person does. They go to the big box gym, they ask for a trainer. And what I hate, what I hate about trainers is they don't focus on the basics and what they try and do.

Jay Campbell (213:54)

They're on balls. And these.

Scott Clary (213:58)

The term, the best term for, for, for what I see trainers doing with people is it's fuck around.

Jay Campbell (214:04)

Itis abject.

Scott Clary (214:05)

Like, yeah, just like they're not doing anything useless. They're doing everything that I think they, I think the reason my trainers do it is because they want to confuse the client to thinking that keep coming back, I can't work out without this person.

Jay Campbell (214:18)

Keep coming back.

Scott Clary (214:19)

So if the trainer can't teach you what to do in three months and they don't focus on core lifts or at least things that seem, seem like you can walk into the gym without them and do them, that. That's a scam. I think It's a scam.

Jay Campbell (214:32)

100. And again, it, it, you know, outside of the rich people that say, oh, I pay that person to just confuse me. Right? Yeah. For three days a week, for 45 minutes a session or whatever. And those are that small minority, that's 100 accurate. Because again, if you do not learn the intensity, let's call it the desire to show up in that three months, then what the are you doing anyway? You're not paying attention. Tension.

Scott Clary (214:56)

Well, I've had trainers and this is the thing, this is different. So people are going to be, well, then what's the point of a trainer? So I've had, I know how to work out and I know all the lifts now when I have a trainer who's kicking my ass in the gym and, and you know when a trainer counts down from 12, but then they count 1210 times before they. Yeah, they're like 12, 12, 12, 12, 12,. And like people that push you beyond.

Jay Campbell (215:19)

That'S a different story.

Scott Clary (215:20)

That's what a trainer's for. So a trainer. A trainer I think is more mental than anything else.

Jay Campbell (215:26)

But again.

Scott Clary (215:27)

But I would do all those same lifts without Brandon.

Jay Campbell (215:29)

I was just going to say, and we've already said this, you don't need that guy more than 90 days. Right? Because if you learn the intensity necessary to change your body composition, then it should be inherent in your mind that like, okay, I'm doing this because I know I need this and I know what I need to do from a stimulation standpoint. So I'm going to do drop sets, right? Instead of that trainer pushing me for 12 more Reps. Reps. I'm gonna drop the weight in half and do 10 more reps myself. So again, you become inherently motivated to do what you already know. Not to say that it's okay not to hire an awesome coach every now and then. And I look, I have no problem hiring a coach when you're in your 40s and 50s for say six months or three months just out of the blue because you want to do something and you want to see like a benefit or a gain and you want to like, see what this person want to like have fun, miss the push on. Exactly. You want to push beyond. There's nothing wrong with that. But like I said, man, like the whole point of like what we're talking about is, is that people have to understand what it takes to build a better body. And it's not what you said. I love that word. It's not going to the gym arounditis three days a week, clocking in, clocking out, getting fatter, joints breaking further and further down. Because again, dude, as you get older, your metabolism slows down. You're not going to look better. Being at my age, my wife's age, people our age, in our 50s and having a six pack or having an amazing physique, it takes work. But not only does it take work, it takes knowledge. And the knowledge or the gnosis of getting there is actually more than half the battle. Because if you don't know how to get there, no amount of work is going to get you there. And that's why I get mad when I see older people who clearly aren't, you know, New Year's resolutions people, right? Like these are people that have been coming to the gym for decades and they look like. And it's because all you have to do is watch one set and you're like, what the is that that person doing? You know what I mean? Right? It's the people that are pulling the Bar down like this or doing tricep push downs like this and this and this. And it's like, dude, like really, like you couldn't have hired somebody at one point in your life. And, and we need to say this because a lot of people talk about this now, especially the younger generation, way younger than you, bro. They go on Instagram and they go on Snapchat and they go on TikTok and they watch these young fit bro and fit ho influencer who also are very gifted genetically and they think they're just going to watch them and they're going to learn how to train doing that. That is when it gets. Because you again, if you don't have neurological coordination, you were not an athlete, you were not coached, you didn't practice. You got to have somebody that can teach you how to do this. It's really that.

Scott Clary (217:57)

So you also, if you're also following people on Instagram and you're a natural, say you're a natural kid, like 16, 17, 8. You're not taking any drugs. Drugs and kids, kids take gear so young. Now.

Jay Campbell (218:09)

SARMs.

Scott Clary (218:10)

SARMs. We talked, yeah, we already spoke about SARMs. How bad they are. But they also, I mean they also take a lot of gear. They so, dude, and some of these like 18, 19 year olds, they've been taking stuff with their 16.

Jay Campbell (218:20)

They're shutting. We. We should mention.

Scott Clary (218:22)

But the point is you can't, you can't look at them as this is how I should train.

Jay Campbell (218:26)

No, and just to say this because we talked about sars, but like, like, if you're a young guy or gal and you're using gear in your early age, there's going to be hell to pay later because you are shutting down things that have not fully formed. And so you have like essentially, I mean, again, dude. And you see this all the time. You know, I think of that guy, Boston Lloyd. Yeah. When you accelerate, when you accelerate your basic physiology through drug use before it would have naturally happened end all you do is do bad things. So I guess the moral is if you're a young person and you're watching this and I'm sure you have a lot of aspiring young people, this don't do sarms A And if you're going to do anything, just use a micro dose of therapeutic testosterone when you have a deficiency based on your biomarker measurement and don't go anywhere else until you're in your 30s because you are neurologically still growing and developing until you're 30 years old, you don't shift you don't grow height wise anymore. Right. And past like 21, 22 too. But you're neurologically still developing. So I would not do anything other than touch testosterone. You want to use like micro dose of anabolics, that's fine in your 30s and 40s, but wait until everything is done.

Scott Clary (219:34)

Yeah, people are so. People just want to move so quick. Boston Lloyd treated himself as like an experiment. Yeah, I literally.

Jay Campbell (219:45)

Alex Kykel, who's speaking at my seminar, was very good friends with Boston. And him and I have had, you know, deep personal, one on one conversations about that guy. He was a very, a very interesting guy. He was not a bad guy, he was actually well liked. But yeah, dude, he did not have any self worth. And his worth was how much can I inject every single day? Like he, like, Alex told me he was like his personal need was living based on how much he can inject every day. Like that's what he lived off of. Like, I had to do it. I mean, it's sad, but this is.

Scott Clary (220:14)

Where people go because again, not the only one.

Jay Campbell (220:16)

He's not in humble, but. But the truth is, and again, we can get to this before this is over and talk a little bit about spirituality. So like when you don't have love and trust of self, you don't have worth. And so your worth is generated based on like what you do. You know what I mean? And I don't mean like productive wise, but just like your physiology or your narcissistic vanity of being bigger and bigger and bigger. And so many guys in the bodybuilding realm and all of us have a part of this. We have what is called muscle dysmorphia. We don't see ourselves, what we actually look like. We're either smaller, we're not lean enough, we're not muscular enough. Right. It's like we're crazy critics. And so I always tell people, like, that's cool, we all start there, but you gotta work on your inner game so that you can get to a place where you do look in the mirror and you do feel worthy and you do feel enough. I'm enough. I don't have to be bigger, I don't have to be smaller. It doesn't matter. Exactly. It doesn't matter that I'm not that lean. It doesn't matter that I'm not that muscular. So and so has a better physique, me. And that's fine. I don't have to compare and contrast. Right. So many people today, it's all about comparison. Because Social media, right. Comparison is the thief of.

Scott Clary (221:19)

I don't even know why guys do it. Because you know what guys get into bodybuilding to get, to get the girl, right?

Jay Campbell (221:25)

100%. Everything is sex.

Scott Clary (221:27)

Everything is sex. But then who do you actually get attention from when you're jacked and shredded? All. All other dudes. All other dudes. You look so good, dude.

Jay Campbell (221:35)

You look dudes, bro dudes credit don't even give a.

Scott Clary (221:39)

You know, there's this saying in Russian that I only know because Gina speaks Russian amongst the other languages. But it's. The saying is. And I can't speak Russian. Bell said in English, a man should only be slightly more attractive than a monkey. That's the saying. That's the saying. So the point is you should be focused on work. You should focus on making money. Now I'm not saying money is everything, but you should see some. It's a pretty interesting dynamic that we have some friends that are very below average looking Russian guys with like supermodels. The point is they focused on how do I make wealth, how do I build a business, how do I. But and I think that, listen, I don't think it's good to, I don't think it's good to just focus on money. I don't think it's good to just become, you know, ripped and shredded and not focus on business either. I, I don't think it's good to do either of those things and then forget about your, your mental health or your spirituality. But the point is you, you should be focused on upskilling across all levels of your life. And if you, if you want to be in shape, being in shape does not mean being 250 pounds, 7% body fat. That's not in shape. And, and if you, if you build a, that's mutant level and if you want to make money, fine, make money, but don't make money at the expense. Like if you have a hundred million dollar exit and your kids hate you and your wife hates you and your parents hate you and you have nobody left in your life, also not worth it.

Jay Campbell (222:58)

I love the up leveling. I, I think, I think, I think to just to add to that is, and this is statistically proven too, but if you take care of yourself, and again like you said, it's not being 250 pounds and 8% body fat. If you're lean, functional, maintaining that 10 to 15% body fat year round type, you know, body workout into a room exuding Persona, you will exude confidence. People will take you, seriously, they're not going to look at you like you're some stiff or some sort of slob, you know what I'm saying? Like, like you said like no guy who exited 100 million who's a metabolic emergency gets respect. Nobody gives a, nobody gives a shit. Dude. Again, you exit 100 million and now you're like, oh, I'm going to take care of my personal health. It doesn't work like that. You're already a disaster. It's going to take you years, if you can even last that long because you know how much hard work it's going to be to get back, right? So it's like it's, it really does behoove you. Balance is, is key. But like if you just take care of yourself enough that when you walk into a room that both men and women literally respect you because they're like, oh, this guy takes care of himself. I mean I've seen so many influencers speak about how a 40 plus year old man walks into a room. This goes with women too, but obviously from a business standpoint, it's men who's in shape. That person is taken seriously more than the person who isn't. And that's just human nature, right? That, that's instinctual. Like even babies, right, they've done studies, babies see physical form and beauty over sloven, you know, out of shape. People like, they can see it, right? That jawline, like all of these different things. So it's like if none of this makes any sense to you and you, and you're listening to this and you think me and you are crazy, like you should just be looking at this like if your life is about like I want to get ahead, I want to have a better life. I want to provide for my family, my kids, you know, leave a legacy. Then you should just take your health seriously because statistically you have a better chance, chance of doing all those things healthy.

Scott Clary (225:01)

Yeah.

Jay Campbell (225:01)

And again, I mean I'm having time. Maybe also this self confidence. Exactly.

Scott Clary (225:05)

It's over into business when you walk.

Jay Campbell (225:07)

I mean think about this. How many times in your life have you felt, looked at or judged or observed walking into a room by others? And it's in a good way because they look at you and they're like, oh, this dude takes care of himself a thousand percent.

Scott Clary (225:23)

A thousand percent. You get confidence immediately.

Jay Campbell (225:26)

And so like that instantly, regardless of your personality style, that instantly makes you feel better about your chances and your opportunity.

Scott Clary (225:34)

Imagine when you're doing a presentation and you're trying to Make a pitch for something. So there's two, there's two use, right? The you that's in shape, that isn't out of breath, that, that isn't sweating, that isn't feeling gross and tired, versus the you that's in it, that you're not sweating, you're not at a break breath, you're cognitively there because you didn't eat for lunch. So you're not hitting this like, you know, this glucose, insulin roller coaster. Who do you think's gonna close the deal?

Jay Campbell (226:00)

That's exactly, exactly true. And that's what's so mind blowing, is that people don't realize that, you know what I'm saying? Like, they get so caught up in like the nice clothes, the expensive watch, and it's like, bro, you look like one of my buddies used to say, you're 190 pounds of in 125 pound bag, right? Like, people do see that. I mean, dude, good or bad, first impressions are everything. And people do instinctually judge based on the way you look. I don't give a who you are if you walk into a room and you are physically in shape. And again, we're not like you said, we're not talking mutant because that's not in shape. That's like, what the fuck is this guy doing?

Scott Clary (226:38)

This guy's too much time on his hands.

Jay Campbell (226:40)

Exactly, right? But it's like if you're physically impressive and you walk into a room, you already have a leg up. Doesn't matter what you're doing, who you are, you have a leg up.

Scott Clary (226:49)

It's, it's. If people are upset with that, I mean, it's, it's truth. It's, it's real life.

Jay Campbell (226:56)

Truth is only as I used. And I learned this from one of my spiritual mentors. But truth is only for the most sincere people.

Scott Clary (227:02)

You know my biggest life hack that I learned when I was first, I mean, I played a lot of sports and then I got into bodybuilding. But the biggest life hack is if you don't want to worry about what you're wearing, wearing, just be in shape and everything looks good. So simple, you could put on a t shirt.

Jay Campbell (227:17)

It's 100 true, dude, you put on.

Scott Clary (227:18)

A T shirt, you look like you're like a million dollar, not a million dollars.

Jay Campbell (227:22)

That guy wearing a Gucci shirt.

Scott Clary (227:24)

Oh my God. Sometimes you see that in Miami too.

Jay Campbell (227:28)

Oh, dude, I saw yesterday at the hotel.

Scott Clary (227:31)

100, 100 so true.

Jay Campbell (227:33)

Dude. You always see guys are in terrible shape and they're wearing $2,000 worth of.

Scott Clary (227:37)

Clothing and it's like two sizes too small.

Jay Campbell (227:39)

It's like, bro, you can't just wear like a toothpaste. Like I said, 190 pounds of shit and 125 pound bag.

Scott Clary (227:47)

Oh my God. What would be some last. Oh, we didn't speak about spirituality. Where do you think? So I think that if you talk about improvement, like improvement across all areas of your life, I think that physical, mental, relationships, I think spirituality is something that a lot of people lost.

Jay Campbell (228:07)

Lost.

Scott Clary (228:09)

I think society is very secular and spiritual. It doesn't mean God or religion defined that way. I think it just means that believing in something bigger than higher than yourself and removing ego out of the equation and everything that you do. And I think that if you do not have something that you subscribe to that helps you remove your ego out of your decisions, you become slave to some other version of God or something like that. And it controls you as opposed to you influencing it. And I think that that's a very toxic way to live life. And I think that's why people are so depressed and unhappy, because they don't have anything bigger than themselves to live for.

Jay Campbell (228:45)

Agree 100. And by the way, to add to that, well said, profoundly said, religion is not spirituality. And people have to understand that, right? Religion for the most part, in a lot of people's lives. Not that it's bad, but it's cultistic. And spirituality is literally doing what you just said and again said it another way way, it's living in service. And when you live in service, you're automatically grateful. You're automatically looking to help people without an attachment to an outcome that comes after it. Again, it's the opposite of tithing. People tithe because they expect to get more from tithing, right?

Scott Clary (229:24)

They're told that if they a transaction, it's a fishing.

Jay Campbell (229:28)

Yeah, exactly. So it's like the reality is like if you donate and you give unconditionally, you don't do it with an expectation that something is coming in return, right? And you just do it because your heart moralistically, virtualistically, integrally wants to do it. Then that's when you're living in service to others. And look, dude, we're service to others. Excuse me, we're service to self beings by our nature. Because we're in a physical body. We have to eat, shit, pissed, kiss, fuck, breathe. So we have to be service to self in some capacities. If we were energetic, which is our true base spiritual essence, then we would be observers. We don't have to do anything, we don't have to fuck, we don't have to eat, we don't have to shit. We can just sit there and observe as an energetic presence. And that's when you're purely service to others. But when you're now in a physical body, there is parts of the service to self. However, Scott, we can choose to be service to others and that's how we live our life.

Scott Clary (230:22)

That's, that's.

Jay Campbell (230:23)

Do we give 100%? Do we give, give unconditionally? When you see a person in society who is broken and is asking for money, do you give them money without judging them because you want to do it? Or are you one of those people that says, oh, if I give this person money, they may go get high off it or go get drugs or.

Scott Clary (230:40)

Even worse, you only give if it's filmed and put on social media.

Jay Campbell (230:44)

Don't even get me going. But like, you have to live your life coming from a place. Again, I said this to you before. You really truly have to know and mean and feel right gratitude. And when you do that, then you automatically again, the law of attraction. Your vibe attracts your tribe. You automatically attract other high vibrational souls and beings into your life. And you will live a life of abundance and prosperity because those are the only people that are in your energy field. You cannot attract lower vibration people when you are living in gratitude. And again, I'll say this again, do.

Scott Clary (231:16)

You always believe this?

Jay Campbell (231:17)

No. I lived till I was 44 as an egoic asshole. I literally, people called me fuck you pay me. That was my nickname, dude, fuck you pay me. Because I was so good at selling, at closing, at contracting, do all the things that I did. But I was living in the ego mind, dude. That's all ego mind. And again, every experience that happens to us, Scott, in our life, we have an opportunity to learn and grow from it. Most people, unfortunately, they shut down when a quote unquote bad experience, which is only a label, right? Because as you know, every opportunity alters growth. But if you label something negative or bad and then you attach to the feeling of that bad or negative feeling, and then you live your life with that. And you know, the best way to think about it is like a divorce, that's bad. A job loss or a company loss, that's bad. And now all of a sudden you're attached to the feeling that you know. And that feeling was only a transient, fleeting feeling anyway. But you attach to that and that now stifles you and your life's growth and development versus oh, I want less of this and more of the things that make me feel better. And you start living your life like that. But you really can't live your life like that until you actually get to a place of gratitude. And again, a place of gratitude attitude, as cliche as it is, it's holding doors for people, bro. It's looking at people directly in the eyes and smiling. It's walking up like, you and I walk up to each other. We don't know each other and we hug each other, but like, dude, we're gonna make this happen. It's having that energy where it's like, you know what? Everybody is an ally, but I have to treat them like an ally. I can't close my mind or close my eyes and say, look at this, you know, this guy or this person or whatever. And dude, I did that for 44 years of my life. Life. So it's only been in the last 10 years that I have truly developed an attitude of gratitude and live my life beneficially. And when I say beneficially, like, dude, I hold doors for everyone. Last night, after the whatchamacallit, the steakhouse, you know, there was a woman running across the street on the. The Walgreens. Right across the street. Yeah.

Scott Clary (233:13)

I'm glad you were.

Jay Campbell (233:14)

That is. And it crossed and I was like, oh, my God, she's going to get hit. And I ran out and I stood in front of her and went like this, this. And block the cars. You know, a bunch of people honked at me. But I thought she was going to get hit because the cars were coming, you know what I mean? So it's like, it's doing stuff like that without thinking about, oh, I could get killed. That is service to others or what.

Scott Clary (233:33)

Can I get out of this 100%.

Jay Campbell (233:35)

And that's what most people do, right? Like, oh, I'm going to get interviewed. Somebody's going to say I was a hero or some stupid like that. You're right. But like, if you really do live your life as a service to others being, you're not going to think about it. You're going to do that because it's the right thing to do. You don't want that person to get run over.

Scott Clary (233:51)

What caused the shift?

Jay Campbell (233:53)

My wife, 100% my life. She was a very, very advanced spiritual being, dude. She used to tell me, she'd be like, because I had a great physique, she would be like, you do all this stuff, you have this amazing body. What are you doing for Your inner self. And I'd be like, what the fuck are you talking about? Right? I did no spiritual work. I did. No, I was not doing self reflection. I did not read, read, you know, the greats, the Earl Nightingales, the Jim Rohns. I did not read any of that stuff. She taught me about that stuff. And then boom, dude, I got into personal development and then I honestly, I started meditating. I. I started sitting in stillness. I started going outside sungazing with my dog, being in stillness, doing things. You know, I have a chakra tuning app that I use that I put on every single morning, dude, for 12 minutes. I get in my red light bed. I mean, I have a insanely focused, rich ritual. And I have everything is, you know, notifications in my, in my calendar. And I don't live 100 attuned to that, but I live 90 attuned to that. You know what I'm saying? Like, in the time that I've been here, I've had probably four or five notifications show up to say, like, what are you thinking right now? What are your truth really?

Scott Clary (234:55)

So you forced self reflection.

Jay Campbell (234:56)

It's, it's, it's. It's not even forced because like, if I'm in the middle of work, like I have with this amazing podcast, I don't look at it right, but I know it's there. So if I'm in my office and I'm grinding or something during the middle of the day, I can see the notification pop up and I can look at it and then I can like put my mind into that and I can leave the, the busyness to get into that.

Scott Clary (235:16)

But like, well, that's how important the right person is. The right partner is, dude, 100%.

Jay Campbell (235:20)

Yeah, she. So she taught me all that stuff and then it became this, like, guiding, you know, epicenter of my life. And that's how I live my life now. And I'm not perfect, dude. No one is in a third density body. But like, I realize that the more I serve unattached, attached, without an expectation for an outcome, the better my life is. Because my life since I met her has been like this. It's just been like this. I mean, yeah, I've had some down, you know, downturns, as we all do, but I don't label them as negative. I look at them as an opportunity for growth and development. And now once you do that, everything. There's no once you look at it like that, nothing is a challenge anymore because you know that you can overcome it. Because Again, you're not labeling it as negative. It's like, how do I look at this? As what do I, how can I grow from, from this versus a, that this is a collapse of debacle, a fiasco.

Scott Clary (236:06)

And then, and then it actually, the, the effects of that negative thing, they start to spiral into all the other things that you're doing in your life because you can't get it out of your mind. So then everything else you do, you start to sabotage it because you have this negative mindset. So then it's not only the one thing, it's everything you do for the next like three to six months. You self sabotage it a hundred percent.

Jay Campbell (236:26)

It's fear. It all goes down to fear. So you have to live your life. I mean, dude, I think the easiest way to really break this down and just speak it as plainly as possible is like, if you realize that you are a divine essence at basis beyond your physical body, your soul is a divine eternal energy, what are you worried about? You could fucking die. You could get hit by a car. You know, you, you, you may, anything can happen to you, but you're not, it's not the end. And I don't think enough people, and I don't want to go into some psycho spiritual woo woo babble, but I don't think enough people truly come from a place of like, hey, I'm an E energy being. I'm in a video game in Earth right now and I'm here to enjoy the ride, right? But all the ancients, all the gurus, all the sages, they've told us enjoy the ride. The Nissan commercial, they were telling us enjoy the ride, right? This is a ride in third density and the ride is going to go like this. And you can either embrace the ups and downs and the trials and the travels, or you can literally just attach to the negativity of it and think you're a fail, a failure, failure. And then be in fear like you said. And then everything compounds. More fear, more apprehension, more anxiety. That's just how you live.

Scott Clary (237:36)

It's ironic how like when you live in fear and things actually don't work out because you're the one actually making them not work out.

Jay Campbell (237:42)

Exactly. We're thought, all we are is mind. We're nothing more than the thoughts we think. So why do you think negative, why do you even think that you're not going to have a great day? Because something happens in the morning, you know, you lose a client or you lose a deal or something like that. Like, who gives A shit. There's better ones behind it. Million.

Scott Clary (237:59)

There's a million different deals, million different opportunities. What. What's the necklace you wear?

Jay Campbell (238:03)

Oh, so this is. So I'm a crystal man. And again, my wife is a crystal queen, so she got me into this. So this is a Herkimer diamond. And then Moldavite. This is Moldavite? Yes.

Scott Clary (238:12)

Wild rings.

Jay Campbell (238:13)

Yeah. So this is Egyptian tektite. And then this is Egyptian tektite too, with a ankh, Egyptian energy, you know, called a mantle inside it. But. And then this is amethyst. But my wife got me into crystals. And just so, you know, just like really quick. This is not wood. Blue. Moldavite is the highest vibrational stone. So like when they measure energy in crystals, this is the highest amplifier.

Scott Clary (238:35)

I don't know much about Chris.

Jay Campbell (238:36)

Yeah, it's okay. And then Herkimer diamond amplifies Moldavite. So true story. These stones were called the pharaoh stones. So all the pharaohs in Egypt wore these stones because they believed that these would transmute any kind of negative energy. So demonic entities, etheric spirits or whatever. Yeah. So, like, you know, in truth, I've been wearing these. They're also called tectites because they're essentially from asteroids, you know, landing on Earth. The same thing as Moldavite. Ever since I started wearing these stones, bro, I don't ever deal with like, really craziness. Like in public. Like when I was an egoic maniac, I always dealt with craziness. I would get into fights with people. I would. I mean, not like knock down fist fights, but I would get into arguments and disagree.

Scott Clary (239:19)

Just. Life is chaotic.

Jay Campbell (239:20)

Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Like any. Again, if we're talking law of attraction, you attract what you vibrate. So when you're wearing things like these that are super high vibrational, it's likely that you're only going to attract other high vibrational people. This is not woo at all. I mean, you can look into the laws of thermodynamics and conservation of energy. And when you understand vibrational fields, if you're wearing high vibration jewelry or high vibration technology, some of it's technology too. You're only going to attract that same type of person. And again, so since I started wearing these and I don't wear them everywhere, I wear them in a podcast, I wear them on planes. I feel like I'm not only attracting the right people, but I ward off the wrong kind of people.

Scott Clary (240:01)

Yeah.

Jay Campbell (240:02)

So there's a lot of history in crystals. You know, the Atlanteans, the Whole Atlantis colony, they all used crystals.

Scott Clary (240:08)

Like, I think that just the way that you look at life and you look at like optimization across. Yeah, literally every.

Jay Campbell (240:16)

All Strato.

Scott Clary (240:16)

Yeah, I think that's the answer. I think that I know nothing about. I know nothing about crystals at all. I. I mean, like these little. There's something about these.

Jay Campbell (240:24)

You got. Those are. That's tiger's eye, right?

Scott Clary (240:26)

Yeah.

Jay Campbell (240:26)

Yeah, that's really good. That's very strong. Tiger's eye is very strong. EMF protection. So that's actually protecting you from emf.

Scott Clary (240:33)

But I don't know it too well. I want to like, some more about it.

Jay Campbell (240:35)

I mean, I'll. I'll send you stuff. I have like a PDF of the Crystal Bible and you can read through.

Scott Clary (240:39)

It because I saw some of your past content.

Jay Campbell (240:41)

Yeah, I do a lot of stuff on crystals. A lot of stuff on. I mean, like I said, dude, like, I don't. The Jay Campbell podcast, because I would bring you on my podcast. I stopped it in September of last year because I just got bored of it. I mean, I. I entered the last six years. I got so bored of talking about health optimization. All I talked was like consciousness people of the last six years. And I talked to like some of the craziest woo woo people. But like, some of them were like, so knowledgeable about earth and energy and vibrational fields and stuff like that that my brain. Brain exploded and I got so into it.

Scott Clary (241:10)

I honestly think this is why I stopped doing just business podcasts, because I found that all the. Because it's about.

Jay Campbell (241:15)

It's the same.

Scott Clary (241:15)

Yeah, but that's the thing is that, yeah, you can get the same business information, but people want to know how to get better across all parts of their life. They don't just want to know how to build a business and run Facebook ads.

Jay Campbell (241:27)

Honestly, I'm really grateful that you found me. You know, I am too. Yeah, I mean, it's awesome because I know we're going to be friends forever now.

Scott Clary (241:32)

This is awesome.

Jay Campbell (241:33)

But the thing is, is like, I'm just like you. Like, it's about how can I take a little of something from everyone that. That fascinates me or energizes me. And then how do I push that into the universe? Because again, dude, it's about service. And right now we're serving because this podcast is going to reach a lot of people. And if it affects 5 to 10% of the people that it reaches and they do something positive with the information, then it changes. It changes the balance it's the, it's the, it's the hundred monkey. You know, it takes one person taking action that they would never have taken that pushes the balance to more people in a higher vibrational.

Scott Clary (242:10)

What do you want to leave? Oh. So where should people connect with you if they want to learn more?

Jay Campbell (242:14)

So J Campbell.com is in the top five according to SEO last month websites for peptide and hormone related information. I get like 25 to 40,000 unique visitors a month. It's very, very well traversed. Over 90 articles now on page one of Google for, you know, peptide related information. So of peptide information, we put out at least two articles a week. And then you can follow me on social media at J. Campbell333. People ask me, what does that mean?333 is actually a numerology of mind, body, spirit. So that's where I attach to that. And then I have a free URL or vanity domain for every podcast I do. It's called J Campbell.com freebooks. And you get every single book that I published. Five have been international bestsellers, but there's eight. Eight. And you just get the PDF that you can download. And so there's a lot of them that are really good. Like the last two books are major international bestsellers. The peptide book, it's called optimize your health with therapeutic peptides. That's amazing. And then the newest, my newest book, and I have one coming this year, but my newest book is 30 Days to Shreds. And that is probably at least one of the top five fat loss books of all time. It's 490 pages. But we go into the deep metaphysical weeds of what is the best way to lose fat in the fastest amount of time in the healthiest way possible. And that's why it's called 30 Days of Strides, because we help people. People. You can literally lose 10% body fat in 30 days with zero impact on your long term health other than positive things. So that book came out in October of 2023. But I have a book coming hopefully by summer that's going to be the first book of its time. It's GLP1 book. So it's going to teach people how to use GLPs, like in the way that you and I talked about them today, which people desperately need because they're getting bad information from doctors and pharma.

Scott Clary (243:55)

So we'll put, we'll put the existing books for sure in the show notes and then when that new book drops, I'll push it out to the audience of course. Okay, last question. Is there anything that we didn't go into?

Jay Campbell (244:06)

I think we covered it, dude. We got a lot, we got a lot. Talked about a lot of stuff.

Scott Clary (244:10)

Amazing. When you, when you do more research in the future or when you discover new things, you have to come back.

Jay Campbell (244:17)

Awesome. Yeah, no, for sure. I love that. Yeah.

Scott Clary (244:19)

And this is changing so fast. I think that it's important to like stay up to date on this stuff. The future of health, the quantum.

Jay Campbell (244:26)

Even people in my own communities and stuff are like, dude, you told us this four months ago and now you're saying this. And I tell him, I'm sorry, the science changes. We're in a quantum reality now.

Scott Clary (244:35)

Yeah. So follow and look at his work. And then I'm assuming like stuff that's just coming out and stuff that's new. You're going to cover that on social, you cover that on your blogs and everything like that. So you can see it all there. We speak a lot too, so people could probably catch.

Jay Campbell (244:48)

Yeah. And put it this way, man, we didn't say this, but Bio Longevity Labs is going to be the Amazon of biohacking within the next 12 months. And I haven't told you this, this yet. And by the way, we decided this last night after I talked to you. We're literally, we decided last night we're starting a billion dollar longevity fund which.

Scott Clary (245:06)

You'Re going to raise for it 100.

Jay Campbell (245:08)

And it's going to be done like by this summer. Like we have did. I have so many billionaires that are like, I want to give you money, I want to give you money. So we just finally decided, like, let's just finance this. In addition to that, let's finance other business, you know, viable businesses that are connected or attached to it in some way. Way. But yeah, but that's for sure coming. And so, yeah, so I mean like again, you know, just to segue with rfk, he got confirmed today. There's no reason that people like us cannot teach. Like I, I've already said this, like I'm. Instead of Maha, we're gonna say miha. Make Earth healthy again. Right. So that's where we're going with this. But like, we want Biolongevity Labs to be the place for any person, researcher, clinician, layperson, to just go and buy something to extend their life. Whether it's a peptide, a bioregulator, hormones, supplements, small molecules, anything that's out there that's cutting edge, we're going to have it and ship it globally. So not just Canada, US. Like, you know, the people in Australia who are destitute or New Zealand who can't get it in. We're going to figure out ways to get it in those countries so everybody can access.

Scott Clary (246:10)

Good. Last question. You've learned a ton over your life, over your career about health, wellness, business, spirituality, relationship. Like, literally everything that we went into today, I, I love, I love unpacking, like all the different parts of a person because sometimes they're just like, so, like myopic and blinders on about the one thing they want to talk about, but that's not, that's not what makes a person. So you kind of like, you know, you, you, you, you eat your own dog food, so to speak. Right. I think that's important. So the last question, sorry. Out of all the lessons that you've learned over your whole life, you have to make a decision to pass on one of those lessons to your kids. What would that lesson be? Why is it so important?

Jay Campbell (246:48)

And why you must live with an attitude of gratitude. Your children, your legacy, your family, the people that are in your system or in your circle, they have to understand that you really are the living embodiment of a gratitude of a grateful person. And when I mean grateful people, you teach them to hold doors for others. You teach children. This is so important today, Scott, because it's not being taught. You teach children to look into the eyes of the person that they're speaking to, or they're shaking their hands, or they're meeting and you smile and you convey that honest gratitude of like, I'm so happy. Nice to meet you. How can I help you? How can I serve you? What can I do to, you know, to help you? All my emails to every person who emails me now literally is like, you know, when they say something good or bad, I'd say, hey, you know, it's awesome to meet you. How can I serve you right now? And I mean that. I really honestly mean that. And I think we have to teach our children that, like, by being grateful in every moment, regardless of what's going on in your life, you will again, that vibrational frequency attracts other people like minded, and you will literally create a life of absolute abundance and prosperity. And I know this because before, as I've said on this podcast, podcasts, up until 44, I was, you pay me. I was egoic and I lived in the ego mind. And once I changed that attitude, and again to my shout out to my wife Monica, who taught me this, she's my greatest spiritual mentor, everything changed. For me and I didn't have bro. I used to get tickets all the time. I was one of those guys. I have not, I mean I want to knock on wood when I say this, but I have not got a single ticket since I met my wife in 11 years, right. Drive fast BMW M car cars. You know, every now and then I might drive a little aggressively, but I don't, I don't, I don't, I haven't gotten a single ticket. And I, I really feel that I'm living in a such a universal, abundant, prosperous state of mind that I avoid that now because I'm doing so much good for the universe. I'm serving at such a high level. And I think you've heard this and I don't remember who it was, it might have been Jordan Peterson, I don't remember. But somebody that was a great, you know, calm philosopher, modern day philosopher who said your ability to earn is relative to the amount of people that you serve, right? So if you're going to be a billionaire or a trillionaire or a hundred millionaire or whatever, you cannot hold onto that unless you serve at the same capacity. So it's like I realize now that the more I serve, the more abundance will come into my life. It's literally as simple as that. And if you can scale service, which obviously many people have, have, and again not do it from an egoic standpoint, but come from a place of non attachment, no expectation, then you'll hold onto it and you will build legacy wealth. And you will not just build legacy wealth for yourself, but you will build legacy wealth for millions of people who are connected to you. And that's the key. And again, I hate bringing money into the equation because I do think that money is an issue for a lot of people in this world. Obviously debt slavery and debt servitude is terrible. You can use debt in a positive fashion versus a negative fashion. But at the end of the day, if we ever do get human relationships and human, let's just call it vibrational fields to a place where everything is level, people will have to come to a place where they absolutely live in gratitude. They cannot be. I'm going to rip this person's head off and take advantage of this person. And I think capitalism, socialism, every economic philosophy, philosophy, it leads to that. And so like we have to get to a place where like people just are in a place where like money isn't the, the be all end all and that service is the be all end all. And I, I don't know if we in this current time and age can ever get to there. I don't know if our economic. But I think it's people that do.

Scott Clary (250:33)

Live that way change. They change and they end up having a very good life.

Jay Campbell (250:39)

Impact.

Scott Clary (250:40)

Yeah, it's all about impact. I think that it's just very low vibrational scarcity mindset to not think that way. Everybody who I know, like, listen, I've had like hundreds and hundreds of people on this podcast that have built companies that you know the name of like founder of Netflix, founder of Reebok, guys that have true bill, like billionaire billionaires and a hundred millionaires. And it's all about impact. They're very, they're very much like people oriented. Like how do we serve as many people as possible?

Jay Campbell (251:07)

That's it. There's no, it's, there's no secrets, dude. Like once you get to a certain level, whether you've made a billion or a hundred million or ten million or whatever, you get to a place where you just understand that it's service. It's literally because, dude, we're all the same at base essence. We're all souls inhabiting these physical bodies in this third density, you know, video game of, of. Of life. And so it's like if you truly understand that, that you're an eternal energy being and you're not going to die, your physical body will die in this current lifetime, but your energy will keep going. There's nothing to worry about. Enjoy the ride. Enjoy the experiences. Isn't everyone.

Scott Clary (251:41)

No one's no everybody to win.

Jay Campbell (251:44)

There's. You don't really have enemies unless you choose to label someone is your enemy. Because even if somebody that fucks with you or does something that you again label as negative, how do you know that they weren't having a horrible moment in time in their life when they did it and they didn't mean it. You don't. You absolutely don't. So it's like hold no grudges. By the way, we never even mentioned this. Forgive everyone. Forgive. Not for them, for yourself. Forgiveness is what? Lack of forgiveness is what causes cancer. Because you think about when people don't forgive themselves, it's mostly themselves and not the other people. That becomes some sort of inflammation in the body that eventually leads to the cellular degradation that basically manifests as cancer. And so forgiveness is so important. So like don't have enemies. Forgive anyone and everyone. There's no reason to have an enemy for someone. Just forgive them, let it go. Stop being attached to whatever that you thought they did to you because it's a label. It's that simple. Land.

Scott Clary (252:49)

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