Leo Pareja - CEO of eXp Realty (EXPI) | Ideas Mean Nothing Without Execution

Summary

Success Story Podcast: Episode with Leo Pareja, CEO of eXp Realty

Release Date: March 11, 2025
Host: Scott D. Clary

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Introduction

In this episode of the Success Story Podcast, host Scott D. Clary engages in an in-depth conversation with Leo Pareja, CEO of eXp Realty (EXPI), and his wife, Ariana Parejo. The discussion delves into Leo's remarkable journey in the real estate industry, his entrepreneurial mindset, and the transformative strategies that have propelled eXp Realty to the forefront of the market.

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Early Career and Inflection Points

[08:24] Leo Pareja: "Let's kick it off here. Think of an inflection point. It could have been somewhere along your career path..."

Ariana Parejo shares her initial ambition to become a graphic designer during her college years but soon realizes the volatility of the tech job market. Inspired by Robert Kiyosaki's Rich Dad Poor Dad, she pivots towards real estate, recognizing the potential for leverage in people, time, and money. At just 19, Ariana invests $10,000 in a real estate training program, marking one of her first bold entrepreneurial moves.

Notable Quote: [11:38] Ariana Parejo: "The concept of leverage of people, time, and money fundamentally shifted my perspective. There's an alternative to trading dollars for time."

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Sales Philosophy and Techniques

Ariana emphasizes a consultative approach to sales, focusing on qualifying prospects by identifying their genuine needs rather than using aggressive tactics. This strategy not only fosters trust but also leads to long-term referrals.

Notable Quote: [15:08] Ariana Parejo: "All human beings make emotional decisions and then justify them logically. That's why qualification upfront is crucial."

Leo echoes this sentiment, contrasting traditional sales methods with Ariana's refined approach, highlighting the effectiveness of problem-solving over manipulation.

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Growth and Scaling Businesses

Ariana's prowess in real estate sales quickly becomes evident as she transitions from her first successful summer selling 11 homes and earning $60,000 in commissions to becoming the top Keller Williams agent worldwide, closing 4,000 deals. Her entrepreneurial ventures include building Washington Capital Partners, a $2 billion private lending firm, and co-founding Remine.

Notable Quote: [24:16] Ariana Parejo: "Within two years as a full-time agent, I made about $300,000 in gross commissions, significantly higher than the industry average."

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Navigating Market Crises and Resilience

During the financial crisis of 2005-2006, Ariana experienced a drastic fluctuation in her net worth, teaching her invaluable lessons about over-leverage and the importance of sustainable growth. She discusses the necessity of adapting to market changes and leveraging wisdom gained from past experiences to navigate future challenges.

Notable Quote: [26:27] Ariana Parejo: "There's a whole lot of crying, but the lesson learned was resilience and deciding whether to stay in the market or pivot."

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Transition to eXp Realty and Innovation in Real Estate

Ariana explains eXp Realty's disruptive cloud-based brokerage model, which eliminates the need for physical offices, significantly reducing overhead costs. This innovative approach attracted thousands of agents during the COVID-19 pandemic, positioning eXp Realty as a leader in the virtual real estate landscape.

Notable Quote: [62:29] Ariana Parejo: "We were able to legally comply with state rules and create a fully virtual environment, eliminating the biggest expense—physical office space."

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Leadership and Team Management

Ariana emphasizes the importance of self-awareness and understanding team members' unique strengths through tools like the DISC profile. By tailoring incentives and communication styles to individual personalities, she fosters a supportive and efficient work environment.

Notable Quote: [75:33] Ariana Parejo: "Understanding how others are wired allows you to lead more effectively and create a positive workplace culture."

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Embracing Technology and AI in Real Estate

The discussion highlights the transformative impact of technology and AI on real estate operations. Ariana shares how eXp Realty leverages AI to streamline processes, enhance efficiency, and reduce costs, aiming to cut operational expenses by up to 80%.

Notable Quote: [112:05] Ariana Parejo: "AI is as transformative as the internet and mobile technologies were. It enables us to streamline processes and significantly reduce per-unit costs."

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Lessons and Wisdom for Entrepreneurs

Ariana imparts crucial entrepreneurial insights, emphasizing consistency over innate talent, operational excellence, and the importance of focusing on high ROI activities. She advocates for creating painkiller products—solutions that address urgent needs—over mere vitamins that offer supplementary benefits.

Notable Quotes:

• [119:52] Ariana Parejo: "Consistency beats special talent. Overworking consistent efforts surpass sporadic bursts of genius."
• [122:50] Ariana Parejo: "Ensuring your product solves a real pain point makes it indispensable to your customers."

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Defining Success Today

Ariana redefines success as the ability to spend meaningful time with loved ones, prioritizing personal relationships over traditional business accolades. She acknowledges the emotional highs and lows of entrepreneurship but values the overall fulfillment derived from achieving balance.

Notable Quote: [127:22] Ariana Parejo: "Right now, success means being able to spend time with the people I care about and not missing the moments that matter."

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Final Thoughts and Advice

Ariana concludes by encouraging entrepreneurs to embrace the journey with all its challenges, emphasizing the importance of enjoying the ride and maintaining a balanced perspective on success and personal fulfillment.

Notable Quote: [130:55] Ariana Parejo: "99% of everything we fear or keep up at night over is irrelevant later. Focus on what truly matters and enjoy the ride."

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Closing Remarks

The episode wraps up with Ariana directing listeners to connect with her through various social media platforms and highlighting her personalized approach to helping realtors succeed. Leo Pareja and Ariana Parejo's combined experiences offer a wealth of knowledge for entrepreneurs and real estate professionals aiming to navigate the complexities of the industry with resilience and innovation.

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Connect with Ariana Parejo:

• Instagram: Ariana's Instagram
• LinkedIn: Ariana's LinkedIn
• Facebook: Ariana's Facebook
• Podcast: Realtor-Focused Podcast

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This comprehensive discussion between Scott, Leo, and Ariana Parejo provides invaluable insights into building and scaling a successful real estate business, emphasizing the importance of adaptability, technology, and personal fulfillment in the entrepreneurial journey.

Transcript

[Scott Clary]

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[Leo Parejo]

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[Ariana Parejo]

I think in the summer of 05 or 06, my accountant told me I was worth $5 million at 14 rental properties. And then within like a six month period, that accountant said it was worth negative a million dollars. At 19, he was selling homes. By 28, he was the number one Keller Williams agent worldwide, closing 4,000 deals. Over his career, he built Washington Capital Partners, a $2 billion private lending giant, and co founded Remine. Very early on in my college process, I was like, I don't want a job. I want a path that lets me be in control. I read a book that changed my perspective, which is Rich dad, Poor Dad. I turned for one opportunity where knocking on doors and cold calling say, hey, I want to do some of this stuff. They asked me to do these things, which paid like 40 bucks, but we did like 100 of them in 30 days. After two major exits, he took his expertise to Exp Realty, where he now leads as CEO, shaping the company's growth and vision. At the worst year ever, we sold seven homes and then within 12 months it was like 99 homes. And within like a four year period, we did 603 homes. Too many people try to learn sales into like, how do I get you to do something versus identifying? Like, is there a want or need? 99% of everything we fear or keeps us up at night at some moment in life is literally irrelevant at a later date. Beyond business, his Pareja Family foundation is opening doors for minorities in tech, helping them break barriers and build better futures. A powerhouse in real estate, a visionary in leadership, a force for change. This is Leo Parejo.

[Scott Clary]

Welcome to Success Story. I'm your host, Scott Clary. The Success Story podcast is part of the HubSpot podcast network. But HubSpot doesn't just have great podcasts. If you're an entrepreneur, if you're a builder, they've got your back. Now why is that important? Because if you're building anything, you know that marketing in 2025 is absolutely wild. Now why is that important? Because, you know, if you're an entrepreneur, if you're building anything, marketing in 2025 is wild. Stock savvy customers spot fake messaging instantly. Anything AI generated, they sniff it out. Privacy changes make ad targeting a nightmare, and everyone needs more content now than ever. And that's why you have to have HubSpot's new marketing trends report. It doesn't just show you what's changing, it shows you exactly how to deal with it. Everything's backed by research but focused on marketing plays that you can use for your business tomorrow. If you're ready to turn marketing hurdles into results for your business, go to HubSpot.com marketing to download it for free. A huge shout out to Lingoda for supporting Today's Episode now if you're ready to master a new language, Lingoda is the online language platform trusted by over 100,000 students worldwide. Lingoda offers live classes with real teachers available 24 7. You can choose from German, English, Business English, French, Spanish or their newest addition, Italian. What sets Lingoda apart? The smallest class size in the market. It's just you and up to five other students. Or if you want, you can go one on one for personalized attention. Their native level teachers don't just teach language, they share culture too. And you'll speak confidently from day one. With Lingoda's flexible scheduling and proven curriculum, students report being able to navigate real conversations in weeks, not years. And if you're using Lingoda for business, their CEFR aligned courses ensure that you're learning internationally recognized language standards that employers value. Between sessions, you're going to reinforce your skills with downloadable materials and bite sized practice exercises. And all success story listeners, they put together a special deal. Try lingoda free with three group classes or one private class plus you save on any course with my link. Try.lingoda.com success story and code Scott25 don't miss this chance to transform your life through language learning. Today's Episode is brought to you by Vanta. Now listen up. This matters for your business. In today's digital landscape, security isn't optional, it's essential. Without it, deal stall sales cycles stretch on and scaling becomes very difficult now. Why? Because investors, customers and partners all expect businesses to demonstrate strong security practices before they commit. If you can't prove trust, you lose opportunities. So whether you're a startup founder trying to land that first big client or an established company scaling your security program, Vanta helps businesses of all sizes prove that they're trustworthy by Automating compliance across 35 frameworks like SoC2, ISO 27001 and HIPAA. The exact certifications your prospects are demanding here's why you need to pay attention. Vanta gives you back precious time that you're currently wasting on compliance. Their platform automates up to 90% of the tedious compliance work. It helps you respond to those endless security questionnaires up to five times faster. And it connects you with experts to get your security program running immediately. The results speak for themselves. A recent IDC report found that Vanta customers achieve over $535,000 per year in benefits. And the platform pays for itself in just three months. So you're going to join over 10,000 global companies like Atlassian, Cora and Factory who use Vanta to manage risk and prove security in real time. And don't miss this for a limited time, only my listeners can get a thousand dollars off Vanta. That's real money back in your pocket. Visit vanta.comScott right now before this offer expires. That is V A N T A dot com Scott.

[Leo Parejo]

All right, dude, I'm excited to do this. Gonna be a lot of fun.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, I'm excited.

[Leo Parejo]

Let's kick it off here. So think of an inflection point. It could have been somewhere along your career path. It could have been when you're growing up, it sort of pushed you down the path you're on today, pushed you into real estate, push you into entrepreneurship. What was that point?

[Ariana Parejo]

So I feel like I've had a couple of them. I remember being like 14, 15 years old and just understanding the traditional path. I was like, wait, I gotta work really hard for 30 or 40 years and then I have like six years to play golf in South Florida. And I was like, that doesn't sound like a lot of fun. So I, I think even as early as high school, something about the traditional path was not that interesting. But the, the real inflection point was college. So I went to college, college in the year 2000. And my plan was to become a graphic designer. And interestingly enough, I was being recruited from, like, career fairs, even my freshman year of college by companies that don't exist, like WorldCom and AOL in their original form. Because I grew up in the Northern Virginia area and that's what the tech corridor was down Dulles corridor. That was really interesting because that was the first time that I felt my cheese get moved because I was told that if I finished my college degree, because 20 years ago you needed a college degree, I could make $150,000 as a graphic designer or designing a website.

[Leo Parejo]

A lot for a graphic designer.

[Ariana Parejo]

Well, and adjusted for inflation, that was like $300,000. Right. But in a six month period I saw those same opportunities disappear or turn into like $35,000 jobs. Right. So very early on in my, in my college process I was like, I don't want a job. I, I want a path that lets me be in control.

[Leo Parejo]

Was it, did you, did your parents have influence on, on your thoughts at.

[Ariana Parejo]

This time or in the opposite direction? Both My parents have PhDs and my.

[Leo Parejo]

Dad very much the opposite direction.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah. My father worked for the same company for 28 and a half years. So no one in my family had gone the entrepreneurial path.

[Leo Parejo]

Okay, so your family then was very similar to mine. Very, very safe, risk adverse family. So you have this thought and you realize that these jobs that you're lining up aren't so great, but now you don't have a playbook for entrepreneurship. So what were the first steps that you took?

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, so freshman year, college. I thought I was going to become a graphic designer.

[Scott Clary]

Yeah.

[Ariana Parejo]

And go work for a big tech company. I actually took an entrepreneurship class in college where they made us write a business plan to see what it would look like if I went and started a design company. And back then you had to buy servers because there was no aws. And basically the punchline was I did the math on just basic gear. It would have been like $400,000 to get the, the type of hardware you would need in order to be able to host and create web content. Which again sounds crazy.

[Leo Parejo]

That does sound crazy.

[Ariana Parejo]

And based on what you could bill, which back then you could charge quite a bit to, to build the websites that are basically now self serve on like godaddy. Right. But it would have been like three years before I even got to like break even. And so very early on I was like, oh, I'm not sure that this is going to be it, but I read a book that had a very kind of a picture of Dorian Gray effect on me that kind of fundamentally changed my perspective, which is a very cliche answer in real estate because it was Robert Kiyosaki's rich dad, poor dad.

[Leo Parejo]

Right.

[Ariana Parejo]

And what it fundamentally shifted for me was the concept of leverage of people, time and money. Right. It was the first time I understood that there is an alternative to trading dollar for time. And you can leverage whether it's, it's high commission. Right. Of you're not being paid per hour but for the service you're rendered. And then when you hopefully go from the S quadrant to the B quadrant, now you are leveraging other people's talent so you're not limited by hours of the day. And then eventually when you go from the B quadrant to the I quadrant, you become just a capital allocator and you can actually leverage other people's businesses and time.

[Leo Parejo]

So you had this idea before you even started as an agent. Well, at that point, I'm assuming that means that if I'm just like reading between the lines, agent was never the main objective. It was broker. It was building my own business in real estate.

[Ariana Parejo]

It was, it was actually being a real estate investor. Right. So I read the book and go.

[Leo Parejo]

To the last quadrant. Yeah.

[Ariana Parejo]

And then decided, okay, real estate seems like an interesting path. I kept reading every book I could could on real estate at that point. My father met a gentleman who tried to use a very traditional real estate prospecting script on him, which was, would you like to invest passively in real estate? And my dad said no, but my son's obsessed. Will you go to a coffee with him? I went to coffee with him. I came prepared to offer to work for free and he actually turned me down. And he said, if you want to learn about real estate, you should call this guy in Colorado. He can teach you everything you want to know. I called the stranger in Colorado and he said, I can teach you everything you want to know about real estate, but it'll cost you $10,000. And so, unbeknownst to my parents, my friends, I sold my worldly possession of my car and entered a contract with a stranger and wired him all my money. I was 19 years old or 18 years old, and it turned out to be one of the best decisions of my life. One, one. It was like, I think I for the first time bet the farm, right? Like the proverbial farm. And I did it super young and it was a high commit, right? But unlike some other high ticket things that exist in the world today, this was a legitimate relationship where he actually taught me the art of selling in the sense of like, hey, all human beings make emotional decisions and then justify them logically, right? Like, you know, I think too many people try to learn sales into, like, how do I get you to do something versus identifying. Like, is there a want or need? Like ready, will and enable. And like, I think that's actually the best part about sales is first of all is to identify if the person needs the product or service and get to a no very fast versus trying to sell somebody something they don't need. But if they, they are ready, willing, enable and qualified, then it's more like problem solving and Advising.

[Leo Parejo]

So I mean your, your sort of insight and wisdom around sales that was like exceptional at a very young age. Even, I mean even the people that I speak to about sales, they don't, they don't qualify or disqualify. They, you know, it's almost like trying to beat this person into submission and manipulating them with everything possible to try and close the deal. So I think that's probably why you were so successful and you learned this very, very early when it's very different.

[Ariana Parejo]

Right? If, if, if you actually focus on qualification up front, then you actually have a much, much higher chance of having a successful transaction. But more importantly than long term referral.

[Leo Parejo]

You know what's interesting? So what you're describing about sales is how I learned sales in tech. And this is, I think this is like very forward thinking salesmanship. I don't find that this idea permeates real estate. I think that there is negative connotation between real estate and sales to some degree. And I'm curious why you think that this. Maybe I'm wrong. You can challenge me on anything. By the way. This is just my very uneducated opinion. But I feel like true salesmanship is not properly taught with real estate agents.

[Ariana Parejo]

I would argue that true salesmanship is not taught anywhere. Right. I think sales in general has a bad connotation. Right. I think, you know, there's all kinds of terms for like commission, breath and like it doesn't matter what we're talking about. Cars, life insurance policies, you know. And so, you know, and, and again I, I have a different approach because I feel sales is one of the most honorable things that can be done in the world. And if you actually look at like potential income, you know, to be verified. But I've read in a couple places it's, it's typically like you know, a list celebrities, right. Athletes and movie stars followed by public company CEOs and then typically right behind that is the top salesperson at that company. Right. And most scaled enterprises, especially on the smaller side, the top salesperson will probably out earn the executive team and, or the owner because there is no business without the sales funnel.

[Leo Parejo]

How did you apply that when you first started? So now you, you go through this $10,000 program. You understand what true sales is, how to identify pain points, how to qualify, disqualify. So you were, I mean, give me numbers because I have, I have numbers that I found on the Internet. But I mean tell me real numbers.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, so number one, so, so the, the journey was interesting in the sense that I did not want to be an agent, I wanted to be an investor. Right. I, I didn't, I didn't see that that was an interesting path. And so I was, I was learning how to become an investor. And halfway through the, the one year program you said you have to get your license so you can at some point buy and sell yourself without having to hire somebody. You get access to the mls, you'll, you have, you know, it kind of like you in developing podcasts, like how much of it do you need to do yourself versus outsourcing? So I get my license, I have a, you know, pivotal experience in the sense that I, I had to find a new place to live. My landlord and I disagreed on acceptable volume on a Tuesday. And I'm in the office because at that point I get my license and I was looking for a rental on the mls and the owner of the office says you should buy a house. I said I'm a child, I can't buy a house. I'm 19 at this point. And so I get into a conversation with the loan officer and in the US we have the FHA loan which is a low down payment loan product that has a flexibility for something called a non occupant co borrower. So someone that can be on the loan and title with you who's not going to live in the house. So for qualifications for a traditional mortgage, you know to be owner occupied you have to be on title and in the house or not to be considered an investment which require much larger down payments. But this one government backed debt instrument allows an immediate blood family member so like your parents, an uncle to, to either gift a down payment and or be a co borrower. So I asked my parents to co sign my loan, but more specifically to lend me the down payment for basically the day. Because as a licensed agent my commission was about the same size as the down payment. So I get qualified. I had bought this car and paid it off after I sold it. And so I was able to qualify for $184,000 purchase. I negotiated the seller to pay all the concessions, all the closing costs and then effectively bought the property, no money down with my own commission and paid my parents back. But more importantly I rented out three rooms of the four for enough to cover the mortgage. And that was the aha I had, right? So it wasn't, you know, I think when you hear someone's story or you read stats on the Internet, it's like, well that was kind of a very straight line. It's the Opposite, right? It's, it's, hey, I need somewhere to live because my landlord doesn't like me anymore. Well, hey, I actually qualify in this regard. But once I had that one singular experience, I, I only had the one proof point or one script. And that became, you know, I was a college kid and I wrote down a little script and back to like asking the right question or identifying the right need. I said to my fraternity brothers, I said, let me talk to your parents about your housing needs for next year. And when I got them on the phone and I knew I only had 30 seconds, I would say, how would you like me to show you to pay for your kids housing for the next four years with the money you're going to spend next semester? And I like, I was like, okay, I'm listening, right? And at, at that point, 3% on anywhere between 250 to 350 was about one year's room and board. And so I said, you're, you're going to deploy that money one time, they're going to rent out all the rooms, and in four years, when you sell the houses, you'll probably pay for the entire tuition. And again, timing is everything. I did this between 2002 and 2006. So a lot of my fraternity brothers were able to either sell the house and make six figures and go home, start a business, like, go on to a pretty, pretty good head start. But the part that was crazy is I only had one transaction and it was myself. I'd never sold real estate. I was, I'd barely turned 21. And at that point that summer, I sold about 11 houses. So in, in a time where, you know, most kids are working at a mall, I made about $60,000 in gross commission in my summer vacation.

[Leo Parejo]

That's amazing. I think it's, I mean, when I look at sort of the, the framework that you deploy for yourself and now for all your fraternity brothers, I mean, that's, that is almost showing mastery of real estate and the different levers and mechanisms that you can use at a very early stage. Because I've worked with a lot of different real estate agents and between government programs and I'm not a real estate investor. I don't pretend to be. I don't pretend to be knowledgeable. But I'm just, I always find that real estate is the one category of investment opportunity where there's so many systems and opportunities that are actually built to support it. Like, there's all these creative financing rules, there's all these government programs. Like it just Seems like everything is built to help real estate investors succeeded. But the, the real estate agent that I speak to is not knowledgeable about or they don't bring these things to light. Like if I have ever had, very few people have ever told me when I'm looking at a house, oh, these are other ways to finance it. Or have you thought about buying a fourplex and living in one of the units and then renting out the other three? So I think that, I mean part of your success just outside looking in is the fact you just had like you immersed yourself in not only the surface level of the industry, but like all of these again, not just selling, but investing. And that investment actually led you to become a better salesperson. But it's just interesting why I don't see that happen quite often in real estate even for like mature, tenured, experienced agents.

[Ariana Parejo]

So the, the one thing I figured out early on that I still preach is that the riches are in the niches, right? Like you know, blue ocean strategy. Like I much rather become masterful and maybe just a couple things that resonate and then I can actually be an expert at it. Right. So like do I want to compete with Walmart? No, thank you. Because like if everyone's going after the same product or service, then you're, you know, competing on price, consumer acquisitions, expensive versus like hey, let me become really, really good at a couple things. And demonstrating value to be picked is much easier at that point.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah, and that's what you did. So, so 11 homes, 60 grand in commission.

[Ariana Parejo]

So I blow it on a BMW because I'm 20 something. But by my senior of college I was, I think my senior, full senior that year. Right. Because I graduated and then still had more time. I did about $300,000 in gross commission as a full time real estate agent.

[Leo Parejo]

And that's like now like a year and a half, two years into this it.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, two years in. Right.

[Leo Parejo]

So and, and like I mean just tell the audience about statistics. I mean that seems like that is unusually high for two years into real estate.

[Ariana Parejo]

That is unusually high for today's standards. Right. So I think the average agent in America makes about 42,000. So it's probably like 8 to 10x especially back then with the average agent full time professional mate.

[Leo Parejo]

Now eventually this obviously ends up turning into like thousands of homes and real estate transactions completed. So what was the, what was the sort of the playbook to sort of expand on those, whatever first 11, first $300,000 of commissions and then now you, at one point you Were number one agent at Keller Williams. Okay, so what's the journey to get there?

[Ariana Parejo]

That's the, like the highlight on the Internet, right? Of course, the journey is that, you know, or is it just hard work.

[Leo Parejo]

And, and well, repeat.

[Ariana Parejo]

It's also a lot of this, right? So the journey is like, I'm not that special at all. $306,000 happened in, oh, five. Right. I was a licensed real estate agent with a heartbeat in the greatest bubble in the history of the world. And so what that translated to is I went and bought as many properties as I could with a ton of leverage because it was available. No income, no asset loans. You know, the, the, the real pivotal moment was I think in the summer of 05 or 06, my accountant told me I was worth $5 million. I had 14 rental properties at an X5. I thought I was God's gift to real estate. And then within like a six month period, that same accountant said I was worth negative a million dollars. And in the subsequent like 24 months, I gave all that back to the banks after doing a lot of crying and boogers. And so that process was, you had achieved last quadrant.

[Leo Parejo]

You, you had turned into a real estate investor very, very quickly actually.

[Ariana Parejo]

But with, without any of the fundamentals in place, right, like not real free cash flow and real sustainable fixed debt versus variable debt and all, all of the, the, the things that were skipped through in the, in the exuberance of the moment in the market. So the, the, you know, legislative safety measures and the lending system didn't exist that exist today.

[Leo Parejo]

Right.

[Ariana Parejo]

You can't do that again today because we collectively as a country learned that was a bad idea.

[Leo Parejo]

But did you hold on, did you.

[Scott Clary]

Hold on to any of that?

[Ariana Parejo]

No, no. It was all, it was all hit the reset button. But what the lesson was learned is like, hey, there's a whole lot of crying. And then you, it's, it's, it's one of those moments in life which is, is again a philosophy I prescribe to. It's like, hey, the rules of the game changed. You can be mad about it, or you can just decide, do I still want to be a market participant? And I feel like this, this thought process applies to everything, right? Like, you know, email marketing worked really well in 2001, right? They made a movie about it, you got mail, and like people get excited versus, like, we just don't even open it anymore. And so whether it's a marketing tactic or hey, this, this rule changed by the federal government where you can't do that anymore. Do you decide? Okay, I, I could have big feelings about it for like a day. And then you have to make the decisions like, okay, do I still want to be a market participant and learn to play under new rules of engagement or I do, I just move on to do something else. And you also, like, as a human being, you always have that free will to say, I want to participate, I don't want to participate. So for me it was okay. The world ended as I knew it. What do I do now? Do I want to get out of real estate or stay in real estate? At that point it was like, hey, people have lived before me. Let me try to get in front of older, wiser folks who've seen this before. And as soon as I did, they were like, hey, this movie's played before, right? Like 1992, the SNL crisis. There's going to be these things called foreclosures and on the bank ledger books they're going to called reos. So now you need to find out where they're at, right? And you know Ariana, my amazing wife, she was in the business and she had been to a settlement with an agent who had a bunch of reos and she's like, hey, they told me a lot of these banks are in Dallas. You, you need to go to Dallas and go get some of these contracts for us. And I turned for one opportunity where again showing up and knocking on doors and cold calling say, hey, I want to do some of this stuff. And they asked me to do these things called broker price opinions, which paid like 40 bucks for an opinion of value. But we did like a hundred of them in 30 days. And then they're like, hey, you want to sell some houses? And then it went from like at the worst year ever, I think we sold seven homes and then within 12 months it was like 99 homes and then that turned into 280 homes. And within like a four year period, the best year we had, we did 603 homes in a 12 month period in 2010, which by today's standards there's teams that do much more than that. But back then, before the accelerant of high speed Internet and the technology that we have available today, I think our team was number five in the Wall Street Journal of all teams in the country.

[Leo Parejo]

You know, most people that, that I speak to that now look very successful from the outside in. There's always they've achieved a significant marker of success and then seemingly lost it all at some point in their career. And this is like not. This is a story that plays out again and again and again, like it always seems.

[Ariana Parejo]

It's a rite of passage.

[Leo Parejo]

It is a rite of passage.

[Scott Clary]

It's always like, oh, I made a business.

[Leo Parejo]

And it's always, you know, a million dollars for most people is, especially people that are not entrepreneurial. If you're entrepreneurial, usually you have the, the foresight to say, okay, if this goes well, I'm going to be making well over a million dollars. My business will be making well over a million. But for the average like 9 to 5 W2, that's like a big amount of money, a big sum of money to get in one year. But most people that are entrepreneurial, I think what happens is they achieve this milestone, they achieve money that they've never thought possible, and then there's sort of two paths that can go on. Because there's going to be a point. Very rarely will that first success ever turn into the success that you're going to talk about in 20, 30 years from now. Usually there's some shit hitting the fan moment when it all goes to crap and all goes to hell. But I think that, that point, that moment when you, again, like what you said, just to parrot it, you can choose to be a market participant. You can choose to opt in or opt out. You can choose to just complain and cry and, and, and you know, like, woe is me, like, I can't, I can't continue. Like all these different, all these different negative feelings you can have at that point. You can choose to take those lessons, those learnings and just continue to build, or you can opt out. And I think that's actually the, the, the biggest indicator of success, what you choose to do in that moment.

[Ariana Parejo]

So I, I heard a quote once that said, in order to acquire a great fortune, you must first lose a small one. Right? Oh, I like that quote.

[Leo Parejo]

This, you know, but you mentioned also, like, so this happens in every industry. So I mean in, in, in podcasting, Apple podcasts, where majority of podcast downloads come from, they used to auto download. So when I used to upload as well as every other podcast in the world used to upload a new episode, all the people that subscribed to your podcast automatically downloaded it onto their player. So Apple updated this feature about a year, year and a half ago where you don't auto download anymore. So if I subscribe to you five years ago and I haven't listened to you since, it doesn't make sense that I'm still auto downloading because downloads count towards advertiser. But yeah, well it counts towards advertiser downloads and cpm and it, that, that fuels the whole commercial model of podcasting for every podcaster in the world. So when Apple did this, I mean that's on a, on a low end, about 20% of downloads and then revenue were cut overnight for every podcast in the world on the high end, like 30 to 40%. So again, this is something that you just have to deal with in every. And it doesn't matter what you're doing. It could be drop shipping, it could be. You could be selling on TikTok shops. If you're in this space now, it doesn't really matter. It's always going to happen to you where whatever you've been building, eventually the rules are going to change and you have to find a way to persevere in spite of it. So I hear a lot of people say that they think the American dream is dead. What is your perspective on the American dream after going through all these ups and downs and highs and lows?

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, my vantage point is someone who didn't grow up here. Right. I, I didn't get here Till I was 12, so you know, my dad worked for an NGO so we moved around to six Latin American countries. So like I actually did kidnapping drills as a kid. Right. Like I fundamentally believe if my story was in a different country, someone would have kidnapped my family. Because that's what you can do when you get mad at your competitors, when there's no rules. Right. In, in foreign countries. So like just like simple things like our legal system works. If I get mad, I sue you and for performance or non performance or you know, for payment. Right. If I fail horribly, I hit bankruptcy and no one puts me in jail. Like there's, there's debtors jail in other countries. Right. So to, to me this is still the greatest system on the planet. Is it perfect? No. Is there a better one? Show me. Like, I just, I haven't seen a better system. Um, so you know, cost of living, everything. Yes. Maybe it's, it's a tough moment in history and I don't want to take any, anything away from that because I'm hyper aware that there is a lot of pain in the system post Covid with inflation, but I don't know of a better system on the planet than this one.

[Scott Clary]

A huge shout out to bank on yourself for supporting today's episode entrepreneurs. Here's the retirement secret that Wall street doesn't want you to know. Well, you are pouring everything into growing your business. They want you gambling your Future in their 401k casino with no guarantees. As a business owner, you already take enough risks. Why gamble with your retirement too? It is time to discover the financial strategy smart entrepreneurs are using to protect their wealth. Bank On Yourself is the proven approach that gives business owners what they need most certainty, flexibility and control in their retirement. Unlike traditional retirement accounts, bank on Yourself gives you predictable guaranteed growth that isn't at the mercy of market crashes, a liquid cash reserve you can tap anytime to seize new business opportunities or whether downturns, there's zero penalties or restrictions, and tax free retirement income that shields your hard earned wealth from future tax hikes. For entrepreneurs who understand the value of financial leverage, here's the game changer. When you access your money, it continues growing as if you never touched it. This means your capital works twice as hard just like you do. You can get a free report that reveals how you can bank on yourself and enjoy tax free retirement income, guaranteed growth and control of your money. Just go to BankOnYourself.com Scott and get your free report. That's BankOnYourself.com Scott BankOnYourself.com Scott A huge shout out to BambooHR for supporting today's episode. Let me share something I've learned from building multiple businesses. Your time has a dollar value and if you're spending hours on HR tasks, you're literally burning money. That's why I'm fired up about bamboohr. This isn't just another software tool. This is Strategic business optimization. Over 34,000 companies are already using them because it transforms those time consuming HR tasks into streamlined processes. Here's what makes it different. It's actually built for entrepreneurs like us. Simple to use, easy to implement, and it scales as you grow. No complicated onboarding, no HR degree required, just pure efficiency. Listen, if you want to operate like a true CEO, reclaim your time. Do what I did. Check out the free [e-mail] free demo see for yourself all that Bamboohr can do and how truly affordable it can be too. That's BambooHR.com free demo BambooHR.com free demo this isn't just about HR. It's about strategic growth. This podcast is brought to you in part by Stash. Are you still putting off saving and investing? Because you'll get to it someday. Stash turns someday into today. Stash isn't just an investing app. It's a registered investment advisory that combines automated investing with dependable financial strategies to help you reach your goals faster. They'll provide you with personalized advice on what to invest in based on your goals. Or if you just want to sit back and watch your money go to work, you can opt into their award winning expert managed portfolio that pick stocks for you. Stash has helped millions of Americans reach their financial goals and starts at just $3 per month. Don't let your savings sit around, make it work harder for you. Go to get.stash.comsuccess story and see how you can receive $25 towards your first stock purchase. And to view important disclosures, that's get.stash.comsuccess Story paid non client endorsement, not representative of all clients and not a guarantee. Investment advisory services offered by Stash Investments llc, an SEC registered investment advisor.

[Leo Parejo]

Investing involves risks and investments may lose value. Offers subject to T's and C's. If you fast forward from from where you started to, to where you are now, what is one belief that you held about entrepreneurship, about, about success that has radically changed after you've gone through all sort of different iterations of building success that you've gone through?

[Ariana Parejo]

The one that I think about and again, it's because of the moment in my journey, right? So I truly believe there are seasons to everything in life, right? So when Ariana and I, because we've been together our whole lives, like it was a very prolonged period of time where we stayed in the office at like 10 o'clock every single day, right? And it did. And like youth is a superpower of energy, right? Like I tell young people, like, the thing you have on everybody is stamina. Like you can work 12 hours a day for five, 10 years straight and still have a social life and go out and still till two in the morning and wake up the next day. Like at a certain point, either you like, you have kids and then you have to make the choice of like, do you not want them to see you or you just don't have that level of energy, right? Like, if I don't get eight hours of sleep now, can you make fun of me?

[Leo Parejo]

Because like, you know, actually no. Okay, so I make fun of you.

[Scott Clary]

But I was actually thinking about it.

[Leo Parejo]

When we went for dinner at like 4 in the afternoon, that was the perfect night.

[Scott Clary]

So I actually take it all back.

[Leo Parejo]

It was actually great.

[Ariana Parejo]

Like, but if you ever texted me like after nine, right, you know I'm not going to respond. But I respond to you like six in the morning, right? But like, I just know that to perform at the level I perform at today, I probably need to not have a Cocktail and go to bed at nine and have like, eight hours of energy. Because for me to do what I could do at 22, I just don't physically have that anymore.

[Leo Parejo]

But you also recognize.

[Scott Clary]

Yeah.

[Leo Parejo]

So to your point.

[Scott Clary]

Seasons.

[Leo Parejo]

Seasons to your life.

[Scott Clary]

Right.

[Leo Parejo]

Like, you don't want to be. You don't want to be absent from. From your kids and.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, but what I was going to say is that the season. It's like, also know that what you're doing, like, I am going to sacrifice the next season to have a type of season I want. Right. So also know that, like, I think a lot of successful people don't realize it's like, it's. Sprints are in moments. Right. For the most part, it's a marathon. And. But just know that there are going to be times where you have to sprint when you.

[Leo Parejo]

Okay. So if you think about sort of the. The. The seasons of your life. So you were Keller Williams, and then you were remind. And then you're Washington Capital, and now you're exp. Those are sort of like the four.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah. But it was Keller Williams, Washington Capitals.

[Leo Parejo]

So when you think about. When you think about that season that you're building after Keller Williams, so it was Washington Capital partners, and then remind, Washington Capital, and remind, you were still going in thinking like, I am entrepreneur. I can work unlimited hours per week. I want to build things. Is that where you were at when you were going into those two ventures?

[Ariana Parejo]

And the cool part that I think, again, from the outsider in rearview mirror, it looks like this chapter ends and this one starts. What entrepreneurship normally looks like is like, you're always testing stuff. Like you're always saying, is this an accretive side business to what we're currently doing? And sometimes it's a tremendous waste of time and money or it becomes so successful, it dwarfs the previous thing that you were doing, where you just have to let it go, because it's like, I'm gonna sell that.

[Leo Parejo]

You know, that's how Yosef started boxycharm. Of course, he was doing like a. He was doing like. He was like, shipping and selling off, like, liquidation merchandise. Right. And then he started only focusing on beauty and cosmetics as. As one of the categories of merchandise he was liquidating. And then he found out that that was outperforming all the other categories. And then he just spun that off into policy, which is.

[Ariana Parejo]

Which. Which I think is like the best way to build businesses. Right. Where you have you. It's. It's. It's. It's almost a less risky way of finding product market fit. Right. And, and the times I've seen it be done successfully is purely bootstrapped. Right, right. It's, it's, it's, it's an entrepreneurial itch that's being scratched versus I think, you know, we just live through a decade of ideas being backed by dollars that were not, you know, held accountable for product market fit.

[Leo Parejo]

I don't think that's done. I mean we're an AI, we're in.

[Scott Clary]

The, we're in the age of AI right now.

[Ariana Parejo]

We're in the next phase.

[Scott Clary]

You tack AI onto your business and all of a sudden your valuation goes through the roof.

[Leo Parejo]

I don't think it will ever be done. I think that that will always, I think that as long as there's people that are trying to push and break things and create bleeding edge super disruptive products and there's some, you know, hype around the technology they're using, there's always going to be some capital that flows in just because of.

[Ariana Parejo]

Absolutely.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah.

[Ariana Parejo]

I was just saying the ones I've successful yet are very successful in. From my vantage point it's normally been like they were trying to solve a problem as a, as a doer, market participant, expert, domain expert and those seem to be the best solutions.

[Leo Parejo]

So if you think about how you graduated from Keller Williams into Washington Capital and Washington Capital and remind you built with Ariana and for the listeners, that's your wife.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah. And some other co founders.

[Leo Parejo]

But yes, yes. Okay. So what was the goal? And we can focus on either or whichever one is like more meaningful to you from like things that I've learned building this, that I can teach the audience. But which one you can focus on? Either. What was the goal going into either of those two companies?

[Ariana Parejo]

It was always like is there, is there an opportunity to solve? So Washington Capital partners was in 2012 post financial reform, so post.frank and CFBB. So before the financial crisis we could walk into a bank and borrow a line of credit and go buy real estate based on the valuation an asset based loan, meaning if the house was worth 500,000 a bank would lend me up to 250,000 against that property. But there was no ability to repay baked into it. Which again with development or refurbishing, that's not a thing.

[Leo Parejo]

So.

[Ariana Parejo]

Too too many people borrowed too much money with no ability to repay. And so that was a foundational thing mostly for like owner occupied loans where it's like you can't borrow money unless you can afford to service the debt. Through cash flow. So that single rule change affected a lot of investment based loans that don't have the same goal as owner occupied. But it was one of those unintended consequences that come from changing rules to protect the whole. There was a small segment who was like, well now we can't borrow money either. Even though our goal is not to service the debt, it's to fix it up and sell it. So it was again. And when you see a finished product, you know that entities lent billions of dollars and then start like that. It was like, hey, we were borrowing money to buy, fix and sell houses. We stopped buying and fixing during the bottom of the financial crisis. And then the investors who were lending us the money said, hey, can you keep using the capital? Say, well, let's try lending it to other people. And so I went from like, hey, let's do a couple loans to let's do more loans to like, okay, this is becoming a business. Well now we need to raise money. Well now are you still, are you.

[Leo Parejo]

Still like, like selling har. You're still selling houses, you're still buying, fixing, flipping while simultaneously running like a loan business on the side.

[Ariana Parejo]

It was like an Excel spreadsheet and we're doing a couple loans and then it's like, okay, now we probably need to take. And the beauty of the journey, it's like we had this office that incubated the next business almost always sequentially.

[Leo Parejo]

And then this is what eventually like led to remind as well.

[Ariana Parejo]

And so in the lending business we needed an LOS alone origination system. But hard money lending was very niche, so it wasn't like a robust marketplace because the total addressable market is not big enough. So we, we started specking one out and hired some engineers to build it for us. And one of the solutions we, one of the inputs we wanted was public record data. And so we went out to the marketplace and said, hey, where can we buy this data? And we were quoted some egregious pricing from the couple of companies we called. And at that time we heard that Zillow was advertising a public record MLS API and we had to compete in a hackathon to get access to it. And so we attended just purely because we wanted the data, but we had to present a product that was a UI and we actually won the whole thing because we actually understood the, the realtor journey. And when we won, Zillow said, why don't you keep the API and build a product that could be deployed to MLS's? And four months later we are invited to do a presentation at a summit. You know, we, we came up with the name over a weekend, bought a URL, made a PowerPoint and a three minute pitch. We just happened to present to some of the biggest mlss in the country who then said, hey, if you actually build this, we would be a customer. And so then that took us on the next journey.

[Scott Clary]

A big thank you to Indeed for supporting Success Story because hiring people is one of the hardest things you're ever going to have to do. As an entrepreneur, as a founder, as.

[Leo Parejo]

Somebody who's trying to build a business.

[Scott Clary]

It'S important to hire well and find the right person. But it takes so much time and it's so labor intensive because like most entrepreneurs, you have a thousand things going on and there's a good chance you just realized your business needed to hire somebody yesterday. So how can you find that great, amazing right fit candidate fast? It's easy. Just use Indeed because you don't have to waste time struggling to get your job post seen on all these other job sites. If you're using Indeed, you can just use their sponsored jobs to help you stand out and hire fast. Your post jumps right to the top of the page for relevant candidates so you can reach out to exactly who you're looking for faster and the results really speak for themselves. According to Indeed Data, Sponsored jobs posted directly on indeed have 45% more applications.

[Leo Parejo]

Than non sponsored jobs.

[Scott Clary]

And you know what I love most about Indeed? It really just makes hiring so fast because everything is streamlined in one place. No more juggling multiple platforms or waiting weeks for the right candidate. And how fast is indeed in the minute? I've been talking to you. 23 hires were made on Indeed according to Indeed Data Worldwide. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed and listeners of Success Story will get a $75 sponsored job credit. To get your jobs more visibility@inn Indeed.com clarity, terms and conditions do apply. Just go to Indeed.com clarity A huge thank you to Netsuite for supporting today's episode. Now, what does the future hold for business? If you ask nine experts, you're going.

[Leo Parejo]

To get 10 answers.

[Scott Clary]

Bull market. Bear market Inflation up. Inflation down. Honestly, at this point you just need a crystal ball. But until we get one, over 41,000 businesses have found the next best thing. They future proofed their businesses their operations with NetSuite by Oracle, which is the number one cloud ERP. Imagine having your accounting, your financial management, your inventory, your HR all flowing together in one fluid platform. And here's what makes NetSuite different. It gives you one source of truth for your business. You get the visibility and control to make quick, confident decisions while others are guessing. You're working with real time data, insights, forecasting. You're basically looking into the future of your business with actionable data. Whether your company earns a couple million or even hundreds of millions, NetSuite helps you respond to immediate challenges and helps you grab your biggest opportunities. And speaking of opportunities, they put together the CFO's guide to AI and machine learning at netsuite.com Scott Clary this is the playbook for understanding how to use AI for your business. The guide is free. That is netsuite.com/. Scott Clary.

[Leo Parejo]

So a lot of, a lot of the businesses you've built, I mean, to your point, so it's almost been like this natural progression. It's not like you ideated on 50 different business ideas and then you went out into the market and then you pressure tested these ideas and got feedback and spoke to people, then started to build one and then tried to take it to market and find product. These were all these natural progressions of all the activities you were already doing.

[Ariana Parejo]

And, and I, and I, I think that's how most, you know, especially bootstrap entrepreneurs, right? Like if I were to quote Michael Gerber's E. Myth, right? It's like you're a really good doer and then all of a sudden at some point, either you're like, I can do it better than the owner does or I can do it better than the, the franchisee does. And so you then have this entrepreneurial fit. But when you've been an entrepreneur your whole life, I think I feel like you're always testing stuff, right? And like some of the most successful entrepreneurs I've ever met in any industry, it's like, hey, like, you know, I've met a gentleman here in Miami who builds like these phenomenal large scale projects. 400,000 square feet, hotels, mixed use. Like, how'd you start? He was like, I was literally a painter. I was painting. Then I then, then like I figured out how to make money and most of these guys didn't. And I was actually getting a line of credit from the bank and they get like, they told me this drywall guy's about to go under. You should probably call him. And so the bank put, put him in touch with a drywall guy and he's like, well, I already do the paint, I might as well get drywall business. And so he upstreamed his flow a little bit. Yeah.

[Leo Parejo]

And he's like, well, he's like marginal increments, not.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, it's like, well, if I got the paint, I got the drywall, I might as well get the framing right. And before you know it, he's like, he's a developer and so like he just kept going a little bit upstream and downstream in any direction where it's like, okay, why, why don't we vertically integrate a little bit more? And so sometimes it's adjacent. And to your point about our mutual friend, he's like, wait, this outperforms everything with more margin. Right? So. And that's that ideating and testing is what's important. Right? Because you know, the, the real estate peen sales was the cash flow that created the space to go test stuff, right? Because like the part that's not on the Internet, like all the stuff we tried that didn't work, right? Like we're like, hey, let's do assisted living facilities. And we lost 400 grand. And it's like, we tried developing some stuff early on. We lost $750,000. And it was like, but like none of it was an end of life moment because thankfully we had a cash flowing business that allowed us to take risks.

[Leo Parejo]

And I mean, like, that sounds like large sums of money for people that I've never built anything before, never invested us.

[Ariana Parejo]

It was a large sum of money.

[Leo Parejo]

No. Okay, sorry. Yes. My point is it is, it is still a large sum of money for anyone to lose. But I mean, if you have that cash flow, then again it's not gonna, it's not gonna end your life. You're gonna wake up tomorrow, you're still gonna be able to try new things. It's, it's also a risk tolerance that you build over time. So it's a risk tolerance, it's the ability to bounce back from risk and for failure that I think is again, like a hallmark of a good entrepreneur. So if you lose $400,000 because you put money into crypto, not, not this week, not this week, but in the past, if you lost money, put money into crypto, I mean, you, you, you're taking an uneducated investing opinion and I think that that's actually what causes people to, to make emotional decisions as opposed to logical ones. But if you have built things repeatedly and you understand that there's potential product market fit for the solution that you're trying to create and, and you build it and it doesn't work, I mean, you can take a less of an emotional stance on it. And I think it allows you to take more risks and not let those failures like, completely destroy you mentally. Because again, like, you, you, you sort of like expose your. I think a good entrepreneur, like, gradually exposes themselves to more and more risk over time.

[Ariana Parejo]

So a couple, couple of things you said. One is, I actually say a sentence that I think is very important in sales is that all human beings make emotional decisions and then justify them.

[Leo Parejo]

Loud, correct? Yes.

[Ariana Parejo]

Right. So that's why I focus on qualification. But then secondly, like, the tolerance thing is, like, we're parents to younger is kids. Like, our daughter turned 10 yesterday, so it's not feeling younger anymore, but 7 and 10. And you know, when you have a toddler, like, if they don't get the banana or the toy in the second they want it, it's the end of the world. And then by the time they're like, you know, tying their shoes, like, that can trigger them. And then it's like, I got picked on at school. Like, and in that kind of progression of entrepreneurship, take that as the same thing. It's like, oh, I couldn't close the deal. Oh, I lost the deal. Or oh, that marketing campaign returned $0, right? Like, we invested $10,000 in a mailer and we got zero in ROI. Is it because we didn't do it long enough? Like, did I actually have to do that eight times before I got the return I wanted? Or on CPM or anything like that? And then it's just through experience you start to have that tolerance. It's like, okay, most things have a risk reward quotient that I'm solving for. And, you know, how much risk am I willing to take? And then also I think the one that, I think the superpower that comes from those small failures that lead to larger failures, even though in that moment it was everything is, did you die? And that's a crazy concept, right? Like you just said, most, like every entrepreneur you've ever interviewed had an ass whooping super early on. If you choose to get up, which is not always the case, right? Some people I've met try it, get their ass whooped and go get a job and never look back. And then actually tell others a cautionary tale of don't risk anything. But the ones that get back up, you actually have very real tangible experience that, like, it didn't kill you, right? Like, did you die? Do you still, like, the, the next day you wake up and your, your wife is safe, your kids are safe, your parents are alive, you have room for your head, you have food in the refrigerator. Was it really that bad? And what's the worst that can happen? You have to go get a job.

[Leo Parejo]

That's always the worst. And I think that when you. I think that when you look at the skill sets that you've built as an entrepreneur and you realize how employable you actually are, it really takes a lot of the stress and the fear out of it, because what's the worst that can happen? A company wants to. A company will always want to hire somebody that's able to build something from scratch where nothing existed. Now, a couple years later, whether or not it was successful, you built that whole thing from scratch. You figured out sales, marketing, ops, hr, finance. You figured out every single business unit that is a very valuable skill set to a company that's going to pay well over 152,200. $200,000 to employ you. So if that's the worst case, 0.

[Ariana Parejo]

To 1, I think is probably the hardest skill in business.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah, I think that I want. I want you to teach over a lesson for, like, entrepreneurs that are listening, because you, you sort of evolved your business into different businesses based on. Based on, like, what the market was telling you to do. Like, with Washington Capital, with remind, the market was saying, we need this, and then you built it.

[Ariana Parejo]

So I. I think that's even too much credit.

[Leo Parejo]

Really?

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah. I think.

[Leo Parejo]

Why do you say that?

[Ariana Parejo]

Because it was like, well, I was gonna.

[Leo Parejo]

I'll tell you what I was gonna ask you. So I was gonna ask you, what do entrepreneurs do wrong when they start businesses?

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, no, for us, it was always like, we need it. We. We're just literally building it for ourselves.

[Leo Parejo]

I don't think you're giving yourself enough credit.

[Ariana Parejo]

And then we showed it to a couple friends, and they're like, oh, that's pretty cool, friends.

[Scott Clary]

That has significant impact on the market. But whatever.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, but, But I go back to sample size of one, right? Like, I think human beings undervalue their own. Their own vantage point and attention. So, like, the amount of times I've sat down with an agent who's like, hey, I'm going to try this for marketing, what do you think? I'm like, would that work on you? Like, how do you part with. I don't think enough people stop and go, I'm a sophisticated consumer of products and services. Like, does that work on me? Right? Like, and I don't think enough marketers put themselves through that lens. Like, hey, I'm going to try this. Like, okay, would you Click on that.

[Leo Parejo]

I agree with that completely.

[Ariana Parejo]

Would you open that envelope? Would you pick up that phone? Like the second I hear, hey, is this Leonardo? I'm like, click. You don't know how to say my name. You have no business talking to me. Right? So, but like the amount of times I've clicked on a funny product ad on Instagram lately in the last like two years, because that's where my attention for my demographic lives. It's like, oh, wow. Like, I just need to see the right ad at the right moment and I am a ready, will and enable consumer.

[Leo Parejo]

Well, I think there's so much waste in, in marketing spend and marketing effort because I agree with you. I, I've actually. So I want to talk to you about, about average because you speak a lot about what, what average is. And, and I know that, for example, you throw out most of the flyers that you get to your house before they even get inside the house. You float. You throw them out when you're right beside your mailbox. But I think that, and I've never really understood this because again, I've never led like a Fortune 500 marketing team, but if I look at their socials or if I look at their flyering, or if I look at the majority of the marketing campaigns that they put out, I find it to be like, really half ass. Like, I, it doesn't hit home with me. It doesn't resonate with me. Most of my buying decision is based on my research. Now maybe those marketing campaigns, those shitty posts on LinkedIn, those flyers that, you know, like, overwhelm my mailbox, that I throw it just as quickly as you do, maybe they're just meant to keep them top of mind. But it almost turns me off from the company. Like, I ra. I, I defer to somebody who is innovative, who doesn't suck at marketing, who is like a little bit against the grain from somebody that's doing it for the past 100 years because I feel like they have my best interest in mind. I feel like they think more like me. And this is whether or not they do. This is the perception that I get. So I bank with a different kind of bank. I bank with Mercury. I don't bank with like Chase or J.P. morgan. And I, I like Mercury because they're very convenient and the features they set up are great for me. But I'm curious if you have opinion on why do companies put out such average content, such average marketing effort?

[Ariana Parejo]

Companies have seasons, right? So a startup who's being scrappy and creative and against the grain has a limited budget. Right. And, and I think you know, you also have to appreciate like you are their icp, you're their ideal customer profile for what they're selling. And so the bigger an enterprise gets, the more, less specific ICP they have. Then they just like the general population is mine chases and cities. ICP is America, right. Like we want 20% of America because at that point they've just acquired and conglomerated so many business and services where like the lifetime value of you is not just the bank account, it's all the other ancillary products they'll cross sell you. And, and when you are, you know, double digigit market share of a country at that point it is top of mind, right? It's Coca Cola. Right. Like I just need you to remember that when you're at the restaurant and you're about to order and they say Coke or Pepsi, you say Coke. Right? Because at that point you're competing just for top of mind attention versus like hey, we're an aggressive startup, we have a niche and like we're going to focus on that, be world class at that. And so you like again also like I try not to, you know, even let the poor marketing bother me in a sense of like hey, I'm going to choose to do like for example, we bank with a local regional player where what's most important to us is that like I can walk in, ask for the manager and like I can send a wire remotely when we're traveling. Like it's service versus features. Like I can, I don't actually care what the tech looks like if you give me the service I'm looking for. For.

[Scott Clary]

Well by the way, the, the feature.

[Leo Parejo]

Set is like the service is tied into the feature set. So one of the things I didn't have in Canada was TD Bank. I had to walk into a branch to send a wire. I cannot stand walking into a branch to send a wire. So now I can send wire, I can send ach from my desktop, from my laptop, whatever, just it. So service is now congruent with the features they built up.

[Ariana Parejo]

But yes, sorry, yeah, so and again depending on the, the product and service and the phase of life you're in and the like the what the value proposition. And to me that's the beauty of capitalism. Everybody gets to compete on all that stuff. And I think the, what I would say to most entrepreneurs is like you don't need everybody. Like we're the single at exp. We're the single largest real estate Brokerage in the United States. And I'm. And I have 4.2% of every agent who's licensed in the US in the US and like, you know, long term I want to get that to 10 or 12%. But even if we absolutely knock it out of the park and we get to 10 or 12%, that means 90% of the agents will never be with me. And that's okay.

[Leo Parejo]

Let's talk a little bit about what EXP does differently because I think a lot of what we're talking about can dovetail into that quite nicely because EXP does things differently than traditional real estate firms. I mean if I, if again you, you make a point of saying like the average consumer is very smart sometimes I think legacy institutions, I do not consider EXP to be legacy by any means. I think it's very new and forward thinking. Legacy institutions do not consider how smart the average consumer is becoming because of access to information. Is that something that I think you hold that belief to be true? How does that impact like what you, what you do at EXP or what you do differently?

[Ariana Parejo]

So first, like this is my first job. So I, I did not found the company. I didn't set the vision from the beginning, but it's a 15 year old company. We turned 15 like a month ago. And I think Glenn was way ahead of his time as the founder. And it was born out of an entrepreneurial itch. It was born in 2009 post financial crisis where he goes, I can't afford rent anymore. Like I'm either going to, I've got a business or I create a cloud based model. And so when he created a cloud based brokerage, never been done before, like there was a.

[Leo Parejo]

Can I ask why? Because it just seems like that's like reducing a ton of costs. So it makes a ton of sense.

[Ariana Parejo]

But because now it's normal, right? Like in 20, in 2009, the thought was foreign. And by the way, legally speaking, there was a bunch of states where like we still have to have like a 500 square foot office somewhere and put the license on the wall.

[Leo Parejo]

Why is that?

[Ariana Parejo]

Just, you know, it's how it's been done, right? So we were able to legally comply with state rules and create an environment and a platform that allowed us to go fully virtual. But it was like, hey, we can get rid of the single largest expense on everyone's bnl, which is awful space because real estate was dominated by franchises which was literally a store on every corner, right? So he was able to eliminate the biggest Expense and the biggest hindrance because before xp, no one had ever recruited without having a store on every corner.

[Scott Clary]

No, I know. I mean like if you think about.

[Leo Parejo]

Like legacy industries, I mean like real estate is right up there with banking. I don't think it's changed that much in X amount of years. I, I think you're in it. I don't know for a fact, but I mean I feel like outside of exp, before exp, like it probably operated pretty much the same for like a hundred years. A hundred years. Like it does not change significantly. So this was Glenn's vision. What were the, what were the biggest issues that you dealt with? Say, I mean, or that he dealt with even before you joined that sort of emulates like market. Like how did you get, how did you get agents to get on board with this? How did you get people to trust listing, you know, the biggest purchase or sale of their life with somebody doesn't have physical offices when again, yes, it hasn't been done for like this five years.

[Ariana Parejo]

I think the overcoming the objection was purely to the agents because what Glenn understood is that consumers pick the professional they want to work with. No matter what jersey you're wearing, whether it's Keller Williams or ReMax or Center21 or Exp. Like they had a relationship with Scott and like your cell phone, like they didn't have you saved under KW or EXP or really just Scott.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah.

[Ariana Parejo]

So like you could have switched companies between your last purchase and this purchase and they're going to use you regardless. The over the overcoming the objection was convincing that the agent didn't need the physical office. And again, Glenn very creatively did it by like we have an enterprise relationship with Regis, so like we have more office than anybody else does. Right. Because you can walk in and use a Regis office anywhere on the planet. But you know, exp's journey is no different than every other one where it's like, hey, it was a fist fight for like 10, 11 years. And then there was an inflection point which for exp's journey was Covid. Right. Where the world went into a collective experiment of becoming virtual. And I mean they went from like 10,000 to like 70,000 agents. It was crazy. Exponential growth in a two or three year period. And now in 2024, going into 2025, every new national corporately owned brokerage will look more like us than the legacy players.

[Leo Parejo]

What is, I mean, we just established it. Real estate, the majority of it is, is very outdated and it's a legacy industry. Would be one belief it's still held in real estate. That could be harmful.

[Ariana Parejo]

Well, I think one of them still, that you need physical office space. Like again, we're only 4.2% of the market. Right. And if you were to take every copycat brokerage who's modeled us, they're probably maybe 1% together, not even 1%.

[Scott Clary]

Do you see, do you see legacy.

[Leo Parejo]

Companies copying you now?

[Ariana Parejo]

No, it's mostly new startups. So what?

[Leo Parejo]

So they don't, so they, they haven't, they haven't said, oh, we don't want to be blockbuster.

[Ariana Parejo]

So, so I think that's a, the, a reduced statement that doesn't give credit to the like true baggage of any legacy incumbent competing where it's like, wait, like everything we have is built around this legacy thought process. So to disrupt this one thing that seems kind of like obvious in the rearview mirror might be completely and fundamentally disruptive to our entire model. And so, so do, do you burn the bridge and decide to reinvent yourself or, you know, are you either Apple Jobs with the ipods or the iPhone which cannibalize its most profitable product, or are you Kodak where you say film is everything? We're not going to touch this digital thing. And then Canon meets your luxury.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah, it's interesting. What, it'll be interesting to see what, what they do well.

[Ariana Parejo]

And again, I'm, I'm, I'm of the opinion, like, it doesn't have to be binary, right? It's like, we'll get a piece of the market, they'll keep a piece of the market, and everyone coexists. But because in most industries you still see legacy folks, you do exist.

[Leo Parejo]

I know that you're saying that, but there are, there are case studies of people that no longer have any market share.

[Ariana Parejo]

There are. So, but again, the brokerage business is a service fulfillment business for 1099 entrepreneurs, right? So at the end of the day, like, I, I view what we do as a platform to allow real estate entrepreneurs to build their businesses on top of that. So like, for me, we are an operating system, we're a platform. And some other companies have a different model, right? So we tend to attract a very entrepreneurial type of agent who, who our platform is ideal for. But there are other agents who like, are probably more attracted to a brand and they're like, hey, I'm going to join this company because of the like, maybe tens of millions they do consumer spending for facing which we are not.

[Leo Parejo]

But I think that, I think that a platform that enables A realtor to become entrepreneurial or something that is a platform that attracts entrepreneurs. I mean I think the agents at the end of the day are going to be most successful when they adopt an entrepreneurial mindset. Because I mean again I feel that my perspective outside looking in, if I'm going to be in real estate and I'm betting my entire career on a brand that I'm missing the mark on what's actually going to make me successful in real estate. I feel like I'm, I'm over investing in legacy player versus sort of taking that external locus of control, putting it inside and saying I'm responsible for my own success. Let me like partner up with an agency that supports my entrepreneurial vision for whatever I want to build. I think that's probably a fundamental shift. It's a very scary shift. But I think that at the end of the day the agents that are entrepreneurial that understand that their success is yes, supported by the broker but executed on by them, they're going to be the ones that make way more money, close more deals.

[Ariana Parejo]

Correct. And, and the entire industry is entrepreneurial. Right. Because every agent is a 1099 agent. So every single one of them, whether some realize it or not, own a small SMB business.

[Scott Clary]

Yes.

[Ariana Parejo]

And they need to treat like gross dollars as top line revenue which should have a portion allocated to reinvestment whether it's technology or marketing or staff or something else. If you plan to make it a sustainable not you know, kind of S quadrant self employed practice what makes the.

[Leo Parejo]

Best agent in your mind.

[Ariana Parejo]

You know I feel that in my journey I've, it's like what makes the best entrepreneur. Right. It's like hey. And it's, it's pretty clear to me. I think you need to have a lot of introspection, figure out how you're wired. Right. Like most everything can be learned. Right. I, I, I truly prescribe to that. If you have at average or above average IQ you can actually learn anything. And especially in this era where like I just go on YouTube and I don't even have to pay people for it. But where, where my, my thinking is very specific and probably a little different than most is like anyone can do anything outside of like brain surgery or like coding really complicated things. But if you can actually figure out how it is that you're, I'd make.

[Leo Parejo]

The argument that coding is becoming more.

[Ariana Parejo]

Accessible too but 100% with AI, but when you figure out what your God given gifts are and then actually lean in on that. So like for Example, if you take like the Disc Profile, which is a personality profiling test that I'm kind of obsessed with, I know statistically from the results of the test that there are things I'm better at. Natural state, meaning I can actually get on stage, be handed a microphone as long as I'm in my, like, in my cohort, in my domain, and freestyle, like to 5,000 people for an hour. And by the end of that hour, I'll probably have more energy than when I got off stage, when I got on stage. Because, like, I mean, that's when you.

[Leo Parejo]

Know you're doing your best work and you're in the right spot.

[Ariana Parejo]

Because I'm in my gift.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah.

[Ariana Parejo]

A. I had a predisposition for it, but then I have actually spent 23 years of my life honing this. Right? The opposite of that is like the snc, like the detailed and the spreadsheet part of.

[Leo Parejo]

What are you, by the way?

[Ariana Parejo]

You're 99. D. 99 is not most.

[Leo Parejo]

Is that most salespeople, not that pronounced.

[Ariana Parejo]

But some variation of that. And then like a 10, 10 on us and see. And so like once a month, I have to do consolidated financials for three hours of a public company. Right. I can do it. I can pay attention, but that actually drains my energy. Like, for me to take a sales call after that is not a good idea. Right. I'm not going to show up with the same level of energy, with the same level of attention. And like, that night, I probably don't want to do date night or spend time with the kids where I have to be super presence. Like, hey, let's, you know, maybe watch a movie, right? Where you don't need my level of engagement because I might not show up the way I want to show up.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah. It's not your. It's not your gift.

[Ariana Parejo]

So, so tens of the. The question is not a. I didn't forget. The question is, how do you. How do you get to live in your gifts? Because I think that's how entrepreneurs show up passionately, right? When people, like, live in your passions, it's like, well, what are you good at? So verse. And. And I think that's how, like, people get confused about the passion statement, right? Like, you don't have to be passionate about selling houses. You have to be passionate about spending time with people. Or even, like, let's just go into Legion, right? Like, and whether. Fill in the blank real estate agent or anything, it's like, okay, there are many forms of lead gen, right? Like in person, if you are not high. I is probably not going to work, right? If like you're super detailed and you can build funnels with click through rates and a call response to action. Like, that's not me. That's a very successful way of doing it. But I'm really good at like pitching a room which statistically speaking for a good percentage of humans is scary to die. Right. So if you don't have that eye, don't do that because you'll probably create anxiety, create fear, create failure because you're fearful. And then you're like, I had a bad experience. Sales suck, right? Versus like, sales suck that way for you versus like, if you're highly introverted and highly analytical, it's like, figure out some funnel stuff on the Internet and you might make more money than you ever dreamed because it's actually living in your gift.

[Scott Clary]

Whether or not you're an entrepreneur or.

[Leo Parejo]

An agent who is an entrepreneur. What is the, what is the wisdom for them to figure out how to find out what their gift is so.

[Scott Clary]

They can live in it and they.

[Leo Parejo]

Can outsource the rest as, as quickly as possible?

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, so I, I think it's both, you know, maybe taking tests and taking a bunch of them until like, how.

[Leo Parejo]

Did you find yours outside of doing a disc profile?

[Ariana Parejo]

I luckily, like inside the killer wound system. Like they taught us that very early on. So like I started taking discs when I was like 19 in AVAs and Myers Briggs and like strength finder. So like, once I kind of figured out that this is something I want to learn, I went and found more. Then the cool thing was like, I started doing it so young. I actually saw mine change over time. Right. Like if you study this stuff, it says like, it's fluid through your formative years. And typically kind of like you said, the entrepreneur has a ass whooping that normally is when it sets. So like my eye was a 50 and then the financial crisis and we had to start over and my D went to a hundred. Right. It was like I survived a traumatic event and it could be personal or it could be business. And then it's like, okay, now the thing is set in stone. Like, that's how I'm wired.

[Scott Clary]

That's how you want to operate and.

[Leo Parejo]

That'S how you are wired to operate.

[Ariana Parejo]

But like, I've also noticed it's like my, when I'm low energy and like I get stressed, my eye drops dramatically. So I like, I don't have as much patience. I don't, I don't show up as Friendly as possible. And so like to me operationally, like if I know this about myself, it's like, hey, don't schedule meetings in the afternoon on a Friday where I need to be a high. I. Because it's not going to be a good experience for the people receiving and hearing me. And it's not going to be a good experience for me either because I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna be having it.

[Leo Parejo]

I thought this is like, this is beautiful. It's a self awareness. I don't think. I mean, yes, a fair amount of people have self awareness at the level that you do, but I don't think that everybody does. I think that everybody, especially if you are entrepreneurial, you just do everything and you try and apply the same amount of energy to it and you can't understand why some things are giving you energy and taking energy away and you're spending your time over a course of years doing things that you shouldn't be doing. So I think that it's actually very smart to understand that like a lot of this sort of this self awareness and the tools to discover the self awareness that they exist and there's really no reason for you to be suffering through things that you shouldn't be doing well.

[Ariana Parejo]

And if you go down that rabbit hole and like you preach it and believe it organizationally, like once, like I remember we had a small team with Ariana in, in real estate where like we not only had the discs, we actually had you print yours out and put it by your space.

[Leo Parejo]

Do you remember that?

[Ariana Parejo]

No. So like I know how you're wired.

[Leo Parejo]

Oh, okay, okay, I understand, I understand.

[Ariana Parejo]

Right, like to compensate. So like this is a perfect one. Like Ariana and I both are high I's and D's and like we wanted to do good things for our people. Like, hey, let's give them variable comp on bonuses because like we make more money, we want to pay them more money. Well, for an sc, I just ruin their life. Like a detailed oriented, stability driven person actually wants stability in their income. And so by me saying, hey, I'm going to take away your guarantee floor and I'm gonna share my food and bounty with you. You're like, you just rocked my world and what's important to me, right? So even becoming a student of how other people are wired, I think makes you show up as a better leader, right? Where it's like, hey, instead of a cash bonus, you know, we spent more time asking questions like, hey, Ariana went and got her a gift of Something she would have wanted but never spent on herself. And that was a much better way to celebrate somebody. Or like, you take someone who's in detail and support and go, hey, you crushed it this week. Let me bring you up to the front of the room and have everyone clap and they're like, why are you torturing me right now?

[Leo Parejo]

Like, some people would love it, some people would. Why are you want to just die?

[Ariana Parejo]

You're, like, hurting me. Like, you're. You're like, I may quit because you made me so uncomfortable. Maybe that person just wanted you to take them out to lunch and celebrate them one on one and not make a big deal about it, but give them attention versus if you don't have that. If, if, if you don't know how they're wired. Because some people show up a certain way as a defense mechanism. It's like, hey, I need to be social because I don't want to not get recognition at work. But, like, it drains me. I actually don't like it. Like, it's a act.

[Leo Parejo]

Do you have it just thinking about the environment that you're working in right now with exp. Because you don't have brick and mortar and you're not in office with people. I've. I've worked in. In virtual environments as well, but I always found it hard to build relationships virtually. I always was fine building relationships, hiring onboarding in person and then moving it to virtual, but I found it very hard to start a relationship with somebody virtually. So if we're talking about getting to know people in the most intimate sense so that you can actually served how they want to be served and. And engage with them in the way that, you know, they want to be engaged with. How do you deal with that in a virtual environment?

[Ariana Parejo]

So a big distinction that I learned, right? Like, Ariana and I were both, like, in office, only, like, you know, when we were at Remind, Ariana's office was where she could see all the enterprise salespeople and she could hear their calls and she could walk past them. And same for me. And then we were forced to go to this virtual world. That company, Remind, was not born digitally. It was very much in office. Like, I can hear and see you, and we go to events together.

[Leo Parejo]

Analog company, right?

[Ariana Parejo]

Versus, like, Glenn's entire vision was virtual. And, like, he was an early adopter of the Metaverse, which was, like, way ahead of its time, right? Like, I actually have a different appreciation for, like, our Metaverse technology now, which. Which, again, was once a client server and, like, hard to render and, but now it's like really fast asset light browser based. But it's, it's for. What he was driving towards that he created in the metaverse was we actually have this serendipitous moments, right. Like if I like the other day I needed Glenn and before I caught him on the cell I just popped into the international room where he, I know he spends most of his days and like I walk down the hallway.

[Leo Parejo]

Chills in the metaverse.

[Ariana Parejo]

Oh yeah, no, we operate very much certain teams completely in the Metaverse. And what my point was, I saw Felix, who runs growth internationally and I just popped in, we had a 10 minute conversation as avatars in his office was completely serendipitous, right. And it was like, hey, real quick like, like you know, my actual call with him was going to be in eight minutes and I was just there and I walked in, said hi to Felix, asked how the launch Peru was going. And so you know, and you know there's very recognizable data that like when you go from in office to virtual productivity spikes but over time it starts dropping because people get detached from other.

[Leo Parejo]

Okay. So I was my, my follow up sort of like going back to the question I asked was do you not.

[Scott Clary]

Feel friction building relationships for the first.

[Leo Parejo]

Time and engaging with people in a virtual environment?

[Ariana Parejo]

So again like there is the human element of it, but our entire DNA was born in cloud as a business. So there is a much different expectation of like I can actually pop into your office digitally and, and like welcomed. Well, it's expected. It's not only welcome, it's like, it's what people do. Like it is not uncommon for someone to call you on a video format where your phone rings and it's workplace video. Right. That, that in another format that's kind of intrusive. Right. But it's okay. From nine to five we're teammates. If I call and you're available, pick up in a digital format. Like it's the expectations you're working.

[Leo Parejo]

This is the, this is the alternative to me walking over to your desk and saying hi.

[Ariana Parejo]

Exactly.

[Leo Parejo]

So you have to build. I mean so I think that that's probably the best implementation of virtual digital remote because if not, then you.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah. And again, I can't back this up with data. But intuitively I think that's where like we're probably the most skilled enterprise that runs the kind of revenue we do in a fairly in a fully virtual world leveraging the type of virtual tools that we leverage.

[Scott Clary]

A quick shout out to the HubSpot Podcast Network for Supporting Success Story. Now, if you like Success Story, you're going to love other podcasts in their network. One of my favorites is Create like the Greats. It's hosted by Ross Simmons, obviously brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network. You're going to join Ross on Create like the Greats. Ross dissects the genius behind history's most remarkable creators and their legendary work. So you're going to get this blend of history and business and creativity. He has a great voice, always good for a podcast, and he has a decade of practical experience. He's going to break down some of the best creative processes that built influential companies, brands and stories in a way that anyone can apply. So whether or not you're fascinated by history, creative thinking, or you simply want to improve, improve and systematize your own creativity without sacrificing productivity, this podcast is your perfect listen. Go listen to Create like the Greats wherever you get your podcast. A huge shout out to Lingoda for supporting today's episode. Now if you're ready to master a new language, Lingoda is the online language platform trusted by over 100,000 students worldwide. Lingoda offers live classes with real teachers available 24 7. You can choose from Germany, German, English, business, English, French, Spanish or their newest addition, Italian. What sets Lingoda apart? The smallest class size in the market. It's just you and up to five other students. Or if you want, you can go one on one for personalized attention. Their native level teachers don't just teach language, they share culture too. And you'll speak confidently from day one with Lingoda's flexible scheduling and proven curriculum, students report or being able to navigate real conversations in weeks, not years. And if you're using Lingoda for business, their CEFR aligned courses ensure that you're learning internationally recognized language standards that employers value. Between sessions, you're going to reinforce your skills with downloadable materials and bite sized practice exercises. And all Success Story listeners, they put together a special deal. Try lingoda free with three group classes or one private class plus you save on any course with my link. Try.lingoda.com success story and code Scott25 don't miss this chance to transform your life through language learning.

[Leo Parejo]

What would be some lessons? Some okay, so let's let's think of like one positive and one negative that came from your background in entrepreneurship that impacts how you run a publicly traded company. Like what would be one thing about an entrepreneur that does not translate into PubCo leadership and one thing that definitely Does.

[Ariana Parejo]

Well, the one that does, and I think that's why Glenn wanted me involved was it's like the, actually I watched a Steve Jobs speech to a class at an ivy League from 20 years ago that was actually really same as viral clip, right? He's got many, but the one that he was, that I'm referencing is he was kind of like lecturing a bunch of young people who are about to become consultants, right? Where it's like, and, and this is analogous to maybe just going up the corporate ladder. Like if you've never had to live with the outcomes of your decisions, that's a very different wiring. Like whether it's your consultant or you're actually just, you know, a participant or contributor into a very large enterprise. It's like, hey, you've never been like me and Ariana, like, hey, if we kind of mess this up, we just blew through our entire savings and we gotta go create 5 or 10k of excess capital a month to get back to the hundred we just blew on this idea, right? So the entrepreneurial fearlessness or being committed to your decision making process and it's like, hey, not only am I going to make decision, like even if there's backlash, I'm going to, I'm going to be okay with it for a prolonged period of time.

[Leo Parejo]

Just you, that's it.

[Ariana Parejo]

And so that's, that's to me what translates really, really well in the sense of companies are collection of people. And whether it's we have a five person team, a 20 person team, a 50 person team, a 300 person team or a 3,000 person team, at the end of the day you're just, you know, navigating human interactions, harnessing people's disparate talent sets that, you know, collectively contribute more than others. And then it's just operating human interaction. So that like I think the, the, the downside to come going from a small company to a big company is forgetting that, right? Like it's like, oh, now we need to do things differently. It's like how much, how much of it do we need? Like, could this have been an email? Like do we need to go through these like three meetings to get to the outcome? Like, because I think the biggest problem, like, and even when Glenn asked me to join, he's like, hey, just because something is done a certain way, question everything, be willing to break it.

[Leo Parejo]

Such a beautiful mindset, right?

[Ariana Parejo]

It's like if you see bureaucracy or inefficiency, just question like why, why do we do it like this? Why did we do it like this. And like, because we've always done it that way is never the acceptable answer.

[Leo Parejo]

And sometimes I, I mean, sometimes memory is short. Sometimes a, a company can grow and creates all these inefficiencies and people only remember like, people only remember like last week, so they actually don't even know where these inefficiencies.

[Ariana Parejo]

So this is the other thing I've learned about leadership. Whether it's, you know, someone being the leader to me or me than being a leader to somebody. It's like also remember that how humans learn. And whether it's your kid or your employee, sometimes you have to let them go through like, hey, I want to do it this one. Like, that's a terrible idea. And, and, and, and sometimes you say, hey, that's a terrible idea, but go ahead, do it anyway. Or you can say, hey, I wouldn't do it that way, but I'm going to let you make that choice. And they're most likely going to do it anyway. And the decision tree is like, how, how detrimental is this learning experience for them to our enterprise? Like, if it's no big deal and they get to like, I said my piece, it wasn't like I hung you out to dry. It's like, hey, I don't think it'll work because, you know, I've tried it 10 times last 15 years and it's never worked. But go ahead. As long as it doesn't detriment the enterprise at scale.

[Leo Parejo]

No, it's going to be a learning experience and they're going to be a.

[Ariana Parejo]

And like even me more educated person. To the xp, I was like, glenn, I want to do this. He's like, yeah, is a. This is not going to work, but if you think you can do it, go ahead. And then like three months later, exactly what he said was going to happen, happen. I'm like, okay, I get it. But that especially for someone, you know, coming up in business or entrepreneurship, like, you want to test and ideate and iterate and that. And like, and that's the difference of education versus wisdom, right? And there's just some things that are experiential. And whether It's Matteo at 7 years old or me at 42 running a business, it's like, sometimes I just, it doesn't matter how much someone tells me or I read it, probably gonna have to try it and learn it and experience it and then have a very firm conviction of why I believe that.

[Leo Parejo]

One thing that I think you've done really well and I've Asked you how you've done this before because you've handled. I mean, you jumped into exp at like tumultuous is putting it lightly. It was not a easy time for the industry. And I really know nothing about what happened in the industry at all. I just know that it was on the news a lot. Which.

[Ariana Parejo]

It was on the real news. Yeah. Wasn't in the industry news.

[Leo Parejo]

So when it's in the real news, I figure that it's like a, a gray hair at the bare minimum, a lot of. But one thing that I found you do remarkably well is, and I've asked you this before, how do you manage all these situations that are kind of unprecedented and how do you make smart decisions? Because it seems like you've made some very smart decisions that have worked out very, very well. And feel free to go into as much. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna ask you on detail, like about things that you cannot speak about, but. So teach what you can, but talk to me about how you. First of all, some of the things you navigated with sort of like the ups and downs of the real estate industry in the past year. Sort of just a brief disclaimer for what happened, because I think that some people don't still understand what actually happened if they're not in real estate. But then also your decision making process, because I think that's, I think whatever it is, it's worked out very well. So.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, so again, going back to like boiling down to like, what is the downside if something happens versus something doesn't happen. Right.

[Leo Parejo]

So specifically you're referencing some of the decisions you make. There's massive downside.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, yeah. So the, the specific thing you're referencing, there was a class action lawsuit basically against the industry. Right. So the national association of Realtors and then co defendants, the biggest brokerages, including us. And so there was massive delegation in which ours is still not personally settled, so that I can't speak to the specifics on that. But through it, you know, there was, there was some moments in time where it was like, hey, I need to go live in a couple hours and, and make some, some very big decisions on behalf of our agents and potentially the industry. And so just like everything else, it's like you have to have a decision tree. Right? Like there's the stuff that, like, I'm going to make a decision in a vacuum, whether it's myself and a couple of the leaders based on my collective journey. And that's actually why you end up in leadership where you're willing to make that decision and live with the good or bad outcome as the owner, which.

[Leo Parejo]

Is why that entrepreneurial experience definitely helped.

[Ariana Parejo]

And so that, that, that one just, that's the wisdom part of the journey, right? Where like, hey, when I was 22, I was just not equipped to make that decision. And then as I've gotten older, it's also understand that like there's, you're not the only human necessary to make the decisions. Be, be as open as possible to many input points as possible. And so then it's like, like ins, outside counsel, inside council, top, you know, leaders you trust that are experts in that domain and then also saying, okay, what's the worst that can happen? What's the best that can? So, so for us, it was our industry collectively chose to be quiet, retreat, let attorneys speak on their behalf and kind of like batten down the hatches and jump in the foxhole versus that one weekend where it was very pivotal in our industry. We were on with general counsel, we were on with Glenn, and I said, hey, I think I need to get very loud and become the calming voice for our space in this moment. And more importantly for.

[Leo Parejo]

What was the signal that made you think that?

[Ariana Parejo]

The hundreds of text messages and emails that I received from our people with genuine fear in the voice, like, I'm not sure I'm going to be able to feed my family and I'm the breadwinner, I can't sleep. Like, please tell us what's going to happen or what we need to do next. And so that was one of those where like, I, I told Glenn, I was like, I think we need to get really loud. But like, if I get really loud, I could affect our negotiation position. I could affect our outstanding liability. And that's, that's, you know, I, I can make the decision of like, I think this is what we need to do. But at the end of the day, you're the majority shareholder. What do you think we should do? And to his credit, he said, get as loud as possible and we'll deal with the potential upper down because that's the calming voice for our people. And like a, the leadership position is more important than the downside.

[Leo Parejo]

So everything, every, every, every problem that you solve is looked at through the lens of agent first. This is who we serve.

[Ariana Parejo]

So that's that. That is the exact tagline that is his North Star. Right. So like again, and for me, I've always been the founder, CEO, so. Right. This is a different role where it's like I joked with him, I said, I get to be the fun uncle your dad. Then, you know, not that long after he gave me the dad role. Yeah, but the difference is it's, it's, you know, I've never had a job and I was like, hey, I'm not sure I know how to have a job. He goes, it's super straightforward. I only have one, one North Star. And it's, I want to build the most agent centric real estate company on the planet. So that's the prism that we look through every single thing. And um, it actually makes it very simple, right? So it's like if I'm stuck on a problem in my head and I'm like, should I be building this? And it's like, am I solving this for the right icp? And sometimes I'm not. It's like, oh no, I'm trying to attract independent brokers. Well, that's not my icp. I actually, that's not who I'm building the company for. It's for the actual agents who are here or maybe the agents I'm going to compete with them for or her. So at that point it's like as long as I remember what the North Star is, it actually makes the decision making process very simple. So in, in these moments where I've made very bold decisions in the last 12 months, like we made one about changing policy company wide that ended up in the news and it was like a rough couple of weeks. And I remember one day I was quite stressed also about it and Ariana could tell my face and she goes, but are you right? I said, I'm, I'm more right. I feel more right in my head about this than just about anything else. And she's like, to see it through. And in a couple of weeks the, the, the chatter quieted down and a couple of weeks later, just about every other major company followed our lead. And like a couple of months later, entire states are adopting our position. So, you know, it's like, did you die? Do we have the ability to, to recalibrate and change our position? Yes, we do. And so, and again, if you're, you're the prism, is, is this the best thing possible for the people I serve? Then it kind of makes it super easy to go down the decision tree.

[Leo Parejo]

So two thoughts. First of all, super important. Have a supportive partner when you're making yourself decisions. I think that's like half the battle in entrepreneurship to have somebody who's like just like sort of checking your, checking you and checking Your, your thought process, I find that to be one of the most, I mean Gina is again like you with Ariane is one of the most important I I pieces of my life.

[Ariana Parejo]

Like I tell young people, I said, the person you marry will dictate most of the happiness in your life because whether, whether they you choose to have them be your business partner like I have or not, it's still like the entrepreneur, right? Is a hell of a roller coaster. And so if someone, if your other partner, depending on who, who's on the entrepreneurial side of the spectrum is not prepared for that or is not comfortable with that risk, it's going to create a lot of friction and, and you know, whether you're doing it together or one of you as the entrepreneur, you, you need somebody. Like I remember in the toughest moments of, of remind because there was lots of ups and downs is like we took turns being the one freaking out and crying, right? Like our rule was like we both can't cry. Tonight it's your turn to cry and I'll be your rock and the next day it's my turn. And so you have to be able to have those very clear boundaries of support system and even be okay with like hey, I, I, I, you, you, you might need to go get some, some advice from somebody else because I'm, I'm going through it too as well. So. And then just having super open communication.

[Scott Clary]

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[Leo Parejo]

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[Scott Clary]

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[Leo Parejo]

Hardest things you're ever going to do.

[Scott Clary]

As an entrepreneur, as a founder, as somebody who's trying to build a business. Because it's important to hire. Well, it's important to hire and find the right person, but it takes so much time. It's so labor intensive. Because like most entrepreneurs, you have a thousand things going on and there's a good chance that you just realized your business needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find that great, amazing right fit candidate fast? It's easy.

[Leo Parejo]

You just use Indeed because you don't.

[Scott Clary]

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[Leo Parejo]

Than non sponsored jobs.

[Scott Clary]

You know what I love most about Indeed? It really just makes hiring so fast because everything is streamlined in one place. No more juggling multiple platforms or waiting weeks for the right candidate. How fast is Indeed? In the minute I've been Talking to you, 23 hires were made on Indeed According to Indeed Data Worldwide. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed and listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit. To get your jobs more [e-mail] Clary just go to indeed.com Clary right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com Clary terms and conditions apply. If you're hiring, Indeed is all you need. Thank you netsuite for supporting today's episode. Now, what does the future hold for business? If you ask nine experts going to get 10 answers. Bull market Bear market Inflation up, Inflation down. Honestly, I just need a crystal ball. But until we get one, over 41,000 businesses have found the next best thing. They future proofed their operations with NetSuite by Oracle, which is the number one cloud ERP. Imagine having your accounting, your financial management, your inventory, your HR all flowing together.

[Leo Parejo]

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[Scott Clary]

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[Leo Parejo]

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[Scott Clary]

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[Leo Parejo]

Scott Clary I am so smart. Everyone who I know who's built anything meaningful, I mean this, you can't have any trauma or stress in your home when you're trying to build or if you do, it's just gonna make it 10x harder. I think that person is super, super important. Now my second thought on sort of that decision tree framework that you just discussed, what would be again, just sort of trying to pull some lessons for people that are trying to understand how they can apply what you've done to their own story. So you have your icp, you have your avatar, you have your lens that you look all these problems through. What would be some other just thoughts around a decision tree framework that some, someone listening to this can apply to how they navigate in their own business.

[Ariana Parejo]

The first one and the simpler one that I think most people overcomplicate is decision fast. Especially like we're not talking about like industry changing hundreds of millions of dollars liability. Like I'm just talking about like the amount of people I see get stuck in paralysis by analysis at any facet of B business building is the most dangerous one. Like I think aim shoot readjust. Aim shoot readjust is so much better than aim aim, aim, aim. Let me get it perfect. Like let me get the best copy. Like just get copy out there. If, if it sucks, the market will tell you because you spent a hundred bucks and nothing happened. Then you adjust the copy a little bit or have 10 versions of the ad which now you can ask AI what's going to work better but you should test like I was just listening to Gary V Pod keynote yesterday was like the cool thing about social right now in this moment in 2024. So for context, end of 2024 is that the. It's, it's less about like who you follow but like what interests you. So like if, if a organic post gets a lot of engagement, then turn it into an ad. Right? Versus like if an organic host gets zero ads. You're missing the message.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah, I mean this is half of my my content strategy. So like I have my, my, my testing ground is like Twitter and threats. I can put out 10 ideas a day and I can in, in, you know, in under an hour, two hours. I can immediately see feedback from the market, from the audience. Then I'll turn that highest performing tweet into it. Well, I don't run a lot of ads, but it would, I would turn it into newsletter, into solo podcast.

[Scott Clary]

I mean, you like, there's all these.

[Leo Parejo]

Different signals you can look for. I think that's actually very smart. I mean, it's so funny how people don't like, there's so many ways to test for free your marketing and people don't take advantage of them and they for some reason think that all that great organic social they're putting out has to be different from all the ads that they're running. I mean, we can talk about like why companies suck at marketing all day, but that's besides the point. But no, I want to, I want to just sort of, sort of tie a bow and like sort of the EXP and real estate conversation. What would be some, what would be.

[Scott Clary]

Some views that you have on the.

[Leo Parejo]

Future of real estate that may not be popular views or maybe like against the grain things that you think are going to change that the rest of the industry, you're going to be making predictions now and hopefully we can like clip this in like five years from now and be like, oh my God, look at how, look at how right Leo was. So what are some things that you believe that are not like generally accepted right now?

[Ariana Parejo]

So answering that question is probably a little different than, um, you would probably expect me to say it because I've actually been in the business long enough where I've seen probably two big shifts. Um, the first one was high speed Internet. Right.

[Leo Parejo]

So you're dating yourself.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, very much. Very, very much so. I got licensed in 2002. But like, for the folks who remember that or not are young enough, like, high speed Internet was not something you had at home. Like the first plugs for high speed Internet went directly into office buildings because that's where that were necessary. So like the first up and down. So the real estate industry evolved from books where they were dropped off once a week with all the listings for sharing of properties to these like portal mainframe things you would log into for the first versions of MLS where you can actually browse from home. So like you had to physically drive to the kind of like why EXP never was invented previously. It actually was the catalyst of a combination of the two things. I'm going to talk about Where I remember seeing the acceleration of a real estate transaction. So when I started selling real estate in 2002, the fastest you could sell a house if you were lucky to get like an offer was like, if it was a hot, hot market and it was a lot of interest, it would probably be about a week, right? Because I had to log into this portal, hit print, call a bunch of landlines, leave a bunch of messages, people call me back, the seller. I would tell the agent when I wanted to see the property, they'd have to call the agent on a landline, get a call back, take me like two or three days to schedule a showing. Then I'd have to drive back to the office. I'm really dating myself. These, these contracts that had perforated rip aways and one was white, one was pink, one was yellow. And I had to press hard in blue ink and rip it apart in either hand, drop it off or stick it in the fax machine. Hope the fax machine didn't eat it, which it did half the time. Then I had to go get another one and start over. And so like the best case scenario, it was like a week or two on a hot property. The Internet sped that up quite a bit because I could now do that from home. And then like that just accelerated everything. And then the, the, the second accelerant was about three, four years later when the iPhone came out, right? The, the true smartphone where it was like, oh, I don't need a. I could just call the agent. I can just look up the same MLS information on my phone.

[Leo Parejo]

And so now the agent can answer emails while they're showing a house as opposed to waiting till they get back into the office or.

[Ariana Parejo]

Exactly. So today if I list a house that's hot, it will be syndicated to hundreds of websites simultaneously, which will trigger save search criteria that will notify via an app. And the consumer can now collaborate with me through a shared calendar and schedule the showing directly if I'm available. We could physically both be available and see that property within one to two hours. And then the agent can write up a contract on their phone, get you to digitally sign it with a digital signature tool, and it's delivered within hours of the property going live. So the two fast. The, the two transformative accelerants I saw one was high speed Internet and then followed by mobile. In every one of those shifts, I've seen agents not make it right. The Internet didn't put real estate agents out of business. Mobile did not put real estate agents out of business. The agents who adopted these massive shifts in technology and society put the agents that did not out of business. So the way I see that to answer that question is I think AI is as big or more transformative than those two other ships I've witnessed in my lifetime. You know, I've seen some people exaggerate and say it's like it's fire. It's not fire. Like fire was the one that made us change as homo sapiens. But I think it's as powerful as either one of those or more. And so how it affects it, I don't know. That's the part that's super fascinating to me because like, I have the iPhone 16 and so do you. IPhone one was nothing more than a toy. Like it was, it was like BlackBerry was for grownups. That was a toy. But that toy was an iterative process that's become like, it's the remote control to the car I drove here. It's the key to the car. It's my banking app, it's my credit card. Like, I can actually just leave the phone, leave my house with my phone.

[Leo Parejo]

And you can do everything.

[Ariana Parejo]

And I don't need anything else anymore.

[Leo Parejo]

You don't need a wallet, you don't need a iPhone.

[Ariana Parejo]

One was not that. Yeah, right. So when I see large language models or, or tech that enables me to go faster, stronger, there are parts like I can tell you that right now we are doing stuff in the last six months internally that will streamline processes to, to a dramatic point where like when I look at per unit cost to fulfill a transaction, to say that over time, I don't know how long I'll drive, that cost down by 80% in efficiency is not out of the question anymore. Which a year ago I couldn't have said that. Right. Like there are, you know, the, the technology is evolving at a speed that I think things that we didn't think could happen two years ago are going to happen in the next five years. So the, the, the, the confidence statement I can say is the, the companies and, or agents, market participants and remove industry from it, who adopt the accelerating tools that are driving down costs and efficiency are going to be transformative. Right? So like there's early indications that, you know, contributors, individual contributors at companies who are using large language models, fill in the blank, your favorite one on a daily basis as a, like a, a sidekick, are like 25% more efficient. Right. Are removing like 40%, are adding 40% more accuracy. Right. Like perfect example for me, I don't read or Write well, because I'm pretty sure I'm undiagnosed dyslexic. But in the 80s we didn't have labels like that. It was just like he does, he doesn't read good versus like now I can actually write and post without asking for any help at scale from a marketing standpoint or like a social media standpoint because like I'm very articulate. So I can voice the text and then have Chad GBT check for grammar and spelling. And then all by the, all of a sudden I'm like, hey, I can talk a lot in multiple formats versus like confidence wise I was probably limited to public speaking versus like I don't enjoy writing because now you can have.

[Leo Parejo]

A newsletter and you can trans. You can translate that newsletter into multiple languages, multiple languages and it's all you.

[Ariana Parejo]

And I can just like, I can write what I'm trying to communicate and I can say, hey, change the tonality for LinkedIn versus Instagram versus like. And it's like all of a sudden I'm a marketing genius. But. But it's not like, write me a post about this. Like, no, I wrote the post in my own voice. And like, one of the things is like learning to use the technology correctly in the sense of like my prompts say proofread for spelling and grammar, but keep my tone and voice.

[Scott Clary]

I train.

[Leo Parejo]

So whenever I use like any sort of LLM for content, I actually train it on pieces that I've written myself. So it knows my, my own voice. But it's interesting, I find that people, when they, when they approach and adopt new technology or when new technology is present it to them, they either, they either over index on it and use it as a crutch or sort of push back against it and under index and don't use it at all. And I think the actual answer is somewhere in between in the middle where you use all these tools to just optimize and improve and help. But ultimately none of these tools, especially in 2024, can replace a human. If I just say LinkedIn, post, ad copy, newsletter copy for a listing, whatever on chat, GPO and copy for a listing. It's a pretty rough listing. So maybe it would do better than some, but for the best, for the best in class, which is really what everybody wants to be. Nobody wakes up and wants to do a shitty job if you use these tools. It's the first step in a creative process or it's the first step in whatever you're trying to accomplish. But now you can spend your Time and your energy to take it from just okay to exceptional because you're applying that human touch to it as opposed to doing the, the, the really difficult creative, the, the first concept of creative work or the first draft of something like that's what gives, that's what chat GPT with all these different LLMs allow you to do it allows you to spend time focusing on the things that actually matter.

[Ariana Parejo]

Well, and, and where I would say to people especially living through a couple big shifts, it's like whatever is in, in year one or two, it's like ultimately that might not even be the highest and best application of it. So the, the, the, the suggestion is to play and test and try stuff. So it's not just like, hey, it's not just for writing. It's like you and I were out at a restaurant and I took a picture of the wine list and said, hey, for price and value and quality, pick a big bodied red for us. Yeah, and it did. Right?

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah.

[Ariana Parejo]

And it was like, order that one. And we were both pretty happy with it.

[Leo Parejo]

It was great.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah.

[Ariana Parejo]

Right. And so you can actually just snap a picture of an image and ask it to do analysis. And, and like funny enough, you were pulling out your phone and started googling and I was like, I beat you. We're ordering this one.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah, no, it's, Listen, I think that in all industries people get nervous about AI because they're going to say, well okay, so now the, the seller can do X amount of research on selling their home and they don't even need an agent anymore. And I push back against that because all of these, listen, any sort of transaction business is just transactions. It's repeated transactions. There still is again, they, they make, they make an emotional decision, they justify with logic. There still is a human component to a transaction. So even if I did all the research in the world, I still want somebody that's been doing that for 20 years and I want their experience and I want their wisdom because I can look at all the data points as to what I should do. And in theory maybe I could sell my own house, but I still want somebody who can guide me through that process. Because you can't, you can't Google and you can't AI wisdom and experience. You really just can't.

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, no, I, so a couple of things.

[Scott Clary]

I'm sure people bring this up with you all the time.

[Ariana Parejo]

Every time. Yes, it's so and so. The reality is everything has to do with the context. Right. Buying and selling real estate is highly infrequent the average American moves six times in their entire life, three times as a tenant, three times as a land, as an owner. And they don't sell their homes on average right now, every but nine years, right? So if I don't move every nine years, first of all, I probably forgot what happened the first time. Everything's different, right? Like, literally, like nine years ago, you probably used paper. Like, we don't actually have physical paper contracts anymore, right? They're all digital, right? And so every. Everything about the process is different now. And it's full of friction. Like, it's buying and selling a house. And not from the practitioner standpoint, but literally from, like, transferring title, indebting the property, taking an insurance policy, making sure, like, getting insurance in South Florida, did you get wind and flood? Right? Like, it's not a simple process and it's full of friction. And it's highly emotional because one thing is like, hey, I'm buying a business on behalf of my company as my job versus it's like, hey, this is where I'm going to raise my children with my partner, and this is going to be home. It gets highly, highly emotional. So the. The analogy I always give in today's world that I think is super applicable is. Is how we learn. YouTube has democratized learning in a way that's never been done in human history. And I'm a huge fan of it. Like, I learned to cook different things, or I basically learned to spearfish watching videos. But at the end of the day, like, once I jumped in the water, I wanted to go with someone who'd done it before, who knew what to do. And the best analogy I always give people is today, if I were to want to summon Mount Everest, I would do a lot of research on the Internet. And, you know, I could get all the training videos. I could watch the how to videos like, don't do this, don't do that. I could watch reviews on, like, the best waterproof gear, the best camera, the best, like, radio, in case there was an emergency. Like, that doesn't mean I'm going to get to the bottom of Everest and be like, all right, I'm going at it myself. 100 of the people probably should or do hire a Sherpa.

[Leo Parejo]

100 who was born and raised and.

[Ariana Parejo]

Has done it 400 times, right? So, like, that extra layer of, like, you want someone to hold your hand and go, you know, that's. That's not a big deal. Let's just hang out. It'll pass. Or, yeah, let's get out of here. Right, right now. Right now. Let's go right now. So, and then I think that's what an expert guide does on any difficult high friction transaction. Right? Like the, the promise that like we would have gone the way of the travel agent was a fallacy in the sense it was. That's a highly commoditized, government regulated, you know, pork belly, if you will. It's, it's, it's a commodity versus like, hey, real estate is hyper local and there's nuances to neighborhoods from like the school, the zoning, what you can and can't do. Like, is it an hoa? Is it not an hoa? Like what? I don't know. What? I don't know about something super expensive that I only do a couple times in my life.

[Leo Parejo]

I want to, I want to finish this up with just some last sort of words of wisdom from you because I pulled some sort of core entrepreneurial beliefs that you have, and you can just sort of like rip through these and give just a couple of thoughts on why you believe these things. I think these are, these will be like great little reels. We'll come clip them out to sound bites. But I love sort of all these ideas. So let me just go through them and tell me just a couple words about why this is so important for an entrepreneur. So first one is success comes from consistency rather than special talents.

[Ariana Parejo]

So how do you want me to respond? Do you want me to repeat it?

[Leo Parejo]

No. I mean, no, no, no, no.

[Scott Clary]

You don't have to actually format it for reals.

[Leo Parejo]

We do have good editors.

[Scott Clary]

No, no, just why is this, why.

[Leo Parejo]

Is, why are these so important? I'll read through them and just tell me in your mind, why is this good insight for an entrepreneur? Yeah. So the first one is success comes from consistency rather than special talents.

[Ariana Parejo]

I think so much of the world assumes that when you see someone talented, that we're gifted and even entrepreneurs. It's the exact same way, like, not using, like, those are filler words that I beat out of my own communication style through lots of reps. Right. Repetition is the best teacher. And you know, whether someone is extremely talented, they will almost always get outworked by someone who's consistent. And I think that applies from, you know, sports very easily in your head. But everything in life is like that.

[Leo Parejo]

I love that. Why should you focus on operational excellence and removing friction?

[Ariana Parejo]

I go back to the analogy that I said that most human beings don't give themselves enough credit. As a super sophisticated consumer, I obsess with operational excellence and removing friction because I think that's the goal of entrepreneurism. Like the reason I am all in on the Apple ecosystem, from the watch that's on my wrist to the phone that's in my pocket, to the AirPods that's in my other pocket and, and like five other products is because it's frictionless. It makes it easy for me to communicate, transfer my contacts, upgrade pay. It's a seamless ecosystem. We vote with dollars every single day of the year in every moment of our existence in capitalism. And so if you focus on removing as much friction as possible from the system, you become the no brainer answer to the selection for product or service.

[Leo Parejo]

Why should people prefer painkillers? Or actually let me rephrase that. Why should entrepreneurs focus on painkiller products versus vitamins?

[Ariana Parejo]

Yeah, one thing I learned very painfully is that most consumers of a product will always pick the easy button, right? Like one of the things we learned while building remind was that it would have probably applied to people that were super like minded. And whenever you're building a product service in your own echo chamber, you actually get a false positive. Right. So it might resonate for your peer group, but you always need to understand the total addressable market. And someone pulled me aside and sat me down. He's like, your mistake was you built a vitamin regimen versus a painkiller. And again like in 2024, the best example of that is like I heard some crazy statistic like 8% of Americans are arms on right now. Statistically and logically, every single person knows how to get fit, avoid high sugar intake and high fat intake and be in a caloric deficit. Whether it's by working out to create it or you know, putting less stuff in your mouth. Like you actually don't need a trainer. You don't need to Google it. Like I think just about the average human being knows that just from being alive today. But OIC got the 0 to 8% in like 24 months.

[Leo Parejo]

They have a larger market. Oh, I ju. I'm gonna, I'm not going to remember the stat live, but whatever. What there's like this one company and go, everyone listening, go Google it. Because it's, it's absolutely wild.

[Scott Clary]

The market cap of whatever leading company.

[Leo Parejo]

Creates OIC is, is now like surpassing some of like household name brands that you know. So I don't know the exact number on it, but there's one company that's just blowing it out of the water. And again like under two years, they, they accomplished this which is wow, like product market fit. Yeah, that's it. Why is it important for entrepreneurs to understand their time value and focus on high ROI activities?

[Ariana Parejo]

I think that's the only way you actually Progress, right. If, if $ productive activity is relative to your skill set. Right. So I think the entrepreneurial journey is figuring out what you're talented at, figuring out if that's actually, a high dollar productive activity and continue to constantly do a math problem. So you know, if I'm, if I'm meeting with entrepreneurs, I would say take your revenue from last year and divide it by 2008. Especially if you're an army of one. That'll give you, according to the Labor Department, what a full time gig looks like in entrepreneurship. It's probably higher than the 2080. But just for simple math, do that. Right. And so you will get a result, right. It'll be like, okay, I earn 50 an hour, 75 an hour, 150 an hour. And then for the subsequent week, write down what you do every 10 minutes. Like a lawyer would keep track of a notepad and then you'll actually see what you do every day. Right. And so the math problem is first of all, identify what is a dollar productive activity. And then the first point of leverage, whether it's VAs in another country or a in person assistant, everything that's not a high dollar activity. And you can almost, you can pencil buy it what that costs, right? Like is this data entry that could be $4 an hour, right. Is, is this something a large language model can write for you? Right. Like did you spend two hours editing and you're not good at it, right. So, and then you're constantly refining that activity. And in my, again, especially how I'm wired in my brain works, it's like I never let go of lead generation activity because that's always, always, always the most important thing to do in a business. But maybe you optimize by hiring a phenomenal lead generator where, you know, the big company's called a crow and in a small company it's, you're like head of sales. Yeah, right. So but like as an entrepreneur, like to me it's always product market fit and how do you scale that and, and, and whether you're, you are in the beginning of the journey, you're a product, an army of one. I would always be willing to learn every role before you hire it. It's like how do you manage someone or hold somebody accountable if you actually don't know what they're supposed to be doing?

[Leo Parejo]

What would be, you know, it could be one last. One last insight, one last word of wisdom or even like a question. I should have asked you that. I didn't. What would be one last thing you want to leave with the audience?

[Ariana Parejo]

Look, if you choose the entrepreneur route, it is painful. It can be very lonely at times. But the reward of just the experience has been one of the, you know, outside of being happily married and having children, like the best experiences of my life. Right. Sometimes I describe it as oversimplifying to. My highs are higher and my lows are lower than most people can imagine. But it's it. It's that for me, it's been a different form of like, artistic creation. Right. Like, building businesses can be a very creative process that is very fulfilling.

[Leo Parejo]

I love it. Okay, where should people connect with you if they want to? I mean, obviously you have exp. Website, but where do people actually connect with you?

[Ariana Parejo]

Instagram.

[Leo Parejo]

By the way, you have a podcast. I found it on the website.

[Ariana Parejo]

Ours is targeted to Realtors. And you know what I try to make sure to Showcase is that 0 to 1 process for realtors, because I think a lot of people come into the space and this failure rate for Realtors is very high. Right. So it's 66% of the first year. Most Realtors don't make it to year five. Like 90% fail within five years. So, you know, one of the things I tried to always show them, it's like, how did you go from zero to one in our world and not over complicated and get yourself out of the way. But the best ways to connect with me are on Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook.

[Leo Parejo]

Okay, cool, we'll drop everything in the show Notes. Last question I ask everyone. You know, you've had multiple seasons to your life. If you look back and you want to define success, like, what does it mean to you right now?

[Ariana Parejo]

Right now is being able to spend time with the people I care about. Because having had, you know, several moments that externally are defined as success, I think Ryan and I kind of redefined it. It's like it's the people that you care about that you spend time with is actually what matters. Right. So whether it's the moment in recognition from a role or an exit or a success, what. What you learn over time is like a lot of that fades. And, you know, I had a very singular focus in my early 20s of certain titles, and then when I achieved them, it actually felt like an empty me was my moment. So the. The. For me personally, in this season, it's I don't want to ever miss out on something I can't undo. Like for example, I'm never missing Daddy daughter dance. Last night was Natalia's birthday and like I had to be at a very, very important event, but it was like I'm leaving at 1 o'clock and I will get home when she's walking in from her music class. Maybe I was an hour late, but it's like I'm not missing that and it's non negotiable so. And again that's spoken from a place of privilege and I recognize that. But in this season that's actually my decision tree.

[Leo Parejo]

I, I, I love that. And by the way, you, I, I know you're saying it's spoken from a place of privilege, but I think the beauty of what you're teaching over is like also understand what you're optimizing for. So there's, there's levels to this game and you don't have to be playing at the level that you are at or that you have played at or that many of our mutual friends play at to achieve that. And some people, I find they over again they over index on titles financial and they realize they actually don't need all of that to actually live the life they want to live. So I think that even when you're young, just starting out, or if you aren't where you want to be financially, like understand where you want to go and optimize for that, don't always optimize for what you think success looks like. I think that's very important.

[Ariana Parejo]

And the only downside to that, because I completely agree, is you don't know what you don't know yet. Right. So most like the rigor of which we protect our time is only from the wounds we created from not right. Like Ariana and I spent years where I was on the road for 200 days and she was on the road for like 150 days. Like years where we missed stuff, like we don't remember certain moments, like did we even go to that? Like did we even see that versus now? Like that's the non negotiables that go into the calendar for 2025 before we read anything else. And so, and, and that's, you know, there's another quote that I love. It's like youth is wasted on the young. Like you can tell, like I was given very sage advice many, many, many times in my journey and I was like, yeah whatever old man, you don't know better. I'm smarter than you whether, like parent, mentor.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah.

[Ariana Parejo]

Anyone else? So that's kind of the, the beauty of the journey. Like you actually don't know what's important until you kind of fumble that ball and make sure you don't do it again once you have another opportunity.

[Leo Parejo]

I know I said that was the last question, but I lied. What would be one lesson I use? I'm going to change this question because my question that I usually ask is what would be a lesson you tell your 20 year old self? Which is a great question, but I actually want to reframe it and you would be the first person that I'm reframing it with and the question will be what would be a lesson that you want to leave your kids with?

[Ariana Parejo]

I think I would answer it the same way.

[Leo Parejo]

Yeah. Because sometimes I'll tell you why I'm changing it because sometimes people say I wouldn't change anything because all the, the hill, the hills and the valleys, it sort of led me to where I am today. And I don't want like the same clip from every single person.

[Ariana Parejo]

So. No. And that's, that would be my answer. But I will answer differently because you questioned it differently, which, that's why I said I would have answered in the same way, which is enjoy the ride. Whether it's my 20 year old self or my kids. I think especially when we again, like, maybe I'm wired differently, but like it was like I need to achieve X by Y. Right? It's like, no, you don't. 99% of everything we fear or keeps us up at night at some moment in life is literally irrelevant at a later date. Like if I look back at those moments where we made a bad bet and we lost the 350 or 750 or 400 or whatever, you got to remember both of us up at night crying or freaking out or losing sleep or like that feeling in your stomach where you think you're, you know, going to lose your mind. Now I can't even pinpoint what triggered it or how it felt, but like it's like it was no big deal. Like, so, you know, are you spending time with the people you care about in the moments that are important and outside of that's like, you'll be okay and enjoy the ride.

[Scott Clary]

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