Lessons - Understanding How Trauma Shapes Our Relationships and Success | Dr. Thema Bryant - Clinical Psychologist & APA President

Summary

Success Story Podcast: Lessons on How Trauma Shapes Relationships and Success with Dr. Thema Bryant

In this compelling episode of the Success Story Podcast, host Scott D. Clary engages in an insightful conversation with Dr. Thema Bryant, a renowned Clinical Psychologist and President of the American Psychological Association (APA). The discussion delves deep into the intricate ways unhealed emotional wounds influence the lives of high achievers, shaping their relationships and overall success.

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1. The Silent Impact of Unhealed Trauma

Dr. Thema Bryant begins by elucidating the pervasive effects of trauma on individuals and communities. She explains, “02:58,” “So my area of research is actually trauma recovery. So many times people have gone through very difficult experiences... And a part of the healing process is reconnecting with yourself, including reconnecting with your heart.”

Dr. Bryant emphasizes that whether directly experiencing trauma or being connected to someone who has, individuals often develop emotional disconnections as a coping mechanism. This numbness serves as a shield against further pain but inadvertently hinders personal growth and genuine connection.

2. The Illusion of Control and Emotional Suppression

Guest 1 probes deeper into the psychological underpinnings of trauma-induced behaviors, questioning the scientific basis for emotional disconnection. Dr. Bryant responds, “04:42,” “So it becomes really a priority for people to feel safe... The heart has become hardened as a way to feel safe. And even though we're disconnected from ourselves.”

She discusses how the quest for safety leads individuals to adopt an illusion of control, manifesting as perfectionism or workaholism. These behaviors create an appearance of strength and invincibility, masking the internal struggles and emotional voids that persist beneath the surface.

3. The Consequences of Ignoring Emotional Wounds

Addressing the repercussions of neglected trauma, Dr. Bryant states, “05:42,” “We can't heal a wound that we don't acknowledge... So that it is important that we start to tell ourselves the truth, that we have been through some things that were disturbing or that were upsetting.”

She highlights how unacknowledged wounds can deteriorate personal relationships, parenting styles, and self-treatment. The facade of being "fine" often leads to self-neglect and strained interactions with loved ones, undermining both personal well-being and professional success.

4. The Hidden Nature of Personal Wounds in High Achievers

Guest 1 observes that many high performers remain oblivious to their underlying emotional wounds. Dr. Bryant concurs, “06:54,” “Especially if... if it was a childhood wound, then people will say, oh no, that's just my personality... That's actually not you. That's your wound.”

She explains that early-developed defenses can be mistaken for inherent personality traits, making it challenging for individuals to recognize the need for healing. However, Dr. Bryant assures that transformation and self-reconnection are attainable even in adulthood.

5. Manifestations of Unhealed Trauma in Daily Life

The conversation shifts to how these unhealed wounds present in everyday scenarios. Dr. Bryant remarks, “11:28,” “So that's why some of us are workaholics... And so many times we set it up as an either or. We say, do you want to be a successful person or do you want to be a well person? And it's not. That's a false choice.”

She articulates that the relentless pursuit of success can often be a means to seek self-worth or escape feelings of shame, leading to an imbalance where professional achievements overshadow personal well-being.

6. The Myth of Wealth as a Guarantee for Happiness

The discussion addresses the misconception that financial success ensures personal happiness. Guest 1 shares observations, “12:59,” “I think I'm just thinking about some of my friends that have been like, ridiculously successful from a financial standpoint... And then you see these crazy stories, absolutely crazy stories of people that have had like $100 million exit. Then they're depressed.”

Dr. Bryant reinforces this by drawing parallels with lottery winners, noting, “13:27,” “We see the same thing happen with lottery winners... people... can live in a mansion and be miserable.”

These anecdotes underscore the importance of internal healing parallel to external success.

7. Integrating Heart, Science, and Soul in Healing

Guest 1 advocates for a holistic approach to healing, blending emotional, scientific, and spiritual elements. She questions, “13:54,” “Why is it important to bridge these gaps? Like traditionally, I mean, you were, you were president of the APA... Or is this a sort of like a new novel idea?”

Dr. Bryant responds by highlighting the evolving landscape of psychology: “14:22,” “One of the beautiful things trending in psychology is an increased attention to our spirituality or faith or religion... It's not just about your cognitions, but to really think about ourselves holistically.”

She emphasizes that incorporating spirituality and community fosters resilience and serves as protective factors against life’s challenges, promoting a more comprehensive healing process.

8. The Essential Balance Between Professional Success and Personal Well-Being

Concluding the discussion, Dr. Bryant urges individuals to embrace all facets of themselves. “15:56,” “You want to say, I'm not going to ignore or censor parts of myself. I want to be fully grounded in truth.”

She advises against the high performers' tendency to prioritize business success over personal fulfillment, advocating for an integrated approach that nurtures both professional achievements and inner well-being.

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Key Takeaways

• Emotional Disconnection: Trauma can lead to numbness and emotional detachment, hindering personal and professional relationships.

• Illusion of Control: High achievers may adopt perfectionism and workaholism as coping mechanisms to mask underlying emotional wounds.

• Acknowledgment is Crucial: Recognizing and addressing unhealed wounds is essential for genuine healing and balanced success.

• Holistic Healing Approach: Integrating emotional, scientific, and spiritual elements fosters comprehensive well-being and resilience.

• Redefining Success: True success encompasses both professional achievements and personal fulfillment, requiring investment in both areas.

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This episode serves as a profound reminder that success is not solely defined by external accomplishments but is deeply intertwined with emotional health and personal fulfillment. Dr. Thema Bryant's insights offer valuable guidance for high achievers seeking to navigate the complexities of trauma and build more meaningful, balanced lives.

Transcript

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[Host]

In this lesson's episode, explore how unhealed emotional wounds can silently shape high achievers lives. Learn why emotional disconnection often stems from early trauma. Learn how suppressed feelings can affect relationships and leadership. And learn why true healing blends science, heart and soul to build both success and personal well being.

[Guest 1]

It's so interesting because I've always found that we make these decisions with emotions, but then we justify them with logic. But for some reason we try and trick ourselves into thinking that it was just logic the entire time. So first of all, just speak to why we do this and also maybe give some context as to how did your research go in this direction? What was the inflection point that pushed.

[Co-Host]

You down this path?

[Guest 2]

Yes Absolutely. So my area of research is actually trauma recovery. So many times people have gone through very difficult experiences, whether they were the direct target of the trauma, or they love and care about someone who went through a traumatic experience individually. Or we see, like, collective trauma as well, whether school shootings or a veteran after war. And so many times when people have experienced extreme stress or trauma, they disconnect. And a part of what you disconnect from can be your heart. So when you ask people, like, you know, how'd you feel about that? Oh, yeah, I don't know. Or like, nothing. So they're just kind of numb. So a part of the healing process is reconnecting with yourself, including reconnecting with your heart.

[Guest 1]

And I feel like that's not an easy. It's not an easy thing to prove if everybody just thought, hey, if I just spend, like, a little bit more time focusing on myself and focusing on how I feel. But I think there. I think there's something scary there about going and looking inside, like, what. What actually happens with trauma? Like, what's the scientific reason for that disconnect? And you're talking about these really horrible examples of trauma. But I think that most people have some sort of trauma, childhood trauma, things that they haven't dealt with, things that are not as incredibly horrific as school shootings and war, but just things that still impact them.

[Guest 2]

Absolutely.

[Guest 1]

What happens with this?

[Guest 2]

So it becomes really a priority for people to feel safe. And so one way we can feel safe is, you know, when we hear the teenagers say, like, I don't care. You know, you tell them there could be a bad consequence. I don't care. And then some of us become adults who still convince ourselves not to care because we don't want to be hurt again. We don't want to be disappointed again. So then people think the solution is the illusion of control. If I try to control everything in my environment and try to control myself, including my emotions, then that feels safe to people, then that can be falsely thought of as strong, you know, that this person is so strong, nothing moves them or nothing phases them. And so the heart has become hardened as a way to feel safe. And even though we're disconnected from ourselves.

[Guest 1]

And do you feel like this goes counter. What is the. I guess the legacy or the traditional way to deal with this?

[Guest 2]

Yeah. So, you know, what happens is basically, we can't heal a wound that we don't acknowledge. So if I keep saying I'm fine, but I'm actually not fine, I'm just kind of diving into being a workaholic, being a perfectionist, being very driven being, but I think I'm fine, then the negative consequences can show up in the way that I treat myself. So that can be self neglect and self abandonment. It may be the way that I treat people who are close to me because that doesn't feel safe or comfortable. And so the way that I parent can be affected by my unhealed wounds, the way I treat my partner can be an effect of my unaddressed hurts. And so it is important that we start to tell ourselves the truth, that we have been through some things that were disturbing or that were upsetting, that had an impact, and that we then open ourselves up to being transformed, to making a different decision. So that my wounds are not running my life.

[Guest 1]

And I think that. So you're saying most people don't even realize that they have these.

[Guest 2]

Yeah, Especially if, as you mentioned, if it was a childhood wound, then people will say, oh no, that's just my personality. Right. Because they develop this armor so early. They don't remember a version of themselves before they were so defended or cold or hard. And so what I say is that's actually not you. That's your wound. You never got to develop a freely flowing you. But you can, you can develop that now. Even in adulthood. We can develop it.

[Host]

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[Guest 1]

And then when this, when they don't heal these wounds. For the average person listening to this, who is a high performer in their work or in their business or just in life, they just want to kill it at everything. Do incredible.

[Co-Host]

How do these wounds manifest?

[Guest 1]

Because I think that part of you teach so much in terms of healing with yourself, with others. But nobody can heal if they don't even recognize, to your point, that they have a problem. So how do these things show up in your day to day?

[Guest 2]

Yeah, you may be financially successful, resume. Incredible. But my question would be, how are you in the middle of the night by yourself? Right. Because many of us can outwardly perform that. That's our way of coping, is to stay busy. But as you were alluding to, for some people, it's scary to be still and let truth show up. So that's why some of us are workaholics. You know, you want to be so busy because you're either running in pursuit of self worth or running from the stigma and shame of your past. And so for you to actually be well, not just look good on paper. This is what we're talking about, tending to your heart. And it also can affect the way you show up in the workplace. We've all had that supervisor or boss who was very controlling, very dismissive, very dishonoring. They were not. Well, they're on top of this business mountain, but they're not a well person. And so many times we set it up as an either or. We say, do you want to be a successful person or do you want to be a well person? And it's not. That's a false choice. You can be both, but you have to invest in both. Right. So we've invested in the business part. Have you invested in the inner part?

[Guest 1]

Yeah, because I think that I'm just thinking about some of my friends that have been like, ridiculously successful from a financial standpoint. And, you know, they, they have their exit or they build their business and then the relationship with the kids isn't great, or they divorce their wife or they, they, they. And then they, you see these crazy stories, absolutely crazy stories of people that have had like $100 million exit. Then they're depressed.

[Guest 2]

Yes.

[Guest 1]

And they can't figure out why. And it. And they can't say that because everyone's going to be like, well, right now it's so happy.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Guest 2]

We see the same thing happen with lottery winners. Right. Where people thought, like, if you made this amount, that that's guaranteed happiness. And people you know, can live in a mansion and be miserable. Miserable.

[Guest 1]

You blend, you blend heart and you blend sort of.

[Co-Host]

How do I say this?

[Guest 1]

Like, you blend the heart and you blend science and then you blend soul all into this healing formula. Why is it important to bridge these gaps? Like traditionally, I mean, you were, you were president of the apa, which was just phenomenal. Does traditional textbook APA say that? You blend science and soul and heart into healing somebody. Or is this a sort of like a new novel idea?

[Guest 2]

So one of the beautiful things trend that's happening in psychology is an increased attention to our spirituality or faith or religion, which returns psychology to its roots. That it's not just about your cognitions, but to really think about ourselves holistically. So your thoughts, your emotions, your behavior, your sense of what is sacred to you and your relationships and community. So it's an important part, and we have well established research of these things as what we will call protective factors, that when you go through the difficulties of life, the stress of life, having a sense of what's sacred to you and, or having community, those things can protect us and help us to deal with life challenges.

[Guest 1]

Okay, so that makes sense. So you, you do have to account for all the factors that impact your data. Like you can't heal yourself fully by saying, I'm gonna, I'm gonna logic myself into doing some inner work and some, and some internals and some internal searching. But I'm going to remove the emotions out of it. I'm going to remove the spirituality out of it. Which I think that's what people tend to do. People that are high performing, logical people like, how do I fix everything? With a solution or a template or a playbook. And you're saying that's the wrong attitude to go into any of this.

[Guest 2]

Yeah. You want to say, I'm not going to ignore or censor parts of myself. I want to be fully grounded in truth. And so we say to ourselves, what parts of you do you miss? What parts of you were you taught to suppress or to ignore? That in order to be successful, I can't be connected to feelings, or in order to be successful, I can't have relationships. So there are these false notions that we've been given and that we then go and teach the people after us. You know, some people who were mentored to believe that these things were true, and yet maybe the person who is mentoring them still has some brokenness or has some aspects of their life that are unfulfilled.

[Outro Voice]

Thanks for tuning in. If you found this valuable, don't forget to hit that subscribe button so you never miss an episode. And if you want to dive deeper into this conversation, check out the links in the description to watch the full episode. See you in the next one.

[Guest 2]

Foreign.

[Host]

The HubSpot Podcast Network is a success story partner. Now, if you like success story, you're going to love other podcasts in the HubSpot Podcast network. One of my personal favorites is I Digress, hosted by my boy Troy Sandich. With shows under 30 minutes, I digress helps eliminate complexity, complications and confusion in your business with frameworks and strategies to achieve true, scalable and sustainable success. If you are an entrepreneur building anything you need to listen to I Digress. This is one of the most useful business podcasts you're ever gonna subscribe to. Listen to I Digress Wherever you get your podcasts.