Hour 1: River States Conference

Summary

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Sunday Mornings with Matt and Myron

Episode: Hour 1 - River States Conference
Date: March 8, 2026 | Hosts: Matt Jones & Myron Medcalf | ESPN Radio

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Episode Overview

Matt and Myron kick off college basketball’s “best time of the year” with their signature wit and energetic banter, diving deep into the madness of conference play, the NCAA tournament landscape, Selection Sunday speculation, tournament seeding controversy, coach drama, and memorable moments from both on and off the court. The episode also features ESPN analyst Tom Crean for bracket breakdown and a hilarious, unexpectedly heartwarming call segment with alumni from little-known River States Conference schools.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Excitement Around March and Selection Sunday

• Matt opens with pure excitement, calling this “our favorite time of year...one week away from Selection Sunday” (00:34).
• Myron agrees, “This is the greatest three plus weeks in all the sports. And I’m just excited, man.” (01:31)
• Both agree that this season has exceptional talent and high TV ratings, fueled by "the greatest freshman class ever," notable returning players due to NIL, and power programs performing at the top (02:28-03:10).

Memorable Quote

“There’s no sport that gives the underdog a real shot the way that college basketball does. Undeniably one of the greatest sporting events.”
— Myron Metcalf (02:09)

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2. Matt’s NCAA Tournament “Five-Team Guarantee” Tradition

• Matt recounts his decades-long tradition of picking five teams each year, guaranteeing the title will come from that group, with only one miss since 1995 (06:31-06:40).
• This year’s picks: Duke, Arizona, Michigan, Florida; fifth slot will be UConn or Houston after more deliberation (07:30-08:02).
• Myron and Matt debate the likelihood of “chalk” (favorites advancing) and where chaos could enter the bracket (08:22-09:03).

Notable Banter

• Comedic interlude breaks down the phrase “out the wazoo,” with the hosts realizing it means "buttocks" and joking about grandparents’ coded language (03:47-05:17).

Memorable Quote

“I’d stand in the Kmart and the Goodies parking lot and say, I hereby proclaim my guarantee.”
— Matt Jones, on his teenage sports-nerd roots (06:09)

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3. Dark Horses and Upset Potential

• Outside their “top five,” Matt reluctantly says Arkansas is a dangerous team due to “how good Darius Acuff is” and Trayvon Brazil’s impact (10:35-11:03).
• Myron shouts out Iowa State as a possible spoiler if they “figure it out,” but Matt quickly dismisses them, sparking playful bickering about the merits of each pick and Iowa tourism (09:22-10:34).

Fun Moment

“If Arkansas wins the title, I’ll quit this show. I’ll be so mad I’ll be out the wazoo.”
— Matt Jones (11:12)

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4. Drama: Coaches, Ejections & Vitale’s Criticism

• Discussion of UConn coach Danny Hurley’s ejection for allegedly chest-bumping a referee (15:50-17:17). Both suspect Hurley’s non-suspension is strategic due to the postseason stakes.
• Myron asserts, “He’s out of control… And if you like him, you call it passion, but fans are starting to see it’s just too much.” (17:33)
• Matt shares a rare Dick Vitale critical take, calling out Kentucky’s roster for poor return on NIL investment (18:56).

Notable Quotes

“At $22 million, they could have put together a better roster than they did. I really do.”
— Dick Vitale, via Tom Crean’s readout (18:56)

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5. Small-School Scheduling, Seeding Controversy, & Tom Crean Segment

• Tom Crean joins (25:07), passionately defending undefeated Miami of Ohio’s NCAA tournament credentials even if they lose their conference tournament.
• Debates over the legitimacy of some of Miami's wins, given that several are against NAIA or Division III teams like Indiana University East and Milligan (29:10-31:29).
• Crean details the challenges of scheduling for mid-majors and offers context on how some coaches, like Toledo’s Todd Kowalczyk, navigate it to boost resumes (27:14-29:10).

Memorable Quotes

“You don’t want to schedule somebody that you are remotely fearful could come in and beat you.”
— Tom Crean (27:42)

“You win 30 games—I don’t care who you are, you’ve earned a right to play.”
— Rachel’s Dad (46:11)

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6. River States Conference Call-In: Community, Comedy, and Venus Williams

• Matt teases the obscurity of River States Conference schools, only to be flooded by calls from proud alumni—featuring Indiana East grads and Rachel’s own dad from West Virginia Tech (39:05-43:35).
• A highlight: a caller named “Michael Jordan” lists Richmond, IN’s athletic legends, and another shockingly (and correctly) claims Venus Williams graduated from IU East’s online program (44:19-45:07).
• The hosts share genuine amusement and respect as they scramble to verify these facts, skillfully mixing humor with surprise.

Classic Banter

“Myron, tell him.”
“I gotta be honest, you keep saying ‘Myron, tell him,’ like we planned this. I don’t know anything about Serena Williams’ online classes!”
— Caller and Myron Metcalf (43:49-43:51)

“She did! She graduated... Venus Williams in 2011 enrolled in Indiana East’s online program. She graduated in 2015.”
— Myron Metcalf, fact-checking live (44:32)

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Notable Quotes & Moments with Timestamps

• On March Madness:
  “Some people say March Madness is the greatest sporting event… I stand by that.”
  — Matt Jones (01:42)

• On collegiate underdogs:
  “No sport gives the underdog a real shot like college basketball.”
  — Myron Metcalf (02:09)

• Matt’s guarantee tradition:
  “I have missed one time in 30 years.”
  — Matt Jones (06:31)

• On Hurley ejection:
  “Why eject him in that moment if he didn’t do it?... The referee responds like he made contact.”
  — Myron Metcalf (16:32)

• Dick Vitale criticism:
  “I think at $22 million, they could have put together a better roster.”
  — Dick Vitale via Tom Crean (18:56)

• Community pride:
  “Indiana East, it’s proud… We’re not gonna get the five star, not even the four star, but we play hard.”
  — Rick, Indiana East alum (41:46)

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Segment Timestamps

• Season preview & March excitement: 00:34 – 03:46
• Wazoo banter & Matt’s “guarantee” picks: 03:47 – 08:22
• Top teams, chaos potential & dark horse debate: 08:22 – 11:15
• Rapid fire news (coach ejection, Vitale rant, fan fight): 15:50 – 23:11
• Selection Sunday special & Tom Crean interview: 24:38 – 34:36
• River States Conference banter & call-in segment: 39:05 – 46:46

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Tone & Style Highlights

• The episode is anchored in playful but knowledgeable debate, with Matt’s self-deprecating humor and Myron’s bemused, slightly skeptical counterpoint.
• In-depth, accessible college basketball analysis aimed at both hardcore fans and casual listeners.
• Laid-back, community-focused as listeners and staff call in with real stories—blurring lines between expert commentary and crowd-sourced comedy.
• Frequent callbacks to cultural references, from “wazoo” to Napster lawsuits, add generational flavor.

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LISTENERS’ TAKEAWAY

If you missed the show: expect a one-stop shop for the March basketball state-of-the-union, bracketology, coach drama, and a reminder that every school, no matter how obscure, has a story. The expert analysis pairs seamlessly with spirited, inviting fan engagement and plenty of laughs—whether you’re mapping Big Ten contenders or discovering that, yes, Venus Williams once earned a diploma from Indiana East.

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Transcript

[LinkedIn Narrator]

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[Myron Metcalf]

This is Matt and Myron, the podcast

[Matt Jones]

he's known in some circles. You cannot deny that. Myron Metcalf and I'm Matt Jones. I hope you set your clocks forward because it is now daylight savings time and it's Matt Myron on ESPN Radio presented by Progressive Insurance. And at Progressive it is time to tell you more about Progressive. Drivers who switch to progressive could save big. See if you can save at 1-800-progressive or progressive.com Meyer Metcalf, you. You are like me. This is our favorite time of year. We're one week away from Selection Sunday and I spent all day yesterday watching college basketball, including my terrible team, and it was a great deal of fun. What about you?

[Myron Metcalf]

Terrible. That's a.

[Matt Jones]

That's a strong.

[Myron Metcalf]

That's a strong.

[Matt Jones]

I mean, we're not good. Kentucky is not good this year. I mean, terrible, maybe a little harsh, but we're not good. That game. Kentucky's played 80 minutes of basketball against Florida and has not led for one second.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah, I mean, it's going to be interesting to see kind of what happens this week leading up to Selection Sunday. I can't wait. This is the greatest three plus weeks in all the sports. And I'm just excited, man.

[Matt Jones]

You still believe that's true because some people say, oh, they get mad. People get mad at two things I say, one of which is that March Madness is the greatest sporting event and the other is that the Kentucky Derby is the fastest two minutes in sports. People get mad at both those. I think they think college basketball and the in the Kentucky Derbys from a different time. I still stand by. Those are two of the three or four most exciting events of the year.

[Myron Metcalf]

Incredible. I think it's undeniable. I also wonder how many people have actually been to NCAA tournament games to kind of feel the atmosphere, but even just to watch the action. There's no sport that gives the underdog a real shot the way that college basketball does. Undeniably one of the greatest sporting events

[Matt Jones]

in the world and. And maybe one of the greatest years in college basketball this year, wouldn't you say? I, I, I have heard a lot of people, first of all, record setting ratings pretty much all year. All year we have seen numbers that we haven't seen in 15 years. I think it's a combination of three things. One, probably the greatest freshman class ever in college basketball, Nil. Making it to where a lot of guys have returned of substance, names people might have heard of. And then the power programs. Unfortunately, with the exception of mine being at the top of the rankings, I think all of that has made for a really entertaining year.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah, I mean there are high quality programs across the country and I think this is one of those tournaments where, let's say you're looking for sort of an entry point. Why, why you should care? I mean, there are 15 freshmen in this class who are all going to be on NBA rosters next year. So I think a lot of people are going to be paying attention who might not otherwise because of the talent pool that's on its way to the next level. Man, I can't wait. I think we're going to have a lot of fun in the NCAA tournament and I'm just excited.

[Matt Jones]

And I think you're going to have a draft where the top you're going to get, somebody's going to get picked at like 12th, that a lot of years might go second.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yep.

[Matt Jones]

Yeah, literally. I mean, this is one of the reasons you're seeing tanking just out the wazoo, which by the way, that's a.

[Myron Metcalf]

What is a wazoo?

[Matt Jones]

I don't know.

[Myron Metcalf]

Why do people have never been to the wazoo? So I think where is it?

[Matt Jones]

That is like an old person saying out the wazoo.

[Myron Metcalf]

What is the wazoo?

[Matt Jones]

This is where James should be looking up what it means to be out the wazoo. But he.

[Myron Metcalf]

I don't think they let me in the wazoo.

[Matt Jones]

Well, they are out the wazoo and it's because next year's draft is going to stink. And you've just got such a good one this year. Now, every year I make a pronouncement.

[Myron Metcalf]

The wazoo is a person's. Oh, hold on a second.

[Matt Jones]

Hold on.

[Myron Metcalf]

Wait.

[Matt Jones]

What? Wait a minute. Say that again. A wazoo is what?

[Myron Metcalf]

This is the definition I just looked up. What is the wazoo? And it is a person's buttocks.

[Matt Jones]

Oh, it is?

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah.

[Rachel (Producer)]

Apparently the phrase started as up the wazoo.

[Matt Jones]

Oh, okay. Well, we don't need to go into that.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah, I didn't realize that was so.

[Matt Jones]

My grandmother was always Talking about buttocks?

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah, she was talking about the mutt. The older gener, they had some like code words for some stuff that like they weren't explicit about. And now you only learn that later on.

[Matt Jones]

Wow, I didn't realize Granny was like, was working blue back in the day

[Myron Metcalf]

talking about wazoo's non stop. You know, now we know.

[Matt Jones]

Well, Granny. Granny and her wazoo. Not something I thought was gonna.

[Myron Metcalf]

That was gonna changes how I view that that time.

[Ad Voice]

Me too.

[Matt Jones]

All right, so every year for the, for the NCAA tournament, I make a guarantee. I've been making this guarantee since about 1995. And the guarantee was you give me five teams. What are you laughing at? You've heard me do this for years. Why are you googling now?

[Myron Metcalf]

You were like 13 making this guarantee, Is that what you're saying?

[Matt Jones]

Yeah. Well, first of all, at 95 I was like 17 and I came up with this formula.

[Myron Metcalf]

Listen, I didn't have girlfriends when I

[Matt Jones]

was that old, okay? I had to make sports guarantees. I had acne braces and glasses. I had no girls. I was like, I'm going to make a guarantee that's gonna happen for the next 30 years just in the town square.

[Myron Metcalf]

You would just go to like the.

[Matt Jones]

I would go to the Kmart and the Goodies and I would stand in the parking lot and I would say, I hereby proclaim my guarantee. But no, I've been doing this a long time since 95, okay? And I always pick five teams and I guarantee you that the title will come from one of those five.

[Myron Metcalf]

Okay?

[Matt Jones]

That's always been my. And I have missed one time in 30 years. Do you know the one time I've missed?

[Myron Metcalf]

I'm guessing it's 2011 or 2014.

[Matt Jones]

2014 Yukon. That was the one I. That I haven't gotten. I did have Kentucky that year. They got the finals and lost. But that's the only time 2014 Yukon, that I haven't gotten it. So every year I make a big deal about this. Myron. I have four of my five teams. I'm holding out on the fifth until the selection Sunday. Okay, but four of the five teams where I guarantee you the national champion comes from this group. It's not hard. Duke, they won yesterday, dominated North Carolina. Arizona, who beat Colorado late last night. Michigan, who plays tonight today against Michigan State. And then the Florida Gators, who maybe earned the fourth one seed, demolishing Kentucky, now the fifth. I'm holding out. And it's going to be one of two teams. I mean they're going to put in UConn or I'm going to put in Houston. I want to have a little more time to marinate over it. But for me, this year, now you may say, oh, Matt, those are the four best teams. Yeah, that's true. It doesn't always end up like that, where I pick the best, the highest ranked teams. But this year I think the highest ranked teams are just a lot better than everybody else. And so I'm taking those four and then either UConn or Houston and Myron, I think that will almost. We will certainly have a champion from that group.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah, I think this is the year where like the top five teams have separated themselves. Duke, Arizona and Michigan. Duke, Arizona, Michigan and Florida might be separate from everybody else. I mean, UConn has lost it. Marquette, I think they're really good, but we'll see how they recover in the Big east tournament. But I think there's going to be a really chalky tournament. I think that's what we're headed for.

[Matt Jones]

See, I think it'll be chalky at the very top. Top. So I think you're good, those teams you mentioned. But I think under that complete chaos, I think the two seeds in the tournament are not that much better than like the nines and the tens. So that you could end up, you probably won't see a ton of first round upsets. But I think that second round that Saturday, Sunday, Myron, could have wild results.

[Myron Metcalf]

I hope so. Yeah. I do think the top four or five teams have separated themselves. And then, you know, your Iowa State's, your Houston's, teams like that certainly have strengths. Purdue, but then they also have big time flaws that have cost them games in recent weeks. So I could see that happening for

[Matt Jones]

sure if, if I, if my five and let's assume it's that group and then you, Connor, Houston, if they don't win, give me a team off my list. That could spoil my list. Who's the team that's outside of it that you would say, Matt, this is the one you should be worried about.

[Myron Metcalf]

I mean, if Iowa State figures it out, like Iowa State has been an elite team.

[Matt Jones]

I've been, I've been hearing.

[Myron Metcalf]

Okay, hold on a second, though. Hold on a second, hold on a second. You said, give me a team. Yeah, I gave you a team. And before I could explain why I gave you the team, you said, forget about them.

[Matt Jones]

Yeah, I, I'm, I'm willing to say that no one's been to Iowa.

[Myron Metcalf]

Give yourself a team.

[Matt Jones]

That's what no one knows where it is. Ames, Iowa is beautiful place.

[Myron Metcalf]

Hickory barbecue is incredible. If you like the.

[Matt Jones]

You always mention a barbecue.

[Myron Metcalf]

If you like the wind farms, you go. If you like the wind farms. It's a beautiful sight to, to see

[Matt Jones]

who go, who, who goes to wind farms.

[Myron Metcalf]

I have been, I've been, I've been to wind farms.

[Matt Jones]

You just go and look at the

[Myron Metcalf]

visited wind farms before. I'm fascinated. When you get there, I've gone a tour of them and they show you like just the architecture and they talk about just the technology. I've done a wind farm tour.

[Matt Jones]

That sounds like the most boring thing.

[Myron Metcalf]

It was fun.

[Matt Jones]

They do have, I will say about Iowa State games, they do sell walking tacos and. And they are the best walking tacos you can get with the Fritos and all that. But with that said, they're not winning the title. But if that's going to be your pick, I'm going to give you mine.

[Myron Metcalf]

Outside. Outside team.

[Matt Jones]

Outside of the top five. I don't want to say this, but Arkansas is the kind of team I could see getting hot and going on a run with how good Darius Acuff is. And if Trayvon Brazil's playing correct. They don't necessarily. They're not consistent. Their cow. They can lose to anybody. But that would be a team that would worry me because I think at their peak they can put up 110 points which can be difficult to beat.

[Myron Metcalf]

That's the worst case scenario for Kentucky fans, right? Cal playing really well. His team playing, I want to talk about.

[Matt Jones]

But I'll quit, by the way. I'll quit this show if Arkansas wins the title.

[Myron Metcalf]

Well, you probably shouldn't do that, but if that's what you need to do

[Matt Jones]

with your life, well, I will because I will be. I'll be so mad I'll be out the wazoo. That's what will happen if Arkansas. But I'm also honest that they have the talent that they could do it. 888, say ESPN. We're going to talk some more. College basketball, including one of its most prominent coaches, gets tossed. A guy actually pulls it, gets a chair and seems to want to participate in a fight. And Dick Vital rips a team. You never hear that. That's next here on Matt Myron,

[Myron Metcalf]

Matt and Myron the podcast.

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[Matt Jones]

It is Matt Myon here on ESPN Radio. Did you all not pay for the rights to this song and you're using like a tape recorder version?

[Rachel (Producer)]

It sounded fine in my headphones When

[Matt Jones]

I tested this, this is not the official version.

[Myron Metcalf]

I think. I think Rachel needs to listen to the music before she plays it on there.

[Matt Jones]

Rachel, this is not the official time.

[Rachel (Producer)]

I listened to the music before I played it.

[Myron Metcalf]

You got on a cassette tape.

[Matt Jones]

I think what this is for my. For my generation. When you. When you got on Napster and after Metallica started suing people.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah.

[Matt Jones]

You started hearing versions of this on the song where it's no accompaniment, no background.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah.

[Matt Jones]

That is what you have. The post Metallica lawsuit, Napster version of that.

[Rachel (Producer)]

That's what we have in the system.

[Myron Metcalf]

So pre lawsuit was very lucrative for me, by the way. That was a very lucrative time.

[Matt Jones]

Why were you burning CDs?

[Myron Metcalf]

I was selling them on campus. Yeah, I was. I was. I was the CD guy.

[Matt Jones]

Every campus had a dork that knew how to work Napster and for like a year made funny selling CDs.

[Myron Metcalf]

Bunch of college kids in Minnesota had the blueprint by Jay Z because of me. So. You're welcome.

[Matt Jones]

You are welcome. All right. I want to give some quick hitter college basketball topics for our folks out there that don't follow it as intensely as I do. Let's go. Or as we do. Let's go quick. Danny Hurley yesterday. UConn loses to Marquette. He is ejected from the game with 0.4 seconds to go. The coach approached John Gaffney. The official got his chest into the shoulder, voicing his displeasure. Hurley said he never bumped into Gaffney. The cameras suggest that he did. He was ejected and. And now he has been fine, but not suspended. It certainly looked like to me he chest bumped that referee. What do you think?

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah. And why eject him in that moment if he didn't do it? Like, it seemed like that's exactly what triggered the technical and the ejection. And then to say the. They couldn't confirm. Feels like to me, the Biggies couldn't confirm it going into the Biggies tournament. Right. You don't want that to be a storyline going into the Big east tournament, going into selection Sunday with your most prominent coach. But I bet if it's December, I think they would have seen the video in a different light.

[Matt Jones]

You say you think they're not going to do it because it's the postseason.

[Myron Metcalf]

I think that.

[Matt Jones]

So the final game of the regular season, you get one referee bump free.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah. All of a sudden, no one on the video, it looks like he makes contact and the referee responds like he made contact.

[Matt Jones]

Yeah. The referee goes back to the left.

[Myron Metcalf]

Exactly. Exactly.

[Matt Jones]

Just like Keith Hernandez back into the left. ESPN Radio's Bob Valvano said that Hurley is out of control. Do you agree with that?

[Myron Metcalf]

I think in that moment, he was,

[Matt Jones]

you know, in general, he's out of control.

[Myron Metcalf]

I think he's shown the world that he's out of control in a lot of moments. And if you like him, you call it passion. And I think a lot of fans are starting to see it. They've seen it a long time and been like, man, that's just too much. It's over the top. And I think yesterday was that.

[Matt Jones]

What do you think? What would it be like to be married to him?

[Myron Metcalf]

I don't know any of that stuff. What I do know is, well, I

[Matt Jones]

didn't ask if you knew. I didn't assume you were married.

[Myron Metcalf]

What I will say is, do you

[Matt Jones]

think it would be very difficult with that temper?

[Myron Metcalf]

What I do think is the Lakers job that was never going to work.

[Matt Jones]

That would have been awful for him.

[Myron Metcalf]

That would have lasted a month.

[Matt Jones]

Now I got to see again, an old friend, Dick Vital. He was in Lexington for Kentucky, Florida. It was nice to see him. He's such a basketball guy. I went and I said, hey, Dig, it's Matt. And he goes, matt Jones. Tell me if this team is any good. Like, nothing about my personal. Like, he just was, like, immediately into basketball. And then during the game, he did something kind of rare for Dick. He ripped the team. Here's what he said about Kentucky.

[Tom Crean]

I'm going to say this right here. Win or lose of the several now Kentucky games, win or lose, $22 million. This team reports are in terms of the nil for their players. I think at 22 million, they could have put together a better roster than they did. I really do.

[Matt Jones]

What about that? Strong words from the king of college basketball.

[Myron Metcalf]

That's harsh. Like, Dicky V rarely does that. So it means something. It just felt like another blow to Mark Pope and Kentucky, and it has been nothing short of a disaster with that payroll.

[Matt Jones]

He is. He does rarely do it, but is it one of those things as you get older, you're like, yeah, I don't care. I'm just gonna say. What I'm gonna say is that potentially

[Myron Metcalf]

what's happening, I think anybody. If you put a microphone in anybody after 58, who knows? But. But I think it's also rare for Dicky V to be that critical.

[Matt Jones]

No, he's Mr. Positive all the time. I think that's partially what makes it hit harder, is if Dick Vital is saying, you wasted money on Your roster. That's pretty harsh.

[Myron Metcalf]

Is Pope going in the next season on the hot seat?

[Matt Jones]

Potentially, yes. You can't. You can't. Kentucky has, in Pope's two years, finished eighth in the conference and ninth in the conference.

[Myron Metcalf]

Not good.

[Matt Jones]

He only. Billy Gillespie was the coach of Kentucky for two years and got fired. Mark Pope's record is only two games better than Billy Gillespie's was.

[Myron Metcalf]

It's not great. It's not great.

[Matt Jones]

Now. Billy Gillespie had other things going on. He did when he was here.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah, he did.

[Matt Jones]

How come you've never written that story? Billy Gillespie, the untold history.

[Myron Metcalf]

Got a lot of untold histories I've never written.

[Matt Jones]

Oh, who are some of the. Who are some of the other ones?

[Myron Metcalf]

That's a lot. There's a lot that's happened in our sport. But I thought Mark Pope would have more success to this point. And it just. It feels like he's not able to keep it all together. Like, his press conferences are some of the worst press conferences I've ever seen for someone in his situation. It's like he doesn't know how to respond to the drama in this moment.

[Matt Jones]

Well, I hope Dick Vital just spends the rest of the tournament saying what he really starts talking about Wazoo. And like, really gets. Really gets going. Now, you probably didn't watch out there. UTEP and Jacksonville State, you might be shocked that those teams are in the same conference, but they are. And when the game was over, they had a handshake line. And if you watch the video, it's a pretty amazing video. Jacksonville State players had to be held back because a man in the crowd was yelling at the players and then all of a sudden picked up a chair like he was going to go WWE and smash it over their head. Yeah, the players yelled back. The situation got diffused. But this is a front row UTEP booster, which I don't know how many of those exist. Yeah, he grabs the chair. What was your thought when you saw that video?

[Myron Metcalf]

What does it take to get arrested? You know, I mean, I gotta. I feel like if you did that on the street, if you were just like walking down the street and you start going back and forth to somebody and you grabbed a chair and a police officer was standing right there. I feel like that would lead to something. And instead it was just like, oh, put down the chair, Larry. It bothers me that fans have gotten to this point where they're willing to take these steps, they're willing to go to these extremes, if you will, in some of these contentious Moments and no one's doing anything about it. Like, that guy should have been arrested.

[Matt Jones]

You do have to wonder how Mr. Quarter zip there got so worked up that he. He needed to pick up the chair. I'm more fascinated. And his wife is standing next to him.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah.

[Matt Jones]

You want to talk about Rachel? Can you imagine how mortified you'd be if your husband. If you go to a UTEP Jacksonville State basketball game and your husband grabs a chair and it's doing like. What would you do in that moment, Rachel, if that. If your husband did that?

[Rachel (Producer)]

Oh, my face would be covered. My hand would. I would be like, you know the mom. Car seat. Yeah. My hand straight on his chest. Like, no, no, no, no. We're putting this down.

[Myron Metcalf]

Did he think he was gonna beat all those dudes up with one chair? They were gonna turn that chair on him pretty quickly. It was about to get ugly.

[Matt Jones]

I mean, you. Listen, man. Go back to your car dealership in El Paso and chill out. No need to get so worked up. Mr. Tom Cream would've never done that. But he will. Join us on Matt and Myron next year on espn.

[Myron Metcalf]

Matt and Myro,

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[Matt Jones]

So Matt Myron here, ESPN Radio. One week until the brackets come out. And we're going to be in that. We're going to be announcing them right here on ESPN Radio Special NCAA tournament selection special I will be hosting with Myron Metcalf and this young man, Tom Crean, former college basketball coach and ESPN college basketball analyst. Tom, we're very excited to have you join us this year. Are you ready to announce some brackets and break them down?

[Tom Crean]

Oh, yeah. I'm especially excited because you just called me young man last night. Some somebody said I looked old on Twitter and that I responded and my wife really responded to it. So, like, it's, it's cool to be able to hear that I'm young even though I'm really not. But that's cool.

[Matt Jones]

Vigorous. We will. We will. We're going to have a lot of fun. Six to nine on ESPN Radio next week when I announce the brackets, I'll know I like when, as I say, I'm watching Tom's face to see his reactions. Let me ask you this. Let's start with this. What if I announce that the 11 seed or 12 seed is not Miami of Ohio and they are not in, if they lose in the conference tournament? You would think that's fair or unfair?

[Tom Crean]

I think it'd be unfair. I mean, I think it'd be ridiculously unfair with what they've done right now and that is even with a loss, which definitely could happen next week, they have earned their way in.

[Matt Jones]

But they are, but they would be, Tom, the lowest ranked at large team in the history of the tournament.

[Tom Crean]

It does. You know what, they're undefeated. And at some point in time, the metrics, the business, the power conference mindset, every way that this is shifting, you still have to respect that. You still, there are still so many fans that are out there that are a part of this whole deal. And you don't have to be a Miami Ohio fan to be a fan of what they've done. And I just think the way they've won close games, the way they've responded, you know, we could, we could go back and say, okay, could they have scheduled this team? Could they have been in an mte? Did they pass this up? You know, we know a bunch of teams didn't want to play them. Okay, all that stuff is over and done with now. I mean, they are 31 and 0 and do I think they deserve a high seed? No, not really. I mean, but, but I do think that they are a team that has earned their way into being one of those teams that are playing in this tournament. Without a doubt.

[Myron Metcalf]

Tom, I want to hit the scheduling thing because Travis Steele has said they called all these big time schools, these power four schools and they all said no. I mean you've been in the middle of scheduling. Like how real is that when a talented mid major wants to play a high major school like that?

[Tom Crean]

Oh, that's, that's extremely real. But at the same time there's MTE's and things like that that are out there for teams to get into as well.

[Matt Jones]

People who don't know MT is like a multi team tournament, like a holiday

[Myron Metcalf]

tournament that you see.

[Tom Crean]

Yeah, yeah. Like a three games in three day type thing. So we don't know that. Right. Like we don't know if those things were presented. But absolutely. I totally get that on scheduling. There's no way that when you're scheduling a non conference team like that, you know, obviously you can put it on the numbers you can play. We got to hit this, we got to hit that. But you don't want to schedule somebody that you are, that you are remotely fearful that could come into your building and beat you. But I do also think there's ways in that league like Todd Kowalczyk, my former coach or my work with me at Marquette, who's been the head coach at Toledo for a long time, he's figured it out in a lot of ways, like he will, he will schedule other mid major games with teams and he'll go on the road first. So I do think there's a way to do this, you know, because people will get, if they can get a game. Obviously guaranteed games is a little bit different, but you may not get those guarantee games with that with the power conference teams. But scheduling good mid major games, you can do it. I'm not sure if they tried that or not. I know Todd Kowalczyk has done a great job of that over years, you know, bringing. He'll go on the road first and that team comes back and now he's in a new contract with somebody else where it all kind of balances out. So there's ways to do it. But I totally understand what they're saying and what others are saying. And that's not going to change. That's only going to increase because of the level of where people are looking at the net and those type of things. And at the same time they don't want to get beat at home.

[Matt Jones]

I just want to know and I'm for them. I think they should get in. But there's a little bit on the scheduling. I do want to. There's a little boy who cried wolf because I'M gonna read you a couple teams. They played Trinity Christian, who is Division 3. Okay. And that was a regular one of their 31 wins. They won by 80. Just for the record 80. Then Indiana University East. Now, I know, Tom, you coached Indiana. Did you know there was an Indiana University East?

[Tom Crean]

I didn't know there was a Southeast. Yeah, I don't. Where is Indiana east at? I'm not.

[Matt Jones]

That's a great question. If I live in a state that borders Indiana and you coached in Indiana and neither one of us know where it is, I think that's a bad 13.

[Tom Crean]

Indiana school.

[Myron Metcalf]

There's a lot of Indiana.

[Matt Jones]

Well, I'm gonna give them the benefit of doubt. I want you to. James, find out what conference Indiana University is. East, dinner. And then finally Milligan, which is one of those schools that when you're like a freshman in college, it's the first school that sends you stuff in the mail is Milligan.

[Myron Metcalf]

Whoa, whoa, listen. These are all great programs. If you're listening. We have nothing against any of these schools. High quality programs. Kudos to you if you are.

[Matt Jones]

I'm just saying those are three of the 31 wins. Now they have one.

[Tom Crean]

You're making legitimate points. But at the end of the day, I grew up in the Mac, so maybe I'm just being. I grew up in Mount Pleasant in Central Michigan. That's where I went to school. I saw so many great games growing up. That's why I fell in love with basketball. So I'm going to always be partial to that. And seeing that they went undefeated in that league.

[Matt Jones]

I know they did, they did, they did.

[Tom Crean]

Chances to lose those games. And I think. I just think you put them in there. You know, on the flip side, though, like, here, I'll go with this. Like, if South Florida doesn't win their. Their. The conference tournament, I would be in an uproar myself, personally, if they're not in, because I think. I don't only think they deserve to be in. I think they could get to the second weekend because if somebody. And they went, oh, man, that's.

[Matt Jones]

Let me see. But, Coach, let's see. James has got.

[Tom Crean]

Where it is.

[Matt Jones]

Where is it? Indiana East. He doesn't have words.

[Myron Metcalf]

I know they are. Red Wolf Nation. Shout out. Red Wolf Nation. NAIA school.

[Matt Jones]

Yeah. So, I mean, they're counting. One of their 31 wins is in AI. I'm just saying. One was D3, one was in AI. Now, it's still a great story, but. But Indiana University East, I live. I live on the border of East Indiana, and I don't know where it is. So I think that is not a

[Myron Metcalf]

part of Red Wolf Nation. That's on you.

[Matt Jones]

That is an issue. All right. Danny Hurley, coach. You saw what happened yesterday. I mean, I know coaches take up for coaches, but that dude, he's always pushing the line. Do you think there's a time they got to step in even though this is the postseason?

[Tom Crean]

Well, I'm going to say this on the business side of it. The Big east made a unbelievably strategic and smart move getting out in front of that with that fine last night.

[Matt Jones]

That's true.

[Tom Crean]

And. And negated the story. I mean, kudos to them. Seriously. Like, as soon as I saw that, I said, man, is that good business? Because at the end of the day, you handled it. And I would just say this, when you look at that, okay, first off, John Gaffney, who's the one official in question on being close to bumping whatever, and Pat Driscoll. He's had those guys countless times. Had them at Rhode island, might have had them at Wagner, but he definitely had him at Rhode Island. Has them all the time at UConn. So there's relationships there where they will accept. They've grown to accept certain things, but it doesn't matter who you are. They're not going to let you cross that line. There's no question. I mean, you can't. You can't embarrass people like that and think that there's not going to be any repercussions, no matter how well you know those guys. And. And. And all of that is cool, right? Regular season, even conference tournament to a degree. But once we hit the NCAA tournament, everything changes for those officials because of what they're being judged on with the quorum, what they're being judged. And the same thing goes for the players, right? The players and the coaches, what they're judged on and what they can say. The coaches box, the decorum, what they can get away with. Everything is going to be the letter of the law because of what they're being judged on. And the last thing they're going to let you do is try to post them up in some type of demonstrative way in a game. And Danny's a great coach, you know, wears his emotions on his sleeve. You know, all that. We're not going to dissect it. But like that, to me, you can't even come near that. You know, when you're in the NCAA tournament, if you want to advance and be inside of that for the game. So I think again with everything being said, what the Big east did is gave them a chance to not have that be the story going into their conference tournament. Gives UConn and St. John certainly tremendous opportunity to have it if they end up meeting again. For it to be must see TV again. There's so much on the line and that's kind of how I see it. But it will not fly in a week. There's no doubt about that.

[Matt Jones]

All right, so real quick, before we let you go, Tom, may I read you, Myron, the other teams in Indiana University East Conference, Shawnee State, Rio Grande, Midway, which is right down the street from me and I thought was an all girls school. West Virginia Tech, Kentucky Christian, St. Mary of the Woods, Indiana Kokomo, Indiana Southeast, Brescia and Indiana Columbus. Now in that group of powerhouse teams, Indiana University east came in 11th of the 12. So I'm not saying you don't know

[Myron Metcalf]

what they had going on. You don't know if there were things happening with the team. Guys wanted more nil money. You have no idea what was happening with Indiana University east, man. Don't make that judgement.

[Matt Jones]

But at least schedule Shawnee, at least schedule Shawnee State and Milligan, by the way, is in the Appalachian Athletic Conference. I live in Appalachia and I don't know where that conference is.

[Myron Metcalf]

Coach, you just can't call up Shawnee State and get a game on your schedule if the check ain't right. You know that.

[Tom Crean]

Play some D1 Indiana Southeast display. D1? Yeah, see, I did not, I, I, I must be just ignorant because I did not know about Indiana east, but I definitely knew about Indiana Southeast. I thought when you said it, they might have changed their name.

[Matt Jones]

Well, they finished Indiana six games behind St. Mary of the woods. And if Miami of Ohio wants to get in the tournament, they better start scheduling St. Mary of the Woods.

[Myron Metcalf]

I don't know what happened in their locker room.

[Matt Jones]

Tom, thank you very much for your time. I appreciate it. St. Mary of the woods just you

[Myron Metcalf]

just crushing teams that have.

[Matt Jones]

No, no, I just saying these are not real schools.

[Myron Metcalf]

They are real schools and they're not real schools.

[Matt Jones]

All right, here's what real quick, if these are real schools, I have a challenge out there. 888, say ESPN to our nation. If you went to one of these 12 schools, you call in, I want you to have been, I want you to have gone to one of these 12 schools. I want to prove they actually exist. Shawnee State, Rio Grande, Midway, West Virginia, Tech Kentucky Christian, Indiana east Indiana, Kokomo Indiana like the Beach Boys, Indiana southeast St. Mary, the woods, Brescia, Oakland City and Indiana Columbus. I'm going to bet you Myron not one person has been to any of those schools.

[Myron Metcalf]

They're going to flood the lines.

[Matt Jones]

888 ESPN ESPN 888 say ESPN we will see how many members of the River States Conference are out there. Plus joint bachelor and bachelorette parties. They're in the news because they ruined a marriage. We'll deal with that next.

[Myron Metcalf]

Matt and Myron the Podcast.

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[Matt Jones]

The Fun Break I'm not going to lie to you. Members of the River States Conference, one of the teams Miami of Ohio played they're calling in, but they're making our producer mad. Because they're calling in and they're just hanging up. Because they're not. Because the problem is they know that they can't prove that they went to these schools.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah,

[Matt Jones]

we learned during the break. I read you the members of the River State Conference. Two of these teams, Miami of Ohio played as they're trying to say they should go to the tournament. And one of our producers, Rachel, goes during the break. I think my dad might have gone to West Virginia Tech.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah.

[Matt Jones]

And it turns out not only does it exist, her dad graduated from West Virginia Tech. And you didn't even know, right?

[Rachel (Producer)]

No, no, I knew it. I thought it was bought by another college so it therefore didn't exist anymore.

[Matt Jones]

You thought it.

[Rachel (Producer)]

Not, not. Yeah, not that he didn't graduate from there. I, I thought like WVU was like fast food chain. WVU was like, I'm going to take the school now and it's not going to exist anymore.

[Matt Jones]

All right, so they're the alumni of these schools are calling it. Yeah, these are schools that are allegedly in something called the River States Conference that Miami of Ohio played two teams in and they're going to try to take up for their conference.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah.

[Matt Jones]

We have someone from Indiana east who lost by 80 to Miami of Ohio this year. Let's go to Rick in Minnesota. Are you an Indiana east graduate?

[Tom Crean]

I am. And you guys shouldn't be dissing that. So you know what? They know they had, they had the gumption to go out there and play somebody that might be out of their league. But how do you.

[Matt Jones]

I'm not blaming Indiana east, but I'm saying why is Miami of Ohio picking on poor Indiana East?

[Myron Metcalf]

And that's Matt Jones who's being critical. I'm all for Indiana east and all these schools.

[Tom Crean]

You know what? And I can't believe you don't know where it's at. It's like you're on 70.

[Myron Metcalf]

Wait, what's, wait, hold on. What is, what do you mean on 70?

[Tom Crean]

What is that, Interstate 70?

[Myron Metcalf]

Okay, so it is a national show though. Like nobody knows.

[Tom Crean]

Yeah.

[Matt Jones]

What town is it in?

[Myron Metcalf]

You can't just say on 70.

[Matt Jones]

Like we all live there. It's on Richmond, Indiana. Okay, but I've no, I don't have any idea where. Richmond, Indiana. And I'm on I 70 and I don't know where it is.

[Myron Metcalf]

He's so frustrated with us.

[Matt Jones]

All right, before I. Give me one more. What. What should I know about Indiana East?

[Tom Crean]

Indiana east, it's, it's proud. I mean, it's proud. It's a small college. We're not going to go out there and get the, you know, the five star, not even the four star, but we play hard we try hard, but you're on 70.

[Myron Metcalf]

I respect him.

[Matt Jones]

I appreciate the call. He's on 70.

[Myron Metcalf]

Country people think that everybody lives off the same highway.

[Matt Jones]

Like that's.

[Myron Metcalf]

He said on 70. Like we're not being broadcast around the world.

[Matt Jones]

That's just right up there.

[Myron Metcalf]

Right on 70, man. You know?

[Matt Jones]

All right, Michael Jordan is on.

[Myron Metcalf]

Oh, boy.

[Matt Jones]

Wait a minute. Indiana east has their own Michael Jordan, Apparently.

[Myron Metcalf]

Let's hear him out.

[Matt Jones]

Michael?

[Tom Crean]

Yeah, I'm here. Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

[Matt Jones]

And your name's Michael Jordan?

[Tom Crean]

Yes, it is. I've been here 60. Well, 70 years now in Richmond, Indiana.

[Myron Metcalf]

Okay.

[Tom Crean]

Dick Bumgarner, coach, Richmond High School Red Devils. Desmond Bain, come from Seton Catholic School. Lamar Landy came from Richmond, Indiana. Dale.

[Matt Jones]

But I don't know. I mean, respectfully, I don't know who any of these people are that you just named.

[Myron Metcalf]

Let them cook. Go ahead.

[Tom Crean]

Oh, yeah, you do.

[Myron Metcalf]

I don't.

[Matt Jones]

I don't know Lamar Jordan, but I'm

[Tom Crean]

not the real one.

[Matt Jones]

Who's Lamar Lundy?

[Myron Metcalf]

Some stars, man.

[Tom Crean]

Fearsome forcing, man. How old are you?

[Myron Metcalf]

Yeah,

[Matt Jones]

I mean, I'm 47, but I don't know Lamar, I guess.

[Myron Metcalf]

Right.

[Matt Jones]

Okay. But none of these guys you mentioned went to Indiana East.

[Tom Crean]

No, they didn't, but Sierra Williams did an online class there.

[Matt Jones]

Who did? Who did?

[Myron Metcalf]

Sarah Williams. Yes.

[Tom Crean]

Is that her first name? I have. I can't remember.

[Myron Metcalf]

You from UConn. Oh, wait. Serena.

[Matt Jones]

Serena Williams.

[Tom Crean]

Sarah.

[Myron Metcalf]

He said Sarah Williams.

[Matt Jones]

Hang on just a second. Let's just back up.

[Myron Metcalf]

We got to verify.

[Matt Jones]

You're telling me Syretta Williams did an online class. Verify that at Indiana East?

[Tom Crean]

Myron, tell him.

[Myron Metcalf]

I mean, I gotta be honest. You keep saying, myron, tell him. Like, we planned this. I don't know anything about Serena Williams online classes. I don't. Hold on, man. Wait. He said Serena Williams, and he said Myron would know, like. Hold on, man.

[Matt Jones]

I don't.

[Myron Metcalf]

I don't know. I don't know what Serena Williams is doing online, but I gotta. We gotta verify it, though. We gotta verify between. On 70.

[Matt Jones]

Just a second. How do you know Serena Williams took an online class in Indiana East?

[Tom Crean]

70. IU East.

[Myron Metcalf]

All right? She did. She graduated. He's right. No, it's not.

[Matt Jones]

He's right.

[Myron Metcalf]

He's right. It's not Serena. It's not Serena. Venus Williams. Venus Williams in 2015. In 2011, enrolled in Indiana east online degree completion program. She graduated in 2015.

[Matt Jones]

Why would she do that?

[Ad Voice]

Why.

[Matt Jones]

Why would she go to Indiana East?

[Myron Metcalf]

Myron, tell him. I don't know,

[Matt Jones]

sir. I have to tell you the chance, the percentage chance. I thought you were right.

[Myron Metcalf]

Yes, he was right.

[Matt Jones]

Any Williams sister enrolled at Indiana east was zero. He's right back that you are correct. I'm gonna give you a salute to Indiana East.

[Myron Metcalf]

He's right.

[Matt Jones]

Wow. All right, hang on. We have. We'll go. I want to go. Your dad is on now.

[Myron Metcalf]

Now that you know.

[Rachel (Producer)]

Yeah, my dad called in since I made fun of his school. So can we.

[Ad Voice]

Can we play?

[Matt Jones]

Well, actually, let's put your dad on if he is Rachel's dad on.

[Tom Crean]

Yeah. You hear me?

[Myron Metcalf]

We got you.

[Matt Jones]

Yes. You went to West Virginia Tech.

[Tom Crean]

Yeah. West Virginia Institute Technology. It's now the West Virginia Institute Technology at wvu. But they had a pretty good basketball team back in the day. They had a fellow when I was there called Sadel 3.

[Myron Metcalf]

Oh, wow. Yes.

[Tom Crean]

In the NBA.

[Ad Voice]

Other.

[Matt Jones]

How do you feel that your daughter didn't know?

[Myron Metcalf]

She didn't know to school.

[Tom Crean]

Well, she went to Wingate. I mean, what do you expect?

[Matt Jones]

That's true.

[Rachel (Producer)]

Thanks, dad.

[Tom Crean]

But guys, to your point on these things, you know, I don't. You know back to the original point that Green made you win 30 games. I don't care who you are, you're still, you know, you've earned a right to play.

[Matt Jones]

Yeah, but they play. They played your all the ball. And I just feel like that Rachel

[Myron Metcalf]

had to cut her down off there.

[Matt Jones]

Well, that I did not expect this. Wonderful. I'm sorry to the people that went to St. Mary of the Woods. I wanted to get to you as well, but we weren't able to.

[Myron Metcalf]

Thanks for listening to Matt and Myron the podcast. You can listen to the show live every Sunday morning at 10am Eastern on ESPN radio, the ESPN app, and on Sirius XM channel 80. Matt and Myron, the podcast from 30 for 30 podcasts.

[Matt Jones]

Brian Pata, senior defensive lineman from Miami, gunned down the key to this case.

[Tom Crean]

It's Brian.

[Myron Metcalf]

An hour before he died, he was on the phone arguing with somebody. This might be a hit. You want the truth? They just want a conviction.

[Matt Jones]

Being placed under arrest. We had a killer amongst us.

[Myron Metcalf]

Murder at the U. Listen now.