Hour 2: Carolyn Peck and Josh Pastner

Summary

Sunday Mornings with Matt and Myron: Hour 2 – Carolyn Peck and Josh Pastner
Release Date: March 16, 2025

On this episode of Sunday Mornings with Matt and Myron, hosts Matt Jones and Myron Medcalf delve deep into the upcoming NCAA basketball tournaments, featuring insightful discussions with esteemed analysts Carolyn Peck and Coach Josh Pastner. The episode offers a comprehensive breakdown of both women's and men's brackets, conference dynamics, and the potential impact of key player injuries on tournament seeding.

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1. Women's Bracketology with Carolyn Peck

Timestamp: 00:31 – 06:42

The episode kicks off with an in-depth conversation with Carolyn Peck, ESPN's women's college basketball analyst. Peck provides her expert analysis on the projected top four seeds in the women's tournament: USC, UCLA, South Carolina, and Texas.

• UCLA's Dominance: Peck emphasizes UCLA as the "most dangerous" seed, drawing parallels to their previous national championship team.

  "I would have to say that UCLA is the most dangerous. And this is why they are built very similar to last year's national championship team." ([01:24])

• Potential Matchups: She discusses possible high-stakes matchups, particularly contemplating the impact of a UConn vs. UCLA face-off. Peck highlights UConn's defensive prowess and the importance of their big players' consistency.

  "If Connecticut had to face UCLA, they have enough firepower from the perimeter to be able to score baskets." ([02:17])

• Contenders Beyond the Top Four: Peck doesn't discount UConn's potential as a title contender, praising Paige Beckers' determination and the team's evolving synergy. Additionally, she lauds South Carolina's trio of Chloe Kitts, Saniyah Fagan, and Joyce Edwards for their standout performances.

  "South Carolina could be in the mix when it comes down to that final day." ([03:14])

• NC State's Tournament Prospects: Addressing NC State's strengths, Peck underscores the necessity for roles like Isaiah James and Sinai Rivers to perform exceptionally to secure a Final Four spot.

  "When you face NC State, listen, you better lock down your money because he's gonna have some thieves in the night." ([05:03])

• Juju Watkins' Impact: Highlighting star player Juju Watkins, Peck compares her to legends Cheryl Miller and Caitlin Clark, underscoring her record-breaking scoring ability and potential as a tournament game-changer.

  "She is on a tear and I think she could be one of the toughest guards in this NCAA Tournament." ([05:45])

2. Men's Bracketology and Conference Tournament Finals

Timestamp: 06:42 – 12:08

Transitioning to the men's side, Matt and Myron discuss the implications of recent conference tournament outcomes on NCAA seeding, focusing primarily on the SEC and Big Ten tournaments.

• SEC Tournament Final – Tennessee vs. Florida: The hosts analyze Florida's strong performance throughout the season, citing their consistent scoring and defensive capabilities. Despite a surprising loss to Tennessee, Florida remains a formidable contender.

  "Florida is making a very, very strong case, especially if they win this thing." ([08:26])

• Big Ten Tournament Final – Wisconsin vs. Michigan: Attention shifts to Wisconsin's triumph over Michigan State and Michigan's narrow victory against Maryland, setting the stage for potential high-seed placements in the NCAA tournament.

  "[Big Ten] Wisconsin and Michigan are poised to secure high seeds in the tournament." ([09:01])

• Number One Seed Contemplations: The discussion delves into the uncertainty surrounding the top seed, particularly the debate over Auburn's standing versus Duke's potential. Mark Zino argues against Auburn's automatic top seed based solely on their season record.

  "They're likely to be the number one overall seed, but based on what happened to them yesterday... we don't even have to consider anybody else right now." ([07:00] paraphrased)

3. Duke's Cooper Flagg Injury and Seeding Implications

Timestamp: 12:08 – 19:05

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to Duke's Cooper Flagg ankle injury and its potential repercussions on the team's NCAA seeding.

• Injury Details and Availability: Mark Zino raises concerns about Flagg's injury, questioning whether it will affect Duke's seeding if he remains unavailable for key tournament games.

  "It's gonna severely impact their ability to forget winning the whole championship. I'm talking about just getting to like San Antonio to get in the final four." ([12:49])

• Committee's Consideration: The hosts discuss how the NCAA selection committee might factor in Flagg's availability, potentially downgrading Duke's seed if his participation is uncertain.

  "They'll have to present Duke Friday Sunday. Yeah, that may look like... they're doing you a favor by giving you an extra day to get Cooper Flag." ([16:51])

• Speculative Scenarios: Jonathan Zaslow entertains the possibility of Flagg opting out of the NBA draft to return to Duke, highlighting the unprecedented nature of such a decision.

  "It's unprecedented. I can't think of another time that's ever happened in the NBA." ([17:44])

4. Discussion on Conference Strength and Tournament Selection

Timestamp: 21:07 – 36:17

The conversation shifts to the broader landscape of college basketball conferences, particularly critiquing the SEC's dominance and its impact on NCAA tournament selections.

• SEC's Overrepresentation: Mark Zino voices frustration over the SEC securing numerous tournament bids, arguing that not all 14 teams from the conference are deserving of inclusion.

  "This seems like a formula over the course of time though that's bad for the sport when a third of the tournament comes from these two conferences." ([27:51])

• Non-Conference Strength of Schedule: Chris Canty defends the SEC by highlighting their robust non-conference schedules, which bolster their teams' tournament credentials through strong performances against top-tier opponents.

  "All those metrics... it's what you do in the non-conference... that's why they're going to get the majority of the field in." ([34:36])

• Final Four Predictions: Canty expresses confidence that the SEC will have at least two teams in the Final Four, citing Florida and Auburn's season performances as evidence of their championship potential.

  "I really believe that to kind of match up to show that as strong as our conference has been this year." ([30:13])

5. Interview with Coach Josh Pastner

Timestamp: 24:24 – 36:40

In a compelling segment, Coach Josh Pastner joins the hosts to share his insights on preparing for the NCAA tournament and the challenges teams face during bracket selections.

• Pre-Tournament Preparation: Pastner outlines the intense schedule coaches endure once their teams are selected, including scouting opponents, media obligations, and developing game plans under tight timelines.

  "As the head coach, you then got to divide up... preparing for your first game." ([25:14])

• Impact of Tournament Structure: He discusses the demands of playing multiple high-stakes games in quick succession, emphasizing the physical and mental toll on players and coaching staff.

  "It's that second game where does that end up, catching up to you at some point." ([30:57])

• Conference Bias and Selection Fairness: Addressing the ongoing debate about conference biases, Pastner acknowledges the criteria set by the selection committee but calls for a more balanced representation of conferences to ensure tournament diversity and competitiveness.

  "What do you have to come back for? It shows you how much you really don't want to play with the Washington Wizards." ([33:28])

6. Miscellaneous Topics and Lighthearted Moments

Timestamp: 36:17 – 47:09

The latter part of the episode veers into lighter discussions, covering topics such as NBA records, team management decisions, and innovative player strategies.

• Alex Ovechkin's Record Chase: The hosts comment on Ovechkin's pursuit of Wayne Gretzky's all-time goal record, expressing mixed feelings about the potential surpassing of a hockey legend.

  "I don't like it. I mean, I've been very clear about this." ([39:28])

• Atlanta Falcons' Quarterback Decisions: A heated debate ensues over the Falcons' choice to retain Kirk Cousins over Michael Penix, with Mark Zino criticizing the management's strategy and its long-term financial implications.

  "It was a bad decision by the organization and they're paying the price for it." ([42:10])

• Innovative Pitching Techniques in MLB: The conversation highlights the Seattle Mariners' rookie pitcher Urangelo Sanja and his switch-pitching abilities, sparking discussion on the practicality and rules surrounding such a skill.

  "Why can't he throw right if he wants? And in the next pitch... I'm going to throw with my left on this one." ([44:54])

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Conclusion

This episode of Sunday Mornings with Matt and Myron offers a multifaceted exploration of the current state of college basketball, blending expert analysis with candid discussions on team dynamics, player performances, and the intricacies of tournament selections. Whether dissecting the prowess of UCLA's women's team or debating the strategic decisions within the SEC, Matt and Myron provide listeners with a thorough and engaging perspective on the thrilling world of sports.

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Note: Advertisements, promotional segments, and non-content sections were omitted to focus solely on the substantive discussions and analyses presented during the episode.

Transcript

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[Jonathan Zaslow]

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[Mark Zino]

This is Matt and Myron, the podcast.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

For the guys this morning. I'm Jonathan Saslow alongside Mark Zino. This is Sunday morning on ESPN Radio, the ESPN app and SiriusXM Channel 80. Coming up tonight, ESPN Radio's Women's Bracketology. It's at 8pm Eastern with your host Q. Myers and Victoria Arlen. So let's take a look here at what the women's bracket could potentially look like. And joining us now, the great coach Carolyn Peck, ESPN women's college basketball analyst, joining us here on Sunday Morning. Coach, thanks so much for your time. So the projected top four seeds on the women's side, usc, ucla, South Carolina, Texas, if you had to pinpoint one of them as the most dangerous, it's.

[Carolyn Peck]

Who I would have to say that UCLA is the most dangerous. And this is why they are built very similar to last year's national championship team. South Carolina may have a supporting cast of guards who can shoot from the perimeter and they've got six, seven Marne bets inside. I mean, they demonstrated that in the Big Ten tournament, avenging or revenging the two losses to USC in that championship. I think that if you had to put somebody at the top, it has to be UCLA.

[Mark Zino]

To that end, I mean, just studying them, obviously never having made a Final Four in its current, you know, format for the women's, you know, brackets, the way they do it, you know, and we don't know what the seeds are yet, but I mean, where do they get tripped up? How do they get tripped up if this isn't their year?

[Carolyn Peck]

Well, I think they could get tripped up in it depends on where the committee puts Connecticut. You know, if Connecticut had to face the ucla, they have enough firepower from the perimeter to be able to score baskets. UConn is one of the best teams in the country. Defensively, they put pressure on the ball. I think the key though, for Connecticut is how consistent of a play can they get from their bigs inside so that strong could be freed up to play on the perimeter. But I think that if we were to see Connecticut in the same bracket as a ucla, that could be some interesting basketball coach.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Is Connecticut that team outside of the top four? You know, projected top four seeds who you could see as a legit title contender like and if there's another one in addition to Connecticut, who would it be?

[Carolyn Peck]

I do think that Connecticut could be a contender, specifically how they're playing right now and they've got Paige Beckers who is starving for a national championship. It has been a little while since UConn has won, I think back to 2016 and they have really been on an evolution throughout this season of putting the pieces together and finding the right fit and flow. And when it's Paige's time to take over versus when you need something from Easy Fudd or Sarah Strong. I mean they've got all the pieces I think to make a run to potentially win a national championship. But I don't think you can count out South Carolina. South Carolina came along and especially on the back of Chloe Kitts since their last meeting with Ole Miss. She had a triple double in that game and she has not taken her foot off the gas since. Along with her, Saniyah Fagan has been dominant. The coaching staff jokes and compares her to Joel Embiid with what she can do inside the post players. They can do what the guards can do. And you have Joyce Edwards who's a freshman who comes off the bench leads South Carolina in scoring. That three headed monster with the way the guards are playing. We all love my laser full wiley touch. Johnson is coming off the bench to help out Tahina Pow Powell and Raven Johnson. I think South Carolina could be in the mix when it comes down to that final day.

[Mark Zino]

Carolyn Peck, ESPN women's college basketball analyst, joining us. I'm curious your thoughts on NC State. You know they lose the ACC title to Duke, but they seem like a powerhouse team. They really look like a very complete team. What is their, their sort of ceiling in this tournament do you think? Do they have the capability to actually get to the Final Four and win it?

[Carolyn Peck]

Well, I think that in order to get to the Final Four they've got to get help for Batman and Robin in Isaiah James and Sinai Rivers. The surrounding cast has to be able to. When teams concentrate and take those two away now who can help them? You got to be they're tough defensive team now you got to take care of the ball against them because if they can get out and run and create opportunities to score it one on one could be a problem. And Westmore is one of the best game planners in the game. So when you face NC State, listen, you better lock down your money because he's gonna have some thieves in the night, some tricks up his sleeve.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Coach, how great is juju Watkins? Does she remind you of anybody?

[Carolyn Peck]

Oh, man. Juju Watkins, I think, is in a class in itself. Now, Cheryl Miller was a great player that played at USC, but played more of the 3, 4. Her scoring ability and she's already broken the record in the first two years for Caitlin Clark scoring in those first two years. So she has that ability to create her own shot. She, she has the ability to see the floor. You got to find her in transition at the 3. I think if you could combine a Cheryl Miller and a Caitlin Clark, that might be how you describe juju Watk. But she is on a tear and I think after losing in the Big Ten championship, she's going to come with extra motivation, extra firepower, and I think she could be one of the toughest guards in this NCAA Tournament.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Coach Carolyn Peck, ESPN women's college basketball analyst, excellent job, coach. Thanks for stopping by with us here on Sunday morning.

[Carolyn Peck]

Great. Thanks for having me.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

And make sure you're aware Tonight we have ESPN Radio's Women's Bracketology getting going at 8pm Eastern right here with Q. Myers and Victoria Arlen. This is Sunday MORNING on ESPN Radio. He's Mark Zo. I'm Jonathan Zaslow. So we got a couple of big ones, I mean, more than a couple, but I think the biggest ones that stand out to me here on the men's side this afternoon, 1:00pm Eastern on ESPN television, you have Tennessee and Florida, SEC tournament final at 3:30 Eastern. You got the Big Ten tournament final, Wisconsin and Michigan. And I know Joe Lenardi has, you know, updated a little bit as far as some notes in regards to the bracketology getting us ready for today. And he mentioned, which also Zinno J. Will, who joined us here on Sunday morning last hour, mentioned as well, the idea that, all right, you know, Auburn, they're, they're, they're likely to be the number one overall seed in the men's side of the tournament, but based on, you know, what happens to, you know, what happened to them yesterday and, you know, not even making the final, it's possible, not likely, but possible that someone else, maybe Duke is the number one overall seed. And I'm not saying, you know, that Auburn shouldn't be the number one overall seed because, yes, their resume speaks for itself. We're talking about an entire Season, not just yesterday, losing that game. No. But the idea that it's a lock we don't even have to consider anybody else right now. That's the part that I would take issue with.

[Mark Zino]

Yeah, I mean, look, I. Florida is making a very, very strong case, especially if they win this thing. When you look at what they have put together and the way things have sort of, they've gotten stronger as the season goes along. I mean, you know, for all intents purposes, they don't have a loss to any team that's not going to the tournament. Right. They lose a six point game to Kentucky, a one point game to Missouri. They do get blown out by Tennessee, but you know, and a short five point loss to Georgia. So they didn't stumble down the stretch other than the Georgia game, which kind of was predictable. Georgia was.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

And if I could add real quick, and if I could add real quick there to the Gators, I mean, you see the Gators, they score over 100 points there. They've scored over 90 a handful of games in a row. Now that one loss that they had to Tennessee, who they faced today in the SEC Championship.

[Mark Zino]

Outlier.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Yeah, I mean, the gate, how did they score just 44 points that game. Crazy.

[Mark Zino]

Yeah, well, they were held to, I think 34% shooting. So that was part of it. I mean.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

All right, anyway, you may continue.

[Mark Zino]

And they, they were 4 for 27 from 3. So that was also a problem when push comes to shove. I mean, look, Tennessee has that ability to be a lockdown defense, there's no doubt about it. So I think when you look at, you know, this Florida team, they don't possess many holes at all. I mean, they are so good on both ends of the floor. They're going to be a really tough out in the tournament. I guess the better question is, does it really matter who the number one overall seed is?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Yeah, not really. I feel like it's more about prestige.

[Mark Zino]

Sure. It's more about prestige and maybe it's more about, you know, I don't, I don't know that the number one overall seed versus the second number one seed has an easier path to the Final Four.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Right.

[Mark Zino]

I don't.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Oh, you, you get to face the, the fourth number 16 instead of the third number 16. Like who that cares?

[Mark Zino]

I mean, at that, again, at that point in time, you're, you're looking at tough contests no matter what. Once you get past the Sweet 16, everybody's playing a legitimate team.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Coming up next, Duke, they're without their best player right now. But could it affect their seating? We'll find out tonight, of course, but we'll tell you what we think is going to happen next on ESPN Radio and the ESPN app.

[Mark Zino]

NBA Monday on ESPN Radio in the Denver the Nuggets begin a four game road trip against Steph Curry, Jimmy Butler and the Golden State Warriors. Coverage begins tomorrow at 9:30 Eastern with tip off at 10 Eastern on ESPN radio and on ESPN presented by Indeed Matt and Myron the Podcast when you.

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[Mark Zino]

Cooper Flagg has the rebound after the.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Missed shot by Jaden Ustoff.

[Mark Zino]

Oh, that's not good.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

And flagging is not good.

[Mark Zino]

We gotta see how serious this is. We gotta see if we can get.

[Chris Canty]

Him right for this run that we can make in the tournament.

[Mark Zino]

Nobody else on their team could do what he does. He leads them in every stat category. It's gonna be interesting how that ankle plays out and how that could affect the seeding in terms of being a number one seed in a way that could be placed. It would severely impact their ability to to forget winning the whole championship. I'm talking about just getting to like San Antonio to get in the final four.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Just an array of opinions on Duke, Duke, Duke Starr Cooper Flag and his ankle injury. This is Sunday morning on ESPN Radio, the ESPN app and Sirius XM channel 80 alongside Mark Zino. I'm Jonathan Zaslow. Good to have you aboard. Here your pals Matt and Myron who are normally here on Sunday morning. You'll catch them tonight, 5pm Eastern right here on ESPN radio with the Men's Bracketology Special. And then immediately following that at 8pm you have the Women's Bracketology Special and that'll be hosted by Q. Myers and Victoria Arlen. Duke yesterday they win the ACC tournament championship 7362 over Louisville. It is Duke's 23rd ACC tournament champion. Five more then the next closest school. That's North Carolina with 18. But the big story was in the quarterfinal, Duke star freshman Cooper Flagg helped off the court ankle injury late in the first half. They were down big against Georgia Tech. They come back anyway. They still go on to win the next couple of games. Now does it wind up affecting their seating tonight? Let's hear from Dan gave it NCAA senior vice president of Basketball. Here he is on CBS Sports.

[Mark Zino]

But we understand from communication with Duke and the ACC that Cooper Flagg will be available for the NCAA tournament. So don't expect that to impact their seating. He is not the only significant injury. We're tracking other injuries from other teams. Player availability is always a concern and a consideration and could potentially impact seating, especially if a player is unavailable to play in the NCAA Tournament. Player availability is also considered considered in evaluating a team during the regular season based on player injuries and missed games.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

So Duke and the acc, they apparently both respond or both reached out to the committee to let them know they expect Cooper Flag to be available. Here is Duke head coach John Shire.

[Mark Zino]

I don't know who said that. I did not say that directly, but I can tell you that that's exactly my intention. It's the same thing. I mean I think it's trending in.

[Chris Canty]

A great where Cooper would be will.

[Mark Zino]

Be ready to go right away in the NCAA Tournament.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Zinno, you got to say that. You know these teams are afraid. I always use the example way back in the past. Cincinnati, Kenya Martin, they were incredible all year long. By far the best team. Kenya Martin breaks his leg and ends up affecting their seating. It was a whole big to do. If you're Duke, you have to at least present yourself as having your star player available leading it to tonight's.

[Mark Zino]

I mean yeah, all this stuff is posturing and again the choices available is an Interesting word. Right, Meaning wearing your uniforms is available to play next weekend.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

If they call me, I'm available.

[Mark Zino]

I am also available. If they call me, I'm about as available to play as Cooper Flag is, which means that neither one of us will be on the court. So yes, he's available. Sure, he's available.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Okay, so you, you don't believe he's going to be playing next weekend. Now is that because he's not ready or. It's because they don't need him.

[Mark Zino]

They both, they don't need him against a 16 seed. They're not going to.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

I don't even think they need him against an 8 or a 9.

[Mark Zino]

I, they probably won't depending on what the draw is and what it is. But you know, at this point we don't need to see him until, you know, and think about it. If they get the Friday Sunday draw instead of the Thursday Saturday. Right. Depending on where it goes, then guess what he has. I mean now he hasn't played for almost two full weeks.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Well, he goes from. Yeah, what Wednesday to the following Sunday?

[Mark Zino]

10 days, right? 10, 11 days. So you know, what's the status of his ankle? What does it look like?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

You know, they'll give him that, right? Like the committee will do that tonight, right?

[Mark Zino]

You would think that they would give Duke Friday Sunday. Yeah, you know, it may look like punishment, you know what I'm saying? But it's more of, yeah, we're doing you a favor here by giving you an extra day to get Cooper Flag.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Why is it punishment? Because potential less time. The sweet 16.

[Mark Zino]

No, I mean like, you know, they may have to downgrade them a spot to put them in in the bracket where, where they. It's a Friday Saturday game. I mean a Friday Sunday game as opposed to a Thursday Saturday game.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Gotcha. Gotcha.

[Mark Zino]

So you know that those time slots are already. TV wise. They're already done. You know, now you just fill the teams and they play where they're told to play. So that, that's why it looks like it. It could be something where they, you know, they may have to be downgraded a little bit just to get them in a Friday sat. A Friday Sunday situation. But regardless, again, I don't know that in any size, way, shape or form we expect to see Cooper Flag play in the, in the 16 in the 1 versus 16 game.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Is there any scenario where Cooper Flag, you know, they do the NBA draft lottery in late May, you get Washington or Charlotte, wind up getting the number one overall pick and he just Says, you know what? Eh, not interested. Going back to school for one more year. We'll try our hand at this. We'll collect some nils, we'll see what shakes out with the NBA draft lottery the next year. Like is it. It'd be unprecedented. I can't think of another time that's ever happened in the NBA. Like, is there any chance that that happens?

[Mark Zino]

That Cooper flag decides there's more of.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

A chance now because of Nil? You would never do it previously, but now, I don't know. Could be a thought.

[Mark Zino]

I mean. Yeah, it absolutely could be a thought in a sense that, like, why would I want to go to the black hole that is the Washington Wizards right now? That's what I'm saying, you know, I mean, stay nil. He'll make 3 to 5 million next year easily.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Yeah, right.

[Mark Zino]

You know, at Duke and he'll be good to go.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Yeah. Because you got to enter the draft and then they do the draft lottery and then there is a time period where, okay, you're still allowed to pull out. I don't know. I, I'd consider pulling out if I'm Cooper Flat 100.

[Mark Zino]

I would. I mean, I.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Again, especially if Duke doesn't win the national championship.

[Mark Zino]

Right. You know what I mean? The whole thing, it's, it's. What do I have to come back for?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Right?

[Mark Zino]

Like, what's really the. What do I really have to come back for?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Well, it shows you how much you really don't want to play with the Washington Wizards.

[Mark Zino]

You know what valid.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

You know what? The one time, the one time that I could think of that it has happened and it's quite the different scenario from this one. It was the 2006-2007 National Champion Florida Gators and they all came back. Remember, it was Joe Kim, Noah, Al Horford, Corey Brewer. Am I forgetting one more?

[Mark Zino]

There's a really good teams by Billy.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Torian Green, although Taurian Green was, I think it was a second round pick of the NBA. But anyway, Horford, Brewer, Noah, they win the national championship and not one of them decides to come back. When all three of them are projected as lottery picks, they all decide to come back and defend their national championship.

[Mark Zino]

And they did it.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Which they did.

[Mark Zino]

Yeah, I mean Florida crown national champions.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Again, but I can't think of another scenario where that's ever happened before. And it wasn't because they didn't want to go to like none of them were going to be the number one overall pick. Although for a moment, like, like it was thought of after that 2006 season that Noah could have been the number one overall pick, but none of them was going to be the number one overall pick. They all decided to go back to school. This would be Cooper Flag, the presumptive number one overall pick who would not go into the draft because. And again, I'm just. I'm. I'm speculating. There's not a report this. Nobody told me this, although it's been kind of chatted about.

[Mark Zino]

Right.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

But the idea that, hey, you know what? Maybe he says, ah, not interested. I'm going to stay in school for another year, you know, because I make a lot of money. I get to play on a basketball team that's contended for a championship. And, you know, college is really awesome.

[Mark Zino]

And when I don't have to go to class and do anything else and just hang around and hoop all day long and I'm getting paid three to five million dollars.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Yeah, I feel like that's a part we don't consider. College is awesome. College is so good.

[Mark Zino]

Awesome, right? Really does. I mean, do any of these kids go to class anymore that are athletes getting money?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Not at these big schools. And I know, like, Duke doesn't necessarily. Duke isn't necessarily a big school as far as student body, but, you know, it's. I guess it's considered a big school because of how popular it is. None of these schools does like Cooper. Flag's not sitting in class, man.

[Mark Zino]

He's not going to philosophy. He's not going to freshman philosophy.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

No, no. You're not sitting down.

[Mark Zino]

All of a sudden, they're going to writing composition 101.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

No, that's not happening. You know, so I don't know. It'd be pretty wild. It'd be pretty wild to say. Yeah, I'm, you know, I think I'm.

[Mark Zino]

Gonna Google flags is in my stats class. Yeah, there you go. He's right over there.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Be amazing, right? Be amazing. Anyway, so tonight, though, 5:00pm Eastern Time, right here on ESPN Radio, you have the men's college basketball selection show special with your pals Matt Jones and Myron Metcalf, normally who are here on Sunday morning. And today you got a handful of the tournament finals on the men's side here, most notably the SEC tournament final, which is at 1pm Eastern. That is on ESPN. Tennessee and Florida. How about at 3pm right after on ESPN? UAB Memphis and the American Athletic Conference championship final are both you. Is UAB also getting in? They're a bubble team right now. Right.

[Mark Zino]

I. I don't I don't know. I mean, between uab, North Texas, you know, there's legitimate cases that both of those teams could at least be had a conversation about them getting an at large bid.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

So that's interesting then, because potentially if they weren't going to get in, if UAB were to win that game, someone's getting left out.

[Mark Zino]

Yes. Oh, absolutely. If UAB wins today, someone's bubble is bursting. All right, 100. So that, that's going to change things from that standpoint. I mean, there is, there is a legitimate problem If UAB wins Today, that's.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

At 3pm Eastern on ESPN. And also at 3:30pm Eastern you have the Big Ten tournament championship, which is Wisconsin, who topped Michigan State yesterday, and Michigan right before the buzzer, they top Maryland yesterday. That is for the Big Ten. Yeah. You're not a believer. That's okay. You've been wrong before. Coming up next, we're a few hours away from the bracket reveal. Who's going to get that last one seed? We'll bring on an expert. This is ESPN Radio.

[Chris Canty]

Hey, it's your resident super bowl champ, Chris Cany. Before you fill out your brackets, make sure you tune into the Tournament Challenge marathon for all the info you need right here on unsportsmanlike weekday mornings at 6 right here on ESPN Radio, ESPN2 and ESPNU. Your data is like gold to hackers. They're selling your passwords, bank details and private messages. McAfee helps stop them.

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[Chris Canty]

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[Jonathan Zaslow]

1, 2, 3.

[Chris Canty]

Will that be cash or credit?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

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[Chris Canty]

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[Jonathan Zaslow]

Check responses for accuracy.

[Mark Zino]

Matt and Myron the Podcast this is.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Sunday morning on ESPN Radio. We are presented by Progressive Insurance. Your pals Matt Myron normally here on Sunday morning they will have your ESPN Radio Men's Bracketology at 5:00pm Eastern Time right here on ESPN Radio. So in their place, alongside Mark Zinno, I'm Jonathan Zaslow. Coach Josh Pastner joining us as well. He is in studio ESPN college basketball analyst. Coach, thanks a lot for hanging out with us. So on on Sunday night, when the men's bracket comes out and you know, when you were coaching and you see who you're playing and you see what region you're going to be at, give us what the rest of your week as a coach looks like from finding out tonight what you're doing to when the game starts on Thursday or Friday.

[Chris Canty]

Yeah, well, thanks for having me, guys. First, I would say, you know, so your name gets called, which is total excitement. I mean, I don't care how many times you've been there or it's your first time or your 30th time, it's exciting for everybody. Find out where you're going, who you're playing and all those good things. And obviously when you're doing it, usually having a gathering at your house or you're doing something with the athletic department in the arena or some kind of a booster function, whatever it may be. So once that's happened, let's just say at 6:00 to 6:30, between that time you find out, once all that's done and you find out where you're going now you're into preparing for your first game. And so as the head coach, you then got to divide up, okay, which assistant coach is going to be the lead scout of that first opponent and then what two, then your other two assistants are going to then split between the next round of games. So let's just pretend you're the one seeds. You're obviously going to have someone doing the 16 seed and then you've got to have each two other of your coaches focus on the 89 game, picking a team. But then from there that night, as you guys know, you're doing a lot of media that first night, you know, of radios and TVs, of just media obligations with just whether it's local media or national media on that Sunday night. And then really not until Sunday night around 10 or 11pm when things kind of slow down, do you really have a chance to dive in to that, to your opponent. And then from there you start working to the wee hours of the morning, obviously getting ready to go Monday morning, meeting with your staff, putting in the game plan. If you're playing Thursday, you're leaving Tuesday. If you're playing Friday, you're leaving Wednesday. Obviously if you're in the first four in Dayton, you're either leaving Sunday night if you're playing Tuesday, if you're playing Wednesday in the first four, you're leaving Monday. So it's a quick turnaround. And again, if you've played on Sunday and you played on Sunday, you're not going to practice Monday and your next practice won't be until Tuesday. If you've played on Saturday or Friday, obviously you're going to have Sunday probably off and then be ready to get after it in your preparation for the team practice part of it on Monday.

[Mark Zino]

All right, Coach, let's get into the weeds here because I have just kind of railed against this SEC bias. As somebody who lives in the heart of the SEC in Atlanta, I'm just, I'm not here for it. There are not 14 teams from the SEC worthy of being in this tournament. Texas and Oklahoma getting in are a joke. If they got into the Big 12, I might believe that that would be the case. But they're no longer in that conference anymore. So what is your sense of the SEC and should 14 teams be getting in?

[Chris Canty]

Well, Mark, I hate to break it to you, 14 might get in. 13 is for sure getting in. And there's a chance that 14 is getting in. And part of the, I don't know if Texas, I think obviously Texas is on the outside, excuse me, looking in right now. Now their case is they are 7 and 10 in quad one wins. They have a not a good non conference strength of schedule and they got 15 losses. But there has been a lot of, Mark, a lot of hype and promotion and they've earned it on the SEC this year. And let me just say this, the team sheets that the committee's looking at, those numbers where you're talking about the net rankings and Quad one and all those other analytics, so much of that is baked in from what you do in November in those non conference games. So people think that it's just matters in conference. It's all about what you do in non conference as an overall body of work from the non conference. So. And the SEC was incredible during the non conference part of their slate, all 16 teams and that's why their numbers are so strong. So I do think 13's getting in. I think Texas on the outside looking in even though they might have the best case based on their Quad 1 wins against North Carolina or Indiana or some of those teams that are kind of the other big names that are right there in the bubble. The only thing is those committee members could look at what did you do in the non conference that you can control, that you can schedule in your own. And they were not, you know, they did not do a great job in their non conference schedule. So yes, I can understand where you're coming from. And I will say this, Mark, the SEC is going to have to have two teams in the Final four. I really believe that to kind of match up to show that as strong as our conference has been this year, based whether it's whatever it may be, but especially based on the numbers and even the eye test, they probably should have two teams in that final four. And I do think Florida is the best team in the country right now. And as much as people are getting on Auburn because they have had some losses, three of the last four losses of their last three losses in the last four games, look, they still have had an incredible year. They still do have Janiah Broom and they've won a lot of big time games on the road, especially on the road in that league of the sec.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

We got coach Josh Passenger joining us here in studio on Sunday morning on ESPN Radio. Coach, what do you make of the conversation? And look, your guy, Coach Cal spoke about this recently as well as far as the tournaments and how important they are where he made the point, hey, I'm not trying to win the tournament championship, I'm trying to win the NCAA tournament championship. When you look at these conference championships, the SEC today, I mean Florida and Tennessee yesterday with those wins, they look like they're trying the Big 12 yesterday. We know Houston's going to be a number one seed. They look like they were trying yesterday winning that Big 12 championship. What do you make of the conversation around whether or not these conference tournaments are important?

[Chris Canty]

Well, I mean they are important because you're playing for a championship. And look, I understand what Coach Caliperi was saying. I don't know why he said that because he's won a lot of conference championships. I mean he's won a lot of games in the conference tournament. But I don't know if that was just, maybe just a setup for his team or using that as motivation for his team. I don't know his thought process, even though I work for him and I love him dearly. I don't know his thought process on, on saying that because like I said, he's won many times, both in the SEC and when he was at Memphis as well too. But that being said, look, it matters. It's important and I think it can affect seeding sometimes. Now look, this is Auburn. They lose Yesterday, they're still going to be the one seed. Duke is still going to be the one seed. They won the championship. But if they didn't win yesterday, they would have been a 1 seed. Florida's going to, you know, Florida, Tennessee, Florida is going to be a 1 seed. I think Houston winning is going to lock them in, be a one seed. But you're playing for a championship. It matters. It really just comes down to the rest part of it, because it is a grind. Three games or four games in three days or four days. You're, you're, you're, you're, you're beating each other up, in a sense. And, and it's more about the quick turnaround. So for an example of Florida or Tennessee, whatever happens today, the winner or the loser, their turnaround is either Thursday or Friday. And if it's Thursday, that's a quick turnaround. Not as much, maybe about that first game, because either one is going to win their first game. It's that second game. Where does that end up? Catching up to you at some point. But the difference between basketball and football, I would tell you, is in football, you know, you have one week, you're in between games, and people are hiding their plays, and there's so much mysterious, and they're putting things. And it's all about secrecy. Basketball, you are who you are. You can maybe add an adjustment here, add a little wrinkle to a play. But in the end, basketball's 80 to 85% of offense is just breakdown offense. It's the play after the play, and you just got to. Sometimes it's just about who's playing well, the momentum, and also, you know, having really good talent, and you're not going to sneak up on anybody. So even if you don't practice and you take, you know, you play today and you take Monday and do a light walk through Tuesday and some shooting Wednesday and play Thursday, your team is built in what you're going to run offensively and defensively. And your DNA is who your DNA is at this point of the year.

[Mark Zino]

Coach, just one last thing here. So you look at 13 from the SEC or possibly 14.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Okay, yeah, stop saying 13. You know, it's going to be 14.

[Mark Zino]

I mean, again, just, just Georgia's 4 and 11 against Quad 1 opponents, and they're getting to this tournament anyway. Beyond that. So let's just take 13, 14, 9, 10 from the Big Ten. A third of this tournament is coming from two conferences. Look, I always favored the big schools. I always wanted the big schools. I Don't care about the little guy. This seems like a formula over the course of time though that's bad for the sport when it is a third of the tournament comes from these two conferences. Because what's going to happen year after year is there's going to be this natural built in bias that we're just going to talk about them being the toughest conferences and, and being in there and all of a sudden the losses don't matter anymore. So I mean, do you agree that this kind of formula could be bad?

[Chris Canty]

Well, Mark, the only thing I would disagree with you on, and I understand about the bias you could say, but the reality of it is what the selection committee has been instructed to look at on those team sheets, those metrics. Look, the people in the room, Mark, their athletic directors, they don't have the time to sit there and watch college basketball.

[Mark Zino]

That's why they need a guy like me in there.

[Chris Canty]

There you go, there you go. Well, they don't have the time to sit there and watch every game. They have responsibilities of their other sports in their own department. They've got other things going on. Obviously they get together in this week in the last four or five days and watch games. But what they're going to rely on, Mark, is those sheets, those metrics that are given to them of the analytics of the road wins, the non conference strength of schedule of the quad one and quad two opportunities and wins and all those type of things. And how do you get those strong numbers? It's what you do in non conference. And the reality of it is if you win a lot in non conference, you're going to have a better shot within your conference. And the SEC and the Big Ten had elite non conference strength of wins in this year and whereas the ACC did not. And so the ACC is getting less bids probably than the Mountain West. And so I say all that to say it's so much of it's about what you do in the non conference. And so yes, the SEC in Big Ten has more talent than a lot of teams they play, but they took care of business. They won those games, their analytics met up to it and that's why they're going to get the majority of the field in. And even when you add eventually the NC Toy tournament is going to add some teams, it's going to happen. It'll just be a chance for more of the big boys to get in because of the team sheets and the metrics.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Zeno, it's going to be 14 get. Come on, make peace with it.

[Mark Zino]

I'm not making peace with any of this.

[Chris Canty]

I still think Texas is sweating it out. I. They're not 100%. I think they're sweating it out.

[Mark Zino]

They really are because they need Memphis to win.

[Chris Canty]

Yeah. Well, if Memphis, Memphis and vcu, everyone in the bubble is rooting for Memphis and vcu. If those two teams lose, there's going to be some problems. But Texas is. There's without question. They've had many sleepless nights since they lost the other day.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Coach Josh Passner, ESPN college basketball analyst, in studio with us here on Sunday morning. Excellent job, coach. Thanks a lot for giving us some time here.

[Chris Canty]

Yes, sir. Thanks, guys. Appreciate you. Thank you.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Coming up next, we're going to catch you up on all the headlines you may have missed here. That's next ESPN Radio and the ESPN app.

[Mark Zino]

The madness is coming. They ready?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

We are ready.

[Mark Zino]

Bubbles burn, bursting brackets breaking from half.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Court toward the ring.

[Mark Zino]

And Cinderella dancing the madness.

[Chris Canty]

I love the tournament.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

I love this time of year.

[Chris Canty]

Love it.

[Mark Zino]

Continuing coverage right here on ESPN Radio.

[Chris Canty]

Some people just know they could save hundreds on car insurance by checking Allstate first. Like you know to check the Jumbotron.

[Mark Zino]

First before attempting to eat a stack of supreme nachos in one bite.

[Chris Canty]

Now, you're just a meme that everyone shares on game day. Checking first is smart. So check Allstate first for a quote.

[Mark Zino]

That could save you hundreds.

[Chris Canty]

You're in good hands with Allstate. Savings vary subject to terms, conditions and availability. Allstate Fire and Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates, Northbrook, Illinois. I was never really a runner. The way I see running is a gift, especially when you have stage four cancer. I'm Ann. I'm running the Boston Marathon, presented by bank of America. I run for Dana Farber Cancer Institute to give people like me a chance to thrive in life, even with cancer. Join bank of America and helping Anne's cause. Give if you can@b of a.comSupportAnn what would you like the power to do.

[Mark Zino]

References to charitable organizations is not endorsement.

[Chris Canty]

By bank of America Corporation.

[Mark Zino]

Copyright 2025, Matt and Myron. The Pod.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Ben radio is presented by Progressive Insurance. Save on commercial auto insurance from Progressive. Get a fast quote@progressive commercial.com. ah, yes. Sunday morning alongside Mark Zeno, I'm Jonathan Zaslow. We bring aboard our pal Nick Carty producing the show behind the Glass up there in Bristol. Hello, Nick.

[E]

Hello, Zaz. Hello, Zeno. Got some good headlines that we have not quite gotten to because Zeno's on his soapbox about the SEC but, oh, he is there.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

He does not want. He can't believe it. Can't believe the sec. How many teams are going to get in?

[E]

All right, we'll start with a little hockey from last night. Alex Ovechkin chasing Wayne Gretzky's record. Well, he added a tally last night during their 51 win over the San Jose Sharks. Last night, ovechkin scored his 800th, 87th career goal to move with an eight of breaking Gretzky's record. He'd been on a bit of a slump. He hadn't scored in the first two games of the Caps road trip out west. But he nets one last night, and it keeps him on pace. He has 34 goals this year as he's 39 years old. So he's still on pace to break Gretzky's record this season.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

He is, yeah. It's only 15 games left, eight goals. Fifteen games could be really close.

[E]

Well, ESPN says he's still on pace, so I always trust ESPN.

[Mark Zino]

We're not going to argue with those guys, are we?

[E]

So, Zaz, what do you make of Ovechkin's great chase?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Yeah, I don't like it. I mean, I've been very clear about this. I don't like it. I'm a Gretzky guy. It doesn't make sense to me that the greatest player, hands down, no debate. Like, we're not doing LeBron James, Michael Jordan here. Wayne Gretzky is the greatest hockey player of all time. Ovechkin's phenomenal. He's not in the conversation with Wayne Gretzky. Nobody is. Now, I'm going to be the big loser here because Ovechkin is going to get the record. It's just a matter or not whether it's going to be in these final 15 games, you know?

[Mark Zino]

Yeah, I mean, I. You and I are sort of in step on this. We're simpatico. Like, I don't want anybody but Gretzky to have the record because he is the greatest hockey player ever. And records aside, I mean, I mean, and, oh, by the way, OVI is needed. How many more games to do this or less games? Is it more or fewer?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

I think it's. I think it's fewer right now.

[Mark Zino]

It's fewer, right?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

I think it's fewer. Yeah.

[Mark Zino]

But again, just Gretzky, you know, he still has a thousand more assists than Alexander Ovechkin.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

He has more assists than Ovechkin has points. Yes. And anyone has points. Rito Vechkin than Anyone does. Anyway, it's a great. Everybody knows.

[Mark Zino]

Yeah, I mean, I, I don't mind Ovechkin getting it per se, but I'm certainly not rooting for it.

[E]

I mean, it is something to it. It's been, what, 25 years still and this is the first person actually get somewhat close to it. Yeah. All right, we'll move on to something that may upset Zeno more than the sec. The Atlanta Falcons are keeping Kirk Cousins on the roster at past 4pm yesterday. So that initiates a $10 million roster bonus due to him in 2026. He was benched in week 16 after a brutal stretch of nine interceptions and just one touchdown pass. They announced the Falcons that Penix will start the rest of the year and he did and looked pretty good at it. So he will be the quarterback moving forward. It looks like the Falcons would prefer. Prefer, of course to trade Kirk Cousins after just one year of this major contract. They gave him Zeno. So how do you feel about your Falcons?

[Mark Zino]

Well, they're not mine, but nonetheless. Look, I said the day it happened it was a terrible decision to sign Kirk Cousins and draft Michael Penix. There was no way out for that to be successful. None. And it's coming to fruition right now that this was an absolute flop. It was a bad decision by the organization and they're paying the price for it. So what, you're shaking your head. Do you think this was a good decision?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

I completely disagree. It was clearly a good decision to draft Michael Penix. And of course there's a way out of this not being a decision to draft is really good.

[Mark Zino]

You don't need then you didn't then you shouldn't assign Kirk Cousins.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

But they gave themselves two chances to be right instead of just one.

[Mark Zino]

No, you didn't. There was only a very small window where this whole thing worked out and it was the way it was supposed to work out. Was that Kirk Cousins supposed to be very good for at least two years. Take them on a deep playoff run, possibly get into a Super bowl, maybe even win it, then retire and turn it over to Michael Penix who sat and was ready to play and walk in and keep the momentum going of a 1213 win team every year. That was the only window where this all worked out. Now you have 60 million in dead cap over the next two seasons.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Okay, but if that's not success, that's.

[Mark Zino]

The exact opposite of success.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Pennix is great this year. Nobody cares about Cousins. It's all about finding a quarterback.

[Mark Zino]

First of all, you have no data point to know whether he will be great or not. There is not enough out there. Three games is not this.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

But I'm saying if he's great this year, we see it and he's great.

[Mark Zino]

He doesn't even have to be great. I mean, all he's got to do is be better than 8 and 9. Yeah, right. And that's called progress. But again, you're still hampered from a roster standpoint and you've wasted two years of your rookie contract because you're in cap hell with 60 million of dead cap.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Well, that part from a quarterback you.

[Mark Zino]

Should have never signed if you were going to draft Michael Pennock.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

That part, it was a, it was.

[Mark Zino]

It was, it was a, an abject failure by the organization to do both. Complete disaster.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

It's not a complete disaster. Being great. It's not a disaster. If you have your franchise quarterback. You can't say that.

[Mark Zino]

I can say it and I will say that those doing both of them, you could have done one or the other and you would have been fine. Doing both of them is a disaster.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

We have a franchise quarterback disaster.

[Mark Zino]

You don't know if you have a franchise quarterback yet and you probably won't know that for another two years.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

You got one more, Nick?

[E]

I do.

[Mark Zino]

All right.

[E]

This is a tough name to pronounce, so bear with me. But the Mariners debuted a new special weapon on Friday night in spring training. Their rookie pick, pitcher Urangelo Sanja. Got that right. Sanja. He is a switch pitcher, so obviously he can throw from the left and the right. In their game on Friday night, he threw 90 miles an hour from the left side, got an out. Next pitch, 95 from the right side. Obviously the rule, just like batting, you have to declare which side you're going to pitch from at the start of the at bat. But you can switch during the inning if you'd like. He is a 21 year old pitcher. They plan to use him as a righty. But of course with the luxury of pitching for the left, they will change it up if they need to throughout the game. So Zaslow thoughts on the switch pitching?

[Jonathan Zaslow]

All right. Well, number one, this is awesome. Obviously my first question is, so the glove. It's one of those gloves where you have like the thumb on both sides.

[Mark Zino]

It's a six fingered man.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Yeah, I like that. That's cool. And the second thing I would say is that's it's garbage that you have to declare I'm going to be a righty here or I'm going to Be a lefty. Why can't he throw right if he wants? And in the next pitch. You know what? I'm awesome. I throw with both hands. I'm over both arms. I'm going to throw with my left on this one.

[Mark Zino]

No.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Why not?

[Mark Zino]

No, that's stupid. No, it's. You, you have to pick one for the at bat.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

I don't understand why.

[Mark Zino]

Because the whole point is, okay, is that you, you can't, you would have to make a pitching change non stop. Then like, you know, other teams, it's, it's an advantage that is too much in one team's favor.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

All right, well, he's worked his whole life to be able to pitch with both arms.

[Mark Zino]

You know what? He's probably not gonna be that good with both arms. Most guys aren't.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

I'm rooting for him. I like it. You should be able to pitch with whatever army wants at whatever place he wants. Coming up next, the biggest day in college basketball. We're gonna get you ready for the madness next on ESPN Radio and ESPN athletes. Hey, it's Michelle Smallman.

[Mark Zino]

And before you fill out your brackets.

[Jonathan Zaslow]

Make sure you tune in to the.

[Chris Canty]

Tournament Challenge marathon for all the info.

[Mark Zino]

You need right here on unsportsmanlike weekday morning, 6am Eastern on ESPN Martin Radio, ESPN2 and ESPNU. Thanks for listening to Matt and Myron the podcast. You can listen to the show live every Sunday morning at 10am Eastern on ESPN Radio, the ESPN app, and on SiriusXM Channel 80. Matt and Myron the Podcast.

[Chris Canty]

In case you didn't know, these young men are driven. They are prodigies, the savants, the ones we've been waiting for, like Damian Lillard, for instance.

[Mark Zino]

He doesn't seek guidance or mentorship. He's a leader.

[Chris Canty]

He isn't waiting for the baton to.

[Mark Zino]

Be passed to him. He's taken it for himself.

[Chris Canty]

He's relentless in a pursuit of greatness, always pushing to one up himself. He is accomplished, but far from satisfied. He embodies what it means to have an unstoppable drive and are shaking up.

[Mark Zino]

The status quo in their community and beyond.

[Chris Canty]

And Damian Lillard drives a Toyota. A new generation of Toyota drivers are.

[Mark Zino]

Here and they want you to know one thing.

[Chris Canty]

You can't stop my drive.