OSCAR NOMINEES: Paul Mescal on ‘Hamnet,’ Shakespeare and Building Complex Characters (November 2025)

Summary

---

Sunday Sitdown with Willie Geist

Episode: OSCAR NOMINEES: Paul Mescal on ‘Hamnet,’ Shakespeare and Building Complex Characters

Date: March 14, 2026
Guest: Paul Mescal
Host: Willie Geist

---

Episode Overview

In this episode, Willie Geist sits down with acclaimed Irish actor Paul Mescal to discuss his transformative role as William Shakespeare in "Hamnet," a film adaptation of the bestselling novel that reimagines the Bard’s private world, dealing with the loss of his son and the inspiration behind his iconic works. The conversation covers Mescal’s approach to portraying Shakespeare as a fallible, struggling young artist, his unique connection to the character, the film’s powerful performances, his rise from Gaelic football to the world stage, and insights into his next major role as Paul McCartney.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Portraying a Young, Human Shakespeare

• Focus on a Moment, Not a Myth:
  Mescal emphasizes the excitement in portraying Shakespeare not as an icon, but as a striving artist, pre-fame and grappling with personal grief and ambition ([03:46]).

  “You don't hear his full name until the last twenty minutes of the film. It made him accessible… It's an artist. And I could relate to that—the compulsion to write and tell stories but not being aware of your own myth.”
  — Paul Mescal [03:46]

• Relatability vs. Genius:
  Playing Shakespeare was daunting at first, but Mescal felt he could connect to the “animalistic, impulsive man who’s got extraordinary talent, but actually he's not interested in his talent, he's interested in the act of making” ([06:45]).

• Stepping Away from Tropes:
  Mescal and the filmmakers deliberately avoided biopic clichés in favor of exploring the unknown, emotional reality of Shakespeare’s inner life ([05:36]).

Exploring Inspiration and Grief

• Shakespeare’s Generosity as an Artist:
  They discuss how the film foregrounds not just the genius, but the “bravery that it takes to take an incredibly painful period in someone's life and hand it over to an audience for public consumption” ([08:25]).

• On Portraying Parental Grief:
  Mescal addresses acting as a father without being one himself, prioritizing emotional truth and investing in the lived-in love and “nest” of the family dynamic ([10:16]):

  “I don't necessarily sign up to the concept that you have to have lived the experience to relate… I could access that. I also love the idea of being a father.”
  — Paul Mescal [10:16]

Memorable Scenes and Performance Techniques

• The Hug of Relief and Realization:
  Mescal recounts a pivotal scene where Shakespeare returns home, embraces his daughter in relief, only to realize that this means tragedy for his son. He describes acting through that shift as “acting Olympics,” relying on lived-in character relationships rather than calculation ([14:23]):

  “You're just trying to not predict how that feeling is going to strike you… That response…feels almost kind of documentary style. It's just, yeah, I'm very, very proud of that moment.”
  — Paul Mescal [14:23]

• Emotional Authenticity and Gender:
  He notes the film’s nuanced depiction of gendered grief:

  “That concept of men or younger men struggling with the initial release of grief or emotion, I think is true… I definitely relate to that feeling, it takes me a second to compute the enormity of what the feeling might be.”
  — Paul Mescal [16:13]

Partnership with Jessie Buckley

• Praising a Co-Star:
  Mescal is effusive about Jessie Buckley’s performance as Shakespeare’s wife:

  “It is her, it’s Anya’s… she hides her brilliant craft in just this wild humanity… Jesse’s performance is just on a totally different level to most of the performances I’ve ever seen.”
  — Paul Mescal [18:06]

Path to Acting: From Gaelic Football to the Stage

• Early Life and School Musicals:
  Mescal shares how a mandatory school musical audition (“The Phantom of the Opera” at age 16) unexpectedly set him on an acting path, despite being a sporty kid ([21:32]):

  “They had this policy where every student…you had to audition…Had I gone to a different school, I wouldn’t be the person that I am today.”
  — Paul Mescal [21:33]

• Impact of Inclusive Arts Education:
  He talks passionately about giving young people a chance to explore outside stereotypes (“theater kids” vs. “sporty kids”) and lauds his school’s inclusive culture ([22:55]).

• Chasing the First Thrill:
  That first big stage performance still drives him ([25:24]):

  “I think I'm still very much still chasing that that night when I was 16.”
  — Paul Mescal [25:24]

Sudden Fame and Adjustment

• Pandemic Breakthrough:
  Mescal reflects on the overnight success from “Normal People” during the pandemic, describing the adjustment as “pretty intense,” and more jarring than anything that’s come since, even with Oscar nominations and blockbuster roles ([26:13]).

  “Weirdly… the sharpest adjustment period happened when Normal People came out… To have that sharp ascent … but to have friends who've shared that experience, it makes the ridiculousness of what my life seems from the outside make more sense.”
  — Paul Mescal [26:13]

• Staying Grounded:
  Living in London, he finds the city’s sense of privacy and community helps manage notoriety ([28:12]).

Big Projects: Gladiator 2 and the Power of Mentorship

• Working with Legends:
  Mescal describes acting opposite Denzel Washington and working with Ridley Scott as both intimidating and humanizing:

  “They're there forever… They're on Mount Rushmore of cinema… but they took away the stigma of, like, oh, you're working with Ridley and Denzel. It's like you're going to work with colleagues who care deeply about what we're making.”
  — Paul Mescal [28:53]

Next Challenge: Becoming Paul McCartney

• Playing an Icon While He’s Alive:
  The conversation closes with Mescal describing the pressure and privilege of portraying a living legend, Paul McCartney, and the daunting technical challenge of learning to play left-handed guitar ([30:19], [31:14]):

  “It’s definitely been the greatest technical challenge of my career. And I’m really proud with where we’ve gotten to with it.”
  — Paul Mescal [31:14]

---

Notable Quotes & Moments with Timestamps

• “You don't hear his full name until the last twenty minutes of the film. It made him accessible… It's an artist. And I could relate to that—the compulsion to write and tell stories but not being aware of your own myth.”
  — Paul Mescal [03:46]

• "We actually have no idea who he was…"
  — Paul Mescal deconstructing the Shakespeare myth [06:45]

• "There's a real emotional, humanistic literacy that I think he just… there's few people who've given us that over the course of history."
  — Paul Mescal, on Shakespeare’s enduring gift [08:25]

• "You're just trying to not predict how that feeling is going to strike you when you walk into the room…"
  — Paul Mescal, on the pivotal homecoming scene [14:23]

• "I think this performance is, like, not just one for this year. I think it's one for, like, truly for the ages."
  — Paul Mescal, on Jessie Buckley’s performance [18:06]

• "I think I'm still very much still chasing that that night when I was 16."
  — Paul Mescal, on the thrill of performing [25:24]

• "Regardless of how down you are in, like, public spheres, you can live the life that you want to live if you don't operate just purely from a sense of fear."
  — Paul Mescal, on managing fame [27:46]

• "They took away the stigma of, like, oh, you're working with Ridley and Denzel… it's like, you're going to work with colleagues who care deeply about what we're making."
  — Paul Mescal, on Gladiator 2 [28:53]

• "It's definitely been the greatest technical challenge of my career."
  — Paul Mescal, on learning left-handed guitar for the McCartney role [31:14]

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:36] — Approach to portraying Shakespeare as a person, not a legend
• [05:36] — The film’s origin and casting, landing the role
• [08:25] — The emotional risk and generosity in Shakespeare’s art
• [10:16] — Navigating parental grief as a performer
• [14:23] — Acting through the homecoming scene and emotional authenticity
• [18:06] — Praising Jessie Buckley’s performance and on-screen chemistry
• [21:32] — Mescal’s journey from athlete to actor via school musicals
• [25:24] — Chasing the thrill of live performance
• [26:13] — Adjusting to fame after “Normal People”
• [28:53] — Working with Denzel Washington and Ridley Scott
• [30:19] — Taking on Paul McCartney, learning left-handed guitar

---

Tone and Atmosphere

The conversation is warm, candid, and introspective, marked by Mescal’s humility, curiosity, and deep thoughtfulness about his craft and its meaning. There are playful flashes (jokes about “manipulation” and paying Jessie Buckley under the table), but the overall feeling is one of depth, admiration, and serious engagement with acting, legacy, and vulnerability.

---

Summary

Willie Geist’s conversation with Paul Mescal is a compelling deep dive into how one of today’s leading actors crafts rich, complex characters—be it a grieving Shakespeare in “Hamnet,” a modern youth on “Normal People,” or a cultural titan like Paul McCartney. Mescal shares insight into his process, the challenges and privileges of his roles, the importance of embracing vulnerability, and the foundational moments that made his career possible. The episode is rich with wisdom on the craft of acting, the necessity of empathy, and the enduring power of great storytelling.

Transcript

[Commercial Narrator]

There's a difference between liking a house and actually getting it. Redfin is built to close that gap. Redfin agents close twice as many deals as other agents, so when you find a home you love, you're not a step behind when it's time to make an offer. That means less watching great homes disappear and more zeroing in on the one you'll actually end up calling home. Redfin helps turn saved listings into real addresses. Get [e-mail] own the dream.

[Paul Mescal]

Choose to show up

[Commercial Narrator]

with the bold styling of the Mazda CX30.

[Interviewer]

I wake up.

[Willie Geist]

Hey, guys, Willie Geist here with another episode of the Sunday Sit down podcast. My thanks as always for clicking and listening along. Really happy to bring you my conversation this week with one of the brightest rising stars in Hollywood, Paul Mezkal. You may know him best as the star of Gladiator 2, where he went toe to toe and face to face with Denzel Washington in a massive blockbuster that grossed, I don't know, half a billion dollars or something like that. He's starring now in a movie called Hamnet, based on a novel, very popular novel. He plays William Shakespeare in this just extraordinary movie that provide backstory, the inspiration for his tragedy Hamlet. It's the story of his real life son. He had twin sons, the real life William Shakespeare, this is in around 1580 we're talking about. And he has twin children, a boy and a girl. The boy's name is Hamnet and He dies at 11 years old of the pestilence, as they called it back then, got sick and died. So it's this at first beautiful and then agonizing story of young William Shakespeare, who's just a Latin tutor and an aspiring playwright. Nobody knows who he is yet, who's now getting a little bit of acclaim and going to London and the Globe Theater to stage his plays, shuttling back and forth to the countryside where his family is. It's just so well acted. Across from an actress named Jessie Buckley, who plays his wife, Shakespeare's wife. And you can bet we'll be getting a lot of Oscar talk for this performance. Both of them will. So a great guy. So happy to sit down with him. You might remember, remember too if you're a fan. He kind of burst onto the scene in 2020 with the show Normal People, the series. It was on Hulu, a BBC thing that just became a big hit. Took off during the pandemic. Then he earned an Oscar nomination for his performance in the movie After Sun. Just a great Irish guy who started as a Gaelic Football star, which is kind of a combination of rugby and soccer, was an athlete. And you'll hear him talk about he in high school, just going out at 16 years old, auditioning for the school play and winning the part of the Phantom in Phantom of the Opera and kind of being off to the races from there. Went to college, graduated, started his career. He's done a lot on stage. He's won awards there and now developing a big film career, too. So sit back, relax, and enjoy my conversation with Paul Mezal right now on the Sunday Sit down podcast.

[Interviewer]

Thanks for doing this, Paul.

[Paul Mescal]

It's great to see you.

[Interviewer]

I was just telling you I saw the film a couple of days ago and I'm still thinking about it. I was so moved by it. Your performance, Jesse's performance, Jacoby's performance, the young boy in Hamnet.

[Willie Geist]

I'm just curious, first of all, how

[Interviewer]

you approached this version of William Shakespeare, because as we were saying, you're not trying to capture his entire life and career. You're capturing a moment in time. So how did you look at this as an actor?

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah, I think the first, like, typically, I would have been nervous about the concept of, like, a Shakespeare biopic and be asked to play Shakespeare. But I'd read the book before, and I was acutely aware that that wasn't the avenue that was of interest to Maggie the writer and Chloe the director. It was. You don't really hear. You don't hear his full name until the last 20 minutes of the film. So it did open up a real, like, sense of excitement for me because it was like, it made him accessible. I think I was like, oh, this isn't William Shakespeare in, like as a title. It's an artist. And I could relate to that. The concept of, like, feeling like you have to express something, but you're not aware of, like, your own myth.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Paul Mescal]

Like, Shakespeare doesn't know that he's. We're going to be sitting here talking about him 400 years later. He's just somebody who's a compulsion to write and tell stories. And I'm not a writer, but I feel connected to him in terms of wanting to communicate something about the world that we live in and the lives that we choose to live and everything that goes between that. So it just made. It took the kind of a sense of panic away from, like, where do you begin? If you're told, like, play one of the greatest geniuses to ever impact the world, be like, I give that to someone else, you know, So I felt very excited by the kind of setup of the book and the film.

[Interviewer]

And that's part of the beauty of it. This is not the immortal William Shakespeare that we all know and have read in our schools for centuries. As you say, this is a struggling young artist, a Latin tutor teenager looking for love and a family and trying to find his way. So when you first heard that this book was going to be made into a film and that the director was very interested in you playing Shakespeare, did that thrill you, that excite you?

[Paul Mescal]

Like, to be honest, I think I did my own fair share of manipulation with that. Like, I had heard that Chloe, she tells. She. She had basically passed on the film the day before I met her. So we were in Telluride together and Jesse was. I was there with after son and Jesse was there with women talking. And I met Chloe and I was kind of flirting with the idea of bringing up the Hamlet thing because I knew she'd been. But it's. I never really know how to broach those conversations. So I was like, hey, what are you up to? Anything, anything, anything coming down the line. And she started talking about Hamlet. And then I was, okay, great, we can talk about this. She had initially passed and then I think me and Jesse being in the same place over weekend up in the mountains in nature, which is very much like a big character in Hamlet. The film was kind of a beautiful coincidence that I think then she could see a map through what the film could look like. But when like for Chloe Zhao to be interested in the concept of working with you, I was like, this is nuts.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. People don't know she's the Academy Award winning director.

[Paul Mescal]

Incredible.

[Interviewer]

And it's interesting to hear it wasn't quite serendipity. It was your plan to get.

[Paul Mescal]

It was my. My. It was my grand. No. Because I loved the book so much and I really felt like. I felt like I could see a way of playing Shakespeare in a way that excited me and I think would. That would maybe step away from the tropes that we assume. We like, we have these assumptions about Shakespeare that I just think are completely nonsensical. Like we actually have no idea who he was other than the fact that he married Anne Hathaway, who's Anya's in the film. And he had three. He had his children. I mean he wrote these plays. But after that like this kind of bookish notion or this, I don't know, this academic kind of lore that has surrounded him. I really felt like the book tried to remove that. I was like, oh, this feels like an animalistic, like, impulsive man who's got an extraordinary talent, but actually he's not interested in his talent. He's interested in, like, the act of making, which I think is a really. I. I could just. You know, when you have that kind of feeling in your hands where you're like, oh, I know how to go about doing this. And oftentimes I don't have that feeling. And I have to work at the concept of what it would be like to make this character. But I always knew what the kind of rough sketch of him would look like for me, which is. Which was exciting.

[Interviewer]

It struck me, watching the film, and maybe you too, that we know the work.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Just, like, handed down on stone tablets at this point. But we don't really think a lot about the inspiration for the work. What was he feeling? What was he living? As any writer would in that moment.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah. And I think that this film really. I felt incredibly emoted. There's a sequence at the end of the film where we go to the globe and it's the first run of Hamlet. Not the first, but the first kind of iteration of that play with. With his company. And I was struck by the fact that we take his brilliance for granted because it is brilliant. But what I don't think we focus on is the kind of generosity of spirit and bravery that it takes to take an incredibly painful period in someone's life and hand it over to an audience for public consumption. And that's kind of where my eyes separate from him. In my head, it's like, I have no interest in doing that. And that's an amazing act of generosity that he has given us for 400 years. He's shaped this love and grief and transfer, like. And not made it just about this pain of losing a son, but kind of making it this temple, this place that people can visit. His son and his love for his own. His wife's love for his son. And he's given it to us for forever. And I was struck when we were shooting those scenes that I was like, that's actually his brilliance to me. Like, obviously, his poetry is so beautiful, but there's a real emotional, humanistic literacy that I think he just. There's few and far. Like, there's few people who've given us that over course of history.

[Interviewer]

For sure, the film is beautiful, but it's also devastating. You know, you don't have to be a parent to appreciate what that family is feeling. How did you get to that place? Not a father yourself yet. Oh, yeah. But how did you get into that, what a father would feel going through all that was happening in that home?

[Paul Mescal]

I mean, I've played like after son, I played a father. And I don't necessarily sign up to the concept that you have to have lived the experience to relate. Yeah. Because I think, I don't know you're, you're a father. And I don't think I, I, when I speak to people who are like, invest in the work that they do, of course they're a father first, but they're human being before they're anything else. And I feel like I could access that. I also love the idea of being a father. I'm excited about hopefully that part of my life. So it's not something that I feel like, oh, afraid of. But I think to your point about the kind of devastation of the film, I do. It's obviously a part of the film that audiences are connecting with, but there is the part that I think is actually most important is the beginning of the film where you build this relationship between two people. And all of the loss that the audience and these characters feel can only be serviced if you really feel this love and commitment and loyalty that these two characters and these children, this family unit is like a nest. And I like, I think by really investing in that and the joy of that and the real kind of, it's really quite sweepingly romantic at the start and like gorgeous and lush. And I loved really investing in that because then you ultimately, if you stay true to that, all of the work is done for you because you have built these relationships both on and off screen so that like, the loss of a son or the loss of a relationship is only as painful in relation to what you've invested at the beginning. And I think that both those things are crucially important to the, to the, hopefully the catharsis the audience feels at the end.

[Willie Geist]

Hey, guys, thanks for listening to the Sunday Sit down podcast. Stick around to hear more from Paul Mezkal right after the break.

[Commercial Narrator]

There's a difference between liking a house and actually getting it. Redfin is built to close that gap. Redfin agents close twice as many deals as other agents. So when you find a home you love, you're not a step behind when it's time to make an offer. That means less watching great homes disappear and more zeroing in on the one you'll actually end up calling home. Redfin helps turn saved listings into real addresses. Get [e-mail] own the dream Ryan Reynolds

[Paul Mescal]

here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to [e-mail]

[Commercial Narrator]

Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month required. Intro rate first 3 months only then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full [e-mail] shipping, billing, admin, payroll, marketing. You're managing all the things, so why waste time sending important documents the old fashioned way. Mail and ship when you want, how you want with stamps.com print postage on demand 247 and schedule pickups from your office home. Save up to 90% with automated rate shopping. That's why over 1 million small businesses trust stamps.com go to stamps.com and use code podcast to try stamps.com risk free for 60 days.

[Willie Geist]

Welcome back. Now more of my conversation with Paul Mezkal.

[Interviewer]

I don't want to give away too much so you can talk about it if you don't want to, but there's a scene when you come home from London.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Racing home.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And you see your daughter. Yeah. And you're so relieved.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Okay. And you're hugging her. Yeah. And there's this.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So I'm getting chills. Talking about there's this turn to see that you actually shouldn't be.

[Paul Mescal]

I shouldn't be celebrating. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

How did you act your way through that moment?

[Paul Mescal]

That's one of those scenes that you're like this. I didn't try to overthink it because it actually ties to the point that I just said. It was just like I loved my family in that film. I love them as people. I love them as characters. So you're just trying to like, really, you're trying to not predict how that feeling is going to strike you when you walk into the room. There's a myriad of different takes that have the kind of polar opposite responses. That is like one of the scenes that I'm probably proudest that I've ever shot in terms of personally and as a company of actors. It just feels like I haven't, I haven't experienced what that is. But I feel like that response that like Jesse goes through and I go through and Olivia and Bode and Emily, it feels almost kind of documentary style. It's like this feels truthful to me about it also. It feels like a little bit like acting Olympics where you're, like, totally joyful that Olivia is there and you just see his body just go like. Oh. Like. It's just. Yeah. I'm very, very proud of that moment. It's like that. Yeah. 181 of. Rather than kind of going to the kind of maybe obvious Greek release of like, grief, it just actually totally silences him.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Paul Mescal]

And he doesn't know what to say or how to act.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Paul Mescal]

And it's got. It was a. I was worried talking to Chloe. I was like, will the audience get that he's grieving? But actually she was so clever with how she directed that and how confident she was and not being the right choice. But then you, the audience are like, why isn't he releasing anything? But you see that in the final 20 minutes.

[Interviewer]

It comes later.

[Paul Mescal]

It comes later.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Paul Mescal]

And I think that's like, not. I think the film is also, like, very much interested in maybe more stereotypical gender. It's quite gendered. I think the film in a more traditional sense. And I think that that concept of men or younger men struggling with the kind of initial release of grief or emotion, I think is true for. Not for everyone, but for. I definitely relate to that feeling of, like. It takes me a second to like, compute the enormity of. Of what the feeling might be versus, like, you see Jesse's like. It's so profoundly immediate and primal. And primal. Yeah. That I don't think the film or that moment would have worked if I come in and. And it's the same feeling for me. It. You know, and I think that's. That's a real testament to, like, Jesse's tournament. But also like, Chloe's like, the way she modulates all of that so that you get. If it takes time, you know, and

[Interviewer]

you're right, as a man, your instinct

[Paul Mescal]

maybe is to be strong, to be strong and protect. But actually in that moment, I was like, I don't. I don't believe this.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Paul Mescal]

I don't. Right. I don't believe this. And Chloe kept talking about dramatic irony and of. In that moment, this kind of weird smile that comes over his face because he's like, of course it was never going to be my daughter because it would be too perfect. Yeah. This is too. It's unbelievable. I told him to be brave and he's. He's taken the idea of bravery and it's devastating. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Your co star, Jesse is extraordinary. Unbelievable. People are familiar with her. Probably they've seen her Some project. But it does feel like this is the film where the world is really gonna know her name. Can you talk about her talent as an actor?

[Paul Mescal]

I. I think this performance is, like, not just one for this year. I think it's one for, like, truly for the ages. I think I knew it when we were filming it, but then having seen us and watched it and studied it, I really think it's just profound. It's brilliant. It is her. It's Anya's. It's like she's got just this appetite for people and a curiosity about people and love for people that it doesn't. She hides her brilliant craft in just this, like, wild humanity. And I think I'm so proud to have, like, sat across from her and watched her do it. And I also just have such a huge love for her that I'm so proud that. That. Do you always worry that the feeling of making something together won't translate into the finished product? But it superseded my hopes as a collector. But also, like, Jesse's performance is just on a totally different level to most of the performances I've ever seen. It's extraordinary. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And she says the same about you, by the way, when you read interviews.

[Paul Mescal]

I pay her under the table.

[Interviewer]

Oh, is that what it is? More manipulation?

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah, more manipulation.

[Willie Geist]

There's a theme here.

[Paul Mescal]

Pocket full of dollars. Just like, say nice.

[Willie Geist]

Stick around for more of my conversation with Paul Mezgol, right after a quick break.

[Commercial Voice]

Your new home is now ready. Dr. Horton, America's builder has new homes that are ready today. With new construction communities throughout the Puget Sound and Central Washington areas And more coming, Dr. Horton has the right home for you at Dr. Horton. We're still building. With more construction, more communities, and more homes available every day. Tap your screen now or visit drhorton.com to find your new home now ready. Dr. Horton, America's builder. An equal housing opportunity builder. Amazon presents Laura vs Fruit Flies. Hide your bananas. These winged demons came to your kitchen to do two things. Eat fruit and. And they're all out of fruit. But thankfully, Laura shopped on Amazon and saved on cleaning spray, countertop wipes, and fly traps. Hey, fruit flies. Your baby boom ends here. Save the everyday with Amazon. Hey, guys. Finding the perfect gift for the food lover in your life is easy, thanks to Goldbelly. Goldbelly ships America's most iconic foods straight from world famous restaurants right to your door. So if you want to treat someone to Joe's Stone Crab from Miami, Franklin Barbecue from Texas, or desserts from famous foodies like Ina Garten or Martha Stewart. Goldbelly has you covered. Just go to goldbelly.com and for a limited time, get 20% off your first order with promo code gift. That's promo code gift.

[Willie Geist]

Welcome back now to the rest of my conversation with Paul Mezkal. I want to ask you, Paul, about

[Interviewer]

your start and how you got into performance because you grew up an athlete playing Gaelic football, which, for our American audience, a little bit of football, a little bit of rugby. Is that fair to say?

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

A bit of mishmasher somewhere in there. Yeah. Yeah. So it feels like sports were your first priority.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So at what point does performance and theater come into the picture?

[Commercial Voice]

It was.

[Paul Mescal]

We. We did a school musical. I was 16, and I was just totally bitten by the book. It's. I'm very grateful I've said this before, but I'm still, like, I can't say it enough that the school that I went to was public school. Like, wasn't like, a fancy school, but they had this policy where every student, whether you were sporty or no interest in musical theater, you had to audition. And I think that I would love for, like, schools and educational institutions to, like, really look at that model of just going, like, because we don't really focus on the arts enough in school. And I, I, it. I'm absolutely positive that that would have passed me by because I didn't fit that demographic. I was sporty, and I love. I still loved playing sports after, but had my school not afforded me that opportunity to be, hey, this isn't an embarrassing thing to do. You can go and do this. I was just. So. I grabbed it with both hands and just absolutely loved it. But it does kind of scare me that had I gone to a different school. Yeah. I wouldn't be the person that I am today.

[Interviewer]

You play the part that you've almost been assigned, which is on the sports, and they're the theater kids.

[Paul Mescal]

And we were talking about this just before we started turning over just this kind of concept of, like, you're so malleable as a young adult that you're like, oh, exactly. That you're kind of compartmentalized. And there's kind of, like these stereotypes that come up. Being sporty or being a theater kid or. And I was just. I was. I'm. I. I'm so impressed by the school. I'm also. I think we need to give children more credit for the fact that actually, if you give them the opportunity to express something that's outside of their small circle, they Will run with it with both hands. It's only embarrassing or frightening until you're told that it's not. But we shouldn't be placing that responsibility on 13 to 17 year olds with like. I think the infrastructure around them has to be just push a little bit to be like, this is also over here, if you want to have a look at it. If you don't want it, cool. Like some kids went in and sang Happy Birthday because they really didn't want to be in the musical. But everybody was given the opportunity to be like, hey, if you actually want to give this a go, maybe don't sing Happy Birthday. But you know what I mean? So it was very. That was my story.

[Interviewer]

Was this the big Phantom performance?

[Paul Mescal]

It's the big Phantom performance.

[Interviewer]

We start right out of the gate with Phantom. And you are the Phantom, right?

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

I mean, wow. A star immediately in mayuth of nowhere else.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah, no, it was. I, I can. I like distinctly remember just the. I remember doing the first night of it so clearly and it's a big moment in the town that I grew up is like the school musicals, like they build up the, like the sports hall and it's like tiered seating and there's 600 people in there over five, like big and bring in like be the 20 piece orchestra. I remember like playing this like wooden organ was like my knees were just like bouncing. But I was beyond thrilled. And then the, the performance finished and we came out and bowed and it was the first time that like I'd kind of come up for air in the two and a half hours and I was like, oh, this feeling is extraordinary. That's like my. I was saying to somebody earlier, it's like my parents actually met on stage. So I have this weird thing that I feel like being there makes sense to me, you know, being on stage. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And you felt it first that night. That's amazing.

[Paul Mescal]

It just felt like nothing. I think I'm still very much still chasing that that night when I was 16.

[Interviewer]

We've done a good job with the pursuit of that feeling. I mean, you've done stage, of course, then you went on after college to notably normal people, which came out during the pandemic, which earned you acclaim not just in the uk but here. Everyone, we were home and watching. Oh, this is a great show.

[Paul Mescal]

Oh, that's Paul.

[Interviewer]

When that came out at a strange time for anything to come out and you sort of became this known person really for the first time. I think it's fair.

[Paul Mescal]

Except for the school Musical and minutha.

[Interviewer]

What was it? Right, right.

[Willie Geist]

That was a big night.

[Interviewer]

That was a big fight forever.

[Commercial Voice]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

What did that feel like to you, to suddenly be, you know, you've done stage and some television?

[Paul Mescal]

I think that was, like, pretty, like, intense period for the world generally. And I think it just felt a little bit magnified in a sense. I was like, I don't. It was. It's hard to compute. But weirdly, like, now post, like, Oscar nomination for after sun and big films like Gladiator coming out. I weirdly think the sharpest adjustment period happened when normal people came out. Yeah. And I'm so grateful to that show and the people that I met on, like, my best friends are from that time and from before. And I just feel like that was to have that sharp ascent and kind of be holding on for dear life, but to have friends who've shared that experience, it may. It makes the kind of ridiculousness of what my life seems from the outside make more sense. Yeah. It feels a little bit easier. And that's taken a second to get to, like, now I feel like there's not really, like, much more, like, weird.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. This.

[Paul Mescal]

That can. That can. That I feel like would be totally new now.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Paul Mescal]

Which I'm grateful for because it did destabilize me for a bit, I suppose. Yeah. I said, well, I'm kind of glad it did because I feel like if it didn't, I'd be a robot.

[Interviewer]

Well, it's probably understandably intoxicating at first, the attention. Oh, I'm doing well. People know who I am. And then I guess at some point you realize, oh, I need to pull this back a little bit if I'm going to have a normal life.

[Paul Mescal]

Yes. Right. Yeah. And I think. I can't remember telling this, but you can actually, like, regardless of how down you are in, like, public spheres, you can live the life that you want to live if you don't operate just purely from a sense of fear, you know, like, of course, it might be a little bit more difficult to walk down, like, Oxford Circus. Like, just don't go there.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Paul Mescal]

You know, Like, I think I feel very grateful to, like, the scent. There's a real sense of community in London. I live in London now. And there's a real sense of, like. I don't know, it feels like. It's hard to describe. People look after you. They don't want to be invasive. Of course that happens. But, yeah, it feels more manageable. Life feels a little bit more manageable now.

[Interviewer]

And the the leap got bigger with Gladiator 2, which you mentioned, this massive Ridley Scott film that does half a billion dollars at the box office. You're.

[Willie Geist]

You're the guy, you're the gladiator.

[Interviewer]

But also the opportunity to act with Denzel Washington. What did you learn from that experience? Just being nose to nose.

[Paul Mescal]

Yes. And just to be like, with Denzel and Ridley, like two giants of the cinema. Like, they're kind of. They're there forever. They're like, they're on Mount Rushmore of like, of cinema. And I felt very. It felt. I feel very. I was like very close with Ridley and Denzel was just such a force to be opposite and to learn from. But what I was really grateful was that, like, they took away the stigma of, like, oh, you're working with Ridley and Denzel. It's like you're going to work with colleagues who care deeply about what we're making. And it just took away. I don't know, I thought going into something like that, it would be a different job. Like, something would feel different. But I feel very proud of how we approached that film. And like, to be stepping into a kind of world where people have such beloved relationship to the first film. I feel very, very proud of, like, how we went about doing it, you know. And I have an immense love for Ridley Scott. He's very special to me.

[Interviewer]

Before I let you go, Paul, I've got to ask what you're working about, what you're working on right now, which is playing Paul McCartney. So from Shakespeare to McCartney, you're going big here. How has it been to step into McCartney's shoes?

[Paul Mescal]

It's a real, real privilege. And like, as we know, Shakespeare is not alive to have the impact on Hamnet, but I've got to know him and his family a little bit. And they've been so generous with the idea of us kind of really getting into the fore of their lives. And I feel very proud that I feel like there's a transparency with the scripts and what we're. The stories that we're telling. It's not polished off. It's, it's, it's a. It's a really honest and exciting endeavor that we're stepping into. And it's one that's like keeping our brains and fingers very active.

[Interviewer]

Well, I saw the way you just held the guitar there.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

One of the things that comes to playing Paul McCartney is playing left handed.

[Paul Mescal]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

You're not a lefty, I take it, so you're learning how to play left handed.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Paul Mescal]

Yeah. How's that going? Oh, there was a couple of dark months at the start of the year where I thought it was never going to happen, but it's, it's happening. It's, I'm really proud of the work that's like just tech, like film aside, like, it's definitely been the greatest technical challenge of, of my career. And I'm really proud with where we've, where we've gotten to with it.

[Interviewer]

Well, we can't wait to see it. And in the meantime, people are going to love Hamnet. You are brilliant in it. Jesse's brilliant. Jackabee, who we didn't get a chance to talk to is brilliant, the young boy. So congratulations.

[Paul Mescal]

Thanks very much.

[Interviewer]

Pleasure to talk to you, Paul.

[Willie Geist]

My big thanks again to Paul for a great conversation. Hamnet is just an amazing film and it is in theaters now. And as always, my thanks to all of you for listening again this week. If you want to hear more of our conversations with our our guests every week, be sure to click follow so you never miss an episode. And don't forget to tune in to Sunday Today every weekend over on NBC to see these interviews with your own two eyes. I'm Willie Geist. We'll see you right back here next week on the Sunday Sit down podcast.

[Commercial Narrator]

This year, perfect your morning routine with Nespresso Vertuo up with a three second start, easy open lever and dedicated coffee creations mode button. It's easier than ever to brew coffee with smooth flavor and rich crema over ice or milk. It's your coffee your way at the click of a button. Sip for yourself and shop vertuo [e-mail].