← Superwomen with Rebecca Minkoff
Superwomen with Rebecca Minkoff
The Secret to Building a Loyal Community: Vulnerability with Cameron Rogers
00:40:08
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- [00:01]
A
This episode is brought to you by Redfin. You're listening to a podcast, which means you're probably multitasking, maybe even scrolling home listings on Redfin, saving homes without expecting to get them. But Redfin isn't just built for endless browsing. It's built to help you find and own a home with agents who close twice as many deals. When you find the one, you've got a real shot at getting it. Get started@redfin.com own the dream protein is now at Starbucks and it's never tasted so good. You can add protein cold foam to your favorite drink or try one of our new protein lattes or Matcha. Try it today at Starbucks. Not sure how to tackle your taxes? Are you sweating the small print? You may be experiencing FOMO, the fear of messing up the answer. Using TurboTax on Intuit credit Karma. They help you get your biggest refund and then we help you do more with it with a personalized plan designed to help you hit your money goals. It's time to take your taxes to the max. Start filing today in the Credit Karma app. I love my DMs. I'm in there. I'm in my comments. Obviously, the downside of that is feeling exposed in a sense. Like, you know, not everyone's going to agree with my opinion at all. Not everyone's going to like me. That's fine.
- [01:27]
B
Hey, everyone. Welcome back to Superwomen. Today's guest is Cameron Oakes Rogers. You've listened to her forever on her amazing podcast conversations with Cam. She's a woman of all things. Like, I love watching her because I feel like she's talking to me directly. In this episode, we talk about how she's built her career. Listening to your gut and giving yourself six months to succeed before you throw in the towel. Take a lesson.
- [01:51]
A
I sat down and was like, how much money do I need to make a month to maintain this living? How much money am I willing to dip into my savings? And also how much money can I possibly make doing this? So I built out this business plan of sorts. Again, it's not at all what I'm doing now, but I did obviously, like sit down and crunch numbers and I gave myself six months, which I don't think is long enough. It's a lot of just adapting. And I am a very gut leaning person. Like, I trust my gut, I follow my gut. And following what really lights me up I think has always really benefited me.
- [02:22]
B
Foreign. I'm Rebecca Minkoff and this is Superwomen. Each week, inspiring Women are interviewed to uncover the unexpected journeys, the challenges, and the unwavering spirit that makes them powerful. Get ready to be motivated by stories of resilience and discover the keys to unlocking your own potential. I am so excited to have you on. When you reached out to me to have me on yours, I was so excited because I'm a big fan. So now we get to play the other role.
- [02:57]
A
Yeah. I can't wait.
- [02:58]
B
So obviously the world knows about your podcast conversations with Cab, your. Your amazing journals, and lots about your personal life.
- [03:09]
A
Yeah.
- [03:09]
B
Which I love that you share so much. And I'm like, I want to share that much, too. Like, one day, I'm going to get there.
- [03:14]
A
I never want to force someone to, like, step outside their comfort zone to share. If they're not comfortable sharing, then they
- [03:21]
B
shouldn't be in your podcast.
- [03:22]
A
No, no, no. I mean, like, I get that a lot of people being like, I wish I could open up as much on my social whatever. And I think the only reason I do is because it feels so normal to me. I don't even think about it.
- [03:33]
B
Right.
- [03:33]
A
And I don't know if I would encourage someone who doesn't feel so comfortable. You know what I mean?
- [03:39]
B
I do, because I struggle with it. When I'm talking to camera, I. The millennial in me is like, get it? No one wants to look at you talking. Don't do it. And so I sit there and, like, try to be like, I try and get in and get out real quick. I'm like, I'm having a hard day.
- [03:53]
A
Bye.
- [03:54]
B
It's so stupid because you do it so naturally. Like, I'm like, oh, she's just talking to me.
- [03:58]
A
Well, I just think about it ever since. It's funny because I remember when I started my account, my little sister said to me once, because at first, my account had no pictures of myself, it was not me at all. You would not know who I was. It was all food. And my little sister once said to me, when Instagram stories started, she was like, if you ever talk to your phone, I am taking your account away. And I was like, oh, my God, please do. I would never do that. But then I think the climate changed and that became more normal. And for me, I really treat it as I'm FaceTiming. I don't think about the amount of people who are consuming it or who those people are or that they may know me in some realm of real life. I'm just like, oh, I'm chatting with my girlfriends. Yeah.
- [04:39]
B
And it comes across that way, which I think is the magic of what you do. Thank you for those tuning in. You think we're gonna get into some juicier personal life? She's already shared them all. So let's talk about the business of you because you have evolved into so many different pillars that I feel like I want to understand. I guess the most important question is like, did you know an architect this or is it all been like, now I'm going to do this now this, now this.
- [05:03]
A
So when I first left like the corporate world to pursue what isn't even what I'm doing today, but I was doing in home like private chef work and health coaching and I aside of social media, but I had made no money on social media. I had maybe I actually keep telling myself I need to go find the number because I don't know what it is, but I think it was like under 5,000 followers and it was 2018. We didn't know the career of creators and we definitely weren't seeing people speak on it of how they were making money. So when I left the goal was I'm gonna meal prep for people, I'm gonna health coach and like, maybe I'll get one sponsored blog post a month, but that won't be my income. Cause I really didn't think you could make a career out of that. So I did that and I was like in people's homes and cooking for them and doing the whole thing. And I hit this point where I don't actually love being the in home client facing service. I also find this wildly overwhelming and I'm not making nearly as much money as I was in my old career. And if I'm not happier and I'm not less anxious, then like, why did I leave?
- [06:10]
B
So.
- [06:10]
A
So I took another leap of faith and that was when I really started to share about like myself, my mental health, my journey. I think the Instagram kind of stratosphere had changed a little bit. Again Instagram stories were introduced where you could actually like take a video. People were talking more and like sharing more of their journey. And that's just something I've always felt very comfortable with of like saying how I feel, saying what's on my mind, whether that's good or bad. It's definitely like come back to bite me a few times. But really, yeah, because I think in the beginning I was just like, here's everything, right? And since I've grown, I've, I've started to, you know, figure out what those boundaries are. But I started once I started sharing more about that. That was when I started to really feel like I was building a community. And that was also when I started my podcast. And that was just because I was like, I have more to say than these 15 second Instagram stories. I know all these great people, and I want to have these awesome conversations again. For three years, I made not one dollar on the show. I was just recording in my apartment. Like, I invited people to my home. We had no. There was no video. So I just, like, set up GarageBand with my laptop and the equipment I ordered on Amazon. And then I was editing the whole thing and then I was releasing it. So, like, I taught myself on YouTube how to do all those things. And once I started doing that, I was like, oh, I love this. And that was something I started focusing on. So it was a lot of trial and error. And I always say, like, say yes to everything once and decide if it's something you want to say yes to again. Because you never know if an opportunity is going to be something that you're like, oh, I really dislike this. Not for me, or, wow, that lit me up in a way I could have never imagined. And I want to really dive deeper into that. And so I started to focus more on my podcast and my general content. I stopped health coaching. I stopped meal prepping. And then when I became pregnant, that was really when everything shifted because I was like, oh, this is not at all what I expected. I was just really surprised by it. And I was one of the first friends of mine to get pregnant. So I started talking about that. And then the more I, you know, came into motherhood, I felt very passionately about maternal mental health and the motherhood journey and the trence, and I started sharing more about that, and I just started caring less about food, quite honestly. Like, food just was a thing that I enjoyed and ate, but it wasn't something that, like, was on my mind 24 7. And I think that was the natural progression of where my content went. And then again, like, the journal. I could have never dreamed of creating this product. It all kind of happened organically when you get into it, but I just find that you can sit down and, like, create this structure of your life. And I actually did an episode on this with my career coach, Megan Hellerer of, like, you can have this plan and look five years out and 10 years out and, like, grab onto it as tight as you can and white knuckle your way to make sure you stick to that plan, or you can have an idea and then like, see where the world kind of takes you.
- [09:03]
B
Yeah. Well, also five years, I feel like I'm only planning, like two months out.
- [09:07]
A
Right. And like, we have no idea what the future holds, especially in terms of technology and social media and TikTok could shut down, you know, all of those things. And so it's a lot of just adapting. And I am a very gut leaning person. Like, I trust my gut, I follow my gut. And following what really lights me up, I think has always really benefited me.
- [09:28]
B
Hey, everyone, sorry for the quick pause. I want to share something really exciting. Superwoman has a brand new YouTube channel. It's still under construction, but big things are coming in 2026. You'll find past episodes, new episodes, and some bonus content I cannot wait for you to see. Just search SuperWoman Media on YouTube and hit subscribe. You don't miss a thing. Okay, back to the pod. So when you're following your gut and you're following what lights you up, how long do you give yourself to say, okay, now this going to be a way to survive and, and make a living?
- [10:02]
A
Yeah. So when I left my job, which was like the first pivot of following my gut, I was in a place where I come from financial privilege in the sense that, like, I didn't have any student debt to pay off, so I was able to save when I was making a good salary in sales and trading. So I had this, like, net for myself. And I sat down and was like, how much money do I need to make a month to maintain this living? How much money am I willing to dip into my savings? And also, how much money can I possibly make doing this? So I built out this business plan of sorts. Again, it's not at all what I'm doing now.
- [10:36]
B
Right.
- [10:37]
A
But I did obviously, like, sit down and crunch numbers, and I gave myself six months, which I don't think is long enough, but.
- [10:43]
B
Well, I just had Rachel Mansfield on and she gave herself six months.
- [10:46]
A
Yeah. So I gave myself six months and I was like, let's see what happens again in that industry. I felt like I was leaving on really good terms with everyone. I felt like I was talent of sorts that could have been hired back. I could have always gone back, in my opinion. And so I had that also safety net. And six months. Then I pivoted again. I was like, all right, I'll give myself six months trying this. And I think when it comes to, like, the podcast, for example, I didn't monetize it until four years in, but there was no overhead. Other than my time. And at that point, I didn't have kids, and I was like, every free second is going into this. And I hustled and hustled and hustled, and it got to a point where I was able to monetize it. And that's great, but, you know, it would be very different right now in terms of the way podcasts are. The cost that you have to put into it. My time, I don't have the time that I once did to do all of that. So I think each one has been a little different. But also, as you mentioned, like, having different pillars of my business, I might be putting, like, I put way more time into my podcast, and it's only now starting to match financially, like, sponsored content on my page.
- [11:55]
B
Interesting.
- [11:56]
A
Yeah. So it's like, maybe it's not the smartest business move, but because I'm in a place where I'm okay, and I love that I'm willing to do that.
- [12:04]
B
I think people don't realize how much time with monetizing a podcast. It takes so much time. And, like, when I first started, I had whatever. I signed on with an agent, a reaction agency, and they, like, sold all these ads, and they just assumed based on my following that I would garner this amount of down deals. And when I didn't, I was like, that was your marketing plan. Like my Instagram. I thought you were guys knew what you were doing. And you thought I'd get 30,000 downloads, like, in my first episode, Go fuck yourself. I'm out. And then it was like the. The struggle of just. And hard learnings of, like, building this thing.
- [12:39]
A
It's a lot.
- [12:39]
B
It's a lot more than a lot or imagine.
- [12:42]
A
Yeah. And I get it. As a consumer, you're like, oh, it wasn't to this episode. And it was like 60 minutes and they just sat down and chat. But you're not thinking about the prep for the interview, the booking of the interview, the editing of the interview, all of the logistics that go into the show notes. It's a lot. And, you know, it's interesting. I don't know how you feel about this. I used to be, like, really caught up on that. Like, people thinking, oh, like, people think my job is easy. And I don't like that because I know how hard I work or, like, whatever. It used to be this, like, ding to my ego of people thinking this job is so easy, and it really, like, frustrated me, and I've completely let that go, which has been so freeing.
- [13:16]
B
Yeah. I think now I feel like, if someone thinks that, they're just ignorant.
- [13:20]
A
Yeah.
- [13:20]
B
Because every industry is hard and every industry has huge challenges. Even if people go, oh, it must be easy to be a model. No, it's not. It fucking sucks.
- [13:28]
A
Yeah. No, thank you. I don't want that at all. Thank you. I have heard horror stories from my friends.
- [13:34]
B
Oh, it's the worst. That's cruel. They think we have it hard. How do you manage your businesses? Because it's a lot. And like, I have. I think I have three businesses I don't even know. And it's a lot. And it feels like you're always shifting gears because you're in so many different choices. So take me through how you sort of structure that.
- [13:54]
A
When I had my second, it just became like so much I felt like, you know, those monkeys at the circus, like, banging those things. That's what my brain felt like 24 7. And I say that it felt like there were a hundred tabs open on a computer and someone else was controlling opening the tabs. Whereas now I feel like there are a hundred tabs open. Because I think that's just being a mom in today's world and working. But I'm in control of which tab I'm clicking. For me, it's a lot of time blocking. I am religious about my calendar and I really tried to dedicate if I know, for instance, like, I also have a running to do list on my notes app 247 that I'm adding things to. If I think about something, I don't put it down, it's gone forever, a hundred percent. So I put it down immediately and I find that the notes app in my phone, it's just like the easiest place for me to remember to do that. And that's the most important. And then the end of the day, like looking ahead to the next day or the week, I kind of like finagled those to do's in sure priority, but also like batching them in similar mindset. Because me getting on my phone and filming videos is a different mentality than me sitting down and editing a podcast like that. It's using a separate side of my brain in a sense. And so when you're switching back and forth like you mentioned, like, that's hard for me. And my brain needs a second to decompress between switching tasks, especially going from like mom to work, to mom to work, to wife to friend to mom to work. So I will sit down and be like, okay, if I have to edit this show, this show, this show that I know, I've recorded. Like, I'm gonna try and batch that into one larger workflow and really block that out in my calendar. It's not perfect.
- [15:34]
B
Right.
- [15:34]
A
But that's what I try to do. I also think I've created a really incredible group of all women that I work with who are great at their jobs. And I would like to think I let go of control. And so if they're owning something because they've shown that they can, I'm like, great. That is yours. Division of labor in the household with my husband and in work. Like, if you're owning something, I'm forgetting about it because I need that mental space.
- [16:01]
B
That's the only way to scale yourself.
- [16:03]
A
Yeah.
- [16:03]
B
Is that. And then you forget about it and you just go, I hope you have it. Like, I had that thought today. I was like, we have a huge conference tomorrow. We have 500 people coming. We have 40 speakers. And I was like, oh, someone's. I've compartmentalized and forgotten about the, like, nitty gritty doing it. Someone's doing it.
- [16:19]
A
I know my friends will be like, what's in your schedule for the week? And I'm like, I kind of wake up and I look. Because otherwise, I think I would go a little insane in my brain. I'm overwhelmed.
- [16:29]
B
Yeah. So you said something, which I don't. I feel I'm lacking in. You said you have work, kids. Then you said husband and friends.
- [16:45]
A
Yeah.
- [16:46]
B
So for me, in this season. I mean, I hate saying that word, but that's the only way that comes to mind. I can't figure out where to fit that in. And I can't.
- [16:55]
A
Husband, friends, or both.
- [16:56]
B
A husband has fit in because he lives with me.
- [16:59]
A
Yeah. But that doesn't mean. I will say, like, I know I have young kids. Well, too.
- [17:04]
B
Yeah.
- [17:04]
A
Like, just because we live together, I know we need to be better. Honestly, that's the one thing that, like, the two of us have to work on me more so. Because even though you live together, it's like, are you spending quality time together?
- [17:16]
B
But friends, like, at least from what I see, like, you are a great friend. You go on the trips. Yeah. Soak it up. And I'm like, I gotta get there. How do you let yourself do that? Or maybe you've managed to find the secret that we're all seeking. And how do you make sure that that stays consistent in your life?
- [17:35]
A
My female friendships are something I prioritize so deeply, and they always have been. I was raised by a mom of three girls who's incredibly close with her sisters, but also has always been a really good friend. And I was talking about this with her recently and in another episode where I was interviewing someone else and it came up where I watched my mom at a young age. Her two best friends through a 10 year window lost their husbands very tragically, very suddenly. With my dad actually kind of being there for both. It was the 9, 11 and then a tragedy of Hurricane Sandy and the way that my mom just opened every ounce of her being to her friends and poured into them to support them and their children and we kind of all blended into one family. And I think watching her do that at a young age really cemented something in my brain of how important female friendships are in all stages of life, but especially in tragedy. And also my mom was always someone who prioritized them. And I wouldn't say she. She definitely wasn't like going on the girls trips as a kid. I don't remember that. And I don't know if that was just like a different time or what, but there were always women in and out of our home. She was always having parties and dinners with them. And I'm so close with her close friends. And so I also felt that like I never called them aunt, but you know, that relationship, that was also so wonder to me. And I think loyalty has been something that my family just has instilled in us as kids. And I think it's helped me and it's hurt me in some friendships because, like, I will be so loyal. I'll pick a fight for someone that I don't need picked in college, for instance. But yeah, I just, I love my friendships and it's something that I really, really feel strongly about. And they have gotten me through some dark ass times and I am so grateful for them. And I think that connection is vital for me. It's like something that I deeply need to fill my cup. My husband and I talk about this a lot. We've been together since we were 16, so we've like watched each other grow in these like parallel lives that are on the same track kind of. And we've always been very independent while in our relationship and I think a lot of that comes from going to separate colleges. And we both played sports, so it was like there was no time to miss you or to be up all night. Facetiming like we just lived our separate lives and it's something that we've maintained in our marriage of like, we both know how important our friendships are to each other. And so his Time golfing with his guys and mine is my dinners with my girls or my longer girls trips. And I, I think we vowed to each other to like always allow space for the other to have that. And. Yeah. And I, I just love now especially, like, my kids are so close with my girlfriends, even, you know, some of them who live five minutes away and some of them who come and stay with us like a weekend every few months. It's so fun to watch that relationship also build between people who I love so much and then the ultimate person. I love my children.
- [20:47]
B
Yeah. We were the first to have kids amongst our friend group. Right now I'm like, I don't know where, how it would work. You know what I mean? Other than less time with my husband and less time with my kids, I've been like, all right, I guess I'm just gonna not have a lot of fats right now. Yeah. You know what I mean?
- [21:01]
A
Totally. And I also think it's. I have this friendship series on my show where I bring on friends and from different stages of my life. And I would say 99% of my friends are not in this industry. They're people who I grew up with. They're people I went to college with. They're people who I've met in my neighborhood. And that's very important to me, like, vital to me. And something we talk about a lot is having like a low maintenance friendship where, you know, I have people over all the time. Our house is a revolving door. Nothing makes me happier than having our, like, entryway filled with shoes. But, like, you're not getting this, like, perfectly curated charcuterie board and a set table and the house is clean. Because then I wouldn't host.
- [21:39]
B
Right. And not interrupted every five minutes.
- [21:41]
A
Right?
- [21:41]
B
Mommy, Mommy.
- [21:42]
A
And also when you're even chatting with your friends, that low maintenance of like, it's just a constant conversation. Whether we talked yesterday about our kid being up all night and now we're navigating some school drama, or we talked two months ago and it's just like, hey, I miss you. I love you. How are you thinking of you? Like, it's very low maintenance and when we see each other, it's great. It's just picked right back up.
- [22:05]
B
Yeah. And so have you had to evolve with your time blocking? Like, okay, this is the girls trips. This is the.
- [22:11]
A
Yeah.
- [22:12]
B
My husband. And adding that, like consciously adding that into your.
- [22:15]
A
Yes.
- [22:15]
B
Your structure.
- [22:16]
A
Again, time with my husband is something that, like, we keep being like, we need more date nights because we're really Good at spending time with our family. Yeah. With our kids. And we're really good at spending time with other families with our kids. But we're not great at like adult time.
- [22:31]
B
Right.
- [22:32]
A
And after we put the kids down, you know, all kind of work a decent amount at night and then it's like suddenly we're watching the show, we're falling asleep. So that's something we need to be better at. But yes, I think it has to be in your calendar, otherwise it's not happening. I have a friend who does date night every Thursday night. I'm like so amazed by.
- [22:47]
B
In awe.
- [22:48]
A
Her. In awe? In awe. Three kids, they live close to her in laws. So the in laws take the children, obviously. That's very nice. And I'm in awe. And we always say like, we should do that and we don't. But with the girls, dinners and trips. Yeah. I mean, it obviously has to go on the calendar, otherwise it's not happening. And I will say we also have the most incredible nanny in the entire world. I would take a bullet for her, Eddie. Die for her. She is my, like, saving grace. And I couldn't do any of this without her. And I think that's very important to always acknowledge. And my husband is the most.
- [23:21]
B
He's a dad. I'm shocked.
- [23:23]
A
Yeah. Equal partner where I leave the house. I'm not leaving a note. He's not my child.
- [23:27]
B
Right.
- [23:27]
A
He's the father of their children as well. Yes. So I'm able to go on a girls trip and I feel no guilt because everything's taken care of.
- [23:35]
B
So let's dive into the husband thing if you're keen to talk about it. Because I have an equal partner too.
- [23:39]
A
And we talk about this.
- [23:40]
B
Yes. But like people, it shocks me today that that's still a problem when women our age or that they think my husband doesn't work and he's full time dad and that's how I can do what I do. And I'm like, how are we in 2026? And you haven't had a fucking conversation that he's not the babysitter. Can't understand it. And I have close friends who have that. I gotta ask my husband and let me check with him. And I'm just like, why?
- [24:05]
A
Yeah, I mean, I understand. Look, obviously if I'm planning a trip, I'm like, I gotta run the date bot. But I'm not like, I don't need permission. And I also think there are a lot of married single mothers where you are married to someone.
- [24:21]
B
My brain for a second. Yes.
- [24:22]
A
But you are doing everything.
- [24:24]
B
Yes.
- [24:24]
A
And I talk about division of labor a ton because I feel so passionately about it. Beyond. I'm a huge Eve Rodsky fan. I'm familiar with her.
- [24:33]
B
I talk about her all the time. Okay.
- [24:34]
A
So we are big on that. And again, the mental load of things like, I don't know, trash days, recycling days. I don't know the tasks that he owns, because I just. It's. It's out of my brain.
- [24:47]
B
Right.
- [24:48]
A
And I own certain tasks that he doesn't have to think about, so that's out of his brain. And I think that that's the only way to operate a household and really getting clear on, like, who owns what. And Eve says this a lot. Like, it doesn't have to be equal, but it has to be equitable. Like, what is everyone bringing the table. Bringing to the table? Because every couple is going to be different, but it has to be equitable. And I think we found a place that we feel very comfortable with.
- [25:10]
B
And did you have to have that conversation? Was there a point in which you were like, whoa, we got to talk. I'm bringing out the cards.
- [25:18]
A
Yes.
- [25:18]
B
Let's deal them out.
- [25:19]
A
It's so funny. I remember when we first moved in,
- [25:21]
B
and this is before kids.
- [25:22]
A
Before kids.
- [25:23]
B
Okay.
- [25:23]
A
And it was my apartment that he moved into. So I think, like, that setup just kind of had me naturally, like, doing the things.
- [25:31]
B
Yeah.
- [25:31]
A
And I remember there being a toothpaste tube that was, like, running low. And suddenly I started thinking, if I don't refill this toothpaste tube, would he ever refill it? It's like, if there's no toilet paper left, would he buy the toilet paper? And so I hid a secret tube of toothpaste that I was using just to see what would happen. And it got to a point where I was like, have you noticed the toothpaste is out? Like, are you going to buy it? And again, we were so young at this age, and that was, like, the first moment that I think shifted. And I think because we've been together for so long, my friends joke that, like, I've trained him to be this way. But, like, I mean, I hate that it's even, like, a big deal that, like, he's emptying the dishwasher without me asking, or, like, he realizes we're in dishwasher detergent, so he goes to the store and gets it or adds it to our grocery list. But, like, I just can't comprehend being in a marriage where that isn't a standard.
- [26:26]
B
I can't either. But I think it's more than we imagine it is.
- [26:31]
A
I agree. My DMs are wild when I talk about this kind of stuff. We were going on a trip together, but actually separate trips. It was, it's kind of confusing. I had a family trip with the girls and he had a family trip with my dad and brother in laws and his parents were watching our kids. And the day before his parents came, he sent this like very detailed text to our group chat. He was like, hey, here's everything you need to know for the weekend. This is what time swim is. This is where swim is. I'll. A swim bag will be packed for the boys. This is where soccer is. This is the coded school. This is where the lunchbox goes, the nap gear, everything. And it was like extremely long. Yeah, I didn't ask him to send it.
- [27:04]
B
Right.
- [27:04]
A
And I texted him and I was like, I love you, thanks. And I mentioned it and people were like, how did this happen? I was in a room recently talking about this topic and I don't think this is a hot take, but maybe it's a little pushback on like what we're used to. You have to let, assuming a heterosexual relationship, you have to let your husband fail. You have to let him try and fail and then have the conversation of like, okay, what happened there? And how do we move forward from this so that it doesn't happen again? And I think so many of us are afraid to let them fail that we just take it off. And then slowly you start taking on everything.
- [27:41]
B
Right.
- [27:42]
A
And then you're in control of everything. And they're kind of like, well, why would I try? Because if I do it, it's that weaponized incompetence. If I do it, she's going to tell me I did it wrong or I don't know how to do it as well as her. And we almost set ourselves up and it's not the woman's fault, I'm not saying that, but we set up this circumstance for you to do everything and for them to just have it done and to then not think about it
- [28:03]
B
and it's out of their heads and
- [28:05]
A
then also to never even realize that it's happening behind the scenes.
- [28:08]
B
Right.
- [28:09]
A
And so I encourage everyone to, when you go away, don't leave a note. Like, I was with my friend once and her husband called and so he was, he's like, what do I feed her? And I looked at her and I was like, tell him to open the fucking Fridge. Why is he calling you asking what to feed your child? Like, you need to give them an opportunity to try and either prove you wrong and succeed and great and then you know, they can do it or to fail and be like, do you see why this is a problem? Do you see why you should be able to feed our child as their father?
- [28:41]
B
You know, I do know. I have, I have someone I know. And she was on her way to the airport and the husband called and said the baby just threw up. And she was like, do you want me to not get on the flight? Like, okay, right, like, okay, clean up the vomit. So you have a lot of passionate people and I know this because people feel connected to you in such a strong way.
- [29:04]
A
Yeah.
- [29:04]
B
What's the good and the bad of that for you?
- [29:07]
A
I mean, the good is obviously that like, it's helped me build this incredible career where like I get to do what I love and somehow make money and like support my family and live out this dream. And yeah, that's incredible. I also just really value connection. Like I am answering every single DM I receive, which people are like, that's insane. I love my DMs, I'm in there. I'm in my comments. I love community and connection and like feeling that relationship with people. Obviously the downside of that is feeling exposed in a sense. Like, you know, not everyone's going to agree with my opinion at all. Not everyone's gonna like me. That's fine. This industry is weird. Where in a typical world if some doesn't like you, you don't really know,
- [29:50]
B
but they know now.
- [29:52]
A
But like people like to tell you that they don't like you and I, as much as you can say, like, oh, that's their journey. And I've obviously like gotten a lot more comfortable with that stuff. Still hurts sometimes, especially when it's something that you've thought about yourself. Like, I have a very self critical voice that I've had to train for years. And so when you hear someone else say something you've thought about yourself, it's like, oh, that's true. Like that voice inside my head is suddenly loud and coming from someone else.
- [30:22]
B
It's the worst when that happens. Yeah, yeah, I had an onslaught of that recently when I was apparently voting for the wrong mayor and I had like, we're going to burn your bags. Like you're a has been throwing in the trash. And I was like, oh God, am I a husband? So do you have a method for dealing with that that you feel like has been helpful. No. Okay.
- [30:44]
A
I. Therapy.
- [30:45]
B
Okay.
- [30:45]
A
But I also think I feel strongly about my beliefs and I'm outspoken about them. Like, I talk a lot about politics, whereas a lot of people want to shy away from it or they're like, oh, don't go there. I've always gone there. I've always laid all my cards out on the table, understanding. Clearly we live in a world where, like, people have different opinions and gone into a place where, like, I'm okay with that. I'm okay with someone not liking me because they think I should have sleep trained my kid or not liking me because the way I speak, the way I curse. It is what it is.
- [31:17]
B
Right.
- [31:18]
A
And you know what I think about all the time? I don't like everyone.
- [31:21]
B
Right. True. My husband was like, I don't think you like almost anyone.
- [31:26]
A
There you go.
- [31:27]
B
Because I was lamenting about this friend thing and I was like, God, I want more friends. He's like, but you don't even like half the people f after a little bit.
- [31:34]
A
Okay, but do you feel like part of that is because. Are you looking for. Not looking for. But are you experiencing friendships in this industry? Because I think it's very different.
- [31:44]
B
I think that I sometimes go in with a false expectation because we're in the same industry, that we get along, we like each other, that then we're going to be friends. And then you peel the layer back and you're in. Both parties are like, oh, wait, no, I don't want to be your friend. Or you don't have time for a new friend. You know, and so it just gets complicated.
- [32:03]
A
Yeah, I get that.
- [32:04]
B
All my childhood friends don't live around. And all my four friends, we all separated, like Toronto, Hamptons, like, so everyone's in a different place. So that group now is fragmented. So you don't get the. Like, you're a group.
- [32:15]
A
Yeah. Which I think I've been so blessed by growing up in New Jersey and then going to a college in the tri state area. And then we all kind of moved to New York and then some people stayed in New York and then some of us moved to New Jersey. Like, I've been very fortunate. And even with my neighborhood, like, I just got so, so lucky. I moved in and the girl directly in the house next door to me, like, popped up in my driveway and was like, hey, I hear you play lacrosse in college. So did I. I'm like, what year were you? What school did you go to? And we're like the same human. And she had a Group. And so I do feel part of it has been luck.
- [32:45]
B
Yeah.
- [32:46]
A
And I think when it's interesting, because within this industry, I have some. I have like one very close friend who I'm extremely close with, and we're talking all the time. And we're not talking about work necessarily, but if we need to, it's helpful to have someone to, like, discuss that with. And then I have, like, acquaintances in this industry who I love, but they're not the one that I'm. I'm calling a girlfriend maybe five times a day and they're not the ones I'm calling.
- [33:11]
B
Yes.
- [33:11]
A
Yeah. If that makes sense.
- [33:12]
B
Yeah, no, it makes total sense. And it's a smart way to approach it because then you're not just like, why didn't they call me? Why didn't they want to, you know, like, yeah, that dumb high school that I think goes on in our industry.
- [33:21]
A
Totally. And I think friendships serve a purpose. Yeah, I say that a lot. Like, not in a bad way, but friendships in this industry serve a purpose of, like, it's really nice to be able to talk to someone who gets it. It's really nice to be someone to talk to someone of, like, the ins and outs of business and brand deals and all of those things. And sure, they're hopefully a great person. And then a friendship of like, my best friend from second grade will always understand everything without me having to give any context. She gets it. Yeah. And there are friends who are going to serve the purpose of. They have kids the exact same age as you and, like, how great that is.
- [33:59]
B
It's so great when you're in it. That's my qualifier. The dads like each other and the kids like each other. New friends.
- [34:05]
A
Yes. Yes. Every friendship is going to serve something different. And that's okay.
- [34:11]
B
Yeah. And then I have two more questions for you. We were debating a name change, which I don't think I'm going to do for the podcast, maybe calling it the Morning after, but I was like, I don't know. But like the morning after a big challenge or the morning after, like an awesome moment that happened. So you can pick your poison, a good time or a bad time. But, like, take me through what that was and then what you did the morning after.
- [34:32]
A
My son last night, my 2 year old has basically gets a cold every month like every young child in school, and then it turns into a cough. And when he gets a cough, he gets croup. And when he gets croup, I have to sleep with it. It's this whole thing. So today was a city day for me, which, like now are few and far between, but like adding in the morning commute at close drop off all of the things. Also, if I'm a guest, like, I want to make sure I'm ready. I'm on et cetera. And we're getting into bed, my husband and I, and we start hearing the cough and we're like, fuck. So we go in, we do nebulizer, we're like, okay. We get back in bed, we hear the cough again and then we. He's coughed so hard that he's not thrown up, like from all the saliva and mucus that's like his stuck the phlegm. So we clean it all up and I'm like, clearly I'm sleeping with him tonight. And I don't know about you, some one of my children, I can kind of sleep with the other one. I mean, they both are barnacles. They need to be all over me. But my younger one specifically wants to lay on my head.
- [35:28]
B
You want to sleep frolic in your uterus.
- [35:30]
A
So he's like on top of me and every five seconds is coughing and I'm terrified he's going to cough somewhere. He throws up on me. So I'm up. So then I have a lot of sleep anxiety. So I'm like spiraling. It's 11 o'. Clock. I'm like, I'm not gonna sleep tonight. I'm gonna be so off tomorrow. I'm gonna have to text Rebecca. I'm gonna have to cancel. I'm gonna feel so badly because it's gonna be last minute. What am I gonna do? Like, my brain spirals at night and I was pretty much up all night and you don't look like it. Thank you. The morning after is I woke up and my husband. I looked at each other and we were like, that was a fucking shit show night. And of course our older son got up at the crack of dawn and wants to watch the sunrise. And. And we look at each other and we're like, that sucked. But we can do this. Like, we can do hard things. Let's go. And I think that those mornings are where I'm the most proud of myself because I'm able to turn it around. And it's not a hundred percent, but the days where I am like today, I'm like, awesome. I was able to really show up for my kid and help him and support him. And even though it sucked, I can still have my day and like, do what I want to do for my work.
- [36:37]
B
Yeah. I think it's those critical moments where you're like, I could let this ruin everything, or I can just come up, muster through, like, pushing out a baby and just get my shit done.
- [36:46]
A
Yes.
- [36:46]
B
I love that. So, last question. What is a piece of advice you'd like to relay? Something you learned the hard way or some advice someone else gave you that you want to pass on?
- [36:58]
A
I would say the biggest piece of advice I always give is to stay true to yourself. I give that advice a lot to people who are, like, looking to be in this industry, but I think it's relevant to anything. If you try to be someone else, people are just going to want to be with either friends or follow the person you're trying to be. You know, like, be yourself. And I think by being true to yourself and like, really being honest with yourself first and then with everyone else, you'll find the people that are meant for you because not everyone's meant for you. But you'll test out those waters and it'll be a lot clearer if you're yourself from the very beginning.
- [37:36]
B
Yeah. And not tempted by the success. Shiny free gifting or.
- [37:43]
A
Yeah.
- [37:44]
B
Or the, like, cutting the line. Like, you can't let that fucking fuck you up.
- [37:48]
A
Totally. And I think it's really easy to
- [37:50]
B
do in this industry, seeing a lot of people.
- [37:52]
A
Yeah.
- [37:52]
B
Yeah.
- [37:53]
A
And to be like, oh, this shiny thing. Oh, that shiny thing. I want this. I want that. And I think staying true to yourself is the greatest gift you can give yourself.
- [38:01]
B
I love that. So where can people listen to you? Find you by the journey.
- [38:05]
A
Yeah. Okay. Instagram and TikTok is @cameronokesrogers. The podcast is Conversations with Cam. We release a new episode every Wednesday. You can get it anywhere. You listen to your podcasts and then the journal and coloring affirmation book. We have two adult editions and a kids edition, which I love you, doll, cause it's what I use. But the kids is like my baby. And I love it so much. I have to send it to you for your children.
- [38:26]
B
I know they'd love it.
- [38:27]
A
Quiet-your-mind.com okay, awesome.
- [38:31]
B
Thank you.
- [38:32]
A
It was so fun. Thank you so much.
- [38:33]
B
Thank you so much for watching today's episode. Before you head out, I wanted to invite you to our brand new YouTube channel for all things superwomen. It's a fresh space we're building out for 2026, packed with past episodes, future episodes and some space special new content we're cooking up. Just search SuperWoman Media on YouTube and subscribe so you're there for everything coming next. I will see you over there. Thanks for listening to today's episode. If you've enjoyed it, take a second to rate and review the show wherever you're tuning in. It really helps others find the podcast. You can follow me on Instagram Rebecca Minkoff and at rmsuperwoman or for a slice into my personal life, Becky Minkoff. And don't forget to check out my book Fearless the New Rules for Unlocking Creativity, Courage and Success. See you next week.
- [39:23]
A
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