The Portfolio Behind 5% of U.S. GDP: Link Logistics on What’s Driving Demand

Summary

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Podcast Summary: “The Portfolio Behind 5% of U.S. GDP: Link Logistics on What’s Driving Demand”

Supply Chain Now | November 12, 2025
Host: Scott Luton
Guests: Brandon Page (EVP, Link Logistics), Glenn Wy (Senior Managing Director, East Region, Link Logistics), Ward Richmond (Real Estate Advisor/Industry Expert)

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Episode Overview

This episode of Supply Chain Now reunites hosts Scott Luton and Ward Richmond with industry leaders Brandon Page and Glenn Wy of Link Logistics. The discussion dives deep into the dynamic world of industrial real estate, highlighting demand drivers, post-pandemic shifts, new trends, and how AI and technology are reshaping the industry. The conversation is rich in actionable insights, drawing on panelists’ hands-on experience across markets that constitute 5% of U.S. GDP. The episode strikes a balance between high-level strategy and market-level nuance, addressing everything from emerging industry impacts to the role of relationships and technology in market resilience.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Introductions & Industry Backgrounds (02:06 – 11:05)

• Link Logistics Scope:
  • Nearly 3,000 buildings, 500M sq. ft. coast to coast, 8,000 customers.
  • “5% of U.S. GDP runs through our facilities.” — Brandon Page [09:55]
• Roles of Guests:
  • Brandon — EVP, leasing, customer solutions, credit risk, and supply chain board.
  • Glenn — Senior Managing Director, East Region (Boston to Miami), oversees 130M sq. ft. and 125+ team members.

How Industrial Real Estate Has Changed Since 2022 (13:52 – 18:29)

• 2022 as the Peak:
  • “It was a once-in-a-career cycle—relentless demand, record high leasing, record-low vacancy, record-high rent growth... It was just like the perfect storm from a landlord's perspective.” — Brandon [13:54]
• Shift to Cautious Decision-Making:
  • “It’s become much more methodical, calculated, risk averse.” — Brandon [14:37]
  • Customers now “double, triple check” before committing; process is drawn out.
• Tenant Experience:
  • Ward: Post-pandemic, tenants were often left with too much space, resulting in a new, conservative approach to real estate decisions. [16:42]
• Important Analogy:
  • “You were fine driving the rickety old truck until you got in a brand new BMW and then your truck didn't look so great. It's sort of that sports car vs. steady Eddie truck.” — Brandon [18:06]

Biggest Post-Pandemic Surprises (19:06 – 21:28)

• Resilience of Industrial Returns:
  • “Consumers want products faster. E-commerce penetration continues. Onshoring and nearshoring have provided real tailwinds.” — Brandon [19:36]
• Enduring Importance of Relationships:
  • “Two things really matter: relationships, and getting product to consumers as quickly as possible.” — Glenn [19:57]
• Core Takeaway:
  • “Relationships are everything.” — Ward [21:45]

Top Demand Drivers in Industrial Real Estate (23:52 – 27:14)

• E-Commerce:
  • “Still a massive driver. Delivery times are shrinking—what started as 3-5 days is now same day. It's only going to get faster.” — Glenn [23:52, 19:57]
  • 95% of Link’s buildings are within a 1-hour drive of 1M+ people.
• Domestic Manufacturing:
  • “We’re seeing more local groups and 3PLs taking space to enhance delivery efficiencies. Manufacturing demand takes longer to play through but is significant.” — Glenn [24:41]
• Data Centers:
  • Industrial space needed in proximity for both construction and ongoing service support. [25:41]
• 3PLs (Third-Party Logistics):
  • “Historically 25-30% of leasing; last year dipped to 15-18%, now north of 30%... 3PL allows quick market entry and flexibility for users.” — Brandon [26:00]
• Ward’s Industry Lens:
  • “There are three PL real estate brokers—it’s its own operation... Extreme flexibility, very fast-moving.”

Bonded Warehouses, FTZs & Mitigating Uncertainty (29:06 – 33:09)

• Bonded Warehouses Not A Panacea:
  • “You’re not avoiding taxes, just delaying them... It’s usually tenant-specific, often portions of facilities within 3PLs.” — Brandon [29:49]
  • “Quite an arduous process...which is why most people run them through 3PLs.” [31:44]
• Ward’s Take:
  • “Bonded warehousing was like playing blackjack for newbies trying to capitalize on tariff swings… Most established 3PLs, that’s their core business.” [32:13]

Current Market Supply & Regional Dynamics (40:00 – 52:03)

• Supply Equilibrium:
  • “It’s extremely nuanced – markets can be over- or under-supplied even within the same city.” — Glenn [40:22]
  • “Bulk space (400,000+ sq. ft.) oversupplied; sub-150,000 sq. ft. very tight.”
  • “Construction starts are at historic lows; we’re a couple of buildings away in some markets from ‘too much’ to ‘no supply.’” — Brandon [41:56]
• Region Hotspots:
  • Houston cited as potentially “the healthiest US industrial market right now.” — Brandon [46:59]
  • Sunbelt cities (Atlanta, Charlotte, Nashville, Dallas, Phoenix, Miami) highlighted for dynamic activity. [44:59]
• Volatility of Options:
  • “Markets can shift fast; five options one day, zero the next.” — Ward [48:08, 49:46]

Customer Priorities & Headwinds (36:09 – 38:32; 52:37 – 57:25)

• Flexibility & Optimization:
  • “Corporate users have been on the sidelines; uncertainty and margin pressure make big capital investments hard. Customers crave flexibility and warehouse efficiency.” — Brandon [36:09]
  • “Today’s biggest customer focus is on optimization—inventories, right-sizing, power for automation.” — Glenn [37:21]
• Response Time:
  • “Customers value extreme speed and patience. Analysis paralysis interspersed with urgency—data-driven decisions now dominate.” — Ward [38:32]
• Top Headwinds:
  • Economic uncertainty, consumer health, and slower customer decision-making. [52:48]
• Market Stability:
  • “If you strip away big-picture uncertainty, the fundamentals on the ground feel pretty stable.” — Glenn [52:48]

The Role of AI & Technology (52:37 – 59:39)

• Three AI Focus Areas at Link Logistics:
  • Productivity, Automation, Insights/Data (“We have data scientists and a rent modeling tool analyzing billions of data points.”) — Glenn [53:54]
  • “Data will be a key differentiator in the future.” — Brandon [55:17]
  • “Imagine having two bots put together a lease in 15 seconds… That’s a realistic concept.” — Brandon [55:57]
• AI Perspective:
  • “I think AI is at the pre-email/Internet stage—it’s so early, but it’ll expand exponentially... Core human relationships will become even more important as other jobs are automated.” — Ward [58:07]

Market Misconceptions (60:23 – 63:34)

• Not Just a Big-Box/Fortune 50 Game:
  • “Most of our leases are with small, regional businesses… It’s entrepreneurship on display and the backbone of America.” — Brandon [60:23]
• Industrial Is Not a Commodity:
  • “10-20 years ago, it was just a ‘box’—today, you need power, data, fiber, right configuration, and to be positioned for future trends.” — Glenn [61:21]
• Industrial’s Hidden Role:
  • “Most people do not know industrial real estate exists until you notice—and then you can't unsee it. You see the whole supply chain working within those walls.” — Ward [63:14]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “5% of U.S. GDP runs through our facilities.”
  — Brandon Page [09:55]

• "The lease it now and figure it out later mentality is definitely to the wayside."
  — Brandon Page [14:37]

• "Relationships are everything and getting product to customers more efficiently—that's not going to slow down."
  — Glenn Wy [19:57]

• "Imagine having two bots put together a lease in 15 seconds—that's a realistic concept."
  — Brandon Page [55:57]

• “AI is at the pre-email/Internet stage—we can’t predict what it will do to society.”
  — Ward Richmond [58:07]

• “The coolest thing about industrial real estate: Most people do not even know that it exists—until it can't be unseen.”
  — Ward Richmond [63:14]

• “We're in a balanced market; this era requires flexibility and relationships still trump everything.”
  — Ward Richmond [65:44]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Introductions & Company/Role Backgrounds: 02:06–11:05
• Market Changes Since 2022: 13:52–18:29
• Biggest Surprises Post-Pandemic: 19:06–21:28
• Top Demand Drivers: 23:52–27:14
• Bonded Warehouses & FTZs: 29:06–33:09
• Market Supply & Regional Dynamics: 40:00–52:03
• Customer Priorities & Headwinds: 36:09–38:32, 52:37–57:25
• The Role of AI & Tech: 52:37–59:39
• Misconceptions: 60:23–63:34
• Closing Takeaways & Key Lessons: 65:44–66:07

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Conclusion & Key Takeaways

• Market Philosophy:
  The industrial real estate market has swung from historic highs to a measured, balanced period prioritizing flexibility, optimization, and resilience.
• Technology & Relationships:
  The integration of AI/data will enable smarter, faster decisions, but the industry will always hinge on relationships and on-the-ground knowledge.
• For Newcomers:
  Industrial real estate is complex and deeply entrepreneurial—80%+ of deals are with small/local companies. Not just the realm of Fortune 50.
• Strategic Outlook:
  Stability is desirable after years of volatility, but continued headwinds and rapid tech shifts require an adaptable approach.
• Industry Advice:
  Flexibility, speed, and strong relationships are the keys to thriving in today’s environment.

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Contact Info:

• Link Logistics: linklogistics.com / LinkedIn (Brandon Page, Glenn Wy)
• Ward Richmond: Industry events, podcast “Trucking On,” LinkedIn

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This episode is a must-listen for supply chain professionals, real estate practitioners, or anyone tracking the pulse of American industry and logistics.

Transcript

[A]

So, hey, good morning, good afternoon, good evening, wherever you may be. Scott Luton and the one and only Ward Richmond here with you on supply chain now. Welcome to today's show. Ward, how you doing today?

[B]

Great to be here with you. I'm. I'm doing just fine. It's beautiful fall weather here in Dallas and happy to be back on the show.

[A]

It is the greatest blast from the past. Great to see a great friend and a big industry leader, especially for the show we're having here today. So look, looking forward to getting your color commentary throughout this great episode. But, Ward, if some of our audience members recall, we hosted an entire series back in the day all focused on supply chain real estate. Those are some good times, huh?

[B]

They were great times. And I really miss coming out to Atlanta all the time to record live in person with you. We had such a good time at your studio and all that.

[A]

Well, we're gonna do it again soon. And maybe this great show we got here today is going to help us move in that direction. But today, folks, we're running it back along those lines as we've assembled one heck of a panel of industry leaders to help us all better understand a variety of things. Get your pencils ready. Some of the top industrial real estate demand drivers right now. How emerging industries are factoring into the whole equation. Hey, what are a few of the most dynamic markets? What are some of the biggest headwinds that business leaders, especially in real estate, are being faced with? And how are leading supply chain firms leveraging AI and all the other innovative technology out there to advance and break new ground, solve old problems, solve new problems and all that? So much more. Ward, given all of your significant contributions in this space, I'm looking forward to your take on these topics and more.

[C]

Day.

[A]

You ready? You buckled in? Ready to go?

[B]

Ready to go, Scott. Let's do this thing.

[A]

Or you're always ready to go. So folks out there stick around for a great conversation. It's going to offer up tons of actual insights by the truckload. And if they're not actionable, just how good are they? I don't know. Oh, let's welcome in our wonderful guest joining us today, Brandon Page, executive vice president, head of leasing and customer solutions with Link Logistics. Brandon, how you doing?

[C]

I'm doing great. Thanks for having me.

[A]

Great to have you back, my friend. And y' all have continued moving mountains since last time you joined us. We're going to touch on that in just a second. And you're bringing another dynamo with you. Glenn Wy, Senior Managing director, East Region with Link Logistics. Glenn, how you doing?

[D]

Hey, great. Good to see you. Thanks for having us. Ward, good to see you, buddy.

[B]

Yes, sir. Good to see you guys.

[A]

Ward, not taking anything away from your dot, your accent, but Glenn, you take me back like I'm back in Akin county playing football on Saturdays. I swear we might be second cousins, my friend. We could be. We could be. So. But Brandon, last time you joined us, we talked about your, your baseball prowess because as much progress you got in real estate, man, you were quite the baseball player back in the day. You were a pitcher on the University of Utah baseball team, AKA the Utes. And currently you coach your son's baseball team. I gotta ask you, as part of our fun warm up question, what's been one of your favorite baseball experiences? Probably not a very fair question, but Brandon, what say you?

[C]

I do have a. It's one of my favorite stories of when I was playing. This is a long time ago. We're all, we're all has beens now, but we were, we were actually playing Wichita State on the road. And you know, back in the late 90s, Wichita State was a perennial top five program where the mighty Utah Utes coming out of the gym into Witcha. It's like 20 degrees, this is like mid February. And we were actually pretty good. We, we touched the upper half of the top 25, but I still think that's part of the top 25. My freshman year, but I'm this, you know, wide eyed kid from Billings, Montana, no idea what's going on. We go out there and absolutely smack Wichita saved. First game I came in, I actually got saved one of my like career highlights, which, which was awesome. That's not the funny part. The best part, which is the funny part is the next day we went to warm up, we had a doubleheader, it was on a Saturday, played Friday night, and a double header Saturday and flew out and the team was nowhere to be found. And like never saw them coming out and hitting, never saw them taking infield. They didn't even play catch. I'm like, well, it's kind of weird. It's cold out, maybe they're just inside. And they walked out on the field and absolutely drubbed us for two straight games. And I think like at the time I didn't really understand, but the reality is we were never supposed to go in there and beat them in the first place. And the fact that they didn't even pray, they didn't even give us the respect to actually Warm up. And they just came out and pounded us for. Oh, my God. Great games. It's a. It's a classic, classic story.

[A]

Oh, man, that is a good one. Now, now, Ward, have you ever been to Witch Kansas?

[B]

Yes, I have.

[A]

Really?

[B]

I went there when I toured in my band when I was in my 20s. Really?

[A]

Okay, so we're gonna have to all exchange some other witch toss stories after this podcast. But, Brandon, one more quick question. What was your go to pitch? Being a bit closer out of the. The ute bullpen.

[C]

I definitely was a plus slider. I. You know, nowadays guys throw 100 miles an hour. I don't think anybody did back then. We were. If you hit 90, you were. You were good. But I was. I was definitely a A plus plus slider, which got me out of a lot of jams and.

[A]

Oh, man.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Love it. Love it. We'll see. We'll see if your son follows in your footsteps.

[C]

We're working on it. Yeah, we're working on it.

[A]

All right, Glenn, you and I have a lot of things in common, as I was kind of alluding to earlier. But what we hear is when you're not doing big things in real estate and industry, we can find Glenn and your family on a boat or at a Clemson football game. Go Tigers. When he win. And especially maybe in the tailgate section of those football games. I got to ask you, Glenn, we really know comfort food this season. What's been your go to tailgate food when you're up there for a football game?

[D]

Yeah, I would say the tailgate for Clemson this year is much more exciting than the performance on the field.

[C]

So.

[D]

You know, we've tried it all. We've had barbecue, we've had burgers, you know, the casseroles. You try to get fancy at times to do some shrimp and grits. But you know, the one thing that really, it always gets eaten and the people in the Southeast will be. It's the public's popcorn chicken. Yes, it doesn't matter if it's hot out of the fryer. Has been sitting there all day. It is always gone at the end of the day. So I wish I had some fancy family recipe that I could give your listeners, but no, it's simply small fried.

[C]

Chicken bites at the end of the day.

[A]

Go to Publix, Glenn, let's go to Publix.

[C]

Right?

[D]

That's right. That's right.

[A]

You're spot on. And everybody loves popping into Publix and. Or calling those orders in. I've spoken to several public Store managers, because of the demand for their chickens off the charts, they can't hire enough talent to keep those, those chicken factories going because everybody goes to a game. All right, so Ward, he rattled off. Glenn, rattle off, let's see. Barbecue casserole, shrimp of grits and publix chicken. Out of all those, Ward, what's your favorite?

[B]

Oh, I'm gonna have to go with the cheeseburger, man. Like straight up cheeseburger at a tailgate. You can't go wrong with that.

[D]

You cannot go wrong with it. Cannot go wrong.

[A]

Okay. All right. So Brandon and Glenn, I can't wait to learn a lot more from you both, especially when it comes to industry, real estate. But hey, Ward, you've had no shortage of projects outside of of industry since we had that great series back in the day. You've got trucking on your own podcast series, which is Eclipse. 150 episodes. Outstanding. And when you don't tour the world like you used to, but I still see you cranking out great music, I gotta ask you, what's one been one of your favorite recent new songs or conversations?

[B]

Okay, that. Well, are you talking about one of my songs or a. Or like one of my favorite songs that I've heard?

[A]

One of your favorite new songs.

[B]

Okay, yeah. Well, I just released a song and it's called the non Alcoholic Beer drinking Man. So I would highly suggest you go check that out on Spotify. It's under my name and as you know, I'm a non alcoholic beer drinking man. I stopped drinking alcohol in a few years ago and so I wrote a song about it.

[A]

Oh, I love it.

[B]

I'll tell you, I saw a meme on the Internet and it showed a guy who looked a little beaten down by life and he was drinking in oul and the meme said when you see someone drinking a non alcoholic beer, you know they've seen some stuff. So then I wrote a song about it.

[A]

I love it, Ward. Keep up the great work, man. I love the creative side. Of course. I'm a big fan of what you do out in industry and we've got a great. Between you and Glenn and Brandon, we got got a bust of industrial real estate movers shakers here. So let's get on in the business. Our main theme here today of course is going to be supply chain real estate. Right. I want to level set on some topics first though, especially Brandon and Glenn. Brandon, if you would, for those that are newer audience members that may have missed your interview from two or three years ago, tell us Briefly about yourself and in a nutshell, what Link Logistics does.

[C]

Yeah, sounds great. I'm link's EVP of leasing lead, our customer solutions group, oversee our credit risk management team, and then we have an internal supply chain board that I help manage as well. I'm based out of Park City. I'm actually coming in to you live today from New York City, meeting with our supply chain board here tomorrow as well. I started back with Blackstone in 2013 with their original industrial platform InCoR Properties that was ultimately sold to GLP. I rejoined Blackstone in 2017 when they decided they wanted to have a long standing industrial presence that sort of became Link Logistics. Link Logistics Today operates nearly 3,000 buildings totaling, you know, roughly 500 million square feet coast to coast. You know, 8,000 different customers and 3,000 individual assets. So it's a, it's a really big portfolio, coast to coast thing. We like to tout that, you know, 5% of us GDP runs through our facilities.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

You know, most of my efforts today really revolve around helping customers in helping position Link as a partner of choice with our customers and most active occupiers. That basically means I spend too much time on an airplane meeting with both brokers as well as the large occupiers and, you know, trying to figure out how do we do more business with them.

[A]

Outstanding. The in person is still. We've come a long way remotely, but the in person, especially closing big deals, is almost irreplaceable. And I'm assuming, Brandon, when you said Park City, you're not talking Park City, Kansas, you're probably talking Park City, Utah, is that right?

[C]

Correct. Yeah, this is a Park City, Utah. A little bit higher elevation than the Kansas. Still probably cold, same as I remember. Yeah, same amount of cold, but just a lot.

[A]

Probably a lot bigger. A lot more snow. Snow skiing too, probably. All right, Glenn, now that we've got the run done on Brandon and what Link Logistics does, and I love that 5, 5% GDP figure. Glenn, tell us about your role.

[D]

Yeah, I'm senior managing director for the east region at Link and really responsible for the full operating performance of the region. And for us, it's about 130 million square feet. We have offices in portfolio from Boston to Miami. It's about 125 leasing, management and construction team members dedicated strictly to the east region. Been in the industrial world now, gosh, almost 20 years. Started with a group called CV Richard Ellis Realty Trust. Through several mergers, acquisitions, few more gray hairs. Found myself at Link and similar to Brandon have been here since Link's inception about seven years ago.

[A]

Outstanding. Outstanding. And Boston to Miami. There was probably some big similarities and some really big differences between those two markets.

[D]

Glenn, my guess is we'll get into that at some point in this discussion.

[A]

Undoubtedly. Ward, Now I gotta ask you now that we. I've learned more about both Brandon and Glenn. Do you ever see these guys out industry making it happen, conferences, you know, dealership?

[B]

I do. I was about to say we should have done this podcast when we were all intellide this summer. So that's the last time I saw. We were all three together there in June and. But yeah, I've, I, I work on transactions with Link there. I just did a deal with them in Dallas that I got wrapped up and we got one done in Miami as well in Glenn's region. And it's, it's always great to work with these guys and fun to be on here the podcast today.

[A]

Outstanding. And Ward, when I was with you in Dallas, not as exciting as Telluride, but we. I was learning about a Dallas stock exchange are opening up out in Dallas. Has that come to fruition yet?

[B]

Ward, I have no idea on that. I probably should. I don't know if you knew this about me, but I don't read, I don't watch or read the news really. I stopped doing that. I only read the Wall Street Journal supply chain and logistics report. You would appreciate that. And then I, I don't really pay attention to too much else, but I definitely am not aware of the Dallas Stock Exchange. I probably should be, but there you go.

[A]

How about that?

[B]

Everything life simple.

[A]

Hey, simplicity is a great thing. Everything's bigger in Texas to our listeners out there. Check that out. How about that? It's gonna rival the New York Stock Exchange. Okay, so we referenced earlier Glenn, Brandon and Ward that we interviewed you, Brandon and a colleague on supply chain now about three years ago. And man, so much has changed in three months and certainly three years ago. So Brandon, tell me if what, how has the industrial real estate sector changed the most? What's a couple of your top observations in terms of how the market looked three years ago?

[C]

Yeah, I often joke like could we be teleported back to 2022? It was a little bit more fun from the landlord side than it has been here over the last couple of years. The reality is that was like a once in a career cycle. Relentless demand, record high leasing, record low vacancy, record high rent growth. I mean it was just like the perfect storm from a landlord's perspective. You know, it's also not sustainable. It's probably not the healthiest of markets either. Trees don't you know, grow forever as we say. So you know, I hope I'm wrong. I hope demand comes back to that point. But you know, I would say as we look at you know, benchmarking market stats year to year, Covid years sort of, you sort of take them out of the equation. You kind of look Back to like 19, how is demand and how's occupancy and all those relative and you just sort of take those couple of years out because it was such a, I would say it's really, really become a much more methodical, calculated, risk averse customer base and they feel the pressure. There's, there's rising costs in all aspects of their business, shrinking margins and, and, and you do have availability in most markets. So it, it the lease it now and figure it out later mentality is definitely to the wayside. And there's a lot more emphasis on you know, checking, double checking, triple checking, multiple levels, approvals, etc that, that draw the process out.

[A]

So not so much wild, wild west in this space as opposed to three years ago. That phrase you said lease it and figure it out later. Interesting times, interest, a lot more focus and targeting. Glenn, what do you see how things have evolved in the last three years?

[D]

Yeah, I mean Brandon touched on it. So 22 I guess would have been that time frame. We were coming off one of the hottest real estate cycles that was reflected in a lot of our numbers. Downtime was significantly reduced from where it is today. Rates were continuing to climb at a pretty rapid pace in most of the markets that we cover and own in. And to Brandon's point, customers lacked options. It created this frenzied leasing environment. Fast forward to today and customer decision making is much more thorough. It's taking longer. We see obviously that reflected in the numbers. You're playing through some uncertainty in the economy. You layer in automation, new power requirements for our customers. We have certain markets that are undersupplied. We have certain markets that have higher availability. I'm sure we'll get into it, but you layer in AI and I mean frankly it's, it's a really fun time to be in this business and see where everything is, is trending.

[A]

I'm with you. And we're gonna get it. You're right, we're gonna get into all of that and then some. Ward we've heard there from Brandon and Glenn how things evolved in the last three years. Are you seeing a Lot of the same.

[B]

Yeah, very much of the same. And yeah, the COVID years and, you know, the post pandemic boom that occurred, it really made it a tough market to do deals as a person that represents tenants in the marketplace because the supply was so limited and the rates were skyrocketing. And then it swung back down. And a lot of, I mean, a lot of the users were scrambling to get space as fast as possible during that time because there was such limited space. And then when the E commerce numbers dropped back down and that demand shifted, I mean, really, a lot of tenants were stuck with way too much space, which has led to very like a newly conservative approach that I've never really witnessed until in recent years. And I think there was wrapping their arms around what is this new conservative approach going to be moving forward so we don't get in the situation again? And I feel like that's kind of started to level out now and everybody's got a new grasp on how decisions are going to be made, which is a new. A new way. And yeah, and hope. I mean, I'm hopeful it just remains like a nice steady growth pattern like we witnessed for the decade before COVID decade plus. And I think that makes everybody's lives better.

[A]

Yeah, I'm with you.

[C]

Those are good times too. Like, I think we all forget, like, you know, the markets don't feel fantastic, but the reality is pre Covid, we're right in line or better than most of those leasing markets. So it's like, it's almost like when you drove, you know, you were fine driving the rickety old truck until you, you got in a brand new BMW and then you thought your truck wasn't great. Well, it's sort of that sports car versus Steady Eddie truck. That.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

That's the thing, Brandon. Okay, I'm still, I'm still in the truck. No one let me know that I could upgrade to the Beamer man. I'm behind times. So we'll see what the new year brings us. But let me ask you this, Brandon and Glenn and, and Warren will get your take two. So both of y' all kind of described the evolution, you know, over the last three years. And if we take it all the way back to the pandemic, what has surprised you the most? Was there one big surprise since the pandemic here in the post pandemic industrial market that surprised you the most? Brandon?

[C]

Yeah, I would say, you know, many of the industrial, you know, many of the different asset classes have seen these really Crazy swings in demand. You know, values are all over the place. Cap rates all over the place. The place. Industrial rents have moderated and look, they've gone down in some markets. Cap rates have widened a little bit. But again like we Talked about earlier, 3% cap rates probably weren't sustainable to begin with. But I think if you look and like step back at the returns that industrials delivered overall and will continue to deliver, I think it's really remarkable. Consumers want products faster. E commerce penetration continues onshoring and nearshoring has provided, you know, real tailwinds for the demand side and a lot of the different regions as well. So.

[A]

Yep. Sorry but a lot of resilience to what I'm hearing kind of the greater theme you're sharing there Brandon.

[C]

Yeah, absolutely.

[A]

Glenn, about you, what's the biggest surprise here in the post?

[D]

Yeah, I mean it's, you know, a lot has changed as we've alluded to, we've talked about, I do think a lot has has stayed the same and we'll talk about automation, we'll discuss new power requirements. You know, Ward mentioned it. We were together in Colorado. We're laughing about and being at a tailgate. You know, two things that really matter in this business are relationships and getting the product to consumers as quickly as possible. And you know, from a relationship perspective, we're going to continue to cater to our customers and you know, Brandon will touch on it. We're just coming off our customer council where we met with 20 to 30 of the top industrial users in the world. We hear how they're doing and it's a customer centric business and we're going to continue for that to be our focus. And then the second is getting product to customers more efficiently. And that's not going to slow down, that's not going to change in the near future. What started as three to five day delivery times is now same day. It's only going to get faster. So what we've done at Link is really curate this infield centered portfolio that allows our customers to get product to their consumers more efficiently. And you know, I'll quantify it a little bit. 95% of our buildings have more than 1 million people within an hour drive. 87% of our buildings have more than 2 million people within an hour drive. So again, what we're trying to do and what we're going to continue to do is position our customers so that they can continue to give product to their consumers as quickly as possible.

[A]

All right, good stuff there, Glenn. We got a lot to get into. All right. So Ward, resilience relationships. I was trying to think of a third thing that started with R especially related tailgate food. It didn't come to me but resilience and relationship towards speak. We heard that from Brandon and Glenn. Your thoughts?

[B]

Oh, I just think that the relationships are everything and, and even when that market was really tight during this Covid years, I am lucky to represent a lot of great companies that occupy a lot of industrial real estate and have deep relationships with landlords like Link that have properties all over the country. And I find it really great to work with the larger landlords like a link and we can communicate and I can call Brandon or I can call Glenn if there's something going on with the deal, maybe in a market that, you know, they're not deeply entrenched in or something and they will help me out. We, we did a deal with Link recently where my client, they were having a lot of different feedback from the operational side of the business and what we thought, you know, it normally might have been like a six to eight month project turned into a 24 month project, but it worked out and it was a lot of communicating and it was trusting that relationship and so that's everything. And it's great to go do big real estate deals and it's great to save my clients money. But at the end of the day that what gets me coming to work every day is the people that I'm dealing with and that's either my colleagues or landlords or the or clients. And getting to deal with people and help make people's lives easier is the way I look at what I do for a living.

[A]

I like it. I like it, Ward. Well said. All right, now we're going to get more into an expert pulse check on the current industrial real estate market. And folks, even if you're an amateur real estate individual like I am, I don't know a whole bunch about industrial real estate, supply chain real estate or even consumer real estate. But here's your chance to get up speed on some key factors out there. So that's where we're going to start. Glenn, you reference you were touched on some of these already. In fact, all of us have kind of touched on some of these already. The top industrial demand drivers right now. What's the top the list, the short list, Glenn?

[D]

Yeah, I'll give you a few. So I mean we touched on E Commerce, you know, that continues to be just a massive driver in our business business. And we touched on delivery times most Groups are continuing to grow that strategy and you're seeing that from the larger users. You're also seeing more local groups do it. 3 pls are taking more space to, to enhance these delivery efficiencies. So again we could spend a lot of time talking specifics around E Commerce, a few others, domestic manufacturing. That's a trend we're following with some of the recent policy announcements. My colleague in the central has probably experienced a little bit more of that activity from these users. But for us in the east we are seeing it. But I just think that demand takes a little bit more time to play through. If you want to look at like a Greenville Spartanburg with a BMW and the effects that that it. It takes years for some of that demand to spill over. But it is something that we're tracking. Ward probably sees it a lot in, in Texas as well. The other one I'll point out to you is, you know, we hear, you hear data centers a lot and we are seeing that as a new demand driver and have signed several deals within our own portfolio across the country from that. And it's really showing up kind of in two buckets. The first, you know, these are multi year projects. Contractors need space to build the facilities. They're taking down warehouses to be near that for the construction phase of it. That's one of them, the spillovers. The second is we're seeing users that actually service these data centers. So they could be supplying parts, they could be servicing the electric, go, the H Vac, whatever that is. But they need a presence near these data centers and you know, that use feels a little bit stickier to us. And again, we've signed several deals within our portfolio in the last few weeks that have gone for that specific use.

[A]

Man, we could have an hour long conversational each of those topics.

[D]

Go deep into those for sure.

[A]

Yeah. As I shared pre show, I'm going to go out to my first data center when I head out to a big industry conference in Vegas in a couple of weeks. I'm looking forward to that. Brandon, what would you add to that short list of top industrial demand drivers?

[C]

I don't think we can have a conversation about industrial real estate and not reference three PLs, three PLs, which you know, historically have been 25 to 30% of, you know, leasing on an annual basis that backed up to about, I don't know, 15 to 18% depending on the market that you were in last year. And we're north of 30% this year. And I think if you look at the amount of demand that's out there as a result or the requirements that are in the market. It's even above that. The challenge is we were talking to a couple at our advisory council last week is they feel like they're getting their quota on the business side but they're having to work 10 times harder to get that business. So we see a lot of requirements in the market and a lot of times the end users ultimately don't end up executing that plan. But you know some of it is speed to market. You know 3PL allows you to go in really quickly into a market and gain presence and at the same time it also provides the flexibility for a shorter term need that you know, they know, they know they need the business today. They're maybe not necessarily willing to commit for five plus 10 years to a location but, but they need it now. So the, the three PL serves as, as both a quick way to get to the market and also a low initial investment which I think we're seeing a lot of both of those types of requirements from the three PL side.

[A]

Yeah, it's a great call out with three PLs and just you're echoing a big theme really from the whole conversation but certainly in Glenn's short list just the, the pace, the velocity it touches everything from especially from an AI standpoint and the, the demand is putting on the power grid and our infrastructure. Just the pace of business. We've referenced E commerce and can ever changing consumer expectations a few times that feels like it changed by the hour. Ward, when you heard this short list from Glenn and Brandon, in terms of what's driving demand right now, what comes to your mind?

[B]

Oh well, I mean the data center thing is definitely real. I think Google did a million square foot lease from DFW just to support their data center that's getting built. You know pretty sure about that. And the three BL world, that's what I specialize in is working with three BLs and they, I, I say there's like industrial real estate brokers and then there are three PL real estate brokers because it's its own kind of a real estate operation and they are constantly looking at the market and chasing different contracts. They require extreme flexibility. They're very fast moving versus a lot of shippers are a lot more strategic and they're looking for longer term places to be and they can be, they just have the opportunity to be a lot more proactive. So as I think this uncertainty just in the global economy and the supply chain is occurring right now, it makes sense for a lot of these shippers to lean on the 3 PLs heavier than they have been. And then manufacturing is definitely happening here in Texas. There's a ton of demand coming in to position themselves here in the US with you know, the current policies of the current administration.

[A]

Okay, good stuff. All right, so I want to get real specific on one hot space that we, we've seen, especially given your last point there, Ward all the uncertainty and the ever going, ever challenging trade landscape. Right. All new policies. Hope we can get through this conversation without saying the T word being tariffs. But the bonded warehouse and F in the foreign trade zone market. Brandon, let's talk about that. That's been really hot because folks trying, it seems like as an amateur here, trying to insulate themselves from as much uncertainty as they can and, and dodge some of the added costs associated with uncertainty. What do you see in there, Brandon?

[C]

Yeah, look, I think the, the bonded warehouse market's not new. Like that's a, it's been around for a really long time. I think this was definitely a, a key buzzword that you saw in every newspaper two to three months ago, maybe a little bit longer. You know, we have dozens of, of bonded warehouses within our portfolio. What I'll tell you is that you know, one, you're not avoiding paying taxes, you're effectively just delaying that. So we sort of mandate go back, look through our portfolio. What could we do to make these more attractive. And the reality is they're very underlying tenant specific. So most of these warehouses are actually portions of facilities within three PL units. And you know, we, we sign off on them. It's, it's just effectively an agreement that takes place within our footprint. It doesn't have to necessarily be the whole space. It could be two bays within a building. So it is really a tenant specific use that like I said, it doesn't, it doesn't avoid taxes. You know, if you've got a long lead time or something you're gonna be sitting on for a while where that interest carry is, is a meaningful amount. And then it does make sense. It definitely makes sense in terms of some of the products coming in from South America which is why like Miami and there's you know, certain regions that are a little bit heavier on the FTZ side or sorry, the bonded warehouse side. But largely it's not a big driver for us and we really lean on, you know, the three PLs primarily or the underlying client is responsible for Philly filling out all that paperwork. And like I said, we're happy to Accommodate it. We've certainly been helpful with a number of customers doing it, but it's not really a big driver of demand that we see on our side.

[A]

Okay. And I hear they're really difficult to set up. So you need to work with somebody, is my understanding, with folks already have them set up. I think they can take a lot of time to get new bonded warehouses or FTZ areas set up. Is that your.

[C]

It's a process. Yeah. It's quite an arduous process that there's a reason why the three PLs have. They've gotten good at this and which is why most people that do have that sort of, whether it be a short term or long term, need end up running them through the three PLs to help satisfy that. But, yeah, quite a lot of tape to run through to get those set up.

[A]

And Uncle Sam's going to get his tax dollars. He may. It may take a little while to get them, but he's going to get them. Ward, quick comment there. Are you seeing you're hearing what Brandon was sharing about the bonded warehouses and FTCs? Your thoughts?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, the FTZs have always been very important for clients. Depending on. Well, when I say my clients, I mean a 3 DL, and then it's a lot of times it's who their client is and if they're going to require that FTZ or not. I did hear something about the bonded warehouses, that there were some, like, smaller three DLs that were trying to get in and get a bonded warehouse because the tariffs were going up to lock in the lower tariffs, but then the tariffs dropped again and then they're stuck with this initial tariff. So it was like playing blackjack is what it sounded like to me. But I think the three PLs that are operating bonded warehouses, if they're doing that with consistency, and that's their core business. That's their core business. I think people that tried to get into bonded warehousing that had never done it before, when the tariffs started happening and make a quick buck, it's like playing blackjack. Maybe they hit the jackpot, maybe they lost it.

[A]

Right.

[B]

That's the way I look at it.

[A]

I wouldn't say it's blackjack. It's like roulette.

[B]

Roulette, yeah.

[A]

There's zero, there's double zero, there's triple zero. It's like even your work, your luck and odds are even worse. But we'll see. We'll see what lies ahead. Red 19, by the way, if y' all go to Vegas, Red 19 bet the farm. All right. Emerging industries data centers, which we've touched on a couple times. Cold storage. It's amazing to see growth projected over the next 10 years from a cold storage standpoint. Glenn, these emerging industries I mentioned and others, how they impact in demand and industrial real estate trends overall. And Glenn, that's for you, my friend.

[D]

Yeah, so give me one second.

[A]

So hang on one second.

[D]

Which one was it? Sorry, Scott. Which I was listening to Ward, and lost my train of thought.

[B]

Apologies.

[D]

What was the question?

[A]

All good. So I'm a backup and Amanda and or Joshua, we'll just take a little time stamp here. We're going to talk about emerging industries and how they're impacting demand in industrial real estate. And I think. Is that good for you, Glenn?

[D]

Yeah, but did you want to. I mean we talked about E commerce. We talked about the. We talked about domestic manufacturing. We talked about data centers, right? Yeah, we answered that one.

[A]

So what I. So my understanding was we had the top industrial demand drivers that we. That we kind of got yalls responses on and then we were driving a little bit deeper on the bonded warehouse FTZ and then emerging industries, where I thought we were going to go a little bit deeper. But if we want to, we can just skip the emerging industries question and then we can move straight into the top of mind for your customers right now.

[B]

Would that work?

[A]

Or.

[D]

I mean, if we go in emerging, emerging industries, I think that. I think those three kind of cater to what we were. You know, we go into them deeper. What do you think, Ward? I mean, I just feel like we're going to get real nuanced in emerging.

[B]

I think we can move on. I mean really. But it's up to you guys, obviously.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

So what we'll do then, we'll strike the emerging industries question and we'll move straight into what this top of mind for customers right now.

[B]

Is that good?

[C]

Yep.

[D]

You guys? Yeah, I mean we can answer whatever you want.

[A]

Is that good?

[D]

Yeah, sorry.

[A]

All good. All good. Glenn. This is easy stuff. This is our greatest challenge today. Life is pretty good, right? So. So let's see. Brandon, I'm going to you here. So I'm gonna give it a quick pause and Amanda and Joshua, y' all get time stamps. And Melissa, if you have any other. If you had difference opinion, just jump in. But I'm gonna give it a quick pause and then I'm a Paul. Pose, pause and pose. Pose a question. This top of mind question to you, Glenn. Sorry, you brand. Okay, good. Here we go. In Three. All right, so Brandon, the North Star is always what's important to the customers. Right. What they're trying to get done and how we can provide the solutions to said customers to delight their customers, maybe. But Brandon, what's been top of mind for your customers right now?

[C]

The word flexibility comes to mind the most right now. And I think if you look, corporate users have largely been on the sidelines for the last year, which I think is really remarkable given the absorption of the net leasing that's gone on across the industry. But there's just so much uncertainty right now in the macro environment. The margin pressures I talked about earlier, it just makes it really challenging for these companies to make large capital investments. So I think customers are constantly looking for flexibility, looking for cubic efficiency within their warehouses, how they get the most out of what they have. We're seeing cases where a consolidation amongst several smaller facilities into a, a newer, more functional facility makes all the sense in the world. They're being scrapped just because the cost to relocate is so high. And so, you know, just those near term costs a lot of times at this moment outweigh, you know, the long term reward until they feel a little bit better about their business. And that's, that's a really challenging time for them trying to operate their business.

[A]

Yep. I think all of what you just shared there speaks to the vast, daring, varying degrees of uncertainty that we're all were talking about earlier. Glenn, top of mind for customers. What do you see?

[D]

Yeah, I think if you would rewind a little bit, we did that earlier in the discussion. A few years ago, I think the first answer from a customer would have been labor. We can't find labor. We're struggling with labor. And I think that still is somewhat the case today. It just doesn't feel as urgent perhaps as it was in past years. So I think Brandon touched on a lot of it. I think to summarize that it's really optimization. Right. And it's, you know, when you think of that, it's inventory management levels, most efficient transportation costs. Are we right size? Do we need to grow? Do we need to consolidate? I would tell you power is a conversation that is really, we're having that conversation a lot with our customers. Kind of leads into automation, you know, and obviously we'll touch on AI, I'm sure. But it's just all of those things kind of how they can further optimize their warehouse and be the most efficient.

[A]

Good stuff. All right, Ward, I bet your customers have seen it all, but they're drinking O' tools because they got all these stories to share, all the different chapters of business growth and challenges they've lived through. What's top of mind for your customers right now, Ward?

[B]

I, I was just going to say that they value extreme speed and response time and extreme patience. And when they're looking for space and it's, it depends on what day it is. So it's very fast moving and then a lot of analysis paralysis, if you want to call it that. And that's just go get answers and go send it back in and for people to analyze the data that gets reported back and then there's a long period of time and then when it's go, it's like go. So it's so funny because it's requiring more patience than I've ever needed. And then it's also requiring faster speeds of turning around and synthesizing data. All these decisions are extremely data driven. If there were three data sets that existed in 2019, there are 10 now, and then they'll add another one for each deal. And I think that is just the, the method of CYA in this world that we're living in to be check every box, make dot every I, cross every T when making these big real estate decisions and make sure that whoever's making that decision has backed it up with as much evidence as possible. And that, and I mean it's, it's like riding a buck in Bronco sometimes. And that's. I'm here for it, man.

[A]

Love it, love it. You know, we call that in the Air Force, Hurry up and wait. Because it was around every corner. Hurry up and wait. Hurry up and wait. All right, Glenn, I got a question for you and Brandon here. How would you characterize the current state of supply? Are we in equilibrium, Are we under supplied or are we still working through the overhang from the past building boom? Your thoughts, Glenn?

[D]

Yeah, it's, that's a great question. It's, it's, it's extremely nuanced and a lot of it is, is market, it's submarket dependent, it's size dependent. And that's where I think at Lync, you know, we have local teams, local knowledge. That's extremely important for us as a platform. You know, I touched on size. I think that's, that's one of the things if you kind of look at the bulk space, so let's call it over 400,000 square feet. On a national perspective, that availability rate is trending higher than the 20 year average. But if you focus on the spaces call it below 150, 200,000 square feet. That availability rate is significantly less than the 20 year average. If you add in the fact that construction starts are at a historic low. There's certain markets and there's certain submarkets where probably are on both sides of your question, oversupply and undersupplied. But there's a number of markets right now that they may feel oversupplied. But with that tightening construction pipeline, if a few deals do hit, the availability swings back very quickly. And it's a dynamic that we're actually seeing play through in certain markets right now. And it's, it's really hard to develop infill, new infill product. I mean land scarcity we can talk about. Municipalities are not necessarily in favor of new construction as well. So again, I think as you think about that equilibrium, you have to factor in future, future supply as well.

[C]

Yeah, I think that, you know, that new construction or lack of new construction is really the most important piece of this. I mean, I think if you look to Glenn's point, we're a couple of buildings away in a handful of markets where we go from too much to no supply. And even if, you know, if you think the rents are high today, there's a reason why nobody's developing is because the rents don't justify the return that you need in order to, you know, to develop a new building. So the reality is once we get through this glut in a handful of markets, and I think you could see that happen in a quick quarter, you know, busy quarter, in some cases, rents have to rise in order to justify new construction. The alternative to that is if cap rates go back down to 3% like we talked about earlier. But I'm not betting on that. So I'm betting on the rents rising, you know, to, to sort of kick off that new wave of construction once the supply that's out there today is gobbled up and it will happen.

[A]

Outstanding. I feel like I've just walked back through an economics class that I failed miserably in college. Brandon Glenn Ward, your thoughts on how we're characterizing the current state supply?

[B]

Oh, yeah, it's. I mean, you went from the highest supply in history being built to now back to the low. And I think it's a 62% drop since the peak of supply to where it went down to. It does appear to be stabilizing now. So I think it a market like Dallas, they're building 30 million square feet right now. So Dallas, that is pre pandemic levels of construction and Dallas is leading the country by far. Houston is behind that. So obviously like these Texas developers are feeling pretty optimistic about what's going on here. We also have high vacancy rates going on and that's also looks like a roller coaster and but I think the vacancy stabilizing, I think this is very nuanced depending on what market you're in. I think all the developers, let's say the majority of the developers are paying very close attention to the micro economics of each market that they're developing in. Because what's happening in Dallas is definitely not the same in Los Angeles right now. So it just depends and, but I do feel like things are stabilizing and, and I'm hopeful that it remains stable and it's better than the roller coaster. That is what all of the charts look like for the last five years.

[A]

Yeah, I like how you think practically optimistic. Stable stability is a good thing. Always underrated. All right, so Glenn, are you ready for a two part question? This is a big one. You buckled up, you hang on to your socks. When you survey the national industrial real estate landscape. We're talking about some of these individual market by market perspectives. What are some of the most dynamic markets out there and secondly, what's going on in some of the secondary tertiary markets as, as we've talked about business leaders looking for affordability flexibility. As Brandon touched on other options. Your thoughts, Glenn?

[D]

Yeah, well, starting back with the customer centric approach, you know, we like to be flexible in all markets, so we're here to help on that. But to your question, you know, really like what we're seeing in the Southeast and you know, Atlanta, Charlotte, like what we're seeing in Central Florida, both Tampa, Orlando. Tom, I think if again, if you had some of my colleagues on, you could extend that to the Sun Belt, Houston, Nashville, Dallas, pockets of Phoenix, Miami felt like it was having a little bit of a summer slowdown, but it's, it's starting to pick back up again on, on demand. So it's good to see that that market's performing, continues to perform well too. If you're looking for flexibility, affordability I think is how you kind of phrase the question. New Jersey, I would say, you know, we're seeing levels of demand than perhaps we were 18 months ago. The depth of that demand still feels a little limited. And then if you're looking for ultimate flexibility, I think markets like Memphis, Baltimore, you know, where, where we're just not seeing much demand. If you kind of go back to the, the question, I think around the, the availabilities too. There are certain markets where sizes, size ranges change that dynamic. I look at like a Greensboro for example. We have a big presence there. I like the underlying fundamentals of it, but if you're over 75, 000 square feet, there's probably a few more options. If you're below 75, 000 square feet, it's, it's pretty tight. So again, you know, a lot of this is market, sub market dependent, but that's probably a quick rundown of the east region.

[A]

Well then I like it. I pictured a map as you're walking us through all the different markets. It's like you're a weather forecaster. We need a real estate map. Like they had, you know, weather forecaster use the map. That would be a really cool idea for a podcast. We'll talk more about that. Glenn, Brandon, dynamic markets, secondary tertiary markets and some of those dynamics that Glenn was referencing. Your thoughts, Brandon?

[C]

Yeah, I don't think we can go with, you know, this podcast without giving Houston its due. Houston actually might be the healthiest industrial market in the US right now. I mean Dallas is fantastic. You know, the great state of Texas, the Republic of Texas give it its props. But you know, I think if you look on the Western U.S. i think Glenn mentioned it, but Phoenix, the data center demand that we're seeing there, you know, they had a tremendous oversupply of both leasing or bulk space. That product was actually there last week. And I think it's like there's like two buildings left, over a million square feet and tremendous amount of demand that's coming. I think you got to go back to the. I just got to give, give Houston its props as well. It just makes me happy to see that market finally be on top. You don't say that very often in our career.

[A]

No doubt. And their football team wasn't too bad last year. The record setting quarterback. But I want Street Las Colinas more. That portion of the the Metroplex had four folks trying to sell me a warehouse. So it must be a really hot, hot market. But Ward, when you heard from Glenn and Brandon, some of their observations. Different cities, different markets. Your thoughts?

[B]

Yeah, I, I feel like I'm going to agree with everything those guys say because they are owning these properties in those markets and they see what's going on. I've talked about Texas, the Republic of Texas a lot, future home of the Texas Stock Exchange. And you know, I, I just think it just depends whether I'm repping a user out anywhere in the country. It depends on what they need and depends on what the submarket is. Markets can shift. We just did a deal in Phoenix and we were looking for 300,000 square feet and there were five options. And we picked one of the options of course and we're going down and we're at leases and then a user came along and made an offer to buy that building so that that deal fell apart. We went back to the other four options. They're all leased. All of a sudden we went from having five options to, you know, zero options and had to go back to the drawing board and thankfully figured it out. But the markets can shift fast. These numbers look huge, but a lot of these buildings are huge. So it's just when some handful of big deals and you get that momentum which hap. It seems to just happen like it's all a cliche for a reason. When it rains, it pours and it can shift market conditions very quickly because we're dealing with some huge buildings and a lot of large occupiers and a.

[A]

Lot of as you were alluding to earlier, lots of criteria on. Across all the different data that's available as they do their due diligence and they add, as I think as you put it, Ward as they go through a deal they find three new metrics they like and they add that to the. To the next deal.

[D]

I think Ward's comment around though, those four options, I think he said in Phoenix, I mean that's a real, that's a real deal. Not issue but phenomena that's going on in. In certain markets. I mean Charlotte's the same way. If you surveyed Charlotte 60 days ago, there were ample buildings over 400000 square feet. There's been four deals over 400000 square feet in Charlotte in the last 30 days. So towards point those options are no longer. Are no longer available. So it is an interesting. We go back to that construction supply and that dynamic. They can change pretty, pretty quickly.

[B]

I'll add one more thing that's just another interesting thing is when you're in co when we were in the pandemic post pandemic boom, it was a landlord's market that was a. That was for sure. Then you see in the newspaper that we have this oversupply. So a lot of tenants think oh it's a tenant's market now. And it's just depends because it's not a tenant's market like it was a landlord's market back then because it just depends on what the submarket is and what looking for. And like the stats of the US industrial doesn't tell the story. So it's all very nuanced and it just depends on the deal. And it's not, oh, let's go to every landlord in the portfolio and ask for a blend and extend. It might just be 10% of the portfolio. Might make sense to go try to get some kind of a deal or there's some really aggressive landlords but it really just depends on. And then a lot of landlords have, or they're well capitalized and have the ability to wait it out and they're not dropping rents. And you frankly, landlords can't drop rents because they paid so much for the buildings in the first place. And so it's just a little bit of an odd market and it really depends on a deal by deal basis on whose favor it's leaning towards.

[C]

Yeah. And I think if you step back too and think about like 7 to 8% vacancy as being about market, I mean that's kind of where we're at. So we're over, you know, oversupplied on the bulk end but under supplied on the small end, which is where we lean to in our portfolio. You know, that balance is kind of in that 7, you know, 7, 8% vacancy range. Doesn't always feel like it. I guess our customers are probably saying the same thing. But it really is kind of a balanced market.

[B]

Yeah, I agree.

[A]

So I gotta ask you. So Glenn, we had a two part question a second ago. One good two part question serves another. So I'll talk about, we reference some of the headwinds, right? Some of the trends, some of the things fueling demand. We've touched on some headwinds that the industrial real estate sector is facing right now. In light of that, how is LINK positioning itself to weather all the headwinds and how are you leveraging AI or other innovative technology in the industrial real estate sector? Glenn?

[D]

Yeah, another two parter. I thought we were family. Scott, you're throwing the, you're throwing the more difficult ones at me here, but.

[A]

I can handle it and hey, no, you got it. Thank you.

[D]

You know, from the, the biggest headwinds I would say it's really just general uncertainty in the economy. I mean we, we won't say the T word but you know, it's still, there's some uncertainty obviously and then I think consumer health. Right. And, and that's leading to slower decision making by our customers. You know, how does some of that play out over the next few quarters, we'll obviously watch and monitor because if you, if you, if you strip away those and you just focused on some of the fundamentals on the ground that Brandon Ward and I have touched on, it feels pretty stable in, in most of those, in most of my markets. And what we operate in AI, I think was the second part of, of your, your question and my goodness, we could dedicate another hour to that. I'll tell you. You know, the way Link is thinking about this and it's, it's, it's a lot of fun and to be in a real estate company that's focused on AI is, is, is very unique and fun. But there's really three ways to kind of break it down for us. Productivity, right? How can we make our teams, our assets, our platforms more productive, increase output. The second really is automation or automate. What can we do again for our people, our assets, our platform to gain efficiencies for us, for our customers, reduce cost. And then the third is really Insights and it's how can we as a firm make faster decisions, smarter decisions? And I'll give you, I mean we have a team of data scientists which we welcome those conversations with them as well. Matt Rand who leads our research. And, and really, I mean one example of, of these insights is there's a rent modeling tool that we have if you will. It analyzes billions of data points, market demand indicators. You then partner that with kind of our local teams. It allows Link again to identify market trends earlier, allows for smarter decision making. And you know, it's again, it's just a, we're just at kind of the forefront of this and it's, it's really exciting to already see the progress and, and where this is trending.

[A]

Glenn, that is really cool. That is really cool and I bet you are having a heck of a time. And when you're investing in all that innovative technology, it helps you keep up with the pace and the velocity of business that we were referencing throughout the conversation. Brandon, your thoughts on the same two parter, How Link is best positioned to handle the headwinds, facing the space and leveraging AI and all the other innovative technology.

[C]

You know, I think Glenn actually did such a great job talking about how we headwinds. I'm probably not going to address that one. A lot of the same thoughts on my side on the AI front though. I think, you know, from my perspective we haven't even scratched the surface. I think you know, six months ago we really weren't Thinking about it, others were thinking about it, but it really wasn't necessarily playing into data. I thought where I think, you know, it's going to be a differentiator, you know, data, and we have a lot of data and how we use that data is going to be a key differentiator. I think it's going to impact, you know, customer supply chain teams, how they gonna, how they're gonna decide where they need their facilities, how are we gonna price our buildings based on that? I think the legal process is going to change. Imagine having two bots go at, put together a lease in like 15 seconds. I think, I think that is a realistic, you know, concept. That's something that we never really thought would happen. I think it's going to help us spot growing industries. And as we start to see things shift sooner, I think you'll. This is all like really great concept, but it's a challenge. We're not a language learning model company, but I think there's a ton of ways that we can take and I think I spend a lot of my time thinking about where is demand coming from. And ancillary data center demand is a perfect example of that. We're all kind of looking for what's the next demand driver. And I think AI is going to help us spot those types of opportunities before others see it. I think some of it between our proprietary data as well as just the information that's out in the world right now, you kind of blend that plus the relationships that we have with our customers, large occupiers, market movers, those are the things that are going to help us sort of pinpoint where is that next demand coming from and how do we get in front of it.

[A]

Brandon, very cool. And you referenced the, you know, one day we're going to have one soon day, one soon hour, we're going to have two AI agents hammering out real estate deals.

[C]

I'm not here to suggest that we're going to eliminate the need for attorneys. That's not my point. I just think there's a lot of inefficiencies that are built into, you know, whether it be drafting the lease. We could be on the, you know, Lois, all of that I think is going to be shortened here.

[A]

I'm with you. You know, there I was going to say that when those AI agents get together, I bet initially we're going to have some beach deals closed in Arkansas, maybe some snow, snow ski deals closed in Florida. But eventually we'll get fine tuned in and, and kidding aside, it'll be interesting to see how these deals grow in value, grow in terms of their streamlining, how we can streamline deals, make it easier while enhancing and ensuring that the right decisions for the customers are being made. It's amazing times. Ward. Really quick. We're going to do a fast and furious finish in a second. But your thoughts there on what Glenn and Brandon both touched on. Headwinds technologies and then some.

[B]

Yeah, well, when I think about the AI aspect, I mean, it's just when I went to college, that's when I first found out about email. Right. 1996. And you just think about the iPhone existing today. Who would have ever thought that we would be in a place when I was in 1996 where I could pull out my phone and do all my emails, which I really didn't understand what that was in 1996, and have a map and be able to listen to every song that I've ever thought about in my life. And every song, any song I hear, I can find out what song it is. Obviously we all know what an iPhone is. I think AI is at this stage right now that's like the pre email Internet, you know what I mean? I think it's so early, but I think it's going to expand so exponentially that to predict what it's going to do to our entire society is beyond what our minds can process. So I think that humanity is going to be a huge value. These personal relationships are going to be more important than ever. And I do think that it's going to make a lot of things a lot easier for us to do. But I think a lot of the core human skills that we talked about earlier when we're talking about relationships are going to become way more important as a lot of these other jobs get taken away by the, by the robots, you know. Ward.

[A]

Well said. Or the, the beautiful and very unique human factor empowered with AI and other technologies. But I would also agree with you. We really, we know, we know now. Right. But we have such a blind spot, I believe, like you're alluding to, of what AI is going to do five months from now, certainly like five years from now, it's going to be amazing. And, and you know, not just AI, but other technologies. All right, so I gotta get off the technology nerd talk. I'm bad about that. From time to time. I want to wrap on a couple key items here. Misconceptions about industrial real estate that you wish more people understood. Brandon, you're. What's one misconception you wish More folks didn't have.

[C]

We all spend a lot of time thinking about, you know, Fortune 50, Fortune 100 companies. We talk about those names or, you know, that's what the headlines are all about. You know, we have 3,000 buildings, 8,000 different leases. Most are not Fortune 50. So, you know, the majority of our portfolio is small, regional local businesses. And I think it's fascinating when you walk through customer spaces, you know, they're proud of what they do. They want to show you what differentiates them from their, you know, from their competitors. And it's, it's sort of that entrepreneurial spirit which you could all argue is kind of the backbone of America. And that's on display. And you see that every time you walk through our facilities. It's something I really enjoy about walking through our buildings is the pride that you see each of these individual businesses and, and their, you know, their goal to succeed and support their families.

[A]

Love that, Brandon. Tom's a thousand. Love that, Glenn. It's gonna be a tough answer to top there. What's one misconception about industrial real estate you wish more folks didn't have out there? But Glenn.

[D]

Yeah, I mean, Brandon, that was a great. I completely agree with, with Brandon. I'll kind of add on, I guess, to it a little bit. It's. It's really that industrial is. Is viewed as simply a commodity. Right. And maybe if you rewound 10, 15, 20 years, it was. It's simply a box, right. Does it meet a survey geographically? Is it the right size? And, you know, today, and we've talked a lot about it in the past hour or so. You know, we partner with our customers, local economic development groups, you know, municipalities, to make sure that we have the right power is, do we have access to fiber data? Are we equipped to handle automation? You know, we didn't spend a lot of time on configurations for our customer cube heights, you know, because we are really focused on kind of being positioned where this industry is headed, not necessarily where it just is today.

[A]

So much more to talk about in this equation to arrive at that holistic solution that whether they're highly complex real estate needs or maybe some of the more straightforward needs, but good stuff there, Glenn. And Brandon, that just tells you that we got to have you back. We gotta have you back. Ward one misconception. You wish you could have a magic wand and just do away with out there in the market.

[B]

Oh, I, I just, you know, kind of along the same thing that Glenn just said, you can. Like we'll go into a market and there might be 100 buildings in a market like DFW for a client. That might make sense from an initial survey perspective. But once you get into it and it's like, well, how many trailer parks do you need? How many dock doors do you need? What you need office spaces ready to go. Okay. You need levelers that are in place that you don't have to wait on. And you get a drill down, you might be lucky to have one or two options that really work in the clear height and everything else lined up. So it is very different. And I mean the coolest thing about industrial real estate is most people do not even know that it exists.

[A]

Right.

[B]

It's like your eye does not even notice it until it does and then you can't unsee it. You see the whole supply chain working within the walls of those facilities and, and I'm really thankful that we all get to work in that sector and see the backbone of commerce in this world.

[A]

Well said. You know, my dear friend Tony Sirota, who has led and continue to lead the Reverse Logistics association is now part of the National Retail Federation ecosystem. And he's long said that the reverse space returns management space has been the, the dark side of supply chain that no one knows, no one wants to deal with. And I think it has a little bit in common as you're talking about with industrial real estate that even practitioners, you know, like myself didn't really understand throughout our journey. And I think the more and more folks and see it and then can't forget it. As you were saying, Ward, I think industry is better off. Okay, so Brandon and Glenn and Ward, I've had it as I knew I would. I've got about 17 pages of notes here from the brain trust and getting the pulse check on on supply chain real estate. I want to make sure folks know how to connect with each of y' all because if there's anything clear after this last hour is folks need trusted experts, specialists as they have as they're trying to solve their real estate needs out there. So Brandon, how can folks connect with you in the link logistics team?

[C]

Yeah, I'd suggest just reaching out either through our website linklogistics.com or you can find me on LinkedIn search Brandon page link logistics and I'll pop up.

[A]

It is just that easy. And Glenn, how about you my friend? When you're not tailgating in the still national championship Clemson Tigers, we got hopefully another one on the horizon soon eating that good, those good public chicken wings. How can folks track you down do big deals in the industry.

[D]

Yeah, same. I mean, we're on the website. Feel free to reach out and, and.

[C]

You know, we would welcome it.

[D]

We, we love transparency. We love to hear, you know, how you are doing, what we can be doing better. So, yeah, please feel free to reach out.

[A]

Outstanding. Well, Brandon, Glenn, great to have you both. Ward, you've got probably the toughest question I think here today because we've covered so much ground. There's lots of actual takeaways, as we knew there would be in this conversation with Brandon and Glenn and yourself. What is the key takeaway that our audience members just cannot lose sight of after today's conversation?

[B]

Oh, I, I think the key takeaway is that that we're, we're in a balanced market and that this day and age requires a lot of flexibility and that relationships still trump everything in this world. And those are my three takeaways. I could just do one.

[A]

We're getting some bonus takeaways. I love it. Well said, Ward. It's been great to see you continue to evolve out there and great to reconnect here on today's podcast. I got to ask you, trucking on your latest podcast, I'll just surpass 150 episodes. What's the latest? What are you looking forward to?

[B]

Well, I'm looking forward to a brief hiatus, so I'm still recording a couple of episodes between now and the end of the year, but I'm not going to release any until January. And I'm just taking a pause for the cause and enjoy the holiday season, just kid sports and all that as this kicks into that time of year.

[A]

Outstanding. Well earned. Well, I look forward to reconnecting with you soon. Hopefully next time in person. Big thanks to Ward Richmond. Big thanks Brandon Page and Glenn Wiley, both with Link Logistics. Brandon, thanks for being here, my friend.

[C]

Thank you. Appreciate it. Enjoy the conversation.

[A]

But I'm gonna get some slider, some A plus slider tips from you soon for church softball, of course. And Glenn, great to have you here as well, my friend.

[D]

Yeah, thanks for having us. And I'm sure with Clemson season, we got a few extra tickets floating around these days. If you need a few, just come on out.

[A]

We'll do it. We'll do it. And Ward Richmond. Ward's been a pleasure to reconnect with you here and can't wait to see the latest music gig coming out the podcast and of course, all the big things you're doing that industry. Great to see you, Ward Richmond.

[B]

Thanks.

[A]

God, what a great conversation, man. I feel like I've gotten a master class and I certainly lead this conversation knowing again, all the complexity that a lot of us out there just maybe take for granted that that goes on in the supply chain real estate realm. But big thanks to all of our guests and are my special co hosts. So big thanks, Brandon, Glenn and Ward for being here. To all of our audience members out there, folks, you got homework. Hope you enjoyed episode number one. But you got homework. Take one thing, just one thing you heard here from Brandon, Glenn and Ward. Put it into practice. Share it with your team. Do something with it. It's about deeds, not words. That's how we're going to continue transforming the global business world, global supply chain and realize more and more of the art of the possible. So with all that said, Scott Luton, challenging all of you out there, do good, give forward, be the change that's needed. We'll see you next time right back here on supply chain now. Thanks, everybody. I think we got it in the can. We got it.

[B]

It was fighting.

[A]

It was fighting. We pushed it in there and covered that real quick. We got it.