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- [00:00]
A
What's up, y'? All? Welcome to another episode of Sweat Equity. Today we have somebody that I admire building something I admire Simon Kim.
- [00:08]
B
How's it going?
- [00:09]
A
I. We typically don't do like large intros in here, but give people context because.
- [00:14]
B
One of the things as well is.
- [00:15]
A
Like, we always talk about, like brand social, you know, and obviously we talk about the integration of creators, but I think what you are building and then how you're building and how it's centered around content is super important. But you give an intro to. To yourself what you're building, and then I'm guns blazing in school.
- [00:30]
B
Yeah. So my name is Simon. I run creator camp, also Camp Studios. And essentially we're on a mission to basically bring Internet creators to the big screen. So build a bridge from, you know, just making videos in your bedroom to actually becoming a full out filmmaker, putting things out there, whether it's getting films into theaters, whether it's doing your own theatrical tour. That's sort of the belief that we've championed and we've kind of built this community of like, artists, storytellers, creatives over the last four years of hosting events, and that's kind of led us to this point.
- [01:00]
A
Very familiar with you. And I'd gone through like, the Mission and even like the notion page months ago.
- [01:05]
B
Oh, heck, yeah.
- [01:06]
A
And so, like, I'm reading in and now I'm like piecing parts of it together where I saw something recently where Sydney Sweeney's like, last four films have been like a. Yeah, like, haven't popped. I think it was her last three, four films.
- [01:19]
B
Boxing one. Yeah.
- [01:19]
A
Right. Um, and it was like, oh, it's one of the worst runs, et cetera. And I. And it's not like a. It's a Sydney Sweeney error. It's a Hollywood error. Right. And it's because Hollywood has changed so much. And even you look at how like a. A movie is promoted typically in the past, like, it'd be promoted very, very heavily, and now it's promoted. Like there's sometimes I see a movie like two weeks before it goes out.
- [01:42]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [01:43]
A
And I see one trailer. And like, you don't build up kind of like the hype and the FOMO to like go and watch the thing and it's. It's just changed so much. And you guys are betting on the restructuring of Hollywood. What does the restructuring of Hollywood look like?
- [01:57]
B
I think over the past, like 10 years, you've seen a decentralization of like, basically every industry. Yeah. That's like tech products coming along and disrupting. You see, like, these core players getting, like, broken up. Whether it's like JP Morgan now, there's like Mercury and there's like, carrot banking and there's all these different things. But I think Hollywood's the last one to go. And it's sort of like, very resistant to that because it's just a highly gatekept industry. But our hope is, like, over the next. Or what I believe to be true over the next, like, 50 years is like, instead of one big Warner Brothers, there'll be like, you know, thousands of these micro studios where it's just a group of creatives coming together, just making, you know, their own feature films. Because obviously the cost of production is going down, the cost of distribution and marketing is going down. And so that was sort of our bet is like, how can we be the first people to kind of crack that? Or, you know, we're not the first creators to get a movie in theaters, but, like, to do it in the way we're doing it and really champion that movement. But that's kind of how we see as this, like, Internet cinema movement. Right. It's like, it's not just for us, but it's like, okay, we're already seeing it now with, like, all these different creatives popping up their own studios, working on their own film projects and realizing, like, you know, I can just, like, go out and make things with a few friends and there can actually be a path to, like, get that. To get distributed. And so that's like, how we see the future of Hollywood. It's more like the individuals, the small groups of creatives all across the world.
- [03:13]
A
What if you were put in the inverse and you. And you had like, one job of I have to save Hollywood. How. How would you approach that? Would it be like kind of taking the same model that you're doing now and, like.
- [03:21]
B
Yeah, I think, like, also just giving. I mean, one of the fundamental issues that we found is, like, you. You have to invest so much into these projects. Like, you have to invest, like, hundreds of millions. And I think giving more of that share of the pie to the creatives on set, like, is. Is sort of a necessary thing. Or giving more of those backend points. Yeah. To the creatives, I think is super necessary because. Or else you're just incentivizing the budget to go up because everyone's getting paid out of the budget.
- [03:48]
A
Yeah.
- [03:48]
B
And so that's an interesting take. I also think this. Yeah. Honestly, I have no clue because I think there's so many Issues, the more we go along the lines, I think there needs to be more competition in the theatrical market, because right now, even for us to go out and like, hey, we want to get our movie into theaters, we had no idea how to do that. But a lot of these indie films might actually get people in seats. But the issue is, like, the big studios are basically gridlocking those theaters. Like, hey, we have Wicked coming out. We're gonna need three weeks of your screens or else, like, we're gonna pull that from you. We're gonna take, you know, 70% of the box office. And so I think there's not enough competition on the theatrical market where, like, in maybe, like, a town in Indiana, it's like, actually, this indie film might bring more people than Wicked to that theater. Right. But there's no way for that indie film to even get to that theater. And so there's no competition in the market. And so I think that's something that has to be monopolized. Yeah, it's basically been, like, monopolized by, like, the bigger players because, like, a Disney can go to the small art house theater and be like, yo, like, we're going to play Moana 3 or whatever. And here's our demands. You need to give us this many screens, give us this big cut, or else we'll pull it from your theater. And that small theater needs Moana 3 to survive, you know, to get people in seats.
- [04:57]
A
And so my ass would be there. My dog I'm wearing right now.
- [05:01]
B
There you go.
- [05:02]
A
I can't listen to a damn song in the radio. Every time she gets in the car, it's Moana, Moana.
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B
You know how far I will go or wherever. So they have so much control in that market. And so I think hopefully part of, like, what this campaign with this last film does is, like, start to at least, like, encourage that conversation of, like, we should be open to playing more things, that sort of thing.
- [05:20]
A
So I didn't know that's how it was structured, though. Like, I didn't know that's how it happened where Warner Brothers comes to X chains, and it's probably like, we need X amount of time. And so then is your opportunity small windows where there's no movies.
- [05:32]
B
Yeah. So, for example, like, the first and a lot of indie movies do this as well. Like, I don't think we're doing something, like, crazy. Fundamentally different than, like, a lot of indie movies in the past. Right. But, like, for example, like, everything, everywhere, all at once, the film by 24, like, it took A whole year before it really went as wide as possible. Yeah. And so with this film, like it was really hard to get into theaters because we had to prove people, hey, all these social media views will end up converting into people actually showing up. Which is like one of the least. You can't attribute that. So we did in 30 theaters November 14th. We did a whole road show before then to prove that there was like demand and momentum. We did 30 theaters December 5th and now late January. We're looking for like 100, 200 plus. Because that's when you know there isn't like a Moana 3 or something like that in theaters.
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A
That is wild. I really did not know that that structure. Where do you think the next Disney comes from?
- [06:25]
B
The next Disney might not. I don't know if there'll be a next Disney I guess is my take on it. Right. It's like will there be that big of a player that comes in the entertainment space that's so centralized in power? Right. That's the question. Like going back to that original thing of like all these studios popping up. We know that the next Stephen Spielberg is probably going to come from a YouTube like YouTube channel. Right. Or just like growing up making TikToks. But I don't know about the next Disney because I'm not sure if like something can get that big anymore. Right. Like it might just have to be all these like little studios that are.
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A
More like little Disney's.
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B
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
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A
And you think that those mini Disney's will come from multiple creators that like they build their, their own ip. They're building out like their, it started in their bedroom, it becomes a much bigger thing. But they're their own version of Disney.
- [07:12]
B
Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly.
- [07:14]
A
That's super interesting. And I think you're seeing it now among some creators, right? Like who is the. I don't know if they just built a studio here is it dude. What is it?
- [07:24]
B
Dude? Perfect.
- [07:25]
A
Yeah. Like this ginormous studio where their, their whole premise too was like, we're going to build like a Disney, right? Disney like studio. Now what I think is interesting is in the notion you talked about the difference between like parasocial capital and the narrative capital. Yeah, right. And the evolution that you see for, for creators and how creators can monetize in one way. They can, they can monetize via, hey, I have, I built my audience. I'm going to launch a product. It's one sided. I'm going to launch feastables. I'm going to launch a course I'm going to launch XYZ thing and I build that bridge, I launch my product, it's successful. Awesome. But then there's the narrative capital where it's like some of the most, you know, successful things in the world. When we're talking about content creation are these stories. Yeah, right. I, ironically was. We were getting a summer moon. Have you had summer moon, by the way? Yeah, go it. We were getting summer moon yesterday and me and this girl Tatum just happened to be talking about, I think I was talking about today's episode actually and I was talking about like Harry Potter and the fact that it's driven billions and billions in revenue from like one person's story, from the book and then to the film. And like there's this infinity where the people that grew up with the film like have this relationship with it that you can't break. Like my wife has, when we went to London, she got like a little lightning bull. I almost got something but I was like, I don't know if I could explain this one. But then you go in London and you see like how many people are lined up to. There's a, one of the stations. There's like a little area where they, they have a Harry Potter like cart going through the platform 9, 3/4. And they have a bookstore, bro. Everything had lines out, like out the door. Yeah, it was just a regular like Tuesday, Wednesday, you know what I mean? And that all stems from, from one story. So can you break down for me how then you're thinking about like, okay, the next evolution that could be an even bigger stage for these creators is actually narrative capital versus a social relationship.
- [09:27]
B
Yeah, I think that's a good question because it comes back to like my personal experience and my co founder's personal experience. Like I had grown up making videos on TikTok, grew an audience there and then moved to YouTube. And that was when I was a full time creator for the first time. Like built an audience there. And a lot of it was off of trying to tell a narrative story and like document my life and kind of make a film out of it. Right. And we began to realize that like, okay, first like something felt off. Like you're kind of like monetizing your life in this weird Truman show esque way and then also realizing that there, there's less scale to it. Right. Like for example, if you are to just lean on your parasocial relationship you have with your, your audience versus make a piece of ip, tell a story that can scale outside of yourself, like that's a much more sustainable path in, in our opinions and in my personal opinion than to continue to be on this hamster wheel. And I think a lot of what we built at camp is because we felt like we were on this brand deal hamster wheel of like, I don't know when the next brand deal is coming in. This is how I'm going to survive. You know, this is what I've been taught is the way to be a full time creator. But I want to tell like really meaningful stories and I want to make films and that sort of thing. And so like, what is the mechanism to like make that a profitable thing or like make there be some structure for that to exist? And so a lot of it comes from like my own experience in creating and being like this feels weird monetizing off the parasocial. But actually again, to your point, like realizing like, wait a second, Harry Potter is like just a story that someone came up with that's not about J.K. rowling. Like, you don't even. She never mentions herself, but she told a great story and that can scale way beyond what, what her personal brand could. Could end up being.
- [11:02]
A
What would you tell someone then if. Because I'm in the same boat in a way outside, like let's, let's disconnect me from the agency studio that we have. I make money as well from brand deals. And then we have cut 30, which is like a short form bootcamp, which is, you know, in many ways, like it's parasocial.
- [11:19]
B
Like it's.
- [11:19]
A
We created our audience, we. We monetize it via that course. But if I want to be on the other side where like I want to. Because I'm honestly in the same boat. One of my larger goals is producing a movie. That's one of my, my bigger goals. I study it a lot and I, and I want to do something there. But that's not going to happen overnight by any means. Right. If I want to make it to the other side where it's like, okay, you're building out this a narrative relationship. Where do I start?
- [11:46]
B
Where.
- [11:47]
A
Where would you say, Alex? Actually, I think you should do one to two things. These ten things, et cetera.
- [11:51]
B
Yeah. I guess also peeling back, I think like we saw the first evolution of the creator economy where it's like, okay, cool, you build this audience and then you need to monetize it by building a business. Yeah. But we realized at least in the niche that we were in, a lot of these artists, they, they're not like, they're not going to be the ones that launch like this mobile network or this feastables chocolate. Like it makes no sense. How can the art itself be sustainable? So I guess that's another point of like what led us to this moment. And I guess like to, to your point, that's what we're trying to create is more of that conversation or like that, that almost that path. Right. And so like a lot of that comes in educating the theaters, educating the studios, doing it yourself, creating a case study. Like that's sort of what we're up to now. But I think the biggest thing is just start putting out more narrative work. Like just put it out there in the world. Because we like to say that YouTube is the next film festival. Now like people like execs and people in studios will, who can potentially greenlight those projects, right. Or give you funding, whether you do it yourself or whether you, you want a partner in that way. Like they're going to find these stories on YouTube and be like, okay, that's IP that's tested, obviously has an audience attached to it. Like if it has a significant amount of reach that people are like, okay, like this. It's like the cane pixels thing with the back rooms and how 824 picked that up. So I would say just like put more narrative work out there and just sort of start putting it online. Because then obviously like you, you know, that you never know who's watching. And So I think YouTube as itself or like Instagram, all these social platforms are like the next film festival where you get discovered and that sort of thing.
- [13:24]
A
To do that though, you have to tell good stories and you're around an amazing, amazing level of creators from, from all sizes. Can you break down some storytelling, like structure and spines and kind of frameworks that you guys have for putting together? Because I've watched a significant amount of your videos, Barons, et cetera. Like, I've watched a lot of the videos even down to your guys's short form content. But most people that create short form content aren't good at long form or the narrative aspects. Right. If I, if I'm scripting something informational and it's, you know, it's about good content versus bad content, that is entirely different than something that's a narrative based where I'm like, yeah, yeah, fuck, I just turned 30 and I, you know, I'm saying like, and I'm going into like this, this story. How and where would you advise I start with actually putting together a good narrative? That is interesting.
- [14:11]
B
Yeah, I think first, like, it's interesting your point about like, short form to long form, because a lot of the folks that we've brought on that have done the best at short form, like, started on long form because you build such a longer, like, muscle towards like. Yeah, you know, if you can get a million people to pay attention to a 30 minute video about your life, then all of a sudden, like, obviously, like 60 seconds becomes a lot easier, I think. Like, so it was funny because with the camp videos, we were stuck at a certain scale because we were almost a little too pretentious with our brand. It was like really pretty stuff. But we're like, wait a second, this is very inaccessible, right? And so that's when we started scripting out more of our stuff. And I guess, like, one of the frameworks we use is like, first just always looking at something and being like, why should I care? And like, Baron actually gave us great advice. He's like, you know, people would care. You need to make people care about the characters because then whatever the characters do, like, they'll end up paying attention. And we're like, okay. One of the narratives is like, we're camp studios, we're trying to change the film industry or we're trying to, you know, sell these tickets to this movie. But then the other, like, narrative on top of that is like, we're a bunch of 20 year olds, like in this old school building trying to, to make something happen, trying to change Hollywood, right? And like, that's such a more compelling narrative, which is like more personal. And so I think always like, peeling back to like the meta narrative, like, one layer deeper of like, okay, but like, really what is happening here? What would most people resonate with? I think that was really helpful for like, a lot of stories. I think, like, personally, a lot of the early stuff I did on YouTube was really just like, put the camera up and then go about my life for three months. And then I would feel some change in me and be like, okay, hold on. Boom, I got something. Let me go back to that footage and like, tell the story backwards. It was like a form of journaling. It was very like, cathartic to go through that. So that's how I initially started.
- [15:58]
A
But was there any structure to that when you would kind of reverse engineer, like, if. Because there is a lot of. I mean, there's even a wave on the brand side where the founder is documenting the entire. Right. Like, you saw kind of Daniel Dallin, I think, launched this, like, new phase of, of vlogging more cinematic More narrative where you are filming an entire week and then putting it into like a 10, 15 minute video where it's like obviously heavily inspired by Casey, but it is different. If somebody is doing that, how would you then look at it and say, hey, like here's how you could structures in a way where then it's not boring because I've done two and two is not a lot to, you know, two at bats is not a lot, but I've done two. And they both missed. Right. But the way they were pieced together was sequential versus maybe like emotional or like more narrative versus it just being like, hey, I did this on Monday, I did this on Tuesday. Like I didn't center it around maybe like something that we were trying to accomplish. And like, did we accomplish or not? Like, how would you then look at my video as an example and. Or anybody who's like filmed a week and then rip it apart to be like, hey, here's how you need to form it into something that somebody wants to pay attention to?
- [17:10]
B
Yeah, that's a really good question. I think a lot of it comes down to the craft of it. I struggle to sometimes see the bigger picture because I love editing and I love getting into it. Right. And so like, even with the content, like, like I'm technically CMO and there are people under me and like they're working on the content. But I'd edit a lot of those short form videos you see, I'd write really out of them. Yeah, like be very involved. Because the way my brain works is like, even when we work with these brands, I'm like thinking about the actual content itself. So I'm like very nut in that way. I think a lot of it comes down to like the editing, the pacing, like how. What are you making people feel? Right? Like, I think for me it's more like in that nitty gritty of like actually being in the timeline and making those changes than to be like, here's the structure, the narrative and that sort of thing. I think it's more of like a feeling thing there, at least for myself. Like I've never been able to sort of plan out something beforehand. I usually get in the edit and I have all this footage and I play a song that like makes me feel a certain way. And we're okay, here we go, here it is. And so I'm sure there's something I can explain under that. I just haven't really examined it or gone deeper into like, okay, what is a strategy here? It's more of like, how do I feel? And, like, how fun is it? Because I feel like every creative has that moment where they're editing something. You probably have this a ton of times where you're like, 2am and you're, like, freaking out. You're like, I'm the best. Like, I just made this thing. It's dope. And maybe tomorrow morning you're like, nah, screw that. But, like, in the moment, you have that. And I think we're all chasing that feeling. And I think what I found is, like, when I feel that way about something, it always performs better. Some people are like, okay, the stuff I love, like, doesn't perform and like, this. But for some reason, when I feel that in the edit, it's like, that thing will do better. And so that's always what I follow. I'm very granular. So not very much like the group narrative picture, more like an actual edit itself.
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A
We'll go granular in a second there. What's funny is I remember a moment like that for me when I first did a hyperlapse.
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B
Yeah.
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A
And, like, I did a tutorial, and then I remember being in. I sort of got, like, in Barcelona, and I was like, I was walking, you know, taking, like, having it perfectly set up. Take a picture.
- [19:08]
B
Yeah, walk, walk, walk.
- [19:09]
A
Right? And I did this for, like, ever. And I remember putting in premiere. I'm like, okay, let's do this thing. Let's follow the tutorial. And then it hit, and I put warp on it, and it was so smooth. I was like, oh, my gosh, I'm the best. Like, we're gonna be like, Beautiful Destinations Part 2 over here. Like, yeah, I just remember that moment. I didn't know that you scripted a lot of the actual videos that. That are on your guys's page. Can you walk me through granularly that process? Let's just. Let's take an idea. Or if you want to take a video that you've already published in. In the past, like, yeah, I think one of your colleagues is top one. Is like, if Hollywood is dying, why.
- [19:44]
B
So that's when I. I wrote and edited and like, we had a moment there. Shout out Caleb Shaw, one of my friends. Like, he was in the office, and he actually helped me, like, sound design it. But we were freaking out because that was the first time we did something where we were like, okay, we've been too pretentious with our brand. Let's go more direct. Right. And so I think how we broke that down was first, like, what's the story? Here. What's really interesting, like, I think when we first moved into that office, we met this lady Carrie. She's really nice. She actually, her and her husband founded Alamo Drafthouse, like a theater chain. And the first thing she asked us is, oh, you're a film company. Like, how do you have money? Like, how? Basically, like, it's her building, we're renting out. And so that got me thinking, like, everyone associates film to, like, basically losing a bunch of money. And so there's an automatic tension there. And so we realized we have a great opportunity to tell a narrative of, like, you know, Hollywood's dying. That's what everyone's saying. So why are we building a film company? Like, that's a really, like, obvious question that anyone would kind of look at us and be like, what are you doing? Why aren't you building, like, a tech product? Why aren't you building whatever? And so I think it's playing the music, going through it, like, realizing, okay, that's the biggest thing. Realizing that, okay, first we need to talk about the industry to set up, like, some of the problem. And then we always need to go into, like, our personal, like, us. Because obviously, at the end of the day, if people care about the people, then they'll watch anything. And so you kind of set up this bigger picture. You talk about the issues with the industry, what we're seeing that there's a lot of resonance with. Because I think in Hollywood and in the film industry, there's a lot of, like, energy that's like, pent up, right? Whether it's like, animosity or just like, feeling like there's opportunity, whatever it is, there's a lot of people that have opinions. And so we'd like, address that. And then we go into, like, we're Camp Studios, we're a group of these 20 year olds trying to do this. And so that last part's more like building our personal narrative, right? But a lot of it also is like, okay, we'll draft out that first thing, feel it out, and then like, just rip it apart. Obviously, like, you probably do this as well, where it's just like, destroying the script. And then eventually we get to a place where it's like, okay, this makes sense. And then we were really hype about it. I remember, like, jumping up and down with everyone being like, yo, this is it.
- [21:47]
A
You were jumping up and down, looking.
- [21:48]
B
At the script, looking at the video when we first put it together. Oh, this is crazy. And so that was a great feeling. And then, like, that video did well, probably because we felt that way towards it. Right. And so, yeah, that's kind of breaking down some of the process there.
- [22:00]
A
And then what about, like, pacing and delivery? And I mean, even in that video, I think there's like a. What's her name? That.
- [22:07]
B
Christina.
- [22:07]
A
Christina. She. She has, like, a really good pause that she does on, like, the delivery of the first line. And I think there's like a crash zoom as well. Yeah, right. Like, how do you think about then those details of. Okay, we have this line. How do we make it more dramatic? How do we get someone's attention even more? Right. Like, if obviously those first three seconds are so important, like, how do we create the most impact in those. Those three seconds? How do you think about, like, those little details?
- [22:32]
B
I think it's just very intuitive, but, like, we're probably thinking about that subconsciously. But it's very much like running around. Like, here are this lines. Like, let's. What is a shot here? And, like, it also helped that we were in that old school building, so we knew that it would look like a set, and, like, it'll be visually interesting wherever we went in that building. And so I kind of just like, like, ran around with Christina and we're like, oh, this line feels weird. Like, what do you think about this? Or she was, like, helping write a lot of it too. And yeah, it was very much just run and gun, like, impromptu. Probably some element of my head's like, okay, if we zoom in, have some motion, they'll do better. But I'm not really thinking that. It's just, like, more subconscious, I guess.
- [23:03]
A
One thing that drives me crazy a little bit about my content is that it's nine out of ten times, like, stationary. Right. Like, it's always just talking head. You guys have mastered the ability to do take what talking head is like, some kind of information that you're saying, but change.
- [23:18]
B
Yeah.
- [23:19]
A
Where it's said, you know, or even changing. Like, if it's first start straight on, and then all of a sudden, like, the next line kind of naturally goes like this, and the next one goes, yeah, this. It's like it. It puts it in a way where it's so engaging. How do you think about that from a retention perspective and how important it is to. To content? And then how would you even. Actually, I'll make this a selfish question. How would you look at my content and be like, okay, cool, like, you have a good set. How can I structure it in a way where I can add more motion? I Could add more engaging elements between my points, etc.
- [23:51]
B
Yeah, I think, like, so we're very inspired by, like, Cheetah Rajan, the guy that's doing the Virginia cabin. Like, I don't know if you've seen this, but he's like the goat. He kind of invented that format, I'd say, where he's, like, documenting the story of him building a cabin in Virginia, you know, that guy, like, wellness retreat. And so we're like, okay, how do we do this? But in our way, right? So that was our first level of inspiration. And it's obviously like, okay, we have a set of rules. We need to shoot on, like, the Sony. We need to make it look good, we need to color grade. There was a lot of internal, like, conflict, honestly, at that time, where it's like, ah, this feels like we're playing the game too much. And so this whole, like, debate. But, like, we eventually landed on something in the middle, but very inspired by his work and kind of what he had put forward. So it was very easy to take that as inspiration, I would say, for this space. Like, I think the main thing is, like, the instantly, like, most fun thing, I think, is, like, the fact that there's all those weights over there from your house. And I think even telling the story of that and like, realizing the scale of, like, the place that I'm in and not feeling that in the video somehow, I think is like something interesting where it's like you could be like a crazy wide of you, like, standing on the railing or something, you know, and like, showing more of, like, this space. I think, again, I keep going back to the gym because I think it's just so interesting having all the gym equipment there and the story behind that, right? So I think people, like, any creative, like, dreams about having a space like this, right? And so I think capitalizing on that, sometimes it might be good to, like, go as wide as you can. I'm sure you've done videos like this. Like, I haven't gone through everything, but, like, I think there'd be some benefit to that because I think the space is just, like, so cool and like, how you have it laid out, you know?
- [25:25]
A
Thank you. Yeah, I think it's part of. It is like, we just got this cycle built and so naturally you're like, that's the. The flashy baby, right? Like, the flashy thing that I want to make content in. But at the same time, I. Because I. I swear to God, I watch you guys videos all the time for references to Be like, okay, like they're really in three spots, but it feels like they're in 15 different spots because they're changing maybe like the camera angle etc, and like, I need to do that.
- [25:48]
B
Yeah.
- [25:49]
A
And then I look at like what you said. Like, I've thought about, okay, how can I do shots up there coming out of the bathroom. Right. Like, there's so many ways I could add variables to the content that even, like, because I see the sets, I'm attaching like content formats and ideas to sets.
- [26:02]
B
Yeah.
- [26:03]
A
And so I want to be able to like, okay, what are things I could do to add motion or just like that are engaging, that I then maybe bring me into the set. And then when I'm in the set, like, little other things that I can do to make it engaging. But I gotta figure, I gotta figure that stuff out. And I think part of that too is like a lot of my content because it's so information based. I get so stuck on the actual information that I'm gonna say that I don't think about the shot list or the storyboard. Right. Of like, what if, you know, if I added like five things that made it a little bit more interesting and that's maybe 20 extra minutes can make a world of a difference. Like that could be the difference between 20,000 views and 250,000 views.
- [26:41]
B
Yeah. I think, like, to Max, my co founders credit and Chris, like, so we were, we're somewhere in the summer, I think I was like, in Australia. We're taking a month off after the festival and like our event series afterwards. And like they had sent me a text and they were looking for like an office space. So like, okay, cool. Like, they're like, Max is like the space guy. Like, he's always on Zillow just like searching, like on the toilet. Like, that's what he does. And like, he found our house that we lived in last year. So I'm like, I trust us. Curious. Yeah, I trust him. Yeah, exactly. And so then I come, come back and they're like, we got it. Like, what do you mean? And at first I was like, dude, we're not spending all this money on this. Like, like freaking, like, whatever, we don't need this. But then also being able to see it as an investment in like the videos we make and like telling that story. Like, a lot of people would get on calls with us and be like, oh, you're the guys that are in that old school building. And it's like, that's maybe they saw a few things Maybe they don't even remember what we said, but they at least remember that as a set. And so I'm like, okay, like, the. That investment isn't purely just a space investment now. It's like the content. I'm sure that's how you think about this place as well. Right. But, like, that was cool too, because, like, I don't know if I alone would have been able to have the balls to just pull the trigger on that. But that's sort of what they're thinking through as well. And all of us are creators ourselves, so we're kind of always like, you know, thinking about that. That sort of thing.
- [27:56]
A
Dude. Yeah. I was nervous for like, the three weeks before I pulled the trigger on.
- [28:00]
B
Yeah, it's scary. It's very scary. Yeah.
- [28:02]
A
Everything's, you know, three years and I'm like, okay, like, that's a big commitment. And then it's always, you know, things work out in funny ways where I was listening to someone who's like, if you're. If something is making you very uncomfortable, but it feels right, it's probably right.
- [28:18]
B
Yeah. How do you feel about it now? Like, being in the space, building it out.
- [28:20]
A
Very. Right.
- [28:21]
B
Yeah.
- [28:21]
A
You know what I mean? From two ends. On the business side, as in, like, with the clients we work with, we've been able to. We've had this cycle for probably two weeks, bro. We've probably shot in it like eight out of those 14 days.
- [28:34]
B
That's sick.
- [28:35]
A
And like, built. And some days had like, multiple shoots. Like, the team was here shooting in the morning, then they shot something, I think, like midday for a completely different brand, and then at night did a photo shoot in it.
- [28:45]
B
Yeah.
- [28:45]
A
You know, I'm saying it's like we're making that from.
- [28:47]
B
Already pays back. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [28:49]
A
And then on my end, I'm able to churn out more content and better content. Content that I'm more proud of. Yeah. Because of the set. I as much as, like, I like the green screen videos. Anybody can make them. Right. Like, I can. I could make a video that goes viral today, and then, like, the next person takes my information, does the same Green screen video, they can't replicate the set. They can't replicate. If I'm in here moving around, like, doing a storyboard and a shot list and like, you know, working with McCoy or working with Charles, like, making the best video possible, they can't replicate that. Or it's going to take a lot for them to replicate it. And that friction is going to cause them not to replicate it.
- [29:22]
B
Yeah.
- [29:23]
A
And so, like, that investment in that thought process to me was big as well. It was like, okay, I'm going to do things in here that people aren't willing to do. It's very easy to copy somebody. It's very easy to be like, to just rip information or rip a style that, you know, is, is not hard to do, but it takes a lot more effort to be like, yo, I'm about to drop $1500 just to build out a set.
- [29:46]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [29:47]
A
And for an idea that might flop, you know what I mean? Like, about, like this whole lab area for like a specific set that we're, we're doing, it might flop. But I'm excited about the idea, which I think is like the, the fun part, you know what I mean? To be excited about the idea and to come in here and try to make an amazing piece of content. So to me, looking back at it, you know, looking back at 2, the last two months, like, the best thing.
- [30:09]
B
Yeah.
- [30:10]
A
And then once I have the gym in here too, like, fully set up and like put in a place where I lift and the team lifts, like, that's when it's gonna be.
- [30:17]
B
Yeah, that's like, this is a dream. This is like what you drew. Like having a space like this, right? You have the. I love it. You know, like, you have everything. Like, you have this, the cycle. So it's like, I love it. You know, that's like anything leaning into that as like a narrative is like so strong because it's like, you know, everyone wants a space like this. At the end of the day, the.
- [30:35]
A
The follow along series I've been brainstorming on is like, watch us take our, our creative studio from seven figures to eight figures. And they're like, it almost being like a reality show in here.
- [30:46]
B
Yeah, I like that.
- [30:47]
A
Like, and I think that's really cool because it's like. Yeah, at that point, you're following along. I, I would share the numbers, I'll share what we're doing, how we're scaling our growth, you know, the things that, that we're up to and like, how we're investing into this space and into the team and into the equipment, etc. Like, I think that could be. I think it'd be interesting.
- [31:05]
B
Definitely. We had this, like, bit going because, like, oh, it's so funny. My co founders, Chris, he, he has the Steve Jobs book, like the Walter Isaacson one. And like, we all have that book, right? And so he was reading it and then he'd start he'd make this an inside joke where he'd, like, carry it everywhere he went. So, like, he'd be in New York, and he'd be like, take a look. And he'd, like, whip out Steve Jobs face. And then eventually, like, I don't know what happened to that book. I think we were on the tour and, like, one of our friends, Cody, like, he accidentally ripped it, and it was, like, this whole, like, traumatic experience, but it became like, an inside joke for the team. And then one of the things we did is we bought the Elon Musk book and, like, showed up to the. Yeah, the Walter Isaacson one. And we had that in the office, and it just became such an inside joke with, like, one of our interns at the time, Sam. And so we almost made it, like, a little bit in some of our videos where we had in the background and stuff like that. And, like, when you have a space space like that and you have recurring characters, it's like, almost a show, you know, like, the funny inside jokes, like, and it was just funny for us. And, like, I'm sure, like, I think that's the benefit of having, like, a recurring space is like, you can kind of build that world around it where it feels kind of like. I'm not sure if you're a big fan of yes Theory, but, like, I was a huge fan. And, like, the first time I went to the yes House, I'm like, holy crap. Like, I seen this, and, like, you know, and so there's something to that where you can build, like, this. This world in the space.
- [32:19]
A
Did you have BPN Bear performance?
- [32:20]
B
Yes.
- [32:20]
A
Yeah. Nick Bear. I just went to their facility on Wednesday, and it was kind of that moment of like, okay, I've been following you guys forever. You guys been putting out, like, cinematic masterpieces from a brand, dude.
- [32:32]
B
The half iron man or the. Not the. Yeah, I'm running a half iron man. So I've been watching the full Iron man training series from Nick Barrett.
- [32:37]
A
It's crazy.
- [32:38]
B
And, like, it's so beautifully done. Like, those hands are crazy.
- [32:41]
A
They're crazy. I don't know if you saw. And I'm gonna actually dive into a bit, but, like, if you saw the one called Surrender. Did you see that?
- [32:48]
B
Is that where he's just running, like, one street?
- [32:50]
A
No, it's like the. The people competing against each other. It was a race that they just had. You should watch that. That is like an hour and 30 minutes. They actually premiered it at a movie theater.
- [32:57]
B
Oh, wow. That's awesome.
- [32:58]
A
Yeah. And it was a whole thing. They sold out all tickets for it.
- [33:01]
B
Like, wow, that's awesome. Yeah, that's great.
- [33:05]
A
But it was a cinematic masterpiece. And actually I'll segue now. I think what I just did a podcast episode with. I don't know if, you know, Tatum Brant is. But with Tatum Brandt. And we talk about 2026 brand predictions, you know, to. It was 2026 brand predictions to build a cult following. One of the ones I put on there is brands are going to start making movies because I, I, and I wholeheartedly believe that. I think BPN's a great example of it. You should watch that film that I'll send it to you called Surrender, where they held this race called the Last Man Standing race where it was like four mile loop every hour until somebody gives up, until there's only one person, like, standing.
- [33:42]
B
Oh, I, I've heard of this. I saw a Buy maximize, like reel on Instagra about it. Yeah.
- [33:47]
A
Yes. Yeah. And so it was a crazy event where basically everybody gave. There was 50 runners. I think everybody gave up at like max 120 miles. And then there, there were these two kids like in their early, early 20s that they kept going, bro. And they kept going until 240 miles.
- [34:05]
B
Wow.
- [34:06]
A
And then they got rained down. Like there was leather. But the whole thing was like two parts. They went live during the entire team, during, during the entire thing. So, like, you got to actually see it unfold. Right. Which was huge. And then the, the content team was also focused on, hey, we know we're going to make a doc on this. Like, we're going to make a movie about this. And they did. And it was literally a cinematic masterpiece, I think from an infinity side. When you look at what you're, what you're referencing of like these narrative relationships or this narrative capital, a brand like BPN has so much affinity because they literally have like hundreds and hundreds of short films and like movies around the brand that when you buy product, bro, like, there's no convincing factor.
- [34:50]
B
Yeah.
- [34:50]
A
You know what I'm saying? Like, it's such a different relationship where I don't look at price. I'm not re. I'm not trying to get. Have the landing page convert me. I mean, yeah, I was converted. You know what I'm saying? Like, and, and that's like, it's like that for a few brands. It used to be like that for me with Nike because Nike would put out like these amazing commercials and you'd feel such, such a type of way about the Commercials where like, and they weren't doing movies but you feel such a type of way where we're just gonna buy the thing. And I think like it even happened with the Last Dance, like the Netflix documentary.
- [35:22]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've seen that.
- [35:23]
A
It was like if you look at how Jordan shoes spiked after the Last Dance, it was crazy because it's like bro, they just watched.
- [35:30]
B
I mean that doc was like I was so hyped up, you know, Best dog.
- [35:34]
A
It's always like my background dog.
- [35:36]
B
Yeah, it's so good, so good.
- [35:38]
A
But it was like ten 45 minute episodes of just like beautiful cinematic like masterpiece. I'm curious to hear your thoughts on. Do you think more brands are going to be making films?
- [35:48]
B
Yeah, 100%. They're already trying to do with some of the micro drama stuff like on short form I think like, and that's sort of like why like now my role is like cmo. So I was leading the marketing and all the content and now I'm shifting more towards like building out this back end agency around camp because like, oh, interesting. A lot of brands have come to us for certain things and we're like, well we, we can go build a team and go do this thing for you and then come back to like the main thing. But then we're realizing like, like I don't know. And a lot of these startups and brands aren't recognizing this yet, which is kind of frustrating. But like as these tools evolve, as AI evolves, like the differentiating factor is going to be storytelling. So it's like you need to invest in that and like, yeah, you can explain it to these folks like, oh, like good brand, like lowest CAC over time, whatever, like that sort of thing. But like I think the stickiness of products in the future for consumers will depend on like how good the storytelling team is or how good like the. Again, BPN's doing a great job at that. Like when I'm training for this thing now I'm just going to use like BPN subs. Like it's obvious now, right. And so I, I definitely think they are. I think they have to like the best brands. They, they need to invest in telling their brand story at the highest level because that's going to be one of the only like moats in the future, I believe.
- [37:01]
A
I agree too. I, and I was watching or I was listening to something from a founder's podcast. I don't know if you were listening. Yeah, and he was talking about like Red Bull was talking about or the founder of Red Bull was talking about Red Bull as a company that like, we're not an energy drink, we're a marketing conglomerate.
- [37:15]
B
Yeah.
- [37:15]
A
He's like, we are literally a production team. Like we are putting on movies for our customers around like the idea of Red Bull. Right. Red Bull gives you wings. Our movies are going to be like the process in the showing of you getting those wins. And I just think there's such a relationship between long form content and like cinematic content. To then a consumer being like die hard fan forever.
- [37:37]
B
Yeah.
- [37:37]
A
You know what I mean? Like the same way with Harry Potter, it's like people watch and I know that's an extreme example, but you can like, you do it for Marvel, you could do it for Star wars, you could do it for Harry Potter, you could do it. I mean even for smaller movies that people like rock, like Rocky's huge, but like, you know what I'm saying, there's still even smaller movies that, you know, even if you're not building next Star wars, there's a small set of Star wars or an idea that's like a smaller version of Star wars that's gonna pop and have like this die hard audience that you can make a lot of money from or you're gonna have a die hard audience from. And like, I think too with where social and content is going in and like the way we consume, we are picking the brands that we identify with from like a value perspective.
- [38:18]
B
Yeah.
- [38:18]
A
You know, like we're not just buying a shirt anymore because it's cool. It's like. No, I feel a specific kind of way about this in life around like these kinds of values is how I live my life, whatever. And so therefore I take these supplements. Right. Or I buy this shirt or I buy this hat and that. I don't think there's many things that could influence that more than long form.
- [38:40]
B
100. 100. That's the coolest thing though too, to be able to like, I've been thinking a lot of this because I, I just went home to Michigan and like it's a very different environment. Like it's, it's very like chill, like Midwest. Like all my friends are kind of working their traditional jobs, that sort of thing. And people love Michigan football. Like I grew up a Michigan football fan. Right. Like people are die hard Michigan football fans. And it made me realize like there is, there's not a lot of things you grow up and like really care about, like outside, like your family, your friends, maybe like you work the same job, whatnot. For a long period of time. But, like, I think the coolest thing about telling stories is, like, you can create things that people care about in that way. Like. Like, a lot of people go to Michigan football games and it, like, gives their life so much meaning because it's like something to look forward to, something to talk about, something to, you know, consume content about. Like, kind of be in this community in the same way, like Harry Potter and that sort of thing. And. And I think, like, that's why I find exciting is, like, when you tell stories, you can create things that people see themselves in and.
- [39:40]
A
Yeah.
- [39:40]
B
Actually care about. Because if you think about the amount of things you're going to care about for the rest of your life, it might not be a lot of different things, which is a kind of like a sad thing to realize. And so I've been tinkering with that idea. It's not, like, fully fleshed out, but I think there's something there where I'm like. Like, I care about that story of Michael Jordan watching that doc. And, like, it means something to me. And, like, that's super special, you know, 100.
- [40:02]
A
I think the stories extend the life cycle of the things you care about. Yeah. You know, drastically. I read a study, I think this is last year, where if I wanted to buy a piece of furniture, right? And I go to Ikea and I buy that thing and I buy a piece of furniture for my house, it's like, cool. I bought that piece of furniture. Nothing special about it. I don't care if it gets dinged up, hurt, even if it costs a thousand dollars, right. $2,000. It's like, it happened if I go to a garage sale and I start talking to someone and they're like, oh, it hurts me to, like, sell this, but I need to sell it because it's passed down from my great grandpa to the grandpa to my dad and now me. And, like, I'm the one that now has it. You will cherish that and value that so much more than the thing that you got just because of the story that's attached to it.
- [40:45]
B
Yeah.
- [40:45]
A
And when you start thinking about through that perspective and then as like a founder and you're launching a product or whatever, and you think about, like, the idea of investing in brand. This is brand. It's like there's a story attached to this product. Right. Like, there's a. There is something here that I associate with that is so powerful that, like, I'm always going to choose this product. And that is a very, very impactful thing.
- [41:07]
B
Very, very impactful thing, 100%. I've been thinking about the idea of like artists, but then also thinking about like in that BPN example, for example, like you're making the best films about these athletes and then you end up having these die hard fans that become beacons for other athletes. And then you just kind of like compound on that in the same way. I've been thinking a lot about like a lot of these brands. I want to appeal to like creators and creatives and artists and that sort of thing. And just realizing like, you kind of have to be more gentle when it comes to like the artists of the world because they, they are the signal like when it comes to like what is cool, what is. How is culture. You can't really buy culture, right? But these folks who are like, maybe harder to work with that are like more of these creatives that won't sell out or anything like that to, to, to sort of cater to those folks in a way that isn't like, okay, we're going to pay you this much to do this, like, hey, actually go and do something crazy, super creative, right? Like you can kind of like make this ecosystem where it's like you have these artists who like revere your brand and help build your brand up because they are the signal for culture of like what is cool, you know. And so I'm thinking a lot about that as well.
- [42:13]
A
Tell me more about actually work that you guys have, have done and produced. So I know we were talking about this before, but you guys did something with Baron, American Baron, where you guys launched basically a film in less than 100 days. I won't spoil the, the details. Walk me through that. Because that seems, let me give context for anybody that's listening. Doesn't produce a lot of content. Sometimes it takes us 45 days to put together a short form series from like casting logistics, the settings, the scripting, the shot list and like, and even for like a big campaign, it could take us that's going to be like maybe 18 pieces of content. Could take us 100 days.
- [42:53]
B
100, really?
- [42:53]
A
You know what I'm saying? Like 120 days. Something, something along those lines, you guys put something together, a movie for that, you know.
- [43:01]
B
Yeah.
- [43:01]
A
In 100 days. Walk me through that process. How much did it cost? How much do you think it's going to return for Baron? Like how, how is it beneficial to him as well? Like walk me through that.
- [43:12]
B
Yeah. So creator camp started as a series of events. So it was sort of myself like taking A gap year from college and, like, being, like. Like, I'm super lonely. Where the creatives that, like, think in this vein of, like, not optimizing for the algorithm, but, like, making meaningful stuff. And so we went on this journey of, like, bringing together these creatives, artists, musicians, through these series of events, basically building at break even, but realizing, like, there's something here, there's something special. That's where we met Baron, was through one of our events. And that's where Baron met Caroline, co writer, co lead, at one of the events. Wow. And we realized, okay, like, we're gonna host this film festival because we realized, like, where this is going. A lot of these creatives, like, they, okay, the events are cool, but, like, what do we work on now? And we thought one of the cool things was, like, these people are making stuff on, like, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, that are, like, really, really good. Like, they could live on the big screen. And so that kind of got us thinking, okay, let's host this film festival. Like, what does it look like for the Internet to have their own Sundance? And there's, like, this. We. We felt this, like, overlap, this niche of people that, like, really cared about, like, the Gox or the Nile Linds or these, like, storytellers on YouTube. Like, we wanted to be somewhere, and so we made a film festival for them. And part of it was like, hey, we have 100 days. We're going to pick a cohort of folks, and we're going to give them funding. And Baron, we actually told him like, a month before, we're like, we might want to do a feature film with you at some point. Because that's when the idea of, like, being a film studio popped up. But he hadn't worked on it. And we're like, okay, screw it. You're going to be part of the cohort. All these nine people are going to make a short film, and then you're going to make a feature film. And so the nine short films we gave them, I think it was like 10 to 15,000 each. And there's just, like, short film projects, like, you know, 20 minutes long and then there. And we gave them $100,000 budget to go out and make this thing. And, yeah, it was a crazy process. Like, they wrote it in 12 days, just him and Caroline just riffing. And these are, like, the most talented folks I've ever met. So I think I was just very trusting in that process. All of us were. But, like, literally, they're. They're. They were riffing and Coming up with a movie while the person, Owen, our friend, who's scoring the movie, is scoring them, riffing and doing these bits because he doesn't have enough time to score after he gets all of it because we won't have enough time in post. So he's like live scoring them, like creating these lines. And it was just a very crazy process, I think. Like, it was move fast, break things. Definitely. There's definitely a lot of things we could have done better, but it was done out of the spirit of, like, okay, you're an Internet creator. You can move fast. That's the whole point. Like, you can create these ideas really quickly. And so shot by our friend Ethan, who's also a creator. JT was ac. He's also a creator. It was created purposely, I think they're only like four different locations so that we could like, shoot it reliably within that time frame on that budget. And so we just like went for it. And it was like, I know a few days. Like, there's no official script to this day. Like, it's just a. Scattered across different docs. But it came together and like, I think it was a great point. I was talking with Baron where it's like, it's not National Geographic quality. They're like warbles and like wobbles in the camp and that sort of thing. It's not locked off all the time. Sometimes it goes out of focus. But they're writing the writing, being the backbone. They're such great writers. And the story, like, has really impacted people in a. In a positive way. And so, yeah, I think it was. That's sort of how it came to life. It was very. Just thrown together.
- [46:24]
A
I mean, one crazy. I saw here, it sold out. 150k world premiere.
- [46:28]
B
Yeah, that was in Austin for the film festival. So that was like part of like all those short films we had. Baron sold out like 150k of tickets. People falling in from Austin, which was insane.
- [46:36]
A
Made your investment back.
- [46:37]
B
Yeah, yeah. So it was great just having that as like the place to kick it off. Right.
- [46:42]
A
And then now that I know the next layer of it is you guys are going to go us. You guys are going to go into US theaters and do a whole tour.
- [46:50]
B
Yeah.
- [46:50]
A
Right. With the estimating, I think it says targeting 5 to 10 million in revenue across all theaters and streaming. Yeah, if that happens, which I believe in you guys, that it will. That's a huge return.
- [47:03]
B
Definitely. Yeah, I think so.
- [47:05]
A
100K instead. 5, 10 mils.
- [47:07]
B
Yeah, I mean, that's the beauty of, like, narrative. Right, like, and also understanding that, like, the theatrical windowing system is like, very good at. It's still good. Like, the way Hollywood works of, like, you put it in theaters first and you build the groundswell of the buzz. You put it in more theaters, you get it out there, and then you have the window onto, like a streamer, that sort of thing. That business model is actually, like, really good at making money. And you think about it one from a perspective of, like, why I want to go into theaters is first. Like, you know, ticket sales versus, like, CPMs online or advertising dollars. It's like, much different. But then also, like, culturally, like, we only have so many marketing resources ourselves to, like, push out. But the word of mouth, actually, we're starting to feel a little bit, which has been great. So, yeah, the biggest launch will be January 23rd, where we're targeting like, 500 plus theaters across the U.S. also, like Australia, I think, like UK, Berlin, Paris. And so that's when we hear goes, why is possible. Yeah. So we created a map where we had people pin their location of, like, where they are and where they want to watch the movie. That way we could go to the theaters and be like, hey, I know we're like, unconventional. I know we're not spending millions on marketing this, but we have 100, 200 people in your city that said they want to watch this. And so we have to build things like that. Yeah, that's working so far. Like, everywhere we've gone where that has a lot of pins, like, it'll sell out. So Those first, like, 30 theaters and the 30th years, again, have all sold out, which has been hugely awesome.
- [48:28]
A
Congrats.
- [48:28]
B
Appreciate it. Yeah, it's really cool.
- [48:30]
A
That's amazing. Walk me through. Because I already know 2026 is going to be huge if you guys have done some of these things in this year. Walk me through. What does the vision for you guys look like? 2026. I know you're probably in 2026 planning right now and in the fun of it too. Right. Like, it's so fun to look at. This is what we're going to achieve. Here's how we're going to achieve it. Walk me through that.
- [48:50]
B
Yeah. So 2026, I think for the most part, like, obviously the first thing is going to be like, the film tour, potentially getting, like, distribution and streaming, that sort of thing. So figuring that out. The thing about indie films is, like, there's a film called Hundreds of Beavers. That's a good case Study that we based a lot of this off of. They spen something k. And then I think they did like 1 to 2 million in the box office and they just kept going. And we realized a lot of these indie films, like, you can kind of just be like, hey, we're in 100 theaters this weekend, or you scale down and scale up. It's very different than your traditional, like, yo, we have this opening worldwide release and then it's in theaters for a month, then it's going somewhere else. Indie films operate on a different timeline, which is great. So probably do that widest release and then still like do some stuff with the film. And then I think for us is like building out more, even more like IP film projects, potentially doing another film festival. Because I think like, we just want to be the center of this movement of like showing creators that, hey, you can get your work on a big screen. And I think that's like really core to us. And another thing is obviously like building out the back end, the agency, that sort of thing. And so we have like events, film and then like commercial projects. And that's sort of like the ecosystem.
- [49:56]
A
What's the commercial project side of it?
- [49:59]
B
That's sort of like we do like one off launch videos, campaigns. We did stuff with Spotify Notion, that sort of thing. Run organic social for brands, that sort of thing. And so because we realized, like, we're really good at doing these like really big things where it's like, we'll take 100 creators to Switzerland and we'll work our asses off for like a year and then it's like this massive crash and there's just like spike in revenue, spike in like morale. But then we're like, okay, how do you build a more like something sustainable, Right? Yeah. And that's a lot of fun.
- [50:25]
A
A lot of.
- [50:25]
B
Yeah, exactly. It's like a lot of this film, we put so much of like everything we had into it and we're like, okay, how nice would it be if like it was just a side project? We're like, okay, like, you know, we, we don't need to push that hard, that sort of thing, or we don't need to risk everything on. Right. And so want to build that out. And also a lot of like creators in our community, they want to direct and write and stuff, but they're. You don't go from that to straight to a feature film. Like you could go to directing commercial, that sort of thing, then scale up. But yeah, those are the three sort.
- [50:54]
A
Of buckets that's exciting.
- [50:55]
B
We're working on.
- [50:56]
A
Yeah, that's exciting, man. I appreciate you big time for. For coming on, dude.
- [51:00]
B
Thanks for having me.
- [51:01]
A
I could literally go for another hour. The problem is I have meetings stacked to the brim today.
- [51:06]
B
Yeah.
- [51:06]
A
If not, I'd cancel them. And if they weren't onboarding calls, I would cancel them and just stay here. But the fact that you're in Austin now, we will run often and I think we could do. We'll bring Brian in, and if you want to bring your co founders, we could do like a big round.
- [51:23]
B
Yeah, that would. Cool, dude.
- [51:24]
A
Sick.
- [51:25]
B
Yeah. Yeah.
- [51:26]
A
I don't know if this cycle is big enough. Maybe we could.
- [51:28]
B
We'll figure it.
- [51:29]
A
But, like.
- [51:30]
B
And if you guys want to shoot in the school, like, let us know. Like, you have full access at any point. Like, it's really chill.
- [51:36]
A
So thank you.
- [51:36]
B
Thank you.
- [51:37]
A
Plug yourself though. Everything that you're doing. Plug your socials, plug Crater Camp, etc. Plug everything, please.
- [51:46]
B
Cool. Creator camp. Simon Kim at Simon Kim on Instagram, YouTube, that sort of thing. And yeah, we're. We're doing the thing. So check us out.
- [51:55]
A
Do the doing the thing. Follow them, support them if they hit a theater in Austin or wherever you are.
- [52:00]
B
Yeah, 2sleepypeople.com that's where you can check where the film's going next. So drop a pin.
- [52:05]
A
Oh, yeah. Thanks for coming on.
- [52:06]
B
Appreciate it, dude.
- [52:07]
A
Thank you.
- [52:07]
B
Heck, yeah.