Transform Your Brand's Aesthetic in 53 Minutes

Summary

Sweat Equity by Marketing Examined: Episode Summary - "Transform Your Brand's Aesthetic in 53 Minutes"

Release Date: February 4, 2025
Hosts: Alex Garcia & Brian Blum

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Introduction

In this episode of Sweat Equity by Marketing Examined, hosts Alex Garcia and Brian Blum delve deep into effective content strategies for transforming a brand's aesthetic. They explore real-world applications, exemplified by their experiences at the Wodapalooza event and the success story of Americana Pipe Dream. The discussion also touches upon navigating social media algorithms and overcoming challenges within the agency business.

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1. Americana Pipe Dream: A Case Study in Content-Led Growth

Brian Blum introduces Americana Pipe Dream, a brand centered around military surplus, achieving impressive annual revenues of $15 million without running a single advertisement. The brand's success is attributed to its creator-led and content-focused approach.

• Brian (02:15): “They don’t run a single ad, and yet they do around 15 million a year.”

This example underscores the potential of content-led growth as opposed to traditional product-led growth. Brian emphasizes the importance of mass-producing shareable content and leveraging a strong community to drive organic growth.

• Brian (03:02): “Content led growth was obviously the main way that software companies would grow and all they thought about was how to build growth loops into their product.”

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2. Executing a Live Content Strategy at Wodapalooza

The hosts share their firsthand experience executing a comprehensive content strategy during the Wodapalooza event. They aimed to move beyond traditional hype videos, focusing instead on creating a brand campaign that enhances the brand's perception.

• Alex (05:05): “...without focusing on Waterpalooza at the event, as in like recaps and shit like that of the day. It needed to be like a brand campaign.”

They developed the campaign "No Grit, No Glory", which served as the narrative backbone. This campaign was broken down into several content pillars:

1. One-Shot Heroic Videos: Capturing unseen moments of athletes' preparation and triumphs.

   • Alex (06:47): “One-shot heroic... you see everybody competing but you don't see that moment of LeBron James like sitting back and meditating.”

2. The Pit: Collaborating with an announcer to capture authentic, vulnerable interviews with athletes.

   • Alex (10:12): “We put a mic in her mic... and she would ask a specific question to open the door for vulnerability.”

3. Voiceovers: Narratives that delve into athletes' off-season preparations and personal rivalries.

   • Alex (10:50): “Voiceovers prepped that were kind of like in the mind... and we built narratives around those.”

4. Heroic Photography: Creating larger-than-life images that evoke iconic sports photography.

   • Alex (11:06): “Specific looks... like the old Muhammad Ali photos.”

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3. The Crucial Role of Dedicated Editing

A significant insight from the episode is the necessity of having separate roles for videographers and editors to handle high-volume content creation efficiently.

• Brian (13:13): “Having an editor that's very, very good because they're actually curating the output... it's a unique skill.”

Alex recounts how integrating a dedicated editor, Xander, who could perform day-of editing, was pivotal to their content strategy's success.

• Alex (12:03): “...put together a playbook for how they were going to execute Wodapalooza content.”

This separation ensures that videographers can focus solely on capturing quality footage while editors work in real-time to produce engaging content aligned with the brand's campaign pillars.

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4. Navigating Instagram’s Evolving Algorithms

The hosts discuss the challenges posed by Instagram's algorithm changes, which have affected content reach and engagement.

• Brian (44:07): “They were testing likes on your followers initially. And so last night, my video, the cookware thing, it's the biggest flop... exclusively non-followers.”

Alex shares a hack for leveraging Instagram's trial reels to increase follower count without over-relying on feed posts.

• Alex (43:46): “Publish your best performing content just as a trial, just as a trial reel, and then never put it onto the feed.”

However, both acknowledge the ongoing frustrations with fluctuating analytics and reduced engagement, emphasizing the need for adaptable strategies in social media marketing.

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5. Overcoming Business Challenges in the Agency World

The conversation shifts to the inherent challenges within the agency business, such as trading time for money, dealing with undesirable clients, and managing cash flow issues.

• Brian (36:13): “It's a horrible experience. I hate it so much.”

Alex reflects on his journey, highlighting the fulfillment found in executing successful campaigns versus the frustration of managing client relationships.

• Alex (37:32): “There are things that you do not like, and there's things that you like.”

They both express aspirations to transition from the agency model to creating their own products, seeking the dopamine rush of seeing their products used and appreciated by the community.

• Brian (38:59): “I want to get the dopamine of seeing someone in my stuff or seeing someone use my product.”

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6. Personal Insights and Social Media Dynamics

The hosts share personal anecdotes about navigating social media, including instances of content theft and the emotional rollercoaster of content performance.

• Brian (33:29): “I stole it. I did.”

• Alex (24:06): “And then like the one before that performed really well. And then the one like after a few days after got like 100k too.”

They discuss the volatile nature of social media engagement and the importance of resilience in the face of fleeting content success.

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7. Conclusions and Key Takeaways

The episode culminates with critical insights for marketers looking to transform their brand's aesthetic through strategic content:

1. Content-Led Growth Over Product-Led Growth: leveraging community and shareable content can drive substantial organic growth without heavy reliance on advertising.

2. Comprehensive Content Strategy: Developing a strong narrative with clear content pillars ensures consistent and impactful content delivery during events.

3. Separation of Roles: Assigning dedicated roles for videography and editing enhances content volume and quality.

4. Adaptability to Social Media Algorithms: Understanding and adapting to platform changes is crucial for maintaining content visibility and engagement.

5. Agency to Product Transition: Building proprietary products can offer greater fulfillment and potential for brand recognition beyond agency constraints.

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Notable Quotes

• Alex Garcia (05:05): “It needed to be like a brand campaign.”
• Brian Blum (02:15): “They don’t run a single ad, and yet they do around 15 million a year.”
• Brian Blum (13:13): “Having an editor that's very, very good because they're actually curating the output... it's a unique skill.”
• Alex Garcia (06:47): “Can you get those little moments that people don't always see... like that moment of LeBron James like sitting back and meditating.”

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This episode serves as a valuable resource for marketers aiming to enhance their brand's aesthetic through intelligent content strategies, effective role allocation, and adaptability to evolving social media landscapes.

Transcript

[A]

All right, guys, welcome back to another episode of Sweat Equity. Episode, I don't know, 64 or five.

[B]

Getting into the mid-60s.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like a man in his prime.

[A]

Exactly. Exactly what it is. Like LeBron.

[B]

Yeah. He'll be there 25 years.

[A]

Yeah. Coming back after two weeks. We haven't recorded. We got to double up. This episode has to go out in 24 hours. Just got to give some insight into the. To the people so that they understand the. Understand the grind.

[B]

There's urgency, you know, there's urgency for you guys.

[A]

This is going to get turned around in less than 24 hours.

[B]

Alex and I are extremely underpaid volunteers, but we love it. Anyway, dude, honestly, I'd rather get right into that. Let's just talk about Miami.

[A]

Yeah, man. It's actually today's two weeks, so I just got back yesterday, which was weird. I haven't been away for two weeks and what feels like a minute, but, yeah, that's going to be what I'm going to talk about today. We executed some. Some dope content and some dope. Just a dope strategy for. For tier overall for Wadapalooza and, like, how we built a team around it. What they were focused on, how, like, the process that we did. So I'm going to give a little bit of behind the scenes on that because I think it could be interesting for. For people to understand. Like, when you have an event, so many people spend money on having a videographer for the event to only get, like, a hype video at the end.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's such a waste of money. Like, hype videos suck. First off, like, nobody. You shouldn't even be making hype videos. So that's what I'm going to be getting into. What do you got?

[B]

Yeah. If this podcast can teach you one lesson, it's that volume is not actually hard to achieve. You just have to plan it out in advance. As long as you got a videographer there, everything can be kind of chopped up. Speaking of volume, so I want to talk about this brand. They are fascinating. It's called Americana Pipe Dream, and it's so creator led. I don't even know if I would call them. I don't know which came first, the business or the creator, because he's created a massive community around military surplus. So he's selling exclusively helmets and pants from a bygone era, like 1980s Swiss camouflage pants. And he doesn't run a single ad, and yet they do around 15 million a year.

[A]

Really.

[B]

To give you an idea of the Scale and execution of his organic content.

[A]

How'd this pop up on your timeline?

[B]

I've been out by the wayside since you left me. You went to Florida. I was all over scouring the Internet for ideas. No, honestly, I came across just similarly to how I found a lot of stuff. I heard about it through the grapevine. One of my buddies was like, hey, this is a brand that doesn't get talked about a lot as far as execution, but they're one of my favorites out. Which, by the way, if you have one of those brands, be sure to send it to us because, I mean, love to experience new things. Sometimes you got to get out of the American streetwear diaspora, if you will.

[A]

I don't know anything else outside of that.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. But this brand's crazy. It's really cool to see how creator led he is, how content led he is. I think something I'm going to really start trying to preach about is content led growth. So product led growth was obviously the main way that software companies would grow and all they thought about was how to build growth loops into their product. So how do I create this sign in functionality that requires someone to invite three friends and create some sort of network effect? And I think there's starting to be some ways for brands to think about content led growth, whether that's mass production of assets, whether that's making things that are very easily stitchable, shareable, you name it. But I think these guys did an amazing job. So I'm going to break that down. But, dude, talk to me. Wallapalooza.

[A]

Cool. So Wallapalooza, I don't know if you know, but it's like almost like a fitness festival right around.

[B]

A well known thing on this podcast is my fitness is hit or miss.

[A]

To say the least. Yeah. And so we went over there for basically a week to execute like Waterloo. So Waterpolooza goes from Thursday to Sunday. Right. And there's like individuals and then team events. Individuals. A lot of the tier athletes are some of the top athletes there. And the same thing for the team side. And so we went in with the game plan of. Okay, we had to put together. We had 72 hours to put together an entire content strategy for it. And so the main thing was the good or the good thing was they already had videographers that were going to be there. So they had this guy Chadrick and Carlos that were focused on a documentary.

[B]

Chadwick.

[A]

Chadwick. Yeah.

[B]

Dope.

[A]

Chadwick's awesome.

[B]

That's all you got to say.

[A]

They're Actually all awesome. But they had Chadwick and Carlos. They were focused on documentary, but they were following around two main athletes. This girl, Alexis Raptis, and then this guy, Ricky Garard the entire time. And so then there was Bennett. Bennett was focused on these 60 second short form documentaries. And. And then we had BK, who is a photographer. And then the missing piece that we added into the loop was Xander. And Xander was the editor, ironically.

[B]

So Xander's like, what an insane set of names. Yeah, you couldn't find a single normal bro at the street.

[A]

Not one. I mean, Carlos. You got Carlos.

[B]

That's true.

[A]

Yeah, we got Carlos.

[B]

That's true. Bringing it back in.

[A]

Yeah. The craziest thing about the entire thing was Xander lives in Paris.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Okay. Xander used to live in Austin. Like, we used to work with him in rare air stuff. And he moved to Paris and like, nobody's kind of ever seen him.

[B]

Like a true creative.

[A]

Yeah, Xander's my guy smoking cigs. But, like, Xander's just like that guy to like, just leave and never tell anybody. And then you kind of just find out from the grapevine that he's in Paris. And I was like, yo, like, we, we. We're gonna need you for two days to do not on site editing, but, like day of editing. So, like, we'll figure out a way to drop you all this footage you edit. And he's like, oh, dude, I'm actually going to get to Miami on Wednesday. And it was like the most. It just aligned perfectly. It was the weirdest thing, but it aligned perfectly. So what we had to do was put together a playbook for how they were going to execute Waterpalooza content. But it was. It didn't need to be focused on Waterplus at the event, as in like recaps and shit like that of the day. It needed to be like a brand campaign. Think winning isn't for everyone? That kind of level of a campaign had three days to do it. And then we had to be able to put together content pillars for that. And so what I want to start here with is how you can use an event to execute essentially a brand campaign. We had all of their athletes or a lot of their athletes at one place at one time. And so it was like, okay, how do we put together a brand campaign? Because they have a new initiative of leverage or, like, focusing on how people perceive the brand going into that kind of Nike ask. Like, they have that potential because of the athletes that they sponsor. They. They sponsor Katie Ledecky.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

They sponsor Mitchell Hooper. Who's one of the world's strongest men. They sponsor a lot of the top CrossFit Games athletes and Olympians and all of this. And so they have the roster for it, but they haven't leveraged the roster from like a brand campaign perspective. And so what we came up with first was, okay, we have to understand like what the narrative is going to be and what nobody in CrossFit focuses on. You know, everybody in CrossFit focuses on like kind of these hype EDM videos, you know, and we wanted to take a completely different approach. And so we went like that Nike esque route and we, and we came up with like the campaign narrative of no grit, no glory. Right? That was going to be the initiative for this and something that they've been wanting to kind of lean towards for, for a while now. And so it was like, okay, we're going to build across or build out around no grit, no glory. The next layer was what are the content pillars that we are going to develop for no grit, no glory. And so we came up with four or five. I remember off the top of my head we came up with one that was like one shot heroic videos. And so then we had the, the essentially three sub pillars to that. There was focus and that's the athlete before an event or before a game right there. They're meditating, they're getting in the zone. They're like mentally prepping themselves before then agony. So them competing and them going through some kind of hardship to finish the event and deal with the pain and be able to come get over the pain. Then the third was greatness. They completed something. Now they're celebrating, they're, they're, you know, they're showing them in that element of an athlete that just did something that or accomplished something. So it was like one shot heroic. And the goal there was can we get those little moments that people don't always see. You see everybody competing but you don't see that moment of LeBron James like sitting back and meditating. And you don't see that moment of, especially in CrossFit of like what's called the corral of the athlete back there warming up and like getting mentally prepping themselves to lift 400 pounds or something along those lines. And so those were the three sub pillars. That was one pillar that we were going to focus on. Because one of the other things about event content and something like this is the only key or the key to this is speed is everything. If you're executing an event, you can't post things three days later or two days after the event, you have to be posting while it's still relevant, while the emotions are still high and while the conversation and the content is relevant. Right. And so we basically had the goal of getting five to six things out every single day. There was two to three events every single day. And so it was like, okay, every single time we hit an event or an event finishes, we have to know exactly what we're getting, what we're trying to pull from that content. So the second pillar was called the pit. The pit was we were going to work with the announcer, this girl Bella. We were going to work with Bella to. We put. I think we put a mic in or. No, we put an SD card in her mic or something along those lines. And so you know how, like, after a game or at halftime, they always interview a player or the coach or something like that. So we basically prepped a hook and we had her ask a hook to the athlete that was like, hey, like, you know, getting ready for competition season. What are this? Wasn't it? Exactly. But something along these lines of, like, what are some of the things that you dealt with to get here? Right. And it opens the door for now, like, them being vulnerable and us building a story around that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so we worked with her to then build the pit where it was going to be anytime a tier, she interviewed a tier athlete, she was going to ask a specific question, we would interview, or we would use that beginning of that interview as the hook to then go into the story. Almost like, not a one to one comparison, but like, do you remember in the Last Dance, episode seven, when the interviewer asked Jordan, he's like, you know, some people regard you as, like, not being that great of a friend. Right.

[B]

And like, I wasn't here to be anyone's friend.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I was here to be great.

[A]

And then it goes into a story with a voiceover. Yeah, we're going for, like that same.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Kind of feeling. The third then was we had voiceovers prepped that were kind of like in the mind or in the, like in the mind space of that athlete that then around different narratives around, like, things that they did in the off season, rivalries that they have. And so we would have. We got there, had them record all those voiceovers, and then we built narratives around or videos around those. And then the last one was like heroic photography. So, like, we had specific looks that we wanted to attain from these athletes where they felt like, larger than life, like a lifter or. Sorry, an athlete, like doing a365 clean and you see the whole crowd like kind of around them, almost like those old Muhammad Ali photos of like him in the ring. I forget who it is on the floor. And you'd kind of just see Sonny Liston. Yeah, yeah, I don't know. And so we had our content pillars dialed in, right? And we had like our, hey, if we can hit this content calendar, that's optimal, essentially, Dot. All right, marketers, we know you love the tldr, so let's get right to the point. Here are five things you can get done faster with wix Studio. Number one, you could scale content with dynamic pages and reusable assets. Then number two, you can integrate with Meta's conversion API, Zapier, Google Ads and more in just a few seconds. Then number three, which is a given, and this is AB test where you can create them in days, not weeks with their intuitive design tools. Then number four, you could connect to tracking and analytical tools like SEMrush and GA4 in seconds and manage all of your client social media from one dashboard. All right, if you're ready for more, then go to wix studio.com again. That's wix studio.com. so the way that then we had to execute it was you can't just have videographers if you're trying to get out that much volume. You need to have a dedicated editor. That editor's gut job is to look at those content pillars, be executing against those content pillars all day. And so the way it worked was the AT or the, the videographers would shoot as soon as they would shoot. We had a tent and it was a tier like booth, but in the back we had like this like tent area and they would come immediately drop where we'd have like briar, go grab cards, run cards over if like we had to do fast. And we then we had like little meetings throughout the day of what are sound bites that you remember, what are like little things that we should be looking for. And so basically we'd meet, comb through the footage, talk, drop shit to Xander. Xander would start editing and unlimited Red Bulls back there.

[B]

Huh?

[A]

Reigns?

[B]

Yeah, what is it? Reigns?

[A]

Yeah, you know, rain, R, E, I G N. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Spartan looking thing.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. They're owned by Red Bull actually. Oh yeah, they're like a bang energy kind of dude. Like same kind of branding stuff, everything. But we had a ton of reigns, just unlimited in the back.

[B]

These are crazy because it's like, it seems like it's A Monster Energy, but it's not.

[A]

Or they're owned by Monster. I think they might be owned by Monster. I don't. I don't know which one. You might have to fact check me there, but 300 milligrams of caffeine in that bitch.

[B]

Nah, he was dialed. Yeah, they are owned by Monster.

[A]

Oh, by Monster. Okay. And so basically, the operation was. Event goes on. What are the sound bites? Take note. Try to remember them. Event finishes, meet at the tent. Everybody talks about sound bites. We look at the content pillars. We piece it together in our head, present the kind of like the verbal creative brief to Xander. Xander executes within an hour, hour and a half of the event being finished. We're publishing content, and we did that for four days straight. The result of that was a few things. We took such a. Like, a hard right for tears content. A lot of people were like, holy shit. Like, what is this content? The athletes loved it. Everybody loved it. People were just like, we need more of this. We basically looked at, what does a sport not have that everybody loves in other sports?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's how we determine the content pillars. And then it was like, well, what do the. What does nobody get to see of these athletes that we can share with people? You know, we had moments where this girl, Alexis Raptis, she finished the event. And like, yeah, everybody saw her win or something like that, but, like, nobody knew that she was. Had the flu right before. And it was like crushing the events. Was in fifth place going into the last day. Ended it at third place, like, podium to whatever. She finished an event and she's, like, laying on. She know she's laying on the floor talking to her coach or something. She was like, I told you I could do it. I told you I could do it. And it was like this powerful moment that nobody gets to see. Right. And so we really wanted to look at those moments and be like, how can we bring these to the people and kind of bring you this doc, like, live docu series of Wodapalooza, but doing it in a way that was branded and really focusing on the brand's perception that they want to mold in 2025. And so, again, I want to make sure that the takeaway point here is you have to have. If you're going into an event, you have to have your content pillars dialed. That's step number one two. You have to be able to have, like, video. You have to have the separation of videographers and editors. You can't expect the videographer shooting the Event to then also edit. Like, during the event, they're focused on what they're shooting. They're they. And that's what they need to be focused on. You have to have an editor then who is like, literally sole job is to bring the vision to life. They have a process. They know how to do it. Like, they have their own way of being able to get footage, color grade, build out the templates, all of that, to then be able to ship footage. Yeah, right. Because a lot of the edits that were being made were being made while the next event was going on. Which means, like the videographer, like, you know, if you look at my text between Xander and I, there's probably one video that's made six different ways. Because I'm like, give them small edits as we go. That can't happen if the videographer is back on the, you know, back on the event floor. So that separation. And I also think that is going to be one of the biggest hires a brand can make this year is an editor, someone that can know everybody could shoot footage. And when I. And what I mean by that is like, most companies have a, like a ton of footage that they're just sitting on that they can repurpose, repackage into amazing content, but they don't have. They just think we have to shoot more and more and more versus like, even looking at tier's backlog. They have what's called Rogue Invitational. They have World's Strongest man, they have the olympics, they have CrossFit games. All this shit from all of 2024 that hasn't been touched, other than like, some recap stuff that we can be pulling from now and making and like continuing to amplify this campaign, which is what, you know, what one of the things we plan on doing. But overall, I think it wouldn't have been as successful if we didn't have an editor in place. Like, that is such a key, key move. But it ended up being great. I think it over the course of like the 3, 4 days is. I don't know if it's like a 8, 900,000 total views, but yeah, good amount. A good amount of growth on that side too. And I think the. The best part on my end was the conversation started happening about, damn, like, what is this content? Like, who's doing this? What are you guys doing different? Because that I was getting DMs of like, yo, I know you work for a tier. Like, is. Is this. Y'all. Like, this is sick. Like, I've never seen Stuff like this.

[B]

And so it's pretty clear when you look at their grid. Yeah, I've just been kind of like peeking behind this. To me, what you did was you introduced storytelling versus all of this previous stuff was just very static image focused. To your point. You're trying to make them much more similar to a Nike or to a brand that mastered storytelling. You also properly resourced it. I think one thing when you're mentioning the editor stuff, a bunch of brands do have a videographer. Not a hard thing to come by, is like a random bro that can shoot and produce all in one, but it's a whole nother thing when you start to see the upside. And having an editor that's very, very good because they're actually curating the output. Which. It's one thing to have a bunch of shot images, a bunch of visuals, but how they put them together, how they storyboard them, how they edit the transitions and put together, that's a unique skill. That's not just something that is commoditized, which videography and photography is to me. And so having that person on site, I think that's pretty unique. I don't think most people are really trying to put out content at that speed either. When you say, I was kind of thinking about back in the day going a boys trip, it's like, you got to get that Instagram out by Tuesday or else no one's going to. You can't post the gram from the trip two weeks later because no one's going to care.

[A]

Yeah, it's almost like I already feel late to post a recap of Miami.

[B]

You're too late.

[A]

I'm way too late.

[B]

You're too.

[A]

Like, I should have posted that shit.

[B]

Because then at some point you're, you're. You're starting your caption with. You're like, oh, well, two weeks ago. Yeah, I went to Miami. It's like, damn, bro.

[A]

Yeah. You know what's crazy is I posted a Facebook, Like, I haven't posted on Facebook and God knows how long.

[B]

What?

[A]

I put a Facebook, like, album.

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

It was like, miami, Whatever.

[B]

Damn. So maybe you need a burner on Instagram now.

[A]

No, I just didn't even. Not. I didn't think about it. Like, I wanted to do it, and I just. I guess I just did not fucking do it.

[B]

Yeah, I think more brands and also, you know, I think the natural pushback from a lot of smaller folks will be, well, what do I do with my lack of events and my lack of in Real life activations. You know, obviously Tyr can do this at this thing that they put on. That's no brainer. And a lot of brands with similar resources can probably do the same thing. But how do you inject yourself into local events? A lot of folks, if you're in anything remotely adjacent to athletics, a lot of people are good at sponsoring these run clubs now. Or a lot of people are good at hosting these coffee and clubbing meetups. I don't know if you've seen that new trend where everyone's doing house music and lattes.

[A]

11Am we have something with blenders that we're doing like this perfect.

[B]

So.

[A]

But they, they have their own. Their own space, so. Which is cool. So like Blenders has their main building on like Pacific Beach. I think that's what it's called. Pb. Right. Pacific Beach. And he just bought like the, the building next door. I don't know if that's public knowledge. So maybe Cade beeped that out a little bit.

[B]

I don't know. I mean, he's not. I don't think IRS watches this podcast. And if they do, we got bigger problems.

[A]

Well, I don't know if I was supposed to say that about blenders, bro.

[B]

He bought a building.

[A]

It is.

[B]

No one's ever mad when you say, oh, he bought a house. Yeah, like, damn, how much?

[A]

But he bought it to be able. And it's a sick little, like, not sick little. It's like a dope spot to be able to put together basically that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like coffee spot. Dj. And they're big on music, though. Like that's in their roots and in their DNA's music. And so he basically wants to be able to put that together. And we're working on something. I should be going to San Diego, like 14 days. We should be putting together something for that.

[B]

I'm also gonna be in San Diego in 14 days.

[A]

The 17th.

[B]

Yeah. For significantly less work related reasons. I'm just going on a golf trip. Cooling.

[A]

Gotcha. Gotcha.

[B]

Yeah, no, that's cool. I mean, I think the coffee and house music stuff is, you know, if you really drill into why that's effective, people want to do stuff where they're less hungover, but they still want to socialize, give people a venue to go hang out and, you know, go vibe. My beef is a lot of these DJs don't deserve it. A lot of these DJs that are playing music at these things are just. They're not curating the right vibes. That is.

[A]

That's fair.

[B]

I mean, you know, it's not 1am at Club Space. Right. Like, just let me, let me chill while I'm enjoying my latte.

[A]

Like you gotta do chill house.

[B]

Yeah. Like, don't make me want to. Like, I don't know, my heart's beating on my chest.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know what I'm saying? Like, for sure. And also in the daylight, it's kind of. It's different when people are like up by the dj, like you know, going.

[A]

I don't think you ever. Unless you're at Vegas, right? Like, unless you're at the pool parties in Vegas, you do not go up to the DJ booth and, and talk.

[B]

High status, low status positioning, you know? Yeah, I want to be up, up near that booth.

[A]

I'm surprised your hydration high status, low status didn't take off.

[B]

Yeah, I don't know, maybe Law of shitty. Click through. I don't know, maybe I've just pressed it too much. But the one yesterday, Terrible.

[A]

Did it?

[B]

Oh my God.

[A]

What brands was it?

[B]

I took a shot at the wrong person. I got petty. I don't know if they listen to this podcast, but I went after Caraway, which is a pan company, aren't they.

[A]

Right down the road?

[B]

No, it's made in. I also took a shot at them. I should have gone after William Sonoma first and. But you know, you learn. I mean, it is what it is.

[A]

Why are you saying it was petty?

[B]

Like, because I'm just a hexclad guy, you know, Caraway has kind of. I feel like they haven't been so nice to Hexclad. I mean, basically Hexclad got exposed for the non toxic thing not being true for them. They weren't able to make that claim. And so it's like all Caraway talks about is they're non toxic, but still nonstop.

[A]

Oh, did you say that line in there?

[B]

No, I said they were like the pants from the movie Robots.

[A]

Oh, yeah, okay, I remember that.

[B]

Which I thought was funny.

[A]

That was like in the first line, like the first few lines.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, but I thought that was funny. But apparently, you know, sometimes. Sometimes it's just you, dude.

[A]

I had Laughing in a room, Miami. And maybe that's why I got sick, bro. My dopamine was like this during Miami because I hit a few videos and they all popped during Miami.

[B]

That was your best one ever, right?

[A]

It's at 1.3 mil.

[B]

That's your best one ever.

[A]

And like, you could ask Rudy, because Rudy was there. I posted it and it started taking off and I said, I'll wake up. This is going to be at 60,000.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Woke up, it was at 58, right? And then I was like, by the end of the day I was like, oh, this is probably going to end at 200. Ended up at like 354. And I was like, oh, okay, this is, this is going to go crazy. And then like the one before that performed really well. And then the one like after a few days after got like 100k too. And it ended up bringing in like 17,000 followers.

[B]

Yeah, that's OD in a week.

[A]

And then on top of that, Tears content was performing well.

[B]

No one said you had it. You had to take an L. Like that's just how the universe.

[A]

And then it was like on top of that, I know I took two Ls and I want to get into American pipe dream, but I took two Ls. The biggest L was I rented an Airbnb at a resort in Miami called Caroline Wellness Resort. Cost seven grand or eight grand for the week. Okay. I got it. Because I was like, okay, everything I need is here. I have a two story gym. It had sauna, cold plunges, steam, chirotherapy, everything you could imagine was there. And then like beautiful Airbnb, all glass, looking at the beach. Just sick because I didn't reserve it 10 days prior of like being like staying there. I couldn't use any of the amenities.

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

So imagine paying seven, eight grand.

[B]

Remarkable levels of ho shit from them.

[A]

Insane.

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

So I'm like, I just paid seven grand. And like I'm, I'm thinking, bro, I'm a cold plunge every morning. I'm a sauna, I'm a workout. Like I'm going to like still be on my training. And I had to deal with that. And so I just had to run every day on the boardwalk.

[B]

Is this event something that you're trying to compete in?

[A]

Yeah, eventually. Like, it's not my. It's not the event that I look at. I'm like, this is the one I want to win.

[B]

Would theoretically be a part of something like this.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah, that's cool. Yeah.

[B]

Damn.

[A]

So that was two years out.

[B]

You're just going to be like taking over the CrossFit. It's like a vlogger taking over the CrossFit.

[A]

The goal. That's the goal.

[B]

That's crazy. Maybe you could single handedly make CrossFit cool. You're kind of in the process doing it.

[A]

I'VE thought about this a lot. Because if you really think about it, Nick Bare made hybrid training cool. What is hybrid training or hybrid athlete or whatever? Like, he made that shit cool.

[B]

I was gonna say we could. The pod will be three hours if we go into this debate.

[A]

Agreed. Bro.

[B]

Lifted and ran and called it a term.

[A]

But that's smart. You know that, like, I won't go.

[B]

Any further because I've been blocked by people over my takes in this subject matter.

[A]

Have you really?

[B]

That's what Sam blocked me for. Remember when I was like, oh, it's.

[A]

Quite bigger than yours? I can answer that. Yeah. I don't think that.

[B]

I think you'll make CrossFit cool one day. That's kind of like your arc right now. Because how do you differentiate from the other green Screen bros? It's like, got to do something in real life. I feel like the other green screen bros, myself included, limited in real life execution.

[A]

That's why even I'm going. We have content coming out from the behind the scenes of that as well. But I've thought a lot about how to make CrossFit cool.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And, like, to the point where. And I don't. I'll put the idea out here because I don't think any of them are cool enough to do it. But it's like, you know, OBJ would. Would have his cleats made and, like, would have designers do his cleats. Like, simple things like that, I think would go a long way in CrossFit.

[B]

Yeah. 100%.

[A]

Like, if I got my lifters that technically aren't, like, that cool of shoes, but you just have to use them. And I had, like, the shoe surgeon make a crazy design or do something crazy with them. That's such an easy win, bro. Just having tattoos is like a. Or, like, being all right. The biggest thing, I think that that would actually. You've changed. CrossFit is having somebody that's, like, the enemy. And when I say the enemy is.

[B]

They need a villain.

[A]

Yeah, bro. Because everything in CrossFit is, like, so Kumbaya. Like, everybody loves you. If you and I competed and I just beat you in, like, a lifting competition, we'd finish and, like, hug and.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's stupid.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

In basketball, like, I understand you lose a game and, like, you just. You say good game, but you're still mad. But you're mad as shit. Everybody's happy. Every interview is like, oh, I'm just so happy to be here. I'm blessed to be here. And I'm Like, I get it, but you.

[B]

In a sense, they are. I mean, I feel like the sport is growing, and so they're grateful for where it's at. But you. You're right that it is almost time. Maybe you should manufacture that, though. Like, you got to, like, fake it. That's what you're about to say, fake it.

[A]

And it's also, like, who. Like, I'm not. If I was in any kind of interview kind of shit. Like, I'm never going to say, oh, I'm just happy to be here. Like, I could be in, like, I would 100% be in, like, first place whooping everybody. And somebody is like, you know, you came into this, it's your first year in this shit. Like, what's there to be happy about? You, like, that kind of like, somebody. They need that.

[B]

They need an edgy. A little more edge to them.

[A]

Yeah, a little more edge and a little more, like, professionalism and maturity. A lot of the CrossFit athletes are just corny. Even the content that they make is very, totally corny and bubbly.

[B]

It's always been that way. Yeah.

[A]

And that's. That's why I think Hyrox is.

[B]

Has a lot of potential, because even.

[A]

Their braining, like, the black white with, like, the yellow is.

[B]

People just, like, are desperate for new attention vehicles these days. I swear, like, they want one thing that the whole onslaught of people running, Dude, I was just on the trail yesterday, walking the trail, looking at all these people that have no business running, running. And I was like, yo, y'all, what.

[A]

Does that even mean?

[B]

I'm just saying, like, if your knees don't look like they're holding up well, like, you should not be running 16 freaking miles, okay? Like, you know, if it's clear that it's not going well. And all I could think about was I was like, oh, this is giving everyone agency to feel like an athlete. It's something that you can do with zero skill, right? You can be someone who never touched a ball in their life, and you could still go be a good runner. CrossFit's relatively similar, but just in the sense of, like, dude, if you're getting in great shape, you can go do high rocks. Like, if you're getting in great shape, you can go. If you're someone with two hands and feet, you can go play pickleball. Right? Like, these really accessible sports are giving people agency and making them feel like they're in a, you know, athlete's journey.

[A]

Like, they're. Yes.

[B]

Which is the most addictive thing ever. Like you're a former athlete. It's like, I miss it every day. The reason to wake up and go grind on something which was physical, you know, I think another element of this is, you know, everything that we do is so virtual these days. Like, bro, I don't get anything out of just crunching numbers on spreadsheets and writing copy, to be honest, unless I'm, like, extremely caffeinated. And it's just not the same as when you're hooping or playing football or whatever. And I just think all these niche little sports and communities are starting to build because they're giving people a reason to do activities that makes them feel cool. Like they just feel athletic.

[A]

I couldn't agree more. I couldn't agree more.

[B]

And that's why I'm more bullish on Hyrox, though, because it feels a little more accessible to those people rather than. CrossFit is, like, kind of harder to do. I feel like it is.

[A]

Because with Hyrax, it's push a sled. Pull a sled.

[B]

The cables, the walls. Yeah. This thing.

[A]

This. The skier. Yeah. And rowing, I think a few other things like lunges and broad jumps, something.

[B]

It's like a. It looks like a super intense hit workout. Whereas CrossFit, you gotta, like, hit the Olympic lift. You have to break my neck.

[A]

Yeah, you have to. Olympic lift. You have to be able to do, like, gymnastics. You have to do all these things. So it's. No, I agree. But they've. They're nailing the branding and they've attracted what I would say is, like, a lot of the cool people.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, and that's good for the sport. Right. Like, of High Rocks, they've attracted people in street wear, people in sportswear. They've attracted a lot of those kind of big, big names in those worlds that are also dominating that, like, run club, community.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And they're bringing them over to High Rocks. So. Yeah, it's interesting, man. I think CrossFit has obviously the most potential because you have the elements of. You have somebody that's lifting 400 pounds, you have, like, a lot of these athletic things. The problem is media. The problem is branding. The problem is the HQ and shit like this. But that's a bigger, bigger conversation.

[B]

Something I learned from. So I put out that piece of content that I stole from that girl. The. If I were to start a men's apparel brand, this is what I would do. Which I'm on the record. I stole it. I did.

[A]

I'm sorry, everybody, but you even took the font.

[B]

I didn't know Renzi was gonna do that. It was like, I was, like, 30 minutes away from press and publish, and he sent the font, and I was like.

[A]

I was like, yo, this man took, like, the exact font.

[B]

No, that was crazy. I changed the color, though. 3%, actually.

[A]

We should have never talked about that rule ever.

[B]

I mean, dude, I don't know. But it's true, though. Like, Virgil literally just threw some text and, like, a little safety pin on a pair of Air Jordans made him iconic.

[A]

But he was getting paid by Nike to do the collab. Like, it's a little different.

[B]

Yes and no. I mean, my sense is, I think everything is stolen. I think 95% of social media content is stolen, at least in some way from somebody.

[A]

Agree. No, I agree with that big time. Yes.

[B]

So if you hide it, that's. That's cap. Like, that's.

[A]

Well, I don't think you. The hook was the same. The text was the same.

[B]

Yeah. But I think at the same time, where I struggle with this is that's not a complicated concept. Right. Her doing that is. Sure, she gave the incentive for someone to copy her by it being successful, and that's great, but if I were to start a men's workout brand, this is what I do as a concept, I think I could totally get away with that not being similar to hers at all. If I did a different font. For example, like, if I put that on screen in a completely different font, different way, I don't even think it would be fair to say that I copied her. Now. Renzi used the same font, which is crazy. If someone called me out for it, I'd be like, yeah, you're right.

[A]

Which is crazy.

[B]

Which someone did. And I deleted that comment so fast.

[A]

Really? What'd they say?

[B]

They said, yo, you stole this from that girl on TikTok. I looked her up. She's not even on TikTok. So they were like, they were wrong with their facts.

[A]

I had throw it out in evidence.

[B]

Throw it out in court.

[A]

I had somebody DM me and say, when are we starting Rush?

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

And I was like, that's some haterade.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, to be fair to that, I'm more bullish on that idea right now because of all this tariff stuff. I mean, it seems like you're not going to be able to make your products overseas for a little bit until trade board stops. I mean, it'll naturally stop, but I've.

[A]

Been thinking about too, like, I want to have My own product. I think there's the one problem with the agency game is like the same thing that you and I have talked about. It's like you're just trading time for money.

[B]

It's a horrible experience. I hate it so much.

[A]

I don't hate it. There's a lot of things that I love, and then there's shit like, I mean, like any business, there's things that you do not like, and there's things that, that you like.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like being at Waterpalooza, executing all that was a high of high. Right? Like, that shit was super fun to say.

[B]

My client, I'm getting dinner with a client. Like, it feels cool, you know, but at the same time, you have. You have good clients and bad clients, and bad clients take up so much more of your time. And good clients.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And people also just, like, simply don't pay on time. And so that part sucks too, because I can't do that with my employees. I can't say, hey, sorry, I haven't gotten paid. So you can't get paid either. Yeah, that's crazy. No, the agency game is fine. I mean, it pays the bills. I think my number one advice to anyone who's getting started is you should start an agency because your quickest time to cash, but it's definitely not very fulfilling. Like 80% of the time. 95, 97. 3%.

[A]

I don't know if I, I'm with mine, I would say it's like 50.

[B]

50, but you're newer. You're not as, like, you're not as, like, beaten down as I am. I enjoyed life last year too.

[A]

No, like, we had Rare Air and yeah, I dealt it with Rare Air. And then the first company I ever started was an agency, but it was like 2016, 2017, called Social First. And I experienced it there like the most. Now with Playbooks and how we execute that, it's very rewarding to see teams execute it and it perform well. It's very. Like, I do get a high from that. Like watching the Jocko team start putting together like, this big brand campaign and like the, the. The tears of the world and blenders and all that. Like, it's fun to see that execute and crush. But yeah, there are definitely the moments where you're just like.

[B]

Yeah, but I.

[A]

That has to be. I mean, every. All these companies are now dealing with this tariff stuff. You know what I mean? Like, that's.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

I mean, like, there's, there's always going to be those ups and downs and.

[B]

Like, Those moments is not having the ability to turn on the money printer. Like when we do do something elite and it's like printing for a brand and there's just like, woohoo. You do what you're expected to do versus, you know, some sort of maybe commission upside on. On ads that rep. And so that's where it's like, well, you have your own product. You create a winning piece of creative. You spent several hundred thousand dollars behind it. Now you're feeling good. You're like, oh, this is.

[A]

I want to get the dopamine of seeing someone in my stuff or seeing someone use my product.

[B]

Yeah. I think physical products are cool.

[A]

I do too. I had. I think it's like this similar dopamine of. I had a good amount of people come up to me at Wadapalooza and be like, I love your content. I just implemented this for this campaign. Like, I pitched this, this brand and I was like, that's sick.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Now imagine seeing 200 people wear your shoes, for sure. Wear your shirt where you're. You know what I'm saying? Like the amount of obviously tier, because it was tier water plus it's. But like the amount of represent that I saw, the amount of strong coffee, like in. Strong coffee is a coffee brand, but they sell cool merch. I probably saw 30, 40 people in their merch, which is sick. Seeing people like walk around and just always have like Jocko Fuel on them and then also going to like the grocery store and you kind of just see Jocko Fuel and you see Raw and you see like these different brands. It's sick to. To know like, that you, you see, it's just different. It hits different.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it's because, like ours, what we do is so digital. We're so on the back end.

[B]

Yeah. Your dopamine. Yeah. It's just different. I mean, I think ultimately content is a great vehicle, but it's honestly more annoying to me at this point than anything. The content flywheel. I just absolutely despise that. A video flops and I'm like, fuck me. That feedback loop is so bad. You feel like you're king of the world versus you. And I don't even care that much.

[A]

But it still hits, though.

[B]

Put effort into something and then it just like dies and you're like, damn, I probably just like didn't do the hook properly. And like, this was good content.

[A]

I agree. Because I had a few videos. Where are they? It was like my Nike marketing. Nike running marketing campaign. Like a mood board. One Brand virality formula in your brain is a mood board that I put like a lot of time into scripting.

[B]

Which probably was so much content. You know, like if you think about it, it's like it was probably some of your most information dense videos and yet because it wasn't packaged in a way for the masses to like easily comprehend within 0.5 seconds of them just monkey scrolling on their feed, then Instagram penalized the shit out of you and you got nothing out of it. Yeah, that is just what's like really driving me nuts recently because I feel like my heart and soil video I put out was probably one of the most valuable things for brands to actually watch recently because it talks about how to build topical authority in your market. And that's what every single brand needs to do, is they need to be thinking about how can I become a go to resource of information in my category. And that's what social should be right now. And it just completely fucked. The worst part is, you know, you know that flops within like the first 30 minutes. You're like, damn.

[A]

Yeah. And you kind of hope you go to bed and you kind of hope like you wake up and it just like you know, accidentally took off.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it didn't.

[B]

But at the same time, you know, mentality wise, it's like, well dude, you know, whatever. Like, I mean that's the game. Like you just keep. I can post the same, I can do the same script with a different hook six months from now and then probably work. So.

[A]

But what I will say is like not to get down about it because I was, I was not down, but I was annoyed, right? I'm like, yo, this Nike running marketing campaign, the brand, all these kind of just didn't hit. And then ame1hit then like brand social predictions for 2025 and oh, and I remember thinking like yo, what's wrong? Like am I, did I just lose the juice?

[B]

Did you lose the time?

[A]

You know, like, can I not do this anymore? Because then even like the other ones didn't hit as much. Right? Brand social trends for 2025 got 54. How to create a viral campaign for MOA got 41. But the AME one took off. Cortez took is off 100k. But then good content versus bad content streetwear brands and why your brand needs to launch a social show absolutely took off. And the thing there is it all compounds. So the interesting part was when the social show and the good controversy, bad content took off, amel door video was at like 150. And it retook off to now 300.

[B]

Yeah, that. That's definitely how it goes.

[A]

Cortez was that like stuck at like 40, took off to 100. Right. And so now all of them are starting to compound. And that's why it was like I added 17000 followers in a week. Yeah, you know, I mean like that, that does happen. So it's just interesting and. Okay, I got a hack for you.

[B]

What's up?

[A]

So here's something that you could be doing with your Instagram videos that nobody else is doing. So you can take your best performing content, publish it just as a trial, just as a trial reel, and then never put it onto the feed. Yeah, I'm posting. And because it only is shown it to net new people, it's not shown to anybody. Huh.

[B]

Is it picking up followers?

[A]

So I started posting like my good content versus bad content writing brands. Is that 70, 80,000 followers right now or. Sorry, 70, 80,000 views. And it has four or five hundred followers from it.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So like there's a move there with publishing your top content. Just there hitting it trials and then just bringing in. It's like, it's just extra people.

[B]

I don't have trial reels.

[A]

Really.

[B]

They're ho.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

It's crazy.

[A]

Like, have you updated the app and everything?

[B]

I don't think I'm. I'm not like shadow banned, but I definitely am in like an account category where they've been like with me for the last like ten days pretty much. It's been like very noticeable because my analytics keep changing.

[A]

Like mine have changed.

[B]

They like took it away and gave it back. But what I really noticed was so usually I would get like 50, 50 follower versus non follower split on like the first, I don't know, like 5,000 impressions.

[A]

So I don't have that.

[B]

You have all followers, all followers except.

[A]

The brand show one.

[B]

Exactly. That's why they were fucking you on your analytics before, because they're showing it to only your followers because they pushed that update that Mosseri was talking about where he was like, we're only going to look at shares amongst non followers and then likes on your followers. And so what they were doing is they were testing likes on your followers initially. And that's why last night, my video, the cookware thing, it's the biggest flop. I haven't had a video flop like that in two months, which is bizarre. But like it was exclusively non followers that I pushed it to. So most of my videos recently have been like 95. 5 followers. And they're taking a longer time to take off. Yeah, last night it shot up to like 3,000, but it was all non followers, so it got like no engagement and then it just died. I'm like, they're definitely like pushing a bunch of updates right now, so that part's been tough because I wonder if.

[A]

I just hit it at the right time.

[B]

For sure. Well, I mean, like a good video.

[A]

Orin's content, though, will go. I think it show every single time he posts. It's like within 10, 15 minutes, it's showing to like 50, 50 split, basically.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, they definitely treat different accounts differently, too.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I feel like I'm a quote unquote, I'm a small creator. So they're like, do we show this? I don't know.

[A]

Are you going to be somebody that geeks out when they hit a number? Because I'm not like, no, I'm not that person at all.

[B]

I actually feel like, like hitting 20 was kind of like it just. You, no matter what number you're at, you always feel small.

[A]

The only one that was dope for me was 10K.

[B]

Yeah. Like transitioning from 100%, getting out of that single digit.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, I feel like the dopamine rush of going from 10 to 20 happened for me in like eight days.

[A]

Was that chill, the 2J's video?

[B]

Yeah, that was cool. But honestly, no, I mean, it's just, dude, no matter what, like, you know you're about to hit 100, which is sick until you look at Orin having four. You know, like, no matter what it is, I feel like there's always a bigger.

[A]

There's always 100%. I just. I'm not going to be that person because I see it too often and I think it's lame. It's so where they're like, I can't believe I have 100k. Like, thank you to all of you.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

And it's like, people hit.

[B]

People say that at like 10.

[A]

Yeah, bro. And I'm just like, I get it. But it's not that I'm not thankful that you're following me. It's just like, let's just keep it going.

[B]

A great job of engaging with our followers more though, I think, you know, like, I keep. Dude, Squid Pactor is so good at it. Like, just hitting the yap video 24 7. It's like, I still kind of gatekeep that part of me, and I think people would probably enjoy it with some of the takes that come to mind. But I don't really post like, stories or like any of the lifestyle stuff. And so I'm really just like this talking head. It's like, I know, dude, for them.

[A]

I deal with that with myself as well, where I'm like, I need to share what I'm at. Like, if nobody knows me. And yeah, if nobody knows me, can they just watch my stories and be like, oh, he's about it. Like, he's working with these brands because somebody commented on like, my good content versus bad content was like, oh, I'm seeing so much of these lately. Like, good content. But. And I'm like, yeah, I was in the comments. I'm like, yeah, like, one, they're just copying me.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Two, I'm actually working with these brands for sure. Like, we're actually.

[B]

I've been thinking a lot about that recently. Like, talking about, like just doing. Because, you know, JT talks about that a lot. He's like, you should do the three pinned posts, which is like, who I am, what I'm doing, why you should follow me. And I've been thinking about that recently too, because, you know, but it's also like, I try and inject that personality into some of the videos. Like saying that hokas are for the slowest people at your local run club. Like, that's hopefully a take that your regular green screen bro wouldn't have. But yeah, I also hate seeing other people at my size because I'm like, my agency is definitely like 10x the size of your business and we just shouldn't be the same.

[A]

And that's what I'm saying is like, they. So for example, and I'm not gonna name names, but somebody will take. Is taking your videos. Taking my videos where I'm like, hey, this is represents $100 million marketing playbook. And then they go, this guy is a marketing genius. He's grown his brand to 100 million off of these, you know, and their video go like mega, mega viral.

[B]

So it's so unbelievably discouraging. It's like scrolling LinkedIn, which is.

[A]

It's like, it's fine. That's going viral because I know that's also attracting not the right people. Yeah, like the fact that you're. We're not using that kind of verbiage. And it's like, oh, they just.

[B]

Which is.

[A]

They're part of that game.

[B]

That's been my experience with IG in general is I'm not attracting nearly the same Level of, of buyer as I was on Twitter and even LinkedIn recently.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Yeah. I get follows from these people. Like random big, big brand folks. But I just don't know. I don't know. I kind of think that UGC is really less in demand right now. For sure. Good. UGC is still infinitely valuable, but like, it's got such a bad taste in people's mouth that I think they go to my website and they're like, oh, this is like a TikTok shop UGC agency. So I've been thinking a lot about, I'm going to change my funnel in the link in bio. Yours is really good. What's good about yours is I feel like you qualify up front before you let them book a call, right?

[A]

Yeah. If they're not doing, I think it's.

[B]

Above 10 decision tree in your type form. Yeah.

[A]

If it's not above 10 mil, you don't get a calendar.

[B]

Because that's what's killing me with my calendly is you can't branch decisions. So everyone selects the 5k to 7500. I've taken like 15 calls with people that just have no business being able to afford it.

[A]

And I don't take any, like, not one of those calls.

[B]

I know. I, I, I've kind of been trying to like, do the say yes to everything, you know, because sometimes, well, you never know. Like, sometimes you get lucky with that.

[A]

But all it's taught me is I need another product that is probably lower ticket, a grand, two grand to sell to these people. Because you know what? Let's, let's flex on the pod a little bit. I'm gonna open up how many people are in this type form? And like this type form has been up for three months. Yeah, three and a half months. Because I've had the opposite where you get a lot from Twitter. Twitter, to me has not been shit.

[B]

Well, I feel like you, you, I.

[A]

Don'T really post that much.

[B]

But you haven't posted on Twitter in like two years.

[A]

I just don't find it, like, meaningful.

[B]

I'm out on Twitter now.

[A]

I mean, I'll lie or I'm lying. I closed our biggest client from Twitter by responding to a comment and I got a DM and it closed in. Truth hurts 24 hours.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So, yeah, actually this is, I don't know why I'm not logging in, but.

[B]

Should we keep going?

[A]

I think we're good. I don't know if we would just want to keep rambling. It's definitely killing our attention There's a bunch of random shit in here.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, hopefully you all enjoyed that yap session. Alex and I just haven't hung out, like, three weeks.

[A]

Yeah, I haven't seen him in a minute.

[B]

But if you're still watching at this point, please do us a favor. Leave a review on Spotify, leave a review on Apple. Subscribe on YouTube. Means the world to us. Helps us grow this thing and continue to improve that production quality and get us to two episodes a week.

[A]

So we're almost at 10K. We're at, like, 8.4. Yeah, something like that.

[B]

Share with a friend, too. Spread the gospel.

[A]

Oh, we got to put that comment. Yeah, an episode.

[B]

All right, we'll catch you all next week.