Sword and Scale – Episode 323 Summary
Podcast: Sword and Scale
Host: Mike Boudet
Release Date: October 17, 2025
Episode Theme: The gruesome murder of Lisa Dodd, an expectant mother, exploring the harrowing intersection of intimate partner violence, mental illness, and the failures of those closest to the tragedy.
Overview
Episode 323 of Sword and Scale immerses listeners in the devastating true crime case of Lisa Dodd—a 22-year-old woman, seven months pregnant, found murdered and decapitated in her Alton, Illinois apartment in June 2022. Through the words of her mother, Heidi Noel, raw police audio, and candid narration, the episode exposes not just the horror of Lisa’s death but the tumultuous and often invisible patterns of abuse leading up to it, the role of mental illness, and the limits loved ones face in protecting those in danger.
Key Discussion Points and Insights
1. Discovery of the Crime (02:44–09:00)
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Heidi’s Chilling Discovery:
Heidi Noel drives to Lisa’s apartment after 15 hours without contact—an abnormality for their close relationship. Her concern is palpable.- Scene described with haunting detail: Lisa’s unlocked apartment, unsettling silence, and “something is off.”
- Quote – Heidi Noel ([01:12]):
“Lose a child that way and that baby is an extension of her mother and the rest of her family. So they lost a child as well.”
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911 Call and Realization:
Heidi’s anguish is captured as she calls 911 and finds Lisa’s decapitated body.- “She catches something in her peripheral vision. Lisa is on the floor, on her back. A towel is wrapped tightly around her head, almost like a turban. Blood is soaked through…” ([04:26])
2. Lisa’s Life and Dreams (09:00–12:25)
- Highlights Lisa’s personality, aspirations, and excitement about becoming a mother.
- Details about family closeness and anticipation for the upcoming baby shower.
- Quote – Heidi Noel ([09:13]):
“She attended Shelby’s, much to Shelby’s dismay, middle school orientation in a tiara and princess gown…she was a character.”
3. Escalation of Abuse and Toxic Relationship (21:19–36:43)
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Lisa’s Relationship with DeAndre Holloway:
- Met through social media in 2020; DeAndre displayed classic signs of emotional manipulation and instability.
- Heidi’s Perspective:
Spotlights the difficulty and nuance in addressing a loved one's abusive relationship, highlighting how pressure can backfire.- Quote ([25:55]):
“It’s a very fine line between navigating this with them… the more my parent tried to clamp down… the more rebellious I was.”
- Quote ([25:55]):
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Early Warning Signs:
- Episodes of mental illness (hearing voices, dissociation) noted by Heidi, who is a nurse. DeAndre was briefly hospitalized after one severe episode.
- Lisa’s reluctance to involve police due to DeAndre’s prior record.
- Violence Escalates:
Choking incident leaves Lisa unconscious—Heidi intervenes, sending Lisa to Colorado for safety, but social media keeps them connected. - Quote – Heidi ([34:15]):
“That was probably her dying. You don’t normally see people, and it’s a very serious situation… he could kill her.”
4. Failed Interventions and Community Apathy (36:43–53:13)
- Instances of violence increase in frequency and severity: broken nose, black eyes, recurring arguments—Lisa continually excuses or hides the abuse.
- Family attempts various interventions including temporary phone confiscation and placing Lisa with her sister, but cycles of abuse persist.
- Neighbors’ Inaction:
Despite hearing rife arguments and even “chopping” sounds on the night of Lisa’s murder, no neighbors called 911. - Quote – Mike Boudet ([51:05]):
“No one called 911. It was just business as usual. They’d heard the fighting before and everything turned out okay. Why should they intervene?”
5. Murder, Motive, and Mental Illness (42:37–65:26)
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Day of the Murder:
- Lisa found decapitated; killer fled with her car and was captured on surveillance disguised in Lisa’s clothes and a headwrap.
- DeAndre’s delusions include hearing the voice of a woman named Ruth, occasionally “taking charge.”
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Investigation & Arrest:
- DeAndre is arrested in Litchfield, behaving erratically—cutting off his beloved dreads, pouring out bleach.
- Police interviews show DeAndre as calm and rational at times, refusing medication.
- Quote – Mike Boudet ([58:08]):
“There were no voices. It was just plain old DeAndre … He wasn’t playing the crazy card, at least just the belligerent one.”
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Trial and Sentencing:
- Initially found unfit, later declared competent to stand trial after treatment.
- Pleads guilty; sentenced in Jan 2025 to 60 years for murder, intentional homicide of an unborn child, and concealment of homicidal death.
- Lisa’s missing head is found in a dumpster, wrapped in bedding.
6. Aftermath: Grief, Regret, and Hardened Wisdom (65:26–67:54)
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Heidi’s Fortitude:
Despite everything, she offers forgiveness rather than hate.- Quote – Heidi ([66:26]):
“I do not hate you. The world holds enough anger and hate for you that I don’t have to carry those emotions. I’m sad and disappointed in you… that you destroyed so many lives, so many hopes and dreams, including your own.”
- Quote – Heidi ([66:26]):
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Reflection on Parenting in the Face of Danger:
“All she could do as a parent was exactly what she did. Sometimes, no matter how hard you try to help… it’s up to them to decide their own path.” ([65:26], Mike Boudet)
7. Closure and Tragic Irony (67:00–67:54)
- Final conversation the night before the murder between Lisa and her mother:
- Quote – Heidi ([67:00]):
“She had actually said, ‘I wish I could see baby Bean tonight. I’m ready to see my baby now.’” - Poignantly, Lisa and her unborn child are united in death; for Heidi, this brings a small comfort amid the loss.
- Quote – Heidi ([67:00]):
Notable Quotes
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“[Lisa] was my mini-me. We had a lot of same characteristics and behaviors … As they became adults, they became the best of friends.”
—Heidi Noel ([07:17]) -
“She reaches out and touches her daughter's pregnant stomach and finds it cold. She thinks maybe, just maybe, it's not too late. Maybe she can still do CPR. Maybe the baby…”
—Mike Boudet ([04:26]) -
“He said that it didn't matter because he would just pull the crazy card.”
—Heidi Noel ([41:49]) -
“Monsters thrive in darkness and complacency. It makes them powerful and unstoppable.”
—Mike Boudet ([65:26]) -
“That night she got to be with her baby does bring me comfort. And in my mind’s eye, I see God and Bean waiting for Liza to join them to walk her home.”
—Heidi Noel ([67:54])
Important Segment Timestamps
- 01:12–02:41: Heidi expresses the impact of loss and the start of the narrative
- 04:26–07:11: Discovery of Lisa’s body and the 911 call
- 09:13–11:09: Lisa’s childhood memories and maternal aspirations
- 21:19–36:43: Development and escalation of abusive relationship
- 34:15: First incident of DeAndre’s extreme violence (choking Lisa unconscious)
- 42:37: DeAndre’s reference to “pulling the crazy card”
- 51:05–53:13: Account of neighbors overlooking the critical night of the murder
- 58:08: Police interrogation—DeAndre’s demeanor
- 65:26–67:00: Sentencing, Heidi’s final words to DeAndre, and episode reflection
- 67:00–67:54: Last conversation between Lisa and Heidi
Tone and Language
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Tone:
The tone is raw, direct, and honest, combining matter-of-fact true crime reporting with emotional and personal moments, especially from Lisa's mother, Heidi. Host Mike Boudet wields dark humor and biting commentary, often addressing system failures and cultural issues surrounding crime and mental health. -
Language:
Blunt descriptions, occasional profanity, and unfiltered dialogue—echoing the show’s style of presenting “the raw uncensored audio [that] tells the story.”
Conclusion
Episode 323 delivers a gut-wrenching account of a preventable tragedy, laying bare the realities of abusive relationships, the labyrinth of mental health and justice, and the heartbreak of families who do “everything right” but still lose. It is an unflinching reminder that the worst monsters are indeed real—and, as the show's signature line suggests, they often thrive in our own complacency and silence.