C (8:42)

Thanks Maria. I'm glad you're feeling better. And back on the mic today our space has signed a launch agreement for two satellites to be manifested on an ISA spectrum vehicle in 2026 from Andoia Spaceport. Turian Space will fly Arete's next generation event camera in 2027. Space Systems Command Front Door Initiative has been re to the Space Force Front door and another 27 Project Kuiper satellites were deployed this morning thanks to ULA.

A (9:10)

Thank you Alice. It is good to be back. And again you can read more about all of those stories by following the links in the show notes. They can also be found on our website space.n2k.com hi T - listeners. We have regular segments that we air here on T Minus, where we have regular experts that join us monthly to talk in depth about their areas of expertise. And if you have burning questions, our guest experts may have answers for you. Law, Cybersecurity, Intelligence, Policy and Innovation. Got questions on any of those? Well, just send us your questions to space2k.com and we'll share them with our segment experts to answer on the show. Chances are whatever's on your mind is top of mind for lots of other listeners too. Don't be shy and thank you.

D (10:14)

CISO Perspectives is back with an all new season. This season is all about change. Whether it be emerging technologies like AI, shifting governmental roles or evolving threats, we are sitting down with security experts and getting their insights to help you make sense of these changes. We are part of a larger ecosystem and if you look at the largest cyber incidents, they have massive downstream effects. I'm Ethan Cook, Editor of Cisco Perspectives at N2K CyberWire. This week host Kim Jones with his first guest Ben Yellen to discuss the current state of regulation.

E (10:47)

Absolute security by definition is an oxymoron. I can secure you absolutely if you shutter your doors, wipe your computers, wrap them in Lucite and drop them in Mariners scratch. But then again, you ain't going to make no money.

D (11:01)

CISO Perspectives is an N2K Pro exclusive show, but for this season we're sharing the first two episodes free on the Cyberwire daily. To hear the full season, visit TheCyberWire.com and click on subscribe now to become an N2K Pro member.

B (11:19)

At Talas. They know cybersecurity can be tough and you can't protect everything. But with Thales, you can secure what matters most. With Thales industry leading platforms, you can protect critical applications, data and identities anywhere and at scale with the highest roi. That's why the most trusted brands and largest banks, retailers and healthcare companies in the world rely on Thales to protect what matters most applications, data and identity. That's Talas T H A L E S learn more@talasgroup.com Cyber.

A (12:05)

Today's guest is Dan Trujillo, AFRL's Space Vehicle Directorate's Space Cyber Resiliency Technical Lead, and Dan started off by telling me more about his fascinating role.

E (12:19)

My current job is I lead the Space Cyber Resiliency Technical Area for the Air Force Research Labs in the Space Vehicles Directorate. Now I always say Air Force Research Labs, but I actually work for the US Space Force because we're a little Bit of a carve out because of the Space vehicles directorate. So our motto is one lab serving two services. So I lead a team of scientists and engineers and we do research and development to secure our space vehicles from cyber attack. And so we do a lot of research in taking raw technology visions concepts, maturing it in the lab, you know, because a lot of these are just cyber technologies that we want to bump up or integrate into space systems. How that cyber intrusion detection system works, for example, how it actually will work in a space vehicle or a space system can be different. Especially when you can't go up and fix those satellites, right? You can't go up and touch them or do things. It's just all through software updates. And that's a large part of our job. The goal is to get capability to the war fighter and that capability is in the form of space vehicles providing pnt, isr, nuke detection, SDA and all that. So how do you take these ideas that come way from far, far from the, I'll say on the left side, right, the R and D and mature them till they actually are able to run in a space system and then be able to transition? And that's the overall gist of how we move technology to the war fighter. Right. But we also know that there's a mix between what the DoD is doing, what commercial is doing, what the intelligence community is doing, what NASA and for example, civil. Right. And so we also want to secure those assets as well because we're moving into that future space architecture. And I think everybody, the biggest example out there is SpaceX with these thousands of satellites that are networked together and all the services that they're going to provide and of course people are moving out to that domain and our main go is to secure those systems. We want to make sure that we are able to design in the cyber protections from the get go before this large architecture is built out.

A (14:47)

Absolutely. Yeah, you're right. It's, it is a fascinating opportunity to, to get it right.

E (14:53)

It is. I feel like we're, I mean you always say at the start, but I feel like we are at the start of, you know, this explosion into space. Right. And, and all these capabilities that we want to put in, into the space domain for users or for people on the, on earth, but as we move out towards the moon and beyond and for space exploration, you know, our satellites are going to have to be autonomous, they're going to have to be work and do things without human communication or interaction. So to me that's the Wild west, right? That's, that's, that's a, you know, that's something that you need to make sure is secure, right? Because if you're going to invest billions or trillions of dollars in this architecture and it goes out and it's cyber attacked, then you've just lost that. Right. You know, it's not like a PC or anything like that. So, you know, that's, that's, like I said, our goal is to make sure that these, these assets are protected because, not only because of all the capability up there, but because humans are going to rely on those services that they currently rely on, but it's going to be even more, you know, as they come from space.

A (16:06)

The main reason why we're speaking today is about an event that you all have going on at AFRL coming up in early October that I know we wanted to help put the word out here at T minus to make sure that people know about it so they can join if this sounds like something that's a good fit for them. So tell me a bit about the AFRL Space Cyber Summit, please.

E (16:25)

Yeah, right. So I'm very proud of the summit because this will be our fifth year from where it began. And so, you know, like you said, space cyber is fairly new. It's the merging of space and cyber worlds together. And so the first one was, who's even out there that's interested in space cyber, who's working on it, who's a stakeholder, you know, let's find out who these people are. And so the first one was to gather that group and see what organizations and what they were working on. And as we've progressed from year after year, we've expanded, right? It was kind of like, hey, who out in the DoD is working on this? Right? And then it was like, hey, who out in academia is working on this and who in commercial? And so now I start to see the same faces. It is a small group of people, and by the small, I mean, you know, it's thousands, but compared to some of the other domains, it's actually, you know, very small. And so that is something that I'm very proud of doing is bringing together all of those people to address the cyber threat to our space systems. And you know, like universities, they want to help us. They have smart kids that are developing these, these technologies, but they don't really know what we want, you know, how to address the problem, right? So, you know, we help them understand the problems that we're trying to solve so that they can align their curriculums towards helping us out and do these things. The goal, right, is to get everybody to understand what are the issues associated with protecting space systems against the cyber threat. And this year we will hold a summit October 15th and 16th in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Now this is an in person event. I always like to do that. I don't like to do virtual because I like to be people, to interact and, and have good discussions there. So this, this particular format on day one will be unclassified. It's open to the public and that's how we get a lot of the university people and a lot of commercial. And then of course the second day is going to be held at a higher classification level where we'll talk about specific things. But that's essentially the summit is the two days. And this year I'm doing a little bit of a different format. I typically have speakers speak at the audience for 30 minutes and then there's like five minutes left for questions. But we always run long and we end up having to cut off those questions. So what I want to do this year is have really more of a 15 minute presentation on a particular topic area and then the other 40 minutes or the rest of the hour is open discussion with the audience. Because what we want to understand is we want to get all those new ideas from them. And so that's why we're doing it. Now on day one, we are going to break up into the following areas and you can get this on our website. But the first topic will be securing the space vehicle supply chain. And of course that's important because our space vehicles have hardware and software. There's people developing that software, there's hardware being developed in different areas and parts being developed in different geographical areas. And they all flow through, through supply chain, they all flow through networks, they get touched by different organizations. And so we really need to start thinking about how we're going to secure that. And the second topic will be the cyber hardening of space vehicles. And really that gets into the architecture and reducing as much attack surface and vulnerabilities as possible. And really what that means is you end up taking a snapshot of what the technology is in time and what you see as the cyber threat. And then you build a technology based on that. But your architecture has to incorporate what could be the unknown going into the future, right? What are the zero day attacks? What are, you know, you know, and so that part is resiliency and so you need to design for that as well. The third topic will be onboard cyber detection Obviously it is important to know that a space vehicle, for example, is under cyber attack because your response matters. Right. If it's because a lot of times cyber attacks can look like faults or malfunctions and you want to be able to have that ability to detect. And I should say that all these topics are really focused on the space vehicle because that's where I'm focused right now, not necessarily on the ground part, because I think that looks more like an IT system. And so there's a lot of solutions out there for that, but there's not very many for the space vehicle.

A (21:03)

Yeah, it's sort of a known. Yeah. Yep.

E (21:06)

Right.

A (21:07)

That's right.

E (21:08)

Yeah. The other topic, or the next topic would be onboard cyber protection, which is how do we kick the malware off, how do we reduce its impact? And then the next would be onboard response strategies. Again, just because you can detect a cyber attack and you think, well, okay, I'll just go and kill that process, that's not the way to do it. You have to be smart about how you respond because you could be executing a mission that you cannot kill that process. Right. You might want to see if you can work through that. So what I'm trying to say here is we have to be smart about how we respond. And the last topic would be designing for adaptive cyber resilience. And the best example can use is the human immune system. We don't know what we don't know. There's the zero day attacks, the unknown attacks that may hit our systems in the future. So is it possible that we can develop some type of cyber protections that are able to adapt much like the human body? If you get the cold virus one year and your body can then develop a signature for that. And so the next year in 26, let's say that same virus that's morphed, it can detect it. You can update all your protection and detection and cyber hardening technologies to, to address that. And so that will be the, the first day. Like I said, I want, I want to get good ideas from the audience. The deadline is October 8th. Last year we got over 100 people and you can register for day one or day one and day two. If you register for day two, that is a classified event. So you're going to have to send in your credentials and so forth and get that set up. So I hope that people get on this soon. I also think it's a great time of year in Albuquerque, New Mexic. October weather is amazing. We also have the balloon fiesta out here. That's going to be going on that week, which is really cool event. But yeah, I hope that it's another successful event and that we continue to drive space cyber technologies into the future to address the cyber threat.

A (23:33)

We will be right back.

B (23:39)

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A (24:23)

Welcome back. A lot of things in life are better when shared, and that includes information that benefits all of humanity, wouldn't you agree? Utah State University's Space Dynamics Laboratory clearly feels the same way regarding their Starfall software, which detects potentially harmful meteors. Or to put it in more official lingo, it is a near real time bolide detection software suite. It takes data from NOAA's Geostationary Lightning Mapper or GLM instrument, and is able to distinguish bright flashes in our atmosphere that aren't lightning but are meteors burning up. Quite simply, the light behaves differently. Sounds pretty logical to me. And now Starfall is open source. Meaning you, me, anyone with a bit of software know how can benefit from what this software does. And since Starfall is open source, anyone interested in bolide insights can deploy Starfall to receive alerts and view estimated times, approximate locations and total energy releases for Bolide entries. Part of the beauty of open source software is what the user community can contribute back to the software to make it even better. And the hope is that researchers using Starfall may be able to extend Starfall's current capabilities and help it do even more. So if the prospect of going to a GitHub repo, installing all the prerequisites, dependencies and then installing and building the Starfall itself sounds doable. And really, if you even understood what I just said, you can poke around the source code for yourself. GitHub.com spacedynamicslaboratory starfall okay, you know what link is in the show notes for you.

E (26:06)

Foreign.

A (26:10)

And that is T minus brought to you by N2K Cyberwire what do you think about T minus space daily? Please take a few minutes to share your thoughts with us by completing our brief Listener survey link is in the show notes and thank you for helping us continue to improve our show. We're proud that N2K CyberWire is part of the daily routine of the most influential leaders and operators in the public and private sector. From the Fortune 500 to many of the world's preeminent intelligence and law enforcement agencies, N2K helps space and cybersecurity professionals grow, learn, and stay informed. As the nexus for discovery and connection, we bring you the people, the technology, and the ideas shaping the future of secure innovation. Learn how@n2k.com N2K Senior Producer is Alice Carouse. Our producer is Liz Stokes. We are mixed by Elliot Peltzman and Trey Hester with original music by Elliot Peltzman. Our executive producer is Jennifer Ibin. Peter Kilby is our publisher and I am your host, Maria Varmazes. Thank you for listening. We'll see you tomorrow.

E (27:18)

T minus.