← Take-Away with Sam Oches
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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to Takeaway with Sam Okus, a podcast for leaders of growing restaurant companies looking to take their businesses to the next level. In nearly two decades covering restaurants, I've gained access to some of this industry's most influential decision makers, and I'm letting you in on the conversations. In today's episode, you'll hear from a top executive at the 11th largest chain in the United States about what it takes to balance heritage with originality and about how legacy chains can stay relevant through innovation. Andrea Cherng is the Chief Brand Officer at Panda Restaurant Group, parent company of Panda Express, which has more than 2,600 locations in the US that pull in more than $6 billion in sales annually. Andrea has been a part of Panda for pretty much her whole life as her parents, Andrew and Peggy Cherng, founded the concept back in 1983 as a quick serve spinoff of their Panda in Full Service concept. Today, Andrea oversees growth and development at Panda, which includes helping the chain carve out a distinct American Chinese menu that borrows from China's eight renowned regional cuisines. We just named Panda Express as this year's Brand Icon winner and I traveled to Panda's Support center in Rosemead, California to sit down with Andrew, Peggy and Andrea to learn more about the brand's balance between its Chinese heritage and its desire to create something wholly original. We're sharing my interview with Andrea on today's episode of Takeaway, and you'll learn more about how an immigrant ethos drives Pandas growth and how the chain creates valuable experiences both in stores and on its digital channels. If you learned something from this episode, go follow Takeaway wherever you listen to podcasts and leave some feedback. It is the best way to get these lessons into the hands of fellow restaurant leaders. Also, dive deeper into the Panda Express story with my Brand Icon profile plus exclusive videos from my time at Panda Support Center. Visit nrn.com brand-icon that's nrn.com brand-icon to learn more. Jumping now into my interview with Panda Restaurant Group's Andrea Cherng. Also, as we are all at Create this week where I will chat with Andrew and Peggy on stage as part of our Brand Icon. There will be no takeaways for this week, but we'll be back at it again next week. Enjoy the conversation. Andrea Churn, the chief brand for Panda Restaurant Group. Thanks for sitting down with me.
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B
Oh, it's an honor. It's a pleasure.
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A
So we're talking about Panda and you have such a unique viewpoint and perspective on this business because you grew up in it. Your parents, of course, are the founders. Tell me about your earliest memories of Panda.
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B
So my earliest memories of Panda were really centered on the Panda Inn in Pasadena, California, where my grandfather was back of the house. He was the head chef, and my father was front of the house. And he would be the person that would be welcoming everybody in the beginning, when the business wasn't successful, he was the person that was going onto the street to chase people down and bring them into the restaurant. And then my mother, who was working as an electrical engineer, would come on the weekends and evenings to be the hostess. And my memory was being brought into the restaurant. And I'm not sure if it's an actual memory or if it is something that was implanted in my mind, because I'm told that I would just wander into the kitchen, and then my grandfather would pick me up and feed me hot and sour soup, which I think was pretty good for a toddler to be eating hot and sour soup.
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A
Totally.
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B
And I have that memory of that moment with my grandfather. I also have memories of climbing over the bar and going for the pineapple slices and the maraschino cherries, because the mai tais are a. Not touching the mai tais as a toddler, but the sliced fruit was what I remember. So I have those memories of sort of growing up in the restaurant.
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A
Yeah, it must have been a fun upbringing to grow up in the restaurant space, but then also very exciting, because at some point, you must have realized my parents aren't just restaurateurs. They're really business. I mean, they're very good at business. And this business is growing. So when did you sense that what was happening with Panda was.
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B
So when I was growing up, we always had aunties and uncles around us, and the aunties and uncles were not related to us, but the aunties and uncles were the people that worked with my parents. And so from a very young age, I knew that the aunties and uncles were important. And this group of aunties and uncles actually very much were what we call the Panda pioneers. They were the group of people that worked alongside my parents to move the restaurant from one restaurant to 10 restaurants to 20 restaurants to 100 restaurants. And so I think what was always very clear to me was that there was a dynamic of almost like a second family that was happening that was allowing us to grow. I think when it became clear that we were growing was when it became, oh, we're not only at 100 restaurants, we're at. We're hitting 500 restaurants. And there's a scaling and aspiration for, I think at one point my father, at about 100 or so restaurants started talking about thousands and then 10,000 restaurants. And I thought that's a big aspiration. But ultimately what made it a more, I guess even a bigger deal was that the 10,000 restaurants were marked by the peril of how many opportunities could be provided for people if we had that many restaurants. One of the things that I love about what my parents have done is from the beginning their values have been very consistent, even though maybe the tactics of the strategies have shifted. And so imagine that you have a sit down restaurant, Panda Inn, then you're courted to open a fast casual version of it, Panda Express. As the Panda Express restaurant started to expand into two, three, four, five restaurants, what my parents did is they started profit sharing with the managers of the Panda Express restaurants so that the front of the house got 10%, the back of the house lead got 10%. So the chef and the GM of the restaurants each got 10% of the profit of that restaurant from the very beginning. And, and so that enablement, that provision for people, even though the tactic looks different today, was very consistent all the way through. And I think that is what provides so much for our people.
- [06:37]
A
Sure. I imagine you worked in the business at a young age.
- [06:41]
B
I did, but I was not proficient. Let's be very clear. I had jobs where, I mean, I have a picture of myself and I'm a handful of. I have a picture of myself and I look very young and I'm sitting in front of the hostess stand and you see sort of the Panda Inn logo behind me on a T shirt and you have this big reservation book. I would not have been effective at that job. But they have a picture of me actually in that position. I remember sort of at Support Center. I would do my summer jobs at Support center. And, and so I was a receptionist for a period of time during the summer. But in our culture, when we're referring to people that are older than us, it's respectful to call them Auntie Knuckle. And so it was, I would get a call and it would be for Uncle Luther Kwok. And so you would hear me over the intercom say Uncle Luther, phone call on line one. And then you'd hear like the ripple of laughter through the building. So that was sort of how I ended up doing the job when I was younger is I would take on different positions at different times.
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A
Yeah, Tell me about watching your parents as leader of this business because obviously two Very strong leaders, two strong founders. I'm very fascinated by the fact that. And you guys even talk about this in your branding materials, about how they're sort of a yin and yang and they're complementary. Yeah. How did you. In watching them be leaders, what did you learn from them in their leadership?
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B
Sure. I think that the biggest lesson I've learned from their leadership is the necessity of having sort of partnership and to find your complement. We talk about how sort of Panda stands for P and A. That's not actually the reason why it's called Panda, but I think it's very compelling. Yeah, there's a P and a Peggy and an A. And so when you think about sort of the growth of the business, you have someone in Andrew that is the unreasonable entrepreneur that will push the boundaries, that wants to actually have the highest possibility, that gets into the detail of operations. He is a quintessential operator and a challenger. And then you have Peggy, who is a PhD in electrical engineering, is a systems builder and thinker that has a legacy of building probably one of our first sort of POS systems and likely will actually start to invent even more. I think part of her legacy is going to be designing the first smart restaurant. Right. And so you have, again, these two personalities, very strong in their individual attributes and unapologetic in those attributes, but with very common values. And the common values center around how do we take care of our people, how do we provide opportunities, how do we ensure that we keep getting better in how we deliver customer experience, how do we continue to, again, always push the quotient with regard to progress, always with a heart around people.
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A
Yeah, that came up over and over in my conversations with them. It's so clear that if success means anything, it's successful in investing in people. So you clearly have watched that over the years and that importance of people. So now you're here as Chief Brand Officer. How do you start with people in your role? Because a lot of what I imagine you're here to do is help to push this brand into the future. How do you bring that legacy of people that your parents have designed?
- [10:22]
B
I think when you choose to be a leader at Panda, you choose to actually move the mission forward. And the mission of the company is about inspiring better lives. And that mission of inspiring better lives starts with a. This is from an immigrant ethos. This is from the fact that my parents came here with an aspiration for a better life, and they were able to build a better life here. And so if they can build an Organization where people can actually have better lives and they can move the minds and hearts of people to actually aspire for that. That is sort of the DNA of the organization. And so if that's sort of why we are here today, then every leader in the organization carries that. And in my role of innovation, it's more around sort of continue to be people centered with regard to knowing how to advance the organization so that our people are even more proud tomorrow than they are today about who we are becoming. And then also for our consumers. Consumers are changing so much over the last many years. They've changed in terms of the type of products they want to buy, in terms of the type of storytelling that they enjoy. And so how do we always have an eye to how people are changing? Always retaining what they love about us, those comforting favorites, the flavors of nostalgia, but always also advancing the quotient in terms of what we're able to provide for them.
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A
Sure. That concept of innovation, our brand icon award, is really about that meeting of innovation with legacy. Obviously, Panda, with 50 years of a legacy behind it, but continuing to push into the future, which you're helping to spearhead, what does innovation mean to Panda? Because as you find that balance of what this brand has meant for 50 years and you seek ways in which to push it into the future, how can you do that through innovation?
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B
I think innovation for Panda is about honoring origin while aiming for originality. It's the balance of both origin and originality. So in all of our innovation, we start with heritage. And so you think about sort of menu innovation and you think about heritage and origin and what we anchor in the eight regional Chinese cuisines. So every dish we start with in what area of China is this inspired by and what flavors do we want to tap into? So you start with that sort of again, DNA and then you move it into original expression. And so you have dishes, for example, like our newest lto, our sweet and sour chicken, that take the flavor of Cantonese sweet and sour, but actually marry it with spice. Forward bulldog. And now you have a sweet and sour chicken for this generation or the next generation. So always again, anchoring an origin, but pushing towards original expression, that can be a bit of a new adventure for our consumers as well.
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A
Sure. I imagine over the years too, you've watched since the early days of this brand, you've watched a lot of different innovations.
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B
Yes.
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A
Come forward. Right. And it even starts with when Panda Express opened standalone restaurants versus mall locations, adding drive thru, thinking about things like online ordering, loyalty program. You rolled out a Couple of years ago has been massively successful. What are some of the innovations that you've seen Panda roll out that have been really pivotal for this business and setting it up for the future?
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B
I think our menu innovation is incredibly important. I think sort of authoring our original orange chicken has been iconic for us in terms of the dish that people love and crave. I think movement and the continued movement of our menu, even in quiet ways, so that our menu is more health forward today than it was a decade ago. Moving our storytelling so again that in our storytelling we're anchoring in heritage and origin. For example, in our celebration of Lunar New Year. Our celebration of Lunar New Year is about sharing with others the values and traditions of Lunar New Year, but sharing with an audience that may not typically celebrate. So this year we have an animated film, wishes that's a hand drawn animated film that again explores and shares the family ties and the belonging and the celebration of Lunar New Year and ties it in a story that anybody can relate to because fundamentally it's about a father and a daughter and time spent together. So that's what we get to do to continue to sort of advance how we show up as a brand. I think to go to your question, two really significant innovations have been our loyalty program in 2023. And with our loyalty program in 2023, our Panda rewards program, we did something a little bit different in that we created a panda world where again people could collect points and get good fortune. But we also continue to advance that world. And so now we have Walk Wednesday and Walk Wednesday marries sort of in store experience with digital experience. And it can be called experiential innovation. Right. Where you're playing a game online, you learn more about our ingredients and how we cook, you get a gift or a reward and you can go into store and redeem it. That again advances even our reward program and moves us into progress. I think another significant innovation for us is in 2023 as well. We have a partnership with UNLV. And in that partnership with UNLV, when you take classes at University of Panda, it can go to college credit at unlv. Now that is a seismic move for us because one of our goals as a company is that our people are able to achieve their college degrees and are able to purchase their first homes. And so by allowing sort of University Panda or crafting our curriculum so that by taking these classes, you are one step closer to your college degree. It helps us live into that mission of actually helping people to make their lives better.
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A
Sure. Talking about the loyalty program and rewards. And so much of this obviously comes back to the relationship you have with your guest.
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B
Yes.
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A
And you mentioned heritage and rooting everything in heritage. What does the relationship with guests look like when a lot of the customers are American, are maybe not as familiar to your point about the Lunar New Year and some of the key points of the Chinese heritage? How do you kind of build that bridge and that connection between that sort of Western audience and this heritage that you're talking about?
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B
I think we always play with what stays the same. What are the core values that stay the same, and where do you push towards progress or storytelling or innovation or advancing a narrative? And so I think that the core values that we lean into, which have to. To do with belonging or sharing good fortune or respect, those anchor almost all of the work that we do honoring origin. People of all backgrounds want to dig into origin and understand heritage and understand what it means to honor that, but they also understand the desire for original expression. So leaning into those core values that are resonant with all audiences, but then also pushing the quotient a little bit in terms of how we tell the story to bring sort of unapologetically the traditions, the customs, the color of our background and an unapologetic American Chinese identity is, I think, part of the incredibly fun job that we get to do.
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A
Yeah, sure. Well, if we put ourselves here in this moment, in 2026, it feels like customers today, consumers, are more embracing of global flavors. Authenticity is very important to them. Seems like the customer is very primed for an experience like Panda Express because they want that authenticity and they want that adventure, culinary adventure. How do you feel like Panda can capitalize on that?
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B
The culinary team and I have talked about how there are eight regional Chinese cuisines, and what would it be like for Panda to help define a ninth regional Chinese cuisine that is American Chinese, where, again, we take sort of Chinese origin, and it's rooted in Chinese origin, but it is filtered through an American expression. And so that becomes sort of the aspiration when we talk about our menu and we talk about advancing our menu, we talk about defining the next generation of American Chinese food, where you are actually starting to establish the classics, what people will think of as the classic, sort of moving forward. Now, you might have and you tap into the flavors of nostalgia. You have the sweet and the crispy and the comforting, but you also might move the quotient in terms of spice. So all of a sudden, you might have a numbing spice that you've never tasted. Before or again, a marriage with a bulldog and an introduction of a Korean spice. But always pushing the quotient more and more so that we can actually define again what American Chinese food can stand for in the future.
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A
Yeah. Feels like there's a story that you're telling at the end of the day. Right. And I've noticed in the branding and the marketing, especially around that the Wishes film, I mean, these are a way that you're connecting with the consumer in ways they want to also connect to, which is very much in multimedia, visual ways. Where do you see that going in the future? And the ways you leverage things like social media, multimedia to connect with today's especially young customers.
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B
I think the last couple of years have caused us to completely reevaluate our playbook. I think that in the last couple of years, we've seen wallets getting tight because of cumulative inflation. We've seen the emergence of a creator and influencer economy, we have seen unparalleled levels of uncertainty. And so as you think about sort of where consumers are today, it's our job to almost anticipate or know where they are today and anticipate what they need or want. And so when we think about sort of cumulative inflation, we think about what does it mean to deliver that kind of consistent quality, the comfort of their favorites that they can count on. And so we've really worked on our guest experience. When you think about sort of the idea of, again, sort of influencer and creator economy, it's about how we're not going to be the only people telling our story now. It is about a partnership with those creators and influencers that we call and can call legitimately, Fandas. Fandas are the fans of Panda. So we can call the Fandas to help tell our story, knowing that now it's about sort of a shared storytelling. That's how people resonate and that's what's authentic to people today. And so that's what we're leaning into more and more. And as we think about sort of uncertainty, the two parallels of uncertainty is, again, you want to remain what people want you to be. There is a core that we need to ensure that we're delivering on. You have your original orange chicken, and you have been eating it since childhood. We promise to deliver to you our original orange chicken, your favorite. And you likely want more of a little treat in uncertainty. You want little experiences and safe adventures. How do we deliver that to you as well? Through our LTD pipeline, knowing that we are in a competitive restaurant industry. But if we stay true to our origin and understand what our consumer needs. Maybe we can break through in ways that really draw people in.
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A
Sure. Well, there's so much out there to help you innovate today when it comes to especially technology and thinking about AI, online order and all the things that are available that can be a little overwhelming because probably not all of it is good fit for the Panda brand. What are some innovations out there today in the restaurant industry that are exciting to you that we should expect to see Panda explore in the future?
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B
When I think about the business where we were in 2019 versus where we are in 2026, it's a much more complicated business. In 2019 it was very much focused on an in store business and a drive thru business. And now it is equally in store, drive thru and digital and in that for our people. It is an incredibly complex business because you have three streams of customers coming at any one time. So when I think about sort of technology and innovation, I think about the role that it can play to alleviate the burden on our associates. If we can have more predictive sales volumes, if we can know per store the amount of volume that's going to be coming in each of the channels at each of the day parts and actually be able to set up our operators to be able to respond to that volume, that will enable them to deliver a better guest experience. So I look forward to actually enabling our people with the insights to be able to make better decisions, to serve our guests and to be able to better empower our people. That's what I'm most looking forward to. I think as we think about the future and how technology will play a role, so much of it is a bit of a democratization. It is ensuring that each of our people, meaning each person at Support center, understands how technology and AI is going to impact their roles and giving them the ownership to actually reinvent with us. Because if everybody is empowered to reinvent living into our value of progress, that's what's going to best sell up the company, but also best set up that individual. And because our mission is about helping people get better, we want to make sure that they have eyes wide open and ownership to actually author that next stage for themselves as well.
- [24:52]
A
You were talking about looking at the last couple of years and I mean, if we do look at what's been going on in the broader restaurant industry and how Panda has been performing, you guys have been growing where others are not growing. There's a lot of struggle out there right now. But Panda Express is actually knocking on the door of being a top 10 restaurant company in the US and it is growing tremendously. It's way out in front of. There's really no other Asian flavor chain that comes anywhere close. So it's established this very dominant position in the marketplace. What has been key to that? Why is Panda Express? Why do you think, in your opinion? It's resonated so much with the American consumer.
- [25:33]
B
I think what's made us successful is that fundamentally, we started as a mom and pop Chinese restaurant, and today we are still a mom and pop Chinese restaurant. There is a mom who's leading the way. There is a pop that's leading the way. But what that symbolizes for us is that there is a consistency in leadership and a consistency in values and a consistency in mission. And I think because we have had that consistency and stability, that's been foundational for our people along the way. And it's also because these people, the mom and pop, are unafraid of reinvention. They're always moving the quotient to how do we get better, how do we push for. For more more in terms of, again, how do we serve our guests better, how do we provide for our people better, how do we live into our vision and our values better? So almost that ethos and push, I think, is the reason why we stand at the doorstep that we are today. I think it's pretty incredible to think that probably the largest mom and pop Chinese restaurant could be the 11th largest rest restaurant chain in the U.S. that is an incredible testament. I will say that all credit goes to the people and the teams that have made it happen. That even though I might say that, again, we are a large mom and pop restaurant, you have to remember the aunties and uncles that came alongside to help us to be able to grow and scale today. You have to remember the 55,000 associates that make every day possible for us. And I think that our success is because we have not lost sight, that our mission is about providing opportunities for people, and those people make sure that our guests are taken care of every day.
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A
Andrea, last question for you. You talk about this being a mom and pop restaurant. It's your mom and pop's restaurant. So you have such a unique perspective on that. And you're the second generation of leaders here in this company. When you think about the impact and legacy that you hope for Panda to leave behind in its communities, whether that's from a culinary standpoint and how it's impacted influenced Chinese flavors in the US or from a people perspective, what do you see long term as being what you hope the legacy of this brand could be?
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B
My hope for the legacy of Panda is is that the words on the wall, meaning our mission of inspiring better lives, translates not only into thousands but millions of stories of our people actually having better lives because they were here. People talk about Panda as the best type of school where they grow professionally and then they grow personally. And I hope that the stories that we've already captured over 50 years just continue to grow where more and more people are able to grow and are able to point to Panda as a pivotal moment for which they got better. I also hope that as a brand for our consumers that we celebrate unapologetically a multicultural and multi ethnic identity, that it is a beautiful celebration of both origin as well as original expression, coming together in a way that's expressed in food and stuff storytelling that inspires people to actually embrace and celebrate their unique origin and original expression as well.
- [29:03]
A
That's great. Andrea Cherng, Chief Brand Officer for Panda Restaurant Group, thank you for your time.
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B
Thank you so much for your time. Thank you for your great question.
- [29:09]
A
Absolutely.