← Takin' A Walk - Music History with Buzz Knight
Takin' A Walk - Music History with Buzz Knight
Buzz Knight Chats with Rome: From Music Fan to Frontman of Sublime with Rome’s Inspiring Journey
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- [00:01]
A
Taking a Walk welcome to Taking a Walk. I'm Buzz Knight, and we're deep into our Fresh Start 2026 theme week. Exploring artists who've embraced reinvention and forged their own paths in unexpected ways, Rome Ramirez faced one of the most daunting fresh starts in modern music. Imagine being asked to step into the shoes of a beloved frontman to carry forward the legacy of a band with a fiercely loyal fan base. That's exactly what happened when Rome joined Sublime with continuing the spirit of the iconic ska punk legends while bringing his own voice and vision to the table. It takes courage to honor a legacy while making it your own. Rome didn't try to be somebody else. He became the bridge between Sublime's storied past and its future. He faced the skeptics, won over the doubters, and proved that a fresh start doesn't erase history, it writes the next chapter. In this conversation, Rome shares what it was like to step into that spotlight, how he found his own identity within an established sound, and why sometimes the best way forward is to respect where you came from while staying true to who you are. If you're navigating your own fresh start this year, especially one when you're following in someone else's footsteps, Rome's story will resonate. And then he even talks about his new creative paths as well as. So let's talk with Rome on this past episode as we celebrate fresh start 2026 with taking a Walk next. This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human.
- [01:43]
B
Taking a walk.
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C
Hello, Rome, and welcome to the Taking a Walk podcast.
- [01:47]
D
How's it going, man? Thank you for having me.
- [01:50]
C
It's going fantastic. Thank you. So, since the podcast is called Taking a Walk, I wanted to ask you, Rome, if you could take a walk with somebody living or dead, preferably around music, but that's not mandatory. Who would you like to take a walk with and where would you like to take that walk, man?
- [02:13]
D
That's a good question. Well, the. The first person that comes to mind would probably be my grandpa, just because, you know, I feel like as a man now, he. He passed away before I could, you know, kind of get to know a little more about or get to the point where I wanted to know more about the family, you know, so probably walk with him, ask him some questions, you know, probably explain. A lot of stuff goes on in my head anyway. But then in terms of, like, entertainment, you know, if I could take a walk with somebody, man, off the top of my head, like, first person that came to mind was Jimi Hendrix, just You know, I mean, for obvious reasons, but he's just such a creative guy. I would just love to, you know, hear what kind of like, stuff he had to say about, you know, just, just movies and, and, you know, art and just, just kind of pick his brain.
- [03:07]
C
You know, I got chills thinking about both of them, including the Jimmy response. And, and I have this feeling you and Jimmy would be kindred spirits because Jimmy seemed to emote this tremendous sense of certainly creativity.
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D
Oh yeah.
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C
And passion, but amazing sense of, of gratitude. And I, I see you at this place in time in your career and I feel like you are exuding your own sense of this tremendous gratitude. Am I right on that?
- [03:49]
D
No, thanks, man. I'm for sure. I mean, you know, it's like for me, I, I've already like, like, done more than I've ever could have imagined, you know, and there's still things that I 100 want to like, accomplish and, and do. But like, once you get to a point where you're actually able to like, you know, put food on your family's table through music, you know, that's a very, very, like, that's a blessing. And I don't know, I just, I, I'm like at that point now. You know, I have three children and my wife and you know, it's like I'm like very grateful to be able to be still playing music and having like, fans that listen to the music that I make and music that I've been associated with and you know, I've gotten to tour the world with my favorite band for more than a decade and, you know, I made it out all right. You know, I'm in a wonderful marriage and I have beautiful children and I'm very grateful for that. And I think, you know, that's, that's a huge contributor to even why I continue to want to do this professionally. You know, I want to put that message out into the world.
- [05:07]
C
Fantastic. We're going to talk about why me and the behind the scenes creative process that led to it. It's outstanding. And also I want you to be able to tell everybody about the music festivals and performances that you're going to be certainly, you know, making the rounds at as well. Oh yeah, but you just turned 37. How do you feel about this milestone? Does it change how you look at your music or your life in general?
- [05:41]
D
You know, for me, it's like I was just having this conversation with my mother in law because I love growing older and I know people hate it. You know, I'm Just kind of figuring out like the health part of it, you know, like working out and eating right. Like, I've been in that world the last like six months now. But in terms of like, you know, mentally and emotionally, like, growing up is awesome because you just like, you get more and more in tune with what you like. And my mother in law was saying which, which I couldn't help but agree with, but like, you know, and she's, she's got like 20 years on me. You know, the older you get, the less like you give a shit about what people think and like, you just get more sure of yourself. And I just like, I couldn't help but agree, you know, even at my age of 37, you just get to this point, you know, where you're like, man, I got three kids that are like doing all right, like, I'm gonna be fine, everything's gonna be all right. And that's not a big deal. That's not a big deal, you know, and you just kind of get to this place so to, you know, make a long, long answer shorter. I definitely love the fact of growing and becoming smarter and more aware. And you know, the flip side of that is, you know, time becomes less and less of, you know, something that you have, you know, just in terms of your responsibilities and, and that can put a real big damper on your creative process. So that's one thing that has been, you know, a little less than favorable with like growing up is like, you know, I definitely missed the time of just sitting around and just sitting in the studio all dang day and making music, going to bed and waking up and doing the same thing. But that' probably not a very healthy lifestyle either. So I'm, I, I, I'm rolling with it, man. I love it.
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C
Tell me what it was like being born and raised in, in California. What was childhood like? And talk about, you know, just that, that aspect of your, your journey in California.
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D
Yeah, man. Well, so I, I, I grew up in the 90s, like your typical 90s child. You know. My earliest memories of music were, were Bob Marley, Fleetwood Mac, Motown, you know, so that was like the Supremes and you know, anything from Stevie Wonder or Smokey Robinson, of course, and Rolling Stones and Led Zeppelin and hip hop that was on the radio. So I was like a pretty eclectic, you know, mix of music and, but I mean, it was like my mom and my dad and those were, some of my earliest memories were musical memories really. I was very much a fan, you know, where I grew up in the Bay Area. It was, you know, heavily inspired, like, by, like, gang culture. There was, you know, the Bay Area is synonymous for its own music industry. It's its own music, you know, genre, really. It's like hip hop. But, you know, we got, like, artists that have just really been fundamental to west coast rap. You know, shout out to E40, too short and stuff like that. Mac Dre. So needless to say, all my peers in school, everybody I knew, it was like, hip hop, hip hop, hip hop. And, you know, I would hear all this, like, soul and other kind of music from my parents, and I took a trip down to San Diego, where my family was from, and I, like, heard, like, Sublime for the very first time, which was kind of a trip, because it kind of put all of this. All that music that I was talking about, it put it all into one, which I thought was just so awesome. It was so fresh to me. I think I was, like, 11 at the time, and I just remember hearing this music and, you know, it would be borrowing melodies from, like, the Supremes, and it would be like, you know, doing, like, punk rock stuff, which I hadn't even really heard punk rock yet at that point. Sublime was my introduction into punk rock. And, you know, so hearing that for the first time and. But, like, you know, had some stuff from, like, hip hop samples in there, and so it just really blew my mind. And from that point on, like, honestly, from, like, listening to Sublime, it really transitioned me from, like, being, like, a listener to, like, me wanting to learn how to, like, play an instrument, you know, And I got a guitar. And then shortly after getting a guitar, you know, I just started to was. I played that thing all the dang time. And the more I played guitar, the less I was skateboarding. And I could kind of, like, I got to a point where. Because the only thing I loved in the world was skateboarding. So I got to this point where I was just like, you know what? Like, I think I can probably be a better guitar player than a better skateboarder. And I just really started investing all my time in the guitar playing. And, yeah, eventually that, you know, a lot of the stuff that was going on in my family, you know, my. My dad had his stint with drugs for most of my childhood, and. And so that just created all kinds of chaos in the house. Everything that you would imagine. And that was really monumental in, like, my growth as, like, becoming a songwriter, leaving the guitar, you know, like, guitar player mentality and stepping into, like, singing and writing songs about all that stuff. And that's when like music really like transformed for me where like, you know, the dip in my grades was like, for real. It was like I was like all in. I just wanted to go to la, start meeting people and just start recording these songs. And yeah, that was like the, you know, pretty much the start of like high school. And that was like a really troubling time because I just like couldn't get my shit together in school, man. I just wanted to play on that guitar and start bands.
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A
So.
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D
But yeah, that's, that was kind of like, you know, the, the cadets version of a, of a up and down lifestyle up and down California, between Northern and Southern California in my upbringing.
- [12:00]
C
But it's really a storybook, really life here. When you get to, you know, join a band that you were a fan of and tour and record, I mean, you must have just, you know, pinched yourself in amazement of what you had accomplished.
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D
Dude, it was crazy. Like all I ever wanted to do when I was a kid. You know how like they tell you to like hold your breath when you're going under like a, a bridge or you're going like in an underpass or like you're going over a bridge, you know, hold your breath and make a wish, right? Ever since I was a kid, man, all I could remember was like when I blow out the candles and I'd make a wish and you're not supposed to tell anybody. All I would wish was to, to be a professional musician. And I would say those words because I wanted to at least be able to live off music, you know, Like I had a couple uncles that like play guitar and they were just like, you know, just living a miserable life. And, and I just at least wanted to put some food on my table. Playing, playing the guitar. I didn't want to go to college to like get to this point now. Like, that's where a lot of the gratitude comes from. And you know, moving to LA was like, it took so much to like then get to la. But then like, you know, what happened in Los Angeles really didn't pan out the way I thought it was going to pan out either. Like, I never thought in a million years that I would be fronting the band that was plastered all over my wall as a kid. That was just something that, you know, life kind of unfolds, you know, the, the, the journey kind of opens doors for you that, you know, you probably wouldn't have opened or even like fathomed as possible. Never a million years. When I was listening to Sublime as a kid, that I think that one day I'd be jamming with Bud and Eric, singing those songs. It's crazy. And during that journey, I met this band called the Dirty Heads. And this was.
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C
I've heard of them.
- [13:58]
D
This was a year before I even met anybody in Sublime yet. So I introduced to. I was introduced to the Dirty Heads and I started hanging with those guys, and they were, like, just playing, you know, probably like 50 people in, like, bars and clubs and stuff. Just, you know, just like, getting that phase going in the van, you know. And when I met them, like, I listened to their music. I saw, like, their YouTube stuff, and I was like, oh, dude, they're so good. Like, their music is so rad. I was a little more in, like, Funny Enough, kind of doing what I'm doing now. Like, more music that is, like, I'm making now. That's kind of where I was before I joined Sublime. And so when I met the Dirty Heads, I was listening to what they were doing, you know, with their first record, and I was like, man, it's such beautiful music. I love their mixture of everything. So naturally, you know, we were like, let's write a song together, man. You know, I was living in my van at the time. They all had day jobs. And we wrote this song, this little old song, Lay Me down, and we liked it. It was cool, you know. But they already had a record that went out just eight months prior. So they weren't in no rush. Their label wasn't in any rush to go and get in the studio and record a song. And, man, that song sat around for like, a year. And one day, our manager, who I later ended up being managed by the same manager as the Dirty Heads manager, the Jury Heads manager, took their demo, like, a CD of, like, a stack of songs. So like, maybe four or five songs, took them up to Kevin Weatherly over at kroc, who's, like, the most influential man in alternative radio.
- [15:41]
C
I know that guy, you know, Kevin Weatherly.
- [15:43]
D
Big shout out to Kevin Weatherley for changing all of our lives. Big shout out to Lisa Warden. Love you so much. You know, These are great times, man. And our manager, Cheese, like, he played him, you know, the song.
- [15:54]
C
They.
- [15:54]
D
They had this song with Slash playing guitar, and that was, like, the one, you know, it was like, okay, this is the one. We loaded it up, you know, this is the good song. We got Slash as a feature. This is. This is the one. But our manager's assistant, her favorite song was Lay Me down, the song that me and the guys did which was just a crappy old demo we just put together at home studio. And so she put that song at number one, God bless her heart. Shout out Tamara. And. And man, Kevin Weatherly popped that CD in, hit play in the meeting and oh, freaking Lay Me down started and she's my manager damn near had a heart attack. But, you know, he. He already started vibing, so you don't stop. The man, he's already tapping his toe and shaking his head. So it's like, whatever, man. He loved the song. He played it back four times in a row. He was like, play it again, play it again, play it again. He loved the song, was like, this is a hit. This. You know how it used to go back in the day, which it still does sometimes. And you know, man, the rest was history. You know, he. They put it on, he's like, let's hear how it does on the phones. That was like a demo, you know, our manager was like, it's not even mastered yet. He's like, oh, you want to hear how it sounds mastered on the radio? Here you go, we're going to go play it. And he just goes and plays it and the phone's blew up like crazy. And I mean, that song really changed our lives overnight. You know, I got a publishing deal within a month from Sony atv. And, you know, because I wrote half that song with the guys and they were like, hey, do you got more songs? And I'm like, that's all I do is sit and write songs. Like, of course I got more songs. And so they were like, here's the deal. Can you write more songs for other artists? And I didn't even know that that was a thing thing. So I started writing all these songs for all these other artists and getting introduced to all these just amazingly talented people where I am like the easily the least talented person in the room for like years and just soaking it up, man. And it, I mean, it's just been such a fun ride, like, to, you know, that part. And then like, boom, joining in with Sublime and then getting to tour around the world. So, I mean, you just never know, like, keeping an open mind and. And I think that sort of like, humility of like, I just still can't believe that, like, you know, this is what I can do for a living. I don't have to go work at like, you know, do roofing anymore. So it's like, yeah, it's rad. I'm very grateful for that. And I think that sort of energy is like, what keeps me Waking up in the morning and like after it, you know.
- [18:33]
C
Oh, no doubt, no doubt.
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B
We'll be right back with more of the Taking a Walk podcast.
- [18:39]
C
Foreign. So let's play this little game called Fast five. I'm gonna ask you five fast questions and get your, get your, your comments here. First of all, first album you ever.
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D
Bought, self titled Sublime.
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C
First concert you ever attended, Dan's Warp Tour.
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D
I wanted to see 311 in Bayside.
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C
First time you heard your music on the radio?
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D
Oh, man, I was. I was like, sitting on my friend's couch watching tv. It was actually his girlfriends and my manager about that. It was that day he called me and was just like, hey, what are you doing? I'm like, I'm just sitting on the couch watching tv. He's like, turn on KROC in five minutes. And then he's like, call your mom. You're. You're gonna be a rock star. And that's what he said. And I was like, what are you talking about? And yeah, I heard Lay Me down on. We. We. We went in my homie, his girlfriend's. She used to drive like this baby blue, like VW bug. It's like a 2012 or something. And no, it's older than that. 2007 because the song came out in 09. And yeah, man, we just sat there and I, man, I almost blew her speakers out. We turned it up so dang loud and. Yeah, you just, you never forget that moment. Even to this day. It don't matter where you're at, when you hear yourself on the radio or, you know, come on, on the satellite radio at a restaurant or something, it's like the most just takes you right back to being a kid. You're like, this is like why I do it. You know, I love this. I love that this is possible.
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C
First moment you knew you were gonna have a life of music.
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D
Oh, man. You know, part of being an artist is like that unshakable fear that all this is going to go away. But I just started to kind of get rid of that whole thing, funny enough, leaving Sublime. I know that sounds ridiculous. There's this kind of feeling with artistry where it's like. It's like almost too good to be true. That can drive you mad. But when you're kind of by yourself, when you're on your own, before you're like married with children and stuff, uh, you don't really care, you know, Young and dumb, young and reckless. You know, live fast, die young. Right? You're just living for the moment. But once you start packing on, like, responsibilities, you know, to people that you love, your children, you know, God, you know, bless it. Like, God forbid you even become, like, somewhat remotely successful, where you start hiring some of your family, like, you start to, you know, build something that becomes greater than yourself. So you think it starts to make the art part and this whole dream, the career thing, like, it starts to put pressure on it and a little squeeze on it, and things get complicated. And, you know, you see a lot of artists that just can't handle that. Either they quit or, you know, they harm themselves with drugs and alcohol or, you know, even worse, you know, they take their own lives, everything in between, I think it's important to kind of shake all that and. And, you know, to make a long story short, just within the last year, honestly, leaving Sublime was kind of. When I was, like, kind of figured out and trusted myself and trusted the world and God and just was like, I don't know. I don't know what's gonna happen, but I. I know, like, I'm happy and I know I'm committed. And this is like, I have music that. That I die for. And. And that. That's. That's the energy, you know?
- [22:23]
C
I love it. I love it. Okay, one more on the fast five. First instrument you ever bought?
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D
First instrument. Guitar. Electric guitar. Yeah. My dad, he got one in pawn shop and brought it home and haven't. Haven't put it down since, like, 11 years old.
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C
11 years old. I love it. So take us behind the creation of why me? It's such a. An awesome project. And, you know, this. You described a little while ago, you know, the confidence that it took to make this move. You're at this moment in time. I think that is a amazing moment. So take us a little bit behind the curtain on the creation of why me?
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D
I'd love to. Well, it all kind of stems from, like, the Pandemic, because Sublime with Rome had been touring, you know, every year since its formation. And like many other artists, when the Pandemic happened, you know, we. We were forced to kind of throw in the towel for a little bit and. And, you know, kind of had some time off, so I started, like, live streaming, and a lot of people were sitting at home, too, so these rooms were getting, like, really full. And, you know, I started getting all these fans. And after I ran through all the catalog and all the Sublime stuff and Sublime with Rome stuff, people were just like, dude, do you got any music that you're working on? And the the honest answer was, like, no. Like, I hadn't worked on music for myself in so long. I mean, I'd just been writing songs for other people, and that was, like, I had all this time. So I was like, you know what? That sounds like a lot of fun. So I started waking up in the morning and going to studio and just, like, putting together these songs and kind of putting together my whole, like, sound that I was, like, really after in my head, like, the. The sounds that I loved and the music that had the most inspiring. Like, that was the most inspiring to me. And I wanted to just kind of fuse all that together and. And, you know, see what happens, you know, because it wasn't like I was gonna, like, put an album out and go on tour. It was like the pandemic, you know? And once I started doing that, man, it just like, became such a labor of love, like. Because most other songs that I would write, they were for a reason. They were for an artist or for, you know, an A R, Hit me up or, you know, we need this kind of record for this artist. Are you interested to take a session? Here's a couple songs. You know, or. With Sublime, you know, I had other people, you know, I had to listen to the music. And so this was something that was just so free and so creative and. And it. You know, and it just created, like, a. A sound for me and an outlet. So after a while, I just, like, really couldn't. Couldn't, like, get away from the music. It was, like, all I really wanted to do. You know, even being on the road with Sublime with Rome, I would start really thinking about, you know, once it opened up the world, I would just be thinking about wanting to be at home and, like, record this music. And, like, you know, oh, man, I want to play this song my live in front of all these people. But, you know, you can't do that. It don't work like that. And. And that's, you know, why Me was one of the later songs that I really tacked onto the album. And it was because it was like my kind of just wrapping up my entire tenor with Sublime. And even, like, the single artwork of the song is a picture of me when I was 12 on my bed. And you can see, like, six sublime posters in the background because, you know, that's my favorite band. Getting to tour around the world with them, and then now stepping into, like, my solo venture and putting out my first bit of music. I wanted to pay homage to that. And, you know, the song is just really about being grateful and. And about seeing the world through, like, a better lens, you know, I don't know who said it, but I heard this really cool quote where it's like, one of the most important decisions you'll ever make is when you wake up if the world's gonna be a good place or if it's like a harmful, terrible place. And I'm, you know, butchering that. But I just think that that is, like, so true. So I wanted to flip an old age, old saying, like, why me? Kind of flipping on its head and turning it into. About something, you know, about, like, why me? Like, I'm so grateful.
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C
Like, you know, can you talk about some of the other songs that really excite you to go out and, you know, show people at the festivals and other shows you'll be playing at?
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D
Yeah, totally. So I have this other song that I'm just so excited for everyone to hear. It's called Slow and Easy. And this song is like, you know, really, it's. It's about, like, me and my wife and just like, you know, focus on so many things and trying to have control over all these aspects of our life and make sure everyone's living optimally, you know, ourselves last on the totem pole always. And I wanted to write about that and just kind of take a. You know, write a song about unplugging and just taking it slow and easy and just kind of like getting back to the simpler kind of things and just, you know, disconnecting a little bit. And, you know, it. It. It has this vibe of. Of the music that I love so much. You know, it's like this, you know, it's got like some rhythmic notes and the soulfulness of reggae, but it fuses like, almost really, really effortlessly with like, you know, soul and like. Like, you know, folk, like Van Morrison, almost. So it's like this tone, like this sound that I'm just obsessed with that I think I've kind of stumbled into.
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C
And.
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D
And, you know, I'm just. It was so awesome the way it was, but then I was like, you know what? How rad would it be to, like, put the dirty heads on here? Because one, they're my brothers, and this is like one of my favorite songs on the record. So it would just be awesome for like, a full circle moment, you know, like, everyone is so used to, you know, like, lay me down, like, whenever we're on tour together, Austin, lay me down with them. And, you know, it's like. It's kind of like a summer anthem. For like our, our age generation. So I was like, this is like the most summer anthem track that I have on the album and I gotta put my boys on it. So it's like almost full circle, you know, and that's, that's a song that's like really, you know, near and dear to me. And one of the other songs that I definitely want to highlight on the record is a song called New Me. And you know, it's, it's kind of like a double entendre where, you know, it's, it's, it's talking about like you say you knew me, but you never knew me at all, you know, because like, it's like a newer version of yourself that sometimes people, they'll take for granted what's in front of them and then like, you know, expect to keep you in like a box or whatever. And you know, it can happen in relationships very often, but you know, it could also happen in, you know, business relationships and in bands and all kinds of anytime you're dealing with another people in general, you know. And I wanted to write about that sort of feeling and that sort of experience. So that's, that's another song that I'm really excited for the world to hear. You know, it's. It's cool being able to. I have these shows and these festivals that I've been playing, you know, Cali Vibes and Cali roots and Summerfest, July 15th and all these cool festivals. And I feel like I'm kind of doing it like my music career now. I'm kind of doing it in like a, like a little more of an old fashioned way where I'm. I'm writing these songs on like that guitar, you know, and then I'm going live and I'm just playing them and I'm getting the feedback and I'm like seeing what's moving. I'm like, that bridge is too long, you know, or like this song's boring, you know, or, you know, and, and I'm kind of like, and then I'm coming home. And then I'm like, these are the songs that I want to record and it's awesome. You know, it's like so much different than like how a lot of it's done now where it's like, you know, it's just you in a little room like this and a little camera like that and you just make and make and make and self mix and put it out and shoot and shoot and shoot and shoot and put it out and shoot and put it out. And that, I mean, as an artist, it sounds awesome, but it's, it's not very fair to the art, is it? So I like living and I like being with my fans and letting them kind of determine. Help me determine the songs that we need in the movement.
- [31:11]
C
You know, you are in a zone. You know the term the zone? You are in a zone. I could absolutely tell with, with this new music and hitting the road. By the way, you mentioned Van Morrison. Shout out to Van if you haven't checked out his brand new song called Remembering Now. Check it out.
- [31:30]
D
I check that out. I haven't heard that.
- [31:32]
C
It's outstanding. It's one of his best things he's done in, in years. But I wanted to, to, to mention that for sure. So in closing, Rome, when you sort of think about younger Rome and Rome at this age, what would you tell younger Rome in terms of advice that, you know, you think about now as the older Rome?
- [31:58]
D
Drink less alcohol for sure. But you know, like, honestly, if I didn't drink less out, if, if I didn't, if I drank less alcohol, I don't know if I would be chiller right now. If I learned, you know, I had to go make a fool of myself a couple of times in the world for me to calm down. Just like I had to touch the fire, you know, I'm one of those people, unfortunately, where like no matter how many times you tell me, no matter how many videos or how many books, I just gotta learn it on my own. And I learned, I learned a lot about life watching my old man. So I'm very grateful for that. I tell him that all the time. I love him for that. I wouldn't change a damn thing about it every night. Every thing that we went through, it made me who I am. I'm a good ass dad and I take pride in that more. That's the thing that I'm the most prideful about. All that stuff led me to this point now, so. But I would go back and say, you know, hey man, like, chill out all the booze a little bit and call your mom more, you know, I love it.
- [33:07]
C
Rome, congratulations on your SO solo debut. It's. It's incredible music. I'm so happy for you and I'm so honored that you came on the Taking a Walk podcast. Thank you, Rome.
- [33:18]
D
It's an honor buzz. Thank you for having me, brother.
- [33:21]
B
Thanks for listening to this episode of the Taking a Walk podcast. Share this and other episodes with your friends and follow us so you never miss an episode. Taking a Walk is available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get your podcasts.
- [33:39]
A
This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.