Takin’ A Walk – Music History with Buzz Knight

Episode: Buzz Knight Welcomes Alan Pepper and Billy Altman to Explore The Bottom Line's Legendary Music History Journey
Date: February 3, 2026

Episode Overview

In this episode, host Buzz Knight is joined by Alan Pepper, co-owner of the legendary Bottom Line music club, and music journalist/author Billy Altman, co-authors of the book Positively 4th and Mercer. Together they explore the iconic history of The Bottom Line, its unique approach to live music, the vibrant village scene, and the creative and logistical process behind documenting three decades of musical legacy. Through engaging anecdotes and candid conversation, listeners get an inside look at the behind-the-scenes magic, heartbreak, and triumph that made The Bottom Line a cornerstone of New York City music culture.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Vision & Birth of The Bottom Line

[03:19–05:56]

• Alan Pepper shares the origin story:

  • The Bottom Line was about foregrounding music, not food or drink.
  • Built as an "intimate little theater," with state-of-the-art staging and a unique audience-first approach: no drink minimum, no noisy utensils, and minimal disturbance.
  • “We wanted to open a music room where the thing we were selling was not food and booze, but the thing that we were selling was music.” (Alan Pepper, 03:36)

• Emphasized thoughtful staffing—multiple sound mixers and stage crew, which was unprecedented for a club at the time.

• Created an environment where music could be heard and artists truly respected.

2. Creating the Book – “Positively 4th and Mercer”

[05:56–08:35]

• After the club closed in 2004, Billy Altman wrote a reflective article that ultimately led to him being tapped as co-author for the book.

• Alan Pepper: The book was intended as a legacy project, recording not only his and Stanley's achievements but the club’s role in music history.

• “I kept coming back to that article that Billy had written. Cause it had made such an impression on me...” (Alan Pepper, 07:59)

• The book follows a chronological oral history, closely tied to Pepper’s meticulous record-keeping of every Bottom Line show.

3. Favorite Guests & Interviews

[08:35–16:08]

• Bruce Springsteen was highlighted as a particularly generous and memorable interview.

  • “He was very generous because he gave Billy 25 minutes.” (Alan Pepper, 09:08)

• Billy Altman describes the diversity of acts and genres featured: rock, folk, blues, jazz, country, spoken word, theater, cabaret.

• Most artists and staff had “warm feelings” for the club and its founders.

• Touching Stories: Hearing about Darlene Love’s arrival in New York, Buddy Holly “what if” scenarios, and the special pairing of Roger McGuinn & Pete Seeger.

  • “Roger McGuinn... gave me almost a minute by minute rundown of the whole day of that performance, of spending the afternoon with Pete Seeger… It's the Pete Seeger Memorial Umbrella.” (Billy Altman, 12:45)

• Other notable mentions: John Hiatt, Paul Shaffer, Lenny White, Betty Buckley, Joey Stefko (of Meatloaf), Flo & Eddie (The Turtles).

4. Writing Collaboration & Challenges

[16:08–22:50]

• The process took several years and was collaborative yet sometimes contentious.
  • “Both of us have the scars to prove it.” (Alan Pepper, 18:54)
• The club’s broad reach meant there was far more material than could fit in one book.
• Decisions were made about who and what to include, always with an eye for a compelling narrative.
  • “You can't interview every waitress, you can't interview every stage manager... even when it came to music, there were times I felt we were missing the boat. But [Billy] constructed such a roadmap.” (Alan Pepper, 17:42)

5. The Legendary Location’s Legacy & Loss

[25:57–32:39]

• Buzz Knight asks both guests who they’d take a “dream walk” with around the Bottom Line.

  • Alan: His late partner Stanley and his wife Eileen.
  • Billy: Imagines chatting with Buddy Holly if he had survived.

• The unique intersection of musical history at West 4th and Mercer is discussed:

  • “So Dylan basically found his commercial voice on one Corner of West 4th and Mercer, and Bruce Springsteen on a parallel corner.” (Alan Pepper, 27:01)

• Reflections on the sense of cultural loss now that The Bottom Line is gone, and the role of NYU’s real estate decisions in the club’s closure.

  • Billy: “You just feel a loss of the culture of New York. And obviously, you know, cities change, neighborhoods change… but just to know that you could be veering down the street on Mercer, and you get to the corner there, and it's just another building. And as you know, there's no sign up there. There's no plaque or anything like that.” (Billy Altman, 29:23)

• Discussion of missed opportunities for the club to become a formal NYU partner or curriculum component.

6. Radio’s Partnership & Cultural Synergy

[35:48–42:54]

• WNEW FM's partnership was vital for The Bottom Line’s identity.
  • “New was very, very important to me. First as a fan, I started listening to NAW way before the Bottom Line was open… They play all kinds of music. You could go from jazz to folk to rock. And New was very successful at doing stuff like that.” (Alan Pepper, 36:20)
• FM radio’s “anything goes” approach paralleled The Bottom Line’s eclectic booking.
• Alan saw The Bottom Line as the live extension of what FM radio was doing.
• Billy Altman notes how this passion for sharing and discovery set The Bottom Line apart from clubs simply run for profit.

7. Moments that Made and Broke Them

[42:54–47:55]

• Alan shares a painful story of a mismatched show:

  • Paired wild, electric Bette Davis (not the actress) with jazz pianist Les McCann, leading to great personal embarrassment.
  • “Bette Davis was on the... Suck it. Fuck me. And I went, holy shit… I mismatched so badly… I just stayed upstairs. I did not want to walk around downstairs. That's how personally I took this stuff.” (Alan Pepper, 44:03–44:43)

• Discussion of rare Bottom Line live tapes; some were saved, some lost, or unable to be released due to rights issues.

Memorable Quotes

• “We wanted to open a music room where the thing we were selling was not food and booze, but the thing that we were selling was music.”
  —Alan Pepper (03:36)

• “We had no minimum. So you just had admission when you came in. That's all you had to pay for. We instructed the waitresses not to hassle anybody for drinks, to let them enjoy the music.”
  —Alan Pepper (04:30)

• “The one good thing that set us on a path was I had written down every show that we ever did. So... along with people who sat in and ticket prices. So it gave Billy a path. I gave him a guide.”
  —Alan Pepper (09:38)

• “I would envision that Buddy Holly did not die in his plane crash and that he was still living on 5th Avenue and 8th street, right by the arch of Washington Square park, and... he would talk about shows that he went to at the club as an older guy.”
  —Billy Altman (26:36)

• “Dylan basically found his commercial voice on one Corner of West 4th and Mercer and Bruce Springsteen on a parallel corner. So that's a very, historically speaking, that's a very valuable piece of musical real estate.”
  —Alan Pepper (27:01)

• “So the pairings were very important to me, or as Vin Skelser always says, the perfect segue. And when I mismatched, and I did mismatch, I took that very personally.”
  —Alan Pepper (42:54)

Notable Podcast Segments with Timestamps

• 03:19 – The origins and vision for The Bottom Line
• 06:20 – How the book collaboration formed
• 09:08–16:08 – Favorite interviews and stories from the book
• 18:10 – The writing process and creative friction
• 26:23 – Dream “walks” and memories of Greenwich Village
• 27:01–28:22 – Neighborhood’s musical significance; “squeezing” fans into legendary shows
• 29:23–32:39 – The loss of The Bottom Line and significance for New York
• 35:48 – The symbiotic relationship with WNEW-FM radio
• 42:54 – The art (and risk) of pairing acts; Alan’s “mismatch” story
• 46:03 – Fate of live radio tapes and Bottom Line recordings

Episode Tone & Style

• Conversational, candid, sometimes wistful and always passionate about music history
• Rich in New York lore and insider anecdotes
• Deep appreciation for craft, community, and artistic legacy

Final Thoughts

This episode serves both as a tribute and a living document of The Bottom Line’s impact on generations of musicians and fans. Alan Pepper and Billy Altman’s chemistry reflects both the pain and pride of memorializing a venue that helped define American music. Through stories both funny and poignant, listeners come away with an understanding not only of the club’s history, but the lessons and spirit it brought to the world of live music.

Recommendation:
If you love stories from music’s golden age, value oral histories, or care about the places where legends are made, Positively 4th and Mercer (and this episode) are musts.