← Takin' A Walk - Music History with Buzz Knight
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Replied via text that you would never.
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To find a three bedroom closer to the beach. To which he replied, why are you so uncompromising? A fun way to spend an afternoon.
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Use most Music Saved Me.
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But telling that story through my music and watching, you know, the tens of thousands, hundred thousands of people gravitate towards that, find inspiration and hope in my music and use my music to help them get through whatever they're going through and then to get to meet them at meet and greets at shows and hug their neck and, you know, them cry on our shoulder. That's what's kept me going. That's what's kept me straight.
- [03:08]
A
I'm Lynne Hoffman and welcome to the Music Saved Me podcast. The podcast where we get the incredible opportunity to chat with musicians who share their stories about overcoming adversity, or what I like to call obstacles, through the healing power of music. If you enjoy our show, please share it with your friends and check out our companion podcast with a really cool guy that I think you're gonna like a lot. His name is Buzz Knight and he hosts a really great podcast, also music related, called Taking a Walk. And you can find that wherever you get your podcasts. All right, today we are really excited to welcome Struggle Jennings as the grandson of Waylon Jennings and Jesse Coulter. He hails from a legacy of outlaws and rock stars, which I think should be the name of your next album. Struggle has new music out called Live from Rikers island, and he's also had chart topping success with one of our very first guests on the Music Save Me podcast. Struggle is also the face of the Sound Sobriety Rehab Clinics, which is a revolutionary music themed rehab program that we'll also get to discuss. Welcome Struggle Jennings to Music Save Me. It's so great to have you here.
- [04:21]
B
So good to be here. I'm so grateful. Thank you for having me.
- [04:25]
A
I could have you talk to me forever. That voice is just. I'm sort of a voice geek, even just talking.
- [04:32]
B
Yeah. Thank you so much.
- [04:35]
A
All right, let's start at the beginning. Struggle, can you tell us a little bit about your musical upbringing and some of your early influences when you were growing up in Nashville?
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B
Yeah. So I'm an 80s baby music singer and I grew up, of course, in a musical family. My mom had a piano in the house and my grandfather was Waylon and grandmother Jesse. And So the first 10 years of my life, or from the time I was 4 to 6, my mom was touring with Waylon as a backup singer. And so summertimes, stuff like that, I'd get to go out on tour with them and standing backstage and, you know, watching Waylon do his thing and watching My mom sing, and hearing the instruments, I was automatically just so drawn to the emotion in music. And of course, we'll get into it a little bit later. But like my mother, you know, she liked bad boys. She didn't want to take handouts from Waylon. So we ended up living in lower class areas throughout Nashville. And so as I was growing hip hop, really, as it was blowing up, it's what I really latched onto, you know, the storytelling and the stories of hard times and heartbreak and the same as country. Just it was that generation, you know, and that was the. That's what spoke to me due to my environment more than anything. So at a young age, I started writing poetry and falling in love with music. And, you know, my mom would play the piano every night when she'd get off work or every morning when she woke me up for school. She would start the day singing hymnals and playing and, you know, trying to infuse that energetic, happy, blessed to be awake environment. Even through our hardest times with. She was 16 when she had me, so, you know, we struggled a lot with her growing up and us kind of raising each other. So. But she always tried to infuse music into the household as uplifting and as a way. So I latched onto that immediately. And a lot of my influences, of course, was Waylon, musically. A lot it came from, like, Tupac, you know, with my lyricism and telling my story in a way that others could gravitate towards it. Right. Like always. Even when I was just doing poems, when I was young, writing poems in school, it was always something maybe that. Not that I went through, but that I was watching somebody else go through and just really heartfelt things.
- [07:18]
A
Well, that's interesting. So even when you were young, you observed things and were inspired to write about them poetically?
- [07:27]
B
Yeah. One of the first poems that I ever wrote was about abortion. And of course I was like 11 years old, so I didn't really even understand what that concept was. But it was called nine months, and it was about being in the womb and then. But, you know, then it was about abortion. So, yeah, I was always. I've always been like the person to like, soak up everything around, around me. Like, we'll get into it later. I did five years in prison and I didn't write a single song while I was in there because I was like, I want to just really take care of everything else I need to take care of right now. Observe. Soak this up, and then I'll tell the story when I leave And I've always just been that kind of person, you know, like, super empathic, so.
- [08:12]
A
Well, do you. Do you remember? Empathic is a phenomenal way to explain it. Do you remember the first moment that music really deeply touched you?
- [08:22]
B
I mean, I don't. I think it's been happening so long that I probably don't remember the exact. But I remember being in kindergarten and liking a girl named Sarah in school, and that song Sarah was, like, on the radio. And I can remember just, like, being emotional on the way to school, thinking about this girl that is in. I'm in kindergarten that I have a crush on, you know, and latching onto that song or, you know, my mom was really musical, so she was always listening to the radio. Like, music was constant. When we were in the car, the music was up all the way. And as long as I can remember, I can remember the feeling of the emotion from the songs, right? So, like, I can pinpoint a time of my life to a song a lot of times, an emotion, like when I was going through a breakup or when I was, you know, going through a tough time in school, you know, when I lost my father at 10, I can kind of pinpoint songs to that because I. I've latched on so heavy my whole life to music and the emotion that came from it, whether it's to soothe or to inspire or to make me feel better about whatever the situation I'm going through or, you know, like, I've got all these different playlists, and the range of music is so wide, you know, depending on, you know, if I'm going to the gym and I need, like, something that's gonna get me there, or if I'm sad or happy or, you know, music has such a power of being able to.
- [10:04]
A
Steer that for sure. And. And speaking of steering, you were once hailed as one of Nashville's top rappers. And I'm curious, despite your country music roots, what drew you to rap, hip hop?
- [10:20]
B
Well, it was just the environment. It was the era. It was, you know, the 80s and going up in the early 90s, becoming a teenager, and, you know, 93, 94, and Tupac and the long list of, you know, UGK and 8Ball and MJG, they were, like, from kind of close to where I'm from. And growing up, that was what I gravitated towards, you know, and by the time I was 12, I was in a gang. My mom was working two jobs, and my dad was murdered when I was 10. And so my life had kind of taken this Huge shift to a different path, you know, and rap is just what I latched onto. It's what spoke to me. It's what made me feel okay. It's what made me feel like I wasn't alone in what I was going through or how I felt. Then I became, you know, I started writing raps at 12, 13 years old and decided that's what I wanted to do, you know? And, of course, life had its different obstacles and different, you know, speed bumps, but, yeah, I think that's really where that came from. But country music was still always a backdrop, you know, it was always the soundtrack. You know, when I was with my dad or when, you know, after my dad was gone and I was with my uncles, country was what everybody was listening to. Country or southern rock. And so that was always ingrained in me. And I would. I found the same kind of comfort in country a lot of times, just because of the storytelling. So they kind of both coincided in my life to really pave that path to me being one of the first artists to ever mix the two genres, you know, and then.
- [11:59]
A
Awesome.
- [12:00]
B
It's really awesome now leaning into country and finding what my voice is, what my role in country music is. And a lot of these songs that I'm doing now are coming out really old school. And, you know, it's natural. It's not like we're pushing to get a sound or we're pushing it. We're just going in there and writing about my life and laying the instruments to it, and it's turning out. I've got 65 unreleased country songs right now.
- [12:25]
A
Wow.
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B
Coming up in the next year or so. Wow.
- [12:28]
A
Congratulations.
- [12:29]
B
You know, I took a break from touring last year for just a few months. For three months, I still did over 100 shows last year, but for three months, I took a break from touring and wrote over 100 songs in those three months.
- [12:46]
A
How did having Waylon Jennings as a grandfather impact your relationship with music?
- [12:53]
B
Well, for one, you know, growing up with him as my grandfather, I didn't really, you know, he's pawpaw. So until I got older, I didn't realize, like, oh, man, my pawpaw is like, the man. Yeah, like, back then, he was just pawpaw. And I knew he was. I knew he was famous, but also in school and stuff, kids would give me stuff about it. Like, you know. You know, my mom said, your dad's. Your grandpa's not a country music star. He's just a drug addict. Or, you know. Cause he had been going through Legal cases with his drug abuse and stuff. But I didn't know that side of him because I think it was an 85 or somewhere. When I was like, 5 or 6, he had that big heart attack and he quit doing everything. So when I was just really young, he switched over to a whole nother role as who he was. And I got the best years of him, you know, as a grandfather. But musically, it drew me, of course, closer to music. Watching the guy that was like, you know, my everything my dad was wasn't around anymore, and Waylon had stepped up to the plate to really be like my father. And getting to watch him walk out on those stages and the people just go crazy and him sing those songs, and that, of course, solidified what I wanted to do as a man. He taught me so much about family and about integrity and about standing your ground and not selling out or selling yourself short. Musically, he inspired me so much to just tell your story and be truthful and honest and just be you. Don't try to be like somebody else or, you know, don't follow. He used to say, don't follow in my footsteps. Find your own light, you know, stand in my shadow. Yes, there's so much that I gained from those years with him being my grandfather. But when I was young, I didn't, you know, he's like, yeah, Wayne James is my grandfather. And some people like, yeah, right. Or really. Or, you know. And it got to a point when I was older, I didn't tell anybody for a few years. Yellow Wolf tells the story all the time that he was. You know, me and him were best friends for almost a year before I even brought it up. Oh, my God.
- [15:04]
A
Because what was his reaction?
- [15:07]
B
He was like, what? Yeah, right. But I didn't want to be judged that way musically. Coming in, like, I didn't adopt the name Jennings until probably 2012, 2013. Like, I was just struggle, you know, there's a lot that comes with that. You know, some people automatically assume, oh, you've had it easier. You're riding your grandpa's coattails. You've had it easier because of who he is. It's like, no, man, that makes it 10 times harder. They expect you to feel this. They say, oh, you're not like your grandma. Well, of course I'm not. I'm not him. I'm myself, you know, and I'm. I'm doing things my own way. And so there's. It actually makes it a lot harder now. It makes for a good conversation piece, you know, when you walk into a room of musicians or artists, of course, but as far as in the industry or fans, there was no head. You know, there was no. Like, didn't get any free rides because of that. If anything, it made it a lot harder.
- [16:05]
A
I bet it was.
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B
And the reason. The reason I even adopted the name is because that's what they started calling me. They started calling me Struggle Jennings when, like, everybody was talking about me going to prison and, like, the news, you know, and dear friend of mine who's been riding with me the whole time and helped me build my brand, a guy named Sebastian Marbury, he was like, man, if you type in Struggle on Google, you're never going to find you. But you put in Jennings, you know, it'll pop up. And I talked to Shooter about it, and Shooter was like, man, please, that would be amazing. Like, pay homage to him and use the name. So I fought it for a while, but it just kind of became part of the story, you know?
- [16:45]
A
Yeah, it's a great legacy. And I understand that because I've talked to so many artists who have kids who have said the words like, I've ruined my kids. They all think they're gonna be just like me. And it's, you know, there you are with your grandfather, and it's a tremendous burden to carry, especially if you're going to go right into that same industry. And I totally understand.
- [17:09]
B
One of the things, I think one of the things that helped the most about being his grandson and having that relationship, even in my darkest moments, even when my music wasn't streaming, even when I had eviction notices on the door, even when, you know, I was getting in trouble and fighting court cases, and regardless, all the different phases of my life, I never gave up. Because he was a clear example that I had from as early as I can remember, that he came from nothing. Dirt floors in Texas. And to me, seeing him at his prime with, you know, a nanny and maids and Cadillacs and Mercedes and guards at the shack and, you know, like, so I got to see what was possible. So regardless how bad things got, I always had that glimmer of faith and hope that it would. It's possible. And I think a lot of people from my neighborhood and a lot of my old friends, they never had that. And that was one of the defining things, you know, And I try to instill that in my kids now and in other people's kids. You know, I have friends that are still struggling and, you know, work, you know, 60 hours a week to still barely getting by. And they can't do as much for their kids as maybe I can. But I try to pick up that slack and take them on vacations and do things because I want those kids to see that, too. Like, this is. If you get a taste of that better life, sometimes you'll. You'll never settle for less. And I think that's what the. One of the differences was, is I never settled and I never gave up, regardless what was handed to me or what was in front of me.
- [18:50]
A
Yeah, and that's something that's definitely built in when, you know it naturally, to not give up. And, you know, people leading ahead of you by example certainly put that out there, but you have to be able to see it and make that choice. And that's really hard, I think, for a lot of people to just choose to not give up. Yeah, it sounds so simple, but it's, you know, like you said, it's a choice.
- [19:16]
B
It's a choice. There was many times in my life where I never thought the music would work out and, you know, being Tony Montana wasn't working out. And, you know, like, you know, all these different phases of my life. And in the neighborhood that I come from, West Nashville, it's called the nations, it's surrounded by prisons and factories. And, you know, in our neighborhood, you either worked at the factories or you went to prison. You know, it's kind of like those were the two. And so, like, to make it in that neighborhood is to get a job with the city and, you know, work your way up to $20 an hour in a retirement fund, you know, and I just. I always saw past that so far that I never could settle into that comfort.
- [20:06]
A
You know, you're a visionary. You know, you speak quite openly, I've seen on TikTok and a couple of other places about a very pivotal moment in your life. Although you saw the potential in the future, you still ended up going through quite a bit of strife to get where you are now. And when you were in prison, you decided to turn your life around. That was the moment. At least that's what I can recall from what you had said. Yeah. Can you describe that moment, that moment for the listeners right now? Because I feel like you're such an amazing example of someone who has. Everybody thinks you had it all, and you had all the best influences from the top down, and you saw the good, you saw the bad, but you still ended up where you ended up. What was that moment like for you? And can you tell us?
- [21:02]
B
Yeah, well, you know, there Was a lot of in and outs as far as jail. And, you know, I attempted to change my life a few times and been successful and then failed and, you know, took steps forward and fell steps back. And at one point I did 15 months in jail for a marijuana case and got out and my kids were scattered. The mother of my kids was fighting a fed case. And so I went and got my kids and I was a single dad with two kids. And I did good for like five, six years, stayed straight, working, you know, two jobs if I had to, and started having more kids with the mother of my three youngest and fell back in. You know, it was like one, two, two minute or two too many eviction notices and, you know, jobs not panning out. And, you know, I just, I kept. I kept working hard and then I, you know, get knocked down and. Or allow myself to fall. I hate to use the get knocked down because we have this choice as well, right? To get back up.
- [22:08]
A
I love that you said that.
- [22:10]
B
And I fell short numerous times in and out of jail and, you know, did good for years, and then I fall back off. And then this last time when I went to prison, at that point, I had five kids. I was watching the ones that I thought for so long I was doing right by. You know, I was instilled with a lot of irrational beliefs at a young age. You know, you feed your family by any means necessary. It's okay to do wrong if you're doing it for the right reasons. You know, I live by that. I justify everything by, like, I'm just doing this for my kids. I'm just doing this for my family to take care of my kids. You know, Then when those gates shut, my kids became the biggest victim. They were left without a father, without someone to protect them, provide for them. You know, my wife at the time was left without a partner, without the man that was paying the bills and taking care of her. So I got slapped with that reality real fast that, hey, I'm not the man I thought I was, and I'm not being a good father, I'm not being a good husband, I'm not being a good son, I'm not being a good friend by continuing to put my family through this. That's a hard pill to swallow. You know, when you really have to look at things and take accountability and say, everything that is happening to me and everything that is happening to the people that I love is a direct result of a decision that I made. You know, you can't really hide anymore. You can't hide behind. You can't justify, you know, you can't be mad at the guy that told on you because I shouldn't have been doing what I was doing. And then to top that, I'm watching what's happening. The mother of my kids hooking up with another guy, getting addicted to drugs again when I worked hard to get her off of them. My children being drugged through the mud and into bad situations, you know, having to make those phone calls home. And my five year old daughter at the time is crying saying, daddy, we have an eight. And I'm having to teach her from a jail phone how to make macaroni and cheese so she can feed her two siblings because her mom's passed out on drugs and realizing that I'm not there, I can't protect them, you know, and then my daughter got molested in a drug house, you know, and I'm, and I'm finding all this out while sitting behind concrete and steel with no one to blame but myself. You come to a point where you're like, hey, the same way I messed all this up, I'm the only one that can fix it. So I decided to just really buckle down and work to become the best man that I could, make sure that my kids never had to go through that again. There were a lot of moments in there where I'm looking around the room and I'm seeing the guys that are gambling and smoking cigarettes, eating honey buns and, you know, and then I'm seeing the guys that are reading books, going to every program, working out. I said, that's what I want to do. So I spent every day of my five years training. Mind, body, soul, spirit. Finding out, stripping down all those layers and finding out, why do I keep coming back? Why do I keep coming here? How can I stop this vicious cycle? Because my uncle did it. My dad was killed when I was 10 and you know, he was a, a great man, but, you know, he sold drugs and worked hard and just a good old boy. But this is a vicious cycle. You know, Waylon passed from drug induced diabetes, you know, from years of addiction. I don't want my kids to have to go through what I went through. I want them to have a father. I want them to have a role model. I want them to have somebody they can look up to, look to, count on. I started stripping all those layers away and really digging and soul searching and finding myself, finding who I wanted to be. Like, who am I really? That's why I wear all the turquoise, because for so long since I was a kid, turquoise was my favorite stone. But I was so caught up in what was cool and what I thought I was supposed to be that I would never wear it. I had all these diamond chains and, and gold and you know, and so when I came home I was like, turquoise wasn't cool at that time, you know, and I was like, but it was to me. So I started rocking the turquoise. Now it's trendy, but you know, back then when I first came home. Yeah, but yeah, so it was like watching all this happen, you know, even leading up to the death of the mother of my kids who died from a drug overdose a few years ago, watching what my children were going through and having to honestly look at that and go, this is because of me. This is because of that guy I was trying to be. And I justified it for so long, you know, and now trying to make sure that I can keep those same irrational beliefs out of my children's mind. So, you know those moments and those phone calls calling home. I remember as soon as I got in the county jail, one of the first things that my five year old daughter Innocence, who just went through so much finding out that her mom had passed out and she was at a bus stop crying, couldn't, you know, no one there to pick her up for four hours, you know, and thinking about what a six year old is going through in their mind when she's used to daddy pulling up and being there and now daddy's not here and now nobody's there to pick her up. Like just those, those moments were the, just the ones that is even though as tragic as they are and I tell my family all the time, it's like that's what I'm not gonna give up. That's why I didn't give up. Something great has to come from this or it was all in vain. If we can take all the pain and all the tragedy and all the bad mistakes and do something great with that, learn from it and inspire others and live a purpose driven life in gratitude and we can do something great with all of this. It wasn't in vain.
- [28:36]
A
We'll be right back with more of the Music Saved Me podcast. And by the way, if you like this podcast, you are going to love our companion podcast called Taking a Walk. It's hosted by my dear friend Buzz Knight and you can find it wherever you get your podcasts. Time for a sofa upgrade. Visit washablesofas.com and discover Annabe where designer style meets budget friendly prices with sofas. Starting at $699, Anabe brings you the ultimate in furniture innovation with a modular design that allows you to rearrange your space effortlessly. Perfect for both small and large spaces, Anibe is the only machine washable sofa inside and out. Say goodbye to stains and messes with liquid and stain resistant fabrics that make cleaning easy. Liquid simply slides right off. Designed for custom comfort, our high resilience foam lets you choose between a sink and feel or a supportive memory foam blend. Plus our pet friendly stain resistant fabrics ensure your sofa stays beautiful for years. Don't compromise quality for price. Visit washablesofas.com to upgrade your living space today with no risk returns and a 30 day money back guarantee. Get up to 60% off plus free shipping and free returns. Shop now at washablesofas.com Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply. Millions of people have turned to Claude, the AI assistant from Anthropic because it just feels different. Where other AIs often sound a little robotic, Clawd has been designed with special research that informs its character, meaning that Claude just gets it when it comes to empathy and emotional intelligence. That's why Claude has become the if you know, you know choice for dating advice, career coaching, gathering your thoughts for those important life decisions, and more. Give Claude a try for free at Claude.com that's C-L-A-U--E.com and let us know how you feel the difference. At homes.com we do whatever it takes to get you the in depth info on local schools you won't find anywhere else. Things like student teacher ratio, test scores and school programs. And sometimes that requires attending school recitals. So many recitals.
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- [32:57]
B
Every bit.
- [32:58]
A
Yeah.
- [32:58]
B
Yeah, every bit of it. You know, I journaled the whole time I was there, wrote letters I would write while I was in there. I didn't actually form songs because I was like, I'm just gonna write my, you know, write about things. And that's always been my go to, that's always what, where my therapy was and then getting out from prison and telling that story, showing that transformation, of course in my actions and who I am. But telling that story through my music and watching, you know, the tens of thousands, hundred thousands of people gravitate towards that, find inspiration and hope in my music and use my music to help them get through whatever they're going through. And then they get to meet them at meet and greets at shows and hug their neck and, you know, cry them cry on our shoulder. And that's what's kept me going. That's what's kept me straight. That's what keeps me focused. It's what keeps me from, you know, losing it. God allowed me to be strong enough to make it through this. And now I have a testimony to give and I have an opportunity to give that back. And you know, when you have that, when you have a purpose, when you feel like there's purpose in what you do, right, all the other things that come, not like I tell people all the time, I don't look at ops. I look at obstacles as opportunities. Another notch under my belt, another story to tell to show somebody else that they can get through this, too. You know, like when I found out that. I just found out recently that how my father got killed, you know, and it had been by a family member. And when I was young, he died when I was 10, and I was outside playing football, and my mom comes out there, and she's like, hey, your dad's on the phone. And I was like, tell him I'll call him back later. When I came in that night, she was crying. All my family pulled up, told me that my dad was no longer with us. I was 10, and they told me it was suicide. So where they thought they were protecting me by telling me it was suicide, I was the last person he called, and I didn't take the phone call. So I lived with that all through my teenage years, feeling that regret of, what if I were to answer the phone? And. Which, of course, led me to be suicidal, because then I was like, you know, that's how my dad died. And it wasn't until I was 18, and my uncle told me, boy, your dad didn't kill himself. He was killed. But I never got a clear answer who it was. And then one of my family members, my favorite aunts, she was on her deathbed, and I went to visit her, and one of my other uncles let it out the bag that she was the one that had killed him. And I had my arm around her when it was told to me. And it was one of those moments where, like, you know, I kind of blanked out, you know, and I just kind of looked around and I looked at her, and she didn't budge. You know, she took it all the way to the grave with it. But she. But she had been such a light in my life, and she had took care of me so many times when I was in my darkest moment and I wasn't even mad at her. It was another level of closure. I would have liked to been able to talk to her and find out, like, what happened, you know, like if they got an argument or what, what the reason was. But she passed that night, and I didn't. I never got that. But. But even then, it was one of those things. It was like I had to go through that to become who I am today and to be able to talk to other people that are going through the same things or that have been through or been through, you know, things like that, to let them know that they're not alone. And that they can find strength in the fact that I'm still here and I'm doing good. You know, I'm working to do great, but I'm doing good. You know, I've got all seven kids in the house. You know, my. My daughter who was molested and, you know, cooking macaroni and cheese in that apartment, talking to her dad on the phone, trying to feed her siblings and watching her mom overdose and pass out and then eventually losing her mother to a drug overdose. She just called me this morning because she couldn't. She was trying to figure out where to get her parking pass at college. She graduated with a 3.9 GPA honors.
- [37:34]
A
Awesome. That's such amazing news.
- [37:36]
B
She's in western Kentucky now, you know, for going to college, you know, and is doing incredible. My daughter courtesy, who's 16, she's, you know, she was right there. She was the younger sister and she was. Went through all of that just as much, you know, and having to be stripped from not only their father leaving, but then their mother crashing when he left. And then, you know, going from a life where I was providing to the depths of poverty until they ended up in foster care. And then, you know, I came home and fought for a year to get them out of foster care and to get custody of them again. And then, you know, rebuilding those relationships and that trust and stability and, you know, now she's 16 and he drives a brand new Lexus SUV and homecoming queen, straight A student, like not even 98, like hundreds and hundred and twos. Like, you know, in an incredible relationship with a great guy who's a huge soccer star. I mean, it's just, you know, there it is possible to turn it all around. You just have to believe. You have to believe in yourself. You have to put the work in and you have to find those things. Like, for me, music was one of the biggest things that I could latch onto and when I needed, you know, of course I have prayer and other things, but when I need to just recenter, I can find that song, you know, and strike that emotion. And whether it's me driving around, you know, with it on 10, crying my eyes out, or, you know, getting amped up or just a happy singing to the top of my lungs, whatever that is, whatever that emotion I need or that strength that I need, being able to pull it for music, you know, that's why we came out with sound sobriety. The concept of sound sobriety, which is the rehabs that we're opening, supposed to be cutting the ribbon on the first one. Soon we had a few hiccups in it, but we're lined up to do about 20 of them as soon as we get the first model completely locked in and done. But I'm also working, and we're still working. Even though we don't have our facility open yet, we're still doing things. But the concept behind it was, you know, for me, writing was one of the. My biggest avenues of release and therapy. And, you know, so I'll be having big songwriters and big artists come in to the rehabs and doing a songwriting class where we teach each other participant that comes through how to put their life and their emotions and their feelings into song form. And then when they graduate the program, they'll get a BMI number and be a registered songwriter. And so they'll have somebody that they will pitch songs for them. You know, they'll have somebody that they can turn their songs into and pitch them for other artists and hopefully give them, you know, hope and a career in that as well. Because that's what it's been for me. You know, if I didn't have divine connection with music or that deep passion to create and, you know, who knows if I would have made it through all this stuff.
- [40:54]
A
I don't even want to stop this momentum because you're just. Your story is just so incredible. And then every time I think I've heard it all, it's just another height that you've reached after reaching the lowest low. It's. It's pretty incredible. And it's amazing how much music has been a part of it. And obviously this question I'm going to ask you, I'm going to guess I know the answer to. Do you believe that music has healing powers?
- [41:18]
B
I think it's one of the strongest. I mean, we know it scientifically, right, through like, you know, different frequencies and stuff, you know, that are able to heal sound, bats and, you know, there's so much scientific research, but just as far as a personal yes, I think it's one of the most healing things ever. You know, I've had songs that I needed to write, like when the mother and my children passed or when I was first coming home and I didn't really have that relationship back with my daughters yet that I'd have these songs that they'd take me months to write because every time I'd get emotional when I try to write it. But once I got that out on the paper and once I sang it through that microphone, not only did it. Did I get A level of healing, but then being able to play it for them and them understand and have that to hold on to as well, is just a whole nother. You know, I think music has definitely been what's healed me more than anything else.
- [42:19]
A
Who are some of the artists that you listen to when you're having sort of a difficult time or maybe that you can recall you listen to. And in Times of Darkness, I mean.
- [42:29]
B
There'S so many, you know, and different levels of different years. And who was everything from, you know, old country, 90s country, George Strait and George Jelly, like, heartbreak songs or, you know, Ed Sheeran has had. There's. He's had a couple songs. There's an artist named Ron Pope who. He had some songs that got me through some really, really dark times. Let's go. Chris Stapleton. You know, I mean, there's just so many, you know, you can go back to, you know, Waylon songs and Tupac songs, you know, old rap. That was just telling those stories. There's so many, you know, I couldn't pinpoint one artist.
- [43:13]
A
That would be a whole other show, wouldn't it?
- [43:16]
B
Yeah. Yeah.
- [43:17]
A
Well, you know, speaking of artists, one of your besties. Can I say that about guys? Best.
- [43:23]
B
Yeah, he's my best, actually. When I just. When I just went to the ATMs, the ACM Awards last year.
- [43:30]
A
Yeah.
- [43:30]
B
Down in Texas, you know, you get your credentials and Jelly was up for a bunch of awards. I wasn't up for any awards or anything, but I was there as his guest, and my credential said Struggle Jennings artist Jelly Rolls Bestie oh. So.
- [43:46]
A
All right, good. So I'm not the only one that called you that.
- [43:49]
B
No, no, that's my bestie.
- [43:51]
A
I love that so much. Can you tell I love him, too. How important is that brotherhood with someone like Jelly Roll on your. On your journey?
- [44:01]
B
Oh, it's been everything, you know, I mean, it's been. It's been played such a major role. He. We met. I was fresh out of a jail sentence, raising two kids by myself. I think I hadn't even had my third child yet when I. When we met. And he had just got out of jail or juvenile because he was still young and he was out selling CDs and doing rap battles, and I was promoting a show and selling my cd and we met and just automatically clicked and going on 23 years of a friendship, you know, he slept on my couch. And I've watched him, you know, grow and. And become who he's become. And not only did our Friendship, because we were in the streets together, you know, we did a lot of things. We carried a lot of caskets together. We lost a lot of friends. We both did time, you know, during our friendship. And having somebody that you just always know is there for you, you know, has been such a major part of it. Because there's, you know, I think a lot of people make a lot more. That's why I believe in support systems so much. I believe that a lot of people make a lot worse decisions when they feel like they're all alone and they have nobody. You know, the level of desperation or the level of loneliness and. And feeling like you have nothing to lose. And that's something Jelly's always given me, is feeling like I had something to lose. You know, when I was in prison, he, you know, calling him from that jail phone and him being like, oh, man, I'm in Missouri or I'm in Mississippi. You know, he was out doing shows and he was sleeping in a van. And, you know, he started telling me as I was getting close to getting out, like, sure, I'm telling you, this is possible, man. I made a thousand bucks last night at this show, you know, like, why you made a thousand dollars in one night without selling drugs? Like, you know, so there was so much inspiration and hope. And when I came home, he, you know, he still didn't have it figured out. He was still, you know, doing shows and sleeping in a van still sometimes. And, you know, he wasn't. But then he just never gave up. He kept plugging away. And it definitely was a big inspiration for me to not give up, you know?
- [46:38]
A
I bet.
- [46:39]
B
And then we started doing the Wayland and Willie albums together, and they just took off. And then he signed with Strange Music and then had the song Save Me, and it was just like, yep, now he's a household name. And I couldn't be more proud of him. I love it. And he's still, this day, my best friend. You know, we can sometimes talk five times a week, or sometimes we might not talk for three or four weeks because of his schedule.
- [47:08]
A
You just pick out where you left off.
- [47:10]
B
Well, anytime we call, two, three hour phone call, you know, I can be that sounding board for him. And he can decompress and know that anything he says on that phone with me is a thousand percent safe. And things that he. You know, a lot of time as men, we don't have too many people that we can really just vent and lay it all on, you know, like our wives or our children or our Mothers or everybody kind of looks to us to be that strength and that backbone. So in our moments of weakness, sometimes it's hard. You know, we try to hold that industry, shield others from feeling, you know, getting nervous or antsy. You know, we gotta act like we've got it all together. Yeah. So me and him have that in each other. And, you know, I don't call him because I respect his time and I know how busy he is. Right. I mean, if I had something, you know, that I really needed to talk to him about that was, like, important or something, I would call him. I'm not saying I don't ever call him, but I just. I kind of try to be that friend that is just, like, he knows he can call me at any time and I'm gonna shut the world down and give him those two or three hours that he needs because he's. He's really busy right now. He's going through a lot. A lot of changes, you know, from coming from where we came from and going through what he's went through to now being the biggest star on the face of the planet. You know, there's a lot of pressure in that. There's a lot of. You know, I know he's so busy. He's got people pulling him 100 different ways. Right. So being able to be that support for him and just be that guy for him that's always there for him means the world to me.
- [48:56]
A
You know, two things keeping each other grounded and also knowing that as much as it's great to ride to the success levels, there's also pitfalls that come with it. And I'm sure he needs the safety of your friendship. Even though he's always have it.
- [49:13]
B
He'll always have it.
- [49:14]
A
Yeah. It's very special.
- [49:15]
B
It really is. Holding each other accountable to, you know, like, he calls me all my, you know, and I'm like. He's like, struggle or you're not being accountable or not holding yourself accountable right now. Why did that happen? You know?
- [49:31]
A
That's a nice way of putting it.
- [49:32]
B
Yeah. Well, he, like. He likes to give me my own medicine, you know.
- [49:35]
A
Yes.
- [49:36]
B
You know, I gotta hear my own sermon sometimes from somebody else.
- [49:41]
A
Yeah. Like, what would you say to yourself? What would you tell me? Tell yourself that same thing. Kind of advice. Yeah.
- [49:48]
B
Jelly does that. He uses my own sayings against me. Not against me. It's for me. You know what I mean? Yeah. No, but you need that. You need. You know, if you're surrounded by yes men or people that just Tell you what you want to hear or, you know, condone your bad behavior. Right. Because we're all gonna slip, we're all gonna make mistakes. That never stops. Right. It's really just realizing when you make those, taking accountability for them and then fixing it. Because it's really not about how many times you fall. It's about how many times you get back up. You know, we all have riddled with human nature mistakes.
- [50:29]
A
I like to say mistakes are tuition. You know, if you. If you use them correctly, then they're not mistakes.
- [50:37]
B
Yep.
- [50:37]
A
And like, sometimes you have to have a. A friend of mine said this once. It was so much. Sometimes, you know, when, like a piano just falls on your head. Like those are those moments that you need to wake up, you know, whatever that, you know, incred incredibly. I saw a video and I believe it just happened this past year. And I just wanted to congratulate you. And you were invited to the Grand Ole Opry. I was bawling watching the video of him asking you.
- [51:03]
B
Well, I didn't know what was going to happen. He told me I needed to come down there to the ACMs and there was like a little Grand Ole Opry event that he wanted me to come to. And I went and did Billy Bob's with him the night before. And so I'm in there and the Vince Cool or whatever, but I was like, I might have a drink or something, you know, So I mosey over to the bar and I'm talking to other artists and hanging out, and I see him coming across the room and I can tell that he's upset. He's like teary eyed and he gets up on me and I'm paying attention to him. So I didn't even realize there was cameras around us, right? But they were like, this camera crew's following him, but I'm locked into his eyes because I can see he's like choked up. He's like, man, I got to tell you something. And. And my first thing, because of our history and, you know, I thought somebody had died. You know, like, we lost one of our best friends, like our little nephew. A year, two years before that, the day me and him were doing Red Rocks together, we got the call that he had got killed outside of a club in Nashville. Our nephew Nate. And so it was like we've had so many of those kind of moments that I just automatically went into like, what's wrong? What's wrong? What's wrong? And then he's like, they've invited you to Play the Grand Old Opry. I was just like, he couldn't even.
- [52:25]
A
Get the words out. He couldn't even say it.
- [52:27]
B
I know the look on my face in that video. I laugh at it all the time because it was like a whirlwind of emotions going from thinking somebody's died or something's really wrong to oh my God, this is one of the greatest honors I could ever get. And I'll take something else. How God likes to give little winks every once in a while and let you know you're doing right. My Grand Ole Opry debut, I didn't get to pick the date. You know, they said, well, this is the day that you're gonna that we want you to come do The Grand Old Opry fell on the same day as my last day of parole. So I walked out on the stage at the Grand Ole Opry a free man. And it was like one of those wings from God saying, this is the end of one chapter and the beginning.
- [53:13]
A
Of another, you know, it sure was.
- [53:17]
B
You can't make it up, man.
- [53:18]
A
You give me kisses.
- [53:19]
B
You can't make it up. It's just so beautiful how if you just stay in tune and you stay in line and you, you listen and you pay attention, do your best to be your best and be humble and grateful, so much amazing things fall into place, things we could never even design, you know.
- [53:40]
A
Struggle Jennings, thank you so much for coming on Music Save me and sharing your story with us. Thank you really, I mean, just wonderful, wonderful stuff that you're doing and keep doing what you're doing and that's what we're doing here. And highlighting stories like you are just some of the most amazing things that I feel like I've ever been a part of. So thanks for coming on to share it and for the listeners.
- [54:03]
B
Thank you doing what you're doing. Thanks Keep, keep touching lives. People need to hear it.
- [54:10]
A
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- [55:41]
B
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- [55:43]
A
Mentions the R word Remission.
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B
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A
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