← Takin' A Walk - Music History with Buzz Knight
Takin' A Walk - Music History with Buzz Knight
"takin ' a walk" Celebrates New Music from The Head and The Heart.
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- [00:01]
Buzz Knight
When your company earns unlimited 2% cash back on all purchases with Capital One, that's serious business.
- [00:07]
Kenny Hensley
So Stephen at Sandcloud got a serious business card, the SparkCash plus card from Capital One.
- [00:13]
Jonathan Russell
We used our 2% cash back to help build our retail presence.
- [00:17]
Kenny Hensley
Savvy Steven.
- [00:18]
Jonathan Russell
And we get big purchasing power so our business can spend more and earn more.
- [00:22]
Kenny Hensley
The SparkCash plus card from Capital One. What's in your wallet?
- [00:26]
Jonathan Russell
Terms and conditions apply.
- [00:27]
Larison Campbell
Find out more@capitalone.com SparkCashPlus In Mississippi, Yazoo Clay keeps secrets.
- [00:35]
Jonathan Russell
7,000 bodies out there or more.
- [00:39]
Larison Campbell
A forgotten asylum cemetery.
- [00:41]
Jonathan Russell
It was my family's mystery.
- [00:43]
Larison Campbell
Shame, guilt, propriety. Something keeps it all buried deep until it's not. I'm Larison Campbell, and this is under Yazoo Clay. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.
- [01:01]
Lynn Hoffman
Taking a Walk.
- [01:02]
Buzz Knight
It was just this really exciting thing to witness and then to introduce myself and be a part of it. And as we got to know each other and started playing there more often, it was, yeah, this really kind of addictive feeling in the room. Everybody was showing up every week. And then, I don't know. It's really hard to explain, but I've never experienced anything like that.
- [01:21]
Lynn Hoffman
Welcome to another edition of the Taking a Walk podcast, where Buzz Knight digs deep into the stories of music, their influences, and their creative process that connects with their community. If you like this podcast, check out our companion podcast hosted by Lynn Hoffman called Music Saved Me. Today, Buzz is joined by two members of the indie folk rock band the Head and the Heart, Kenny Hensley and Jonathan Russell. We'll dive into their musical journey and get the stories behind their music. Next on Taking a Walk.
- [01:56]
Kenny Hensley
Well, Kenny and John, thanks for being on Takin A Walk. And since this show is called Taking a Walk, I have to ask you guys, if you were to take a walk with someone living or dead, and it could be musical, but it doesn't have to be. Who would that individual be? And where would you be taking a walk with them, you think?
- [02:20]
Buzz Knight
John, you want to take this first?
- [02:22]
Jonathan Russell
Sure. I feel like I've got a few and then I keep. Every time I think about, oh, this one for sure, I'm like, don't be your idols. You know, I'm gonna go with Chris Martin. I met Chris Martin, obviously from Coldplay. I met him at a house show party that we actually played acoustically years ago. And he was super nice. I was so nervous and I think he knew it, but he was really gracious and took a, took a fair amount of time to speak with me. I was really blown away by how kind he was and I would love to spend more time with Chris Martin.
- [02:58]
Buzz Knight
So you've already had a talk with Chris Martin, but you'd like another one?
- [03:01]
Jonathan Russell
I'd like, I'd like some more time.
- [03:03]
Buzz Knight
You had like one of those things where you had a conversation with somebody and then a couple days later you were like kicking yourself for not saying certain things and wish you could go redo it.
- [03:11]
Jonathan Russell
Yeah. Or like, or yeah, like you mentioned, you know, like this is why you play music is because of you. Like, wish I could take that back.
- [03:20]
Buzz Knight
Yeah.
- [03:21]
Kenny Hensley
And where would you go, John?
- [03:23]
Jonathan Russell
You know, I think he lives near the beach, at least in terms of la. So I'd probably suggest, you know, some long walk along the beach, you know, maybe sunset, maybe sunrise with coffee. Actually probably be even better for me.
- [03:35]
Kenny Hensley
Yeah, perfect.
- [03:36]
Jonathan Russell
Yeah. Malibu, baby.
- [03:38]
Kenny Hensley
All right, Kenny, you're up.
- [03:39]
Buzz Knight
Yeah, you know, I was thinking about this. We were told that this might be a question to put a little thought into it over the weekend, you know, a lot of musicians and influences crossed my mind and you know, of course there are many people that I would enjoy the privilege of doing something like that with. But the more I thought about it, I started kind of getting weird with it where I started thinking, you know, if I could go on a walk with myself when I was younger, that would be like my ideal situation to like talk to, like going on a nice walk with myself when I was 18 and like just, I don't know, maybe like gain some excitement or like wide eyed exuberance from like that 18 year old who hadn't experienced too much in the world yet, you know, and try to, you know, find, find what inspired me back then and get some of that again. But I was thinking about it more and then I, I kind of settled on a relative. Not a famous person or musician, but I think if I could take a walk with anybody, it would be my mom's dad, my grandpa, who I never met. He passed away when my mom was 16 and he. I've just heard stories my whole life about this guy. He was a World War II vet and was shot down over Germany. Survived the plane crash, ended up meeting my grandma who's German during the war and they ran away to Hollywood together and like lived in Morocco at one point. Just really epic, like, you know, has a purple Heart and amazing stories and my mom just always has the best things to say about him. And I Know that she, you know, thinks every day about the fact that he, you know, never got a chance to see us or have grandkids and whatnot. And so I think I would love to go on a long walk with him and I think I would do that here in Los Angeles, where I'm from and where he was born and raised also. He's, you know, I'm like fourth generation Angeleno, which is pretty rare. And I think it'd be fun to walk around like old classic LA with my grandpa I never got to meet.
- [05:35]
Kenny Hensley
Thanks for sharing that. That's. That's special.
- [05:39]
Buzz Knight
Thanks.
- [05:40]
Kenny Hensley
So bands are pretty fragile things, Fragile entities. So what makes the Head and the Heart tick is a band, in your guys opinion?
- [05:52]
Buzz Knight
It's tough and I mean a lot of therapy. I guess that's not what, what makes us tick, what, what keeps us together. You know, we, we've been a band now about 15 years and we've been through a whole lot, you know, we. Yeah, a lot of ups and downs, a lot of, lot of moments and situations. I think a lot of bands wouldn't have made it through, but I think like anything, you know, like getting through the hard times and building these layers of layers and layers of like armor. I feel like we have at this point we can kind of get through anything. And yeah, we started doing therapy as a band years ago. Group therapy. That's kind of, you know, off and on. We still do it and I think having those resets as a group with a moderator, a mediator of some sort has been really helpful and has really kept us going, I think, and kind of got us over the hump. I feel like we went through periods that looking back, I think we kind of like we made it, we got through that and I don't think we'll ever have to deal with that again, hopefully, you know. So. Yeah, I don't know if that answers your question, but that's what comes to mind.
- [06:53]
Kenny Hensley
Yeah. Kenny. Sorry, John, before I get to you, I mean that's so amazing that you guys have embarked on that part of your journey. It came up in the Music Saved Me edition of the Head and the Heart, which I encourage folks to check out as well with Maddie and Charity. So I think it's so admirable that you, you put in the foreground the need for, you know, just transparency on how we're feeling and how you're feeling as a band. So kudos to the Head and the Heart for having that bravery.
- [07:30]
Buzz Knight
Yeah, thank you. I think, you know, not saying that we're any different than most bands or any band. But there's, you know, six very, very different personalities in this band. You know, we somehow work well together musically, and it comes together and we love each other. It's like a brother sister type deal. But you almost couldn't put together a group of more like different, you know, neurotic or perfectionistic type people. And because of that, it's come with a lot of struggles over the years, but I think it also is kind of the magic that binds us and that separates us from other groups. Yeah.
- [08:08]
Jonathan Russell
And really, just to add to that, because I agree with everything Kenny has said and maybe something that's very obvious, but I think I. I've overlooked it from time for sure. Is. Is really the thing that drew us together in the first place. And that I think, has kept us choosing to remain even when things are very challenging is the music chemistry. Like, you know, when we were all meeting one another in Seattle, Washington, over the years, I guess it was like, what, 2009, when we were kind of. Majority of us were all meeting, like.
- [08:40]
Buzz Knight
Yeah.
- [08:42]
Jonathan Russell
It's not like we necessarily had something in mind of, like, looking for a sound. You know, we had all kinds of variations of players and instrumentation and styles and personalities. And then for whatever reason, like, when these six people started playing together in our, you know, our grimy little rehearsal spot, it just clicked. It was just like, kind of smiling and everyone was just, like, instantly willing to wanna put in, like, as many hours as we could, as many days a week to rehearse, because it just. I don't know, it was. For me at least, it was like something I'd never experienced, you know, like true musical chemistry. And of course there are, you know, there are hard conversations and sometimes, you know, it's not all honky dory, but, like, in general, like, it was just the type of musical chemistry that I think that remains compelling enough to put up with what is a very challenging artistic endeavor. You know, there's a lot of compromises and there's a lot of personalities to deal with. And at the end of the day, I think there were numerous, you know, occasions to want to just walk away because it was just. It could have been too much. But I think the music chemistry keeps bringing us back. And that's in studio as well as on stage. I mean, we've got a. We're sitting on a new record right now. And, you know, somehow I'm yet again, like, just giddy like a little child. I can't wait to get back on stage, start playing these new songs. And, you know, we've been doing it for a long time. You would think that that would wear off. And it just. It blows my mind how excited I am to just get back on stage with these other five people. So.
- [10:24]
Kenny Hensley
So we'll talk about the. The new music and sort of the. The creation of it. But you referred to this. But I want you to maybe take us back a little bit more particularly to those, you know, those open mic nights there at the Burn Pub. When at that pub, did you first realize there was some chemistry with this group of people?
- [10:49]
Jonathan Russell
I mean, the entire, like, experience of that was really intoxicating. I mean, even when we weren't necessarily this exact. Because. Because the kind of Burn open mic that you're speaking of was sort of like a revolving door. You know, it's like it was where we kind of got to try out our different identities. You know, like one night we would have three girls singing with us, and one of them plays flute, one of them plays Glock and Spiel. Like a little superfluous maybe, but, like, let's try it out. Because we had a buddy who had a buddy, and. And it was just. I don't know, it was just like there was such a fertile music ground happening in Seattle. And maybe it still is to this day. I hope it still is to this day. But for us, I can only speak of then. I don't know, it just. It just felt like. I don't know, Kenny. I feel like.
- [11:42]
Buzz Knight
Yeah, I mean, I can add on. Yeah, I mean, for me, at least my experience, it was a very, like. It felt like for me, John said this, but for me, it felt like the first time I felt something different. Like there was this connection that I had never experienced before. There was a feeling in the rooms there, like the community that was happening. And for me, at least I was 21. I, you know, was just old enough to start going to bars. I moved up from LA by myself, didn't know anybody, so it was really just like avoiding college, not wanting to do music, but, like, just trying to, like, make a change. Just like hoping I'll meet somebody eventually or something. Or something will happen, not. Not knowing at all. And I went to Connor. Burn is the pub we all met at. I went down, just as a recommendation from a friend to watch a basketball game. It was like a Laker Finals game. And I've grown up here in la. I'm a, like, lifelong Lakers fan. And so I went down to watch this game and it happened to be the night that they won the NBA championship in 09, so they beat the Orlando Magic. And I just was at this Irish pub. And it's funny, too. Chris, our bass player, was bartending me that night. He worked there. And so I met. I met this guy Chris and was talking to him, explaining him that I was new to town and didn't really know anybody. And because they won the game, I kind of was like, well, I'm celebrating. I'm going to stay out and have more drinks and, you know, enjoy and try to meet some people. I didn't have any friends and there happened to be a little show happening that night. And John and Josiah, who had just met, like, maybe a month or two before, were a part of that, this kind of collective playing. And I just remember sitting and watching with the idea that I just moved to the city with the goal of pursuing music, but literally having no plan whatsoever, thinking I might move up to Seattle and spend three months there and move right back to la because I didn't meet anybody or nothing happened. And it's like a week after I moved there and I'm sitting in this place watching John play songs by himself, like a singer, songwriter, and just being so impressed, like. Like, whoa. Like, here's a guy who sounds really good and like he's playing original music. Like, that's amazing. And then 10 minutes later, Josiah goes up and it's another guy. And I'm like, wow, this guy's good too. Like, and they're hanging out, they're friends. Like, I need to meet those guys. And there are other people that would go up, you know, there was like, it was an open mic night. So there was. There were some groups. There was like a group called the beatfunkles that only played Beatles and Simon and Garfunkel covers, and they were like, more silly. And, you know, there was stuff like that, of course, but there were also people that took it very seriously. And we're really testing out, like, new original material. And so I met. I met John and Josiah and it was just really exciting to see this thing happening. And I had never in my life performed in front of anybody. I had never been in a band. It was kind of my secret thing that I like my greatest love. But I was too scared or embarrassed or much of a perfectionist to, like, be out in the world about it. Like, I never performed and never even told my friends I played music. It was kind of my thing I did at home. But the hope was when I moved to Seattle. All my friends were like, why are you moving there? I'm like, oh, I'm going to be a musician. And they were just like, what? Like, you don't play music? But yeah, it was just this really exciting thing to witness and then to introduce myself and be a part of it. And as we got to know each other and started playing there more often, it was, yeah, this really kind of addictive feeling in the room. Everybody was showing up every week. And then, I don't know, it's really hard to explain, but I've never experienced anything like that in my life. Like that, that first six months when everything just started to be clicking, there was something really special there, and I almost can't put words to it. But, yeah, amazing time.
- [15:19]
Kenny Hensley
It's a moment of serendipity, I would say, with the Laker win and the fact that you were, you know, surfing from couch to couch pretty much right at that point in your, in your life. And it's so funny talking to a lot of musicians, asking many of them, well, did you have a plan B along the way? And most of them did not have a plan B. But it sounds like at least with you, Kenny, you didn't have a plan A even.
- [15:50]
Buzz Knight
Yeah, no, I didn't really. I mean, when I graduated high school, I was obsessed with the idea in high school of seeing the world and traveling. I was always like, I couldn't wait to get out of school so I could go and experience the. And experience culture. And I just love the idea of doing that. And so the last couple years of high school, I basically just worked a couple jobs, saved up as much money as possible, and the second I graduated, I was out and I took off to Europe for a handful of months and then came back home because I was broke, saved up more money and did it again. And I just kind of like, as long as I was traveling and experiencing the world, my parents didn't give me too much crap. You know, they didn't like, bug me too much about, like, hey, what are you going to do when you get older? What are you going to do? You're going to go to college? This and that. And yeah, so I kind of did that for a couple years. And then Seattle was really a last ditch effort. I. I had told them I wanted to move up there. I'd moved to Oklahoma for a bit, and back then I moved up to Seattle. Just saying, hey, this is my last, like, I want to give it a year, I want to rent a piano, I want to try to Meet people I want to really like, try to do the music thing for a year. If it doesn't work out, then I'll go come down here and go to school and figure it out. And that was kind of my backup plan. But I had no idea what that meant really, aside from going to school and picking a career and. Yeah, luckily, within a week or two of moving to Seattle, I met John and Josiah and we started. Started this band.
- [17:12]
Kenny Hensley
But, you know, you're such a wallflower, so I can't see along the way how you would have had difficulty making friends. Right. I mean, I'm kidding, you know, I.
- [17:21]
Buzz Knight
Mean, it's funny that I am pretty introverted by nature. I can like flip the switch and be that person if I need to. But in school I didn't have a ton of friends. I skateboarded and so I had those guys I hung with. But I wasn't very social. I didn't do a whole lot of stuff like that. And that's why I wasn't very open about music. And I remember Josiah, the first night I met him, just telling me, hey. I told him, I don't really sing. I don't feel comfortable doing that. But I write piano music. I write music and I write melodies and I write music, I compose music. And he told me, why don't you just write some stuff and play the piano on stage next week and do the open mic? And the thought of even doing that was like, sent shivers down my spine, was like, what? But it felt like that moment, it felt like the door kind of like, I've moved here. This is what I said I wanted to do. Like, why not try this out? And so that week in between meeting John, Josiah, or a couple days before the first open mic I went to, I just kind of sat in my friend's basement that I was living in at the time and put together a bunch of piano music that I had written and just made like a 15 minute thing out of it so I could go up and perform at the open mic and just do your 15 minute slot. And so I went up and did that and it was my first time ever playing and I. Yeah. And I just remember Josiah coming up and being like, that was amazing. It was great. And that was kind of the. Maybe like the audition in a way. Like, I kind of did that. And then it made Josiah at least, and. And John. I would. I would hope so. Comfortable enough being like, all right, I think he's like, good enough to be playing with us and we should like, Explore this a bit, you know, and there were a lot of others that came in and out that weren't very serious about it. And eventually it settled into the six of us.
- [19:00]
Kenny Hensley
And, John, did you have a plan, a Plan B approach to your career?
- [19:06]
Jonathan Russell
I guess my plan A was, like, at that point, I was living in Richmond, Virginia, before I moved to Seattle. I had been in one band before that. And it sort of fell apart for all the typical, like, reasons that most bands fall apart in your early 20s. And I was just so frustrated. I was so fed up with, like, people who weren't willing to make a true commitment to some to what, to me was so the only option, I guess, that I thought of. And, yeah, I just. I. Everyone I knew was my age was either in college or thinking about going, you know, like, what do they do? Nobody was, like, saying, all my eggs are in this basket called music. And so I was just like, well, then what am I doing in this town? Waste of my time. So I had a friend driving out to Seattle, so I just asked her if I could go with her. Basically, I was just trying to find a way to get out of Richmond. I would have gone anywhere, but she was going to Seattle, so I went to Seattle. So that was my plan. I mean, because of my current experience with other musicians. My actual plan was to move to Seattle and find people who would just be willing to back me up. Because I was just. My example of bands was, you can't trust anybody. They're gonna bail on you. No one's committed. So I was actually under the impression that I was like, you know what? I'm sick of, like, relying on other people and was hoping to just go out there. And I heard, obviously Seattle's a music town. I'm sure it won't be hard find. Hard to find people who can be players, who can just support my music. And it's funnily enough, I mean, the first person I meet who ended up being Josiah immediately broke that mold. I was just like, well, shit. I mean, neither one of us were like. Like, shredders or players, per se. And our gifts, I would say, are more, like, around songwriting and singing and harmonizing and just crafting music. And so I was like, well, shit. You know, Like, I just kind of immediately was like, at least this the plan. I mean, the plan was to go there and focus on music, but. But I did. I did, at least for a little while, think I had an idea of how to achieve it. And that was just for me to do my thing. And to pay people to play music. And so I think, like, Kenny, when. When you came along too, it was just like, I still just really met Josiah. And, you know, I think at this point, the world's kind of gotten to know Josiah enough to, like, he's a pretty. Like, he's a character. He's. He's a. I love him. He's my brother. But, you know, I was just kind of like, I don't know, like he possessed. He possesses gifts that I don't have. You know, he's much more welcoming. He's more supportive. I think I was, like, so in my, like, like, blinders up, like, I was just so sick of things not working that I wasn't. I wasn't seeing. I wasn't really available to see, like, a bigger picture. So fortunately for him being a part of us at that time, I mean, he was like, he did see you. He heard you and was supportive. And, you know, I think I was just kind of like, I don't know if this fits into my plan. You know, thank God it wasn't me up to those decisions at that point, because I think I was just afraid of trusting people again. Unfortunately, Josiah was one of the most trusting human beings on the planet, so he kind of blew up my plan. A. And, you know, we all kind of developed our own plan, and I'm very grateful for that.
- [22:31]
Buzz Knight
Yeah, I think, too, like, I mean, Josiah, like you said, is such a character, and he's very positive. Very warm, like, welcoming. Welcoming, welcoming. And a funny example that I always give because, like, John and Josiah ended up being such a great duo and such a great team as friends and as songwriters. But meeting them the first night, it was so funny because Josiah, I went up to Josiah and he immediately was asking me questions, and then within a minute, was inviting me to Music Mondays at his house. You know, he's like, john's coming over. We have Music Mondays come over. We're going to play together, and we're going to do this and that. And I was like, wow, this is great. This guy's, like, inviting me to parties already. I just met the guy, and then I go up and talk to John, and he kind of looked at me like, why the hell are you talking to me? Like, I don't know who you are. I just remember the difference. The, like, black and white and being, like, a little intimidated by John, but also, like, I don't know who he is, but he sounds good. So I want to try to get to know the guy. And then, like, Josiah was like not. No intimidation whatsoever. And of course over time you get to know just that's how people click and work, you know. And I consider both of them like my brothers in a way, you know. But yeah, very funny introduction. And I think without Josiah, we probably never would have. I don't think John and I would have started playing music together. I think Josiah was the glue in a lot of ways that like got this band off its feet. I think I probably would have gotten to know John and like liked his music and maybe we would have tried to mess around. But the first time John and I tried hanging out one on one without Josiah, we sat there at a restaurant and just realized that we didn't know how to talk to each other really. And we like sat there awkwardly for 10 or 15 minutes. You know, we're just like, I mean, we work really well together but our brains work differently. And Josiah was 100% the glue that like kept the three of us like this can work if it's the three of us and then eventually turned into six, you know. But yeah, without Josiah, I don't think. I think we just would have known each other, but we wouldn't have started playing together. I don't think. Yeah.
- [24:27]
Lynn Hoffman
We'll be right back with more of the Taking a Walk podcast.
- [24:31]
Larison Campbell
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- [25:35]
Lynn Hoffman
Welcome back to the Taking a Walk podcast.
- [25:38]
Kenny Hensley
You know, thinking away the way you guys are talking about Josiah, I came up with like a term I don't think I've heard used that sounds like it applies to him. Sounds like he has mastered the art of Creative leadership. Is that fair?
- [25:54]
Buzz Knight
Maybe. It's really hard to explain Josiah. He's such a. Interesting guy. All right. Maybe it's not fair. Yeah.
- [26:01]
Jonathan Russell
Yeah. I mean, yeah. I don't know. I mean, because, you know, the other side of. There's a larger side of this band's history. Like, at this point, we've been in band longer without Josiah, and so, like, I think. I think the things that came natural to him also ended up. Ended up almost like, getting abused, unfortunately. Like, we. You know, it's not like we had, like, delegated roles to one another, and, like, he was this, like, creative mastermind that we followed leads. It was like there were certain things where he would just, like, say yes more, you know, and me being in the state of mind, I was just very east coast, very jaded, very mistrustful. And so he kind of was the, like, go between for every single person all of the time. And I think it became exhausting. So I don't. I wouldn't say mastered it if he was here. I'd say the same thing. I think, if anything, like, he's learned boundaries, which allow you to become a lot more masterful. But for a while, I think that actually ate him alive because I don't know that any of. I can speak for myself, at least, you know, I wasn't aware of just how I was contributing to, like, abusing his. His superpower or his.
- [27:08]
Kenny Hensley
His.
- [27:11]
Jonathan Russell
His willingness and his, like, just openness. And there would just be things that I didn't want to do. Like, I wouldn't want to. I would be on tour and we went. We'd be getting asked to do these interviews, and I'd be stressed out, under slept, probably hungover. Just not a very good person in those days. And I would just be like, I'm not doing it. And thinking that then everybody else would be like, cool, I guess we're not doing it. And he would just be like, okay, well, I'll do it. I'm like, I never really thought about how that would add up. You know, he just kind of took. He took a lot of things on. He's just a nicer person. Or at least, you know, back then, I wasn't very kind, unfortunately. But so I don't know. I mean, he's. Yeah, it's. We were so young, and things that became natural to him, I think, had he kept touring with us and kept figuring all of that out, I would say he definitely has that potential. But I don't think any of us really knew how to do what we were. We were just sort of doing it, you know what I mean? I feel like now Kenny and I and the rest of us are fortunate enough to been around long enough to like, actually take stock of like, like how things happen, how they work, how to get better at them, how to like, be proactive, learn to communicate. Like, what are boundaries? You know, like, how did I do that? Why did it work, you know, versus just a lot of accidents kind of happening. Yeah, sorry, I took your question and kind of steered it in a different direction, but.
- [28:27]
Kenny Hensley
No, you didn't. And the word I wouldn't use again would be mastering. Because no one really has mastered anything really. We're all always trying to be better at something, to be better at ourselves, to be better in relationships. So I think mastering is probably where I took it off course. But thank you for taking me inside. Deep into the complexities of the head and the heart in a good way.
- [28:55]
Buzz Knight
I think that's a great word to complexity. I think like Josiah is just at the end of the day, a very complex person in a lot of ways. And I think early on he contributed to a lot of why we got started. But like John said, it's like we've now had Maddie in this band longer than Josiah was ever a part of the band. So it's been so long now since those years. But of course, when you're talking about the foundation of the band and where we came from, then he's a big part of that, you know, so you have to, you have to include him in that story.
- [29:20]
Kenny Hensley
So before we talk of the, the new album in the process, can you guys give me a little glimpse personally into your, you know, what's on your Spotify playlist so I can kind of get a sense of the many different influences I think exist for both of you.
- [29:40]
Buzz Knight
I can go real quick because mine will be pretty, pretty short. I am admittedly not the best at researching and discovering new music, or at least I've noticed since this band has become a full time thing. When I was in high school, growing up, I was obsessed with finding the newest bands that I loved and was super influenced by all of that. But I also grew up with a family and a household that just played a lot of Beatles and a lot of Simon and Garfunkel and a lot of CSN and Dylan. And I've always loved that era and that time in music more than anything. And I still find myself just falling back on that most of the time. If I do listen to music, which I really don't even listen to music a ton. I listen to a lot of audiobooks and podcasts, but I feel like my ears almost need. Like, when I. When I listen to music now, it brings me right into creative or work mode, and so it can be a little exhausting. But yeah, I. I tend to listen just to a lot of the stuff I grew up with, which is the old classics. And every once in a while I stumble upon something that I really love and hits me right away. But yeah, I am admittedly not the best at that and want to make an effort to listen to more new music. For sure.
- [30:51]
Jonathan Russell
Yeah. It's funny, I think listening to. I was always really envious of people who had good taste. Like, there was good taste of music in their upbringing, like from their parents. No offense. I'm sure my mom was probably gonna listen to this. I mean, it's not that their taste was bad, but I think when we were being. When we were coming up as kids, there was sort of the shift of like. Like, oh, we're parents now, and like, we go to church now. So, like, I feel like a lot of the stuff my mom grew up with she sort of put aside for a while. So I didn't even necessarily have access to even what she was listening to for a while. So for me it was like Christian music and like 90s country, which I do love 90s country, but for me it was so. And I guess on the inverse of that, it, like, it left me really hungry for. Searching for everything. Because I had no. I had no. There was nothing to be sentimental about, music wise. I just. I had this like, voracious appetite, I guess, for. For everything. So. And then I think becoming a songwriter, like, you just keep wanting to. You know, it's like, I don't know, you want to consume everything maybe, but I'll. Sorry. Anyways, my list is I've got Survival, which is my favorite Bob Marley Records, like 1980 or 1981 Siguros Record. It's I Can never Inya Love, Inya Mobb Deep Nirvana, the Incest Decide record, which is like, like a pretty strange album. And then like. Like a junk Coltrane compilation record from 58. But for me, like, whenever I'm making an album, like, I typically need something that's like, polar opposite of what we're working on. Otherwise, I'll start comparing before a song is even finished. And then I'll be like, oh, so obvious. You just like went to the chorus again, John, or whatever. Or like, why. Why isn't there a chorus, John? You know, so. So I usually find myself listening to things that can't, you know, weigh me down in my own creative endeavors or whatever.
- [32:52]
Kenny Hensley
So, yeah, to take you away from that present moment so you could focus on that present moment. Right. And not be, you know, diverted too far into your influences. Right.
- [33:04]
Buzz Knight
I think it's so interesting too. I mean, just. Just, you know, what people are raised with based on where they're from in the country. It's like, you know, you were born in, you know, Florida, then grew up in Virginia. It's like, no wonder you grew up listening to Tim McGraw and, like, and this stuff. And it's like, I think that's cool that. That people in different areas and upbringings, you know, grow up with different stuff. I also had, like, the benefit of having a sister that is five years older than me who was very in tune at a young age to, like, what's what she thought was cool. She was in a ska band when she was, like, 14 and then was just really into, like, what I considered cool music early on. So I was lucky in that way. I was like the kid who was a freshman at high school with, like, a Wilco T shirt and, like, listen to Radiohead a ton. And, like, none of my friends, like, knew all these bands. But I had the upper hand of having this older sister who I was really close with, who was just constantly sharing me or sharing with me new music she was coming across that I would also love. So I think without her, that would have been very obviously the stuff you grew up with your parents listening. But I would have been pretty basic just listening to alternative rock radio.
- [34:09]
Kenny Hensley
So tell everybody what they can look forward to with the new music from the Head and the Heart, the anxiously awaited new music. Of course, Arrow is out at this point, which is great. Congratulations. But can you take us inside a little bit to what people can expect from the band?
- [34:29]
Buzz Knight
I try really hard not to sound too repetitive because we obviously get asked this question frequently enough and it starts to become like a scripted thing in your mind, which I would like to avoid. But I do think this album will cater very heavily to our earlier fans. I think it's the first record. It's our sixth lp. It's our first album since our second that we self produced. We self produced our first two, so it's the first one. We did three records on a major label in between. And we definitely, like, tried all the production stuff and maybe a little overproduced sometimes and really tried to have radio hits here. And there. And this does feel like we've kind of gone back to, like, how did we make music when we started? And that was trusting our gut, trusting each other in the band, not worrying about any outside sources and just doing it and putting out what we like and what's feeling right to us. And this whole process felt like we kind of had just decided to go back to that. We did a bunch of trips to Richmond, Virginia and Seattle to do writing. And the writing kind of turned into recording in real time because we were just getting takes that we really liked. And so a lot of the songs on the record, you're hearing live takes for the most part, that were maybe even recorded the day we wrote the song or the day after we kind of like finished composing or finishing, adding finishing touches to a song. So it's very raw in that sense. There's not a ton of production tricks or stuff like that. You know, I think. I think it's gonna. Like I said, I think our early fans are gonna be really happy with it and really excited. It's maybe gonna feel in a way, like they kind of got their band back a little bit, you know, that they maybe loved early on, but haven't loved as much, like, as we try to do more produced sounding music. But, yeah, it's just quality. I think it just sounds and feels good and happy. Like there's a positivity to it. Like, not all the lyrics in the songs, they're all hunky dory and positive, but it makes me feel good. There's a lot of really good driving songs, like Road Trip songs. Yeah, it's just been a really great experience. And we kind of were talking about this a couple weeks ago, and it's wild that it dawned on us, but this is. We realized that maybe the first record that all six of us, as the group right now, have ever made together with all of us. Like, every single record either was before the Josiah and Maddie switch happened or was during a period where somebody. Somebody in the band was not a part of it. You know, like, either I was not a part of a recording process or a writing process or somebody else had taken time off. And so this is the first time that the six of us all were in it from the very beginning and have our signatures all over it. And it just feels the most like us than maybe I've ever heard.
- [37:28]
Kenny Hensley
And is it fair to say, even though it goes down some paths that certainly are through elements of darkness, that it comes out in the sense, you know, with optimism and Brightness, you know, ultimately. Is that a fair assessment?
- [37:47]
Buzz Knight
Totally. And that's kind of been one of the, you know, even getting into the album campaign and the artwork and what we want it to look like physically and visually, that's been an ongoing. It's just like the light opening the door. It's letting the light in. That's like a theme that we pretty much has pretty much been spearheading this process, I'd say. It's really like, getting through dark times and. And there's songwriting that's about those dark times and about rough, you know, hard things. But it really does feel like it's like we got through that, and this is almost the. Almost the closure in a lot of ways on some of those things and moving forward into, like, a lighter time in our lives and a lighter time in this band's history.
- [38:30]
Kenny Hensley
John.
- [38:31]
Jonathan Russell
Yeah, I mean, that was such an excellent description. I don't. I don't want to steer it away from any of that. I love that you said it. It's like, we got it. Like you were saying, some of those early fans might sound like they got their band back. I feel like we got our band back, too. Like, yeah, we're all, like. We were intentional and united before we started writing, which is just, you know, when you all live together in the same town and, like, you don't have a whole lot of complications in your life, like, that just kind of naturally falls into place when you're living in different cities, life starts happening, families are getting started, you know, like, and it's time to make a record. Not everyone is in sync. Not everyone's feeling creative. Not everyone's in a good place. And I guess, you know, I don't even know that I was necessarily in a good place when we started writing this, but we, at least, artistically speaking, we had pretty, like, specific intentions. And a huge part of that was working without a producer again and just letting our own writing have its voice again and really let a lot of things remain. So, yeah, I feel like we got our band back, too. I love this record. Like, yeah, I agree. When we get further and further from, like, people thinking of artists putting out albums, it's a little bit of a bummer for me because I personally still listen to albums, even if it's in a digital format. I just hope people do that because this is an album.
- [39:58]
Kenny Hensley
I think they will for sure. I want to close with something that I think is so cool about this band and you guys, and it's this sort of hidden gem factor. Where there are these songs that are hidden gems that sort of pop out. Not that, you know, they're. They're buried or whatever, but they're just. They're these. These gems that are found. And the one that. That I think of is. Is Winter Song. What is the mystery of this band and the hidden gem factor? Can you explain this? I think it's fascinating.
- [40:32]
Jonathan Russell
I think we just don't give up on a song. Like, every song means something to us. So even if it isn't, like, even. Even. Even if it isn't, like, if it's not raising its hand for, like, a single, like, we didn't. We didn't put songs on the record that to us, didn't mean something. That's my only. I'm guessing, in real time. Kenny, I would love to hear.
- [40:51]
Buzz Knight
No, yeah, I think that's totally true. I think that our. Like. One thing I'm most proud of as far as being in this band is just the depth of the catalog. I think that anybody who, you know, likes this type of music or in general would maybe like a band like ours. I think if they really took a deep dive. I don't think our albums have too many weak points. You know, I think there are tracks that are kind of deeper, that aren't singles, and they're not on the radio, that are my favorite songs. And the real fans that, you know, have been to a bunch of shows and have listened to the albums front to back are always requesting those songs. It's not the single that everybody knows. I think there's a lot there that people haven't heard. And I would suggest or, like, really try to push anybody who is interested in our band to really give the whole albums, like, a chance. You know, don't just listen to the singles. I think you'll find songs that are deeper in there that you might like as much or more than what you're hearing on the radio. You know, there's a good variety, you know, And I think also one thing is that just a band of six people that. All right, so, you know, it's not like. Like, there's. Of course, there's singers and there's people that are song that are writing lyrics, and there's a difference there, but it's not like it's one person's project and there's five people backing it. We're all invested in a way to. Where there's writing happening all the time individually. And so I think you're getting colors. You know, the palette is just very colorful. And you're getting sounds that maybe only Charity could think of and melodies that only she could think of. And you're getting stuff that only I would be able to think of. You know, Winter Song's an example. That was like a guitar song that I came up with in high school that I just really liked finger picking and thought it was pretty. And when we first met, I just showed Josiah and John that, and it was like, that's nice. Let's, like, add lyrics and melody over that. And there's that song. You know, it's like there's a million different ways that we can come at making a song. And I think because of that, you. You just get a really beautiful variety, you know, I think you get a lot of, like I said, a lot of color and doesn't get old, you know, it's not just the same thing drilled into over and over and over again, I think. And that's something I love about this band.
- [42:57]
Kenny Hensley
Well, I could talk to you guys forever. It's really been a joy to connect with you. And I gotta say, you know, for a band like the Head and the Heart, this is certainly why I got into the business that I got into being in and around, you know, music and radio and the creation of things. It's so beautiful to hear it from your perspective. And I have to thank you so much for continuing to give us this amazing music. Congrats on the new music, and thanks for sharing all of the. The inside backstory of everything. It really was wonderful.
- [43:35]
Buzz Knight
Of course. Thanks so much. That was a really, really fun time.
- [43:38]
Lynn Hoffman
Thanks for listening to this episode of the Taking a Walk podcast. Share this and other episodes with your friends and follow us so you never miss an episode. Taking a Walk is available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get your podcast.
- [43:58]
Larison Campbell
In Mississippi, Yazoo clay keeps secrets.
- [44:02]
Jonathan Russell
7,000 bodies out there or more.
- [44:06]
Larison Campbell
A forgotten asylum, cemetery.
- [44:08]
Buzz Knight
It was my family's mystery.
- [44:10]
Larison Campbell
Shame, guilt, propriety. Something keeps it all buried deep until it's not. I'm Larison Campbell, and this is under Yazoo Clay. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.