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Takin' A Walk - Music History with Buzz Knight
The Healing Power and Soul of Songwriter Sandy Knox-Music Saved Me
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Podcast Host
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Music Saved Me Host
Music saved me.
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Sandy Knox
I moved here in 1983 with $1,500 in my pocket and not even knowing a soul in this town. But music was just. It was just. It was all I could think about. And it was also no matter If I never, if I never ever got paid, this is what I was gonna do. It was that important to me.
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Music Saved Me Host
Welcome to another episode of Music Saved Me, the podcast where we the transformative power of music through the stories of artists, songwriters and fans whose lives have been changed by song. Today we are honored to welcome Sandy Knox, a Grammy nominated songwriter and recording artist known for her heartfelt lyrics and enduring contributions to country music. Writing hit songs for, oh, just some unknown artists like Reba McEntire, Dolly Parton, Neil Diamond, Dionne Warwick and Donna Summer. One of my personal favorites, just to name a few. Sandy Knox's journey in the music industry is marked by resilience, creativity and a deep connection to the healing power of music. With a career spanning decades, Sandy has penned hits for legendary artists like I mentioned and faced personal challenges that have shaped her unique perspective on life and songwriting. Her story is one of overcoming adversity, finding hope in melody, and using music as a lifeline during the toughest moments. And in this episode, Sandy shares her experiences of how music has been both a sanctuary and a source of strength, offering insight into the ways songwriting can help us process grief, celebrate joy, and even connect with others on a profound level. Now she also has something really cool. It's a first hybrid musical that we're going to get into and talk about, which I can't wait to hear all about. It's. It's the first of its kind too, so she's once again groundbreaking. So hopefully you are in for this amazing ride that we're about to dive into Sandy Knox's inspiring journey and discover how for her, music truly saved the day. Sandy Knox, welcome to Music Saved Me. It's so great to have you here.
- [04:39]
Sandy Knox
Thank you so much. I'm so glad to be here. You're my first podcast interview about this project, so this is exciting.
- [04:47]
Music Saved Me Host
Oh, I am so excited to talk to you about it. Before we get into that, I want to kind of roll back a bit and get go back to sort of the beginning and some of your early inspirations and maybe have you share with our audience a little bit about your early experiences with music. And I want to know what, what first drew you to songwriting?
- [05:10]
Sandy Knox
You know, my parents had a very eclectic music collection. Music was very prevalent in our home and I just gravitated to toward it. It was just something that was always there in my ear. I memorized lyrics, I knew songs. You know, I was really as very young I was studying lyrics. When I say studying, I mean like looking at them and reading them and Wondering, you know, and also, I'll just say this. One of the first inspirations probably for me for meter and rhyme were Dr. Seuss books.
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Music Saved Me Host
Oh, interesting.
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Sandy Knox
As he rhymed everything, there was a pattern. There was a meter to his books and how they were when someone was reading them out loud to you. And I think that had something to do with me going in that direction also toward music.
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Music Saved Me Host
Yeah, that's so cool. You know, a lot of people do say that. It's their parents music. Of course it would make sense. The albums, putting them on and hearing them and learning them all was. Was there a moment that you realized, or an event in your life where music was sort of more than just entertainment and that it could actually help to save you?
- [06:30]
Sandy Knox
Yes. I will tell you that when I was in about seventh grade, well, first off, I wanted to be in the cor. I wanted to be. Played the drums in the marching band. And in order to do that, in the junior high school that I went to in Houston, you had to have a year of choir. So I was like, I gotta take a year of choir, but all I want count on those big drums. And so I had to go in and take a year of choir. And sixth grade, you had to sing. The choir teacher, Mrs. Hinkle, you always remember the teachers. That meant something. Mrs. Hinkle, in order to. So she would know where to place you in the choir, you had to sing My Bonnie Lies over the Ocean. Because that has. That's a pretty little rangy little couple of notes. So I sang it. And I remember her turning and looking at me and she said, sing it again. And she went up, you know, you went up a half step. I matched her. She kept going up, she kept going up. And that day, I'm going to tear up on saying this. She called my mother and said, do you know your daughter can sing? And I didn't want to play the drums in that marching band anymore. I just wanted to be in the choir. And there was just instant acceptance. And all of a sudden, music meant so much more. And I also. That year, so my parents bought me a guitar and I started learning chords. And the first song that I wrote was called oh since we broke up, Chuck and I called it Upchuck. And.
- [08:09]
Music Saved Me Host
The Comical Sensibility comes right out already.
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Sandy Knox
And my parents, believe it or not, said, wow, that's actually pretty clever for an 11 year old. And so from that point on, songwriting was something I was really interested in. And they supported it. They continued to support it all my life.
- [08:29]
Music Saved Me Host
That. That's a big thing. What you said about the chorus teacher, when someone you look up to tells you that you're good at something.
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Sandy Knox
Yeah.
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Music Saved Me Host
That's huge. Oh, sorry about that.
- [08:42]
Sandy Knox
I know. Sorry I'm crying. I'm still. You know, I. I always sang around the house and everything, and. And like I said, there was lots of music in our household, and neither of my parents played an instrument or sang or anything, but music was always being listened to. But, yeah, when Mrs. Hinkle called my mother that day and said, you need to. Your daughter can sing. Really can sing, and you need to maybe get her into voice lessons.
- [09:10]
Music Saved Me Host
Wow. Wow.
- [09:12]
Sandy Knox
So I started taking voice lessons. So. Yeah.
- [09:16]
Music Saved Me Host
Have you ever talked to her again since then or.
- [09:20]
Sandy Knox
Not since then, but you only had Mrs. Hinkle for one year, and then you went into the next level of choir with Mrs. Scandret. And Mrs. Scandret and I kept in touch until she passed away.
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Music Saved Me Host
Wow. It's amazing that. I bet they're just filled with such joy hearing that they had such an impact on your life.
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Sandy Knox
Yeah. And fortunately, they both lived long enough to see my early success with. With my songs.
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Music Saved Me Host
That's so great. Well, I wonder how songwriting helped you sort of navigate through your life once you realized that was what you wanted to do. Perhaps during maybe difficult times, did you sort of grab the pen and just start writing, or is that, you know, is that part of your process?
- [10:08]
Sandy Knox
Oh, gosh, yes. Can I tell you, my publisher loved it when I broke up with a boyfriend.
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Music Saved Me Host
The original Taylor Swift.
- [10:19]
Sandy Knox
Yeah. Great songs were gonna be coming forth, you know, so, yeah, I do write about what I know. Except in one instance, I will tell you this. Does he love you? I get asked all the time if I ever had an affair with a married man, and that's where it came from. I never have had an affair with a married man. That song came about because of something else totally different, which, you know, maybe we'll get to that or not, but. But for the most part, I do pull from things in my life or something somebody said or maybe something I read. Then I went, oof. That could be a song, you know, in there. So there's a hook is always somewhere, you know, it's always spinning around you somewhere.
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Music Saved Me Host
That's true. And you've worked with so many incredible artists. Is there any one favorite or collaboration that you had and something that really made it extra special that you could share with the audience?
- [11:16]
Sandy Knox
You know, Neil diamond did a tune of mine called like youe Do. It was on his Tennessee moon. Album, and I got to know Neil a little bit, and I actually, he invited. I'll tell you what, he came to one of my gigs, which, let me tell you, look, singing along, doing your gig with your band, and looking out and seeing Neil diamond sitting front row and center. Ah, wow. I don't think he was as nervous to see me as I was to.
- [11:43]
Music Saved Me Host
See him, I bet.
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Sandy Knox
But he invited me to come into the studio. He wanted to try the song out as a duet, and he was going to pitch it to Barbra Streisand. So he said, well, Sandy, will you come out to the studio and sing it? You know, let's try it as a duet. So I did. And so that was pretty fun, going in the studio and just, you know, just hanging with Neil, you know, singing with Neil Diamond. He didn't end up doing it as a duet. He did record it, but he did it, you know, as a solo. Yeah, but that was pretty cool.
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Music Saved Me Host
You mentioned that. I can't imagine that it gets much bigger than that, but say, for example, you're driving in the car and you hear a song that you wrote for an artist, or you're at a show. What does it feel like when you see Dolly Parton singing one of your songs or Donna Summer? That means maybe. Is there anything personal in there that I can't even imagine what goes through your mind?
- [12:42]
Sandy Knox
Dolly did a remix of Does He Love you? With Reba, so that's that cut. You know, there is a. This career, you know, we were rolling the dice when we decide we're going to move to Nashville or wherever and pursue songwriting. And when. When you hear one of your tunes on the radio for the first time, it is such a stamp of approval. I made it. Oh, my gosh. I can't believe this. I can't believe I did this. It is a. It's a huge deal. The day that my first cut on Reba, which was an album cut song called He Wants to Get Married, was also the first day that a single, Dionne Warwick came out called Where My Lips have Been, I sat on the floor of my apartment with the cassettes. I don't know if I had CDs or cassettes, but I'd play one, then I'd play the other. I just kept going, pinging back and forth, listening to both of these songs with these iconic artists singing them. That was a big, big day. And I'll never forget that moment.
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Music Saved Me Host
I can't even imagine. And did you ever see the role of music sort of, and how it Connected with mental health and understanding that how songs can help us emotionally in terms of healing not just for yourself, but also for those of us listening to these incredible songs. Did you realize that that was gonna be a side effect of what you were doing?
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Sandy Knox
Not really. I will tell you, I've had a lot of people tell me that certain songs affected them greatly. Like caused them to stop and think or to put things in a different perspective. The first time I did Does He Love youe, it had just been released and I was performing at Harlan Howard's birthday bash, you know, which was a great honor to be asked to come sing on that stage. And I got off the stage, the song had only been on the radio, I'm gonna say maybe three weeks. And I sang it with a dear friend of mine. Got off the stage and I remember this youngish woman stopped me and said, because of that song, I stopped having an affair with a married man that has been breaking my heart for years. I'll never forget that that song had affected her in that manner. As far as mental health, you mentioned mental health. One of the ways that music saved me was I was a pretty fun kid, a little mischievous, got into trouble here and there. When I was in junior high, one of the people at the school, I don't know if I think it was the vice principal, called my parents and suggested that because one of my conduct cards said, if there's ever a distraction in the class, we can pretty much bank Sandy. We'll be in the middle of thought of that now.
- [15:38]
Music Saved Me Host
You know, that means that you were intelligent because you, you. It really does. A lot of the ones that didn't pay attention is because they were bored by all of it, because they knew it already. I get that.
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Sandy Knox
And this, this, like I said, I think it was the vice principal. He suggested that maybe my parents should entertain the idea of putting me on Ridlan. I think Ridlan was just starting to come out or something. It was just. And. And, you know, a drug to tap me down. And my mother, who was not a pill popper, she barely took Tylenol. She said, we will not tap down her imagination or her creativity. Sandy's not going to go on drugs in order to come to school and be calmer. I thank my mother for that so much. I think about that. Thank God she didn't say, oh, of course. She said, no, we're not going to give her a pill to tap her down. But what ended up happening is I really started channeling my energy toward music and writing songs and Being in shows at school and trying out for things. And then my clique of friends started becoming more music oriented or theater. I was very involved in theater, and that ended up being what I took in college. But it drove me to a different group of friends who were healthier for me to be around because I could have gone a different direction. I had a couple of friends who were inviting me to be in. Get into trouble.
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Music Saved Me Host
I bet you remember their names, too.
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Sandy Knox
In contact with them, are you?
- [17:14]
Music Saved Me Host
That's so fun.
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Sandy Knox
One of them became a police officer.
- [17:18]
Music Saved Me Host
Oh, interesting. Isn't that funny? Well, you know, focus sounds to me more like what you really needed, which is what you found in getting into that music thing. And, you know, I always like to ask my guests what advice they would give to those who want to get into this. And also to use it as a way of sort of coping or healing, especially if they dream of a career in songwriting. What kind of advice would you give them?
- [17:49]
Sandy Knox
Wow. You know, the terrain has changed a great deal since I entered in. Since I moved here in 1983 with $1,500 in my pocket and not even knowing a soul in this town. But music was just. It was just. It was all I could think about. And it was also. No matter if I never. If I never ever got paid, this is what I was gonna do. It was that important to me. I think, you know, for God, giving advice to young people about this career, I think you've got it. You have to believe in yourself. I think it's very important to research the history of songwriters in their lives and Lear and who went before you. I think that's crazy important. I would love it if a couple of the schools here, a couple of the universities that have music industry programs would have a class in the history of, like, songwriters and stuff in their journey. I think that's very important. And I did that before I moved here. I read every hardback book I could find on the. On songwriters bios, on music industry, on people's journey, and to find out that a lot of them stumbled and fell several times. Boy, okay, then I can stumble and fall. I can get back up too then, because look what they did. So I think that that's an important part of the music. But, you know, I just think I go to the old adage, write what you know. I would not write a song about being a gold nettle Olympia, because I don't know anything about that. But I think that's important. Write what you know. And you gotta stay true to your Star. And I tell you what, continuing to believe in yourself, that's a hard road. Sometimes that's a really hard road. But as my mother said, because there were a couple times I wanted to bail, I wanted to give up. And my mother would say, well, you know, if, if you keep trying, if you give up, you have a hundred percent chance of not making it. If you keep trying, at least you got a 50% chance.
- [20:10]
Music Saved Me Host
That's great advice.
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Sandy Knox
And I'll never forget that because there were times when I just wanted to.
- [20:16]
Music Saved Me Host
Throw in the towel. There's times, I'm sure even up until this moment, that there have been. But, you know, what you said really hits home to me because I moved to New York with six months disposable income and if I didn't make it, I was gonna go home. So one of those things is to be fearless, take a calculated risk and do your homework on the history of what you want to do. I think that that's probably the first time I've ever heard anyone give that kind of advice. And it's such great advice, study.
- [20:50]
Sandy Knox
Especially because this industry, you know, at that point when I was making my journey into, there weren't. There wasn't colleges where you could go take classes in the music industry and such. Now there are. Kids have a little bit more of an opportunity to go study. And there's several colleges. But, you know, all I had was to be able to read and try to dive into stuff. And, you know, I had so many books on the music industry and on Elvis. I loved Elvis.
- [21:21]
Music Saved Me Host
Oh, my gosh, who doesn't love Elvis?
- [21:24]
Sandy Knox
I saw him live three times before I was. Gosh, before I was 18 years old. Wow.
- [21:29]
Music Saved Me Host
I never got to see him. I wish I did, you know. And that brings me to my next question about funny or surprising stories from your time that off the top of your head, you've always wanted to tell that you haven't been able to tell. Nothing salacious, but just something spectacular. Well, if you want to get salacious, you know what I mean?
- [21:52]
Sandy Knox
Here's a story when I first moved here in 1983, and I can tell you August 13, 1983, is the day that the U Haul pulled up. Because my dad drove the U Haul and I drove my car. The next day he flew back to Houston and I went to the grocery store because I had my first apartment all by myself. I was scared to death. And I loaded up the cart with food because I was, you know, putting stuff in my brand new apartment and all of a Sudden it dawned on me that I was very much alone in the city I'd never been to, and I didn't know anybody and I needed to get a job and blah, blah. And I just burst into tears in the. I think it was the spice aisle of the Kroger. And I just left my cart and in the middle of the aisle and went home to cry because it was so scary. But I don't know where we are on time, but I will tell you this story. When I moved here, Nashville was in the middle of a phone strike. So I couldn't get a new phone. So I am delivering cassette tapes at publishers with no contact information because I didn't have a phone. So I had my name and I think I wrote my address. And so somebody had told me, a neighbor had said, you know, to go. And this is the funny thing about Nashville, you know, it's a lot about who you know and networking and whatever. But I took. I dropped off a tape. Couple of days later, I decided to call and follow up. I call and follow up. I sit and, you know, the woman said, can I ask for Roger Sovine? Can I tell him he's calling Sandy Knox? Roger comes on the phone, he picks up and he goes, hey, where have you been? And I'm thinking that the receptionist said, tammy Wynette's online, line one. Sandy Knox, line two. And he's picked up the wrong line. I said, this is Sandy Knox. And he said, I know you didn't put your phone number on your cassette.
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Music Saved Me Host
Goosebumps.
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Sandy Knox
Yeah.
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Music Saved Me Host
Wow.
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Sandy Knox
Yeah. So that was amazing. That was a fun. I never forgot that moment that he actually wanted to pick up the phone, talk to me.
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Music Saved Me Host
Isn't that amazing? And you know, you wonder if that cassettes even ever get to the desk of the person you're sending it to to begin with. Yeah, that's great. Oh, my gosh. I don't want to let you go because there's so much more I want to talk about with you. But let's get to something that we kind of teased up front, which is sort of, you're groundbreaking. You're doing an audiobook slash musical, and it's called Waiting. And there was a quote that I had to read real quick from it. It says, we will all meet the love of our lives, reside in a perfect fairy tale existence, and achieve complete and total world peace just as soon as we lose £20. I mean, that's like going on a diet Monday, you know?
- [24:40]
Sandy Knox
Exactly.
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Music Saved Me Host
Can you tell us about this exciting new chapter for you and what we can expect.
- [24:46]
Sandy Knox
Well, you know, it is a audiobook slash musical, so I call it a boozical. That's what I've called it. For the last several years, I've been working on it. And it's about a place that I actually went to after breaking up with a bad boyfriend. It was kind of a diet place, an alternative to going, you know, on a cruise where you'd eat all the time. It was like a place where you went and kind of were healthy and watched your food and your intake. And I left that place thinking, man, there's something about this place and the people I met and everything else. And I started thinking about, is this a song? And then I realized it was much more than a song. And so through. And that was in 1996. 97. So a couple of years later, I really started thinking about it as something else. First it was gonna be a musical, and then during COVID I started thinking, when the lockdown happen and live venues and everything were on the down low, I started thinking, you know, I think I could write this as a audiobook and interweave songs, let the songs happen at the certain time. So that's how it was born. So, yeah, that's so cool.
- [25:54]
Music Saved Me Host
If you could sort of. Is there any connection or. How can people get this and see it and hear it?
- [26:03]
Sandy Knox
Well, it will be available across all audiobook platforms. And then we have a single. There's a single coming out called There Could Never Be Enough of youf. Yeah, we all want to hear, right from everybody who says they love us. And then the whole soundtrack of. It's 28 chapters, 21 original songs, and it's. And the whole book is only five and a half hours. It's not a huge listening commitment, but. And then the SoundTrack drops on July 11, and that'll be on every music platform. Wherever you get your tunes, that's what they.
- [26:41]
Music Saved Me Host
Wherever you get your tunes. I like that. Instead of your podcast, Sandy Knox, I could talk to you all day. It is just such an honor to meet you. And I can't believe how much we actually have in common. Personally, I would love to talk to you when we're done with this and just compare notes. And I really appreciate you coming on the show and sharing all of this personal stuff with everyone, because I think it's just so important, because we're so much more alike than we are different. And, you know, if just one person listening takes the advice of someone who's been there, done that, then we've done our job. So Sandy, thank you so much.
- [27:15]
Sandy Knox
Thank you so much.
- [27:19]
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