Talk Easy with Sam Fragoso: Writer Hilton Als on Prince and ‘What Joan Didion Means’
Podcast Information:
- Title: Talk Easy with Sam Fragoso
- Host: Sam Fragoso
- Guest: Hilton Als
- Release Date: December 22, 2024
- Description: An intimate conversation with Hilton Als, Pulitzer Prize-winning writer, exploring his works, experiences with Prince, and his new exhibition on Joan Didion.
1. Introduction to Hilton Als
Sam Fragoso welcomes Hilton Als, highlighting his illustrious career at The New Yorker since 1994, his Pulitzer Prize for Criticism in 2017, and his influential profiles of notable figures like Toni Morrison and Maggie Nelson. Als's recent works include his novella My Pinup, which delves into themes of desire, sexuality, race, and his experiences with Prince, as well as his curated exhibition at the Hammer Museum titled Joan Didion: What She Means.
Notable Quote:
“My Pinup... explores desire, sexuality, race, and Prince.” – Sam Fragoso [00:21]
2. Hilton Als’s Journey and Career Beginnings
Hilton Als shares anecdotes about preparing for his appearance on the show, revealing his tendency to arrive early due to anxiety about commitments. He discusses his longstanding relationship with writing, influenced greatly by his mother's unwavering support and encouragement.
Notable Quote:
“You walk into the situation listening and watching, and you don't interrupt the emotional panorama of what's happening.” – Hilton Als [05:07]
3. Experiences with Prince
The conversation delves into Als's time on tour with Prince in 2004, as detailed in his novella My Pinup. Als describes Prince’s deep desire for approval and his vulnerability, contrasting the public persona with his private need for connection.
Notable Quotes:
“He really wanted our approval... that he did need other people.” – Hilton Als [06:32]
“He was so sweet... delightful to be with him.” – Hilton Als [08:17]
4. Early Life and Upbringing in Brownsville, Brooklyn
Als reflects on his childhood in Brownsville, Brooklyn during the early '70s, growing up with his mother who was a member of the National Council of Negro Women and attended the March on Washington. He discusses the complexities of his relationship with his father and the early instances of expressing his identity through costume parties.
Notable Quote:
“There was no language and there was permission.” – Hilton Als [10:40]
5. The Impact of Tragedy and Racial Violence
The discussion shifts to the September 1967 incident involving the death of Richard Ross, a 14-year-old black teenager. Als reads an excerpt from his essay Homecoming, published in The New Yorker in 2020, illustrating the cyclical nature of racial violence and its enduring impact on communities.
Notable Quote:
“The pattern, the circularity of history, it's unnerving.” – Hilton Als [15:29]
6. Literary Influences and Joan Didion Exhibition
Hilton Als elaborates on his admiration for Adrienne Kennedy and Joan Didion, discussing how their works influenced his own writing. He explains the conception of his exhibition Joan Didion: What She Means at the Hammer Museum, emphasizing Didion’s honesty and her ability to articulate societal fractures through her writing.
Notable Quote:
“She was very interested in how what did this vulnerability mean? What did this life mean without the...” – Hilton Als [28:57]
“She articulates destabilization... How do we live through it? With language.” – Hilton Als [29:53]
7. The Power and Elusiveness of Memory in Writing
Als and Fragoso discuss the role of memory in Hilton’s writing process. Als shares insights from his commencement speech at Columbia, emphasizing memory as both a dangerous and necessary tool for artists. He explains how his ability to control and select memories has evolved, enhancing his storytelling capabilities.
Notable Quote:
“Never disavow what you see and remember. It's your brilliant stock and trade.” – Hilton Als [39:20]
8. Legacy and Hope
In the latter part of the conversation, Als contemplates his legacy and the ongoing search for hope amidst personal and societal challenges. He reflects on the impact of his mother’s unwavering hope and expresses optimism about his ability to create a meaningful legacy through his writing.
Notable Quotes:
“I feel like I'm just beginning.” – Hilton Als [45:30]
“Because every day that's given to me is the hope that I'll be able to tell the truth on the page.” – Hilton Als [45:35]
9. Concluding Thoughts and Final Readings
Towards the end, Als shares excerpts from his works and Jean Reese's unfinished autobiography Smile, Please, emphasizing the struggle and necessity of writing as a means of personal and artistic expression. The conversation concludes with reflections on moving forward while honoring the past.
Notable Quote:
“If you stop writing, my life will have been an abject failure.” – Jean Reese (read by Hilton Als) [48:36]
Key Takeaways:
- Authentic Observation: Hilton Als emphasizes immersing oneself fully in the subject matter, allowing genuine emotions and experiences to shape the narrative.
- Memory as a Tool: Memory plays a crucial role in Als’s storytelling, serving both as a source of inspiration and a mechanism for selective storytelling.
- Influence of Mentors: The support and influence of his mother and literary figures like Adrienne Kennedy and Joan Didion have been instrumental in shaping Als’s writing style and thematic focus.
- Legacy and Hope: Despite grappling with societal and personal challenges, Als maintains a hopeful outlook, believing in the power of truth-telling through his art.
For More Information:
- Book: My Pinup by Hilton Als
- Exhibition: Joan Didion: What She Means at the Hammer Museum
- Listen to More Episodes: Talk Easy Podcast
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