← Talk Shop with Ariel Okin: A Fenimore Lane Production
Talk Shop with Ariel Okin: A Fenimore Lane Production
The Things That Matter: Nate Berkus on Home, Style, and Storytelling
01:05:29
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- [00:00]
Arielle Oken
Before I welcome today's guest, I wanted to take a moment to thank this season's presenting sponsor, Shop My. Shop My is a platform that connects designers, tastemakers and creators with shoppers who trust their style and recommendations. With Shopmy, you can discover and shop the pieces experts actually use and love in their own homes, all in one beautifully curated place. This season, we're bringing ShopMay directly into the conversation. Each guest will share why they love the platform and the thought behind the products they've chosen for their own Shop My storefronts. I personally love using My Shop My account and you can check out my own storefront in the show notes. So let's dive right in.
- [00:39]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
What is the single most important lesson you hope that readers will take away from the book?
- [00:43]
Nate Berkus
A. That it's not a chore. That there's a tremendous amount of joy in crafting a home that feels layered and assembled over time. But the biggest lesson is that I hope people slow down.
- [00:58]
Arielle Oken
Welcome to Talkshop. I'm Arielle Oken, a New York based interior designer, writer and editor looking to bring a little bit of magic into our homes every day. After years as a writer and editor in the interiors world, I founded my own editorial site, Fenimore Lane, in 2020 and the TalkShop interview series was born. Each week I delve into the personal experiences of the top interior designers and tastemakers around the globe. Some designers have a style you notice, then there are those whose work feels like an invitation, a way to make a home truly reflect the people who live in it. My guest today is one of those rare talents. This week on Talkshop, I'm joined by Nate Berkus, one of the world's most influential interior designers. Since first appearing on the Oprah Winfrey show in 2002, Nate has built a storied and inspiring career defined by approachability, humor and an elevated, deeply personal design aesthetic, all while being a trusted expert for nearly 30 years. Starting his interior design firm at just 24, Nate's work now spans interiors, product collections, television and books. From curated furniture and vintage pieces to collaborations with brands like Kravit, living spaces and PetSmart, Nate's design extends into every corner of the home. He's also the travel ambassador for Celebrity Cruises and recently designed the Sunset Bar on the ship Beyond. Nate has authored two New York Times bestselling books and has a new book, Timeless Design that Feels personal, out on November 18th. Throughout his career, he's consistently sought to empower people to let their homes tell their stories, a philosophy that has earned him features in Architectural Digest, El Decor, House Beautiful, Vogue, and more, as well as repeated recognition on the AD 100 and EL decor A lists. So please join me as I welcome Nate Burkus to the podcast.
- [02:45]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Nate, thank you so much for coming on the show. I'm so excited to get the chance to talk to you.
- [02:50]
Nate Berkus
Thank you. I'm very happy to be here.
- [02:52]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Well, for everyone listening, we always kick off every conversation. We ask everyone who comes on, can you describe your style in three words or less?
- [03:02]
Nate Berkus
I would say classic, layered, and rooted in history.
- [03:07]
Arielle Oken
I love that.
- [03:08]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And I feel like that ties so much into your book, which we'll get into. But for those listening, and there's nobody listening who does not know, but can you tell us a little bit about yourself and where you are at this point in your. In your career right now?
- [03:22]
Nate Berkus
Sure. So where am I in my career? That's such a great question. Changes every day. I will say that, like, the. One of the great joys of doing what I've done and continue to do in design and media and product design is that I have not probably for the last 25 years, ever had two days that were the same. You know, right now, I think what you're finding me at a stage where we definitely are relaunching a lot of categories in terms of home and going to be a lot of exciting news in the sort of Nate Berkus world, which of course is not just me. It's a huge team of very dedicated and talented people. But we're launching Bedding and Bath again. We're launching stationary. We're launching baby furniture. We have a million.
- [04:12]
Arielle Oken
Wow.
- [04:13]
Nate Berkus
So this has been like a year of rebuilding. Yeah. And then, you know, I'm primarily very excited about a lot of our design projects. When right before COVID hit, I opened an office in New York, I realized, like, I needed a place to go every day. It's been really fun, though. And we've got a ton of great design projects. We have three offices now. Chicago, which is the main office. New York, which I lead, and also California, Los Angeles. So it's been really a fun. The truth is, when my kids went back to school, I was like, I need a desk. Like, what's going on? So that's what I did.
- [04:50]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Haze, too. It's like we all needed to get out of the house. How old are you now?
- [04:55]
Nate Berkus
Our daughter Poppy is 10, and our son Oscar is 7. Oh, wow.
- [05:00]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Oh, my God. That's. Those are such fun ages. My daughter, my two daughters, six and three. And A half. Really hard to work from home when.
- [05:07]
Nate Berkus
They'Re home, it's really hard to do that. It's also like, I didn't want to miss anything. That's been like a primary concern for me and for Jeremiah as well. I mean, we, we love. It was a decision for us to become parents 10 years ago. And we, you know, we. We honor that decision by being as present as we can be. Those are the three people that I'd rather spend time with than anyone.
- [05:30]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
That's so sweet. Well, let's talk a little bit about the beginning of your career. What initially drew you to design? I know you started your firm so young. You were 24, which is wild. Was there a defining childhood moment or an experience that sort of set you on this path?
- [05:49]
Nate Berkus
It wasn't one. It was that my mom was an interior designer growing up, and our home was just constantly a place of experimentation and risk taking and changing rooms and the purpose of rooms. And my mom taught me by example how to search for really great things, which is still like a tenant of what I love about design and love about what I do. It's like the sourcing, the finding the things that everyone doesn't have. And I spent my childhood going to antiques shops and malls, like multi dealer antique malls, where you see something in a case like 800 miles away and you have to go up to the front desk and ask someone to open it for you like that. I can do like a 10,000 square foot antiques mall in under an hour because I've been doing it since I was six years old.
- [06:40]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah, it's so funny you say that because my. My mom also is an interior designer. And I grew up, she would just schlep me everywhere. And that's part of it. It's like you just grow up with it and it's just embedded in your DNA.
- [06:54]
Nate Berkus
We still go to those. I mean, my design firm in New York City, we leave the city to buy accessories and things like that for our projects. And I was telling my mother the other day that the best part about it is that we just pick everything and then we leave. And then a truck pulls up. And my mom was like, wait, what? You don't have to figure out how to get it. I'm like, no, mom, we just send the movers because it's so much stuff. But, you know, I love that. I would never give that up. Every. You probably feel the same, but not every design firm has that as a component. That searching and hunting and it's the best. It's the most fun thing in the world.
- [07:31]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Totally. Going to antique and artisan is like my favorite pastime.
- [07:35]
Nate Berkus
Oh, it's phenomenal. Phenomenal.
- [07:37]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
So it seems like your mom really is. Is the first person who encouraged your love for interiors and collecting. That's so beautiful.
- [07:44]
Nate Berkus
Yeah, she really was. And she liked weird things. Like, I remember she came back from France with her girlfriends and they all had, like, scarves, and she had bought a tooled leather seat.
- [07:54]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Oh, my God.
- [07:55]
Nate Berkus
And she had it matted and framed on linen and sort of it hung in our dining room. And like, that's the kind of stuff today that I'm still really interested in, like, how we make decisions in our homes and how I can help people make decisions in their homes that are, like, deeply personal and special.
- [08:14]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Totally. And that ties in to, you know, you always say home should tell a story.
- [08:19]
Nate Berkus
Do you know how long I've been saying that? Ariel.
- [08:23]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I feel like I learned that from you.
- [08:25]
Nate Berkus
500 years.
- [08:26]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I have been watching you and I have your book. I've been watching you forever. And I know that's sort of your.
- [08:34]
Nate Berkus
Your key line always been. Yeah, it's always been. Well, now it's like ad slang. Like, it's like, your aspirin should tell your story. Your skin cream should tell your story.
- [08:45]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
It got co opted.
- [08:47]
Nate Berkus
It definitely has been co opted. But I would like to claim that.
- [08:50]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Around home, you should claim it because you own. You gotta trademark that. Honestly, looking back, what story did your childhood home tell?
- [08:59]
Nate Berkus
I think it told a story of a mom who was very talented and loved color, was drawn to other cultures and other places. It was in suburban Minneapolis, and that wasn't a particularly sophisticated community for interior design at the time. You know, my mom was not doing duck decoys and plaid. And if it was plaid, it was like French silk plaid. So, you know, mixed with a billion patterns. And so I think what the childhood home represented was, again, sort of an outlet for my mother's own creativity, but also to really have an understanding that when you're surrounded by things that you love, when your eye travels around a space and just continuously bounces from things that really, that you're really drawn to and that you like, there's a power in that. There's like an efficiency and energy in that that makes kind of everything else a little bit better. It makes, you know, bedtime better. When you love your bathroom, it makes meal times better. When you love your kitchen, like it makes doing laundry, which is one of my all time favorite things to do. When Jeremiah and I were in a renovation for one of our homes. He said to me one day, if you have another meeting with the architect about the laundry room, I don't think we're going to, like, make it to actually move into this house together. And I was like, right, but, babe, like, a cleaning bottle is only three inches deep, and so I can get all these shelves like this behind doors. And he was like, you're a crazy person.
- [10:38]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
You're insane. Yeah, but it makes you happy. And that's. That's the point, really, is what you gravitate towards and what makes you happy. You should fill your home, and in turn, it feeds your soul.
- [10:48]
Nate Berkus
100. I've always really believed that.
- [10:51]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I do, too. I totally. I think your interiors, like you said, they have a frequency. And when things are in order, it's similar to your wardrobe. Like when you're in a really great outfit and you feel amazing about yourself, like, everything else just falls.
- [11:03]
Nate Berkus
Your house should feel like you have a great haircut every day.
- [11:07]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yes. I love that. It's so true. So let's talk a little bit about how you started your firm, because you started your firm at 24, which I find just completely remarkable. What gave you the confidence to take the leap so young, and how did you decide to do it, and how did that start?
- [11:24]
Nate Berkus
I mean, I was so dumb. Let's be honest. I'm glad I did. But, like, I worked for an auction house in Chicago, and I was given the responsibility of organizing all of the exhibitions because all this stuff comes in, and it's upholstered in fabrics that don't match. And, you know, it's a million different styles, from modernist to English brown furniture to gilded things and Chinese. And I was like, we needed the owner of the auction house, who's still a very good friend. She said to me, I think you have an eye. I think you can kind of pull all this stuff together, because I feel like the more attractive it looks, the more it will sell for on auction day. And so I had that job. On top of being, like, the world's worst assistant to this lovely person named Colleen. You land, and she would cry to our boss and say, you have to fire him. I, like, stopped by his desk, and one letter I asked him to write to this banker is still sitting on his desk like, a week later. He's like, he's the worst assistant in the entire world, and you have to fire him. But instead of firing me, they put me in charge of the exhibition spaces and then doing this series of monthly auctions and then, you know what? I was just, like, tired. I was 23. I had graduated from college. I'd interned at that auction house. I gave it everything I could at the time. And I had met all these people in Chicago, people with money and real estate brokers, and. And I thought, you know what? Let's try it. Like, what's the worst thing that can happen? Leslie Hindman, my boss, was my very first client. She hired me to redo her living room. You know, I got to work with all the things from the auction house, which is insane. And she had beautiful, great things. She still has wonderful taste. And then I started just getting referred to different people, and I was honest with them. I was like, you're taking a risk on me. I have no staff. I don't really know what I'm doing, but I promise I'll never lie, and I'll work really hard for you. And they were like, okay. And some people were like, no way.
- [13:29]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
The best story. You make all these, you know, these mistakes, and they're good experiences in the beginning. So I. I love that you said to people, you know, I'm. I don't really know what I'm doing, but I have the eye, and I feel.
- [13:41]
Arielle Oken
Trust me.
- [13:41]
Nate Berkus
You know, I will tell you, too, if I can share a story of that. I just thought of it.
- [13:45]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [13:46]
Nate Berkus
I was hired by this lady who lived next door to Michael Jo Jordan.
- [13:50]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Oh, my God.
- [13:51]
Nate Berkus
And she said to me, you know what I really want to do on this wall? I really want to do custom millwork and, you know, kind of bookshelves. And then the television would be incorporated. Don't you think that's a good idea? And I was like, yeah, I think that's amazing. And I got in my car and drove back to the city, and I thought to myself, I don't know how to do that, and I don't know who can make that. And I was driving for like an. An hour back to Chicago, and I was trying to figure out, like, how do I solve this? How do I solve this? And I went to Ralph Lauren and spoke to the manager of the store, and I asked who did their millwork.
- [14:26]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Oh, my God. Genius.
- [14:28]
Nate Berkus
And they said they gave me the name. And. And I called the company, and I went into that company. It was called Detmers in Chicago years ago. And I went in and I said, I'm just started a design firm. I do not know what I'm doing. I really need help. I have a project, and, you know, how does the process work? And Never forget. They were like, do not worry. We will walk you through this. We will show you, like, you know, how it's done.
- [14:59]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [15:00]
Nate Berkus
We will come up, we will do a site measurement. We will provide finished samples for you to show the client. And at the time it was like $20,000, which might as well have been $2 billion, because if it was wrong, I was like, okay, well, I'm gonna go live in my childhood bedroom.
- [15:16]
Arielle Oken
Totally.
- [15:17]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [15:17]
Nate Berkus
I was like, that's my choice.
- [15:19]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
But isn't it amazing how, you know, you start like, first of all, this is like pre Google probably like, you're.
- [15:25]
Nate Berkus
Like, oh, way pre Google.
- [15:27]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah, yeah. You're being so resourceful. You're going like, what an amazing and smart way to be resourceful and find a vendor like that. And then also for the vendor to walk you through it. Those vendor relationships become 30 year relationships and absolutely how it works in this industry. That's such an amazing story. I love that. Do you remember first space that you ever designed where you thought, this is what I'm meant to do?
- [15:52]
Nate Berkus
You know, it's so funny because when I was 13 years old, I shared a bedroom when I was a little kid with my brother Jesse, who lives in LA with his wife and two children. And he was a normal kid. By normal, I mean filthy. And I was not. And so it made me insane, like, to step over his laundry on the carpet and all this stuff. And I would beg, beg, beg my parents, can I please have my own room? And so when I was 13, they built me a bedroom for myself in the basement of our house. Oh, my God, I was out of my mind. I was like, so happy. Oh, beyond. And I remember I wanted it to be. It was 1984. I wanted it to be red and gray and white with some black accents. Yep. And my mother let me pick kind of everything temporary. She wouldn't let me pick, like, things that were built in. She was like, no, I'm overriding your weird Formica obsession. Yeah. She's like, this isn't happening. But, like, I got to pick my wallpaper and I got to pick my bedding and I got to consult on the carpet. And it was, it was really cool. And so that was like the very first time I remember my parents giving me this opportunity to exercise my own vision in my own space. And the power that was in that, like, what that did to 13 year old me.
- [17:18]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [17:19]
Nate Berkus
Was you probably can't really quantify it because it just was. It seemed like such a pivotal thing and a pivotal Moment because it was.
- [17:27]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
You know, ship over your space and creativity completely.
- [17:31]
Nate Berkus
And meanwhile, my friends, when we would, like, sleep over, I would ask friends to sleep over. I'd go to their house. If I went to a friend's house, we'd go to the mall, we'd go to Radio Shack. We'd ride our bikes. We do everything. If someone came to my house, I would make them, like, lift up one side of the bed because I wanted to see what it would look like on this side of the room. And there's one moment where I, like, glued these little, like, mirror tiles onto my ceiling. And, you know, we spent, like, two hours on a chair, my friend Ronnie and me. And so it got to the point where, like, nobody would come sleep over at my house.
- [18:03]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
They were like, we're good because they become your assistant.
- [18:05]
Nate Berkus
Yeah. They're like, you can come over here. But, you know, that was 13. Yeah.
- [18:09]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And also, so many designers have that same formative experience. Like, I feel like you. It starts so young, and you know, it from the beginning that, like, it starts with your room, really. Like, how many times have you, like, bonded with another designer?
- [18:25]
Nate Berkus
Oh, my husband. My husband's family sold the house that he grew up in. They had. There were, like, 20 layers of paint on the wall.
- [18:33]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Oh, my God. From him just experimenting in there 100%. I love that. Were there any early mistakes or lessons that, in hindsight, ended up being really crucial to your growth as. As a designer and also as an entrepreneur? Because there's a whole business side of your firm, too.
- [18:51]
Nate Berkus
You know, there were. Obviously, there were a million. And I would say that probably the. And this applies to everything. Not just design, not just business, but life. Maya Angelou once said, when people show you who they are, believe them the first time.
- [19:06]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [19:06]
Nate Berkus
And I wasn't in a position where I could turn down projects. I had to take everything that came my way. That's what you do when you're starting a company. And. But I knew. I knew who was going to be a nightmare. I really did. And they were. And it was a mess, and it cost more money and, you know, time and nothing worked. But, like, you know, when you're young and you're trying to get your foot in the door, you have to eat shit, like, all the time. And so I just ate shit constantly. But, you know, and now it's really funny because there's been certain projects that have come up where, you know, the. The stakes have changed. It's these people have a gazillion dollar home in one city and another house in another city, and they want us to do it all. And I'm like, but I don't like you. Like, it's going to be hard, and my team is not going to have a good time. And. And so, you know, I. I continue to sometimes make that mistake. The difference is now 30 years in, I call it way earlier than I did when I was younger.
- [20:07]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah, no, it's not worth it. I mean, I had so many, you know, early experiences in the beginning, too, because I. I took everything that came my way because I was young, and you can't turn it down and.
- [20:18]
Nate Berkus
No, you have to do it.
- [20:20]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
My husband and I landed. We went to Napa. It was like our first and last trip before. Like, we were gonna try to have kids. And we, like, landed at San Francisco Airport, and this woman was just reaming me on FaceTime. And I started crying in the airport baggage claim and was like, you can't do this. Do this. And I was like. But I. But I also can't say no.
- [20:40]
Nate Berkus
So isn't that crazy? It is. It. Listen, I think what people forget, and this is something that I've never forgotten, we are in the service industry.
- [20:49]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yep.
- [20:50]
Nate Berkus
Period. We're not the star of that project. We're not the star of that situation.
- [20:56]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
No.
- [20:56]
Nate Berkus
We are there to make sure that their money is spent well, that they have been given the. The best choices to choose from based on everything we know. But that's it. And then we're the guys who. Or the people, I should say, who are responsible for not only whether or not the project comes together, but what the experience was.
- [21:21]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [21:21]
Nate Berkus
The whole time.
- [21:22]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
100%.
- [21:23]
Nate Berkus
And. And that is not any different than anybody serving coffee, doing a manicure, or coloring your hair.
- [21:32]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
No, it's so true. We. Our whole firm read. And I'm sure yours did, too. Unreasonable hospitality when it came out.
- [21:38]
Nate Berkus
Yep.
- [21:39]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And we went through that whole, you know, book club moment of going through it. But it's so true, because it is a service business. And one of my favorite things that I've heard David Nutto say is I'm no different than the plumber.
- [21:51]
Nate Berkus
Absolutely.
- [21:52]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
We are in a very high touch service business. And so you just have to eat shit sometimes. And also you have to make sure that people come away with the best experience at the end, which you guys absolutely always do. I want to ask you about Oprah because you made your first appearance on the Oprah Winfrey show in 2002, and that really introduced you to a national audience. How do you feel like that experience changed the trajectory of your career?
- [22:23]
Nate Berkus
I'm going to answer this honestly, like, I have everything else that you've asked me, Ariel, but I'll tell you, it was phenomenal in a thousand different ways. And in a few ways, it was also challenging. It was phenomenal in that I got to be a part of a platform that she had crafted based on human connection, and I got to do what I love doing, which is obviously, like, design and makeovers and crafting spaces and be a part of that platform. And, you know, I was also, like, in the control room, like, while she was interviewing Nelson Mandela. And, like, you know, come on. Like, you have to be really dumb to not learn a lesson in that building every day. So we had this, like, we had this amazing experience. I had an amazing experience, and what it taught me most of all was resourcefulness, because there are no people on this earth that are more resourceful than the Oprah show producers. There was never a. No. We did a small space makeover in Boston, one of the very first ones, and the refrigerator came in with the opening on the wrong side for the kitchen. And I just, like, looked at everybody, and they were like, nope, no problem. And I remember Jenna Kostelnik got on her BlackBerry and was like, let me find a model refrigerator. The same model, but on the floor somewhere. We'll buy it or we'll borrow it and then give it, you know, switch it out after the show. But, like, that new fridge that opened the correct way was there in 45 minutes, from the moment we discovered it.
- [23:59]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Oh, my God. I mean, that's like a masterclass in resourcefulness and just getting shit done.
- [24:05]
Nate Berkus
It was. It was just. There was never something that couldn't be solved. And it wasn't just throwing money at it. It was how you thought about it. So that was formative. The other things that were incredible about it, obviously, it gave me a tremendous amount of opportunities. I. In terms of products and retail partnerships and licensing and publishing. It also taught me how important it is to say no. You know, I was always very conscious of the fact that I was representing Oprah's brand, not just mine, that her brand always had to come first, and that I didn't want to do anything to embarrass her or embarrass her team. So I was very, very careful about what I agreed to do and what I didn't. And that served me really well, because if you think about it, there were a lot of people who didn't do that. And she was on air every weekday for 25 years. So there were a lot of people that had the same opportunity that I did and they blew it.
- [25:04]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I mean, when you use Oprah as your barometer or your litmus test, like, I mean, come on, I think you'll do pretty well.
- [25:10]
Nate Berkus
Yeah, seriously. Also, by the way, as a side note, no one's more fun. No one's funnier. I've never met anyone funnier. No one's more fun. Still to this day, Jaron, Oprah and I had dinner in Santa Barbara not that long ago. Just the three of us. We laugh like you can't believe how hard you laugh in a three hour dinner. Brilliant, funny. Everything anyone has ever wanted her to be and nothing anyone's ever accused her of being.
- [25:39]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
It's amazing. Also the soundtrack of like every single day. When I got home from school, it was on in the kitchen for, for everyone, for America. Everyone.
- [25:47]
Arielle Oken
Totally.
- [25:48]
Nate Berkus
You know, it's. That was, it literally was, it was like, you know, an anthem.
- [25:52]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah. She was an American icon. Well, I want to talk about your product lines because you have done so much, it's like mind blowing. You have a new collection with Regs usa. You have furniture lines, you have Petsmart. I mean, you have created an entire Nate Burkus world, which is so inspiring and, and I'm just so in awe of it. How do you view the product aspect of your business and how that fits into the your overall world?
- [26:21]
Nate Berkus
So again, when that started, which was a direct result of being on the Oprah show, that was the first opportunity was with linens and things years ago. And the team, we went to like all these mass retailers because Oprah said to me, don't do that thing where you design things that my audience can't buy.
- [26:39]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Right.
- [26:40]
Nate Berkus
She's like, that would be a really dumb smart. Right. And I was like, right, of course.
- [26:44]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Business advice, totally.
- [26:46]
Nate Berkus
So that made sense. And I remember at the time I met with Bed Bath and Beyond, I met with Target, I met with Linens and Things. And there was this woman at Linens and Things, Taryn Chernin, who I could like see in the meeting was getting really excited. And Linens and Things had never done like a brand partnership before. They sold mattress covers and like Dyson vacuums. And it wasn't like a fun place to shop. It was like kind of a chore.
- [27:16]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [27:16]
Nate Berkus
And Taryn had this idea that we could make a store inside a store and it would be like these Nate Burkish shops and we would not have everything in Plastic. We'd have baskets with napkin rings in them. And we'd have, of course, bedding and bath mats and, yeah, comforter sets and all of that. But yeah, it really was. It was like, yeah, interactive. Very ahead of its time. And so we ended up. I ended up signing with them and I had no idea what I was doing. I panicked, like, you know, in the car on the way back to New York City. I was probably 20, 27, 28.
- [27:54]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
That's crazy.
- [27:55]
Nate Berkus
And I got in the car and I was like, I don't know how many tines are on a fork. I don't know the size of a standard pillowcase versus a Euro sham versus a king size pillowcase or a boudoir pillow. Like, how am I going to do this? And I learned and I dug in and I figured it out and I figured out who I needed to hire and it was so fun. And that first deal gave me the bug to the point where anywhere I was around the world, I'd be in a cathedral and in Mexico and I'd be taking photos with my flip phone of the pattern of the marble. And I'd be like, that is going to be a top of bed for Target. I'm going to take that design back to the offices and re proportion this and whatever. And I don't have a lot of turnover in my company at all. I have people who have worked for me for 26 years, 27 years.
- [28:49]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Your director in Chicago is. We have a mutual best friend.
- [28:52]
Nate Berkus
Oh, really?
- [28:53]
Arielle Oken
Yes.
- [28:54]
Nate Berkus
Oh, that's so great.
- [28:55]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And like, I just have forever. Always heard how it's just the most incredible place to work and everybody loves working there.
- [29:02]
Nate Berkus
Well, I don't want to work in a place that's. That doesn't, that doesn't feel like that. Yeah, you know, and Lauren, Lauren Gordon, who. Who is my partner in the design firm and runs the Chicago office, like, she is literally one of the best human beings. It's like, that's what you want to have lunch with. Like, that's who she cares about everybody. She knows what's going on in everyone's lives. She leads a team really strongly. She plays to everyone's strengths. She mitigates their weaknesses by assigning those roles to other people. Like, she's very, very good at what she does. That's just all part of it. And I think, you know, when my team and I sit down and we talk initially about every new project and they always start by asking me, what are you into right now? Like for Rugs usa, I Had never said Chinese art deco rugs, I think, are really cool ever in 30 years. And Meredith, who works with me and helps design all the collections, she was like, can you be a little bit more detailed? And, like, she started pulling up all these art deco designs. I'm like, okay, well, no dragon and no weird coin, please. But the vibe is this. And it, like, look. And I was like, give me a pen. And I was, like, erased, like, 90% of the motifs and just kept a border. And I was like, this is what I mean. And she was like, oh, that's sick. You know? So then the team takes it and starts running with that and. And starts sending Stu to me. And it's so much fun. It's the most fun.
- [30:31]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And you can tell, you're so involved with it because it has you stamped all over it. And your. Because you have such a specific, very personal aesthetic to everything that you bring. That's so warm and inviting, and it's so hard to translate that into a very large license collection that's manufactured all across the world. And you do, and it's really, really hard to do that.
- [30:54]
Nate Berkus
Well, thanks. We try to stay even, actually. Come this year, even more than ever. We're really trying to sort of define the brand, define the look. Classic American design. Think Ralph from, you know, 20 years ago.
- [31:13]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [31:14]
Nate Berkus
Original Kate Spade mixed with Jenna Lyons at J. Crew. Like, what does that represent in home? And I have a lot of leeway. I'm not one note in terms of what I'm drawn to aesthetically or culturally or geographically. And so there's tons of influences in everything. But you're right, and I appreciate you saying that. That is the hardest part, is to kind of look at what is happening over in stationary with this manufacturer and bedding with this manufacturer and rugs with these 12 manufacturers, and be like, okay, what is the through line? What is consistent? And I will tell you, Ariel, what it's born from is that I have still a tremendous amount of respect for somebody who has $50 at the end of their paycheck and decides to spend that $50 on something for their home. And something with my name on it.
- [32:10]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah, I love that.
- [32:12]
Nate Berkus
Like, that just matters. And it still matters. It just matters.
- [32:16]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And that's why you can tell that it's imprinted in the collections, too, because it's very easy to just put your name on something and, you know, they show you something, you check it off and whatever. And you've seen. We've all seen collections like that. And your collections are Never that. And it's very, very obvious that you have a strong hand in it. What continues to motivate and inspire you after 30 years in the industry, which is so wild.
- [32:44]
Nate Berkus
Yeah, I know. It's really, really wild. It makes me derm.
- [32:48]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
No.
- [32:49]
Nate Berkus
What's Dr. Levine doing this afternoon? Let's see if he's free. No, I mean, 30 years in, I'll tell you, I'm not bored. I am obsessively on auction sites all day and night. I love. Isn't it the best? You know, it's funny. We have this count that we're friends with in Venice who's, like, the most charming, amazing guy, and he's on the Italian version of live auctioneers, which is called Katowiki. I don't understand Katowiki. I'm never going on it. And you don't need to, obviously, because live auctions, you can go to those auctions in general or wherever. He and his wife, Bianca and Jer and I were having dinner one day, and Jerry was complaining about how much time I spent on live auctioneers, and Bianca was complaining about how much time GB spends on Katowiki. And we both looked at each other, and we're like, it's research. It is. It's research. I mean, I have learned so much. Yes, tell him.
- [33:48]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
But every time a case piece mysteriously arrives at our house.
- [33:51]
Nate Berkus
Exactly, exactly. A package, anything. Jewelry, bags, like name, silver, like, all of it. But, you know, listen, I think what's great about that is that it does continue to inspire me because I'll see a light fixture or a pair of sconces or wall lights from 1930, and they'll be signed by somebody that I don't know. And I'll go on to first dibs and figure out who that person is or do a search and try and understand who they were, that designer, their body of work, and then that bleeds into the bathroom that we're redoing on Park Avenue, and it's just all connected. And travel still, you know, for me, is deeply, deeply inspiring. But I like to go to the markets where everyone who lives, wherever I am, shops.
- [34:37]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [34:38]
Nate Berkus
Like, I want to go see where they buy their pots and pans. I don't know. Need to go to, like, the Chinese.
- [34:42]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Rug department feel of yours, too, because that's what kind of helps you translate your work to a mass scale, too, in a way that feels really un.
- [34:52]
Arielle Oken
Special.
- [34:53]
Nate Berkus
Definitely. I mean, listen, I always remembered, like, in art school, you have to know how to draw a perfect apple or paint A perfect apple before you can attempt a portrait.
- [35:04]
Arielle Oken
Yeah.
- [35:04]
Nate Berkus
And so I always think about that, because how am I recommending a side table or a daybed or a set of dishes if I don't have at least some sort of mastery on the best quality out there that exists? How do you design something? How do you design a towel for 12 if you've never dried off with a $200 towel? You have to know the difference.
- [35:30]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [35:30]
Nate Berkus
You have to know what matters and what doesn't. And so I will take on your husband and my husband and GB's wife Bianca any day and say it is.
- [35:42]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Research man Nate Burkus, advocate for all designers around the world. 100 shopping addictions.
- [35:48]
Nate Berkus
Exactly. It really is pretty sick, though.
- [35:52]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
No, it is. I want to talk about your book because I'm so excited about it. It's caused.
- [35:57]
Nate Berkus
Thank you. I am, too.
- [35:58]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Foundations Timeless Design that Feels personal. And I have both of your other books, but this new book is all about helping people design spaces that feel very personal and timeless, which, to me, those two adjectives evoke so much of your work. What inspired you to write Foundations at this stage in your career?
- [36:17]
Nate Berkus
So it wasn't what I wanted to write. What I wanted to write. Yep. I didn't want to write this book initially. I wanted to write a book that was like, kind of like the Phidan Guides. And I wanted it to have like a box set with all these little books that were divided by everything I've learned for living rooms, bathrooms, kitchens, powder rooms.
- [36:39]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
That's a good idea.
- [36:40]
Nate Berkus
That's what I wanted. I thought so too, Ariel, but the publishers were like, you're insane. You know how much it costs to print a cover, right?
- [36:47]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Multiply.
- [36:49]
Nate Berkus
Yeah, exactly. They're like, you may not buy. Sell $15 guides to every room. You can put all of that information into one book. And so that's how Foundations was born. I will say, though, there's some publishers that I met with were like, no, it's time for you to do that $150 coffee table book of all your work. And, you know, it's the firm's 30 year anniversary. Like, this is the year. And I didn't want to write a book that people couldn't use and couldn't afford. And I didn't want it to be about me. I wanted it to be more of a thank you note to anybody who's ever DM'd me a question or commented on a post or emailed a question or bought a bath mat. Like, I just thought to Myself. You know what? I need to turn, like, shine this.
- [37:38]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Back out on the audience. Yes.
- [37:41]
Nate Berkus
It's not about me. And it was so much fun to write.
- [37:44]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
We had the best, though, to say, oh, yes, I'll take the really splashy, big, you know, whatever. But the thoughtfulness behind saying, you know what? No, I'm going to structure this deal differently, and I want it to be accessible to everyone, which is so much of what you do. You know, like, your firm is. Is one side of your business, and then your licensing is the other. And that's. That's amazing. I love that story.
- [38:07]
Nate Berkus
Well, I have to tell you, what was really interesting about it is that the big decision around that was you only have the first 30 years of projects photographed. You can only use them once.
- [38:20]
Arielle Oken
Yeah.
- [38:20]
Nate Berkus
And so, you know, the decision I had to make was if I was going to break down foundations room by room, share every single thing that I could think of that could help people really craft a space that represented them, how do I do that without sharing the best photography of the best projects? And I realized, like, this is the book. It. I can't save anything. I have to put everything I have and every asset I own into it. And, you know, it's really cool. It's like, it's broken down. It's really fun to read. It's. It's fun to look at, but it's even better to read. I try to teach people, like, when I'm looking at inspiration imagery, what do I see? Like, how do I break down that image so I'm not just looking at the whole room? Like, what element stands out so they can. When they're, you know, saving images on Instagram, they can be like, well, I. I saved this image because I just like the furniture layout. I hate the fabric. I hate the color of this room. But I really thought that that was a really inventive way of laying out the furniture. So I'm trying to show people sort of how to move through the world like we do, you know, like, with this kind of sensitivity and understanding, and then just really practically how they can apply everything I've learned in the last 30 years into living.
- [39:40]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Well, I cannot wait to get this book. I mean, it's not.
- [39:43]
Nate Berkus
I'm really proud of it. I really like it. It's, like a thing to talk about.
- [39:47]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
The ethos and the thought behind it in general is just beautiful. And also the fact that it's not just a design manual. It's filled with questions and exercises to help readers hone their taste like, it's got an interactive element to it, which is really unique and different. And not a lot of books have that.
- [40:03]
Nate Berkus
It definitely does. And then even in the back. And the last chapter is, like, it. We call it the Designer's Toolbox and the Numbers Game. And I give people, like, all the standard dimensions of everything so that when they're out at the flea market, they can be like, wait, how. How high is the seat of a dining chair? Okay, wait, this isn't really a dining table because it's only 27 inches high. And Nate said in his book that, you know, a seat is 18 inches. That's only nine inches for my legs. And that means I can sit there, but I can't ever eat anything. So I'm passing.
- [40:37]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah. And these are things that trip people up and that they have no clue. And, like, it's really valuable information.
- [40:44]
Nate Berkus
I think it's going to be really helpful to people. I think it's helpful in terms of inspiration, but I know it's going to be helpful in terms of recrafting the way we think about acquiring, the way we think about amassing stuff, the way we fill our homes with stuff that we don't care about, and just a different introduction into, like, furniture styles and what could work well with different things and how to really dig in and understand, like, why it's so important that your home should represent not only who you are, but who you've been and who you aspire to be and how you can do that. So what I wanted it to answer, what I wanted foundations to answer was, where do I begin? And once I start, how do I do this? And if you only care about bathrooms, you go to that chapter. If you only are renovating your kitchen, then just read that and look at that, and all the materials and combinations are in there, and hardware locations and styling, the. The countertops. And, you know, it's just. It's very, very specific because it was built almost like a magazine.
- [41:50]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
What is the single most important lesson you hope that readers will take away from the book?
- [41:55]
Nate Berkus
A. That it's not a chore. That there's a tremendous amount of joy in crafting a home that feels layered and assembled over time. But the biggest lesson is that I hope people slow down. I hope that people don't, like, click on a cart and fill a room. I hope that people don't listen to, like, like, bullshit from me. David Netto, you, Markham. I hope that it gets people to realize that design as a pursuit and living well as a pursuit is Something that if you actually do a little bit of groundwork before you set off to do it, whether you hire a designer or you do it yourself, that groundwork, which I explain in the book really clearly, is unbelievably important. I'm not an expert in everything, obviously. No one is. But I've learned a lot in the last 30 years. But even in areas that I think I'm pretty good at, I was like, for the book, I wanted to, like, bring true experts in those fields in. And so I remember Heather Somerville, who I worked with on the book. She and I were talking. She helped build the whole thing in chapters and all that scary math stuff. We were talking about guest rooms and, like, how to make a guest room feel special and gracious and not just this, like, afterthought of, like, your sort of crappy furniture you don't want in your room anymore. I was like, you know who we should talk to? Let's call the GM of the Carlisle. Like, let's find out what. What that.
- [43:28]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
What.
- [43:29]
Nate Berkus
What Marlene Poynter has to say about a guest's experience. Like, let's add her. I set a great table. I love setting tables. It's like, I can't make a grilled cheese. My children complain that my eggs taste like nothing. So Jeremiah cooks. I clean and set the table. But, you know, I was like, you know who I want to hear from? Aaron Lauderdale. I was like, let's ask her. What did Esti teach you? Like, let's put that in the book. Even millwork, for instance, in general contracting. Like, Steven Fanuca is a contractor that we've used over and over in New York City, and he's done a couple of our projects for us personally. And I was like, I don't want to tell people about millwork. I want to hear from him. So that if somebody goes to a cabinet maker in their town, they already got whatever Stephen says they need to communicate their vision to somebody, whether there's a designer involved or not. And so it's just. That's how I was framing the building of foundations. They really are the foundational ideas to get you thinking differently about how to craft a space.
- [44:31]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Amazing. Oh, my God. I can't wait to get my book. It comes out November 18th, for those listening, by the way.
- [44:36]
Nate Berkus
Correct.
- [44:37]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Which I'm so jazzed about.
- [44:39]
Nate Berkus
Thank you.
- [44:40]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I want to hear a little bit about working in design. What is your favorite thing about working in design?
- [44:46]
Nate Berkus
Definitely the sourcing. But, you know, I was spoiled for 12 years being part of the Oprah show of, like, standing next to somebody with their eyes closed and my hand in their hand and having them open their eyes and see their space reimagined.
- [45:00]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [45:00]
Nate Berkus
And I still do that.
- [45:02]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
So special, though.
- [45:03]
Nate Berkus
I mean, it was the coolest. It's. There's no other feeling. It's such a rush. And so even these days, like, my firm, whenever we do a project, we really do it. Like, you open a linen closet, and there are new towels folded all the same way. Photos are in frames. Flowers are in vases. It's been professionally cleaned twice. And then we invite the client home. Like, I love them. I love the fingertips on the books and spines in the bookshelves. I love when their eye lands on a photo of a moment that. That, you know, obviously, the photos came from them. We asked them for photos for the frames, but, like, they didn't know that on their bathroom vanity would be their three kids as babies. Like, you know, we're just trying to be so deeply thoughtful about every aspect of it.
- [45:53]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And hospitality. That's amazing.
- [45:57]
Nate Berkus
Well, that's really what it is. You know, if you're gonna be pouring coffee, then get a nice cup.
- [46:05]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah. What design rule do you always follow? And do you think there's one that's made to be broken?
- [46:11]
Nate Berkus
You know, Jeremiah and I fight about this a lot, actually. He thinks all rules are meant to be broken. I think some rules aren't. I think there's obviously not one right way to assemble a space. And I've learned that being married to somebody else who does what I do and has oftentimes in a more interesting way or in a way that I would have never thought of, and that was, in and of itself, a lesson. But I will say that I'm personally probably too hooked on, like, provenance and where something came from and how it's made. And Jeremiah is more. A little bit more free around that. He's like, who cares? I'm like, no, that's new. What are you talking about? Like. Or like, he'll. He'll refinish a cabinet from 1940. I'm like, I wouldn't touch it. Like, I'm much more of an archivist. That's actually the direction I've given every contractor for our homes. I'm like, archival. Like, I don't want everything to look.
- [47:05]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Like it's not brand new.
- [47:06]
Nate Berkus
No, don't touch it. Like, I don't. We're renovating our farm in Portugal right now, and. And I said to the team, it's an original 18th century massive fireplace in a dining room, and it's got all the, like, soot and everything from all that time. And they're like, and you want this painted white, right? And I was like, if you touch.
- [47:25]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
That, I will kill you.
- [47:27]
Nate Berkus
I will move like, no.
- [47:30]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
So that's the patina I mean, you talked about embracing. Exactly.
- [47:34]
Nate Berkus
Exactly.
- [47:35]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Why rooms feel complete when they include old things is because it adds that character.
- [47:40]
Nate Berkus
There's no substitute. Even old building materials, you know, salvaged wood floors, salvaged hardware, salvaged fireplaces, fire brick. Like, that is the stuff that I love so much about my job.
- [47:55]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah. I want to talk a little bit about you. After so many years of helping others tell their story through their homes, how would you describe the story your own homes tell right now?
- [48:08]
Nate Berkus
I think that they. That's a great question. I think they say everything about me. To be honest with you. I don't think there's any mystery. First of all, there's not a lot of mystery around who I am. Like, I'm pretty consistent, and. And I've been, you know, in the public eye for a really long time, so I don't really have much to hide. But I would say that our homes are. Well, first and foremost, they're very much representative of a style that's not just mine and not just Jer's. We've managed to find a style that actually is a blend of both of us that we're both happy and good with and inspired by. But, like, the house would be completely different if it were mine and completely different if it were just his. And we both know that, and that's okay. But.
- [48:53]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And the fact that do it separately, and then you've come together to create your own style, and your home is so romantic and cute.
- [49:00]
Nate Berkus
It's cute. We have one rule. If somebody says no, we can't try and sell it to them. That's the only rule. Like, I can't be like, but what if it was mixed with this? And he's like, nope. What if, you know, you can't do that?
- [49:11]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Like, yeah, if it's a no.
- [49:12]
Nate Berkus
Against the rules. No is no. Find another thing. Come up with another idea until you get a yes. That works for us. But I would say that the home. Our homes feel very vintage, heavy, very, very much patinaed. All of them very much a mix of periods and creators and things that we both really are drawn to a lot of. For me, 18th century and 19th century mixed with French, 50s, and 40s. And most of the paintings and artwork is pretty contemporary. Although now we're, like, in this weird phase where I'm like, do we like this picture of this bloody rabbit on a hunt? Like, I'm not sure. Like, is there something like, why is that? Why are these old masters looking interesting to me right now?
- [50:00]
Arielle Oken
Amazing.
- [50:01]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [50:02]
Nate Berkus
I'm like, this fat lady with the robe in the window. Is that happening? I'm like, yeah. I'm like, what's going on? Is this good? But I would say it represents the fact that we're very well traveled. The fact that we're realists about living with our kids and that they're welcome there in every space and that we love to collect, like, love. Like, you know, we have such cool things that we found over the years. You know, some are very valuable and some are not valuable at all monetarily. Like, I don't know what I like more. A rare Renee Proud daybed that we have in our living room or the woven black and natural placemats that we bought in Chiang Mai 10 years ago that our kids still use every time they sit down at the table that you can wash with a sponge. Like, I don't. You know, it's. It's our home. There's nothing in our house that I don't like. Not a coffee cup, not a scent, not a soap dish, not. Not a serving spoon, not a bowl. Everything has been. Is there? Because at least we like it.
- [51:11]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [51:11]
Nate Berkus
Some things we love, but at least we really like everything.
- [51:15]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I feel like that's such a good lesson also for designers. If you're not in love with it, even for sourcing for clients, like, totally. It doesn't go in, you know, and, like, you only show and give your best, and that's how great work comes about.100.
- [51:30]
Nate Berkus
When we present four or five options for each piece of furniture to a client, and I can tell that they're not really excited by one of them. I say, we're going to pull some more things for you.
- [51:40]
Arielle Oken
Yeah.
- [51:41]
Nate Berkus
I don't want you. I don't want you to settle on any of it. I don't. I want you to be excited about all of it. Is there anything here that I could talk you into? You know, like, are you not getting it? What's going on? But. Because if it were my house, I would do this. But again, I have no problem pulling four different dining chairs than what you're seeing here if you really don't love any of the options that we're showing you.
- [52:05]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [52:05]
Nate Berkus
And clients appreciate it.
- [52:07]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
No, of course they do, because they're like, thank you. They can feel when people are really, genuinely, authentically want them to have the house of their dreams and.
- [52:16]
Nate Berkus
Yeah, what they want, what they love.
- [52:18]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Exactly. Let's talk a little bit about inspiration. I know you guys travel so much. How has travel shaped your eye and your collections, too?
- [52:27]
Nate Berkus
Probably because I've always been and continue to be very much drawn to craft. And so for me, what is one of my favorite things about travel, aside from flea markets and vintage shops and wherever the area is that has all the antique shops or whatever, that's a given. But I always like to figure out wherever we go, what is the best thing that's made here?
- [52:54]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [52:55]
Nate Berkus
Is it a jam or is it a placemat? Or is it. Is it just a million different things in carved wood? Or is it embroidery? Is it cotton? Like, once I have a sense, like, I'll do that on an airplane, even, like, to an island, I'll be like, what are the crafts? Like, what do they make?
- [53:12]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Such a good idea.
- [53:14]
Nate Berkus
I love it because I love having things that represent these places in an authentic way. Once you're home, I don't want a snow globe. I don't want anything from, you know, I don't want. I don't want any of that stuff. I don't want a T shirt. No, thanks.
- [53:27]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And you're holding your eye in real time, physically, in these places, and you're.
- [53:31]
Nate Berkus
Learning, too, and they're so much better made. Years ago, we went with one King's Lane to Peru, and I'll never forget, we were, like, on the side of this mountain, Jeremy. We. We actually got engaged that trip. Not as a side note. He would kill me for being like, yeah, that was the trip. But we were on the side of this mountaintop with a. A whole tribe of people that hand make and hand weave and vegetable dye, all of these, amazing, like, bright rugs. And we were buying things on behalf of One Kings Lane and curating this, like, online sale for them. And so we were able to buy a lot. And Susan Feldman, who owned it, was looking at me that day, and she goes, this isn't, like, for you, though, right? And I was like, nope, not at all. Like, I don't want any of these for me, but I appreciate them. And. But I'm never living with any of that. But I love them, but it's not for my house. And she was like, no, I didn't think it was. Meanwhile, we went back into the, like, little shack, Literally built it out of, like, concrete on the side of this mountaintop. And we all had tea, and I was sitting on these cushions that were this brown and camel herringbone. Like a wide herringbone. It looked like an old Armani coat from, like, the 80s.
- [54:48]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [54:48]
Nate Berkus
And like, an exaggerated wool herringbone. And I was like, what is this fabric? And they all kind of laughed at me. And they're like, well, that's like the. That's the utilitarian fabric of Peru. Like, that's what we carry potatoes in. That's what we carry the corn in. And I was like, where do you buy it? And they're like, oh, at the market in Cusco. They just sell it by bolt. I'm like, it's all woven, though. And they're like, yeah, of course it's hand woven. It's Peru. I was like, okay, now I know.
- [55:15]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Where I'm going tomorrow.
- [55:16]
Nate Berkus
Oh. Not only do we go, but I, like, bought a huge duffel bag. I had to take it off the roll and fold it into, like, a thousand pieces, but we still have pillows made from that. And I had a suit made out of.
- [55:29]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Wow.
- [55:30]
Nate Berkus
And. And I'm like, you know, I. I picked one of my, like, best suits, like, that fits perfectly, and brought it to a tailor. And I was like, can you line this, please? Because it's obviously wool and really itchy, but. Yeah, but. But I really want this, and I still have that. And so, you know, for me, that was like one of those. Like, that was like, the dilemma of, like, well, what is the. How do you define the best craft? Because this fabric that was like a 5 cents a meter to me, was the most beautiful thing I saw.
- [56:01]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Right. You know, you have the eye.
- [56:03]
Nate Berkus
It was just. It's super cool.
- [56:05]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And your resourcefulness brought you there, which to me, like, I'm thinking of that story of how you went into Ralph Lauren again like that and asking them where the market is. You know, like, it's that plus your eye. That's how you are, who you are.
- [56:20]
Nate Berkus
Well, thank you. But, I mean, listen, I love this stuff. I could talk about it all day, obviously.
- [56:25]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
So cool. A new thing that we're doing this season, because Shop My is our lovely presenting sponsor for season five is talking about your Shop My storefront, which I look at all the time. And you put the coolest stuff in there. You can tell that you're constantly saving things and that you're just constantly browsing and shopping, because there's just such amazing. Like, there was a watch in there recently that I saw that. I was like, oh, my God, that's The sickest thing I've ever seen. Is there anything in your storefront on your wish list right now or something that you really want in your seasonal rotation?
- [57:01]
Nate Berkus
Yeah, I. I only put stuff in shop. My. That I actually really love. I think that the concept is really, really cool. I don't really consider myself an influencer, but they asked me to do it, and then they put me on billboards during fashion week, and I was like.
- [57:15]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I know. I saw.
- [57:17]
Nate Berkus
I was like, this is.
- [57:18]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
You're the original influencer.
- [57:19]
Nate Berkus
Yeah. I was like, this is sick. Like, I'm really into this. This is great. But I would say there's some vintage in there that I am truly obsessed with that I always add. It's always a mix of, like, my stuff and then vintage stuff and then some of our new lines and things like that.
- [57:37]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
There's some really good first dibs finds.
- [57:40]
Nate Berkus
Yeah, there's some, like, vintage Hermes stuff in there. There's some really. There used to be these puifourcat silver beakers in there, but somebody bought them. They were vintage. They were so beautiful. And they were. They were cups, but, like, I would use them as vases, obviously, because who needs that? You're not right, Caesar. But. But on an entry table. That sounds good. I do keep up with it, though. I'm constantly, like, adding stuff to it, and I put in. I'm not a huge, like, shopper per se, but I'm pretty loyal to a bunch of random brands. Like, there's this brand called Ishto, which I found in Portugal, and they make, like. Like, the best jeans and the best pocket tees and the best car coat, and. And so, like, that would be, like, for instance, a good gift for your husband.
- [58:24]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah, I don't know that. I might have to check them out.
- [58:27]
Nate Berkus
It's really. It's great. And the cut is, like, great.
- [58:30]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I'm gonna go down a rabbit hole now. And for those listening, we're gonna put Neat's storefront link in the show notes so you can shop it too. How did you decide to organize your shop? Is it just, like, kind of everything's in there, or is it categorized?
- [58:43]
Nate Berkus
It is categorized, but it's pretty easy. I mean, I don't really venture. There's a little bit of skin care, because my best friend Brooke was like, if you're not using this skincare, your face is gonna be ugly. So I think, okay, what is it? It's system biology.
- [58:59]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Oh, yeah.
- [59:00]
Nate Berkus
I'm kind of. I'm really loyal. Like, it's so good. It's really good.
- [59:04]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [59:05]
Nate Berkus
And worth it. And, like, the mask is great.
- [59:07]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And so I smell. Have, like, a really weird mask. Yes. But they work well.
- [59:14]
Nate Berkus
It's the best thing. But you have to do it. Like, you have to get separated from your husband and.
- [59:19]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah. Ben won't come near me when I.
- [59:21]
Nate Berkus
No. Jer won't even come on the floor that I'm on. He's like, literally, like, you're so gross. I'm like, but I'm gonna be so cute in a minute.
- [59:27]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yes. No, it works so well.
- [59:30]
Nate Berkus
So funny. Terrible.
- [59:32]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Okay, let's get into our take 10, which. They're my favorite. It's how we end every episode. It's rapid fire questions. They have nothing to do with design at all.
- [59:41]
Nate Berkus
Okay, let's do it.
- [59:42]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Okay. What is your favorite food?
- [59:44]
Nate Berkus
Thai food.
- [59:46]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Favorite drink?
- [59:47]
Nate Berkus
Little saints, which is non alcoholic or the margarita flavor is, like, delicious or. It's great.
- [59:55]
Arielle Oken
Yeah.
- [59:55]
Nate Berkus
Tequila and soda is, like, my drink of choice. With fresh lemon juice.
- [59:59]
Arielle Oken
Me too.
- [60:00]
Nate Berkus
Is it?
- [60:01]
Arielle Oken
Yes.
- [60:01]
Nate Berkus
We should be married.
- [60:02]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yes.
- [60:02]
Nate Berkus
Makes perfect sense.
- [60:04]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Favorite film.
- [60:05]
Nate Berkus
Overboard with Goldie Hawn. That makes me laugh out loud.
- [60:09]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
She's just. She has, like, physical comedy to a T down. She's just the best.
- [60:15]
Nate Berkus
I agree.
- [60:16]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Favorite hotel.
- [60:17]
Nate Berkus
Ooh, I'm gonna have to go with the Ritz Paris.
- [60:20]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
I mean, there's nothing. I mean, it's just better than that.
- [60:23]
Nate Berkus
No, and it's like, you know, I would. I would normally, I wouldn't be like, oh, a city hotel. Like, I love the Amman in. In Laos, in Luang Prabang, I think is insane. And I. I think everybody, if you can, should try to go there once. It' old former French colonial building, several buildings, whatever. But it's such a beautiful part of the world. I love Southeast Asia, but, I mean, the Ritz is like, it's just the best hotel.
- [60:50]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah, no, it is. I went. My mom took me for my 16th birthday. She took me on a trip to Europe, and we went there for two nights. And I will literally never forget it.
- [60:58]
Nate Berkus
It's crazy. My kids have stayed there, and Jer's like, they're ruined now.
- [61:01]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah.
- [61:03]
Nate Berkus
Disaster.
- [61:04]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Favorite city?
- [61:06]
Nate Berkus
New York. I love living here.
- [61:08]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
It's the best place.
- [61:09]
Nate Berkus
I. I just love it. Favorite bedding, actually, right now, Restoration Hardware.
- [61:15]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Ooh, you know what?
- [61:16]
Arielle Oken
I keep seeing Annie Meyer.
- [61:18]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Shire just shot her house for her book, and she had all this great RH stuff on her.
- [61:23]
Nate Berkus
Yeah, I'm kind of into it, I would have to say, like, there, it's cotton. It's really comfortable. It gets softer and softer and softer. I really like it. I think they're doing a great job.
- [61:34]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Job. Yeah, it's beautiful, too. Tea or coffee? And how do you take it?
- [61:39]
Nate Berkus
Coffee, black. Which I had to learn how to do.
- [61:42]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
And I was gonna say that's where we differ. I can't do that.
- [61:46]
Nate Berkus
No, I do do that. But it was a huge thing for me because you. Any creamer that was, like, total garbage, like, candy bar or whatever. I was so into coffee mate.
- [61:57]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
My mom.
- [61:57]
Nate Berkus
Oh, coffee mate. I mean, coffee made. French vanilla. Coffee made is delicious.
- [62:02]
Arielle Oken
It's heaven.
- [62:03]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
It's so good. I don't use it anymore. It's so good.
- [62:06]
Nate Berkus
Ye. You can't. You have to use the weird fake organic ones. But it's still.
- [62:10]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
That don't taste as good, but.
- [62:11]
Nate Berkus
No, not at all. Which, by the way, makes no sense that I forced myself to have black coffee. And I do enjoy it now, but I'll also, like, go to Dairy Queen in Connecticut in two seconds, so nothing makes sense.
- [62:24]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yes. It's. You have to live a life of. Of, you know, dichotomy. Favorite playlist or music to listen to.
- [62:30]
Nate Berkus
I like hip hop from, like, my era. So like, 90s, 80s 90s hip hop and rap.
- [62:37]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah. Favorite weekend activity, Walking around the West.
- [62:40]
Nate Berkus
Village with my kids and Jer.
- [62:42]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
So cute. And then the last one, which is our. I think, the hardest question. Favorite design book?
- [62:47]
Nate Berkus
I would say it's the book of Yves Saint Laurent and Pierre Berger's. All the interiors that they did. Yeah, it's just really good because it's like Morocco, Paris. You see the quality of what they collected and what they. The collections that they built over all these years. And then, in addition, you see, obviously, the mastery of the interiors.
- [63:11]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Yeah, that is a great one. Well, Nate, this is, like, the ultimate delight. Thank you so much for coming on. I have final few words. What are you working on right now? And are there any new projects you can talk about besides foundations so much?
- [63:26]
Nate Berkus
Truly. Like, we've got this extremely modern project that we're working on in Miami. We have a really cool house that we're working on for a family that I like a lot in Aspen. Several projects here in New York, Chicago, of course, and some really, really great. The fourth project we've done for the same family now in la, so the design from Swamped, but, like, in. In really. And then we have, like, this cute young couple who bought their first apartment that we're installing in two weeks uptown, and she's pregnant, and. And they're Like, I think they're like 26, and I love them. Like, they were having so much fun. It's like they were like, we didn't know if we could call you. I'm like, yep, this is great. Like, some. I hope we work together for 80 years. I hope I'm in a way for control by blinking. But we've got all of that going on. And like I mentioned in when we first started talking, it's been a real year of, like, research, expansion and brand partnerships. So there's gonna be a lot of launches coming out next year.
- [64:28]
Interviewer (possibly Brooke or another host)
Wow. I'm so excited for you and I'm just, I've always been a huge fan of yours and, and I'm just in awe of how much you do. And you're amazing. So truly, thank you for coming on. This was such an honor for me and a delight, and I know our listeners are going to be so happy. So thank you for coming on.
- [64:44]
Nate Berkus
Thank you for having me. It was great.
- [64:46]
Arielle Oken
Thanks again to my guests today for joining me and to Shop my for sponsoring this season of Talk Shop. Head to the Show Notes to create your free shopper account and explore the curated storefronts from this season's designers. We'll be back next week with more thoughtful discussions and amazing guests. Follow us on Apple podcasts, Spotify and YouTube, so you never miss an episode. And of course, follow me. Arielokun, see you next week.