Talkin’ Cowboys: Resetting the Defense

Summary

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Talkin’ Cowboys: Resetting the Defense

Podcast: Talkin’ Cowboys | Date: January 29, 2026
Host(s): Josh Rodriguez (sub for Kyle Youmans), Patrik Walker, Isaiah Stanback
Episode Focus: In-depth reactions to the hire of new defensive coordinator Christian Parker, impacts on coaching staff and draft/free agency strategy, and forward-looking analysis for the Dallas Cowboys defense.

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Main Theme

This episode centers on the Dallas Cowboys’ decision to hire Christian Parker, a rising young defensive mind, as their new defensive coordinator. The crew dissects Parker’s fit, the organizational shift towards younger coaches who can connect with players, the re-shaping of defensive personnel and staff, and how the move alters draft and free agency strategy. Throughout, the tone is energetic, candid, and filled with both cautious optimism and analysis-driven realism.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Initial Reactions to Christian Parker’s Hiring

• Youth and Background:

  • Christian Parker is 34—a “fast rising defensive mind” known for developing players like Patrick Surtain and Cooper DeJean.
  • Hired away from a rival (the Eagles), which is seen as a double-win.

• Panel’s Candidness:

  • Isaiah Stanback: “Didn’t know who he was… but after research, respect and high regard for what he’s done. Climbed quickly.” (04:11)
  • The group appreciates his “ability to connect and teach” and sees this as aligning with a generational shift in coaching.

• Personnel Implications:

  • Development of cornerbacks is Parker’s strength, giving hope for current Cowboys defensive backs—especially Savione Revel.

“Christian Parker, even though he's only 34, he's already established a resume of being able to develop cornerbacks into greatness.”
— Patrik Walker (03:12)

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2. Front Office Evolution & Organizational Trust

• Shift in Leadership Approach:

  • The Jones family (Jerry & Stephen) is seen as more adaptive: “they have their eyes open and are humbling themselves to understand that the old ways haven't worked and we have to adapt.” — Isaiah (07:06)

• Collaboration and ‘Listening’:

  • Trust in Brian Schottenheimer (Shoddy) as a culture-builder; Schottenheimer’s input is influencing staff construction.

• Coaching Search Process:

  • Extensive and “exhaustive” search highlighted by consideration of both established and up-and-coming defensive minds.

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3. What Kind of DC Will Parker Be?

• Scheme Projection:
  • Parker comes from the Fangio tree: likely to feature single high safety looks, box-heavy run fronts, and an emphasis on cornerback play and versatility.
  • Success hinges on “teaching and development”—getting the best out of existing personnel.

“You're going to ask a lot of your cornerbacks... which means you have to make sure all of the information that you're giving forth is digestible and that you're connecting—those two things were severely lacking in the Eberflus era.”
— Patrik Walker (09:40)

• Growing Pains Expected:
  • First-time play-caller; inexperience is the “glaring question mark."
  • Staff and front office support critical to his success.

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4. Expectations for Year 1 of Christian Parker

• Panel Consensus:
  • Realistic bar: “top 15” defense in year one.
  • Growing pains anticipated—mistakes may cost games, but growth is expected.

“If you're top 16, top 15 in all-around defense and you can be top five in takeaways, I'll take it. Because... there's going to be growing pains.”
— Isaiah Stanback (13:59)

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5. Coaching Staff Turnover & New Hires

• Departures:
  • Notable loss of D-line coach Aaron Whitecotton (to Tennessee); likely to lose TE coach Lunda Wells as well, both of whom are highly respected internally.
• Candidates and Interviews:
  Additions/Interviews Discussed (23:47 - 28:56)
  • Ryan Smith (expected new CB coach from Cardinals; known for minimal TDs allowed in 2025)
  • Zach Orr (former Ravens DC), Robert Livingston (from Colorado, prior NFL experience), Ronell Williams (Eagles assistant LBs coach, could require title/promotion to join), Marcus Dixon (Vikings DL coach and former Cowboys player)
  • Emphasis: Young, modern teachers with secondary and linebacker expertise; ability to connect with players is a recurring theme.

“He's one of those straight shooters… when you have a coach that can talk to these cats, meet them where they're at…”
— Isaiah on Marcus Dixon (29:00)

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6. Draft and Free Agency Strategy With Parker at the Helm

• Likely Priorities:

  • Both the draft and free agency will emphasize defense, with the first round likely yielding a defensive pick—a cornerback, pass rusher, or athletic linebacker, depending on how roster holes and coaching staff solidify.
  • Possibility of trading one first-round pick to accumulate more mid-round selections due to lacking day two picks.

• Scheme-Wise, Roster Needs:

  • Core traits for Parker’s system:
    • Safeties: Versatile, can play high/in the box
    • Corners: Non-panickers, strong in zone
    • Linebackers: Speed over bulk, must run and cover
    • Emphasis on depth: Rotate seven to nine DBs (“need depth, not just star power”)

• Panel Debates: Star Power Vs. Consistency

  • Is it better to have a handful of “dudes” (difference-makers) or consistent, smart, assignment-sound depth?
  • Consensus leans toward competition and versatility: “You don’t need Superman, you need guys that know what’s about to happen.” (40:30)

“Sometimes you either have the one dog or you have three cats that’s gonna be there, tried and true every week.”
— Isaiah Stanback (40:17)

• Parker’s Voice in Personnel Decisions:
  • Recent front office actions under Dan Quinn and Aaron Whitecotton show a willingness to listen to coordinators. If Parker asks for personnel, likely to get support.

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Memorable Quotes

• “Congrats to [Parker]...34-year fast rising defensive mind who is responsible for development of guys such as Patrick Surtain...So pretty damn good.”
  — Patrik Walker (02:54)

• “I am proud of Double J. I’m proud of Stephen Jones…they have their eyes open and they are humbling themselves to understand that the old ways haven’t worked and we have to adapt.”
  — Isaiah Stanback (06:09)

• “There's gonna be things that happen this year where you’re like, 'What in the entire heck was he doing, bro?'...but that’s a part of growth.”
  — Isaiah Stanback (14:17)

• “If Christian Parker comes to me and he says, ‘to rebuild your defense in my vision…the way that you want it…I need you to give me whatever I ask,'...whatever you need, Christian.”
  — Patrik Walker (45:23)

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Notable Timestamps

• [02:03] — First reactions to Parker as “young buck” DC
• [03:43] — Impact on Cowboys CBs, focus on player development
• [04:11] — Isaiah admits not knowing Parker, then growing respect
• [06:09] — Front office evolving: willingness to adapt & change
• [09:23] — Scheme speculation: single-high, Fangio influence
• [13:47] — Realistic 2026 expectations for Parker’s defense
• [19:26] — Losing Aaron Whitecotton; impending staff changes
• [23:47] — Detailed rundown of new/targeted defensive coaches
• [32:37] — How Parker’s hire changes draft & FA priorities
• [39:48] — “Star power or consistency?” debate—depth is crucial
• [45:23] — Will front office empower Parker on draft/FA picks?

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Takeaway for New Listeners

This episode offers a comprehensive, honest look at the Cowboys’ defensive “reset” as they embrace youth, teaching, and a more modern approach to both coaching and roster building. With Christian Parker’s hire, the Cowboys are betting on development, adaptability, and collaboration—balancing excitement with the reality of an inexperienced coordinator. The staff and player changes ahead signal a pivotal period for the franchise, with the success of 2026 hinging on the new DC’s vision, support from ownership, and wise personnel moves.

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Transcript

[A]

The following is a production of Dallas Cowboys.com and the Dallas Cowboys football club.

[B]

How about them?

[C]

Cowboys? Go Cowboys.

[A]

This is Talking Cowboys streaming live from the Dallas Cowboys world headquarters at the Star in Frisco.

[D]

CD Lamb. Touchdown.

[C]

It's on. Jake Ferguson.

[D]

Prescott keeps it and he bangs it into the touchdown.

[A]

And now your hosts, Isaiah Standback, Patrick Walker, Josh Rodriguez and Kyle Yeomans.

[E]

Welcome to Talking Cowboys. We are live from the SWBC studios here at the Star and Frisco. We are brought to you by Black Rifle Coffee, the official coffee sponsor of the Dallas Cowboys. We've got Patrick Walker, Isaiah, stand back. Chris Beam in the back. Fasika is in the back, but she's not.

[D]

Oh, fat.

[E]

I'm Josh, the Josh Rodriguez of film School University, holding it down for Kylie Oma, who is covering the Senior Bowl.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

In Mobile, Alabama.

[D]

Yeah, Chris.

[C]

Tommy out there cooking.

[E]

Oh, yeah, Tommy.

[D]

I mean, Kyle.

[E]

You got Scott out there. The mustache himself. They're all there covering.

[D]

Oh, Scott Stashios out there.

[E]

Scott Purcell rocking the crazy mustache. Good for him, man. Lots of discussing Talking Cowboys. It's been a, what, 10 days since our last episode.

[C]

Long time.

[E]

We got a lot to discuss. Last time we were on here, we didn't have a defensive coordinator and now we do. Fellas, we have a defensive coordinator to talk about. And guess what? Young buck it is a young buck spring chicken.

[D]

Fresh, fresh face. Fresh, fresh meat.

[E]

And from a rival team, no less.

[C]

Magnificent.

[E]

So you made the Eagles lesser and you pick up a young man and then if he becomes a head coach, you also get draft picks to a lot.

[C]

Not too shabby.

[E]

And I think people like this guy. Guys, we have to talk about.

[C]

Let's Shoddy Cook.

[E]

Christian Parker, defensive coordinator. Guys, reactions to this. Philly fans were struggling. At first. It was, no, please don't take him. And then after we hired him, it's like. Was trying to be like us.

[C]

Yeah. Then it sucks anyway. That good. Cooper De G would be great. Shut your face.

[D]

Get out of here.

[C]

Shut your face. Okay, at the end of the day, let's just put it in perspective.

[E]

Yeah. Reactions, please.

[C]

Yeah, so let's put it in perspective. And I should have. I should have had a sign today. Oh, I should have had a sign. This take does not imply the Cowboys are going to the Super Bowl. I should have had my no.

[E]

Because the Seahawks are going to Super Bowl.

[D]

Yeah, that's right.

[C]

Tank was right. So. Yeah. But I will say yeah.

[E]

And I like it. But he was right.

[C]

We'll say yes. Christian Parker has a Good bit to prove this is his first time in the seat as a defensive coordinator.

[E]

Congrats to him.

[C]

So congrats to him. 30, 34 year, fast rising defensive mind. Who is responsible for the development of guys such as Patrick Certain. Heard of that guy before?

[E]

Yeah, I've heard of Patrick.

[C]

Certainty's pretty, pretty.

[E]

Was he a defensive MVP as him?

[C]

Yeah, I heard it's pretty damn good.

[E]

Okay.

[F]

Okay.

[C]

And also after Certain came the development of Cooper De Jean and Queena Mitchell. Both of those guys got a. An all Pro. Not in 2025. It wasn't second team, was it? It was first team. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So pretty. Pretty damn good. I sell that to say, Christian Parker, even though he's only 34, he's already established a resume of being able to develop cornerbacks into greatness. Now does that mean instantly that the Cowboys don't have to do any work to get him the personnel he needs? Nope.

[E]

No. No.

[C]

Not what that means at all. Right. They still need to do their personnel work, free agency and in the draft to get him guys. But it does give you a lot of promise for a guy like Sivone Revel. Once he's completely healthy and he gets a under offseason under his belt, this will be now a first off season. Healthy and under Christian Parker. So this is a clean slate for a guy like Savone Revel.

[E]

I like those words, Patrick. Now, turning to Isaiah, what were your first reactions whenever we signed Christian Parker to be our defensive coordinator?

[D]

Didn't know who he was. Tell you straight up before the.

[E]

The coaching search, I had no idea who he was.

[D]

Had no idea who he was. But after extensive research and tapping in with my resources, I've gained an understanding for who he is, A respect and a high regard for what he' done has climbed quickly. Ranks. Yep, quickly. That's something we were talking about. You know, obviously I was in on some of the old school cats that. The old ways, but I also said if they don't go that way, they need to grab one of these young tenderloins that. That can connect with this generation.

[C]

Right.

[D]

Because that was one of the conversations we had is ability. Ability to connect with the guys in the locker room.

[E]

We were talking about that from the beginning. No matter who the candidate was, it needed to be a guy that could relate to the players and coach them up in that way and teach them along the way.

[D]

And everything that I've heard about this man, just that. Right. His ability to connect, his ability to. To teach and the. The ability to not only just teach, but those for it to be receptive. So those guys are receiving what he's teaching and excited about working with him. So I am now excited, going back and looking at some of the coverages. Love that. Love that. I love everything about that. But now, you know, my, you know, after excitement kind of wears off now. You know, I look towards the support. I look towards the support and the staff. Let me say this. I am, you know, obviously it is. This person is of greater age than I am, but I can still be proud of somebody that's older than 100. I am proud of Mr. Double J. I am proud of Double J. I'm proud of Stephen Jones.

[E]

Sounds like they're changing their tune a little bit.

[D]

It's not even just the tune. It is. They're listening. They're listening. And when you're in a position of power where you have the almighty hand, right, and all, you know, the, the all, all say the. You can listen, right? Or you can hear people, but you don't have to listen to them.

[C]

And you can't hear Jimmy.

[D]

Yeah, you can't hear Jimmy. So I mean, listening.

[C]

Yeah, Jimmy. Cowboys. Exactly.

[D]

You see what they. But to. Over this last year, we've seen a change in the front office. Over this last year, we've seen those guys be more willing to stand on business in regards to the people that they believe in and people they don't believe in. We've seen them stand on business in terms of going out and acquiring free agents. Yes, we've seen them stand on business in terms of making trades and being more aggressive in that regard. And now we're seeing them stand on business and change. The ways in which they have hired and all these things are in. Are indicative to the fact that they have their eyes open and they are humbling themselves to understand that the old ways haven't worked and we have to adapt.

[E]

Let me say this really quickly, though. I don't think it was. It's not a night and day transition because they did start off last season doing something very interesting in hiring Schottenheimer, which was not the sexy pick. It was not the guy that. It was very unconventional for the Cowboys. But then they also hired Matt E. Flu to be your D.C. a known guy with head coaching experience. So this is a project that they've done many times before. It didn't work out. So now, at least for me, it's not necessarily indicative of the Joneses and the front office listening to. That's what I mean. It's like it is indicative of them listening to what Shotty has to say. Because I think they picked the right guy for sure. I think they picked Shotty as a difference maker for the culture and for the Dallas Cowboys as a whole. But now they gained his trust throughout this, this season. Obviously, Eber Flutes didn't work out there. They accepted it. It's like, okay, now we're onto our fourth, fourth DC in four years. So now the extensive exhaustive search that was taking place for this DC because we heard about all the names that were brought to us over the, the, the several weeks that the, the interviews were taking place, I mean, for me, like we talked about, the most obvious at the time was Arizona coordinator Jonathan, Jonathan Cannon Gannon, who was Cardinals over the last few seasons. That was the most obvious because it's like, oh, he has had coaching experience. There's some relations there that. Okay, there it is. There's the pick. Right, Right. Except things are different now.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

Because of the trust that they have in Shotty. And it wasn't just Jonathan Gannon or else that would have been it. Right. It would have been maybe two or three guys like that. And then it's like, okay, let's go with Gannon. It was an extensive search, an exhaustive search. That word has been used quite a bit by the front Office, by Will McClay, by Stephen Jones, and it's accurate. And there was a lot of names flying around and guys that you wouldn't expect the Dallas Cowboys to interview in a position like this prior to this off season. So I like that. I'm kind of interested now in what type of DC Christian Parker will be because now he's as a play caller because this is his first time calling plays and he's coming from the Fangio tree, which has proven to be pretty successful. It's a blueprint. So I ask you guys, teacher has been brought up a lot. What kind of DC will Christian Parker be?

[D]

I think he's going to be a single high safety, load the box. You're not going to run the ball on us. And we're going to trust our defensive backs to be able to cover your guys. That's what I foresee.

[E]

And that's a Fangio defense.

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

Two high shell, light box, make the QB take the check down, corners can tackle, safeties can rotate.

[C]

That's basically what to that point kind of circling back because. Yes, that means you're going to ask a lot of your cornerbacks in your. In that single high safety a lot. That means that you The DC and your position coaches have to excel at teaching and developing, which means you have to make sure all of the information that you giving forth is digestible and that you're connecting those two things were severely lacking in the one year Eber Flutes era.

[D]

And they have to be capable.

[C]

And they have to be capable. So that goes back to what I said initially. Does this mean instantly that Christian Parker is going to solve all the issues? No, that means we'll see if he's the right guy for the job, but feels as if he is. He is proven he's a fast riser, but you have to get him the pieces. You have to give him the personnel. If those two things jive up well and you get these position coaches lined up the right way, we're seeing some real interesting names coming down the pike as far as these interviews for these position coaches. And that's another thing. You could see the Schottenheimer and now the Christian Parker effect on. Let me build this, this defensive staff as I see fit and I can get some things done for you.

[E]

I totally agree with you. But one thing that I've heard, well, outstanding teacher. That was a quote from Stephen Jones about whenever he's interviewing Christian Parker. That was one thing that they brought up, but another thing that they brought up in terms of using the pieces that we currently have to make the defense better. At the end of the day. This is from Steven Jones. At the end of the day, it was Christian's vision, the wrinkles he can bring that would fit the pieces we have in place. And a few of those names popped up. He's talking about Savone revel, talked about DeMarvin Overshone as pieces that are currently here that can work with Christian Barker's vision. I'm. I'm thankful to hear those words because a lot of these players I think didn't have a fair Shake. I, I think Savon Rebels season was tumultuous at best. But I think a lot of that was the communication with Shake, with Kaylin Carson.

[C]

I mean Raiders game, he just got yanked.

[E]

But a name that wasn't brought up, a name that wasn't brought up by the front office by Shoddy. You're not necessarily hearing that, but Siobhan Revel was a big one that they brought 100%.

[C]

And I think that. And really quickly, Melvin, if you want to know, the, the biggest negative is the obvious, which is he's never called plays before. That's. So that means TBD on his ability to call plays. And that Also means there will be growing pains as he learns how to grow plays and learns how to, you know, what plays situationally. So Melvin and all those wondering, yes, we're talking about the positives right now, but we could, we cannot stress enough the glaring, I don't want to say negative but, but the glaring question mark which is can he and how quickly can he develop his play calling ability. So that's obvious. But personnel is going to be key. What I, I like what Steven said there, but the reporter in me flips it the other way and says okay, now my question becomes, or does that mean that you're not going to be aggressive in acquiring new guys? Because I fear having covered this team for so long that I love the shoddy effect right now. I love it because 20, 26 and beyond, not a good bit in 25, but not on the defensive side of the ball because my Eber Flutz was a front office hire. But now in 2026 we're getting the full shoddy effect. How much of that is going to continue to extend to making trades like they did for George Pickens and Quinn and Williams and, and bringing in guys like Javante Williams who was a risk at the time and our good friend Isaiah Stamback stood on the table and said this guy's going to be something for the Cowboys. And he was absolutely right. But that level of aggression in free agency needs to continue if not ratchet up just a little bit because as it stands this defensive personnel, keeping in mind you have a good bit of these guys going into free agency right now as well. Donovan Wilson being one that comes to mind immediately. What's the development of Maris theophile now look like under Christian Parker for example?

[E]

So because they need fast linebackers personnel.

[C]

Wise, you got, you got some, got some questions that need to be answered.

[E]

One question that I wanted to ask at least is expectations. You kind of touched on it as well. I mean this is a first time play caller as far as a coordinator role for him goes. Would you say that he's here to raise the floor or actually touch like top five defenses in the league right now? Like what do you think the expectations.

[C]

Are for year one Z. Yeah.

[E]

What are yours? Just personally, what are your expectations? Mid tier middle. Yeah, that's not a little take too. If you have a top tier offense, I mean.

[D]

Yeah, if you, if you get top 16.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

If you're top six. We said this right?

[C]

Yeah, we said this on talking Cowboys.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

If you're top 16, top 15 and all, all around Defense and you can be top five and takeaways. I'll take it. Yeah, I'll take it. Because to no seeds points. A very valid point. There's going to be growing pains.

[C]

Yep.

[D]

There's. There's going to be things that happen this year where you're like, what in the entire heck was he doing, bro? Like, you know, in it. And it may cost you some games, you know, it may cost you some games, but guess what? That's a part of growth. And when you hire somebody who's 34 years old, who's gonna, who's around the age of some of the guys that you have on the roster, there's going to be growing pains.

[C]

Yeah, right.

[D]

He has to learn too.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

You know, there's some young bucks that are on the team, there's some young coaches that are now on the team. Yep. So he's gonna have to learn and you're to have grace while he's learning. And that's a part of something that the ownership group understands.

[C]

Right.

[D]

We understand the upside, the potential upside. But while there's great upside, there's going to be some, some speed bumps along the way.

[C]

I feel like I love what Isaiah is saying here. Let's temper the expectations. We love to hire. There's a huge question mark on what does his play calling look like? How quickly can he get past these growing pains? Because there will be growing pains. Okay. I'm going to give him a year, one grace period in saying that if he can land at number 15, if the defense can come in ranked 15th overall and the offense can take strides over what they were last year because they were prolific last year, but they had pockets of times where they went cold. First it was first halves of games and then it was second halves of games.

[E]

In a large part due to the.

[C]

Defense, large part due to the, the defense. But if Shotti can learn from his growing pains, because Shoti had growing pains as well last year, if the offense can become better, you give them a mid Tier defense in 20, 26, you're in the playoffs and possibly at the divisional round, maybe a conference, I don't know. But what I'm saying is a 15th ranked defense I think is very possible. If they finish building the staff out the right way and they attack free agency and the draft the right way to give Christian Parker the support and the personnel.

[D]

I'm all about the position coaches right now.

[E]

And speaking of, there are a lot of names floating around, a lot of interviews taking place and they're trying to Fill out that defensive staff when we come back. We need to discuss those names. Give me those names. More Talking Cowboys after these messages.

[C]

How's it going? You see that Cowboys game? Oh, I watched.

[D]

Been seeing some good things.

[C]

Totally. They have some talent.

[D]

Yup. Some great talent.

[C]

And they got some fight. Hoping this is the year. Me too. Oh, I'm Cody, by the way. I'm Travis. Nice to meet you, Travis. Go Cowboys.

[D]

Go Cowboys.

[F]

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[C]

Hey, yeah.

[B]

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Touchdown.

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Full details.

[A]

Back to Talking Cowboys.

[E]

Welcome back to Talk and Cowboys, brought to you by Black Rifle Coffee. This segment is brought to you by Invisalign, the official smile of the Dallas Cowboys. And did you guys know that fan of the year is presented by Captain Morgan?

[C]

Oh, we did, but tell them anyway.

[E]

It's presented by Captain Morgan. Foe for fan of the year is.

[C]

But are you doing the stance with the leg, though, we can't see the leg is up.

[E]

It's on.

[D]

I didn't want to show off everybody.

[E]

So I wanted to ask you guys about the expectations on Christian Parker because I don't want to be another one of those podcasts that's like just hyping up Parker and then 15th.

[C]

Fifteenth is year one.

[E]

I think that would be an acceptable upgrade.

[C]

Yes.

[E]

From last year's defense to this year's defense. But then you did see after. Anyways, I'm just saying game, temper your expectations where we can be happy about the pick and also temper our expectations. So please understand that. Guys, the coaching staff now, we had a few I'm angry departures from the coaching staff. Aaron Whitecot. I'm angry being the main one.

[D]

I'm angry.

[E]

Why Isaiah?

[D]

I'm excited for him.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

Good for him.

[D]

Great human titans, great human being.

[C]

Great coach. Great coach.

[E]

Motivator.

[D]

Yeah. I mean, we've seen what he did with the D line. I mean, come on, man. Like, he's.

[E]

I, I, I just gathering.

[D]

All this time and I hate that they lost him. There's two, listen, no disrespect to the rest of the coaches. Two coaches that I feel as if the Dallas Cowboys, I don't say can't afford to lose or couldn't afford to.

[E]

Lose, but you'd hate to see, you.

[C]

Hate to see them losing, right?

[D]

Aaron Wycott was one.

[E]

Yes.

[D]

The other one most likely will probably be saying bye to him, too. Go ahead, Linda Wells.

[C]

And there's a good possibility.

[D]

There's a great.

[E]

Because it's, because it's a, it's a promotion.

[D]

It is a heck of a promotion.

[C]

And it just heck of a situation.

[D]

And it's a, it just makes it.

[C]

And you got on black and yellow. Did you do that?

[D]

This is morning. There's no news. I don't know anything that y' all don't know, but I, my spider senses are going off.

[C]

I do know something. It'd be very.

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

And how could you blame him if that's what he decides to go.

[D]

You can't.

[C]

I mean, do know something.

[D]

I listen Cowboys nation. I hope that you retain Linda Wells. I hope that he says, no, I'm staying here. But if you're in Linda Wells and you have opportunity to go play for a coach that you played underneath, you had opportunity to go play for another great organization. Go coach for another great organization. You have a, a great tight end room over there as well to work with. And you have officer coordinator Position where you're one step closer to being a head coach and you don't really have to be the officer coordinator. You just get the title and you get the like.

[E]

And behind a head coach who's already long in the tooth may not be sticking around.

[D]

It's a great situation for him. I don't know. I'm not trying to pump it up. Obviously this is Cowboys talk, but the reality is you're most likely going to say bye to him as well. So 2. One great coach is gone that everybody in that room loves. Obviously he was up for defensive coordinator positions. He didn't get that for where he's going.

[E]

He interviewed here for D.C. yes, he did. We talked about that.

[D]

So, yeah, so it's sad about those departures, of course, that, that departure.

[E]

But the sky isn't falling. Anytime a new defensive, new coordinator is hired anywhere in the league, the. The league turn turns over about 30 to 50% of their staff. I mean, it sure happened.

[D]

So I was hopeful and again, this is understanding what the ownership is in position to do often times. Obviously we blocked. Right. Mr. Jones and the Jones family, they.

[E]

Made one Clayton Adams. Yeah, stay away, buddy.

[D]

They tried to get Clayton Adams.

[E]

No, I mean, to be fair, he probably was like, go ahead and block that, but I'm good on field.

[D]

But the only reason why they were able to block it is because it was an adj. Decent move.

[E]

Yes.

[D]

Right. It was offensive coordinator to offensive coordinator. Right. So that why is. That's why they had the power to block it. They don't have the power to block Aaron White. Aaron White. Cotton, who's getting the D line position in Tennessee, but he's also getting the promotion to the D. To the rush run game coordinator. Right. So he got a promotion in title. Linda Wells is the tight end coach for Dallas Cowboys. He's not going potentially going to go interview for tight ends position coach in Pittsburgh. He's going to go interview for the offensive coordinator position under Coach McCarthy who he already coached under. So is it.

[E]

If you know anything about McCarthy hires his buddies. So is it an interview?

[D]

So, so anyway, so that's. That's that. But about these new guys, about these.

[C]

New guys, about these new.

[E]

Patrick, give us the rundown, please.

[C]

All right, so I will say I'm waiting for. On confirmation for this. I know that there are some credible reports out there from some of our folks that are on the beat, like Todd Archer, for example, who spoke that the Cowboys are finalizing a deal with Arizon. Arizona Cardinals cornerbacks coach Ryan Smith I'm told it's in the works. Told it's not done quite yet. So put a pin in that. Waiting for that to become official or at least agreed to terms. So it's not been agreed to terms yet, but he is in the building. So that's a possible addition. Promising. I will say young. He's in his early 40s, mid-40s. So still on the the new guard type space. Right.

[E]

Modern minds.

[C]

Right. This is also a guy who you know in, in college he coached up Caleb Farley with at Virginia Tech. So and then of course you know that when and you're looking at the Cardinals defense, particularly their passing defense. They were the number one defense in the league as a far, as far as fewest passing touchdowns allowed. They only had 10 last year. That was the lowest amount in the entire league. So if you combine him with Christian Parker's ability to develop defensive backs and cornerbacks, he might be cooking with some some fish grease there.

[E]

I probably listen to a coach with a secondary background on cornerback coaches, but love that.

[C]

Now as far as some well, going to the departures really quickly, Aaron Whitecott and we just talked about that. Assistant offensive line coach Ramon Chin Young. He is reportedly headed to guess where the Pittsburgh Steelers to reunite. See where you're going with that to reunite with Mike McCarthy. So Cowboys need to handle that on the offensive side of the ball and potentially Lunda Wells is vacancy if Lunda takes that job. Now as far as going back to defense pending, these are the guys who are being interviewed. Zach Orr, Ravens defensive coordinator he was interviewed in the defensive coordinator process for the Cowboys, Correct. Seen in the building multiple.

[D]

Multiple times.

[C]

Multiple times.

[D]

Multiple days.

[E]

Have eyes on him.

[D]

Multiple days. Not just multiple times. Multiple days.

[C]

Multiple days. He and his family, his. His significant other and their beautiful young child, they were in the building multiple days during the defensive coordinator search to the point where I figured that he was going to be in a front runner for sure.

[D]

Right.

[C]

As it turns out there's some still love and mutual interest there because he's interviewing for this is home. Yeah. And it is.

[D]

That's also. That's also what it's.

[C]

This is a UNT guy Young family. Right. Young family, UNT guy. If Kyle was here, then I'd let him call. So Zach Orr.

[D]

I said new call for him.

[C]

Zach Orr. He's one that's interviewing again for a possible position coach role. Robert Livingston.

[D]

This is real quick backpedal on Zach or. Yeah, this would be a downgrade, substantial downgrade for him in title. We Never know what the coaches make. So let's lay that out there. But we don't know what they would do back in wise contractually.

[E]

But there was a title, there was a tumultuous end to his.

[C]

In Baltimore.

[E]

In Baltimore. Yeah. And at least if you go on Twitter it's he's not a good pick because everyone thinks he sucks. You know what I'm saying that in terms of Twitter talk. But then again, this is a well respected coach in the NFL that I mean the Ravens are always expected to be top five defenses in the league. So I think you got to give this guy some grace. And nothing went right for the Baltimore.

[C]

And not just that, but also the reality of it is we talk a lot about how sometimes a head coach is better served as a coordinator. Right. Not every coordinator needs to be a head coach. Well, not every position coach needs to be a coordinator. And then sometimes a coordinator might be in a situation that's non conducive for them, be it personnel or ownership or whatever, and then they kind of downgrade to a position coach and that's a better fit and they rebuild themselves and they end up in a coordinate coordinator roll in the next couple years.

[D]

And again, I bring this up again, I don't know this man's family, but I do know that the baby was in a stroller. Right.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Young family. Maybe he doesn't want all the responsibilities of being a coordinator.

[C]

It's a lot comes with it, a lot more time.

[E]

Just speculating.

[D]

But yeah, I'm speculating, I'm looking at it.

[C]

Reasonable speculation. This is we're fathers. Yeah. Conversation.

[D]

Time matters.

[C]

So Robert Livingston going back to him really quickly, the defensive side of the ball. This feels like the Connor Riley move.

[D]

Right.

[C]

Because Robert Livingston will be coming from Colorado as a defensive coordinator. The only difference is Livingston actually has a little bit of NFL experience before he went to Colorado. But the fact is if he comes on board, then shoddy and the Cowboys and Parker are pulling him from the collegiate ranks.

[D]

What position group?

[C]

Good question. Good question. Same with Zach or tbd.

[D]

I thought Zach war was for linebackers. That's what I heard.

[C]

You might be right. I'll double check that because he's not the only one. Ronnell Williams assistant linebackers coach for the Eagles we talk about potent Eagles defensive coaches. We got Christian Parker in the building jokes on you. Well, apparently they're not done because Christian Parker reached back and said, hey, let's see if we can get Ronell Williams, the Eagles assistant linebackers coach in the building as well. So the reason Parker be listening to that Drake hotline. Yeah, that's why I say put a pin in because I heard the same thing you heard about or but I'm curious as to because I feel like if it's a lateral move the Eagles are going to be pissed off enough to say no, we couldn't block you on Parker. Yeah, we're not letting you take Ronnell Williams from assistant linebackers coach to assistant linebackers coach. There has to be a promotion there involved somewhere.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

And if he is coming in as linebackers coach then I don't see running coordinator.

[D]

Right.

[C]

I don't see Zach or going from D.C. to assistant linebacker anything. So it'll be interesting to see how that works out. Marcus D Vikings defensive line coach his contract ended at the start of this offseason. He was in the mix a little bit for defensive coordinators still in the mix for defensive line coach, especially now that Aaron White Cotton is out of the building. So recap. Zach Orr, Robert Livingston, Marcus Dixon, Ronell Williams all being interviewed for position coaching. Ryan Smith is I'm told nearing a finalization of a contract to become the Cowboys new cornerbacks coach under Christian Parker. So those are your updates. A lot of mo pieces so just stay tuned as we get new information.

[D]

And Marcus Dixon is a fast rising coach and he's my ex team.

[C]

I was going to say tell me what, Tell me what. Tell the people what you text me.

[D]

Yeah, MD Tell them what you text. Marcus Dixon was my teammate here in Dallas. I believe it was like in 08. He was my teammate. Big fella, young, you know, young obviously. Same about same age as me. Energetic and can really connect. He's a real one. He's, he's, he's one of those straight shooters and when you have a coach that can, that's played in it and he had a solid career too. I think he played PR jets and moved around a little bit. But he played a position he can connect. He could talk to these cats. He can meet them where they're at. He can talk to them in a way that older guys can't necessarily talk to him with, you know, at and be respected and received. So he's, he's.

[E]

That seems like a reoccurring theme with this coaching style.

[D]

Listen, my last time seeing him I saw him on the field when we're doing a pregame show against the Vikings and he walked, he was walking around the, the the field and I was.

[C]

Like MD he was like man, what's up man?

[D]

There's just instant connection. Just it's always good to see old teammates doing well in terms of the coaching ranks. But I love hearing his name affiliated with the Cowboys again.

[E]

That's great, man. Okay, let's take our last break. When the coaching staff is solidified from a personnel standpoint, how does free agency and draft strategy change? We need to discuss these things more. Talking Cowboys when we come back at.

[F]

AT&T, we guarantee our network so you can talk college football with your BFF while taking Buster to the vet.

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Hey yeah.

[E]

I can't believe he ate the whole.

[D]

Thing of chicken wing. I can't believe we're staging a comeback. Touchdown.

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[A]

To talking cowboys.

[E]

Welcome back to Talking Cowboys, live from the start.

[D]

Let's go, Texas.

[E]

I don't know what that was, but I don't know. Just have some energy.

[D]

I'm here with it.

[E]

We got some energy. Yeah. We're talking strategy changes.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

How does hiring Christian Parker change our draft strategy, our free agency strategy? Please tell me it gets even better from here.

[D]

Well, I can tell you one thing. One of those picks are going to be a defensive player.

[E]

Hey, you think so?

[D]

I can tell you that much.

[E]

Stephen Jones said that they're putting the board together just like they always do. They're not going give me both. Them.

[D]

Both BF apos V e m. Both of them are. I honestly. This is my honest thoughts, please.

[E]

That's all we asked for. On Talking Cowboys.

[D]

I believe that Mr. Jones, Steven Jones, that is, likes to keep things in his pocket.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

He doesn't like to spend it, per se, if I had to guess. I think that you use your first draft pick, first round draft pick, pick, and you trade away your second to acquire more picks. Because I think that what you were just hearing what you, what you. What you were communicating to us there. No, see, in regards to Stephen Jones, talking about using what we have. And like you, you continue to hear the language, right, in terms of, hey, like, I don't want to spend it, but, hey, you know, how about we. We utilize what we already got in the crib. It's already in the refrigerator. We got food at the crib here.

[C]

You know, McDonald's.

[D]

We ain't going out to eat.

[E]

You know what we have at home? Pie.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. Don't start with the pie conversation.

[D]

So I foresee them using the first draft pick on the defensive player to give Parker what he feels that he needs because that's your new coach. And then I think that they. Or they grab something, a position, you know, a position of need, whatever is most evident at that time. And then they trade away that second first round pick to go acquire, you know, a couple thirds or fourth, whatever it might be.

[E]

Do you think because of his background as a secondary coach, does that mean we attack secondary more?

[C]

No.

[E]

More so than a pass rusher.

[C]

More so than you finish.

[D]

No, please let me finish.

[C]

Yeah, no, I think you attack and this is why it's great that you got two picks in the first round. I think you do attack, especially with Christian Parker. I think cornerback was on the Table. Not even, I think cornerback was on the table. Christian Parker. Yeah. Now even more so with Christian Parker in the building. But the beauty of it is because you have two first round picks, you get your pass rusher and you get your cornerback. Now could that be as what Isaiah is saying? Very well. It's very well that, you know, possible that the Cowboys could use one of those picks, move back into the. Later in the first round, maybe into the second, get some more picks because they don't have. I mean, they're missing that pick in the second round anyway, so. And then handle it that way. But I do believe, Believe as we have this conversation and we're having this conversation before free agency starts. Keep that in mind.

[E]

Yes, keep that in mind. Because there are a lot of players. Christian Park Parker has coached on other teams, including the Eagles, including the Broncos, expiring contracts coming up.

[D]

Expiring. So that's why we can't say their name.

[C]

Expiring.

[E]

We cannot say the names right now.

[C]

There's one that's on the. The edge.

[D]

It's cold in here. I sure wish I had a.

[C]

There's. There's had what?

[D]

Had a blanket.

[C]

You all right?

[D]

Yeah, just chilly.

[E]

Don't you have to get on a boat later?

[D]

It's water blanket sometimes.

[C]

Oh, well, I know that one of the players that are coming free is. I hear he's a dog.

[E]

Go Dogs.

[C]

So there's that. But I mean they have several guys that are going to be of note entering free agency. Can't say the names because they're still under contract until that at least legal tampering starts in the first second week of March. But nonetheless, just like Christian Parker is reaching out to try to get Ronell Williams in the building, I 100% foresee him reaching out to some of these form or current soon to be former Eagles players on the defensive side of the ball saying, hey, if you like what we did over there, try coming and doing it for.

[D]

If you tired of people dancing.

[C]

If you don't like your head coach dancing in the background talking trash to fans in the tunnel on.

[D]

Come to Dallas, come to Dallas.

[E]

It's far less punch if you catch that reference.

[C]

Yeah, we're. We're good.

[D]

We're good.

[C]

Yeah, good. But no, seriously, I think so. I think I said hit the nail on the head as far as what could happen with the draft. I still want to see aggressiveness and free agency like we're talking about because if you're aggressive in free agency and you do it the right Way defensively because George Pickens is at the top of everybody's list in this room and in this building. But defensively, you handle it the right way, then maybe you walk away with a very impactful edge rusher whilst retaining Davion Clowney which then allows you to continue to develop and you know, slowly unleash as Raku get you a free agency linebacker who can impact the game along with the Marvio Nova shown and Marisley foul. Okay, now when you go into the draft, because I, I, because I'm going to spend so much on pickings and I want another edge rusher in free agency, I want a linebacker in free agency, I'm not going to say, oh well, also give me a high ticket cornerback because they're not going to do that. But what it does allow you to do is go into these first two round picks first. These two first round picks, sorry. And you say I can attack, I can throw. Cornerback, first pick, first pick in my first round of the draft, cornerback. And then when the second pick comes around, you say okay, well we did get an impact edge rusher, so maybe now we can afford to move back a little bit and attack edge that way.

[E]

So I think exactly that like you're talking about trading that second first round pick to acquire more picks because you currently have no day two picks at all. One of the things, at least in Fangio style systems, they value safeties that can play high and in the box, corners that don't panic with their eyes. Linebackers who can run, not just hit. You have linebackers who can run. Right now I think that that's athletic linebackers, I think the vision is there for him and I think that's one of the things that sold them on Parker. But, but I think an emphasis on the secondary doesn't mean cornerbacks in the first round. I think that means multiple mid round cornerbacks, which is why you would maybe want to trade that for one of those first round picks. And again, versatile safeties in competition everywhere. If you look at the recent playoff defenses, Ravens, 49ers, Chiefs, they rotate between seven and nine defensive backs yearly. You have to have depth. It's not just your number one guys. You're talking about a team that got rid of Trayvon Diggs. They released him in the, just before the last game of the season. A guy that was, you know, a ball hawk in his, in his time, but a guy that would give up the big play. I'm wondering now is the, is the mentality changing on? Like are we over Creating those splash plays. I'm not saying entirely, but are you more relying on players being right? You don't need players to be great. You need them to be right. Cerebral players.

[D]

I am curious to see.

[C]

Question Josh Rodriguez.

[D]

I'm curious to see how. How Coach Parker impacts the draft in regards to. Do you feel as if you need star players or do you need consistent.

[C]

Players across the board?

[E]

The latter, please.

[D]

You know what I'm saying? Like I'm being genuine because.

[C]

And I'm sitting here asking myself, why not both?

[D]

Well, sometimes you can't get both. Right. Sometimes you either gotta go. You gotta go get the guy because there's only a handful of guys.

[C]

That's true. Right.

[D]

Or you sit, say, I gotta. I have to be okay letting that team have the guy. Let me get the guy. That's one or two guys behind him. That is gonna. Not gonna necessarily be that, but I know exactly what I'm getting out of.

[E]

Playing to do disguises another dude.

[D]

Exactly. You know, Tropic Thunder. So sometimes you either have the one dog or you can have. You can have three. Three cats that can. That's gonna be there, tried and true every week.

[E]

You don't need Superman. You need guys that know what's about to happen.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

Guys that can recognize the play.

[C]

Okay. So Devil's advocate.

[E]

You need Sean Lee's out there.

[C]

So. So Devil's healthy.

[E]

Sean.

[C]

Sean Lee, when healthy, was a guy.

[E]

Absolutely.

[C]

So that's what I mean.

[E]

But you need mental Sean Lee.

[C]

You need mental Sean Lee's. Isaiah's not wrong. It's just a matter of how. How are you going to approach this? Right. You have to decide what your outfit's going to look like. Because while Isaiah is absolutely correct in that there are only a handful of guys at each position in the league. Big period. Right. So then you are going.

[E]

We have eight Pro Bowlers on your. On your roster right now.

[C]

Stop that. Now you're going to have to figure out if you're going to go and get that guy and then the depth chart around him are guys who are just simply consistent or are you going to elevate those guys a little bit by downgrading this? And now you have guys who are.

[D]

At, you know, so one of the things about Coach Parker that I read about, I say he loves competition. Competition. He loves competition. And that's. We know that's one of the. The core values.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Well, Coach Schottenheimer loves competition. Right. We saw it. We saw it in training camp. This is another opportunity. Every day this is another opportunity. Do you stay true to that on offense, do you stay true to that? Right? Do you? Do you. And this is where I say I'm curious to see exactly how this draft goes down. Does Coach Parker stand up in the meeting room, in that room, in that war room and say, I need these guys? And the Joneses say, well, we already have these guys that we invested in. Then what's that conversation look like then? Right? If. If Mr. Coach Parker says, hey, I need this guy. He's a competitor, he's a dog, they say, well, we already have that position filled. What happens? That's what I'm curious to see. I can't wait to see the picks because that's going to give you a. A peak behind the veil in regards to who's really running the show, who's not. Not certainly who's running the show, but, like, are they going to continue to listen?

[C]

Listen.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

Or is that going to be a situation where there is resistance?

[C]

You.

[D]

You know what I'm saying? And pushback. But they're like, oh, I've given on a lot. Now I'm not. I'm not giving on this.

[C]

All right, so here's the thing, though. You, the Cowboys, over the past several seasons, and when I say over the past several, I'm going. Let me reach back into the Jason Garrett era for a minute. When you're looking back at the Jason Garrett era, a lot of the reasons the Cowboys were finishing eight and eight was because outside of having a guy, a dude, an animal here and there, here and there, you had positions that didn't have a guy or that dude. Now fast forward through Mike Nolan, through Dan Quinn, who had an excellent defense, with the exception of it, couldn't stop the run. And then Matt Eber flu. And Mike Zimmer, not so much. You're going into 2026. You look at this roster and look at who's going in the free agency from all the teams, including this, this one, and you say, okay, at defensive tackle, do I have a guy?

[D]

Yes.

[C]

You got at least two.

[E]

You got two.

[C]

You got at least two without resigning Javion Clowney, because that deal is not done. As we have this conversation. At defensive end, do you have a guy? No, because you don't know where Ezraku is yet. So you don't. At linebacker, do you have a guy?

[E]

No guy.

[C]

You have a guy with an asterisk.

[E]

With an asterisk. We'll see when he gets a full off season.

[C]

Okay, so that's fair. Defensive. But but right now, I would say no defensive back. Keep in mind, you need to be concerned about Duron Bland's foot.

[E]

No, no.

[C]

So no. At safety. Do you have a guy?

[D]

No.

[E]

No.

[C]

You need to get guys. Yeah, that. That's where I'm at with it.

[D]

And I don't disagree with you, but again, my thing is from the management standpoint, if you've invested in guys, right. For instance, take the cornerback position. We just signed Deon Bland to an extension. We just drafted Rebel. We just. We drafted Carson a year before. Do you. If he comes out and said, I need to draft two corners, runners, what is the response by the upper management? He comes out. If he comes out and says, hey, I need. I need more linebackers. Well, we just got. We just got Leople and we just got, you know, overshot. No, no, no, no. I need this. Are they going to listen?

[E]

I think it's indicative.

[C]

If they draft a safety, my answer would be yes. If Christian Parker comes to me, I.

[D]

Think you go get him.

[C]

If Christian Parker comes to me and he says, to rebuild your defense in my vision and the way that you want it to be over the next two to five years of my contest contract, I need you to give me whatever I ask you to get. And here's why I think the Cowboys will be in on that. Because pre Dan Quinn, personnel acquisition wise, looked much different than when Dan Quinn got in the building. The Cowboys didn't approach, attack or bring in the defensive tackle position like they should have. But then here comes Aaron White Cotton. Oh, and all of a sudden, not only did you trade Michael, which you may or may not have done anyway, but you trade them for Kenny Clark and then a few weeks later you go and get Quinny Williams. So that's. To me, they're listening. Yeah, they're listening. Yeah. So if Christian Parker comes to me and I'm Jerry and Stephen Jones and he says, I need him, him, him, and him, I'm like, call him, call him, call him, call him. Whatever you need, Christian. Yeah, whatever you need.

[E]

All right, fellas, that will do it. Talking Cowboys, we will be back next week with the full crew. Kyle will be back for more coverage on America's team. Stay tuned all day, every day on Dallas Cowboys for Patrick Rich, Mocha Beamer and Fasika. We'll see you next time.

[A]

This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys.com and the Dallas Cowboys football Club.