Talking Feds – "Indict, Strike, Repeat"

Date: December 8, 2025
Host: Harry Litman
Guests: Mimi Roka, Tara Setmayer, Jacob Weisberg

Episode Overview

This episode of Talking Feds dives into a week dominated by scandals, legal anomalies, and political controversy surrounding the Trump administration. The roundtable of legal and political experts analyzes:

• DOJ's failed attempt to re-indict New York Attorney General Letitia James
• The extraordinary use of prosecutorial power against political enemies
• A controversial US military strike on an alleged drug boat—possibly a war crime
• Escalating, open xenophobia from Trump after a shooting of National Guard members
• Growing problems around Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth and Trump’s loyalty-first Cabinet

The tone is sharp, incredulous, and at times darkly humorous, spotlighting just how far outside historic democratic and legal norms this era has drifted.

Segment Breakdown & Key Insights

1. Letitia James Indictment Fiasco

(Start – 24:35)

Key Points

• The DOJ’s second grand jury attempt in Norfolk declined to indict New York AG Letitia James, following an earlier judge’s dismissal of the original charge.
• The repeated pursuit of James (and James Comey) is seen as a blatant abuse—the “purest definition” of political prosecution.
• Notably, career prosecutors refused to support these indictments, marking internal resistance to political manipulation.

Notable Quotes

• Mimi Roka [04:48]:
  “I was more surprised...the first time around when the grand jury returned indictments... career prosecutors in EDVA wanted absolutely nothing to do with the Comey indictments or the Tish James indictments.”
• Tara Settmeier [07:57]:
  “They jumped through the hoops that they did to put in Lindsey Halligan illegally to do this, because no other prosecutor in their right mind...would ever bring a case like this.”
• Jacob Weisberg [12:11]:
  “If a president did this in a sane political world...it would be, I believe, an impeachable offense...they are committing, I believe, this strong evidence, impeachable offenses...We know the Comey case, this case, firing Comey’s daughter because of her last name.”

Memorable Moments

• Comparison to Bush-era scandals:
  “Do you remember the US attorney scandal under George W. Bush? ...How quaint that seems compared to this.” — Tara Settmeier [14:00]
• Repeated use of illegally appointed prosecutors; judges and career attorneys pushing back.

Timestamps

• 00:50 Intro to the scandal
• 04:48 Mimi Roka’s analysis
• 07:57 Tara on the political nature and DOJ’s persistence
• 12:11 Jacob discusses impeachable offenses and normalization

2. DOJ and Administrative Lawlessness

(24:35 – 34:29)

Key Points

• DOJ persists in using ousted, unauthorized attorneys to sign indictments, defying court rulings.
• Chaos reigns within offices as career prosecutors try to maintain integrity.
• Experts note we're beyond “normal” crisis, into systemic disregard for the law.

Notable Quotes

• Mimi Roka [21:47]:
  “If they’re telling people, they’re not only ignoring [a court ruling], they’re trying to instruct subordinates to ignore it, which to me is the worst form of misconduct.”

3. Public Forum Doctrine Sidebar

(30:10 – 34:29)

A concise legal explainer by Mary Carr on First Amendment "public forum" doctrine, its history, and modern-day application (including to government social media accounts).

4. The Strike on the Drug Boat – War Crime Allegations

(34:48 – 41:34)

Key Points

• U.S. Forces struck an alleged drug boat, then killed survivors in the water. Admiral Bradley, who ordered the strike, claims independent action, not direct orders.
• Military command shakeups suggest internal dissent; Admiral Halsey’s abrupt resignation raises questions.
• This echoes “torture memo” legal justifications post-9/11; lack of any real legal basis for the strike or the killings.

Notable Quotes

• Jacob Weisberg [26:23]:
  "As war crimes go, this is sort of a hat on a hat, right? ... Shooting the wounded. We haven’t seen the video. We know exactly what it looks like.”
• Tara Settmeier [28:00]:
  “For [Admiral Halsey] to step aside once these strikes started and give up a 37-year career and abruptly retire...there were anonymous reports...that it’s because he had issues with the orders for these strikes and that Hegseth was pressuring him, you either go along with it or retire.”
• Mimi Roka [36:08]:
  “John Yoo’s assessment of that was it would clearly be...a war crime. ... He would still defend those [torture memos] today, I think, but he could not find a way to defend this.”

Memorable Moments

• CNN sources inside the military called the rationale for the second strike “effing insane.” [38:46]
• 41 minutes of debate before deciding to order the second strike [39:27].

Timestamps

• 26:23 Jacob on illegality and internal dissent
• 28:00 Tara on Admiral Halsey's resignation
• 36:08 Mimi on conservative legal opinions labeling it a crime

5. Pete Hegseth & Loyalty Over Competence

(41:34 – 46:57)

Key Points

• Hegseth, the Defense Secretary, faces harsh IG criticism (secondary “Signal” app security breaches) but is protected due to his loyalty.
• Debate on whether Trump would dump him if he becomes an outright liability; loyalty trumps all other qualities in current appointments.

Notable Quotes

• Jacob Weisberg [40:49]:
  “He’s a train wreck... Trump’s cabinet sort of divides into the merely unqualified and incompetent on the one hand, and then, you know, the just like laughable and dangerous. ... If I had to predict... Hegseth will be one of the first... to go.”
• Tara Settmeier [41:34]:
  “The only way Pete Hegseth goes is if more Republicans come out and say he's got to go. That's the only way.”

6. Trump’s Escalating Xenophobia and Immigration Scandal

(48:42 – 55:20)

Key Points

• In response to a shooting, green card applications from 19 countries are paused; enforcement surges launched targeting Somali Americans, among others.
• Trump’s language is openly and explicitly racist, with no internal pushback.
• The administration treats blood-on-hands deportations as routine; collective guilt is invoked in Nazi-like fashion.

Notable Quotes

• Jacob Weisberg [49:41]:
  “Grotesque expression of racism and demeaning people and, and behind it this idea of collective guilt, which is, you know, forgive me, a Nazi idea.”
• Tara Settmeier [51:53]:
  “The absolute craven cowardice of the...people who know better, not saying anything, allowing this, and not only allowing it, but collaborating with him on it. It’s gotten beyond enabling. It’s collaboration at this point. These people have completely sold their souls.”

Memorable Moments

• Mockery of Cabinet’s boot-licking:
  “Kiss my ass while I’m sleeping...” — Jacob Weisberg [54:23]

Final Segment: "Five Words or Fewer"

(55:20 – End)

Panelists, with gallows humor, imagine what else Trump loyalist Cash Patel might demand of government agents for personal service, crystallizing the sense of shameless abuse of power now everyday in D.C.

• Tara: “Polish his kid size boots.” [55:59]
• Jacob: “Take down my dry cleaning.” [56:10]
• Mimi: “Get a tight fitting raid jacket.” [56:14]
• Harry: “Carry olives for his martinis.” [56:19]

Thematic Takeaways

• The Trump administration, in its second term, is even more unmoored from tradition, legality, or restraint.
• Abuse of power—from indictment-shopping to war crimes to racist policy—has become systemic and normalized.
• Career staff, internal norms, and legal traditions are under siege, but some remain quietly resistant.
• Cabinet and Congress—especially on the GOP side—are now characterized more by collaboration and loyalist culture than actual governance or oversight.
• Dark humor is sometimes necessary to process the absurdity and tragedy of ongoing “bizarro world” governance.

Listen for These Notable Moments

• [04:48] – Mimi Roka on the rarity of a grand jury rejecting an indictment
• [12:11] – Jacob Weisberg calls Trump’s DOJ behavior “impeachable offenses”
• [14:00] – Tara Settmeier on how “quaint” prior Republican scandals seem
• [21:47] – Mimi Roka on subordinates being told to ignore court orders
• [28:00] – Tara discusses the high personal cost to Admiral Halsey
• [36:08] – John Yoo, architect of torture memos, calls the strikes a war crime
• [41:34] – The panel speculates on the endurance of Trump’s loyalty-first crew
• [49:41] – Jacob Weisberg on collective guilt and outright racism
• [55:59] – Panelists’ “Five Words or Fewer” segment skewers government sycophancy

Language & Tone:
Frank, irreverent, and deeply concerned, the panel pulls no punches about threats to law, tradition, and the very premise of democracy.

This summary delivers an in-depth picture of the episode’s substance, helping both regular listeners and newcomers understand how unprecedented—and worrisome—even the week-to-week operations of the Trump administration have become, as explained by top legal and political minds.