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- [00:00]
Isaac Saul
Hey prime members, are you tired of ads interfering with your favorite podcasts? Good news, with Amazon Music, you have access to the largest catalog of ad free top podcasts included with your prime membership. To start listening, download the Amazon Music app for free or go to Amazon.com ad free podcasts. That's Amazon.com ad freepodcasts to catch up on the latest episodes without the ads.
- [00:27]
Will K. Back
To get people excited about Boost Mobile's new nationwide 5G network, we're offering unlimited talk, text and data for $25 a month.
- [00:34]
Ari Weitzman
Forever.
- [00:35]
Isaac Saul
Even if you have a baby.
- [00:35]
Ari Weitzman
Even if your baby has a baby.
- [00:37]
Isaac Saul
Even if you grow old and wrinkly.
- [00:38]
Will K. Back
And you start repeating yourself, even if.
- [00:40]
Ari Weitzman
You start repeating yourself, even if you're.
- [00:42]
Will K. Back
On your deathbed and you need to make one last call or text, right? Or text the long lost son you abandoned at birth, you'll still get unlimited.
- [00:48]
Ari Weitzman
Talk, text and Data for just $25 a month.
- [00:50]
Will K. Back
With Boost Mobile Forever, after 30 gigabytes.
- [00:52]
Isaac Saul
Customers may experience slower speeds.
- [00:54]
Will K. Back
Customers will pay $25 a month as long as they remain active on the Boost Unlimited plan forever.
- [00:57]
Ari Weitzman
Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile.
- [00:59]
Will K. Back
I don't know if you knew this.
- [01:00]
Ari Weitzman
But anyone can get the same Premium.
- [01:02]
Isaac Saul
Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying.
- [01:06]
Will K. Back
It's not just for celebrities.
- [01:07]
Isaac Saul
So do like I did and have.
- [01:09]
Ari Weitzman
One of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to do@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3.
- [01:19]
Will K. Back
Month plan equivalent to $15 per month Required intro rate first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full terms@mintmobile.com.
- [01:30]
Ari Weitzman
Coming up, will K. Back joins us and we are talking about all the craziness and the numerous stories we have missed. I can't even read them all off here. There's dozens of them that we didn't get to cover this week. The fact that Trump's complying with court orders, nobody seems to care. I give some tip of the hats to Grok and Starlink and my dear friend Elon Musk. And then we play a game where I try to remember things that happened a year ago and I actually do better than I would have expected. Plus some grievances. It's a good one.
- [02:03]
Isaac Saul
From executive producer Isaac Saul. This is Tangle.
- [02:18]
Ari Weitzman
Good morning, good afternoon and good evening and welcome to the Tangle Podcast, a place where you get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking and a little bit of my take. I'M your host, Isaac Saul, and joined today by Will Kbach, our senior editor here at Tangle. Ari Weitzman, our managing editor. I actually don't know if he shared where he's going publicly, so maybe I won't be the one to say. He's in the. He's in the air. He's on a very long flight, we'll say right now.
- [02:46]
Will K. Back
Although I did hear that a judge asked the plane to turn around to bring him back. So we'll see if pilot complies.
- [02:53]
Ari Weitzman
Come on, Will. Too much. Too much.
- [02:57]
Will K. Back
Bring Ari back.
- [02:59]
Ari Weitzman
Yeah, man. God, I don't even know where to begin. So, before we. Before we got on the podcast today, I sent Will a Slack message earlier, and I was just like, I really want to capture how much is happening right now. And I know it's sort of cliche to just say Trump's flooding the zone or there's so much news or whatever, it's hard to really know, like, what the dynamic is, whether it's he and the administration are just doing so much more or that reporters across the country are doing a better job covering all this stuff that's happening, or that people are so locked in because Trump is such a divisive, evocative figure that everybody's just paying attention. And now it's easier to find all these stories, but it feels like there's more happening. I don't know if you have a view on that. Before I get into this list, I guess I'm curious how to maybe frame it properly, because I really don't know.
- [04:03]
Will K. Back
Yeah, I think, like most things with Trump, it's like a combination of everything that you just said. I also think we just came from an administration where it kind of felt like they were playing prevent defense for four years and throttling the amount of news coming out of the White House on purpose, deliberately. And we now have the polar opposite of that. So I think that's made it especially jarring. But there is just objectively so much happening in the news across the government, I don't think that that sentence is off at all. Just because it's Trump.
- [04:38]
Ari Weitzman
Yeah, it's totally bonkers. So in the event that you haven't actually listened to this podcast before, or if you have, I think it's worth clarifying what I'm about to do here. I'm just going to share a list of stories that have gotten zero or close to zero mention in the newsletter or the podcast over the last week or so. And these are stories to be clear again that we haven't covered in the quick hit section. We haven't shared as an under the radar story. They haven't been the main topic. Just no appearance, no mention in the newsletter. These things have all happened just to kind of illustrate how much is going on, though maybe one or two of them we've linked out to or referenced to offhandedly in a take or something like that. Broadly speaking, I think none of these have made it into the newsletter. So here's the list that Will and I composed mostly Will, though I added one or two after he was done up. First, the Pentagon is considering a major reorganization of its command structure. That's going to halt modernization plans for the US Forces Japan and relinquishes America's longtime role as NATO Supreme Allied Commander. This is whatever. We'll get back to a couple of these. Second, dozens of Social Security offices across the country are closing thanks to actions taken by Dogecoin. Third, President Trump gave a speech at the Justice Department on Friday promising to expose his perceived enemies. He accused several media outlets of illegal behavior. He declared himself the country's chief law enforcement officer. A jury found Greenpeace liable for actions taken during protests against the Dakota Access pipeline. It said it should pay pipeline company Energy transfer more than $650 million in damages. The value of X has increased in recent months, now valued at $44 billion, which is about the amount Musk paid to buy the platform. Ben and Jerry said this week that its parent company, Unilever, illegally ousted the ice creamery's chief executive because of his support for the company's progressive stances. More than 30 countries express willingness to contribute troops to a peacekeeping mission in Ukraine if a peace deal is reached between Russia and Ukraine. A federal judge said that the government may have willfully disobeyed a court order after US Immigration officials deported Russia Alawiya. I probably mispronouncing that last name.
- [07:07]
Will K. Back
I think that was pretty good, actually.
- [07:08]
Ari Weitzman
Okay, thank you. A Lebanese citizen and member of Brown University's medical school faculty who had a valid visa to remain in the country. That's a different deportation story than the one we covered already. Just to be clear, in a sworn declaration filed in court, an immigration attorney and this I saw just before we got on the show, alleged that the Trump administration deported a soccer player who had escaped the Maduro regime and had been tortured by the Maduro regime. He filed under the CB1 act, the CBP1 act, to come to the United States, sought asylum legally here, had no criminal record, and he was sent to a prison in El Salvador. This filing was made under oath by an immigration lawyer. Adam Bowler, a health care investor and White House official during President Trump's first term, had to withdraw his nomination to serve as a special presidential envoy for hostage affairs after he received criticism for conducting direct negotiations with the representatives of Hamas. At Trump's request, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the CDC published data showing that the U.S. recorded more than 300 cases of measles in the first three months of 2025, surpassing last year's 12 month total of 285 cases. Canada is reconsidering its plan to spend billions of dollars on American made F35 jets in response to Trump's tariffs. A fire that broke out during a live concert in an overcrowded nightclub in North Macedonia killed 59 people and injured another 155. Harvard expanded its financial aid program and to make the university tuition free for families making less than $200,000 a year. Alphabet you might know them as Google announced a deal to buy the fast growing cybersecurity startup Wiz for 32 billion with a B dollars, its biggest deal ever. Chinese EV maker BYD unveiled new charging platforms it says can power a car to travel 400 kilometers. That's 249 miles after just a five minute charge. That would make it far superior to Tesla and some other electric vehicles we know about. Starlink Elon Musk satellite Internet service was reportedly installed at the White House. The number of migrants trying to travel through the Darien Gap to get from Colombia into Panama and eventually the United States has fallen so dramatically in the recent months that it's now at its lowest level since the pandemic. Russia continued bombing Ukraine shortly after a ceasefire. We somehow just didn't talk about that Putin Trump ceasefire deal. And then that night, literally Russia started bombing residential Ukraine again. Doge forced its way into the US Institute of Peace building after a prolonged back and forth with security and police. A judge then denied a request to pause the takeover. We've seen tons of stories about Democrats and Republicans at these town hall meetings just getting completely eviscerated by attendees. Republicans for a lot of the Doge Elon stuff, Democrats for not tanking the CR that they just helped Senate Republicans pass. The Republican in Minnesota, Will's home state. Tough look for Will, who introduced the Trump Derangement syndrome bill, was arrested for soliciting a minor. He's a Minnesota state senator who got some notoriety for that Trump Derangement syndrome bill and now is in the news once again for very bad reasons. Again, every story that I just listed is one that in our five newsletters with 2025 stories apiece at the top, plus the under the radar section, plus the main story we're covering, plus my take where I reference all sorts of stuff happening in the news we just didn't get to cover or mention. I mean literally mention, I don't know, any of these stick out to you as particularly interest foreign. We'll be right back after this quick break.
- [11:00]
Isaac Saul
Hey prime members, are you tired of ads interfering with your favorite podcasts? Good news. With Amazon Music you have access to the largest catalog of ad free top podcasts included with your prime membership. To start listening, download the Amazon Music app for free or go to Amazon.com/ad free podcasts. That's Amazon.com/ad free podcasts to catch up on the latest episodes without the ads.
- [11:27]
Ari Weitzman
It's a cold day here in Alaska, but there's one animal seemingly unaffected, bright eyed and determined enters the husky. Observe as they go up the mountain, guided by pure instinct. They are truly amazing masters of this wilderness. But even these amazing pets can't sign up for Lemonade Pet Insurance. You can sign up now@lemonade.com Amazing.
- [12:05]
Will K. Back
That was like a monologue. That was something else. I mean, it's a remarkable list. I mean, we'll talk a little bit about the Trump and the courts and the legal system stuff in a bit. But I do think the speech at the Justice Department just seemed pretty unusual even by his standards. I mean, I watched excerpts of it and yeah, it was kind of a highlight reel of grievances that he talked a lot about in the campaign, but takes on a different tone when he's doing it as president at the Justice Department headquarters. I quietly think the Canada F35 story is a pretty big deal. I think that's like one of those things where that would be a lot of money on a contract lost out on. I mean, I'm not saying it's going to move the bottom line necessarily, but we're talking about like tangible repercussions for this tariffs ordeal if more stuff like that starts to happen. There's been some rumblings about similar kind of contracts being canceled from the eu. I could see that kind of spiraling a little bit out of control or at least just like laying the terms of these tariffs in a more stark reality. And then I mean, the Social Security offices. That was when you flagged to me right before this and I was just reading about it. And again, you talk about tangible effects. Like, there's been a lot of questions about, you know, will these DOGE cuts, will these DOGE actions actually take effect? They're being challenged in courts. But will when offices start closing and offices that provide vital services start closing all around the country, like, you know, we're in that now. I think that that's a big one. And then, yeah, I think, you know, the Ben and Jerry story will probably be our main story on Monday, so I'll save discussion on that. But, yeah, I think those are the ones that stick out to me.
- [13:48]
Ari Weitzman
Yeah, I mean, the. I would say the, the one that sort of offends my sensibilities the most is probably either Trump's speech at the Justice Department, which, you know, just overtly political, and in some ways I don't think it matters, or I have a hard time supporting the assertion that it matters because he says all this stuff every day anyway. And so it's like, who cares if he's just repeating it at the Justice Department? And I get that, like, there's a general scorn for norms and, you know, you know, people are just, oh, you're pearl clutching, whatever. I kind of think it matters. I have a hard time articulating exactly why, but, like, I don't love the president at the independent Justice Department, just talking about all the people that he's gonna get revenge on and wants to lock up, et cetera, et cetera. It's. At the very least, it's a really scary prospect in terms of the signals he's sending about how he views his power and who he thinks works for him and what he thinks their job is in this case, you know, our law enforcement, arms, and that their job is to go find his political enemies and make them pay. So that's pretty scary. And then the, I mean, the one that just like the, the, the one that makes me sort of enraged, I guess, is the story about this Venezuelan soccer player who got deported, which we saw. I saw just before we came on the show.
- [15:27]
Will K. Back
Yeah, I haven't seen that.
- [15:29]
Ari Weitzman
Yeah, it's, you know, of course, we're assuming that this filing is. It appears totally genuine. I mean, I had five minutes to read about it before we hopped on. But, like, this is why you don't do what they're doing. This is why you have due process, is because you don't want to send an innocent Venezuelan who came here, by the way, legally, if this is true, through the CBP1 app that the Biden administration created. And you can blame the Biden administration for doing that. But this person saw a pathway to come here with temporary status through a legal channel used it was here, has no criminal record, and then gets arrested and deported and sent to this insane prison in El Salvador when he's not a criminal, he's a professional soccer player who fled Venezuela, as far as I can tell. You know, it's just. It's just like we have laws and rules for how to do these things for a reason, and this is why we have immigration courts to adjudicate this stuff, so people like this don't end up being sent back close to the place they just fled, or in this case, also in a totally random country that they don't live in and have no affiliation with and are now in prison there with probably very limited recourse on how to get out. It's insane. I mean, it's totally insane.
- [16:59]
Will K. Back
Yeah. As we were covering this story, a lot of what we were talking about is that even if every single person who's deported on these flights was a gang member, was a criminal, like was alleged, there's still obviously the due process problems. There's. There's the problems with potentially defying the judge's order. But if it turns out that the Trump administration didn't do its due diligence in who it put on these planes and who it deported, the story just takes on another level of. Of alarm, and it seems like that's what's happening now as we learn more about who these people were.
- [17:33]
Ari Weitzman
Yeah, and I want to. Again, I did not have as much time as I should have to verify all this stuff, because this was kind of just coming out as we came on. But one of the things that I said in the initial piece that we did about this deportation effort was that ISIS has claimed that they were using these sort of traditional investigative methods, bank statements, victim statements. They, you know, were looking into these people they arrested and deported and had proof that they were members of the TDA gang. And it appears that this particular person was deported over a tattoo. Again, these are some of the allegations that I just saw. I think that the lawyers making some of the stuff we're seeing on social media, I haven't had enough time to verify them, but at first glance, it looks a lot like the kind of story I referenced, which was a lot like the kind of situation I referenced, which was, I really hope that they're not just doing this based off something as flimsy as social media posts. Tattoos fall into that category. You know, seeing somebody and seeing a tattoo, they have and presuming that it's some sort of gang tattoo, gang affiliation, because it looks like something somebody else is having and then getting them deported is a really bad way to do business. So, yeah, I find that incredibly concerning. I also, um, I guess the, the only other one that feels worth reiterating is Russia. Just, I mean, just literally, Putin just keeps bombing Ukraine hours after this ceasefire on the energy infrastructure. And the reporting out of Ukraine is like, they're just, just nothing changed. And I don't know, it's crazy. I mean, it's just like, isn't Trump embarrassed? Like, if, if another country did this, wouldn't he be like, if Ukraine did this, he would be infuriated. I just don't understand how it's not a bigger story and how little people seem to care that they just completely flaunted this thing that was celebrated for like a full news cycle.
- [19:46]
Will K. Back
Yeah, I mean, I have seen him taking some flack for the outcome of the call with Putin. I saw National Reviews, editors had a piece and I think the Wall Street Journal editorial board as well, that essentially said that Putin played him and that Trump went into that call expecting Putin to commit to the 30 day ceasefire that Ukraine had committed to. Instead, we have this kind of energy infrastructure ceasefire that's contingent on Ukraine's agreement. No further discussions on a full ceasefire. So I think he's getting some flack from the side you would expect. But I mean, yeah, there's not a consistent standard here. I mean, that's also just been apparent since what happened in the Oval Office two weeks ago. So to me, it's a continuation of that. I don't know where we're going to go. I don't exactly know how you save face if you ultimately fail to get a deal of any kind if you're Trump. But, you know, in my mind, I'm sure he just is trying to keep whatever tenuous path that he thinks he has open by not hitting Russia harder for this. But it's not in his nature. You know, he's not, he's not going to go out and criticize Putin the way that he does other countries.
- [20:57]
Ari Weitzman
Yeah. And I don't, you know, I, I don't think, like many people do, that this is some. Trump's a Russia agent, Putin, flacky, whatever it is, Putin lackey. The real thing is that is that Trump operates in a very specific and obvious way, which is that people who flatter him and treat him well, he treats them well publicly. It is the most, I would say, Aside from his anti immigrant sentiment or draconian immigration policies, whatever you want to call them, his belief that he wants to limit legal and illegal immigration, and his belief in tariffs as a powerful economic tool, the most consistent, tried, and true thing about Trump is that if somebody is nice to him, he will be nice to them. And it doesn't matter who it is. I mean, we saw it with Kim Jong Un, we see it with Putin, we see it with leaders in Saudi Arabia, even Frank, even Macron. I mean, he came here and he's just like, knows exactly what to do. You come in, you kiss the ring, you make a couple of jokes, you slap him on the back and then he leaves. Trump's trashing Europe, doing all this stuff, and all of a sudden just adding an asterisk around France and how great they are and how awesome Macron is. I mean, it's like, it is not that hard to figure the guy out. And, yeah, I mean, if I were a foreign leader, I would be like, this is delicious. I mean, it's so simple. Just.
- [22:27]
Will K. Back
Yeah.
- [22:28]
Ari Weitzman
And I don't know that that's, you know, if you're Trump, we could laugh at that and scoff at and mock him for it. It's not the worst strategy to just be transparently transactional like that. Like, you know, I. If you're, if you're good to me, I'll be good to you, and if you're not, I'm gonna make your life hell. It makes things simple for sure. But it's funny. I mean, it's definitely something funny about it. Cause then you get these weird situations where, you know, Trudeau refuses to bend the knee and now Canada is our enemy, and Putin just says nice things about him and the Trump administration and, and he gets whatever he wants. I mean, it's crazy.
- [23:05]
Will K. Back
Yeah. I don't know if you saw the video of when the UK Prime Minister, Keir Starmer visited the White House. This was just before the Zelensky blow up. And he literally.
- [23:14]
Ari Weitzman
That's good, too.
- [23:16]
Will K. Back
I mean, I think he was better than Macron. Like, he came with a letter from the King, signed by the King, inviting Trump for official visit. And you can see Trump's face light up when he produces it, like in a very theatrical manner before they get into the press conference that they're having. And Trump is like, oh, what's this? Oh, what's this? And he reads it, he's like, oh, it's signed by the King. Oh, my goodness, this is such a great honor. And you can just see. And that sets the rest of the meeting on such a positive footing. And it got the outcome that I think the UK and Europe probably would have wanted. Again, I don't think that's inherently bad, especially if that means that it's easy to maintain alliances with the people who we want to maintain alliances with. But yeah, I mean, but again, it just means like everything's on the table, right? It means that anything that's happened in the past doesn't really matter. It's what are you going to do for me right now?
- [24:06]
Ari Weitzman
So, yeah, yeah, definitely. We'll be right back after this quick break. Hey, it's Marc Maron from WTF here to let you know that this podcast is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. And I'm sure the reason you're listening to this podcast right now is because you chose it well. Choose progressives. Name your price tool and you could find insurance options that fit your budget. So you can pick the best one for your situation. Who doesn't like choice? Try it@progressive.com and now some legal info. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates price and coverage match limited by state law, not available in all states.
- [24:57]
Isaac Saul
Hey, prime members, are you tired of ads interfering with your favorite podcasts? Good news. With Amazon Music, you have access to the largest catalog of ad free top podcasts included with your prime membership. To start listening, download the Amazon Music app for free or go to Amazon.com ADFreePodcasts that's Amazon.com ADFreeP Podcasts to catch up on the latest episodes without the ads.
- [25:32]
Ari Weitzman
I guess to put a little bow on this and transition to the next thing that I really want to talk about. There's a few other stories that we didn't share as quick hits and we didn't cover as main stories. I did reference a couple of them in one of my takes this week, but they feel important to talk about here, which is these reversals, these court orders, basically reversing a lot of what's been happening, a lot of the executive action that the Trump administration has been taking. Elon Musk gets ordered to reinstate USAID workers, 24,000 of them, give or take. Trump has to disclose when and where these flights left with the alleged gang members. There's a reinstatement of transgender troops in the military, which impacts some 4,000 troops in the US military or 4,000 members, service members. And then there's a reinstatement of Department of Education grants. And I think there was one other big one that I'm forgetting off the top of my head. But there was another, I saw another judge Orders XYZ thing that I hadn't seen yet just last night or this morning.
- [26:44]
Will K. Back
Okay. Yeah.
- [26:45]
Ari Weitzman
And I want to, I want to talk about this for a couple reasons. First of all, I think it's important to call out that, you know, there's a good deal of the Trump administration's quote unquote victories so far that are being undone rather quickly by the court system. And that if all he is going to rely on is sort of this executive action and executive overreach and testing the boundaries of his power, they're not going to have a whole ton to show for it. I'm seeing stuff now. Tim Wall, some other Democrats have been saying this is an opportunity when we get back in power to rebuild these federal agencies that they're tearing down, sort of working under the presumption that all of this is going to work. I'm not totally convinced. I'm sure they're going to have a big impact, but we'll see, I guess. Which is just to say, I wouldn't presume that a lot of the stuff we've occupied our minds with the last two months are going to be the things that we remember about the Trump administration in five years. And the second thing that also feels worth talking about because one of the number one questions I get from liberals who listen to this podcast or read our newsletter.
- [28:08]
John Wall
Hey everybody, this is John, executive producer of YouTube and podcast content and co host of the daily Podcast. I hope you enjoyed this preview of our Sunday podcast with Ari and Isaac. We are now offering this podcast exclusively to our premium podcast members along with our ad, free daily podcast, Friday editions, in depth interviews, upcoming new podcast series, bonus content, and much more. If you want to receive all that and give your support to help grow Tangle Media, Please go to readtangle.com where you can sign up for a newsletter membership, a podcast membership or a discounted bundle membership which gets you both access to the premium newsletter and the premium podcast. If it's not the right time for you to sign up, please don't worry. Our ad supported daily podcast isn't going anywhere, but if it is in your ability to support by signing up for a membership, we would greatly appreciate it and we're really excited to share all of our premium offerings with you. We'll be right back here tomorrow. For Isaac and the rest of the crew, this is John Law signing off. Have a great day, y'all.
- [29:12]
Will K. Back
Take care. Bye all.
- [29:16]
Ari Weitzman
Our podcast is written by me, Isaac Saul, and edited and engineered by John Wall. The script is edited by our managing editor, Ari Weitzman, Will K. Back, Bailey Saul and Sean Brady. The logo for our podcast was designed by Magdalena Bova, who is also our social media manager. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet75. If you're looking for more from Tangle, Please go to readtangle.com and check out our website.
- [29:56]
Isaac Saul
Wait, what is that sound? What are you chewing on? My socks?
- [30:01]
Ari Weitzman
The furniture? Not my new sneakers again.
- [30:07]
Will K. Back
Dogs love to chew, but not everything they chew is good for them. That's why Earth Animal created no High Chews, the safe, natural alternative to rawhide or whatever else they shouldn't be chewing. Made with simple, sustainable ingredients and flavors dogs love, they're irresistibly good for them and your peace of mind. Give your dog something better to chew. Get no Hide chews today@earthanimal.com Overwhelmed by the onslaught of the Trump administration, wondering what progressives can do to mobilize?
- [30:39]
Ari Weitzman
We've got answers.
- [30:41]
John Wall
The 10 is a weekly show from.
- [30:42]
Will K. Back
The center for American Progress Action Fund that keeps you up to date on.
- [30:45]
John Wall
Politics, policy and progress.
- [30:47]
Will K. Back
It's co hosted by me, Colin Seaberger.
- [30:49]
Isaac Saul
And me, Daniella Gibbs Leger.
- [30:51]
Ari Weitzman
Tune in for expert interviews, news updates and progressive wins and strategies.
- [30:56]
Will K. Back
If you want a weekly lifeline to.
- [30:57]
John Wall
Stay empowered, join us under the 10.
- [30:59]
Will K. Back
On YouTube, Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [31:04]
Isaac Saul
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