The House passes permanent daylight savings bill.

Summary

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Tangle Podcast Summary

Episode: The House Passes Permanent Daylight Savings Bill

Host: Isaac Saul
Date: July 16, 2026

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Overview

This episode of the Tangle podcast dives into the House's recent bipartisan passage of the Sunshine Protection Act, a bill that would make Daylight Saving Time (DST) permanent in the United States. The hosts break down the political, scientific, and social arguments for and against the change, draw on the history of DST—including the failed experiment in the 1970s—and share personal perspectives on what it would mean for Americans. The episode also addresses listener responses to a recent controversial dissent and provides context about time changes in the U.S.

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Key Segments

[02:08] Episode Introduction by Audrey Moorhead

• Audrey Moorhead introduces the DST topic, notes the bill’s bipartisan passage in the House, its uncertain fate in the Senate, and briefly describes upcoming segments including criticisms and historical context on past DST efforts.

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[05:31] DST Bill Highlights

The Bill and Its Passage ([05:41])

• John Law recaps that on Tuesday, the House passed the Sunshine Protection Act of 2025 by a vote of 308–117, with strong bipartisan support (114 Democrats, 193 Republicans, 1 Independent).
• President Trump endorsed the bill:
  "It’s time that people can stop worrying about the clock, not to mention all the work and money that is spent on this ridiculous twice yearly production." (paraphrased, [05:52])
• DST would become permanent in the U.S., except for states that opt out prior to enactment. Currently, Hawaii, much of Arizona, and several territories do not observe DST.

The Arguments

• Proponents: Claim biannual clock changes are antiquated and disruptive. Late evening daylight is touted as a benefit for daily life and business.
  • Representative Vern Buchanan (R–FL): “Ending the clock change is a common sense reform that will improve everyday life for millions of Americans.” ([06:40])
• Opponents: Cite safety concerns, especially for children and morning workers who would face darker mornings in winter.
  • Senator Tom Cotton (R–AR): “Observing DST year round would push winter sunrises to an absurdly late hour, depriving Americans of morning sunshine that’s essential for our safety and well-being.” ([07:19])
  • Some, like Rep. Mary Gay Scanlon (D–PA), urge following scientific evidence and prioritizing health by keeping Standard Time year-round.

The Context

• Only about 40% of countries use DST.
• Studies are mixed: Clock changes can disrupt sleep, increase heart attacks and accidents, but also reduce some crimes and improve mental health.
• The bill notably results from strong support by Florida’s congressional delegation, citing tourism benefits.

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[11:15] What the Left Is Saying

Points of View

• Mixed Feelings: Many on the left are skeptical of permanent DST.
  • Aaron Blake (CNN): DST's history shows it doesn’t correct the underlying problems (energy savings minimal), but introduces new issues: unsynchronized clocks with Europe, dangerous dark mornings for children, religious challenges, and lack of farmer support ([12:12]).
    • Quote, paraphrased: “The biggest downside... meant putting children at the bus stop in the cold and dark, which some feared was deadly.”
  • Sen. Tom Cotton, quoted by Blake: “Not every human problem has a legislative solution.”
• The Economist: Argues DST should be abolished entirely due to disruption—biological clocks, health, and productivity suffer ([13:21]).
  • Quote: “Humans have evolved over millennia to be in sync with the sun. Light regulates human rhythms... Daylight Saving Time takes people further away from the natural cycle.”
• John Lovett (Washington Post): Advocates letting states choose; a one-size-fits-all solution doesn’t account for U.S. geographic diversity ([14:22]).
  • Quote: “This is why a national mandate of permanent Daylight Saving Time isn’t the answer...All Congress has to do is revise this law to provide for this third option. That’s it. Everybody wins.”

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[15:45] What the Right Is Saying

Perspectives

• Main Critique: Many on the right argue for permanent Standard Time or abolishing clock changes, citing health and circadian science.
  • Jennifer Gilardi (Daily Signal): The origin and recent extensions of DST were “driven by targeted lobbying,” not evidence or grassroots health concerns ([16:05]).
    • Quote: “Public policy should reflect the natural order, not be manipulated for profit.”
  • Michael Brendan Dougherty (National Review): Criticizes Congressional overreach and the idea of legislating the sun.
    • Quote: “The best argument will be used in the wrong direction... There is a documented increase in motor accidents and other problems caused by law-driven shift in timekeeping. This is a great argument for not changing the clocks twice a year, but it’s not an argument for permanent daylight saving” ([16:51]).
  • Jeff Corayer (Town Hall): Calls for ending “pointless” clock changes but recommends Standard Time year round ([17:34]).

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[18:19] Audrey Moorhead’s Take

Personal Reflection and Position

• Audrey shares the evolution of her thoughts—initial confusion as a child, growing acceptance with technology auto-updating the time, but renewed concern as Congress moves towards permanent DST.
• She notes broad U.S. support for ending clock changes but a split between permanent DST and Standard Time.
  • Interesting Data: “A February YouGov poll found that 64% of U.S. adult citizens want to end the biannual time change...43% of Americans want permanent DST and 28% want permanent standard time.” ([18:46])
• Her Argument Against Permanent DST:
  • While late evening sunlight has clear summer benefits, permanent DST in winter creates “obvious safety concerns for kids and adults alike. Traffic accidents are more likely in darkness, and those risks are compounded by cold and ice.” ([19:40])
  • She references history: The 1974 attempt at permanent DST was quickly abandoned after public backlash over late sunrises during winter ([20:25]).
  • Scientific consensus notes that DST disrupts circadian rhythms, with associated physical and mental health harms; experts lean towards permanent Standard Time or sticking with clock changes ([20:56]).
  • Claims of energy savings are minimal.
• On Federal vs State Approach:
  • Like John Lovett, Audrey argues that Congress should let states decide, referencing the federalist nature of U.S. governance: “There’s no reason North Dakotans should deal with 9am sunrises during daylight savings just so that Floridians can have later evening sun” ([22:10]).
  • Proposes that Congress revise laws to let states pick either Standard or DST permanently.
  • Final position: Hopes the Sunshine Protection Act fails in the Senate, and prefers to “keep falling back and springing forward, at least for now.” ([23:24])

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[27:31] Addressing Listener Criticism

Background ([25:49])

• Isaac Saul addresses listener backlash over Audrey’s dissent in a previous episode:
  "Some of the responses, though, were gross attacks on Audrey for being too young, too white, too privileged, too Christian, or the wrong sex... The ratio of good faith arguments to ugly personal attacks was discouraging."
• He sets up Audrey’s response.

Audrey’s Response ([27:31])

• Clarifies her intent on dissenting regarding ICE-related killings: She condemns the use of deadly force except in the most dangerous situations, supports investigations, and sympathizes with victims’ families.
• Explains her own behavioral response in high-risk situations as grounded in lived experience and as aligned with ACLU and National Immigration Law Center advice: Stay calm, don’t run or resist, and prepare for legal proceedings.
  • Quote: “Failing to react in the expert recommended manner is not the same as culpability for what happens to you. Obviously, in the heat of the moment, people can react very differently, which was both the point of Isaac’s hypothetical and the point of my dissenting response.” ([28:50])
• Acknowledges these responses do not guarantee safety but may increase chances of survival, and that compliance with injustice is not an endorsement of it.

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[30:23] Historical Context: 1970s DST Experiment

• John Law explains the U.S. history of time change:
  • In 1974, amid the oil crisis, the U.S. went to year-round DST for two years as a conservation experiment.
  • Initially popular, the policy quickly lost support as widespread winter darkness led to public complaints and safety issues—including children hit by cars.
  • The experiment was ended after only one winter ([30:55]).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Not every human problem has a legislative solution… Sometimes we have to live with an uneasy compromise between competing priorities and interests.” —Senator Tom Cotton (as quoted by Aaron Blake), [12:54]
• “Public policy should reflect the natural order, not manipulated for profit.” —Jennifer Gilardi (Daily Signal), [16:23]
• “Humans have evolved over millennia to be in sync with the sun. Light regulates human rhythms... Daylight Saving Time takes people further away from the natural cycle.” —The Economist, [13:35]
• “There's no reason North Dakotans should deal with 9am sunrises during daylight savings just so that Floridians can have later evening sun..." —Audrey Moorhead, [22:12]

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Episode Flow by Timestamp

| Timestamp | Segment/Event | |---------------|------------------------------------------------| | 02:08 | Introduction & rundown of today’s episode | | 03:44 | Quick political news hits | | 05:31–10:00 | DST bill coverage: Overview, arguments, history| | 11:15–18:19 | Left and right perspectives on permanent DST | | 18:19–24:35 | Audrey Moorhead’s personal analysis & position | | 25:49–30:23 | Listener criticism and Audrey’s response | | 30:23–31:25 | U.S. experiment with permanent DST in 1974 |

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Conclusion

This episode provides a comprehensive, nuanced look at the debate over making Daylight Saving Time permanent in the U.S.—touching on historical precedent, medico-scientific evidence, economic interests, federalist policy design, and personal experiences. Both politics and lived experience intersect in the analysis, reflecting Tangle’s mission to bring “views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking, and a little bit of our take.”

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For more detailed discussions and related content, listeners are encouraged to visit readtangle.com or check the episode show notes.

Transcript

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[Audrey Moorhead]

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[Isaac Saul]

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[Audrey Moorhead]

from executive producer Isaac Saul, this is Tangle. Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening. And welcome to the Tangle Podcast, a place where you get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking, and a little bit of our take. This is Associate Editor Audrey Moorhead and today I enjoyed the early light of the morning sun, which rose at 5:45am I love summer. Speaking of the morning sun, in today's podcast I'll be tackling the bill to make Daylight Savings permanent, which passed the House with bipartisan support and now heads to the Senate where it'll meet slightly more entrenched opposition. Then I'll respond to some criticism of my dissent from yesterday and we'll tell you more about what happened in the last attempt to pass year round DST in 1974. But first, this week on suspension of the rules, Isaac and Camille were joined by senior editor Will K. Back filling in for Ari, and they broke down the arguments for and against appointing family members to fill the seats of deceased lawmakers, a viral video of Nevada's governor and President Trump's latest election administration moves. Plus, we have an interview with epidemiologist Caitlin Jeddalina on the cyclospiriasis outbreak. You can check it out at the link in the show notes after you've gotten through today's podcast. With that, I'll pass it over to John for today's quick hits.

[John Law]

Thanks Audrey and welcome everybody. Here are your quick hits for today. First up, the Senate Judiciary Committee held a confirmation hearing for Acting Attorney General Todd Blanche, who is nominated to serve in the role permanently. Blanche defended some aspects of the Justice Department's recent settlement with President Donald Trump, while saying that the $1.8 billion anti weaponization fund initially created in the settlement has been scrapped. He also apologized to victims of convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein for mistakes made in document releases earlier this year. Separately, President Trump's nominee for Director of National Intelligence, Jay Clayton, testified before the Senate Intelligence Committee answering questions about election security and recently issued subpoenas to York Times journalists. Number two, House Republicans shared a framework for a $95 billion reconciliation package that includes funding for defense, food security programs and state level voter identification mandates. Separately, the House rejected a proposal to cut off U.S. aid to Israel in a 104 to 314 vote, with 10 other lawmakers voting present. 103 Democrats voted in favor of the measure. Three smoke and wildfires in Canada covered large portions of the Midwest and Northeast, prompting air qual advisories. Number four, wholesale prices as measured by the Producer price index declined 0.3% in June, lower than economists expectations. Prices rose 5.5% on an annual basis. And number five, President Trump will deliver a primetime address at 9:00pm Eastern tonight. The speech is expected to focus on election security and claims of fraud related to the 2020.

[Audrey Moorhead]

Tonight, is the sun finally setting on America's twice a year time changes, Daylight savings time can stay the possibility hitting a viral fever pitch.

[John Law]

Please, let's actually do it this time.

[Audrey Moorhead]

It comes after the House this week passed the Sunshine Protection act to make Daylight Saving Time, the time we're currently in that's observed from March until November permanent.

[John Law]

On Tuesday, The House voted 308 to 117 to pass the Sunshine Protection act of 2025, a bill that would make Daylight Savings Time permanent in the United States. The legislation passed with 114 Democrats, 193 Republicans and one independent in support, and now heads to the Senate. President Donald Trump has endorsed the bill, writing in May, it's time that people can stop worrying about the clock, not to mention all the work and money that is spent on this ridiculous twice yearly production. A note that While the technically correct term for DST is Daylight Saving Time, Tangle has opted to use the more colloquial Daylight Savings Time, a decision that we've explained with the link in today's Episode Description Roughly 40% of countries use DST, a period beginning in the spring when clocks are set forward one hour, offering more evening sunlight during the summer months. In the fall, DST ends and clocks are set back by one hour, reverting to Standard Time, leading to more sunlight in the morning but less in the evening. The utility of the practice is contested. Some studies have shown that the clock change disrupts the body's rhythms and can lead to negative effects like increased car accidents and heart attacks, while others have found that robberies decline and mental health improves when DST is observed. If enacted, the Sunshine Protection act would apply to all states except those that exempt themselves before the law takes effect. Currently, Hawaii and parts of Arizona do not observe dst, nor do Puerto Rico, Guam, American Samoa, the US Virgin Islands and the North Northern Mariana Islands. Florida's congressional delegation has been among the most vocal proponents of the legislation, arguing that the twice yearly clock changes are unnecessary and that more daylight in the evenings would benefit the country. Floridians and Americans across the country are tired of the biannual time change. Representative Vern Buchanan, the Republican from Florida, said ending the clock change is a common sense reform that will improve everyday life for millions of Americans. Other lawmakers oppose ending DST because it would extend morning darkness in the winter, potentially endangering schoolchildren and and impacting many early morning occupations. In October 2025, Senator Tom Cotton said observing DST year round would push winter sunrises to an absurdly late hour, depriving Americans of morning sunshine that's essential for our safety and well being. Some have proposed permanent Standard Time instead, which would offer more light in the mornings and align with humans circadian rhythms. If we're going to make a permanent change that affects every American. We should follow the science and prioritize Americans health, representative Mary Gay Scanlon, the Democrat from Pennsylvania, said today. We'll break down the DST debate with views from the left and the right, and then Associate Editor Audrey Moorhead will give her take.

[Isaac Saul]

We'll be right back after this quick break. Hey everyone, quick thought before we get started. If you listen to Tangle, it's probably because you're trying to escape the media echo chamber. But even when you read broadly, it's hard to see which stories are being emphasized and which ones are being ignored. This episode is brought to you by Ground News. Ground News is not a publisher. It's an app and website that gathers reporting on every news story from across the political spectrum and shows you each outlet's bias rating, factuality rating, and who owns it. It's more than just an aggregator. It gives you context on every perspective in one place so that you can make up your own mind. For example, a recent story about a bipartisan border deal collapsing was covered by 50 plus outlets. One left leaning headline read GOP sinks border deal under Trump Pressure, while a right leaning one said Democrats Block Stronger Border Enforcement. Same event, very different framing. Ground News lets you compare that instantly and even flags blind spots stories disproportionately covered by one side. If you want unlimited access to these features, subscribe to the vantage plan for 40% [e-mail] that's groundnews.com tn promo code tn again, groundnews.com tn code tn for 40% off if you care about seeing the full picture, I think you'll really value this tool.

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[John Law]

Alright, first up, let's start with what the left is saying. The left is mixed with some saying that permanent DST attempts to fix an unfixable problem. Others advocate for a permanent return to standard time. Still others suggest that states should choose for themselves. In cnn, Aaron Blake described the downside of making Daylight Saving Time permanent. The move to permanent DST in 1973 didn't actually save much energy, according to a later study from the Department of Transportation. But it did produce a series of other changes that it turned out were problematic, blake wrote. It put clocks out of sync with Europe, made religious rituals related to sunrises more difficult, and, contrary to popular opinion, wasn't popular with farmers. The biggest downside of adopting this permanently meant putting children at the bus stop in the cold and dark, which some feared was deadly. Too often, proposals to stop changing clocks are treated like a simple fix for an annoying thing, blake said. Senator Tom Cotton has warned his colleagues to learn the lessons of 1974. Not every human problem has a legislative solution, cotten said last year. Sometimes we have to live with an uneasy compromise between competing priorities and interests. That's doubly true when considering how the movement of the stars and the planets affects the lives of 300 million souls spread across our vast continental nation. That doesn't exactly fit on a bumper sticker, but it's a good point. The Economist said Daylight Saving Time needs to go. The origin of Daylight saving lies in efforts to use less energy in wartime, but the evidence suggests that the costs are surprisingly large, not just because of the immediate disruption to people's daily lives, but also because of the longer term biological consequences of moving out of sync with the sun, the writer wrote. The disruption it causes to people's lives adds up immediately after the clock change. The sleep deprivation that follows is associated with a spike in the number of heart attacks, strokes and fatal car accidents. Overdoses and medical errors rise, and even stock market performance suffers. Humans have evolved over millennia to be in sync with the sun. Light regulates human rhythms. Body clocks rely on bright light in the morning and an absence of it in the evening. Daylight Saving Time takes people further away from the natural cycle, the writer said. Evenings get longer anyway, regardless of whether the clock changes, thanks to the Earth's axial tilt and its orbit around the sun. Those who really want an extra hour of light in their day could get up earlier rather than imposing costs on everyone else. In the Washington Post, John Lovett argued for sending the sun back to the states. I now think this one time fits all policy would be a mistake, lovett wrote. Look at Michigan versus Maine. Sunrise and sunset in Detroit are almost an hour later than sunrise and sunset in Portland, which means that permanent Daylight Saving Time in Maine would be a lot like Permanent Standard Time in Michigan. This is why a national mandate of permanent Daylight Saving Time isn't the answer. It would force the same policy on states regardless of their latitude or attitude. Sorry, and it might just cause a backlash that could jeopardize the policy altogether. But there is a solution that could give the heroic, bipartisan and universally beloved sponsors of the Sunshine Protection act what they want and what I want without forcing their preference on other states, lovett said. Right now, according to the Uniform time Act of 1966, states can choose permanent Standard Time or they can spring forward and fall back. But states can't choose permanent Daylight Saving Time. All Congress has to do is revise this law to provide for this third option. That's it. Everybody wins. A few states continuing to switch their clocks while most don't would be no more complicated than our current system. Alright, that is it for what the left is saying. Which brings us to what the right is saying. Many on the right criticized the bill advocating for a return to Standard Time instead. Some say time changes have problems that permanent DST does not fix. Others note the health problems caused by annual time changes in the Daily Signal. Jennifer Gilardi said it's time to save Standard Time. This issue is a fundamental trade off between public health and commercial interests, gilardi wrote. These decisions were not based on human health, grassroots demand or even policy to save energy. Both major extensions of Daylight Saving Time were driven by targeted lobbying in the mid-1980s. A coalition of commercial interests, retail and chamber of Commerce groups, outdoor recreation industries and tourism businesses pushed Congress to extend DST beginning earlier in April to make more money during the evening hours. Misalignment of clocks with the sun's natural position in the sky has been estimated to decrease sleep duration by an average of 19 minutes every night throughout the duration of DST observation, Gulhardi said. Despite the testimony of experts, many in Congress have unabashedly claimed that it is great for communities. Bottom line with more business to boost the economy. The push to standardize what is not standard or healthy is a mistake, particularly for certain geographic areas that will suffer the most. Public policy should reflect the natural order, not manipulated for profit. In National Review, Michael Brendan Dougherty argued against a legislative noonday. First, I hate the insane pretense of the name of the bill itself, as if 435 legislators could by fiat do anything about the duration of sunshine or that they somehow exercise guardianship over Mother Nature, dougherty wrote. Second, I hate the substance of the bill, which is meant to pressure the whole country into permanent daylight saving, under which solar noon would happen in most of the country around 1pm and in some places closer to 2pm Third, the best argument will be used in the wrong direction. The biannual changing of the clocks really does mess with humans circadian rhythm, and there is a documented increase in motor accidents and other problems caused by law driven shift in timekeeping, doherty said. This is a great argument for not changing the clocks twice a year, but it's not an argument for permanent daylight saving, which would push sunrise to as late as 8:45am in some places. Unfortunately, I expect people to demagogue this the other way. In Town Hall, Jeff Corayer wrote Stop the Harmful time Changing Ritual. This practice gives Americans more time in the evening to enjoy sunlight. This helps owners of golf courses, tennis courts and other outdoor entertainment venues, cruair said. Conversely, it also forces parents to drive their children to school in the dark. With the time change, accidents increase, as do health related issues. Losing an hour of sleep disrupts our body clocks. Along with heart attacks, accidents and workplace injuries, there is undoubtedly a loss of work productivity. It may have been a promising idea when it was implemented in 1918, however, not in 2026. For most Americans, changing clocks twice a year is both inconvenient and pointless. The answer is to make standard time year round and end this clock changing ritual. All right, let's head over to Audrey for her take.

[Audrey Moorhead]

Thanks, John. This is Associate Editor Audrey Moorhead and here's my take. Changing the clocks twice a year is one of those events that seemed monumentally important when I was a kid. Like quicksand or Mount Everest, I assumed biannual time changes would loom over my adulthood. I remember preparing to spring forward or fall back with my parents by changing all the clocks in the house to make sure we'd still show up at church on time in the morning. As I grew older, I noticed how the outside world changed when the clocks did. In fall, I would go from getting home from school with the evening sun shining to near darkness. Somewhere along the way, I stopped believing that I'd get stuck waist deep in quicksand since I don't live in marshes, or believing that I'd climb the tallest mountain in the world since I have bad ankles. And I also stopped believing that changing clocks was an immutable reality. I learned instead that Daylight Savings Time, or dst, was largely a product of wartime in the United States, first used during World War I and re instituted during World War II. Some people claim that Ben Franklin came up with the idea, but I don't really think his saying people should get up earlier is the same as saying the time on the clocks should literally be altered. As a kid, I remember thinking, this is stupid. I didn't really understand the wartime logic that changing the clock times could preserve energy and resources for military benefit. And even if the logic were true, we weren't at war anymore. I thought we should stop switching the clocks entirely. We should just fall back one more time to Standard Time and never spring forward again. After all, it's Standard Time. Normal is basically in the name, but eventually, around the time I got a cell phone that automatically updated the clock change, I mostly stopped caring. However, now that legislation to make DST permanent is advancing through Congress again, the issue's back on my mind, and I think lawmakers are making a mistake by choosing permanent Daylight Savings. In fact, I'm not sure Congress should choose one over the other at all. For what it's worth, Americans disagree with me on that point. A February YouGov poll found that 64% of U.S. adult citizens want to end the biannual time change, and neither partisan affiliation nor typical waking times has a major effect on opinion. From there, though, things do break down. 43% of Americans want permanent DST and 28% want permanent standard time. Interestingly, the YouGov poll also shows that a majority of Americans want the sun to set later in the evenings, but we're split on daylight in the mornings. Wake up times play a major role here. Early risers want earlier light, while late risers would prefer the sun to rise later. Now, I'm no populist, but I'm solidly with the American people on the topic of late evening hours, and that's what makes daylight saving so great in the summer. I love the sunlight lasting past 8pm I enjoy evening walks and sitting outside as the sun sets, and during these months the sun still rises early enough. Today it rose at 5:45am for me that I get the full benefits of a bright morning while I'm making breakfast and coffee. But not so early that the light wakes me up before I want it to. But as many of the writers above mentioned, and as history has taught us, daylight savings during winter is a very different animal. With year round daylight savings, the sun would rise after 8am or even 9am in large swaths of the country. Adults would go to work and kids would go to school in total darkness for several hours, raising obvious safety concerns for kids and adults alike. Traffic accidents are more likely in darkness, and those risks are compounded by cold and ice. Not to mention, I don't imagine most parents like the idea of sending their kids off to school in full darkness for weeks on end. While Americans right now are split on the merits of early daylight, public opinion is likely to shift rapidly when faced with the severe depths of a permanent DST winter. After all, that's exactly what happened when President Richard Nixon started a permadst experiment in 1974. Public backlash during winter was so strong that the experiment was abandoned early. Beyond the court of public opinion, though, is science, sleep and circadian rhythm Experts nearly unanimously agree that permanent DST will scramble a person's biological clock. Correlated effects include worse physical health, obesity, and a decline in mental health. This is also true of our routine process of switching the clocks twice a year, and it's why experts are more likely to support choosing permanent standard time over permanent dst. Even the purported benefits of daylight savings that it might help us save energy costs by maximizing sunlight hours don't really bear out. A 2018 meta analysis found that on net electricity Savings were just 0.34% when DST applied. It saved more energy in northern latitudes, but locations nearer the equator actually used more energy during daylight savings. So why did Congress end up choosing permanent DST for its bill to end the clock changes? I think it's a mix of populism, business practices and state level differences. Retail industries believe that evening daylight hours encourage consumer spending and drive up revenues critical during the already slower winter months. Notably, the Florida delegation is pushing hardest for the change, and it's hard to blame them when the benefits for their state, more daylight hours for tourist attractions and outdoor recreation are clear. Honestly, through all of this, I've become more and more convinced that the solution shouldn't come at the federal level. Like John Lovett, who you heard from in what the Left Is Saying, I wonder whether an issue like timing the sunrise and sunset is better left to each state. There's no reason North Dakotans should deal with 9am Sunrises during daylight savings just so that Floridians can have later evening sun, just as there's no reason Floridians should deal with 4am Sunrises on standard time. We have a Federalist system for a reason so that when appropriate, states can solve their own problems. That doesn't have to mean that Congress lets every state set its time willy nilly. Instead, it should change the laws already in place. Right now. Congress lets state opt into permanent standard time as Hawaii and most of Arizona have already done, but not permanent daylight savings. A prudent path forward would be for Congress to change that law to allow permanent use of one or the other, while also allowing states that want to have time changes. Keep doing so. Until then, I'm crossing my fingers that the Sunshine Protection act will fail in the Senate and that we can keep falling back and springing forward, at least for now.

[Isaac Saul]

We'll be right back after this quick break. Decisions made in Washington can affect your portfolio every day. But what policy changes should investors be watching? Washington Wise is an original podcast from Charles Schwab that unpacks the stories making news in Washington right now and how they may affect your finances and portfolio. [e-mail] Washingtonwise

[John Law]

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[Audrey Moorhead]

That's it for my take. So now I'll pass it off to Isaac.

[Isaac Saul]

Hey guys, Isaac here. I want to jump in here because our audience had a very impassioned response to Audrey Moorhead's dissent in yesterday's edition. I thought some of the criticism was inbounds people sharing their firsthand experiences with law enforcement or ice, and their view that complying doesn't guarantee safety. Some of the responses, though, were gross attacks on Audrey for being too young, too white, too privileged, too Christian or the wrong sex to have an informed opinion on this issue, or worse, allegations that she didn't care about innocent people being murdered. I was frankly a little disgusted by the overall tenor of the response from this community that I cherish so much, and that is so often elevating the discourse and dialogue. The ratio of good faith arguments to ugly personal attacks was discouraging. I told Audre that I wanted to write something in response from the perspective of someone who strongly disagreed with her, but she offered some wisdom of her own. My trying to defend her would only reinforce the idea that she was too young or helpless to articulate her own positions. So I asked her to write a brief response and follow up to some of the criticism that she received. Before you listen to it, I just want to offer Writing dissents is incredibly hard. You are forced to put hours of conversation and closed door editorial debate into a few brief sentences. It's a new feature in the podcast, and one lesson I'm taking from this experience is that maybe in the future we should give more space to those dissents when it's appropriate. So with that, I'm going to turn it back to Audrey.

[Audrey Moorhead]

First and foremost, I regret that I did not make it much more clear how truly narrow my descent to Isaac was. While I did not argue that ICE agents were not at fault in these killings, it's clear now that I should have explicitly stated my position. The use of deadly force is acceptable in only the most dangerous and threatening situations, and I have thus far seen no evidence that the incidents we covered yesterday rose to that standard. I hope these DHS agents are taken off the force while a full investigation takes place, and in the meantime I'm praying for the families of the victims. However, I also want to be clear that I stand by the stated position of my dissent. I would not fight or attempt to flee if law enforcement sought to detain me. There are four common responses to perceived threats Fight, flight, freeze or fawn. I have developed my natural response of fawning, freezing, or de escalation as a woman who has faced real threats of physical violence from men. As a general rule, women understand that most men are stronger than we are, that men with ill intent abound, and that even though we deserve complete and total safety, we still must take precautions in the event that that safety is compromised. My precautions include not walking alone at night, texting friends and family when going on dates, and when faced with a situation in which I sense danger, remaining calm and attempting to diffuse the situation before seeking outside help. While this is my natural response developed from my own experiences, it is also legal experts recommended response for individuals facing ICE detainment. The American Civil Liberties Union advises stay calm, don't run, argue, resist, or obstruct the officer. Even if you believe your rights are being violated. Keep your hands where police can see them. The ACLU continues, Stay calm and do not resist or obstruct the agents or officers. Do not lie or give false documents. Prepare yourself and your family in case you are arrested. Memorize the phone numbers of your family and your lawyer. Make emergency plans if you have children or take medication. Furthermore, the National Immigration Law center recommends stay calm, do not run away or try to stop the agents. Failing to react in the expert recommended manner is not the same as culpability for what happens to you. Obviously, in the heat of the moment, people can react very differently, which was both the point of Isaac's hypothetical and the point of my dissenting response. Furthermore, reacting in the recommended manner does not guarantee one's safety, which I explicitly acknowledged. These truths can coexist with the fact that sometimes in order to preserve one's life, one must endure temporary injustice. And acknowledging the advantage of preserving life by enduring that injustice is not the same as saying the injustice should continue. That's it for my response, so I'll pass things back to John.

[John Law]

Thanks, Audrey and now for a deeper look. Since 1966, America's clocks have sprung forward and fallen back on schedule, except for one year. In 1973, the Yom Kippur War prompted the Organization of Arab Petroleum Exporting Countries to impose an oil embargo on the United States. As oil prices climbed, the US looked for ways to limit its usage. On January 6, 1974, Americans moved their clocks ahead by one hour to daylight Savings Time, where it was set to remain for two years. The adjustment was initially popular. However, during the first winter under the new law, Americans opinions soured. The sun was coming up later, causing children to have to walk to school in the dark, and several schoolchildren were hit by cars. Ultimately, President Gerald Ford signed a law ending the two year DST experiment, reverting the US to the previous schedule. And last but not least, our have a nice day story. Ada Kelly was jolted awake just before 1am by her poodle, Squilliam, barking incessantly. The doll kept running to her bed and back to her owner, refusing to settle. When Kelly finally got up, the smoke detectors were screaming and flames were already spreading throughout her West Milford, New Jersey home. Kelly escaped safely with Squilliam while the fire engulfed the structure behind them. The house was lost, but they made it out alive. He's my hero, my angel, kelly said of the dog who saved her life by saying something and saying something loudly and persistently. CBS News has this story and there's a link in today's episode description. Alright everybody, that is it for today's episode. As always, if you'd like to support our work, Please go to retangle.com where you can sign up for a newsletter membership, podcast membership, or a bundled membership that gets you a discount on both. The latest episode of Suspension of the Rules is out and you can listen to it on Apple Music, Spotify, or your favorite podcast platform. Or you can head to our YouTube channel and check out the full video of it this week. Isaac and Camille welcome senior editor Will Kay back to the the table as well as author of the newsletter. Your local epidemiologist Caitlin Jettalina on the cyclospiriasis outbreak. Isaac, Camille and will also discuss the arguments for and against appointing family members to fill seats of deceased lawmakers, a viral video of Nevada's governor and President Trump's latest election administration moves. We'll be right back in your ears again next week, folks. In the meantime, for Isaac, Audrey and the rest of the team, this is John Law signing off. Have an absolute, absolutely fantastic weekend, y'.

[Hannah Berner]

All.

[John Law]

Peace.

[Isaac Saul]

Our Executive editor and founder is me, Isaac Saul, and our Executive producer is John Wall. Today's episode was edited and engineered by Dewey Thomas. Our editorial staff is led by Managing Editor Ari Weitzman with Senior Editor Will Kbach and Associate Editors Audrey Moorhead, Lindsey Knuth and Bailey Saul. Music for the podcast was produced by Diane75. To run more about Tangle and to sign up for a membership, please visit our [e-mail].

[Audrey Moorhead]

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[Hannah Berner]

Get the [e-mail] this is Hannah Berner, the co host of Giggly Squad. We could all just stay in bed scrolling through other people's vacations forever, but where is the fun in that? The best memories come from stepping outside of your little bubble and being open to the unexpected. And what better way to be open to the unexpected than finally booking that trip to Europe. You guys know I'm a Delta girly. Every time I go, I get my Delta headphones. And when I fly to Europe, Delta treats me like a queen. And they'll treat you too. I was always a little nervous about navigating a foreign country, but then I realized just it's so important to grow and see different cultures and to put yourself in different situations and Delta held my hand the whole time. Being away just helps you put life into perspective and your little worries are not so bad. Travel really is the best way to discover something new about yourself and grow from the experience. Step outside your comfort zone this summer, get some Delta headphones and fly with Delta airlines. They truly are the best way to get to Europe and they just make the whole journey feel so comfortable and seamless. Go book your next chapter right [e-mail]

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