Tangle Podcast Summary

Episode: The Jay Jones Texts
Host: Isaac Saul
Date: October 7, 2025

Episode Overview

This Tangle episode, hosted by Isaac Saul, dives into the controversy surrounding Jay Jones, the Democratic candidate for Virginia Attorney General, whose explicit and violent text messages about political rivals were leaked. The episode explores how the story has taken center stage, especially among conservatives, discusses reactions from across the political spectrum, and considers the broader implications for political rhetoric and standards. Isaac also shares his own perspective and answers a listener question on California's SB771 bill.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Setting the Stage: Episode Introductions & Corrections

• Date & Venue: Isaac records from Philadelphia, briefly recounting a Halloween prank in his office.

• Corrections Section ([03:00]):

  • Clarification on previous immigration reporting: the cited figure of "10 million unauthorized migrants" referenced border encounters, not unique crossings, and thus was overstated.
  • Commitment to transparency: “We track these corrections...to maximize transparency with readers.”
    — Isaac Saul ([03:40])

• Editorial Note on Israel-Gaza Conflict:

  • Tangle will not cover the October 7 anniversary in detail because it was recently discussed.

2. Main Story: The Jay Jones Texts Controversy

Basic Facts ([07:11])

• Leak Details: National Review published text exchanges from 2022 in which Jay Jones, then a Virginia House delegate, expressed extreme hostility toward Republican colleagues, including violent fantasies and wishing harm upon opponents’ children.
• Target: The texts were sent to Republican Delegate Carrie Coyner and focused on GOP House Speaker Todd Gilbert.
• Key Excerpt from Leaked Texts:
  • “[Jones] wrote about violence against GOP lawmakers and urinating on the future graves of political opponents, even killing a state GOP leader with, quote, ‘two bullets to the head.’ He also wished death upon Republican lawmakers’ children because, quote, ‘they’re breeding little fascists’ and ‘only when people feel pain personally do they move on policy.’”
    — Narrator ([07:11])

Immediate Fallout ([08:00])

• Jones’ Apology:
  • “I take full responsibility for my actions and I want to issue my deepest apology to Speaker Gilbert and his family. Reading back those words made me sick to my stomach. I am embarrassed, ashamed and sorry.”
    — Jay Jones, statement ([08:47])
• Republican Response:
  • Calls for Jones to drop out came from Virginia Republicans, Governor Glenn Youngkin, President Donald Trump, and others.
  • Conservative groups quickly tied other Democrats to Jones and pressured them to condemn the remarks.

Democratic Response

• Most Democrats denounce the texts, but few explicitly call for Jones to exit the race.
• Don Scott, Democratic House Speaker, told parishioners: “They want us to get distracted by the text message here or something else. Stay focused.” ([09:46])

3. Political Spectrum Breakdown

What the Left is Saying ([12:37])

• General Consensus: The texts are condemned; debate exists on severity.

• Washington Post Editorial Board:

  • “Curbing the epidemic of political violence will require leaders who do not excessively inflame routine partisan conflict...Jones’s texts cast doubt on whether he has the temperament to become the state’s top law enforcement officer.” ([13:03])
  • Criticized Jones’ initial non-apology and his attack on National Review.

• Left-wing Commentators on X:

  • Many accuse Republicans of hypocrisy; cite inflammatory rhetoric from GOP leaders.
  • “If Jay Jones has no business being lieutenant governor ... then Stephen Miller ... has no business being in government either.”
    — Rachel Bitecofer, election strategist ([13:48])
  • “It’s hard to care about J. Jones when you have a sitting president who speaks like this.”
    — Alisa Marcos, political consultant ([14:03])

What the Right is Saying ([15:00])

• Condemnation & Calls for Accountability:
  • Eric Erickson, newsletter writer:
    • “If Jones were a Republican, every major news outlet would demand GOP leaders to condemn him… And the people who hate Trump will find lots of excuses to deflect...” ([15:13])
• Wall Street Journal Editorial Board:
  • Suggests these are “disqualifying sentiments” for an aspiring AG and says Jones should step aside. ([16:13])

What Virginia Writers are Saying ([16:35])

• Robert B. Mitchell, Any Damn Thing newsletter:
  • “There is simply no legitimate place for this kind of language, and any politician who indulges in it deserves public condemnation... The most responsible thing [Jones] can do now is quit the race.” ([17:09])
• Dwayne Yancey, Cardinal News:
  • Explores whether the scandal is politically fatal, noting Jones lacks the ability to redeem himself through public office actions as Northam did. ([17:52])

4. Isaac Saul’s Take ([19:49])

• Empathy for Multiple Viewpoints:
  • Reflects on conservative Guy Benson’s call for liberals to understand right-wing fears amid recent political violence.
  • “[Benson] asked those on the left to consider that...conservatives were seeing...a major statewide candidate had sent these death wish text messages about a political rival.” ([20:17])
• Broader Social Context:
  • “Benson's exercise was a genuine reminder that right now, fear is just everywhere…Everyone is afraid for different reasons.” ([21:37])
• Setting a Red Line:
  • Argues both parties should enforce: “Endorse political violence and you’re done.”
  • “Here we have a powerful and easy centralizing idea that could be seized for the endorse political violence and you're done.” ([22:20])
• Why Jones Should Drop Out:
  • Jones’ texts are “genuinely obscene” and “disqualifying,” especially for a high moral office.
  • Stresses the upside for Democrats in taking "genuine moral high ground" by ousting Jones.
  • “Someone who would send a text like this should be nowhere near the Attorney General’s office.” ([23:13])
• On Standards:
  • Urges consistent condemnation of political violence across the spectrum, whether it comes from Trump allies (e.g., Rep. Clay Higgins) or left-wing activists.
  • “Let’s make it unacceptable not just to commit political violence, but political poison to endorse or incite it.” ([25:47])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Jay Jones Statement ([08:47]):
  “I am embarrassed, ashamed and sorry. This was a grave mistake and I will work every day to prove to the people of Virginia that I will fight for them as attorney general.”
• Washington Post Editorial Board ([13:03]):
  “Gentility is the Virginia way. His texts were the opposite of that.”
• Eric Erickson ([15:13]):
  “And the people who hate Trump will find lots of excuses to deflect, scream both sides and do everything possible to avoid condemning the man whom Democrats think is fit for Attorney General of Virginia.”
• Isaac Saul’s Principle ([22:20]):
  “He offers a chance to collectively set and enforce a new red line. Jones should drop out of this race. Agreeing with this sentiment is a tremendous opportunity.”
• Isaac Saul on Consistency ([25:47]):
  “Let’s make it unacceptable not just to commit political violence, but political poison to endorse or incite it. And then let’s enforce that standard for everyone.”

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:26] – Episode Opening & Corrections
• [07:11] – The Jay Jones Texts: Summary & Fallout
• [12:37] – Political Spectrum Analysis: What the Left & Right Are Saying
• [16:35] – Virginia Writers’ Perspectives
• [19:49] – Isaac Saul’s Personal Take
• [27:39] – Listener Questions: CA Bill SB771 Explained
• [30:23] – Under-the-Radar Story & Notable Numbers

Listener Question: California SB771 ([27:39])

Is SB771 law? Does it fine users $500,000+ for 'hateful' posts? Is this censorship?

• SB771 has passed the California legislature but not enacted yet—awaiting Gov. Newsom’s signature.
• Fines (up to $1 million) target platforms, not individual users, for algorithmic sharing of content that constitutes criminal violence or intimidation.
• Censorship? Many say yes, as it coerces platforms to restrict speech, but the bill doesn't criminalize direct user speech. The definition of “hateful” remains a contested gray area.

Closing Thoughts

• The Jones scandal is a flashpoint for debates about political rhetoric, accountability, and the normalization of violent language in politics.
• Isaac and the Tangle team urge parties on both sides to take a principled stand against any endorsement of political violence—publicly or privately.

For more on this story and others, visit readtangle.com.