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- [00:00]
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Isaac Saul
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John Law
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- [02:02]
Isaac Saul
Good morning, good afternoon and good evening and welcome to the Tangle Podcast, a place you get views from across the political spectrum, some independent thinking and a little bit of my take. I'm your host Isaac Saul. It is Wednesday, February 4th and today we are covering the government shutdown that I guess no longer exists, the government funding deal. We have a mostly funded government with DHS stuff on hold, so we're going to break down exactly what happens and the fight that this is setting up for the future, which should be pretty interesting. Going to share some views from the left and the right and then my take. I'm here in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Got the whole Tangle team here this week so I'm recording this sitting next to my good dear friend John Law, our executive producer, which is not a common thing these days. Super excited for the show, glad to be here with the team and with that I'm going to pass it over to John for today's main topic and I'll be back for my take.
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John Law
Thanks Isaac and welcome everybody. Here are your quick hits for today. First up, Israel carried out airstrikes in Gaza after it said Palestinian militants attacked Israeli soldiers early this morning. Gaza officials said at least 21 people were killed in Wednesday's strikes. Number two in an interview with former Federal Bureau of Investigation Deputy Director Dan Bongino, President Donald Trump called on the Republican Party to nationalize the voting in the United States, saying specifically that the GOP should take over the voting in at least 15 places, which he did not name. Number three President Trump and Colombian President Gustavo Petro met at the White House to discuss the country's relations after months of tensions over the Trump administration's actions in Latin America. Both leaders called the meeting a success and said they were working on a counternarcotics agreement. Number four the US military shot down an unmanned Iranian drone approximately 500 miles from Iran's southern coast after the drone aggressively approached the USS Abraham Lincoln naval aircraft carrier. Number five Former President Bill Clinton and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton agreed to testify before the House Oversight Committee as part of its investigation into convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. The House has been pursuing contempt of Congress charges against the Clintons after they initially ignored a subpoena to testify. And number six, Eight lawyers reportedly resigned or announced their intent to resign from the Minnesota U.S. attorney's office, bringing the total number of resignations in the past month to 14. The attorneys have cited recent directives from the Justice Department related to the investigations into the killing of Renee Goode and Alex Preddy as their reasons for leaving.
- [04:51]
Sleep Number Advertiser
After hours of debate and delays, the partial government shutdown is over.
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Sponsor/Advertisement Voice
Yeah Lawmakers passed a revised funding bill that splits DHS funding from the main measure. The president just signed it.
- [05:02]
John Law
On Tuesday, The House voted 217 to 214 to pass a full year funding package for several federal agencies, excluding the Department of Homeland Security, ending a four day partial government shutdown. The funding bill previously passed the Senate 71 to 29 after Democrats pushed to remove funding for DHS following the shootings of two US citizens by federal immigration officers in Minnesota in January. 21 Democrats voted for the measure in the House, while 21 Republicans voted against it. President Donald Trump signed the bill on Tuesday, funding most federal departments through September 30th. The deadline to fund Homeland Security was set for next Friday, February 13th. The package provides funding to the Departments of Defense, Treasury, State, Health and Human Services, Labor, Housing and Urban Development, Transportation and Education through the remainder of the fiscal year. It also provided $195 billion of discretionary spending, led by allocations to the Department of Health and human services for $49 billion for biomedical investments in research and $33 billion to the Department of Education for K12 formula grants. Last year's One Big Beautiful Bill act allocated $191 billion to DHS, with $75 billion in funding for Immigration and Customs Enforcement and $67 billion to Customs and Border Patrol. The OBBA also specifically funded CBP and ICE through 2029. However, annual funding for DHS still must be approved for fiscal year 2026 or some of its services will be suspended. In addition to ICE and cbp, DHS oversees citizen and immigration services, the Trans, the Federal Emergency management agency, the U.S. coast Guard and the Secret Service. Democrats have indicated that they will not support a continuing resolution to fund dhs, insisting any further action be tied to reforms. Among the requested reforms are mandatory body cameras for DHS agents, a ban on roving patrols, mandated coordination with local police, more stringent warrant requirements, a ban on agents wearing masks and a requirement that they carry identification. Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer called these measures common sense, adding that Republicans who refuse to support them are choosing to protect ICE from accountability over American lives. On Monday, DHS Secretary Kristi Noem announced that all of the department's agents in Minneapolis will be issued body cameras immediately and that the program will be expanded nationwide when funding becomes available. House Speaker Mike Johnson said on Tuesday that roving patrols will be modified. Senate Majority Leader John Thune expressed interest in cooperating with Democrats towards a solution. A government shutdown is not in anybody's interest, noon said. If Congress is unable to reach an agreement to fund DHS by the February 13 deadline, some of DHS's unfunded services may again partially shut down. Today we'll take a look at what the left and right are saying about the funding package and then Isaac's take.
- [08:01]
Isaac Saul
We'll be right back after this quick break.
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- [09:15]
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- [09:52]
John Law
All right, first up, let's start with what the left is saying. Many on the left insist Democrats hold firm on their demands for the coming DHS funding fight. Some suggest a path to a bipartisan agreement is emerging. Others say Democrats have more leverage than they did during the last budget negotiations. In the Hill, Lindsey Granger said Democrats must hold their ground on DHS funding. House Democrats are staring down a familiar problem, and it's not just a procedural fight over the funding of the Department of Homeland Security. It's the deeper issue of what the party actually stands for right now and whether it has the backbone to defend it when things get get uncomfortable, granger wrote. Here's the problem. Democrats have been here before, when healthcare reform faltered, when shutdown brinksmanship backfired, when messaging fractured instead of focused. The result wasn't leverage, it was weakness. Immigration enforcement can exist, but it cannot operate like a system with no rules, no transparency and no accountability. Masks off body cameras on proper identification, granger said. So if Democrats are going to take a stand, this is one that actually matters. Not a symbolic shutdown, not another short term patch, but putting clear enforceable rules on paper and refusing to fund a system that operates in the shadows, the Washington Post editorial board wrote about how to avoid another shutdown. Clearly, changes are needed at the Department of Homeland Security, and the demands of Democratic leaders are mostly reasonable. Senate Minority Leader Charles E. Schumer from New York wants Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents to be required to wear body cameras on duty, the board said. Schumer also wants ICE agents to take off their masks and wear some form of identification, which are standard practices across American law enforcement. DHS warns of doxxing, but anyone who threatens federal officers can and should be prosecuted. At the same time, bands of faceless, unidentifiable plainclothes agents patrolling American streets sows fear and seeds mistrust. Privately, many Republicans sound ready to accept thoughtful reforms. They acknowledge the scenes from Minneapolis are a moral failure and a political nightmare. With the midterms just nine months away, they're spooked by losing races like the special election in Texas over the weekend, the board wrote. Lawmakers of goodwill in both parties should understand that true accountability won't impede ICE agents from going after threats to public safety. Most Americans support the deportation of criminals, but it becomes hard to sustain a mission that creates so much collateral damage. In the Atlantic, Tolouse Oloronapa said this shutdown is different. Trump is largely the same person that he was four months ago when the previous shutdown began. But his push to quickly resolve the latest shutdown highlights how much the political landscape on immigration has shifted. Following daily videotaped clashes between masked federal agents and Minneapolis residents, two of whom were killed last month, Olarenpa said Trump made clear that he was willing to work with Democrats to avoid another government shutdown. The bill that Trump signed today funds most of the government through the end of September and continues funding for the Department of homeland security until February 13th. Democrats push May already be making an impact. Noem said yesterday that ICE agents working in Minneapolis will begin wearing body cameras immediately and that agents across the country will be doing the same once funding becomes available, Olorunapa said. But Democrats are likely to face more resistance to other demands. Asked about judicial warrants today, Trump was non committal. But buoyed by the newfound leverage they have to draw Trump to the negotiating table, many Democrats are looking to exert maximum pressure in the coming days. Alright, that is it for what the left is saying. Which brings us to what the right is saying. The right is glad to avoid a protracted shutdown, and many expect a DHS funding compromise to come together soon. Some criticize Democrats demands for ICE reforms. Others credit Congress for funding most of the government despite major political hurdles. In Hot air, Ed Morrissey wrote, the shutdown ends for now. Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer want new restrictions on arrest powers for ice, which Republicans refuse. Although both the GOP and the Trump administration have granted other concessions, Morrissey said Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem has already ordered all ICE and Border Patrol personnel to wear body cams as soon as they can be purchased and distributed, a move that is long overdue anyway. Other than the demand for arrests only on existing warrants, the rest of the demands appear negotiable. Two weeks may be a small window for these talks, but the vote today makes it clear that Democrats don't have much leverage. DHS runs a number of agencies, including TSA and fema, which House Dems can't really afford to derail twice in the same session of Congress, morrissey wrote. Also, the more success Tom Homan has in lowering the temperature in Minnesota, the less leverage that the radicals will have in Congress. Another two weeks of reasonable coordination, and the House Democrats will likely want to get back to affordability in American greatness, John R. Lott Jr. Argued Democrats are using the shutdown threat to rewrite immigration enforcement Democrats are demanding that major changes to Department of Homeland Security enforcement policy be written directly into the budget agreement. Those changes would largely shut down President Trump's deportation efforts. They want to require judicial warrants for immigration arrests, force ICE agents to be easily identifiable, and grant states the authority to conduct their own investigations of federal ICE agents, lott said. The vast majority of ICE's 600,000 arrests and detentions last year through the beginning of December relied on administrative warrants or warrants issued by immigration judges. Requiring judicial warrants would overwhelm the federal court system. Democratic demands for body cameras are especially puzzling because the very spending bill they are threatening to Filibuster already includes $20 million that must be used to purchase body cameras for ICE and Border Patrol agents, lott wrote. Democrats are using the threat of yet another government shutdown to force sweeping policy changes that would sharply curtail federal immigration enforcement. Some of their demands even contradict long standing Democratic positions on federal supremacy and immigration. But Democrats have one goal in stop Trump from deporting illegal aliens. In the Dispatch, Philip Wallach offered two cheers for a semi normal appropriations process. On January 22, the House passed the final six bills, including defense spending and the thorny matter of spending for the deport Department of Homeland Security. Thanks to the detailed work of staffers conducted out of the public eye, Congress was on pace to have 12 of 12 appropriations laws in place, Wallach said. Their accomplishment was somewhat derailed by events entirely outside of their control. The killing of Alex Pretty by Border Patrol agents operating in Minneapolis just 17 days after the killing of Renee Goode by Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents in the same city. Appropriators would have to settle for 11 out of 12. The political and substantive importance of the immigration enforcement questions is huge, and Democrats have every right to play hardball. But they will have plenty of chances to do so even if the current bill is signed into law. In that case, absent further congressional action, the Department of Homeland Security would return to being shut down on February 13th, Wallach wrote. Meanwhile, the appropriator's considerable accomplishment does not deserve to be casually tossed aside. Legislators should relish opportunities to support good faith cooperation when they have them. Alright, let's head over to Isaac for his take.
- [17:28]
Isaac Saul
Alright, that is it for the left and the right are saying. Which brings us to my take. It may be hard to believe, or it may be repeated so often that the phrase has lost its meaning, but none of this is normal. The government is not supposed to regularly shut down during spending negotiations. Before last week, funding lapses had produced five true government shutdowns in which operations were impacted for more than one business day since 1980. This week made six, and three have now occurred under Trump, one in his first term and two already in his second. Trump even had a second shutdown in his first term too, but it only lasted two days and not more than one business day. Congress is also not supposed to repeatedly pass spending bills on a temporary continuing resolution basis. Kudos to Speaker Mike Johnson, who had made some momentary progress this year to return to regular order, but he hasn't yet been able to fully end decades of chaos. Our government is not designed to negotiate substantial overhauls of agencies in a matter of days. Yet here we are. Republicans and Democrats have nine days to determine how to fund the Department of Homeland Security and what changes, if any, they want to make to the department's immigration immigration enforcement tactics. Democrats are going to push for DHS to remove their masks, wear body cameras, which Krissy Noem said they're already starting to do, halt random sweeps and warrantless searches, and apply the same use of force policies as local and state law enforcement agencies. I support these policy proposals. I think most people probably do. Federal law enforcement should be subject to the same oversight laws and limits as police, and the actions of DHS agents in the last few weeks have demonstrated precisely why. Republicans, meanwhile, are going to fight tooth and nail against some of those provisions while also pushing to crack down on sanctuary cities or municipalities that limit cooperation with federal immigration authorities. While non cooperation in these cities has some upside, like unlawful residents reporting crimes to police or attending their immigration hearings more regularly, they also have huge downsides. At the very least, policies in these sanctuary cities should not prevent DHS from making arrests at prisons, a much more secure and less volatile environment than the public spaces and streets where the arrests currently occur, typically involving people here illegally who have also been convicted of crimes. Yet I doubt Republicans get any concessions from Democrats right now, given the forces at play in this moment. Which is to say, anyone expecting this to get resolved in nine days strikes me as naively optimistic. The dynamics of this standoff seem quietly ripe for long term problems. Democrats feel the wind at their backs to push against Trump's key electoral issue. They also understand that any failure to provide funding to DHS means the parts of the department that aren't ICE or CBP won't get funding, which Democrats will have a much higher short term tolerance for than Republicans. Even if it seems counterproductive. House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, the Democrat from New York, is already saying that he will not back a second stop gap funding measure for DHS if no deal is struck. Any lasting funding gap for DHS would be most acutely felt by Americans when FEMA or TSA stop functioning properly. Obviously, a funding gap for an agency responding to natural disasters is always a risky proposition, especially with the sensitivity to natural disasters, both environmental and political, these days. TSA agents, meanwhile, could face furloughs without a resolution. During the last shutdown, many started calling in sick to work, and the Trump administration rewarded those who didn't with a $10,000 bonus when the government reopened. How those employees navigate another indeterminable funding gap this time around will have a huge impact on US Travel and thus a big impact on the political pain Congress feels for extending any standoff. At the same time, Republican leaders like Speaker Mike Johnson are already striking a defiant tone, insisting they won't unmask federal agents for fear of them facing personal threats and doxxing. But it sounds like the White House is going to be directly involved in negotiations, which means any resolution will be dictated by Trump, not Johnson, and thus influenced by the president's read on public opinion polling and how each side's arguments play out in the press. Another refrain I've overworn through repeated use is how much can change in a few months in politics. Remember, we are fresh off the longest government shutdown in US History, which started with President Trump and Republicans promising to revel in the government grinding to a halt and to take advantage of it at every turn, and ended with them triumphantly signing a bill to reopen the government while celebrating the fact Democrats caved on their core demand. No extension of COVID era Obamacare subsidies. At the time, Trump's lack of interest in resolving the shutdown was a key element of the story back then. In the ancient political era historians call November 2025, it would have been fantastical to suggest that less than three months later Democrats would force a shutdown over funding the Department of Homeland Security, that Trump himself would be deeply involved in resolving the shutdown quickly, and that he would ultimately cave to Democrats demands to negotiate DHS funding separately. This time, Trump's bravado was gone and so too was the fanfare. The government reopened and now Democrats head into DHS negotiations with a timeline that I think favors them. The fact that Congress has nine days to resolve this means negotiations will take place. While public sentiment is strongly In Democrats Corner, DHS's worst actions are fresh in everyone's minds, and if the deadline were weeks or months out, that dynamic would change. One more worn out reminder all of this is over policy questions on an issue that has now twice propelled Trump to electoral victory, it's pretty astonishing Republicans have lost an unbelievable amount of political leverage in the last few months because of consistently unprofessional and even illegal actions by DHS agents in the field. I genuinely do not know how the next nine days will play out, though I'm deeply skeptical Congress can reach a compromise in such short order. I do suspect we'll see something akin to a compromise in the end, but nothing that constitutes meaningful reform. Democrats should land provisions for body cameras and use of force standards, which are easy to sell to the public and where they are already making progress. Making ICE agents remove any face coverings will be more difficult, as the threat of agents being targeted is clearly a live issue. I also doubt Democrats make any progress in limiting the kinds of warrants DHS can use. Administrative warrants have been common for some time, and any law restricting them will likely land in the courts. As Speaker Johnson said, a crackdown on how the administration can apply those searches would all but end the enforcement effort Trump campaigned on, and that just isn't going to happen. So we'll see who blinks first. The real test, if this extends beyond the nine days legislators have, will come when TSA and FEMA operations take a hit. Hopefully we don't get there, but I'd be shocked if Congress can resolve anything until the vice tightens around. Not just them, but the rest of us too. We'll be right back after this quick break.
- [24:50]
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- [25:21]
Sleep Number Advertiser
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- [25:23]
Isaac Saul
Can I make my site firmer?
- [25:25]
John Law
Can we sleep cooler?
- [25:27]
Sleep Number Advertiser
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- [25:58]
Isaac Saul
All right, that is it for my take. Which brings us to your questions answered. Today we're actually doing one of our callbacks update on the progress of TrumpRx.gov so every now and then we leave these internal notes to ourselves to check back in on stories from the past. So on December 18, 2025, we covered a national address from President Trump, writing at the time that apart from a $1,776 Warrior dividend, the address contained only two announcements of upcoming actions. Which one was Trump Rx, a government website offering prescription drugs at lower prices, and a new pick for the next Federal Reserve chair to be announced soon. We left a note to ourselves to see what progress had been made on these two changes. Six weeks later, one of these announcements has already been fulfilled. As we covered in yesterday's edition, Trump nominated Kevin Warsh to be the next Fed chair last week. The second initiative, using Most Favored Nation pricing and a new website to make prescription drugs more affordable and accessible to, is incomplete but actually well underway. Since Trump's speech, the administration has secured deals with multiple major pharmaceutical manufacturers, more than a dozen, according to the White House, to join Pfizer in participating in the Trump RX platform. The website trumprx.gov was expected to launch in January but has been delayed. The new launch is expected sometime next week, according to Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. The administration has also made some progress on administrative constraints. In late January, HHS released guidance to pharmaceutical companies on how to make their drugs available directly to consumers without violating federal regulations. However, three Democratic senators, Elizabeth Warren, Dick Durbin and Peter Welch, formally expressed concern that the program would violate anti kickback regulations, writing a letter to the inspector general asking for a report on the program's compliance. So while we're still waiting on many details, we should have more information in the next week or so if the official website launches as planned. All right, that is it for your questions answered, which was really a flashback to some of our previous coverage. I'm going to send it over to John for the rest of the pod and I'll see you guys tomorrow. Have a good one. Peace.
- [28:17]
John Law
Thanks, Isaac. Here's your under the radar story for today, folks. On Monday, the Rafah border crossing reopened for movement between Gaza and Egypt for the first time in roughly 21 months, fulfilling a key provision of the U. S Brokered peace deal. Israel mostly closed the crossing after taking control of the Gaza side in May 2024, and a reported 20,000 sick and wounded people are now waiting to leave Gaza to receive treatment. However, Israel said only 50 patients per day can leave initially and 50 others will be permitted to cross into Gaza and no goods will be allowed through European Union supervisors and local Palestinians will facilitate the reopening while Israel will carry out remote security checks. The BBC has this story and there's a link in today's episode description. And last but not least, our have a nice day story. The percentage of Americans volunteering for religious organizations or other charitable causes fell by 8 points between 2017 and 2021, likely driven in part by the COVID 19 pandemic. However, according to new polling from Gallup, volunteerism has bounced back to pre Covid levels. As of 2025, 63% of Americans reported volunteering in 2025, up from 56% in 2021. Overall, people in the US remained highly engaged with charities in different ways, with 76% donating money to religious organizations and other charitable causes. Gallup has this story and there's a link in today's episode description. All right, everybody, that is it for today's episode. As always, if you'd like to support our work, Please go to readtangle.com where you can sign up for a newsletter membership, podcast membership, or a bundled membership that gets you a discount on both. We'll be right back here tomorrow. For Isaac and the rest of the crew, this is John Law signing off. Have a great day, y'.
- [30:01]
Advertisement Voice
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- [30:02]
Isaac Saul
Peace Our executive editor and founder is me, Isaac Saul, and our executive producer is John Lowell. Today's episode was edited and engineered by Dewey Thomas. Our editorial staff is led by Managing Editor Ari Weitzman with Senior Editor Will Kbach and Associate editors Audrey Moorhead, Lindsay Knuth, and Bailey Saul. Music for the podcast was produced by Diet75. To learn more about Tangle and to sign up for a membership, please visit our website@readtangle.com.
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- [32:05]
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- [32:09]
John Law
Can I make my site firmer? Can we sleep cooler?
- [32:12]
Sleep Number Advertiser
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