Tangle Podcast: "The Undecideds: One Year Later"

Date: February 25, 2026
Host: Isaac Saul

Episode Overview

This episode reunites four of the five original "Undecided Voters" the podcast followed throughout the tumultuous 2024 election. Now, a year into Donald Trump’s unprecedented second term, host Isaac Saul and the Tangle team check in on these Americans’ reflections. Each shares how their vote feels in hindsight, what’s surprised or worried them, and what (if anything) is giving them hope as the country faces new and ongoing crises. Through their reactions, the episode explores personal identity, political division, the erosion of norms, and the challenge of balancing hope and disillusionment in today’s political landscape.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Setting the Stage (02:50–06:13)

• Election Recap: Saul recalls the events that shaped the 2024 race: Trump’s legal issues and felony conviction, Biden’s withdrawal, Kamala Harris’s last-minute nomination, an assassination attempt, and a final Trump vs. Harris face-off.
• Return of the Undecideds: Out of five, four agreed to share their post-election thoughts: Claire (OH), Brian (AZ), Phil (PA), and Diana (FL). Zahid declined to participate.

2. Claire (Ohio): Reflecting on Third-Party Independence

Interview by Ari Weitzman
First-time young voter, works at All Sides, media bias analyst

On Her 2024 Vote (08:37)

• Voted third-party; doesn’t regret the choice but is more aware of how her sense of personal identity shaped it.
• Quote:

  “I do think I miscalculated what Trump’s second term would look like. I think it’s been worse than I thought it would be, for sure.” (08:37)

On Self-Identity and Voting Behavior (10:08–11:43)

• Now more aware that personal identity—her self-concept as an “independent thinker” and “writer”—influences her choices as much as objective policy preference.
• She’s wary of “blind spots” and trying to be more conscious of them going forward.

Trump Administration's First Year: Highs and Lows (12:18–16:51)

• Most Disturbing: Crackdown on protestors and immigrants—specifically, the "Ozturk case" (young woman detained by masked officers), ICE-linked shootings, and restrictions on pro-Palestinian speech.
• Foreign Policy: Appreciated the Middle East ceasefire but is troubled by chaos, intervention in Venezuela, and lack of clarity on intervention choices.
• Memorable Moment:

  "I didn't expect that we would put our own American lives at risk by intervening militarily as much as we have." (17:51)

Evolving Priorities & Hope for Midterms (18:32–21:53)

• Focused on ICE, free speech, and affordability.
• Still seeking a “realist” leader who can bring the country together, listen, and move past culture wars.

Fears & Hopes (22:13–23:47)

• Worry: Crackdown on speech, due process, increasing deportations of even US citizens.
• Hope: In American protest movements and democratic engagement.

  “It gives me a lot of hope…this is a great representation of how democracy works…people standing up in whatever way makes sense to them.” (22:13)

3. Brian (Arizona): Conservative Christian Searching for Consistency

Interview by Magdalena Bokova
Teacher, father, deeply Christian; voted Trump out of value alignment

On His Vote & First-Year Assessment (29:41)

• Does not regret voting for Trump; chooses “the problems I’d rather have” despite acknowledging ongoing issues.
• Quote:

  “It’s definitely the lesser of the two evils...Trump and the Republicans, even though they’re still far from what I would consider optimal and ideal, I have to stay on that side because of my values.” (31:28)

Trump’s Style and Substance (32:39–33:56)

• Applauds the administration’s speed and decisive action, particularly on border and immigration, but dislikes the “obnoxiously aggressive” lack of grace and statesmanship.

  “Things move at a pretty quick pace...but boy, could they be done with so much more grace and poise…It just seems kind of ugly.” (32:39)

Local vs. National Impact (34:14)

• Despite proximity to the border, sees little change locally but is watching national headlines.

Defining Incidents: ICE Shootings & Division (35:38)

• Troubled by events like the Minnesota ICE shooting and the polarity of American reactions.

  “It definitely surprises me that the two views are so diametrically opposed on what we define as illegal immigration...” (35:38)

Long-Term Hopes: Christian Worldview & Historical Optimism (38:17–49:04)

• Wishes for a national leadership more closely aligned with Christian worldview—not just policies that please Christians, but deeper motives.
• Sees the death of Charlie Kirk as galvanizing the Christian community’s unity through prayer rather than protest; skeptical that any unity with the left is possible soon.
• On History and the Next Generation:

  “The church and Christianity has always thrived under persecution...my job here is to equip them with the tools...the blood of the martyrs is the seed of the Church.” (46:11–49:04)

4. Phil (Pennsylvania): Center-Right, Character-First, Neither Party Fits

Interview by Will K
Pastor, professor, longtime Republican now alienated by Trump; wrote in candidate

On His Vote & Political Dislocation (55:10)

• Feels “homeless” between parties—remains center-right, votes independently, and stands by his refusal to endorse Trump or Harris.
• Quote:

  “Trump has turned out to be in some ways the worst-case scenario of himself...He comes in with a sledgehammer or a flamethrower instead of a laser or a scalpel.” (55:10)

Defining Issue: Expansion of Executive Power (64:57)

• Sees Trump’s overuse of presidential power as the most dangerous precedent—surpassing even previous expansions by Obama and Biden.
• Worries about a “dysfunctional Congress” enabling near-unchecked executive authority:

  “He didn’t create it, but he sure is using it...the precedent being set for the next generation is very disturbing.” (64:57)

On the Parties and Hopes for Moderation (67:23–69:55)

• Desires a centrist shift but believes both parties increasingly punish compromise.
• “Politics is…figuring out how to solve our problem through compromise and creativity. And that kind of politics is a thing of the past.”

On American Division, Family, and Dialogue (76:47)

• Reports deep generational and cultural splits but takes hope in nuanced personal conversations.

  “We can talk to each other and we share a common political vision…old-fashioned Republicans and Democrats who could still cross the aisle...” (76:47)

Hopes for the Future (82:59)

• Hope is grounded in cultural renewal—truth-telling, open debate, and moral character—not in national politics.
• Praises media like Tangle for fostering genuine pluralism.

  “Ultimately, I think the things that make a society have more to do with issues of character and the ability to be truthful and to engage in meaningful dialogue...” (82:59)

5. Diana (Florida): From Reluctant Republican to Disillusioned Independent

Interview by John Law
Retired teacher, lifelong moderate—voted Harris reluctantly

On Her Vote and Today’s Regret (93:50)

• Glad not to have voted for Trump; upset at his re-election and what she perceives as moral and institutional decline.
• Quote:

  "There are things that have happened that have been beyond my wildest dreams that I just never even thought could happen...things have exceeded my expectations to the negative." (93:50, 98:26)

Main Concerns: Immigration, Authoritarianism, Ethics (94:59–98:26)

• Deeply disturbed by mass ICE raids, the treatment of immigrants, and the removal of expert input from government.
• Sees Trump as “trying to turn himself into a king,” surrounding himself with only loyalists and silencing dissent.

On Policy (102:57)

• Acknowledges the need for better immigration enforcement, but not the methods used.
• Appreciates some global outcomes (stock market gains, less drama in Israel/Gaza) but is troubled by the overall means and tone of the administration.

Division, Dialogue, & Personal Experience (105:18–108:09)

• Lives in pro-Trump area; tries to keep politics out of social spaces but witnesses little sympathy for affected immigrants.
• Draws empathy between herself and marginalized women (e.g., ICE shooting victim in Minnesota), expressing fear and sadness.

Worries and Hopes for the Future (115:20–119:32)

• Worries: Rollback of vaccines/public health protections, erosion of social services, and authoritarian drift.
• Hopes: The pendulum will swing back toward the center; believes a quieter “middle” majority exists and may assert itself.

  “There’s a lot more people in the middle like me than there are anybody else…they’re the ones that get all the publicity because they make all the noise.” (118:07)

Notable Quotes & Moments

• Claire, on how political identity shapes choice:

  “Voting has a lot less to do with the people running and a lot more to do with who you conceive yourself to be and who you most identify with.” (08:37)

• Phil, on Trump’s approach:

  “Even when he's shooting in the right direction, he shoots a bazooka, not a rifle." (55:10)

• Brian, on unity:

  “The only way that can be resolved is when the correct worldview prevails and people are willing to finally submit to their Lord...I don’t think there’s going to be any unity anytime soon.” (43:35)

• Diana, on hope:

  "I’m hopeful that maybe there are more people in Congress that get along and that talk and try to work things out than there are now." (118:07)

Important Timestamps

• 02:50: Isaac Saul introduces the “Undecideds” series and stakes of the episode.
• 08:37: Claire reflects on voting third-party and Trump’s second-term reality.
• 12:18–18:32: Claire discusses Trump’s actions on immigration, free speech, and foreign affairs.
• 29:41: Brian on voting for Trump, value alignment, and ‘lesser of two evils’ logic.
• 32:39: Praises Trump’s swift action but critiques lack of grace.
• 38:17–49:04: Brian on faith, the Kirk shooting, unity, and long-term optimism.
• 55:10: Phil on his write-in vote and being politically “homeless."
• 64:57: Phil sees executive power as the era’s defining, dangerous shift.
• 93:50: Diana describes regret, fear, and feeling politically detached.
• 102:57: Diana points to immigration as a necessary issue, but derides the approach.
• 115:20–119:32: Diana’s specific worries (public health, instability) and cautious hope for a more balanced future.

Episode’s Tone and Takeaways

The conversations are frank, thoughtful, and at times raw. Regardless of political persuasion, each participant expresses serious anxiety about division, institutional dysfunction, and threats to American norms. Yet, each also clings to some vision—however modest or qualified—of hope: through protest, cultural renewal, intergenerational teaching, or the future possibility of moderation and dialogue.

Isaac Saul’s closing words:

“The goal of the Undecideds was never to tell you who to vote for or what to think...it was to provide perspective, to listen to people examine their own political beliefs, reflect on tough questions, and to make space for opposition and nuance in a political culture that often leaves very little room for it.” (120:06)

Listen If…

• You want to hear honest self-reflection from Americans who don’t fit neatly into partisan boxes
• You’re seeking insight into how regular people process (and survive) an exhausting era of politics
• You care about the personal side of democracy—identity, conscience, hope, and fear—in a time of historic upheaval

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